Old Bailey Proceedings.
25th July 1892
Reference Number: t18920725

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Old Bailey Proceedings front matter.
25th July 1892
Reference Numberf18920725

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Sessions Paper.








Short-hand Writers to the Court,








Law Booksellers and Publishers.



On the Queen's Commission of



The City of London,





Held on Monday, July 25th, 1892, and following days.

BEFORE the RIGHT HON. DAVID EVANS, LORD MAYOR of the City of London; the Hon. Sir CHARLES EDWARD POLLOCK , Knt., one of the Justices of Her Majesty's High Court of Justice; Sir WILLIAM LAWRENCE , Knt., Sir REGINALD HANSON , Bart., M.P., Aldermen of the said City; Sir CHARLES HALL , Knt., Q.C., M.P., Recorder of the said City; STUART KNILL , Esq., JOSEPH RENALS, Esq., HORATIO DAVID DAVIES , Esq., M.P., ALFRED JAMES NEWTON , Esq., JOSEPH COCKFIELD DIMSDALE, Esq., and WILLIAM PURDIE TRELOAR, Esq., other of the Aldermen of the laid City; Sir WILLIAM THOMAS CHARLEY , Knt., Q.C., D.C.L., Common Serjeant of the said City; and ROBERT MALCOLM KERR , Esq., Q.C., LL.D., Judge of the Sheriffs, Court; Her Majesty's Justices of Oyer and Terminer and General Gaol Delivery, holden for the said City, and Judges of the Central Criminal Court.









A star (*) denotes that prisoners have been previously in custody—two stars (**) that they have been more than once in custody—a dagger (†) that they are known to be the associates of bad characters—the figures after the name in the indictment denote the prisoner's age.


OLD COURT.—Monday, July 25th, 1892.

Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-680
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation

Related Material

680. MARY AGNES ILLINGWORTH , Forging and uttering a postal order, with intent to defraud.

MR. PHILBRICK, Q.C., and MR. CASSALLY Prosecuted, and MR. C.F. GILL Defended.

DAISY DAVIS . In March last I was an assistant at the Bedford Hill Road Post-office—it was part of my duty to issue postal orders, and to keep a record of them—on March 25th I issued this shilling order, No. 538,706 (produced), on which the poundage was a halfpenny—on April 1st the name of die office was altered to Bedford Hill—it is not in the same state now; "one shilling" has been altered to 15s. in words and figures, and the date, March 25th, to April 19th, and the amount of poundage from 1/2 d. to 1 1/2 d.—there was no writing on it when I issued it—this is a genuine shilling order, and the order I gave was in the same state when I issued it—I put a post-mark on it; it has not been taken out, but it is very faint.

Cross-examined. This is not a bit like the "5" on a 15s. order, and I should notice the "fif" in "fifteen" at once—this "shilling" ought to be "shillings"—it must be signed before payment.

Re-examined. I pay orders as well as issue them—this (produced) is a genuine order for 15s.—the "5" in 16s. in the forged order is smaller than that in the genuine order—it is a very bad imitation.

MASON CHALES FAULDING . I am manager of the Magneto-Electric Battery Company, Imperial Chambers, Oxford Street—on April 20th I received by post this letter, dated April 19th, signed "Mary Agnes Illingworth," and containing this order, signed "Miss Emma Illingworth"; it contained this postal order purporting to be for 15s. as it is now—it appeared to have been altered, and I made a communication at once to the Post Office authorities—on 22nd April I wrote this letter to the prisoner in reply to her letter. (Enquiring whether the three belts ordered were for the same person and were to be eighteen inches each)—on 22nd April this letter came in a registered envelope. (Requesting that the belts might be

sent or the 15s. returned, signed MARY AGNES ILLINGWORTH, 113, St. James's Road, Upper Tooting.)—that contained a form marked "Paid for 15s."—on April 23rd I received this letter in answer to mine: ("Gentlemen,—Kindly send me three belts, one 18 inches, one 20, and one 24. Pardon my not being more explicit.—M. A. ILLINGWORTH.")—I sent the belts by registered letter post, addressed to Miss Illingworth, with this letter. (Stating that the belts were enclosed)—this (produced) is the registered envelope—on 30th April I received this letter, dated the 29th. (This teas signed by the prisoner, and stated that she was pleased with the belts, and had given two of them to two ladies, who offered her 10s. each for them)—we have not received them back.

Cross-examined. We advertise very largely; we do not send circulars by post; we insert them loose in weekly and monthly publications, and in newspapers—we receive a very large number of postal orders—I saw immediately that the "5" was different to what it ought to be—it was not a large order, but three belts for one person was curious; one person would require them all the same size—whoever wrote that letter gave us an excellent testimonial, which was apparently voluntary—I saw at Bow Street this draft of a letter on the back of one of the forms: "113, St. James's Road, Upper Tooting. Dear Sir,—I return you the three belts; they have not been ordered by me or by my authority.—MARY AGNES ILLINGWORTH."

Re-examined. We did not receive any such letter as that on the back of my letter enclosing the belts.

REUBEN JONES . I am a postman attached to the Tooting sorting office—on 28th April I received a registered packet addressed to Miss Illingworth, 113, St. James' Road—I detained it till next morning, and handed it to the postman Cook, and gave him this form of receipt (produced), with instructions.

JOHN FRANCIS COOK . I am a postman attached to the Tooting Post-office—on 26th April I received a registered letter addressed to Miss Illingworth—this is the cover of it—I also received this form of receipt to get signed—I went to the house at 12.20, and delivered it to the prisoner, who I knew—she took the receipt into a room, and brought it back signed as it is now.

EDWIN BUTLER . I am a detective police sergeant attached to the General Post Office—on 9th May, about seven p.m., I arrested the prisoner on a warrant—I had had her under observation for some time—I read the warrant to her; she said, "I am innocent"—I then showed her the postal order and the letter, and said, "This is the order you are charged with forging, and this is your letter which accompanied it"—she said, "Those are like the other forgeries"—I took her to Tooting Police-station, and requested her to turn out her pockets, which she did, and handed me her purse, a bunch of keys, and a diary—in the purse was this cutting from a newspaper. (This was a report of a discussion in the Souse of Commons on 26th April, 1892, on the subject of stolen and altered postal orders)—I went to her father's house, and he showed me her room, and in a drawer there, which I unlocked with the keys I got from her, I found these two packets of circulars of the Magneto-Electric Company, addressed to Miss Illingworth, also a bundle of circulars from the Savings Bank Department, and telegrams and other papers from the Post Office, and this cover of a

registered letter, with which was the letter from the Magneto-Electric Company, which I gave to the prisoner, and said, "This is a letter I found in your drawer"—she said, "I received the belts, I did not order them, and I returned them by post from the Bellevue Road Post-office, and left them there about 1.80 the same day; I paid 4d. postage"—the original postage was 2d., and 2 1/2 d. registration fee—she did not say whether she had returned them by registered letter—in answer to the charge she said, "I am innocent"—the reply on the back of the circular was read before the Magistrate, and she said, "I wrote that."

Cross-examined. The Post Office authorities have had her under observation on and off for six months—a claim had been made on the Post Office for £7 10s., and another in respect of some Post Office Savings Bank amounts—we should not pay a claim on a cheque sent by letter unless we believed the cheque was sent, and as to the claim about the Savings Bank, it can be ascertained whether a person has money there or not—I found some letters addressed to her father by the Post Office as far back as February, about the forged stamps—the Post Office has not been defrauded of anything but the postage of the letters, whore a forged stamp has been used; "Official, Paid," is on them—the correspondence has been going on about a year.

Re-examined. I have had occasion to watch her in respect of a charge not connected with this; there were a very great number of libellous and indecent cards, in consequence of which I watched her.

FREDERICK CARTWRIGHT . I am an assistant in the Confidential Enquiry branch of the General Post Office—on 26th April I had instructions to watch the house where the prisoner lived at Tooting, and did so from 12.45 that day—I knew her—she came out about 1.10, and walked down St. James's Road to Wandsworth Common, and along a footpath on the common, and crossed to a pond, which she walked round and then went home—Bellevue Road is at the end of St. James's Road, but she did not go by the Post Office; she turned away from it, going 30 yards from it—I continued my observations till five o'clock, but did not see her come out again.

Cross-examined. I watched fifteen days, but only three days that week; the earliest date was February 12th, 1891—I made this note the day after last Session, in case you asked me the dates I watched her—I made it from a book which I keep at the office—I made no report with regard to the day I speak of—when I. was watching I probably had my meals at a public-house close by; I sometimes had my dinner at 2.30—it took about five minutes to get from Miss Illingworth's house and back.

Re-examined. I made no written report—I relieved Sergeant Butler on this Tuesday, and when I left, at five o'clock, Mr. Stevens, jun., came on duty—Butler was there when I went there.

E. BUTLER (Re-examined). I watched the house to April 26th; I went on duty about ten o'clock, and saw the postman Cook go to the house with lie registered letter about 12.20.—4 kept observation on the house till Cartwright relieved me, shortly after 12.30.

Cross-examined. I did not give evidence with regard to this matter before the Magistrate; I was not asked any questions about it—I wont about ten, and left about 12.30—the postman delivered the letter, and handed me the receipt, and then Cartwright took up the watching; I met him outside the railway station facing the prisoners house, and left

him there as soon as I had given him proper instructions—the railway station is more than 150 yards from the house—I did not wait while he had his dinner; I do not know whether he had had it.

F. CARTWRIGHT (Re-examined). I had something to eat just before I went on duty, and I had my next meal about 5.30; I did not go anywhere before that for refreshment.

JOSEPH GEORGE STEVENS . I am in the Confidental Enquiry branch of the Post Office—on 26th April I had instructions to watch the prisoner's house at Upper Tooting; I arrived there at 4.50, and met Cartwright, who said something to me—he went away at five o'clock, and I came on and remained till 8.30, during which time the prisoner came out twice the first time she merely went into the front garden, and did not leave the remises; the second time she went across the common towards Balham Station to a fishmonger's, and then to the post office where the postal orders had been issued from, but did not go in; she then went to a confectioner's which she had previously passed, and from there to her sister's, Mrs. Moss, in Ramsden Road, where I left her, when I went off duty at eight o'clock.

Cross-examined. There were five or six hearings before the Magistrate—I was not called with regard to this case—Cartwright told me he had had nothing to eat, and I sent him away at once at about 4.55—I only watched twice, on April 25th and 26th.

Re-examined. A solicitor represented the prisoner at the Police-court, but he did not cross-examine the witnesses with reference to this case.

EMILY ELKINGTON . I live at Princethorpe, Clapham Common, and have known the prisoner for some years; I went to school with her; she is an artist, I believe—I have seen her write, and know her writing—this order to send the belts is, I have not the slightest doubt, in her writing; this little yellow ticket containing the particulars is also her writing, and so is this altered postal order from 1s. to 15s., and the words "Magneto-Electric Company, and this copy, April 26th, and these two of the 22nd and 23rd, and the address and the registered envelope, and the postcard, April 29th.

Cross-examined. I speak to the best of my belief—she writes a great many different hands, and this is one of the many—I think they are all undisguised—I have corresponded with her frequently.

FLORENCE ELIZA HARRISON . I now live at Bournemouth—I formerly lived at Maisonette, Ramsden Road, Balham, with my father—up to September, 1890, I was on terms of friendship with the prisoner—I We corresponded with her, and am well acquainted with her writing—I have no doubt that this letter of April 19th is her writing, also this order form enclosed; also the name of the paying-office and the payee on this postal order; also these letters of April 22nd and 23rd; also the covers of the letters and the letter-card, and the writing on the back of the Magneto Company's letter of April 25th—I have no doubt about any of them.

Cross-examined. They are written in the same kind of writing; not varied—this diary was produced to me by the solicitor to the Post Office, for the purpose or seeing whether the entries in it were in her writing. (One entry in pencil was on April 26th: "First appearance of shadows," and on the next day "shadows," and "shadows" every day

till the day the prisoner was given in custody, the 26th being a day on which the detectives were "shadowing.")

GEORGE SMITH INGLIS . I carry on business in Bed Lion Square, and hare studied handwriting for some yean—I have examined letter A, which is the order for the belts, and B, C, and D, and the altered postal order for 15s., and have formed the opinion that they are written by Miss Illingworth—I compared them with the letter which she said at the Police-court that she wrote, and it is the same—she writes various hands—this diary is written in a small hand—the lines are very close together, but it is the same writing as the others—the second stroke of the small "h's" turns round backwards instead of the other way, and finishes with a small knob—I find that in the diary, too, on 28th February, in the word "birthday," and here is another "h" in the word "three" on document D, and the same in "inches" and "further"—the diary has on the fly-leaf the name and address of the owner—I have compared that with the "118 St. James's Road" in the order forms, and with the signatures—there is a variety now and then; sometimes one letter is more perfect than the other, but they are by the same hand.

Cross-examined. Handwriting is a matter about which even people who have made it a study may be deceived—Mr. Netherclift and I differed; he relied on the "h," showing that it was the writing of another person—I said before the Magistrate, "There is a little variation in the writing"—the letters to the company are in the same writing as the admitted letter; they are not disguised, and if she did not write them somebody else imitated her writing—I have not looked for dissimilarities.

By the COURT. The letters in the former trial (See Vol exi. p. 269) were different ones to those which are before me now.

M.C. FAULDING (Re-examined). These bills come from my company—we do not send them out done up in this way without being asked for them, only in answer to a request—we say (In a letter addressed to the prisoner): "In response to your application we send you" so-and-so—we should not send that without an application.

GUILTYStrongly recommended to mercy by the JURY on account of her youth. .

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-681
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

Related Material

681. MARY AGNES ILLINGWORTH was again indicted for unlawfully sending by post certain postal packets and postcards having thereupon indecent words and matters.

MR. PHILBRICK, Q.C., and MR. CASSALLY Prosecuted, and Mr. C.F. GILL Defended.

ALBERT WILLIAM HARRISON . I am the father of Miss Harrison, who has appeared as a witness this morning—I formerly lived at Maisonette, Ramsden Road, Balham—I do not remember receiving postcards there, but some were forwarded to me from there to Bournemouth—these are them (produced)—the matter on them is offensive to my daughter and myself.

JOHN PHILLIPS . I am chief of the Private Enquiry branch, General Post Office—I received this letter, dated March 6th, 1891, addressed to the secretary, and signed Mary A. Illingworth—it is written on the reverse of a printed form sent by one of our officers to the prisoner.

(MR. GILL here retired from the case, and the prisoner conducted her own defence.)

FRANCIS BIRCHAM NEALE . I am a copyist in the Savings Bank Department—on March 19th I filled up this form, and sent it to Miss Illingworth in this envelope.

EDWIN BUTLER (Policeman). I took the prisoner on May 9th, and received from her a bunch of keys, with which I unlocked a drawer at the house she lived in, and found the envelope upon which the letter of March 19th is written.

J. BADCOCK. I am the Comptroller' of the London postal service—four of these seven postcards bear evidence of having been through the post, the others bear forged paid stamps—this has been through the post as if it was a good stamp—it was cleverly enough done to deceive the Post Office; it was not charged—the other two apparently have not passed through; they have not been delivered to the addressee—all those which purport to be official paid stamps are forgeries—these bearing the letters O. H. M. S. are not genuine—this order form-purports to be sent by me; I did not send it.

JOHN SYLVESTER . I am the head postman of Balham—on December 3rd I received this postcard (produced) at the Balham office—it was stopped on account of the nature of the stamp.

REUBEN JONES . I am head postman at Tooting—on December 4th I found this postcard at the office—it got stamped accidentally, but I stopped it—this red stamp is a forgery—there were several others at the same time.

JAMES FREDERICK STEELE . I am a Post Office supervisor in Wandsworth district—on 14th January, 1891, I accompanied Mr. Bludish, who is now dead, to witness what took place—I saw Miss Illingworth with him, and heard the whole of the proceedings—he produced this letter of January 1st, 1891, to her—it purports to be written by her to the Post Office—he asked her if she wrote it; she said, "Yes"—he pointed out that the word "insensed" was used improperly in two instances.

GEORGE SMITH INGLIS . This letter of January 1st, 1891, and this letter of 19th January, 1891, are written by the same individual—this letter ("Sir, I wish to make a declaration to you that all the libels, forgeries, and frauds have been committed by me without any accomplice whatever. I cannot say I have annoyed Miss Florence Harrison") is in the writing of the same person, and the letter of March 6th is in the same writing.

Prisoner's Defence. I wish to state I am not guilty of any of these offences—I am the victim of a conspiracy.

GUILTY Judgment respited to the October Sessions. .— There were other indictments against the prisoner, for like offences and for perjury.

NEW COURT.—Monday, July 25th, 1892.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-682
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

682. GEORGE CORDING (18) , Unlawfully uttering counterfeit coin.

MR. WILKINSON Prosecuted.

ELIZABETH MILLS . I am the wife of John Alfred Mills, who keeps a dairy at 60, Castle Road, Kentish Town—on 27th June I was serving

when the prisoner came in for a glass of milk—he gave me this bad half-crown—I said, "This is a bad half-crown"—he said, "It is not a bad half-crown"—he said he had it from the Midland Railway, his employers, on the Saturday evening, in his week's wages—he stayed in the shop for five or ten minutes till the policeman came—he did not pay me for the milk—I showed the coin to Mr. Butler—the prisoner was then making his way from the shop—a policeman was sent for, and took the prisoner into custody—the policeman asked me if I was giving the prisoner into custody; I said, "Yes, for giving me this bad half-crown"—the prisoner said nothing—I gave the coin to the constable.

ALFRED NICHOLLS (323 Y). On 27th June I was called to 60, Castle Road, where I found the prisoner—Mrs. Mills said the prisoner had tried to pass a bad half-crown—I took this half-crown from her—I searched the prisoner, and found a good half-crown, a sixpence, and a penny on him—the prisoner said he got the bad half-crown from a gentleman for holding a pony and trap—at the station the prisoner said nothing in answer to the charge—he gave a correct address—he was afterwards, on the same day, identified by Mill ward from twelve other men as having passed another bad half-crown.

WILLIAM MILLWARD . I work for Mr. Keatley, of 9, Raglan Place, Kentish Town—on 2nd April the prisoner came in for a pennyworth of chocolate creams, and gave me this half-crown—I called Mrs. Keatley, who gave him change—the prisoner said he had taken the half-crown from his work—as soon as he took the change he rushed out of the shop—Mrs., Keatley said the half-crown was bad, and I took it to the station, and gave it to the inspector.

RICHARD BULLEN (Sergeant Y). This half-crown was handed to the inspector on 2nd April and given to me, and I have since kept it; it was marked with a cross.

JANE KEATLEY . I keep a general shop at Raglan Place, Kentish Town—on 2nd April Millward gave me this half-crown; I jingled it on the counter and the prisoner said I need not try it, it was quite good—I gave the prisoner 2s. 5d. change—I found the half-crown was bad, and gave it back to Millward, and sent a boy after the prisoner, but he did not catch him.

WILLIAM JOHN WEBSTER . These two half-crowns are counterfeit, from different moulds.

GUILTY Nine Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-683
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

683. THOMAS HAMMOND (25) , Unlawfully having counterfeit coin in his possession with intent to utter it.

MR. PARTRIDGE Prosecuted.

PHILIP WILLIS (Detective G). On 2nd July, about eleven a.m., I was on duty in the Kingsland Road, and I saw the prisoner go to two public-houses—rafter he left the second one I stopped him and told him that I should take him into custody—I took him to the station—on searching him I found loose in his left-hand trousers pocket eight counterfeit sixpences and one counterfeit half-crown—in another pocket I found a purse containing a good half-crown bearing the same date as the counterfeit half-crown—I also found this knife, with marks of plaster of Paris, and this brown paper bag containing plaster of Paris—I told the prisoner he

would be charged with possessing counterfeit coin; he said "Yes; I found them two days ago down at Woolwich."

WILLIAM JOHN WEBSTER . These eight sixpences and the half-crown are counterfeit; seven of the sixpences are from one mould, I am doubtful about the eighth—plaster of Paris is used in the manufacture of counterfeit coin, and for a variety of other things.

The prisoner, in his defence, said he had found the things on the road between Woolwich and Lee, and that he had dipped the knife into the plaster to see if it had been affected by the damp.

GUILTY Fifteen Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-684
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

684. CHARLES BROWN (20) PLEADED GUILTY to uttering counterfeit coin, after a conviction of uttering in December, 1890, at this Court.— Twenty-one Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-685
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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685. WILLIAM MORLEY (19) , to two indictments for stealing post packets, the property of the Postmaster-General, he being employed under the Post Office. The prisoner received a good character, and one witness offered to give him employment, and, with another, to become surety for him.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Discharged on recognisances.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-686
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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686. JAMES DUNBAR (22) , to stealing a post letter and its contents, the property of the Postmaster-General, he being employed by the Post Office.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Eight Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-687
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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687. WILLIAM BENJAMIN COOPER (34) , to a like offence.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Ten Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-688
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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688. WILLIAM BAKER (40) , to marrying Lois Lavenia Brett during the lifetime of his wife.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Six Months' Hard Labour. And

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-10
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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(689). CHARLES JAMES RICKWOOD (43) , to marrying Jane Barrett during the lifetime of his wife.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Three Months' Hard Labour.

OLD COURT.—Tuesday, July 26th, 1892.

Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-690
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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690. WILLIAM CHARLES GALLOWAY (45) PLEADED GUILTY to unlawfully converting to his own use certain valuable securities, which had been entrusted to him. Other Counts, for converting various other securities to his own use.— Five Years' Penal Servitude.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-691
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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691. CHARLES WOOD DUDLEY (33) , to feloniously setting fire to a stack of hay, the property of Alfred Fox, and to a previous conviction in 1890.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Judgment respited that inquiry might be made as to the state of his mind.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-692
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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692. ELI BURDEN (33) , to feloniously marrying Fanny Fuller, his wife being then alive.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Three Months' Hard Labour. And

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-14
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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(693). MARY JANE SHAW (17) , to forging and uttering an order for £2; also to stealing a blank cheque of Annie Louisa Lee, her mistress.— [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Discharged on recognisances.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-694
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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694. JOSEPH GILCHRIST , Maliciously publishing a libel of and concerning Thomas Mein.

MR. GEOGHEGAN Prosecuted, and MR. CHAPMAN Defended.

By the advice of MR. CHAPMAN the prisoner withdrew his plea of Not Guilty, and expressed his regret, upon which the JURY found a verdict of

GUILTY .— Discharged on recognisances to keep the peace for twelve calendar months.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-695
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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695. CHARLES NEWBOLD , Unlawfully selling certain scandalous and obscene articles.

To this, by the advice of MR. BUBNIE, the prisoner declined to plead, and the COURT ordered a plea of Not Guilty to be entered.

MR. H. AVORY Prosecuted, and MR. BURNIE Defended.

GUILTY of selling articles to be used for immoral purposes, but that they were not of themselves indecent or obscene. The COURT ruled that this was a verdict of


25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-696
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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696. PERCY SMITH and JOHN HENRY CHARLES WHITE , Unlawfully exposing and causing to be sold certain obscene articles, with intent that they should be used for immoral purposes.

The prisoners refused to plead, and a plea of Not Guilty was ordered by the COURT to be entered for them.

MR. H. AVORY Prosecuted; MR. GEOGHEGAN appeared for Smith, and MR. F. FULTON for White. NOT GUILTY .

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-697
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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697. JOHN KNOTT (29) PLEADED GUILTY ** to burglary in the dwelling-house of Arthur Paget, with intent to steal, after a conviction of felony at this Court on 20th October, 1890, in the name of John Thurger Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-698
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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698. JOHN REED (21) , Stealing a bicycle, the goods of Harry Naylor.

HARRY NAYLOR . I am a tobacconist, of 64, Porchester Road, Paddington—on June 25th, about 8.20, the prisoner called on me and hired a bicycle from that morning to the following Monday evening, for which he paid me 8s. 6d. hire and 1s. 6d. deposit for damages—he came on Monday and said he could not ride it back because there was no I amp Attached to it, but he would bring it the next morning—he did not do so, and I found it at a pawnbroker's—it is worth £20—when he came on the Monday he asked me to let him have it on hire for a week—I said I could not, and he said he would bring it on the Tuesday.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I did not offer it to you for £12 it cost £20 new—it has had a year's, wear and tear—you wanted to keep it to the end of the week, and offered to pay the extra hire—you wired to me on Tuesday: "Will return machine and pay extra hire on Monday"—you offered on the Monday when you were arrested, to pay the extra hire and any expenses I was out of pocket, and produced a half-sovereign.

JOHN LYON . I am manager to Fanny Levy, a pawnbroker, of Edgware Road—on 20th June, about 9.15 a.m., the prisoner came and asked if I could take a bicycle in—I said, "Yes, if you have the receipt"—he handed me this receipt for £11 11s. in the name of Blackman, of Kew, upon which I advanced him the money—Mr. Naylor came and identified the machine.

Cross-examined. You asked me not to stow it away, because you would redeem it on Monday morning.

JOHN MARTIN (Police Sergeant S). On Monday evening, July 4th, I received the prisoner in custody—he said, "I got into a scrape; I did not intend to deprive the prosecutor of the bicycle"—he handed me his purse, in which were three receipts. (For £10 10s., £9, and £9 9s.)—I have seen him write—these three receipts and the one produced by the pawnbroker are his writing—he gave an address, which I found to

be false, but ultimately an address at Ledbury Road, which I found correct.

Prisoner's defence. I had no intention of stealing the bicycle; I admit I raised money on it—instead of going home to my parents I went into a lodging and so got into difficulties—I fully intended to take it back—this is the draft receipt for a machine which a friend lent me sometime ago, and which I redeemed.

GUILTY Four Months' Hard Labour.

NEW COURT.—Tuesday, July 26th, 1892.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-699
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

699. JOHN KENNEDY (39) and ARTHUR BARNES (26) PLEADED GUILTY to stealing a van and horse, a set of harness, and twenty sacks, the property of Walter Robert Williams.

BARNES also PLEADED GUILTY to a previous conviction in January, 1891.

Nine Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-700
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

700. JAMES HENDRY (19) , Feloniously forging and uttering an. order for £47 10s., with intent to defraud.

MR. ELDRIDGE Prosecuted.

CHARLES EDWARD SCARISBURG . I am chief cashier at the Holborn Circus branch of the Union Bank—on 13th June, about a quarter to twelve, the prisoner came there, and presented this cheque for £47 10s.—it is an open cheque, and did not require endorsement, but it was endorsed—it purported to be drawn by Mr. Belton; I knew Mr. Belton's writing; I thought there was something wrong about it—I asked the prisoner how he would take it—he said, "Two £10 notes, and the rest in hard cash"—I said, "Did you get this cheque from Mr. Belton?"—he said, "Yes, I did"—I said, "Is he at his office now?"—he said, "I don't know whether he is now, but he was when I left"—I then sent our porter to the door, with instructions not to let him out, and also sent a clerk to Mr. Belton; he returned almost immediately, and said, in the prisoner's presence, it was a forgery; he was then given into custody.

BERNARD JOSEPH BELTON . I am an auctioneer, of 12, Hatton Garden—I have an account at this bank—this is not my signature to the cheque, or signed by my authority—I do not know the prisoner—this cheque has been torn out of the middle of my cheque-book, which was in use at the time; I kept it in a drawer in my office-table; the drawer was kept locked, and I had the keys in my pocket—I only discovered that the cheque had been taken when they sent to me from the bank—I saw the prisoner there, and asked him where he got it from—he said a man at the corner had given it to him—I produce a genuine signature on a cheque taken from the same book—I had seen my book safe on the previous Friday or Saturday.

FREDERICK COOMBER (181 G). On 13th June, about twelve, I was called to the bank, and the prisoner was given into my custody—he said, "I know nothing about that, a man who is outside asked me to cash it for him"—on the way to the station in a cab he said the man was going to wait for him at a public-house somewhere near the Gray's Inn Road,. but he did not know the n«me—I found on him 3s. in silver and. 2d. in

copper, and a silver watch and chain—lie gave a correct address in White Hart Street, Drury Lane—I found this small memorandum-book on him—he is a market porter.

Prisoner's Defence. When I took the cheque in I did not know it was forged—I gave all the information I could to the detective—I have a good character, and worked for Mr. Alexander for twelve months—I am innocent.

GUILTY of uttering. Three previous convictions were proved against him.

Eighteen Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-701
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

701. THOMAS WILSON (54) and GEORGE WHITE (43) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Herbert Scriven Luker, and stealing an Indian puzzle.

MR. LYNE Prosecuted.

HERBERT SCRIVEN LUKER . I am housekeeper to Major George Painter, of 8, Regent Street—I live on the premises—on Saturday night, 18th June, I had been out, and came back about a quarter-past eleven, and found the house in charge of the police—the window in the area was broken, and in the area I found a small Indian puzzle, which had been thrown through the window—it is my property, worth about a shilling—I do not know the prisoners—I afterwards saw them at the station—a person could reach the article by putting his arm through the broken window—it is 4 ft. 6 in. from the ground, and the area is 15 ft. deep.

GEORGE HOWARD . I am a waiter at the Junior United Service Club—on the night of 18th June, about ten, I was in Jermyn Street—the prisoners came up one on each side of me and pushed me—I asked what they wanted; they did not answer—I walked on down Regent Street—they molested two or three more gentlemen—at the corner of Charles Street I saw Wilson standing by the archway keeping watch—White made two attempts to jump into the area of No. 8; at the third attempt he succeeded—I looked over the railings, and heard the breaking of glass Wilson said, "What do you want? what is your business, damn you?"—he pushed against me, and his elbow caught me in the mouth—I went and got a policeman, and told him—Wilson ran across the road; I saw him arrested.

Cross-examined by Wilson. You did not come up to me and ask me to buy some things you were, selling—I did not see you with any things.

WILLIAM PORTWOOD (289 C). Howard came to me in Regent Street, and I went across the road to No. 8—I saw Wilson walking up and down outside the railings, looking down the area in a suspicious manner—I heard the smashing of glass—directly Wilson saw me he ran across the road; I went after him, and arrested him—he said, "What do you want me for?"—I said, "For being concerned with another man down the area trying to break into No. 8"—the other constable brought Wright out of the house, and we took them both to the station.

EDWIN POLLARD (Detective Sergeant C). On the morning of 19th June I went to 8, Regent Street—I saw in the area this small puzzle; the area window had been smashed by a blow from some instrument; it was open about eighteen inches right in the middle, and the glass was lying inside—there were marks of blood on the glass, also on the frame and

the side of the wall—I went to the station, and examined both the prisoners' hands—on White's right hand I saw cuts on his little finger, the index finger, and the back of his hand, also blood on the cuff of his right sleeve—I asked him how he accounted for it—he said it was a scratch.

ROBERT POTIPHAR (15 C R). On the night of 18th June, about twenty minutes to eleven, I was in Regent Street—my attention was called to a man down the area—I went there and saw White down the area—I rang the bell and got admission to the house—I asked White what he was doing there. He replied, "You b——well want to know something"—I took him into custody—I saw blood on his hand at the station—I found on him a knife and a small pair of scissors—a stone was given to me on the following Tuesday, when the area had been swept—I asked White if he knew anything about the window that was broken; he made no reply; there are no steps at the area gate; he must have slid down.

The prisoners' statements before the Magistrate:—White says: "I was drunk at the time. I had been out selling flowers. I had had nothing to eat, and the drink took effect, and I went into the area for a rest. "Wilson says: "Since I have been home I have been getting a living by selling penny articles. I am innocent of this, and know nothing of it. I was not molesting. I was selling my articles."

Wilson's defence. I was out selling these articles, which I showed to the Magistrate. The gentleman beckoned me over. I thought he was going to buy something. I did not molest him. I know nothing about the house. They never saw me nigh the house.

White's defence. I own I was down the area, as I was found there, but I had been drinking hard and it took effect on me; I must have fallen down the area.

GUILTY .—Wilson also PLEADED GUILTY to a previous conviction at Clerkenwell on 9th March, 1891, in the name of John Davis, and other convictions were proved against him.— Twelve Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-702
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

702. CHARLES FOX (25) , Burglary in the dwelling-house of Samuel James Cadman, and stealing six curtains, and other goods.

MR. JOSEPH Prosecuted.

HARRIET JEWTTT . I live at 81, Thomas Street, Burdett Road—on 21st June I had gone to bed—I was awoke about half-past one by a shaking of my window, which is over the kitchen; the window was a little way down from the top—I rose up and pulled my blind on one side and saw two men, the prisoner is one of them; the other was taller—they crept away on their hands and knees along the wall, and descended near the end of it into East Street—I afterwards saw the prisoner at Greenwich Police-court, and identified him—when I saw him in the night he had his hand on the top of the sash—he had no bandage on then—he had it on at the Police-court.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I am positive you are the man; I know you by your features and stature; you faced me—I did not go and give information to the police; a witness did—I told the police one of the men was tall, and the other tall and rather stout—I rent apartments of Mrs. Cadman—I had no light in my room, but I could see you through the window.

LOUISA CADMAN . I live at 81, Thomas Street, Burdett Road; it is the dwelling-house of Samuel James Cadman—on 21st June, between one and two, I was aroused by the last witness—the house was safely looked up when I went to bed—when I came down at seven I found a pane of glass had been broken out of the kitchen window—I missed a basket off the chair, containing an antimacassar and other articles, which I afterwards saw at the Police-court—these are them.

FRANCIS EDWARD HART . I am a waterman—on 21st June, between one and half-past, I rowed two men from Limehouse to Rotherhithe—the prisoner is one of the men—he had this basket with him—a tallish young man was with him—I asked the prisoner for my fare—he said he would chuck me into the mud—I saw him on the Saturday, and recognised him.

Cross-examined. You hired my boat, and when we got across the other man jumped out, and said he was going to get change at a coffee-shop and he escaped—I stopped you as you took up the basket to go.

ALFRED HILLS (174 M). On 21st June, about 2.30 a.m., I saw the prisoner and another man running—the prisoner had this basket with him—I stopped the prisoner, and asked him who the basket belonged to—he said, "To my sister down the street"—I said, "You will have to go back to your sister's"—he said, "It is no use telling a lie; it belongs to my sister over the water"—I then took him into custody; and took him to the station—after he went about 100 yards he became very violent, and struck me several times, and I used violence to detain him—at the station he said a man and woman gave him the clothes to carry.

Cross-examined. I had no chance of apprehending the other man—I knew that man to be a thief and vagabond.

WILLIAM FOLEY (Detective Sergeant K). I took the prisoner into custody—at Greenwich Police-court he was placed among about twelve others—Mrs. Jewitt identified him at once—when I told him the charge he said he was not there—going from Greenwich pier to Limehouse pier people turned round and looked, and as they did so the witness Hart came up and looked in his face, and said, "You are one of the b——s I rowed across the other morning, and you refused to pay me my fare, and threatened to chuck me into the b——y water."

The prisoner, in his statement before the Magistrate and in his defence, protested his innocence.

GUILTY .—He also PLEADED GUILTY to a previous conviction in February, 1891. Fifteen Months' Hard Labour.

FOURTH COURT.—Tuesday, July 26th, 1892.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-703
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

703. CHARLES ROSE (30), MARY DONOVAN (28), and SUSANNAH SHAW (28) , Stealing a coat, vest, and pair of boots, the property of Frederick Walley.

MR. METCALFE Prosecuted.

FREDERICK. WALLEY . I am a seaman—I was paid off my ship on 9th July, with about £7 10s., and went to live at 41, Leman Street—on the

afternoon of 11th July I was drinking in two public-houses—Shaw told me she had a room across the road, and if I wished to stay with a young woman I could go and stay there; she took me to it; Donovan went with us—I had a few shillings in my trousers pocket, and £5 in a leather pocket-book in the inner pocket of my coat; they did not know about that—I went into the room with Donovan—as I took off my coat, vest, and boots, Shaw took them up, and said she would hang them up, and she and Donovan went out of the room, and Rose came in—I had not seen him before—he said, "What are you doing in my room?"—I said, "I did not know I was in your room; I was brought here"—he said, "If you don't go out b——y quick I will throw you out"—I said I would go out, and I asked for my clothes—he said he did not know anything about my clothes; I went out without my clothes, money, or boots—I saw a policeman outside afterwards, and made a complaint to him, and he went in and searched the house.

Cross-examined by Rose. I am sure you are the man.

Cross-examined. I spoke to another woman in the public-house—I had seen the £5 safe in my coat pocket that morning two hours before, when I had come from Hamburg—I placed it in my pocket-book with the certificates of character; I had actually handled the £5 then; it was in gold and silver.

PATRICK LYNCH (189 H). On 11th July I was in Leman Street, and I was called to No. 41—I saw the prisoner outside; he complained to me; he was sober—he was almost in a nude state, and round him was a crowd in which was Hose—I took Bose about a quarter of an hour afterwards at the bottom of Leman Street and Cable Street—I told him I was going to take him into custody for being concerned with two women in robbing a man of his clothes in 41, Leman Street—he said, "How could I have done that when the man was paid off at Hamburg with £1 5s. only?"—when charged at the station he said, "I never was in the room"—I found out it was not his room—I have seen Shaw before, but know nothing of her; I do not know whether she lives at 41—I cannot say I know anything of Dovovan.

Cross-examined by Donovan. I am not aware that you came to the station.

ISAAC FORD (438 H). About seven p.m., on 11th July, I saw Shaw in Leman Street drunk—she said, "There is a man of the name of Bose charged here with robbery who is innocent; I am guilty of the crime"—I charged her with being drunk and disorderly; she gave the address, 41, Leman Street—I have seen Shaw and Bose together before; I have not seen Donovan with them.

WILLIAM THOMPSON (Detective H). At half-past twelve on 17th July I took Donovan from a description and private information—when I told her the charge she said, "I admit being there; the clothes he gave to a girl to sleep with; we never took any money, because he did not have any.

GUILTY .—ROSE then PLEADED GUILTY** to a conviction of felony in January, 1890.— Five Years' Penal Servitude. SHAW and DONOVAN— Six Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-704
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

704. LOUIS FRANKLIN (20) and CHARLES GRIFFITHS (18) .Robbery with violence, together with other persona unknown, on William Rissler, and stealing a cigar-holder.

MR. W. J. ABRAMS Prosecuted.

WILLIAM RISSLER . I live at 11, Lintoll Street, Bermondsey—on 10th July, about half-past one a.m., I was walking at the corner of Tower Hill, quite sober, with a young woman—the prisoners and two others came and stood in front of us, and spoke to my young woman, who answered them—I said, "What do these men want?" and I was struck at the back of the neck and thrown down, a hand was held over my mouth, and my pockets were rifled, and a meerschaum cigar-holder was taken out of my waistcoat pocket—the man that held me got away; I took this scarf from his neck—they broke away, and were brought back by a constable—I am sure the prisoners are two of the men; I lost sight of the man that held me, but not of the prisoners.

Cross-examined by Franklin. Both of you were at my trousers pockets and side pockets, all at the same time.

Cross-examined by Griffiths. You were leaning over me; when I sang out you both ran at the same time.

LOUISA NEWMAN . I was with Rissler on this morning—I do not recognise the prisoners.

EDWIN WHITE (Detective City). About half-past one a.m. on 10th July I saw the prisoners in the company of two other men in the Minories, going towards Tower Hill; on Tower Hill they spoke to Rissler and Newman, whom I then saw on the ground—I ran up—when the prosecutor got up the two men not in custody got hold of his shoulders from the back, while the prisoners felt in his pockets—some men passing in a cart stopped and shouted "Police!" and the prisoners and the other two men ran away—I followed them to Savage Gardens, when the two prisoners ran into Crutched Friars, one turning to the left and the other to the right—they were stopped by constables—I never lost sight of them.

JOSEPH COOPER (762 City). About twenty minutes to two a.m. on 10th July I was in Crutched Friars—I saw the two prisoners run out of Savage Gardens into Crutched Friars—a whistle was blown, and "Stop them!" was called out—I stopped Griffiths, who said nothing when charged.

WILLIAM OGDEN (755 City). About twenty minutes to two on this morning I was in Crutched Friars; I heard a whistle blow and saw the prisoners running, and I caught Franklin—he said nothing—at the station when charged he said he was innocent.

Franklin, in his defence, said that he spoke to Newman, and that these two men came up and knocked the prosecutor down, and that he stood looking: and when the constable came and the men ran he ran too.


Franklin PLEADED GUILTY to a conviction of felony in October, 1891— Twelve Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-705
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

705. JOHN BRADLEY (41) , Burglary in the dwelling-house of James Healey, and stealing an overcoat and other articles, his property. Second Count, receiving the same.

MR. MORRIS Prosecuted.

JAMES HEALEY . I live at 28, Moeran Street, Poplar—on Wednesday, 22nd June, I missed this macintosh overcoat, black skirt, and long jacket

which had been hanging on a door—on the Monday night about eleven o'clock my house was securely fastened, bolted, and locked—there was no fastening on my front window, and I could not say whether it was exactly closed when we went to bed—in my overcoat pocket I had this small 1891 diary—on Wednesday when I missed the things I informed the police, and on Thursday I went to the Poplar Police-station and recognised the articles as mine.

JAMES DAVIS (223 K). On Tuesday, 21st June, at one a.m., I was in Moeran Street—I saw the prisoner and two men—afterwards I returned and saw the prisoner and the two men standing in the same place—they ran off directly down Speeding Gardens—we followed—two of them ran out from behind a dark corner—the prisoner when I turned on my light was hiding, with the skirt, jacket and dolman, behind the fence—he threw away the jacket as he ran—when we caught him he said he was looking for his old woman—he was wearing this overcoat; in the pocket I found this diary.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I did not take you when I first saw you because I had a portmanteau in one hand and despatches in the other—this is the jacket you threw away.

THOMAS DAVIS (504 K). At one on the morning of 21st June I was in the West India Dock Road, and was informed by James Davis—I went to Moeran Street and saw three men standing outside the prosecutor's house—they ran half-way across the road, and returned and went into North Street—the prisoner is one of those men—he has no beard now—I turned my I amp on one of the other men and asked what they were doing—the prisoner said, "I want my old woman"—I turned my I amp on him, and saw him ramming some clothes through a gate—they ran—we ran and caught the prisoner, who said, "You have made a mistake"—he pretended to be drunk and incapable, and we had to carry him nearly all the way to the station—when charged he said, "I did not do the job, but I saw it done"—he was wearing this overcoat—when I afterwards took him from the cell he was without the. overcoat; I asked him where it was; he said, "I never had an overcoat"—it was afterwards found under the cell seat.

Cross-examined. The other constable was with me.

ARTHUR REYNOLDS (29 K R). I examined the cells at the Poplar Station on 21st June, and found this overcoat torn up in pieces and hidden in different places under the seat of the cell in which the prisoner had been confined—he left the cell about half-past eight a.m., and I found the overcoat about half-past ten; no one had been in the cell in the interval.

JOSHUA GRIMBALD (Inspector K). I went to 28, Moeran Street; on 22nd June—I found finger-marks outside the window-sill of the parlour window on the ground floor, as if some man had put his fingers in the dust to get out.

The prisoner, in his defence, said that he had bought the sack containing the things in Moeran Street for 1s. from a man who said he had no lodging-money.


He then PLEADED GUILTY to a conviction of felony in May, 1884.— Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-706
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

706. JAMES PEARSON (21) , Burglary in the dwelling-house of Caroline Napier Cunningham, and stealing three sugar basins and other goods, her property. Second Count, receiving the same.

MR. BLACKWELL Prosecuted.

PATRICK RILEY . I am caretaker to Mrs. Caroline Napier Cunningham, at Inverness Terrace, Hyde Park—at half-past eight on 6th July I went to bed after having locked everything up—next morning I got up at twenty minutes past five, and noticed two bundles in the back garden—I went to put on my trousers—my wife rushed into the kitchen, and I rushed after her and saw the prisoner get over the wall, and then he ran out of the front gate, with me after him—he dropped both the bundles—I followed and caught him in Queen's Road, and gave him into Custody—the things in these bundles belong to Mrs. Cunningham, and were in her house, of which I am caretaker—I went back and examined the rooms with the superintendent, and found the side window of the back dining-room open, and the place all upside down, the cupboards and everything open—when I caught the prisoner he told me to let him go, it was not him.

CHARLES REED (269 F). About half-past five a.m. on 7th July I was on duty in Inverness Terrace—I saw the prisoner rush out of the front garden of 107, Inverness Terrace, followed by Riley—I gave chase, and caught the prisoner in Queen's Road—he said, "It was not me; it was my mate,"—I took him back to the house, where he said, "My mate went in the house and I kept watch outside."

MATTHEW CULDON (Inspector F). I went to this house—I found marks on the back dining-room window-sill, as if caused by a foot, and at the back of the window-catch a mark as from a knife—I found this skeleton key on the sideboard, and this piece of an old table knife on a chair—the clasp could be forced back by the knife.

The prisoner, in his statement before the Magistrate, said that a man told him to come with him if he wanted to earn a few shillings; and that when they got to the house the man threatened him with violence if he ran away, and asked him to carry the things. In his defence he stated that he met a man who asked him to carry the bundle.

GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-707
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

707. EDWARD SMITH (23) , Stealing 48lbs. weight of metal pining, the goods of the Tottenham Lager Beer Company. Second Count, receiving the same.

MR. LE MAISTRE Prosecuted.

FRANCIS THOMAS DANCE . I am a fitter at the Lager Beer Company, Tottenham—I identify this piping as belonging to them—they supply the whole apparatus from standard to pump, and when the pipe gets stopped, or the apparatus is disused, the piping has to be returned—this is returned piping—it is worth about 10d. or 10 1/2 d. per lb.—the pipes are sold at Mr. Farmiloe's.

ANGELO MAKES (95 N). At 10.30 p.m. on 16th July I was in the Napier Road, Tottenham—I saw the prisoner carrying a quantity of tin piping on his shoulder, and asked him how he became possessed of it—he asked me what it had to do with me, and threw the pipe at me and turned to run away—I caught hold of him and asked him the same question again, and he gave me the same answer; he took hold of my collar with his right hand and of my whistle-chain with his left—we fell to the ground—I struggled for five or seven minutes, and succeeded

in blowing my whistle, and Lucas came to my assistance—while lie was taking the prisoner from me the prisoner bit his hand.

JAMES LUCAS (88 N). On 16th July, about 10.45, I heard a whistle blown—I went to Napier Road, and found Marks lying on the ground with the prisoner, whom I assisted in taking to the station.

The prisoner stated that he did not know anything about it, as he had had a drop of drink at the time.


He then PLEADED GUILTY to a conviction of felony in February, 1884.— Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

The COURT awarded Constable Marks £1.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-708
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

708. PETER MCCLINTOCK (26) and GEORGE WILLIAMS (25) Robbery with violence, with another person unknown, on George Walter Plumbley, and stealing his watch and chain.

MR. CONDY Prosecuted.

GEORGE WALTER PLUMBLEY . I am a carpenter, living at Morrison's Buildings, Commercial Road—about 12.20 a.m. on 3rd July I came upstairs and put my key into my door, when I was collared round the neck and nearly stifled—I turned and said, "What the—are you doing?" and I caught Williams by the neck with my right hand and threw him down—my brother, who was in my house that night, heard scuffling and came out—I found my watch was taken out, and I made a grab and caught it in McClintock's left hand—he made off through my door, breaking the chain—there was no need for him to be there, because it was private property—my brother ran after him—I kept Williams down in the corner and never let him go till a constable came—my watch was afterwards picked up off the ground; McClintock had taken it out of my pocket while Williams kept me round the neck.

Cross-examined by McClintock The lights on the stairs are turned out at half-past ten; and there were no lights—I can identify you by your coat and face—I said to my brother, "Catch that man, he has tried to steal my watch."

Cross-examined by Williams. I held you down beside the door, and you said, "Please, sir, it wasn't me, it wasn't me"—there was a light in the opposite building, which showed a light on to the passage where I live, and I could identify you from a thousand.

BENJAMIN WALLACE PLUMBLEY . I live at 24, Morrison's Buildings—I am a carpenter and builder, and the last witness's brother—on this night I heard my brother come down the passage and put his key in the door, and instead of the door opening there was a scuffling outside—my sister opened the door and I went out, and my brother shouted, "Stop him, stop him! he has got my watch!"—I dashed after one of the men who had been holding my brother, and who broke away just as I got to the end of the passage—I caught him on the second flight of stairs—I did not lose sight of him for a moment, and when the constable came up I was holding him—I told the constable to go up higher, as my brother was holding another one.

Cross-examined by McClintock. The lights were turned off at the time, but a light shows from the place opposite—you were at the end of the passage when I opened the door, you two and my brother, all of a cluster—you did not give me the watch back, I don't know if you had a watch.

WILLIAM POWELL (341 H). I heard cries of police, and went to Morrison's

Buildings—I saw a big crowd outside—I went up, and on the third balcony I saw the prosecutor holding Williams—the prosecutor told me that the prisoners had followed him up, and just as he was going to unlock the door, Williams took him by the throat and McClintock snatched at his watch and chain—this is the condition in which I found the watch and chain—I saw the prosecutor's brother on the first landing as I went up; he had hold of McClintock, and he told me to go up to the third balcony, as his brother was up there with another prisoner.

Cross-examined by McClintock. There were no lights on the stairs.

Cross-examined by Williams. The prosecutor said that just as his watch was about to drop on the ground he put his hand and prevented it.

Re-examined. You could see, there was a I amp close by outside.

WILLIAM HANSCOM (344 H). I went after Powell to these buildings, and Plumbley gave McClintock into my custody.

Cross-examined by McClintock. There were no lights on the stairs, only right down on the ground floor—you could see enough to identify a man if you stood in the light of the I amps from the street.

Re-examined. The light from the street shone on to the balcony.

FREDERICK WENSEY (402 H). I have known McClintock for about eighteen months and Williams for about six months—on the night of the 3rd July I saw them in the company of another man at the corner of Commercial Road and High Street, about ten minutes past twelve—I was at the station twenty-five minutes later, when they were given in charge—they said nothing.

Cross-examined by McClintock. I saw you at the corner of High Street eighteen months ago—you are always there.

Cross-examined by Williams. I saw you at the same place six months ago; both of you are always there—I would not swear exactly to the time.

McClintock, in his statement before the Magistrate, said that he went up to see what was the matter. In his defence he argued that the prosecutor could not have identified him in the dark.

Williams asserted his innocence.


MCCLINTOCK,* WILLIAMS*— Twelve Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-709
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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709. JAMES LEMON (43) PLEADED GUILTY to breaking into the warehouse of Harry Hodson, and stealing 22 lbs. of lead; also to a previous conviction of felony.— Six Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-710
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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710. WILLIAM JEFFREYS (34) , to burglary in the dwelling-house of Joseph Crookes, and stealing his goods; also to a previous conviction of felony. [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Judgment respited. And

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-32
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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(711) SEPTIMUS CHALONER (60) , to forging and uttering a receipt for £10. [Pleaded Guilty: See original trial image.] Judgment respited.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-712
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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712. GEORGE LAWS , Stealing a coat, vest, and a quantity of cloth, the property of Emmanuel Franklin and another, his masters.

MR. GEOGHEGAN Prosecuted, and MR. PAUL TAYLOR Defended.

EMMANUEL FRANKLIN . I am a tailor and outfitter, at 71 and 72, St. Mary Axe—the prisoner has been in my employment for two and a half years as a cutter—I placed implicit reliance in him—his wages were about £5 a week on an average—a coat and waistcoat made for Mr. Austen, a customer, were a misfit, and were returned into stock, and subsequently sold to Mr. Morton, but not suiting Mr. Morton he returned

them, and that was the last I heard of them—if the prisoner sold any article he should have entered it in the usual way in the measure-book; every order had to be entered in the measure-book—there is no entry in that book of the sale of Austen's misfit to Keats, a billiard-marker—the prisoner keeps that book—I have since seen the clothes at the Police-court and at Keats's house; these are the coat and waistcoat made for Austen—I have tweed in my shop similar to these trousers—when I buy a roll of tweed there is a ticket on it, showing the length of the roll; the roll of tweed like these trousers is five yards short—about two and a half yards go to make a pair of trousers—there was a ticket on the trousers when I saw them at Keats's house—that ticket, to the best of my belief, was in the prisoner's writing, which I know well—he had no authority from me to sell the suit; he has never accounted to me for the money for it—he had authority to sell to my customers, and if he so sold he would enter it in the book—he had no duty to take the money—he had no right to take goods off my premises and sell them to customers who were not mine.

Cross-examined. I took him into my service on Mr. Stewart's recommendation; he gave him the highest character as an honest man and clever cutter—when I took the prisoner into my employment I knew nothing about tailoring; I am a jeweller by trade—since then the prisoner has been my cutter and foreman, with complete control of the manufacturing department only—we were on terms of intimacy, we had confidence in each other—there were not confidential relations between us—he never lent me money—there was not a running account between us; I had a personal account—if the prisoner wanted any cloth, the goods were booked in the usual way—there were not betting transactions between us continually; nothing of the kind—the prisoner had £2 a week, and half-a-crown for every suit ho cut; I do not call that commission—we had words on, I think, 8th July last; he was rather rude to me before customers—I don't recollect denying at the Police-court that I had a quarrel with the prisoner on the 8th July, and that led to his leaving me—I won't say we had a quarrel, we had words—I did not on his saying he would leave me pay him £14 16s. 6d., made up of £4 16s. 6d. for wages and commission, and £10 he had lent me—I think I paid him £4 16s. 6d. for wages on that day; you are completely wrong as to the £10—there were other people at the end of the same room, which is a large one—the prisoner was not in a position to cut any of my cloths without making an entry of it—he was not allowed to work on his own account; he cut for Taplin and Hopcraft, two tailors, with my permission—I amended what I said at the Police-court, "I know he had private customers of his own," by private customers I meant Taplin and Hopcraft—I know Seelig, Richter, and Marks—I never allowed the prisoner to cut my cloth for his own customers'—I said at the Police-court, "The accused has cut from my goods stuff for his own customers by asking my permission," but I amended it—I do not mean by amending it that I said, "I cannot say whether he cut the stuff he used for other people before asking me"—the clerk of the court put that question to me, and my answer was that I meant Hopcraft and Taplin—he might have cut the stuff without asking me, there were many rolls of cloth short—he was not allowed to have private customers—I meant by private customers Taplin and Hopcraft; I allowed him to cut for them on my premises—

he introduced customers to me, and their names are on my books—in two years he only introduced £64 worth of business—he is a man of large experience in the tailoring trade—he has not a large connection, I saw very little of it—Mr. Stewart introduced the prisoner to me—I do not think the prisoner could earn £10 a week—he earned with me at least £5 a week—Mr. Taplin was subpœnaed by my solicitor here to give evidence—I saw him at the Police-court, and spoke to him outside the Court—he said, "I shall tell the truth in this case"—it is absolutely untrue that the coat and vest I charge the prisoner with stealing were offered by me to Taplin for 24s., or that, on Taplin refusing, the prisoner offered a sovereign for them, or that I said, "Very well, you can have it"—there is no foundation for it—Taplin is not a friend of mine—I have no reason to suppose that he is actuated by any hostility to me—if he comes into the box and says anything of what you have put to me it is a mistake on his part—Taplin was not called at the Police-court; I left the matter in my solicitor's hands—it was the prisoner's duty to enter up simply the measure-book—Coutman, my brother-in-law, is in my employment; he assists the prisoner—he does the bookkeeping, but that is a distinct thing from entering orders in the measure-book; the prisoner does that—all orders should be entered by him, but sometimes he is absent, and then whoever is there enters them; so that they are kept by a number of men—Austen's order was entered in the measure-book—when the goods came back from him they were sold to Morton, and there is the entry in the boy's writing—I never said the prisoner kept the books, he put down the measurements he took himself—he had nothing to do with the stock-book—I did not say at the Police-court he should have entered it; I kept the stock-book—I don't recollect saying at the Police-court, "He should have entered any measurements taken by him in the stock-book;" what was meant was the measure-book—he never kept the stock-book, and never made entries in it—the measure and stock books are separate—a customer's measure is put down, and when the prisoner cut the cloth he would write against the order the number of yards he cut—as to the coat, there would be Austen's order in the stock-book originally, and when it was returned it would be booked in the ledger again to Morton—the prisoner did not keep the ledger—the boy booked it to Morton in the order or measure book—when it came back it should not have been booked again in the measure-book if it had been sold—on the Friday I had had a few words with the prisoner—we shut on Saturdays—on the Monday he did not come and say he would not leave me in the lurch, although I had not treated him very well—when he was working in my employment I had him arrested—I did not know he was going to leave at the end of the week; otherwise he would have given me notice on Friday—I say emphatically he never told me he was going to leave me.

Re-examined. If there was no entry in my stock or measure book I should have no means of checking the cloth the prisoner cut—the prisoner was cutter, and did not make up suits—he cut for tailors, and the private customers, such as Hopcraft, Taplin, and Lyons he cut for, were tailors—there is no entry in my book of this suit being sold—if the police had not communicated with me I should never have known the suit had been sold till I took stock at the end of the year—the prisoner knew I took stock at the end of every year—there were two hearings at the

Police-court, and this matter was discovered between the first and second hearings.

WILLIAM KEATS . I am a billiard-marker, at billiard-rooms near Loughborough Junction—I have known the prisoner for two months or rather more, as playing billiards at those rooms—one night I remarked that I should like to have a suit of secondhand clothes—the prisoner said, "I have a coat and waistcoat I think that would fit you; it was a misfit; I will send it and see if it would fit you"—about two days afterwards he sent me this coat and vest by Garter Peterson's—there was no ticket or invoice with them—two or three days afterwards I saw him and paid him 10s. on account; altogether I paid him £1 2s. 6d. for the coat and waistcoat—a little while after I said, "If you have a pair of trousers you have left off and could sell me, that would be decent enough to go away from home in, I would be very, glad to have them"—he said, "I will see what I can do for you," and he took my measure with a tape from his pocket—some time afterwards I received these trousers, with the ticket still on them, I think—I put the trousers in a drawer at home—I paid the prisoner 9s. 6d. for them—I did not know he was a tailor, but when I had the trousers I thought he must be in that line—I did not know hit name at that time; I knew he was known at the tobacco-shop in front of the billiard-room.

HARRY FISHER SALTER . I am a traveller to Mr. Franklin—I identify the material of this coat and vest as having been made for Franklin, who has stuff similar to it in his shop—this ticket on the trousers is, to the best of my belief, in the prisoner's writing.

THOMAS ABBOT (Detective Sergeant City). Between the remands I searched the prisoner's house—I found this suit of clothes at Mr. Keats's house, the ticket was then on the trousers.

Witnesses for the Defence.

ARTHUR TAPLIN . I live at 32, Hereford Road, Bayswater, and am a practical tailor—the prisoner has been in the habit of working for me; I have always found him thoroughly reliable—this coat and vest were brought to me in Mr. Franklin's shop, and I was asked if I could get rid of them because they were misfits—they were offered to me for £1, and I said I could make a coat and vest like that myself for about 28s., and the prisoner offered £1 for the coat and waistcoat there and then, and Mr. Franklin said, "All right," and I was under the impression that the coat and waistcoat were sold to the prisoner—I received a subpoena from Mr. Franklin to appear at the Guildhall to give evidence on his behalf—I saw him at the Court, and we spoke in a friendly way—I had no reason to be hostile to him—after we had spoken I was not called as a witness; the reason I was not called was not that the Court adjourned.

Cross-examined. I have known the prisoner about three years under the name of George Laws—I never knew him as Samuel Clark Laws—I have not known him intimately, only as a workman—he has worked for me—I know and can swear to his writing—I do not sign tickets for suits of clothes to be made up—the whole of this ticket is in the prisoner's writing—the name Taplin is at the bottom—it is not my ticket—it appears to be an order for a coat to be made up to my order—I never gave the prisoner an order for that coat to be made up—I know Marks—never told him I felt inclined to lock un the prisoner, or words to that

effect—I can swear to this coat and waistcoat by the stuff, which is black corkscrew; it is nothing unusual, I have plenty of it in my shop—I know the coat because it has been altered under the arms—I had it in my hands—I believe the prisoner was represented by Mr. Romain at the Police-court; I saw Mr. Romain there—I never told him what I have said here to-day—I told him to-day that the clothes had been offered to me for £1—I was at the Guildhall when the prisoner was sent for trial—I don't know why I did not tell Mr. Romain then—I saw the suit of clothes there, but I was a long way off and could not swear to it—I knew the prisoner was accused of stealing it—I am not one of his bail—I spoke to Mr. Myers, the solicitor for the prosecution, at the Police-court—I did not tell him what I have said to-day—I first mentioned it to-day to Mr. Romain—I saw Mr. Romain last Saturday at his office, and told him I thought I could identify the coat—the prisoner has been out on bail, and I have seen him twice since the committal—I mentioned to him about the £1 and the suit of clothes—he might have said, "Come up to my solicitor with me and tell him what you know about it," I would not be certain—I went to the solicitor last Saturday—I am not sure who else was present at the interview between myself, Laws, and Franklin; there might have been others or there might not—I cannot tell you how long the interview lasted—it was not said that I could have the clothes for nothing.

Re-examined. This charge was only preferred on the remand—I had been subpœnaed, and expected to be called at the Police-court as a witness for the prosecution; I was surprised I was not called, after I had seen the prosecutor and Mr. Myers—it was after that and after I had seen the coat and waistcoat produced in the witness-box that I first spoke to Mr. Romain—when I went to the Guildhall that day I did not know that the coat and waistcoat were going to be produced—after seeing them for the first time at a distance I gave information, and then on Saturday I saw Mr. Romain—there is no ground for suggesting that I am coming here to shield the prisoner by saying what is not true; I come here because I believe he is innocent—the prisoner used to work for me as well as for the prosecutor, and the prosecutor knew that thoroughly well—Marks on many occasions did work for which I paid him on behalf of the prisoner—I have my books referring to it—we dose late on Saturdays—there was an occasion on which a coat and waistcoat were brought to my house on a Saturday when Franklin's shop was closed; that was a coat with a Taplin ticket on it, and it might have been put on because Franklin's house was closed.

JAMES MCCALL STEWART . I am a commercial traveller, living at King Street, East Finchley—I gave the prisoner an introduction to the prosecutor '—I have known the prisoner I daresay twelve or fourteen years; he has borne a thoroughly good commercial character, as far as regards honesty—he is a man of considerable ability as a cutter—I know mm as George Laws, and in that name I recommended him to the prosecutor—I don't know that he once traded as Samuel Laws.

Cross-examined. I have not known him intimately; I have come into contact with him in business—I heard he carried on business, but I did not hear in what name—I knew he was an undischarged bankrupt—I heard that since I introduced him to Franklin six or nine months ago—the prisoner told me.

Re-examined. My opinion of the prisoner is not in the least lessened by the fact that he is an undischarged bankrupt.

Mr. Hopcraft also deposed to prisoner's good character.

The JURY here intimated that they did not desire to hear Counsel, and returned a verdict of


OLD COURT.—Wednesday, July 27th, 1892.

Before Baron Pollock.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-713
VerdictMiscellaneous > unfit to plead
SentenceImprisonment > insanity

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713. In the case of SARAH GREEN , charged with the wilful murder of Evelyn Eleanor Green, upon the evidence of , surgeon of Her Majesty's Prison, Holloway,

the JURY found her to be insane and unable to plead.— Ordered to be detained until Her Majesty's pleasure be known.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-714
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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714. JOHN GEORGE WENZEL (25) was indicted for, and charged on the Coroner's inquisition with, the wilful murder of Joseph Joyce.


FREDERICK HUMPHREYS (Sergeant J). I understand making plans—I made the plan of the rooms at 176, Sandringham Buildings, including the kitchen—the plan is correct.

Cross-examined. The size of the kitchen is seven feet four by eleven—the distance from floor to ceiling is about eight feet—I noticed a mark on the wall about one foot from the ceiling.

HENRY SELZER . I speak English—I am a baker, carrying on business at 9, Haggerston Road, Dalston—for about three weeks prior to the 20th of June last the prisoner lodged with me; he was an acquaintance—I had a cash-box containing about £9 in money and some papers—he had ceased to sleep in the house a week before that—on Sunday, the 19th, he came to visit me, and about half an hour after he had gone I missed the cash-box and its contents—I immediately communicated with the police, and next day I went with Sergeant Joyce to 81, Charing Cross Road, to look for the prisoner—there are rooms over the shop called 176, Sandringham Buildings—the prisoner was not there—after waiting some time Sergeant Joyce and Mr. Ruman, the manager of the shop, went out to look for him, and they returned shortly with him—I told him I should charge him with stealing my cash-box the night previous; I spoke to him in German—he said, "I have not got it"—someone suggested that we should go up to his room; we did so—it was locked—Ruman fetched the key and we went in—there were two bedrooms adjoining each other—the sergeant asked Ruman if he had lost anything—Ruman pulled out the drawers, looked all over, and said, "No, I. don't think I miss anything else besides the watch and chain"—Joyce said to the prisoner, "Have you got these things?"—he said he had not got them—Joyce then felt his chest, and said, "What have you got there?"—he said, "Nothing"—we then told him that Joyce was a detective; he would not believe it—Joyce then pulled out his card and showed it to him; he looked at it as if he was reading it—I don't think he could read English—Ruman then explained to him that he was a detective—the prisoner said he wanted to go into another room—Joyce would not let him—he said, "No, that won't do," and then asked him where he had got his other things, his box—we all went into the kitchen together; there was

a little portmanteau and two coats lying on the top of it—Joyce asked him for the key of the box—he did not give it him—Joyce took a key I from the pocket of his coat, and took out a pocket-book, in which I recognised some of the papers which had been in my pocket-book, and Joyce handed them to me—I said to the prisoner in German, "These are the papers out of my pocket-book"—he did not say anything; he stood with his back towards the copper in the corner of the room, pulled something out of his pocket and dropped it into the copper; I heard the noise of something falling into the water in the copper—Ruman said, "Hallo, there is something fallen into the copper!" and he went to the copper and pulled out the watch and chain and the bag of money, it was a long purse—I recognised the purse, I had seen it before in my place, it was the prisoner's—Ruman said, "That is my watch and chain"—Joyce pulled the prisoner away from the copper, and I saw him put a handcuff on one of his hands; I don't know which hand it was, but I think it was the left—as soon as I saw that I saw him up with his hand under his smock with a revolver and point it at the sergeant—I saw the revolver in his hand—the sergeant was standing sideways to him and holding his hand, and I heard some shots directly—I was by the side of the sergeant when the first shot was fired—I can't say where Human was then—as soon as I heard some shots I turned round and put the papers on the mantelpiece, and when I turned round I felt a shot—I had heard three or four shots going right off; it must have been the third or fourth shot that struck me—when I turned round I saw the sergeant on the floor, and the prisoner too, and I knelt on his legs to hold him down—Joyce called out, "He has shot me and got loose"; then I heard another shot go off while I was lying on him—Joyce called out, "Take the revolver"—I tried to get it; but we could not; I crawled almost under the sergeant's legs to get at it, he held it very tight, but ultimately I got it from him; I had to use my two hands—as soon as I had got it I heard Ruman run downstairs—the prisoner called out, "I am going to die, I am going to die," several times while he was on the floor; the sergeant was still on him, holding him down—I called out, "I have got it," and I and the sergeant dragged him out into the passage; the sergeant was bleeding, but I did not know where he was snot—as soon as we got the prisoner into the passage he called out again, "I am going to die"—I had hold of him on one side and Joyce on the other; I held him tight—he said, "Let me go"—I said, "No"—then Sergeant Bowden came, and Joyce dropped—when Ruman came back he was bleeding at the back of the neck.

Cross-examined. I have been in England eighteen years; I can now speak English better than German—this took place on Monday, 20th June—I gave evidence before the Magistrate that very day—there was no struggle between the prisoner and the sergeant at the time he endeavoured to put the handcuffs on; as soon as he had the handcuffs the prisoner fired—I think I said before the Magistrate that after Joyce had got the prisoner on the ground one shot was fired; I heard one fired from underneath—I did not say "two" before the Magistrate; I might have said so; I was very excited—the prisoner was continually putting his hand under the mattress to prevent the revolver being taken from him—I was cross-examined before the Magistrate a week afterwards; I did not thon say, "The prisoner fired the revolver widely and rapidly," he

was standing quite still—my deposition was read over to me, and I signed it—I think I did say so; the whole thing took a very short time—I was shot in the left arm, I did not find it out till I got into the passage; when I first saw Ruman it was in the street; Joyce then had his hand on the prisoner's shoulders; the prisoner was not struggling then—when they came into the house Joyce was holding the prisoner by his arm, so that he should not get away—when they got into the kitchen Joyce did not begin to handle him—the prisoner said, "You must not do that here; let me change my clothes, and I will go to the Police-station"—Joyce caught hold of him and pulled the book out of his coat pocket and dropped it on the floor—I said before the Magistrate, "He red from underneath Joyce as he was leaning on him."

Re-examined. I also said, "There must have been one shot fired before we grappled with the prisoner"; that is true—the prisoner fired directly after Joyce attempted to put the handcuffs on him; he was not very excited, he seemed to stand very quiet.

FREDERICK RUMAN . I speak English a little; I can understand you—I am a provision dealer, at 81, Charing Cross Road, and occupy rooms at 176, Sandringham Buildings—the prisoner came into my service on Monday, 13th June—part of the time up to 20th he occupied a bedroom next to mine—before the 20th I had given him the key of my room to get something for me—on Monday morning, the 20th, Sergeant Joyce and Selzer came to my shop—the prisoner was out—in consequence of what Joyce said to me I went up to my room and missed a gold watch and silver chain from a chest of drawers; I also had a revolver there—I did not miss that—I had no cartridges for it since 1887; it was not kept loaded, and had never been loaded since '87—having missed my watch and chain, I went with Joyce towards the City to look for the prisoner—we met him in Charing Cross Road, and we all three went together to my shop—the prisoner then asked what was the matter—Joyce said to Selzer, "Tell him what you have missed"—Selzer said he had missed last night £9, and asked him if he had got it—the sergeant said to me, "Tell him what you have missed," and I told him I missed from upstairs a gold watch and silver chain, and asked him if he had got it—he said he had not got it—he said in German, "Do you think I have done that as well?"—we then all four went up to my rooms and into my bedroom, where I showed the prisoner the drawer from which the watch and chain had been taken—Joyce felt the prisoner's breast, and said, "What have you got there?"—he said, "Nothing"—he had a blouse on, as he has now—Joyce asked him what he had got there—he said, "You won't do it here; you will have to bring me to the Police-station"—I told the prisoner Joyce was a detective, and Joyce took a book out of his pocket and found a card, and the prisoner was looking at it—Joyce asked him where his clothes were—we then went into the kitchen, and there was a portmanteau with two coats lying on it—out of one of those coats Joyce took a pocket-book, which Selzer recognised, and some papers—the prisoner was standing with his back to the copper in the corner; I heard something fall in the water—I looked in the copper and pulled out the watch and chain, and after that a purse with the money—I said, "Here it is"—I heard the prisoner say, "Humph," and looking round I saw Joyce making a handcuff round one of his hands,

I can't say which hand; the prisoner had his other hand under his blouse; I think it was his left hand; it was not the same hand that Joyce was putting the handcuff on—I saw he had got the hand under his blouse, and the next minute I saw that he fired at Joyce—I saw his hand out like that (straight out), shooting at Joyce—Joyce was standing up at the time the first shot was fired, he was in front of the prisoner—when the shot was fired he said, "I am shot; fetch the police," at the same moment I was catching at the revolver, and heard more shots; he shot at different times—I saw him when Joyce knocked him down, pulled him down, not by a blow—lie catched his breast, and put him down, forced him down on the ground—it was at the same time I was trying to get the revolver from the prisoner—I did not get hold of it at any time—altogether I heard four or five shots; I can't say how many; I felt myself shot—the prisoner was standing like that, with' his hand down to the bottom—he had the revolver in his right hand, so, we could not touch it—I went to the right side to try and catch it, and I went to the left, and I fell on my knee and down to the floor, and then I felt the shot; I think it was the last shot that hit me—while I was on the floor I heard the prisoner say, "I will die"; and he groaned—I said two or three times, "Have you got the revolver?"—Selzer, or somebody, said, "Yes"; then I went to the balcony and cried "Police!"—this (produced) is my revolver—Sergeant Bowden afterwards showed me some cartridges; I know nothing about them; they were never in my room.

Cross-examined. I think I bought the revolver in Bavaria; it is not an English make; I used it last in 1887; it is self-acting—I used my left hand when I showed how the prisoner presented the revolver at the sergeant—I did not see him put his left hand under his blouse and take it out—I think it was his left hand, as far as I could judge, in which he held it when he fired—I said before the Magistrate, "Selzer, Joyce, and myself all tried to get the revolver from him, and heard the shots fired while we were struggling; the shots were fired quickly, in rapid succession one after the other—we were all three struggling with the prisoner at one time; he was on his knees and then on the floor—it was while the struggle was going on that the shots were fired"—I have said, "The prisoner was on his knees, and the revolver was going to and fro"—I was catching at the revolver; it was in his right hand, like that (describing)—I did not see marks on his right wrist at the Police-court where the handcuff had gone.

Re-examined. I cannot say which hand it was that the sergeant tried to put the handcuff on—I think the revolver was held in his left hand the first time, but I would not swear—I think three or four shots were fired, and one later—I took part in the scuffle—the first shot I saw he fired at Joyce, and I believe another one or two at the same time—it was after one or two that the struggle commenced.

THOMAS BOWDEN (Detective Sergeant T). I live at 171. Sandringham Buildings—on 20th June, about half-past two, I was at home, off duty—I heard the report of firearms—after waiting a moment I heard someone shouting, "Police!" and "Murder!"—I ran out to see what it was, and I saw Human enter the yard from the street, shouting, "Murder" and "Police!"—he was smothered all over with blood—from what he told me I slipped to my own door, took my truncheon, and ran up to the second floor, when I saw the prisoner, Selzer, and Joyce coming round the corner,

all struggling together—Selzer had a revolver; I snatched it, and was about to push him up the passage, when Joyce pushed the prisoner towards me, and said. "No, no, he has shot me"—I turned round and struck him on the right arm with my truncheon, and then seized him—I struck him on the left arm with my truncheon—Fulbrook and a constable came on the scene almost as soon as I did, and he caught the prisoner by the left arm; he was struggling with Joyce and Selzer; Joyce dropped back against the railings or the wall, and I and Fulbrook pushed the prisoner against the railings, and called out to Ruman, who was still in the crowd, "Is this the man?"—he replied, "Yes"—the prisoner was struggling very little then; several constables came—I took the prisoner to Vine Street Police station, searched him, and found this box of forty-four cartridges in his trousers pocket; I then rushed back and took the deceased to Charing Cross Hospital; Sir John Bridge was there—Joyce was unconscious, and no deposition was taken—I searched Ruman's premises the same evening, and on the following Wednesday I had the room cleaned out, and then found this bullet; it was flattened—there was a mark on the kitchen wall where the bullet had struck; it was about six or seven feet above my head—I gave the revolver to Constable Feeney before I removed the prisoner—I compared this cartridge with those found in the box; they were precisely the same make and size.

Cross-examined. When I first came, with the exception of Joyce they were all very much excited—after Joyce was taken to the hospital the prisoner desired to see him to ask his forgiveness.

Re-examined. I first heard something, and was not quite sure what it was; I thought they were firearms, and then within a minute I heard "bang, bang," one shot first, and then two as fast as it could be—I think the whole firing from first to last was in about a minute and a half—I was quietly listening.

CHARLES ALBERT . I am interpreter to this Court—I have translated this German letter purporting to come from J. G. Wenzel, at Holloway Prison, dated 21st June, 1892, and beginning "Dear Cousin Lena"—I produce a correct translation of it.

GEORGE FULBROOK (27 C R). I went to Sandringham Buildings about half-past two, on hearing cries from the second floor—I found Sergeant Joyce holding the prisoner by the left arm, having hold of the balcony railings—I caught hold of the prisoner—Joyce let him go, saying," That is the man"—I handed him to another constable—Joyce sank down on the balcony; I went to pick him up, and carried him downstairs; he made a statement to me; they were the last words I heard him utter; the prisoner was not within hearing.

ROBERT SHANNON (Inspector C). About a quarter to three on Monday, 20th June, I went to Charing Cross Hospital—I there found Joyce in bed; he was in a very weak and exhausted state, lying on his right side; some of the house surgeons were present, amongst them Mr. Muir, Mr. Foster, and Mr. Blockland—Mr. Blockland said, "Now, Joyce, you are in a dangerous state; tell us how you met with your accident"—he stooped down, and whispered into his ear—Joyce replied in a very weak tone, "I was catching a thief, when the prisoner in custody fired at me in Charing Cross Road"—those words were interrupted by intervals; he seemed unable to go on from weakness, and after he had uttered them

he became quite faint and unconscious—Sir John was sent for, but before he arrived Joyce was beyond speech.

THEODORE GRABB . I am clerk to Messrs. Wilson and Wallis, solicitors—on 20th June I happened to be at Charing Cross Hospital when the prisoner was brought in—Sir John Bridge came after I was there—at his request I asked the prisoner in German if he would like to see the dying man—he said, "Yes"—Sir John Bridge asked what for—he said, "To ask his forgiveness."

HENRY PARKER (Inspector C). I examined the revolver—all the barrels were full; five cartridges had exploded; one was loaded—the five appeared to have been recently fired—I have seen the cartridges found in the box, they are similar to those in the revolver.

LENA KOHLER . I am now a domestic servant at Canonbury—I came over from Germany with the prisoner some time ago—I was engaged to be married to him—on 22nd June last I received this letter from him, written in the prison—it is his writing—I afterwards gave it to Inspector Stroud Read—"H. M. Prison, Holloway. 21—6—92.—Dear Cousin Lena,—Fear and trembling will come over you; for if I had been in Germany I never could have become what I have become in London—namely, a criminal. Oh, Heaven!" What have I done to become so quickly a thief and a murderer? But it is all an aberration of mind that has visited me suddenly. I am not always clear in my mind, and that was the case on Monday evening last, when I wrote a letter to you, in which you will observe my absence of mind. After not being the whole of the afternoon at Selzer's, I took away in the evening a cash-box and £9, and several things belonging to Mr. Human, my master. I did no longer lodge where I did lodge the first few days, because some of my money had been stolen there. I then lodged at the business premises upstairs, next to my master's room. Well, Monday morning came, and I had something to do in town. When I returned at two in the afternoon, Mr. Selzer and a detective were present there to arrest me. I went upstairs with them, to the sitting-room, at 81, Charing Cross Road, a German sausage and provision shop. When we were upstairs Mr. Human also came there. They searched about, and found everything I had stolen. I do not know where my things are at the present moment. I had 33s. in money, and some German money, and when the detective was going to secure my hands and take my revolver, I fired on him. he is very severely injured, and they say possibly, going to die. Selzer has been wounded on the arm, and Human on the head. yet I could not liberate myself; I was taken to prison. Oh, dearest angel, pardon me! Most certainly I shall have to die. Oh, Lena, dear, go to the Queen of England! Tell her your grief—tell her of my mental disease, and beg for mercy. Also go to the German Consul. Oh, cannot you help me once more? Write to me at once, so that I shall know whether you have received these lines.—I am, yours, J. G. WENZEL. Come and see me next Sunday; perhaps we may be allowed to speak together. If I had my liberty I would return to my home. On Tuesday, 28th June, I shall have to appear before the Magistrate."

ROBERT DOUGLAS MUIR . I am one of the house surgeons at Charing Cross Hospital—on 20th June I was there when Sergeant Joyce was brought in—I examined him—I found him suffering from shock and in a restless condition, such as follows severe hemorrhage—on making a

more careful examination I found a bullet wound on the left side against the ribs—there was blood on the shirt he was wearing—there was no gunpowder about that wound—after he had been put into one of the wards I examined him again, and then found a second wound from a bullet in the right arm—he had collapsed by then—he lingered on for a short time, became unconscious, and died about four in the afternoon—next day I made a post-mortem examination and extracted two bullets, which I produce—one of them had occasioned the wound in the stomach—I traced the course of that wound—it had penetrated the left kidney and the left lobe of the liver; that had caused the hemorrhage which produced death—the second bullet I extracted from the wound in the right arm—I examined the sleeve of the coat and the shirt and vest he was wearing—there were signs of singeing and gunpowder about them, and also of gunpowder about the wound—that shot must have been fired very close indeed, and might have been fired in the course of a struggle.

Cross-examined. The wound in the stomach was a circular wound—the ball in the arm was close to the spine of the blade-bone.

MICHAEL FOSTER . I was a house surgeon at Charing Cross Hospital—I examined the witness Human—he had a bullet wound at the-back of the head; I probed it, and a portion of a bullet was extracted.

THOMAS BOWDEN (Re-examined). When I searched the prisoner at the Police-station I noticed the mark of a bruise on his right wrist and blood on both hands—I picked up these handcuffs in the room—the small one would possibly cause a scratch.

THOMAS ALLCOCK (Inspector G). I knew the deceased very well; he was about 6 ft. in height. (The warder stated that the height of the prisoner teas 5 ft. 8 in.)

LENA KOHLER (Re-examined). I do not know whether the prisoner is right or left handed.

MR. MUIR (Re-examined). The wound in the stomach was in an oblique direction; the man might have been standing a little sideways at the time.


NEW COURT.—Wednesday, July 27th, 1892.

Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-715
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > unknown
SentencesImprisonment > penal servitude; Miscellaneous > sureties

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715. FREDERICK CLARK (34) and MINNIE BOWERS (21) , Breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Frederick Augustus Fryer, and stealing a cash-box, a watch, and other articles; Second Count, charging Bowers with receiving.

CLARK PLEADED GUILTY . BOWERS PLEADED GUILTY to the Second Count , also breaking and entering the dwelling-house of John William Gorsuch, with intent to steal; also breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Alfred Dawson, and stealing a set of studs, a pair of diamond earrings and other articles, and £27 in money; Clark having been convicted at Clerkenwell in December, 1881, in the name of Frederick Hoskins.

CLARK PLEADED GUILTY**— Three Years' Penal Servitude.

MR. BESLEY, for the prosecution, offered no evidence against Bowers.NOT GUILTY on these Indictments.— Discharged on recognisances.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-716
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentencesImprisonment > hard labour

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716. FREDERICK JAMES AYRE (22) PLEADED GUILTY to stealing a cigarette box, the property of Marion Winter; also to obtaining, by false pretences, from William Holbrook a bag; and from John Whitcomb a gown, an overcoat, and other articles, with intent to defraud.—

Nine Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-717
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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717. JAMES BURNS (24) , Indecently assaulting James Good child.

MR. PURCELL Prosecuted.

GUILTY .— One Month Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-718
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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718. HENRY JOHN BAKER , Unlawfully transferring thirteen tables, thirty-six mattresses, and other goods, with intent to defraud his creditors.

MR. STEPHENSON Prosecuted, and MR. GRAIN Defended.

JOHN WERTHEM . I am a clerk in the Bankruptcy Department of the High Court of Justice—I produce the file of proceedings in the defendant's bankruptcy—the petition was filed on March 21st by Mary Louisa De Vere and other creditors for £120—the receiving order was made on April 4th; the adjudication was on the 11th, and the Official Receiver was appointed trustee—the statement of affairs shows £15 assets and £429 17s. 2d. debts—there is on the file an account showing how the defendant disposed of this £100—the public examination was on May 21st.

Cross-examined. There are nine unsecured creditors—deducting the £120 of the De Veres, that leaves £169 11s. 2d. unsecured creditors—the secured creditor was Miss Howell, on the bill of sale for £100; then there was the current rent, £37 16s., and the rent of Widdle Row, £12 10s.; that makes £50 6s.—the only creditors who have proved under the bankruptcy are the De Veres, as far as I can tell.

SYDENHAM HALL . I am a clerk in the Bill of Sale Office—I produce a filed copy of a bill of sale dated February 90,1892, by J. Baker in favour of Agnes Howell—he assigns his furniture to her for £100.

CHARLES LEGGATT BARBER . I am official shorthand-writer to the Bankruptcy Court—on May 21st I attended the court and took notes of the evidence—this is a correct transcript of them. (This was put in and partially read.)

JAMES GOFF . I am a clerk in the Filing and Record Department of the High Court—I produce a filed copy of the pleadings in the action of De Vere and others v. Baker—it is for £60 16s. and £59 4s. 4d. costs.

Cross-examined. The judgment was on the 19th, and it was signed on the 23rd—the costs were taxed on March 2nd, 1892.

AGNES HOWELL . I am single, and am manageress of a millinery department—I have known the prisoner since June—my sister was manager to a defendant who absconded—I saw the prisoner sign this, Henry John Baker, to this bill of sale—I was anxious to help him, and offered him money—he refused at first, but the week afterwards he said he should like some money—I said he could have £100, but I should require security; he said, "You can take my furniture"—next day, Saturday, I went to the bank and drew out £100 and went with him, and the bill of sale was executed at Mr. Newsom's in the afternoon.

Cross-examined. He had previously carried on the business of a tea dealer at Bartholomew Close—he said he wished to pay some persons of whom he had borrowed money to carry on the necessary expenses of the

action, and when he came again he said he should like to have the money as the day had gone against him, and he should like to pay the persons who had lent him money—I was doing nothing with the money, I did not want it—Mrs. Dendry is my sister—I was to have 5 per cent, for the £100—the goods are still at his house; I have taken no steps to remove them—he is an amateur organist at a church, and a highly respectable man.

Re-examined. He said he wanted the money to pay his lawyer and persons who he had borrowed money of.

MR. NEWSOM examined by the JURY. I am the solicitor who prepared this bill of sale for the defendant—he came to me and said that Miss Howell had offered to lend him £100, and asked if he could give her a bill of sale—I said, "Yes"—he acted under my advice—I knew of the judgment against him.


25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-719
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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719. CAROLINE EMMA YEO , Feloniously marrying James Henry Yeo, her husband being alive.

MR. BESLEY Prosecuted, and MR. WARBURTON Defended. LORENZO CAMP. I am a coachmaker, of 104, Weedon Road, Kentish Town—I have lived in that neighbourhood on and off for twenty years—I have a brother named Benjamin James—in July. 1873, as near as I ran remember, I was present at his marrriage with the prisoner—she was 19 and he was 21—he went away to America next day by arrangement he is an engineer—Susan Jocelyn is my mother and his mother; she has married again; we are the only two Camps—my mother and I received letters from my brother after he went to America, and the family saw them—we did not see a great deal of the prisoner after my brother left—she did not live in the neighbourhood; she lived at Islington, where she lived before her marriage—I believe these two letters (produced) to be my brother's writing—I have worked in the same employment nineteen years—she knew that, and could easily have made inquiries for me—I do not know about the boy William being born—I did not know of her marrying Mr. Yeo till recently—she has not been to see me at all. (The marriage certificate was here put in.)

Cross-examined. The last letter we had from him was about 1880 or 1881—I heard that he sustained a bad injury in Utah, and was in the hospital; that was about fifteen months after the marriage—I did not hear that his life was despaired of, or that he was in great danger; the letter came to me—I did not show it to his wife; I never saw her, and did not know where she was living then—he was not a professed Mormon to my knowledge before he went out to America.

Re-examined. I destroyed the letter—he wrote long after his injury, and said that he was recovering and was out of the hospital.

SUSAN JOCELYN . I am 60 years of age; my first husband was Mr. Camp—one son by my first husband was 21 in the February before his marriage in July—we were then living in Kentish Town—he introduced the prisoner a longtime before the marriage—she was 19 then, she said—I had lived in Kentish Town all my life, but moved info Great College Street, by King's Cross, shortly after my son left—the prisoner came to me there—my son wrote from America for several years about once a month—the prisoner came to see me for fifteen or eighteen months; I used sometimes to read his letters to her, and sometimes I let her read

them—before he had been away a year my son sent £18 over for her to go out at the beginning of the year, but she postponed it till the following September—I then ceased to see her till this charge—I knew nothing of her having an illegitimate child, or of her marrying Yeo.

Cross-examined. I had £2 of the £18—she had a lot of things to buy, and my son sent home word that he would send her more when she was ready to come out—I had lost sight of her for some time—my son was not a Mormon, but he had an uncle who was an elder of the Mormonites.

Re-examined. I got these two letters among others. (These were dated 1875 and 1882)—they used to be three weeks. coming—my son told me that he had married out there, and had got a child.

JAMES HENRY YEO . On 18th September, 1879, I went through the form of marriage with the prisoner at St. Peter's Church, Plumpton; I had known her about 16 months—I lived near her—she said that she had an illegitimate child, and that Fred Lucas was the father—she did not say that she had been married—I agreed to marry her; this (produced) is the certificate; she gave the definition of spinster—I had no idea that she had a husband who had gone to America—she was doing bookfolding—after the marriage we lived first in Shepherdess Walk, Islington—I had no child by her till 1885—her boy William died on August 8th, 1881; he was kept at her mother's house—I did not know that she registered the birth or the death in the name of Bun with—we had two children; they were born on 31st May, 1885, and 10th March, 1887—they are alive; the prisoner is taking care of them—this (produced) is the agreement we came to in reference to that matter.

Cross-examined. I married her in the name of Bunwith, her maiden name; I have allowed her £1 a week for keeping the two children up to within three weeks—on March 16th I stopped the weekly payments, and she sued me in the County-court, and I had to pay; she got judgment against me, and since that I have been continuing the payments—I consider that the children have a moral claim on me for support, but when I found she was married I thought there was au end of it—I commenced these payments when I found an order was made on me by the County court.

ISABELLA CAMP . I am the wife of the witness Lorenzo Camp—I know the prisoner—my brother-in-law married her when I had seen her several times, she used to visit us in Great College Street—we have not continued to occupy the same house there.

GUILTY .— To enter into recognisances.

THIRD COURT.—Wednesday, July 27th, 1892.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-720
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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720. JOHN HODSON (28) , Feloniously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Clara Walton, and stealing therein a watch and other articles.

MR. KERSHAW Prosecuted.

MARY ANN WAGHORNE . I live as servant with Mrs. Walton, at 19, Rosewood Road, Acton—my mistress went to Ireland on 28th June last, and I locked up the house, leaving nobody there—on 19th July

I went to the house and found the things scattered about, especially the case in the dressing-room—the articles produced are the property of Mw. Walton, consisting of two lockets, four bracelets, four brooches, two rings, a watch, and five bangles; but all that were stolen are not here—I cannot say which rooms those were left in.

Cross-examined by the Prisoner. I do not remember seeing you before—I do not know if you have been on the premises before.

CHARLES BROWN . I am gardener to Mrs. Walton—I went to work about 8.30 on 9th July—I found the glass of the door that looks into the garden broken and the door open—I fetched the police—I had left my work about eight o'clock the night before—the door was all right then.

Cross-examined by the Prisoner. I have never seen you before.

ROBERT MARKHAM (Detective Sergeant X). After 9th July I received information about this robbery—on the 16th I, in company with Brown, saw the prisoner in St. James's Place and went towards him—he ran away to Cheyne Place—we chased him and caught him—I told him I should take him into custody for breaking into a house at Acton—he said, "I know nothing about it"—I said, "Where do you live?"—he said, "I don't know"—I said, "I believe you live at 10, St. James's Place"—I then took him to the top floor front room of No. 10—he said, "I do not live here"—there were some children in bed, and I said, "Is this your father?" and one of them said, "Yes"—I then searched the prisoner, and found that he was wearing this watch and chain—he said, "I won't give you any more trouble"—he then produced from his trousers pocket two pairs of gold earrings, two gold lockets, a diamond ring, one gold brooch, one silver pin, two gold clasps, and bracelets—he said, "I broke into a house at Acton, and I burnt some of the jewellery"—this bracelet has been thrown on the fire and burnt—I then took the prisoner to Notting Hill Police-station, and when charged he made no reply—I had no description of him.

Cross-examined. You never told me that your wife ran away from you, and that it was her door you broke open.

JAMES BROWN (Detective X). I was with the last witness on 16th July—when we saw the prisoner he ran away, but we caught him, and the other officer told him the charge—he said, "I know nothing about it"—when asked where he lived he said, "I do not know"—Markham then said, "I believe you live at 10, St. James's Place," and we took him to the top front room—he said he did not live in that room-Markham then said to one of the children, "Who is this man?" and the child said, "That is my father"—Markham then searched the prisoner, and found he was wearing this watch—he said, "I will give you no more trouble; I broke into a house at Acton"—he then took some jewellery out of his pocket and said, "I have burnt some of it, the other property is in that drawer," which we searched, and found five bangles, one burnt bracelet, and some other articles, some of which had been burnt—there was also a quantity of other property there—I did not hear him say a word about his wife, and I was in the room with the other officer all the time.

The prisoner, in his defence, said his wife was continually running away from him, and that he found out that she was living at 10, St. James's Place, and asked her if she would live with him again, which she consented to do. He then found that she had a quantity of jewellery

and other property in a drawer, and asked her what it was; to which she replied, "If you touch them you will get your nose broke by another man. "He also said that what he told the police was that when he went back to lire with his wife she would not let him in, and he broke the panels of the door, and that he did not tell the police that he broke into a house at Acton.

GUILTY of receiving. He then

PLEADED GUILTY to having been convicted at Clerkenwell on 2nd April, 1889, for warehouse-breaking.— Six Months' Hard Labour.

FOURTH COURT.—Wednesday, July 27th, 1892.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-721
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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721. GEORGE LAWS (set page 1051) was again indicted for stealing a quantity of cloth cuttings and cloth belonging to Emanuel Franklin and another, his masters.

MESSRS. GEOGHEGAN and BIRON Prosecuted, and MR. PAUL TAYLOR Defended.

EMANUEL FRANKLIN . I am a tailor, at 71 and 73, St. Mary Axe—the prisoner has been my cutter and manager for about two years and nine months—his duties were to cut all garments, serve my customer, measure them, and enter some orders in the book—he never had my permission to make clothes for private orders—any orders he obtained from customers coming to my premises would be entered in the order-book, so that I could ascertain the orders that had been given, and the amount, and so forth—I allowed him to cut for Taplin and Hopcraft in his spare time—he worked for me from Monday till Friday night, but during the week he also cut for Taplin and Hopcraft when he had finished my work—he cut out clothes made of my cloth in pursuance of orders received by me—he had no right, and it was not his duty, to send out any cloth of mine to be made up by other people—Marks has made coats for me for over two years—the prisoner would have no right to send out my cloth to him to be made up—on Friday, July 8th, Amelia Marks came to me, and in consequence I went and saw her father, who made a communication to me, and showed me about two yards of my cloth made up into a rough coat, which we call a base coat—I identify the cloth and lining as mine—the ticket produced is in the prisoner's handwriting—I never authorised any such order, and there is no entry of it in my books—I then gave instructions to the police—I was present when Sergeant Abbot and Detective Savage came to my shop—the prisoner said he took the lining—he said he did not take the cloth, but I said, "I have, proof positive of it"; then he said, 'I did take the cloth"—we found' the roll of cloth, and said, "That roll is two yards short"; and he said, "I did take it" in the presence of the officers—he implored me not to proceed against him—he said he would go through the books, and make up all that was short, and he would leave the country if I did not charge him.

Cross-examined. I did not say in the Police-court that the prisoner said he would go through the books and make up all that was short, and leave the country—I was not asked the question—I instructed my solicitor, and he made some notes—I amend my evidence given in the Police-court;

by private customers I meant Taplin and Hopcraft—I did no; amend it at the Police-court—as manager, when customers came to give their orders, the prisoner measured them and cut the stuff subject to my approval—when I said, "The accused has cut from my goods stuff for his own customers, first asking my permission," I meant that he had introduced to me about £64 of trade—Hopcraft and Taplin's goods were not my stuff—they are tailors—the prisoner did not have permission to cut stuff from my goods—what I said at the Police-court was a misunderstanding—he only had authority to sell suits of clothes; he was manager, cutter and salesman, nothing more than that—he was not permitted to make up garments for his own customers, taking the materials from my stock—the account of the goods the prisoner had is in the ledger—it amounts to £16 in two and half years—when the prisoner was charged he said, "You knew of it; I aid not think I was doing any harm"—then he said, as to the other piece of cloth, "I gave that to Richter about six weeks ago; it was no use to me"—I have only been in the tailoring trade two and a half years—I say positively it is not the custom for the man who makes up a garment to have these cuttings—I admit that both Taplin and Hopcraft are respectable men, and experienced tailors—I do not suggest the prisoner could make any profit by giving the stuff to Richter—as to the two yards of cloth, he did ask for the book and look for the entry, but he could not find it—I knew he must have had customers of his own—the prisoner has never lent me any money—I have betted occasionally—I have betted with a friend of the prisoner's, but not with him—I have betted through the prisoner with his friend—I spent the greater part of my time in St. Mary Axe, although I have carried on another business—I do not recollect saying to Taplin, "Have you missed any cuttings?"—he said to me, "It is a very unfortunate thing; I think you had better let him off"—these cuttings are sold at 10d. a lb.—they are not sold at 2d. or 3d. a lb.—unless there is a special arrangement made the cutter does not have the cuttings—I obtained my knowledge as to the custom of the trade by making inquiries of other tailors—I have made those inquiries within the last three months—the tailors I have inquired of are not here.

Re-examined. The customers introduced by the prisoner were spoken of as his customers, and he would execute orders for them, but not without its appearing in my books—there is no entry in my book for orders other than those made in my business, except those which have been pointed out to me—those which were pointed out were orders for the prisoner's personal use—they amount to £16 in two years and nine months—the cuttings are generally sold at eightpence to tenpence a pound—there are a great many to be disposed of in the course of business—I say I had no betting with the prisoner, but I obliged him by putting the money on—I did it to save him leaving the business—he was a good cutter, and he had a confidential position with me, and I obliged him—on the paper produced are the instructions I gave to my solicitor.

AMELIA MARKS . I live at 43, Buxton Street, Spitalfields—I assist my father—I went to Mr. Franklin's warehouse on 6th July—the prisoner gave me a coat and said, "Take this to your father"—I took the coat home—the ticket produced was given to me—the coat was wrapped up in a bundle with canvas and trimming—my father was to make it up—it was made up about Saturday.

JACOB MARKS . I live at 43, Buxton Street—the last witness is my daughter—she brought me a coat on the 6th of July, and gave me this ticket—Mr. Taplin came to my shop the next morning, and brought me a coat to baste up in a hurry—I showed him the coat I had from Laws—in consequence of what he told me I showed him that ticket—he said something to me—I then made the coat and took it to Taplin's place—I showed the coat to Mr. Franklin—I showed him that it was his material, because it had the wrong ticket on—the pattern produced is the same material—I gave Mr. Franklin a bit of the cloth—I then took the coat to Laws at Taplin's place.

Cross-examined. Laws told me he wanted the coat for a customer of his who was to be married that day—it was a Saturday—I took it to him as soon as it was finished—Franklin's shop was closed at that time—I know Taplin; he has not paid me for work done by me for Mr. Laws; he never paid me for Laws' work—I do not know that Laws has got customers of his own—I was not paid on two or three occasions for work done by Laws for Taplin—I know Seelig; I worked with him—I have had no conversation with him—I am quite strange with him—I have been in the tailoring trade thirty years; twenty-four years in London—I am a coat maker—I know what cuttings mean—I do not pick up the pieces that fall down and bring them back to the shop—I do not know what hollowings mean, although I have been in the trade in London twenty-four years.

Re-examined. If some bits of cloth are left we keep them—if they are large pieces we can make use of they are Bent back to the shop—the pieces produced I should send back—they are used for padding.

THOMAS ABBOT (Detective Inspector). I went with Mr. Franklin to 73, St. Mary Axe, after calling at 135, Clifton Street, Finsbury—I saw the prisoner, and said to him, "It has come to Mr. Franklin's knowledge that you have been sending out lengths of cloth to be cut into trousers"—I then pointed to these hollowings, and said, "These hollowings have been brought from Richter's place"—he said, "I have given Richter lengths of cloths to cut into trousers, and it is usual for them to keep the hollowings"—I said, "Have you any authority to give them away"—he said, "No, but I think Mr. Franklin knew of it"—this is the piece of cloth I showed him—I made inquiries about a coat, and this piece of lining was produced—I said, "Marks has made a coat for you last Saturday"—he said, "Yes, the lining was Franklin's, but the cloth was not"—that roll of cloth was then produced and measured in the presence of the prisoner—Franklin said it was about two yards short, and the prisoner then said, "I cut the cloth off that piece for the coat"—he was then told that he would be charged by Franklin, and he asked Franklin not to charge him, he would pay for it—he then referred to a book at the other end of the room to find the entry, but failed to do so—I asked what he had done with the coat—he said it was at home—I gave him to understand I should go to his place—he then said he had given it away; if I would allow him to go with me to Loughborough Junction he would produce the coat—he was then given into custody—on the way to the station he said if Franklin would not charge him he would leave the country.

Cross-examined. I have been about twelve years in the Detective Force—I have appeared pretty often in criminal oases—I know the object of

proceedings at the Police-court is to give the prisoner notice of what he has to meet—it struck me that when he said, "If Franklin will not charge me I will leave the country," that he was inclined to say he was guilty, as a grave admission—I did mention it at the Police-court, although it is not on my deposition—I said so—Mr. Saville took my deposition—the prosecutor was with me on my way to the station—he did not say anything about it at the Police-court—I was in conversation with the prosecutor all the time we were going to the station—I gave my evidence the following day.

Re-examined. The prisoner's bail was increased from two £25's to two £50's, and himself in £100. I am positive he said that he would leave the country.

Witnesses for the Defence.

PERCY SIMPSON . I am a carrier's clerk—I know the prisoner—I was with him on November last at Mr. Franklin's—the prisoner said he wanted some cuttings—Franklin said be could help himself, or something to that effect—I believe I can identify some of the cuttings produced as those which the prisoner then took.

Cross-examined. I suppose there is a strong family likeness between cuttings—I believe these to be the pieces of cloth—I saw them when Laws was tying them up—Laws said he wanted some cuttings, and Franklin said, "Help yourself"—what took place was that Laws asked Franklin whether he might take some cuttings, and Franklin gave him permission to do so—I do not identify all of them; I only noticed one or two as they were being tied up—I afterwards noticed them more closely—I did not take them in my hand at the time—I afterwards saw them in the train the same night—it was a bundle about the size of a suit of clothes—I afterwards saw them on a Sunday morning occasionally in Laws' place—they were undone in the train—I looked at one particular pattern—I only identify this one; there is nothing extraordinary about that that I know of.

Re-examined. I saw a similar pattern to this given to Laws by the prosecutor—I saw a bundle as large as a suit of clothes given to Laws by the prosecutor, and Laws took it away in the train—I helped Laws to carry it—the bundle consisted of pieces of cloth like those produced—I afterwards saw them at Laws' house.

ARTHUR TAPLIN . I am a working tailor, carrying on business at Bayswater—I have been in business where I am now for three years—before that I was in the woollen trade since I was ten—I know the customs of the tailoring trade—when work is given out the cuttings belong to the man who makes the garments—that is the generally recognised custom in the trade—whatever the tailor has over when he is making a pair of trousers belongs to him—we never expect it back in any case—I have known the prisoner and the prosecutor for some time—I am perfectly aware the prisoner had private customers—upon more than one occasion I have paid Marks money on account of Laws for Laws' private work—I was very often at Franklin's—I have been there three or four or five times a week, and sometimes three times on one day—the terms that Franklin was on with Laws were not like master and man at all, but very friendly—I produce my book in which I have entered the payments made to Marks on account of Laws.

Cross-examined. I know that Laws had private customers—the pieces

are given to the tailor who makes the trousers, to piece them up for flies, and so on—the cutter is the man who cuts them out—it would be his duty to give the hollowings and cuttings to the tailor who makes the garments.

Re-examined. If the cutter gives a man a length of cloth to cut the trousers out of (which is very often done when a man is busy; I often do it myself) of course whatever he gets out of the trousers belongs to him—we never expect the pieces back.

By MR. BIRON. I have not lived in many houses myself—I say that where cutters are employed in large houses the custom of the trade is to give the tailor all the hollowings and all the cuttings as his perquisites—I think that is the custom in nine cases out of ten—this ticket is in the prisoner's writing—on 7th July I went to Marks possibly—he did not tell me he was making a coat for me—Marks asked me if that coat was for me; I suppose that was the ticket of the coat; I did not look at toe ticket at the time I saw the coat; I told Marks I did not know anything about the coat; I did not know anything about it; it was not a co made under my orders—the cloth of which it was made might have been mine; I cannot say whether it was or not.

Re-examined. My shop was open on that Saturday and the prosecutors was closed.

By the JURY. I have had coats sent me before by the prisoner under similar circumstances, and I have paid for them, which my books will prove—I can prove they were payments to Marks on account of the prisoner's private customers; there was nothing unusual in it.

JAMES HOPCRAFT . I am a practical tailor at 262, Whitechapel Road—I have been all my life in the trade—cuttings and hollowings are always reckoned to belong to the tailor to whom the garments are given out to be made up; you would not get ten hollowings out of one hundred pairs of trousers—cuttings sell for 5d. or 6d. per lb.; it depends on the width—8d. to 10d. would not be a large price if the pieces were large enough for capes—I did say that these cuttings would sell for 3 1/2 d. or 4d. not 8d. or 10d.

Cross-examined. We should send them to a respectable firm and take their price-sometimes one man is both tailor and cutter; a practical tailor should be able to go right through—it would be the duty of a cutter cutting out trousers to give the cuttings and hollowings over to the tailor, to make flies and backs of trousers—I do not suggest there is any custom of the trade which enables the cutter to give away those cuttings and hollowings to anybody; they are the governors property if they are cut on the governor's premises.

Re-examined. In the case of a manager of an establishment having sole management, there is nothing improper in his giving small pieces of cuttings to one of the workmen employed by his master.

ABRAHAM SEELIG . I live at 19, Eastman Street, and work for the prosecutor—I have made garments for the prisoner on his own account, and I have taken them up to the prosecutor's shop the same as any other work in an open manner—I don't know if the prisoner has been there on every occasion-five or six weeks ago I heard Mr. Franklin ask the prisoner whether he had any money about him; he said "Yes," and Mr. Franklin said, Can you lend me any?"—the prisoner said, "Yes; I have £7 or

£8 about me; and he handed it over to Mr. Franklin—I have been fourteen years in the trade—cuttings belong to the maker, the tailor.

Cross-examined. They do not belong to the cutter.

The JURY here intimated that they had come to the conclusion that the prisoner was


There was another indictment of a similar character against the prisoner, upon which the prosecution offered no evidence.NOT GUILTY. The COURT disallowed the costs of the prosecution.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-722
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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722. THOMAS MOORE (31) , Unlawfully obtaining from James Fernley 3s. by false pretences, with intent to defraud.

MR. HURRELL Prosecuted.

JAMES FERNLEY . I am a cabdriver, living at 18, New Square, Minories—on 21st July the prisoner engaged me; I drove him to several places—he said he had £24 to receive at the pay-office, Tower Hill, and could I lend him a little money—I gave him 2s., and took him first to a home—he said the manager of the home, Mr. Smith, would give him the money to pay me, but he could not see Mr. Smith—he said I had fetter come in the morning at ten o'clock, and drive him to the pay-office, lower Hill—I did so; he went, as I thought, to get. his money, and he went out the back way, and I next heard he was running down the back way—altogether I parted with 3s., because he said he would pay me for the again, and that he had £24 to receive—he agreed to pay me 15s.

The COURT directed the JURY to acquit the prisoner, as no false pretence tad been made out.


25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-723
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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723. THOMAS STEPHENS (32) , Feloniously forging and uttering an order for the payment of £10 10s., with intent to defraud.

MR. BURNIE Prosecuted.

GEORGE THOMAS MELSON . I am a grocer, at 5, Bellevue Road, Wands worth Common-about eight p.m. on 5th July the prisoner came and put this note containing this cheque, on the counter. (The note, headed St. James's Industrial School, and signed "Francis H White, superintendent" asked for three bottles of claret at 1s. 6d. to be sent, and for the enclosed cheque to be changed. The cheque was drawn on the London and South-Western Bank, Clapham Junction Branch, by James Snell, in favour of Francis H. White, or order.)—I knew Mr. White, the superintendent of the St. James's Industrial School—I told the prisoner I had not sufficient change—he said, perhaps some of the neighbours would do it, as his brother rather wanted it that evening—after a little hesitation I cashed it, and gave the prisoner the ten guineas—he remained in the shop for about ten minutes afterwards in conversation with me—I next saw the prisoner on the following Monday at the Marylebone Police-court among other men, and I picked him out—I have no doubt about him.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I think the letter was put on the counter, and my wife handed it to me—I believe you brought it—I gave you the money—I sent to the Industrial School, and the gentleman came and said he knew nothing about it; I sent to the bank, and they told me that there were several cheques of a similar kind, and then I went to the police—I described to them the man who presented the cheque as rather stout, about my own build, dark hair, pale sallow complexion,

little moustache, gold albert chain, dressed in black, with a kind of Inverness mackintosh and high hat—the police instructed me to go to the Marylebone Police-court—I cannot say if you had your hat on there—I came to you without looking to right or left.

Re-examined. The prisoner was talking to me for about half an hour; I hare no doubt about him.

JOHN THOMAS WHITE . I am superintendent of the St. James's Industrial School, Upper Tooting—there is no such person there as Francis H. White—I do not know the prisoner—these, letter and cheque, are not in my writing—I know nothing of the cheque—I do not know Mr. Snell.

Cross-examined. I stood among other men on 16th at Marylebone Police-court for your identification—a young lady picked me out there—I had a high hat on—I was not there when Mr. Melson picked you out.

HARRY WALLACE . I am a clerk in the Clapham Junction branch of the London and South-Western Bank—no person named James Snell has an account there—I do not know the writing on this cheque; the number of it seems to have been altered—I should say it came from one of our cheque-books.

GEORGE FELLOWES (Detective Officer). I was present when Melson identified the prisoner from among about fourteen others, seven of whom were prisoners—Melson picked the prisoner out at once.

Cross-examined. There were five or six men similar to you; no one else had a top hat, but your hat was off.

The prisoner, in his defence, asserted that he knew nothing of the matter, and that it was a case of mistaken identity

GUILTY .—There were other indictments against the prisoner for similar offences.— Twelve Months Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-724
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Not Guilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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724. HENRY MATTHEWS (21), GEORGE KEMP (20), and JOHN WILLIAMS (21) , Burglary in the dwelling-house of Elia Offord, and stealing seven boxes of cigars and other goods, and 9s. 0 3/4 d. Second Count, Receiving the same.


MR. BLACKWELL Prosecuted.

JAMES CLARK . I am manager to Mrs. Elia Offord, who keeps the Cross Keys public-house, St. Andrew's, Holborn—at half-past twelve a.m. on 16th July I went to bed after seeing everything was secure—about three a.m. the police aroused me, and I found that the place had been broken into by breaking the back window and undoing the hasp—I missed £16 worth of property, sixteen boxes of cigars, tobacco, and other articles, and 9s. odd.

HENRY BRITTON (469 E). At quarter past three a.m. on 16th July I was in Arthur Mews, near the. public-house—I saw the three prisoners in the mews with a barrow, which they wheeled out into the road—I went and spoke to Clark—before that I had tried the door of the public house and found it open—after speaking to Clark I went to the corner of the street, and told him the door was open and that I thought something was wrong—I went down one side the road and he the other, and I saw Williams on the right-hand side of the road with the other prisoners who had the barrow—Williams ran away—I found some cigars in the barrow, which I showed to Clark.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I did not take you because I did not know what had been done.

THOMAS CLARK (215 E). On this morning I was on duty in Theobald's Road when Britton came and told me something—I saw Kemp wheeling a barrow down Theobald's Road, and the other prisoners walking down the footway—I went to arrest one of them, and Kemp threw the handle of the barrow to me and threw me down—I chased Kemp and Matthews.

JOHN BRIDGE . On this morning, at twenty minutes to four, I saw Williams in Jerusalem Court, Clerkenwell, standing with his back against the wall—I asked him what he was doing there—he said, "I am waiting for my aunt to go to the market"—after I left him he ran away—at ten o'clock on Saturday night I arrested him, and told him I should take him into custody for being concerned with Matthews and Kemp for burglary at the Cross Keys—he said, "I know Matthews, I don't know Kemp"—I said, "You spoke to them that morning"—he said, "That is quite right, I spoke to them that morning."

The prisoner, in his defence, said that while waiting for his aunt to go to market he met Matthews, but that he was quite innocent.


MATTHEWS PLEADED GUILTY to a conviction of felony in April, 1890, and KEMP to a conviction of felony in October, 1889.— Twelve Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-725
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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725. CHARLES WINDSOR (19) , Stealing two watches, and other goods, and £45, the goods and money of Alfred Watkinson. Second Count, Receiving the same.

MR. HUTTON Prosecuted, and MR. COLLINS Defended.

ALFRED WATKINSON . I am landlord of the Bull Inn, Leatherhead, four miles from Epsom—on the night before Derby Day I was at Waterloo Station, going home, when the prisoner, whom I did not know, came up and asked me for a light—I gave him one, and we got into conversation—I asked him if he would have a drink—we had one—he said, "Are you going far?"—I said I was going to Leatherhead, just beyond Epsom—he said, "Oh! I wanted to go to Epsom; I should very much like to go down there"—I said "If you like to go down, why don't you go down?"—he said, "I have not got the money; I have money to go down, but not the money to get a night's lodging"—I said, "If you have the money for the train I daresay I could find you a night's lodging—he came down by a train later on, because he wanted to go home to get a change of linen—he arrived about a quarter to twelve, and came to my house—we had drinks in the bar parlour, where there is a safe, obvious to anyone sitting there—we sat talking some time, and I told him I had no bed for him, he would have to sit in the armchair, because the house was full; the gentlemen did not come till the last thing—I came over giddy, undressed, and got into bed—I was a little the worse for drink; I don't think he was—when I went to bed the key of the safe was in my trousers pocket—I had last seen it safe at half-past eleven—in the safe were two watches, two chains, two diamond rings, and two diamond pins, a pair of brown boots and £45 in gold, and about 20s. in silver—the value of the whole was about £145—there was only the one key to the safe, and no one could have opened it without the key—my trousers were hinging on the knob of the bedstead—when I went to bed the prisoner

was sitting on a chair bedstead looking at an album—when I woke up next morning at half-past six the prisoner was gone—my door was open—I searched my trousers pockets, and my keys were gone—I went straight to the bar parlour, examined the safe, and found the things in it gone—the next I heard of the prisoner was when I was at Bow Street—I identified the articles produced by the police.

Cross-examined. I had never seen the prisoner before that day—at the Police-court he said he thought he had seen me before, but I contradicted it—I did not go anywhere by train before I went home—I was in liquor in London before I got home, and I had more liquor when the prisoner came, about twelve o'clock—I was slightly the worse for drink; I cannot say I was very much drunk—I daresay I should not. have asked the prisoner to come if I had not been in drink—I did not ask him to come down; he came down on his own account—I told him my address at Waterloo—the robbery was committed on 31st May—I did not give information to the police till some little time afterwards—I did not give it next morning, because I was so bad from the effects of the drug he administered to me and drink—the effects lasted three or four days—I then came to London and made inquiries about the prisoner; he said he had been lodging at a coffee-house in the Charing Cross Road; they said there he had left, and I went to two or three other places and made sundry inquiries, and found out he was a dangerous thief, and I did not trouble to take further proceedings for the present, although he had taken £140 of my property—I did not charge him till 9th July, six weeks after the robbery, until I was persuaded to do so by my brother, and at the same time Walker was in the witness-box charged with stealing a gold watch and chain, which I identified—I knew, when I was about to give information, that the prisoner charged Walker with stealing these things from him—that was not two days after the robbery; it was a short time after—the prisoner then gave information to the police that this property came from me, and the police communicated with me about this charge, with the result that I came as a witness at Walker's trial, and the prisoners changed places—I wrote to the prisoner asking him to give me back the jewellery, and telling him he could keep the money; that was after I had been up to London and knew what the prisoner was, and I did not want him to blackguard and blackmail me afterwards—I did not trouble about the money, but I wanted the jewellery, because it was old family jewellery—the prisoner did not threaten to make a charge against me of acting with him in an indecent manner; he said nothing of the kind to me—I was not frightened.

Re-examined. No indecency took place between us—he did not occupy my bed that night to my knowledge; I was no sooner in bed than I was asleep—when I woke up he was gone—I made inquiries about him about four days afterwards, I should think.

HENRY WALKER . I was living during Derby week in the same room with the prisoner, at 4, Turner's Court, St. Martin's Lane—on Derby morning the prisoner came back to the room, took his hat off, and showed bags containing gold and silver, and watches, chains, diamond pins and rings, and a pair of brown boots—this is the jewellery—he said he went home with Mr. Watkinson, and that he gave him whisky and port wine, and got him to sleep, and he went down and searched the bar parlour, and found the things in the bar parlour in a safe—he said he had taken

the key of the safe out of the gentleman's pocket—he said he came out of the public-house and shut the bar door, and could not get a cab for love or money, and that he came to town—I decided to deprive the prisoner of this property on Derby night; young Arnett assisted me—the room door was left open for the purpose—I and Arnett took the box down into the yard, and burst it open when the prisoner was drunk and asleep in the room—shortly after he gave information, and I was taken into custody and charged before Mr. Vaughan, to whom I made a statement in the prisoner's presence—I first made a statement at the station; the prisoner was not there then—I was remanded, and when the prosecutor came up I went out of the dock into the witness-box, and the prisoner went out of the witness-box into the dock—I had no communication with the prosecutor, or anybody except the prisoner, before I made this statement at the station.

Cross-examined. I admit that I stole this property from the prisoner—I have been convicted before—Wicks took me home to his house for a lodging, and he took a pair of blankets and pawned them, and because I was with him they gave me six weeks—I am not very friendly to the prisoner.

ARTHUR HAILSTONE (Detective E). I was the officer who took. particulars from the prisoner when he reported the larceny from him at the station—he said he had lost £29 in gold, a few shillings, a small gold watch and chain, a spade guinea, a signet ring, a plain gold ring, a summer suit, jacket, white shirt, and other things; he said the jewellery and money had been left him by an aunt who had died a few weeks before, and he referred me to his lather, who is in the employment of a fishmonger in the Brompton Road, to verify his statement—we did not entertain his story till we had seen his father, who appeared very much hurt at his losing the property—the prisoner gave a description of Walker, who was eventually arrested by the Edinburgh police and sent here—I was present when Walker made a statement when he was charged—the prisoner was not present then—the prisoner gave no other account of where he got the property till 9th July; he then said it was given to him by a great friend of his named Watkinson, of the Bull public-house, Leatherhead—I communicated with Watkinson and produced the watch, with the result that Watkinson came up and gave evidence—I know nothing of Walker beyond what the prisoner has told me.

Cross-examined. When Mr. Vaughan ordered the prisoner into the dock Walker had said that they had been lodging together, and that the prisoner had stolen property from a gentleman in the country; he did not know exactly the name of the place, but he said it was somewhere near Epsom; he said that as the prisoner would not give him and his comrades something to assist them, as they were hard up, they stole the things—in consequence of that the order was made.


He then PLEADED GUILTY** to a conviction of felony in July 1889.— Eighteen Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-726
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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726. JAMES LEGGE (60) , Unlawfully and carnally attempting to know Jessie Lane, a girl under thirteen. Second Count, Indecently assaulting her.

MR. HUTTON Prosecuted.


25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-727
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence; Guilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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727. JOHN ROSS and HENEY BOND , Unlawfully committing an act of gross indecency with each other.

Ross PLEADED GUILTY. No evidence was offered by the prosecution against Bond. NOT GUILTY .

Several witnesses gave Ross an excellent character, but a constable said he had seen him with thoroughly bad characters.— [Pleaded Guilty] Judgment respited.

OLD COURT.—Thursday, July 28th, 1892.

Before Baron Pollock.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-728
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation

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728. JAMES TAYLOR (60) was indicted for, and charged on the Coroner's inquisition with, the wilful murder of Mary Taylor.


HENRY NICHOLLS . I prepared this plan of the premises, 8, St. Matthew Street; it is correct and to scale; it shows the mangle, the bedstead, and the corner opposite the mangle—the distance from 4 he mangle to the bedstead is 2 feet 6 inches, just a step.

MARIA SMITHERS . I am now living at Battersea—up to June last I was living at 8, St. Matthew Street, with my mother and the prisoner, who is my stepfather, and his children—my mother had a little baby that she was taking care of for somebody—the prisoner has been married to my mother seven years—he was a night watchman when he could get employment—mother used to keep a mangle—on Whit-Monday, 6th June, mother and the prisoner were rowing all day; he was drunk all day on Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday in that week—he used to get drunk new and again—on the Tuesday and Wednesday I heard him say to my mother that he would do for her before the week ended—I occupied the back room with my sister and brother—I did not sleep at home on Whit Monday, because he would not let us in—my mother did not sleep there on the Tuesday night—she slept with a neighbour, in the house—father was alone in his room that night, and the same on the Wednesday night, mother slept upstairs—father was rowing, and calling us dreadful names; he broke some plates—he got better after that—he was sober on the Thursday, and he continued sober for the rest of that week—on Sunday, 12th June, he was sober; I saw him that day—I went to bed that night with my sister and brother—my father and mother had gone to bed—I heard nothing between them during the day to attract my attention; he was quite sober when he went to bed—mother was sober—I heard nothing during that night—I was roused up by the police at half-past four in the morning—I then left my room and went upstairs; they would not let me go into the front room—I saw my mother dead at the mortuary on the Monday.

Cross-examined. I had lived with my stepfather ever since he married my mother—they always lived unhappily; there were frequent quarrels between them, quarrels in which I frequently took part—I always took my mother's part—my impression was that he did not like me because of these frequent quarrels—mother sometimes got drunk—she was frightened of him—they occasionally fought; he hit her; I don't know about her hitting him—when I say they fought, I mean rowing—I have not seen them exchange blows—he hit her on the head with a poker; I have never seen her hit him—they never fought, beyond words; I am quite sure of that—they quarrelled a good deal about the conduct of

myself and my sister Rose; he did not like the way in which we behaved, and he used to say so to mother—he was the worse for drink on the Sunday, Monday, Tuesday and "Wednesday, and sober on Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday, and during that time, as far as I know, they were on good terms—I had no quarrel with him on the Sunday; I think Rose had—he was in receipt of a Government pension of 1s. 1d. a day; he gave all that up to mother to pay the rent—she did not spend it on me; she has spent some on me—I have not heard him complain of that—I don't know that she occasionally pawned the furniture; I don't think so; or his clothes, I am quite sure of that—she worked at the mangle.

ROSE SMITHERS . I live at 64, Vincent Square—I am the sister of the last witness—on Sunday, 13th June, I was living at St. Matthew Street—the prisoner was drunk that day and quarrelling with his wife; he smashed all the crockery and burnt up the tea, sugar, and butter—he was calling mother names and said he would do for her before the week was out—he sharpened two table knives and put them into his pocket—I saw no more of the knives after that; that was Whit-Monday—that night I slept with my sister in the top room—I heard him say to mother again that night that he would do for her before the week was out—on the Tuesday afternoon he was sitting by the fire, drunk—I slept upstairs with my sister that night, and on Wednesday I slept in Mrs. Cowen's room—on the Wednesday he was jawing and said we were only a lot of bastards—he called his wife names—he then had the two knives in his pocket, hanging out—he was drunk then—on the Thursday, Friday and Saturday he was sober; there was no quarrel then—he was all right on Sunday—I went out that evening at nine-my mother and he were then standing at the door talking quietly—I returned at ten; he was then in bed in the front room with mother and the baby—I slept with my sister next door; the door between us was open—I heard nothing in the night—the first thing I heard was the woman upstairs came and woke us up, and the police came, about five o'clock.

Cross-examined. On the Sunday I and the prisoner had a row—that was between one and two in the afternoon—he had spoken crossly to me, and then went to his own room—I shouted through the door, "You need not worry; you don't keep me"—I was in the habit of having quarrels with him, and so were my sister and mother—mother was not a bad-tempered woman—she drank occasionally, not so very of ten—I never knew them exchange blows—they quarrelled chiefly about my conduct—I always took my mother's part—he complained of my behaviour—he said he would do for mother during the. week—he often used expressions of that sort during the rows through the whole of their married life—I have heard mother make use of similar expressions to him, not so very often, but sometimes—he is a hasty man, quick in temper, soon come and soon go—during the seven years they lived together he only struck her twice, and on each of those occasions he went to the Police-station and gave himself into custody—it was about three in the afternoon when I saw him sharpening the knives—we dine about two—he sharpened the knives about dinner-time; that was on the Monday.

Re-examined. The prisoner and mother were constantly quarrelling during the whole of the seven years—he gave himself up for using the poker, and was sent to prison—the next time was for using a broom, and lie was sent to prison for that—those are the only two occasions I can

remember that he struck her with violence—mother was not the worse for drink on Sunday, the 16th—the prisoner was quite sober that day.

FANNY TRAVEL . I am married—I occupy the first-floor back at 8, St. Matthew Street, Westminster—the prisoner and his wife and the stepchildren occupied the parlours on the ground floor—I had lived there three years and a half—they were there all that time—he and his wife lived very unhappily; he used to use very bad language towards her—on Whit-Monday night his wife went to go into the room to put the children to bed, and they, seeing he was drunk, rushed out, and he made a rush at his wife to kick her, and he told her it she came into the room that night he would kick her guts in—he was very drunk—on the Wednesday, he and his wife had had a little drink, but not much to speak of—they were the worse for drink—they seemed on very good terms then—I saw him again on Thursday—he was not to say sober; he had had a little drink—on the Sunday I saw him between three and four; he seemed to be all right—I went to bed about eleven that night—I heard nothing till I was awoke by the police—I then went down and woke them up—I afterwards saw the woman dead.

Cross-examined. I never saw them come to blows—they had a few words, but the wife used to run away—I was in their room on the Wednesday, between six and seven—I heard the prisoner say to his wife, "If you had made me some broth as I asked you instead of studying the children there would not be so many rows between you and me"—she said, "Hold your tongue, and go and get me a haporth of onions"—the stepchildren were a bone of contention between them; it was principally with the children—they all lived on unfriendly terms together—the deceased was not a sharp-tongued woman—she could hold her own in the quarrels—she used to say some very sharp things at times—that used to make him extremely angry, and then there would be a row.

EMMA CLEMENTS . I am married—I live at 1, St. Matthew Street—I have known the prisoner about twenty years—I saw him about a quarter-past ten on Sunday night. 12th June, standing at the corner of our street—he said, "Is that you, Mrs. Clements?"—I said, "Yes, Jim; what do you want?"—he said, "I wish I could see my Jimmy (his son) or your husband"—I said, "What do you want with them?"—he said, "She has just sent me out for a b——pint of beer, and I don't want it while she hides her b——money"—I said, "Well, don't go for it, if you don't want to, Jim"—he said, "I must go for it, or else there will be a row when I get indoors"—he went and got it, and came back and said, "I am going indoors, good night"—I told him not to have any more rows, to wait till he got his pension in, and then allow her so much a week and the children—he said, "I have offered her 4s. or 5s., and she won't give me any receipt for it"—he seemed sober, and talked sensibly—I have seen him drunk; he was given to drinking—I knew his wife; I used to talk to her at the door.

Cross-examined. I have not seen her drunk—he said, "When I was at work she would not give me a bit of peace; there was never any victuals for me when I came home"—he had a night watchman's place—he also said, "I can't stop indoors, for those two girls are carrying on sometimes unmercifully all day; the language they use, and the missus only stands and laughs at them instead of chastising them"; and he

ended with these words, "If she hits me I shall hit her; we have been rowing all day"

LAVI AVERY (Sergeant 4 H). I was in charge of Rochester Bow Police-station—on the early morning of 13th June the prisoner came there at 3.45, and said, Sergeant, you had better send someone to No. 8, St. Matthew Street; you will find something up there"—I said, "What shall I find?"—he replied, "You will find a woman in bed"—I said, "Well, what of that; is there anything the matter with her?"—he said, "Well, I hit her on purpose to kill her, it's no use walking about the streets; I have had several rows with my wife, and I hit her on the head with a mangle roller, which you will find on the mangle in the room; I have locked the door, so you must get through the window; that is the way I got out"—I at once sent two constables to make inquiry; I did not go myself—I requested the prisoner to sit down—he was quite sober, very cool and collected—I went to the house two days afterwards, on the day of the inquest—I did not see the roller there—the inspector brought it to the station—I was present when the prisoner was charged—he made a statement, which was taken down by the inspector.

GEORGE SAVIN (Inspector A). Shortly before four on the morning of 13th June I received a message and went to 8, St. Matthew Street—I found the front parlour window open—I entered the room through the window, and found the deceased lying on the bed in her chemise, with a large wound on the head; she was lying in a natural position, as one would asleep—a quantity of blood had flowed from the wound and gone right through the bed and mattress, and about a yard across the floor—I did not observe blood coming from any other part, the greater part was from the head—the body was quite warm—a baby was lying by her side in the bed; it was asleep and uninjured, so I let it sleep on till the doctor arrived—there was no sign of life about the woman, but the body was perfectly warm—against the mangle I found this roller; it was one of three rollers belonging to the mangle; it was covered with blood at one end—I took possession of it, and produce it—Mr. Pearce, the divisional surgeon, had been sent for, and he arrived in a few minutes and pronounced life to be extinct—the door leading into the back room was partly open, and the two girls and a boy were apparently fast asleep in that room—I left the room in possession of an officer, and went to the station—I found the prisoner there detained by the sergeant—the statement he had made was shown to me—I then formally charged him with the murder of hit wife—when the charge was read over to him; he said, "Me and the missus could not agree, so I thought we had better part; there's three or four children there that don't belong to me; it is my second wife; they call me a b——old sod, and one thing and another, and she laughs at them; it is enough to make you do something"—I searched him, and took possession of his trousers, and gave him another pair—on the band of his trousers, near the brace button, I found marks of fresh blood—I afterwards handed over the trousers to the divisional surgeon—that was the only part of the trousers where I could discover blood.

Cross-examined. Sergeant Taylor was there when I arrived—I was there a considerable time; it is a very small room—I got out again by the window, and assisted the surgeon in that way; he came almost immediately after me, and Taylor had assisted me in through the window; the three of us were in the room at the same time—I did not

wake the children; it was a horrible sight for them to see—I noticed two rollers under the mangle in their proper place—the mangle was only a short space from the bed—anyone stepping out of bed hastily would come to it almost immediately—I found on the prisoner his Service record; he was twenty-one years in the Army; he enlisted at Derby in 1854, in the 3rd Battalion of the Grenadier Guards—he was discharged from the army on 10th January, 1876, with his character marked "Very good"—he was in possession of fire good conduct badges, and he also had the Crimean medal and a Sebastopol clasp, a Turkish medal and a long-service good conduct medal—after his discharge from the army he was nine months in one employment.

FRANCIS JAMES PEARCE . I am a registered medical practitioner and acting divisional surgeon—about four in the morning of 13th June I was called to the ground floor of 8, St. Matthew Street—I found the parlours in the occupation of the inspector; he helped me in through the window—I found the deceased in the bed, quite dead, lying on her right side, with the left arm doubled up and the hand under the chin, the right arm stretched out at right angles to the bed; she was lying in a natural position, as if asleep—I found a wound on the left side of the head, above and behind the left ear—it was a contused wound, a star-shaped wound; blood was not coming from it then—there was also a wound behind the ear; that was a lacerated and contused wound, and irregular—the ear had been struck; it was an indirect wound—the left side of the face was bruised and swollen; there was a great deal of blood in the bed, and it had run. through the mattress and on to the floor below; it was oozing from the nose and ears; there was no indication of any struggle; the blood was all in one place in the bed; there was no smearing, nothing to show that the body had been shifted from the time the first blow was struck—I am of opinion that she never moved after the first blow—she was subsequently removed to the mortuary—next day I made a post-mortem; I found the temple bone fractured, corresponding with the wound; it was a comminuted fracture, and extended through the parietal bone, the occipital bone, to the parietal bone on the opposite side—there was a fracture of the base of the skull through a portion of the temporal bone, which was very much shattered—it was such an injury as would be caused by this roller—there had been several blows; it could not all be caused by one blow; there were at least three—the fracture of the skull was the cause of death—the inspector afterwards gave me a pair of trousers, and I found blood on the band.

Cross-examined. If she had been sitting up in bed when struck she might have fallen in the position I found her; it is not impossible.

FANNY TRAVEL (Recalled). I went to the Police-court when the prisoner was in custody, and had a conversation with him in the cell—I asked him if it was true what the people said, that his wife had had a miscarriage; he replied, "I told her to change her linen before she went to bed on the Sunday night, and she said, 'No, I have had a miscarriage, but not by you, by a soldier and she told me several things that were not pleasant to hear"—I told him I would not believe it if I was going to have my head chopped off; that was referring to what he Slid about the miscarriage—he said he would not say anything there; he would wait till he got further.

F.J. PEARCE (Recalled). My attention was directed to this alleged statement of the prisoner to the witness Travel, and I examined the woman to see if there was any foundation for it; there was no sign whatever of her having had a miscarriage; there would have been signs if such a thing had taken place within a reasonable period.

GUILTY. Strongly recommended to mercy by the JURY on account of his good character.— DEATH .

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-729
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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729. ABRAHAM HEIDMAN (20) , Feloniously wounding James Groom, with intent to murder him. Second Count, to do him grievous bodily harm.

MR. H. AVORY, for the prosecution, proceeded on the Second Count only.

JAMES ENDELL . I live at 77, Ernest Street, Stepney—on 1st July after the houses were closed, I was in Ernest Street, and saw the prisoner and a man named Merry fighting—I took Merry away, and then went back—I was passing the prisoner's door, and he ran out, knocked me down, and kicked me in the testicles—I got up and he kicked me in the same place—he then rushed at the prosecutor and stabbed him in the neck—I ran for a doctor.

Cross-examined by MR. HUTTON. I was not fighting at all—I did not see Henry Gibbs—I was not fighting with him—I could not strike the prisoner, but I tried to defend myself after I was kicked—other persons were looking on, but they did not interfere—I did not see a knife—I did not see Foley or Groom there.

JAMES GROOM . I am a shoe laster, of 55, Ernest Street—on July 1st, about 12.30 or 12.45 p.m., I was going to bed and heard a scream—I went out and saw the prisoner standing at the door of his house—he made a run at me, and made a kick and put a knife into my neck, and I was taken to the hospital—I tried to defend myself—he showed fight, and I showed fight in self-defence, and he stabbed me in my neck immediately—I did not see the knife—Endell is my cousin, but I did not see him that night.

Cross-examined. I saw no struggle between the prisoner and Endell—I came down because I heard a quarrel—I cannot tell you who between—I did not see the prisoner in the quarrel, and cannot say whether three or four men were attacking him.

BENJAMIN FOLEY . I live at 155, Ernest Street—on Saturday, 2nd July, about a quarter-past one a.m., I was indoors and heard a row in the street—I went down and there was nobody there, but the prisoner was outside his door, and challenged to fight any man in the street—he rushed at me and stabbed me in the groin and stomach—directly I was stabbed I saw Groom bleeding from his neck—we were in company before the row happened—he was standing looking on the same as I was—I was stabbed before he was.

Cross-examined. I came down because I heard that James Groom was in a bit of a trouble—I do not know whether he was fighting—I was going to bed, and my sister-in-law knocked at my door, and I went down to get James Groom away, because I was living in the same house, and I thought he was in a row—I heard that there was a general row going on, but I did not see the first of it—the fighting was all over when I got down—I did not see two or three men accusing the prisoner.

CHARLES GROOM . I am the brother of James Groom, and live in

Ernest Street—on 2nd July, just before one a.m., I was in Ernest Street, and the prisoner was having words with my brother—the prisoner had a knife in his hand, and struck my brother, and he fell covered with blood; I rushed at the prisoner and struck him—he dodged, and fell on me, and I found my leg smothered with blood—I got up, and I saw him rush indoors, and saw a constable go to his door and take him—I was stabbed in my leg.

Cross-examined. The prisoner and my brother were having angry words, and the prisoner struck my brother; I was trying to get him away—I said, "Come home"—I struck the prisoner after the struggle with my brother—my brother was then lying on the ground—four or five persons were present—my brother was stabbed immediately after what I considered to be the fight.

Re-examined. No blow was struck by my brother before he was stabbed that I saw—I thought that he was going to punch my brother on his nose, but he stabbed him in his neck—that was the only blow I saw struck between them.

MARY ANN NORTH . I live at 79, Ernest Street—on July 2nd I heard screams of "Murder!" and ran out and saw the prisoner standing by his door with a knife in his hand—Foley came up to me, and the prisoner said, "Come along, anybody shall have it"—Foley stood with his hands on his-stomach and could not move, and the prisoner ran from his door with a long knife, and ran it into the man's neck; he called "Mother, mother, my throat is cut!" and fell into my arms.

Cross-examined. I did not see either of the Grooms make a blow at the prisoner and then tumble down together—a great many people were there—I was very excited and frightened.

SOPHIA MOODY . I live in Ernest Street—I saw the prisoner draw a knife from his pocket and stick it into James Groom's throat; I had not seen Groom strike any blow—I was quite close to him—after that I saw the prisoner strike Foley in the stomach—I had seen the prisoner before that evening at the top of White Horse Lane, and saw the constable shove him into his house because he was making a disturbance—that was. several minutes before this.

Cross-examined. There were a great number of people outside, and pushing and struggling.

KENNETH MORRELL MCKENZIE . I am house surgeon at the London Hospital—on July 2nd, about 2.15 a.m., James Groom and Foley were brought in—Groom was very exhausted from a wound, which was sewn up; he lost a good deal of blood, and his life was in, danger—the wound could have been caused by this knife (produced), with considerable force—I found two wounds on Foley; they might have been caused by this, knife.

HENRY WRIGHT (278 H). On July 2nd I heard a disturbance in Ernest Street, and saw the prisoner going into No. 94—I went in at the front door, and saw him run out at the back—the front door was locked, but I forced it open, and went through and found him hiding under a fence in the back yard—I put my light on him and he got over the fence—I got over too, and he said, "What do you want me for?"—I said, "For stabbing a man"—he said he had used no knife, he only struck him with his fist.

Cross-examined. He was not the worse for drink.

ALFRED GOODALL (Police Inspector H). On July 2nd, after 2 a.m., I went to 4, Ernest Street, and found this knife lying on a table, with marks of blood on it and on the tablecloth—I was present when the prisoner was charged—he said he only struck with his fist, he should be sorry to use a knife—I told him where the knife was found—he said, "Yes, you have made a mistake there."

Cross-examined. He had decidedly been drinking.

Witnesses for the defence.

HENRY GIBBS . I am a cocoanut showman, of 70, Ernest Street—early on the morning of July 2nd I was in Ernest Street, and saw the prisoner there and the two Grooms—two policemen were standing at the corner of the turning—I went indoors and spoke to my mistress, and went out again and saw the prisoner standing against his own door, and five or six men on the opposite side—I asked him what was the matter—he said there were a lot of men on to him—I said, "Why don't you go in?"—he said, "I cannot get in," and a man struck him in the face and another man kicked him in the privates, and five or six more kicked him—I saw the man who was stabbed in the neck, and I took him in a barrow to the London Hospital—there were a lot of people there, and women screaming "Murder!" and much confusion.

Cross-examined by MR. AVORY. I cannot say who stabbed the man in the neck, because there were such a lot. of people there—I did not see Foley stabbed, but he came up and said he was stabbed—I do not know who stabbed him.

HENRY SYKES . I am a slipper-maker, of 7, Ernest Street—on July 2nd I was outside my door—James Groom came up and struck me two blows on my face—the prisoner came to defend me, and he and James Groom fought—I did not see the man stabbed—there was plenty of noise.

ALFRED GOODALL . Re-examined. I know the house where the prisoner lives—his sister and her husband and two children also live there—any one can run in if the door is open—I saw no marks on the prisoner when he came to the station, but he said he had had a tooth knocked out.

By MR. AVORY. Gibbs came to the station, but said nothing about anybody having attacked the prisoner.

GUILTY on the Second Count.— Eighteen Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-730
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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730. JAMES CLARK (18) , Feloniously carnally knowing Ellen Muriel Taylor, a girl under thirteen.

MR. SANDS Prosecuted.

GUILTY .— One Year's Hard Labour.

NEW COURT.—Thursday, July 28th, 1892.

Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-731
VerdictGuilty > pleaded part guilty; Guilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment > hard labour; Imprisonment > hard labour; Imprisonment > hard labour; Imprisonment > hard labour; Imprisonment > hard labour

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731. JOSEPH BLUHM (36), LOUIS RAGON (33), JEAN LONGUESPE (49), MAURICE THIERRY (44), WALTER VANDER KEMP (22), PETER DEMAN (27), and FERMIN LAGARRIQUE (46) , Unlawfully obtaining by false pretences from Conrad Brock certain postage stamps, value 8s. 6d. Other Counts, for obtaining money from other persons. Other Counts, for conspiracy to defraud.

Mr. HORACE AVORY. Mr. ELDRIDGE, and Mr. C. MATHEWS Prosecuted;

Mr. ABINGER appeared for Bluhm and Thierry, Mr. PAUL TAYLOR for Ragon, and Mr. KEITH FRITH and Mr. BLACKWOOD for Kemp.

After MR. AVORY'S opening the prisoners PLEADED GUILTY, BLUHM, RAGON and KEMP [Pleaded Guilty] to the conspiracy counts only , LONGUESPE, THIERRY and LAGARRIQUE [Pleaded Guilty] to the whole indictment. KEMP received a good character. BLUHM— Three Years' Penal Servitude; RAGON and LAGARRIQUE— Eight Months' Hard Labour each; LONGUESPE— Twelve Months' Hard Labour; THIERRY— Ten Months' Hard Labour; KEMP— Nine Months' Hard Labour; DEMAN— Six Months' Hard Labour.

THIRD COURT.—Thursday, July 28th, 1892.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-732
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > unknown
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties; Miscellaneous > fine; Miscellaneous > fine

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732. HENRY HURST, HENRY HARRISON, HENRY NICHOLLS, ALBERT GRIMMETT, EDWARD HAMMOND, WILLIAM HENRY HART , and ROBERT BALDWIN , Using a public-house for the purpose of betting, viz., the Prince of Saxe-Coburg, Old Kent Road.

Hurst, Harrison, Nicholls, Grimmett, Hammond, and Baldwin PLEADED GUILTY .

During the progress of the case Hart stated in the hearing of the Jury his desire to PLEAD GUILTY to Counts 4 to 11 and 23 to 25 inclusive, and thereupon the Jury found him

GUILTY upon those Counts.

NICHOLLS, HAMMOND, and BALDWIN— Discharged on recognisances; HURST, HARRISON, and GRIMMETT— Fined £10 each, or to be imprisoned for Twelve Months in default; HART fined £20, or to be imprisoned for Twelve Months in default.

FOURTH COURT.—Thursday, July 28th, 1892.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-733
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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733. ROBERT TIEDEMAN (47) PLEADED GUILTY to two indictments for uttering receipts for 3s. 11d. and 2s. 6d.

Discharged on recognisances.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-734
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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734. AUGUSTINE LIONEL CRESSET KENT (19) Unlawfully, by false pretences, causing and procuring to be delivered to another person for the benefit of him (Kent) a warrant for the payment of 55,067 francs 55 centimes, the moneys of Thomas Cook and Son; Other Counts, for conspiring with persons unknown to obtain, from Thomas Cook, and others, a warrant for the same amount, and for other conspiracies.

MR. POLAND, Q.C., and MR. ELLIOT Prosecuted; MR. WILLIS, Q.C., and MR. PASMORE Defended.

GEORGE RUSSELL . I am a cashier in the banking department of Messrs. Thomas Cook and Son, tourist agents and bankers, at Ludgate Circus—on 16th April, about the middle of the day, I received this letter; enclosed in the letter was the signature of H. Munro, to whom the order is to be made payable—about one o'clock that day a person, who appeared to be a bank clerk, having a case and chain, came to the office, and produced from the case this banker's payment slip for £2,190, and handed it to me in the ordinary way—I knew what it was because of the letter—it has the signature of Mr. Hibbert, of the London and Westminter Bank, and is filled up to the credit of Meyer—the other

part of it would go to the Temple Bar branch, be signed by the manager there, and go to the Clearing-house, and we should be credited with that urn, so that we could draw upon it—about five o'clock that day someone representing himself to be Meyer called—J got him to write his name, and compared it with the letter, and thought it was all right; and then, at his request, and as contained in the letter, I gave him this draft on Paris for 55,000 odd francs, and he left—I afterwards, for safety sake, sent to Paris Munro's signature, which had been enclosed in the letter—the following Monday was Bank Holiday—on Wednesday, 20th April, or Thursday, 21st, the same person, representing Mr. Meyer, brought me the Paris draft—I noticed it had been endorsed "F. Munro"—at the request of the person I gave him this cheque on the London and Westminster Bank for £2,187 16s., which was duly honoured and debited to our account—on the day after we received information from our Piccadilly branch of the other document of a similar character, and also from Meyer, for £2,000; inquiries were made and the fraud discovered—we communicated with the Capital and Counties Bank, and the matter was put into their solicitors' hands.

PAYTON CONSTABLE . I am a cashier at the Temple Bar branch of the London and Westminster Bank—on Wednesday, 20th April, this cheque was presented there, and I cashed it with twenty-one £100, one £50, one £20, one £10 notes, and £7 16s. in coin—this is one of the £100 notes and the £50 note.

HENRY ERNEST RHODES . I am manager of the Capital and Counties Bank, Ludgate Hill branch—the prisoner has been a clerk there since 9th November last; he was formerly in the Piccadilly branch—this banker's paying-in slip is on one of our printed forms—we have eleven clerks at the Ludgate Hill branch who would have access to these forms—it has been filled up and signed by me, and the signature is left for the London and Westminster Bank manager—in the ordinary course. these flips are for the Clearing-house, as between bankers, and ought not to be in the hands of any member of the public—if it were a genuine transaction it ought to be sent on to Cook's, who would send to the London and Westminster Bank and get the money—we have a customer Davis, who is here—we received no authority to pay over any such sumi as this—I cannot swear whether this is my signature or not; if I did write it I did not intend to sign any such document—I don't think I could have signed such a document inadvertently—the second document, for £2,000 I know nothing of—it is all a fiction too—I know nothing of the writing of this letter—I don't know the writing of Meyer or F. Munro—the writing of the body of this £2,190 one resembles that of the prisoner's in some respects—formerly we used bankers' slip forma of a slightly different shape; those old ones became of no use; these are some of them—any clerk would bring me documents to sign from time, to time.

Cross-examined. I have noticed that these pieces of superseded printed matter have been written and sketched on by our different clerks—they are all of about the same size—they are put up for notes and memoranda on a string—I should not object to any one scribbling on a bit; of this paper—these signatures resemble mine very much, and I should not like to swear whether they are mine or not—if I were examining

some of the vouchers of the hank I should have passed these as my signature.

ANDREW FRANK BENNIE . I am second cashier at the Capital and Counties Bank, Ludgate Hill branch—the writing of the body of these two slips of 16th and 20th appears to resemble the prisoner's in some respects.

WALTER GEORGE RICKMAN . I am counter clerk at the W. C. post-office, 126, High Holborn—about five o'clock on 30th May this £50 note was brought by a young fellow about twenty years of age—the prisoner very much resembles him, I cannot swear to him—Mr. Hocking was there—the young man asked to have the note turned into postal-orders—several remarks passed in the course of the transaction; a certain number of orders were required which I could not serve as per list, and I gave information what I could supply, and the person walked over to a desk and made alterations on his list—I saw that the note was stamped Ward, Bailey and Co., 139, Oxford Street—the person who brought it was in the office about twenty minutes speaking to me and taking out these orders, which I had to sign and stamp—the note was endorsed T. Brown at my request—I put the numbers of a portion of the postal-orders on the note in blue pencil—it is not a common transaction to change a £50 note for so many orders; but it would not be surprising for large orders—about seven or eight days afterwards my attention was called to the transaction by a police officer—he took me to Bury Street, I believe, Oxford Street—I there saw several persons in the Street; the prisoner was there; I recognised him—he very much resembles the person I accepted the note from, but I will not swear to him—I do not identify him—he resembles him in every way.

Cross-examined. I am under the impression that the man who came tome had a moustache.

CHARLES WALLACE HOOKING . I am a clerk at the post-office, 126, High Holborn—on the afternoon of the 30th I was on duty by the side of Rickman, and noticed the person changing a £50 note—he was there about twenty minutes or a half-hour nearly—Rickman was issuing postal-orders—it was ten minutes or just before five, and the man was in the office till a little after five—I saw the transaction—to the best of my belief the prisoner is the person who presented the note.

Cross-examined. He had a little moustache, but you could hardly notice it; he had a little moustache.

THOMAS WOOD . I am postmaster's assistant, at 191, Oxford Street-at half-past six on 30th May I was on duty when a person whom I cannot identify presented this £100 note to me; it was not the prisoner—I gave him sixty-two £1 orders and other orders—I put my initials oft the note.

Cross-examined. The person was there about ten minutes, or a little more it might have been.

FREDERICK VICTOR ROGERS . I am a first-class clerk in the post-office at the South-Western District branch, but on 31st May I was on duty at the Bedford Street, Covent Garden post-office—at seven or quarter-past seven some person brought in eight £1 postal-orders and one £15. (These were orders given in exchange for the £100 note)—I recognise the prisoner as that person—I have no doubt about him in my own mind—

I noticed the orders particularly; they had not been filled in—I said to the prisoner, "These are not your orders; you have been sent with them"—he said, "Yes"—I said, "Who sent you with them?"—he gave me this address, which I got him to put on the back: "Mr. Lamb, 157, Blackfriars Road"—I explained to him that postal-orders were not negotiable, and his manner of presenting them being suspicious was my reason for questioning him—he said Lamb was a dancing-master at that address—the orders had Bed. Street, short for Bed ford Street—I told him that was irregular, and asked him to fill in Bedford Street in full—he went to the desk to do so, and I looked at the Directory and found there was a Mr. Lamb at 157, Blackfriars Road—I then paid him £8 15s., and he said he would give me 5s. to make up £9—I explained to him the rule in regard to postal-orders, and why the trouble and delay should have been given him—after he left the office I put on the back of the £1 order a full description of the person presenting himself—he was with me quite thirty minutes while this was going on—I afterwards met the prisoner face to face in a street coming down from the British Museum, and recognised him immediately.

Cross-examined. A Post Office constable and a City detective had been to see me before I identified him—I did not go in their company—it was about a quarter-past nine a.m. that I saw him—I had not been told his address at all—I was told where I should be likely to see him—the description I wrote on the back of the note was, "Twenty, fair, slight moustache, five feet seven inches, well-dressed."

WILLIAM LAMB . I live at 157, Blackfriars Road, and keep a dancing academy—I do not know the prisoner at all; I have never seen him—I sent no person to change a postal-order for me on 31 at May or about that time.

Cross-examined. I never saw the prisoner till I was at the Mansion House.

WILLIAM WRIGHT (Police Inspector). On 22nd June I was at the Capital and Counties Bank, Ludgate Hill—I saw Mr. Rogers and others there—the prisoner was called into the manager's room—he was told in my presence that Mr. Rogers had identified him as having passed £8 15s. postal-orders at Bedford Street, Strand—he said, "I know nothing about it"—he was asked if he had any explanation to give from whom he had received them—he said he knew nothing about it—he was afterwards taken to the Central Post Office, Holborn—five or six of us were in the room—I was informed he had been identified before in the street—he was given into custody—I told him he would be charged with forging and uttering a banker's pay-slip for £2,190—he said, "I don't understand"—I said, "Do you understand what I say to you?"—he said, "Yes, perfectly"—I said, "You have been identified by four persons in the street as having changed a £50 and £100 note, and also by Mr. Rogers at the Bedford Street post-office"—I took him to the station; he was charged; he made no reply—next day I got a search warrant, and went to 18, Little Russell Street, Bloomsbury, where he lodges—I found in the room which I was shown as his these pieces of credit slips.

Cross-examined. I searched his room, and also the prisoner—I did not take him to the Post Office for the purpose of being identified—I was

not present when he was identified; I was informed he had been, and I had seen the witness, and I thought it only fair to tell him he had been identified.

JANE RHINES . I live at 18, Little Russell Street—the prisoner had lodged for eight or nine months in the top room which the officer searched—the prisoner had a very slight moustache.

Cross-examined. I was seen and asked to give evidence last Saturday by two gentlemen—a gentleman for the prisoner asked me three weeks ago or more whether I remembered his having a moustache—I said he had a slight moustache, light—that is the gentleman—I did not see the prisoner every day—I signed a document—I said, "I used to see Mr. Kent occasionally, sometimes once a week, sometimes oftener, and sometimes not so often. I know he used to shave, having seen his shaving things. About a week ago last Monday I met Mr. Kent at the door, and spoke to him; I noticed that he had a little hair on his upper lip, nothing that could be called a moustache; it looked as if he had omitted to shave for a day or so. This was after he had been ill; with that exception I have not noticed particularly whether he had any hair on his upper lip; I could not swear whether he had or had not. If he had any hair on the upper lip it must have been very little, nothing that you could call a moustache, or I must have noticed it."

By the COURT. It was very slight, scarcely to be called a moustache at all—I had no conversation with the detective who called—I told him he had a very slight and light moustache—he asked me if the other solicitor had been, and I said yes, and I expected him to call again—the detective asked me about the moustache, and I said it was very slight and light-complexioned, hardly to be called a moustache, and my niece said the same—the detective came to me on Saturday.

DAVIS. I am a customer of the Capital and Counties Bank—I know nothing of having given a credit to Cook and Son for 2,190. know nothing of the writing of this letter—the address on it is the Craven Hotel, Craven Street.

SHERMAN. I am engaged at the Craven Hotel Craven Street, and I was there on 30th and 31st May, and from 1st March—no such person as Meyer was staying there during March or April—I have our visitors' book—I have never seen this gentleman.

WILLIAM HENRY BUCKLEY . I am a clerk at Messrs. Cook and Sons Piccadilly branch—on 21st April a letter was sent to us with tins banker's slip enclosed, purporting to be a credit for Meyer of £2, 000 sent it on to the banking department of our firm to have inquiries made about it—I know nothing further of it—it purports to be written by Meyer from the Bedford Hotel.

FURNELL. I am chamberlain of the Bedford Hotel, Covent Garden—on 20th April or thereabouts no such person as Meyer was staying there.

H.E. RHODES (Re-examined by the COURT). I know all our eleven clerks—to the best of my belief the prisoner never had a moustache.

Witnesses for the defence.

ROBERT DELL . I am a clerk in holy orders, and live at Greenest Gardens, West Hampstead—I have known the prisoner three years or more—he has visited my family very frequent y, and spent some tune with us on those occasions—I have always believed his character to be

perfectly straightforward and honest—I have never known him to wear a moustache, or anything approaching to a moustache—this photograph of him was taken last November, and represents him as I have known him through the whole of that time, with a clean-shaven lip—on the evening of 30th May he visited us, I am quite sure, after dinner, which is at half-past seven, and stayed till ten or past—he had nothing approaching to a moustache then.

Cross-examined. I saw him very frequently—my attention was called to this date, and my evidence was taken some three or four weeks ago.

Re-examined. I remember the date, because a sewing machine stand was sent up from the stores for my eldest daughter that day, and stood in the hall packed in wood; and my daughter asked the prisoner to undo it, and he did.

ALFRED PERCIVAL DELL . I am an articled clerk to a solicitor in South Square, Gray's Inn—I have known the prisoner over three years—I saw him frequently at my father's house, and at my office, where he sometimes called—he had no moustache—I remember the night of 30th, because the day before I went to Twickenham and met the prisoner—on 30th, about rive, between five and half-past five, I should think, he called at my office—afterwards he called at my father's house—he had no moustache, or anything like it, that evening—this photograph is a very good likeness of him, and would describe the general state of his lip—I know his handwriting—the writing on the postal-orders and on the slip is not a bit like his, in my judgment.

Cross-examined. 30th May was Monday, I believe—I should say it was nearer five than half-past that I saw him; he very often called to see me—I would not say it was not half-past five—I have considered it since.

Re-examined. My office was on the way from the bank to his lodging.

JOHN HENRY FULCHER . I am a Scripture reader, living at Duke Street, Bloomsbury—I have known the prisoner for about two and a half years, and I and my wife have received him as a friend—at one time I lived in the same house with him—I formed a very good opinion of him—he never wore anything approaching to a moustache—on the evening of the 31st May he called on. me—I remember the date because I was making out my schedule to take into my office on the next day, the first of the month, when we always take a report of what we do—I did not look at him particularly that night, and did not notice if he had a moustache; but I think I should have noticed if he had had one.

Cross-examined. 31st May was Tuesday, I think—it was about nine o'clock he called.

Re-examined. I know his writing well—I see no signs of his writing on these documents.

CATHERINE MARGARET FULCHER . I am wife of the last witness—I have known the prisoner since September, 1890—at one time we lodged in the same house, and I saw a great deal of him—I never saw him with a moustache or anything approaching to a moustache ever since I have known him—I remember his calling on 31st May, about nine o'clock, and he stayed till about half-past eleven—my husband was writing his report—the prisoner had no moustache or anything of the kind on his lip that night—I have seen him write—I see nothing here that resembles his writing.

FILMER. I live at 12, Brownlow Street, Hoi born, and am secretary to the Debenture Corporation—I have known the prisoner since January, 1891—I lived with him at 26, West Street till October, 1891, and since then I have seen him fairly frequently—he wore no moustache, and had nothing on his lip that could be described as a moustache—I have seen him write—I see no sign of his writing on these documents.

DAMON. I was a visitor at Mr. Dell's on 30th May—I have known the prisoner for about three years, and seen him frequently—I never noticed a moustache; he had none on 30th May.

Another witness deposed to the prisoner's good character. The JURY then stated that they desired to stop the case and find the prisoner.


The prisoner was indicted on four other indictments, three for felony and one for misdemeanour; no evidence was offered by the prosecution.NOT GUILTY.

OLD COURT.—Friday, July 29th, and Saturday, 30th, 1892.

Before Baron Pollock.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-735
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown; Guilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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735. EDWARD COUSINS and ELLEN HEFFRON (45) , Unlawfully procuring Rose Durham, a girl under sixteen, for immoral purposes.

MR. HORACE AVORY and MR. ARTHUR GILL Prosecuted; MR. LOCKWOOD, Q.C., with MR. HORACE BROWN, appeared for Cousins; and Mr. C.F. GILL, with MR. ROSE INNES, for Heffron.


HEFFRON GUILTY .— Ten Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-736
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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736. JAMES MORRISSEY (36) , For a rape on Alice Jane Anglis.

MR. ELDRIDGE Prosecuted.

GUILTY .— Three Years' Penal Servitude.

NEW COURT.—Friday, July 29th, 1892.

Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-737
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded part guilty
SentencesImprisonment > hard labour

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737. JOHN FRANCIS GARDINER (44) , Unlawfully conspiring (with Harry Roberts, not in custody) to obtain money by false pretences from Millicent Anderson, Idly Holton, Alice Lee, and Emily Nelson, and indecently assaulting them.

MR. C. MATHEWS Prosecuted; MR. KEMP, Q.C., and MR. PAUL TAYLOR Defended.

During the progress of the case MR. KEMP stated that the prisoner would PLEAD GUILTY to the Counts for indecent assault. MR. C. MATHEWS stated that the other Counts would not be withdrawn, but if Roberts was taken they would be proceeded with.— Six Months' Hard Labour.

FOURTH COURT.—Friday, July 29th, 1892.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-738
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment > hard labour

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738. WILLIAM FORMAN , CECIL WESTOBY (62), GEORGE PRICE (43), FREDERICK HORNE (49), and ROBERT GEAR (42) , being in the dwelling-house of James Jackson, feloniously stealing 200 cigars and other goods, and £25, and afterwards feloniously breaking out. Second Count, Receiving the same.

MR. BESLEY and MR. TRAVERS HUMPHREYS Prosecuted; MR. ROBINSON defended Forman MR. GREENFIELD defended Horne, and MR. WARBURTON defended Gear.

JAMES JACKSON . I am proprietor of the Guildford Arms, Guildford Street, St. Pancras—on Saturday night, 23rd April, I locked up my house safely—when I came down next morning I found the bar parlour in die order; all the locked drawers had been forced open, and the contents were strewn about—I missed about 45s. in coppers, keys, a cheque-book, on the London and County Bank, and a few other little things—in the cheque book were about ninety Drank forms, and one filled in—these are five of those cheque forms, they were blank—I know nothing about the writing or the signatures on any of them, or who filled them in—I know nothing about any of the prisoners.

Cross-examined by Mr. ROBINSON. The house was shut about twelve—I heard no noise in the night—my servant came down about eight next morning—she saw nothing; she did not go behind the bar—I examined the premises with the police—I saw no indication of anything wrong except in that room—the bar that goes across the door inside had been removed, and was lying against the wall close by—I don't know that the door had been opened.

Cross-examined by Westoby. I have two barmaids and my sister in my employment—they and the potman sleep on the premises—one barmaid had been with me twelve months, and the other six months prior to the robbery, and the potman had been with me six years—I also have a domestic servant, who has been with me about three years—she is a widow—the cheque that was filled in was payable to Foster for £44—I wrote it myself on the Saturday, and it was waiting for Foster to call—the cheque-book was in a drawer; I last saw it on the Saturday evening when I was counting up the money after we closed—I kept it under look and key—my sister, who was away from home at the time, also had a key—I was at home and in business all this Saturday evening—I noticed no one in the bar that attracted my attention particularly—I saw the place properly locked up and saw the door was closed.

Cross-examined by Price. I should know customers who frequented my house; I don't know you.

Cross-examined by MR. WARBURTON. I believe that the police have information that others than these five cheques have been attempted to be passed; these two blank cheques and three filled in are the only ones I have seen since.

Re-examined. I stopped at the bank the cheque to Foster, and it has never come back—I satisfied myself it was a breaking out of, and not into, the house—on the first floor I have a urinal and w. c, and a public room with seats round, which anyone might have got underneath—those rooms are open from the bar—I just looked in, but the gas was out, and I don't know whether anyone was under the seat—undoubtedly all my servants are honest.

CHARLES EVERETT (Inspector E). I examined this house on 24th April, and found that someone who had been secreted in it must have broken out—I found no marks.

Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. It might have been done by a servant there.

Cross-examined by Westoby. I got to the house shortly after ten a.m.—the potman said he found everything disarranged and the bar from the door removed.

FREDERICK GOODYEAR . I live at Hammersmith, and I was formerly a boot salesman to Lilley and Skinner, at Upper Street, Islington—on Saturday evening, 30th April. Format whom I did not know before, bought a pair of boots at 10s. 6d. and gave me this cheque for £3 in payment—I gave him £ I, and kept back the £1 9s. 6d. till I saw if the cheque was good—he came on Tuesday for the balance—I told him I could not give him all, and I gave him 9s. 6d.; the cheque had cot passed through the bank till Wednesday, and on Thursday, 5th May, they returned it unpaid and, said it was forged—I told him it had not passed through the bank, and he said, "Will you give me 9s. 6d.?"—he never came back for—the £1 which was owing.

Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. At that time, 30th April, I was in Anderson's employment at 113, High Holborn, when Forman came in between seven and ten, nearer ten than seven—the cheque was payable at the Oxford Street branch, within ten minutes' walk of my shop—I told For man I thought the cheque would be passed through on the Monday—he said he would came in on Monday, but he did not come till towards Tuesday evening.

Cross-examined by Westoby. He did not try the boots on—no one was with him in the shop—I saw him last Monday outside here—I only spoke to him regarding the boots—I had to make the £2 good—I have received nothing since, and have had no promise—I have never seen you before.

JOHN DAINTREE . I am a member of the firm of Daintree and Smith, ironmongers, of Upper Thames Street—I have known Forman about two years as a customer—on 5th May this cheque for £10 10s. and a letter were brought me by a lad. (The letter asked him to cash the cheque and deduct £5 off his account, and was headed 23, South Grove, Peckham Rye Lane, and was signed, Forman)—I gave no money on account—I passed the cheque through my bank, and it came back marked, "No account"—I do not know the boy who brought it; I have never seen him since—I was never asked for the proceeds of the cheque—I never saw Forman write his signature; I have seen his name on vouchers for the delivery of goods; I cannot say he has afterwards paid the accounts for those goods—I do not know his signiture.

Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. I have only known Forman in business, and car not swear to his signature—I should say that the endorsement on. the £3 cheque and this letter sent to me are not in the same writing—I did not know Forman's address when this letter and cheque were sent to me.

Cross-examined by Westoby. Forman is still indebted to my firm—I have seen him since he has been out on bail, and passed the time of day to him—I never before saw you, to my knowledge, till I saw you in Court.

Re-examined. Forman owed me £80 or £85 for goods delivered—it was from a bundle of delivery orders I showed at the Police-court that, in my opinion, the letter was Forman's; I have not changed my opinion.

FREDERICK GOODYEAR (Re-examined). "Ford" was the name at the back of the cheque when I took it; the man who bought the boots did not write in my presence—my master calls for cheques and money every day; I have nothing to do with the banking account.

WILLIAM BANNELL (Police Officer). On Saturday, 11th June, I went to 15, Stafford Road, Kilburn, where I found Forman living—I said I was a police officer, and wanted to speak to him about some cheques he had been uttering, which were part proceeds of a burglary—he said, "I did buy a pair of boots with one in Holborn; I paid 10s. 6d. for the boots, and received £1 part balance; I went two days afterwards and received another 9s. 6d."—I said, "Why did you not go for the other £1?"—he said, "I heard something"—I asked him from whom he got the cheque; he said, "It was given to me by a man"—I said, "Can you tell me who that man is?"—he said, "You will get nothing out of me"; he said ho had known the man for years—I said, "There is another cheque for £10 10s. that you sent to Messrs. Daintree and Smith, of Upper Thames Street, with a letter"—he replied, "I know nothing whatever about that cheque"—he was taken to the station, where he was charged—I found on him this letter in pencil. (The letter was addressed to Forman and stated: "It is clearly understood that the two cheques you have given me are to be held by me until I have raised enough money on your bonds for you to pay into your bank to meet the said cheques—signed, Satchfield")—I have not seen the cheques referred to there.

Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. I do not know the meaning of that letter—he said the boots he was wearing he had bought with the cheque—he gave the man's name to the Magistrate—I have made inquiries as to Forman's character, and find him to be a straightforward and honest man, as far as my inquiries have gone, and his friends and connections are the same—I made inquiries in King's Road, Chelsea, but found out nothing about the cheque supposed to be sent into a paperhanging warehouse by Forman; no one knew him there.

Cross-examined by Westoby. I did not search Forman's premises, nor the premises of the other two prisoners I took into custody.

Re-examined. At half-past eight on 21st June I saw Price in Huntley Street, Tottenham Court Road—I said I was a police-officer, and had received information that he had given a cheque for £5 17s. 6d. to a man named Poet, and I showed him the cheque—he said, "It is quite right, I did"—I said, "Where did you get that from?"—he said, "A man named Dear gave it to me off Leadenhall Market; if you meet me at two o'clock under the dome of Leadenhall Market I will show you the man"—I went there at two and remained till half-past four, and Price never came—I and Nicholl took him into custody next morning in Huntley Street—I said, "How was it you did not meet me yesterday?"—he said, "I was unable to"—I said, "You will have to come to the station and be detained until such time as we can find that man you call Dear"—he was taken to the station; we could not find Dear, and Price was charged—he said, "I know nothing about any burglary; I am a respectable man"—I brought a man in; Price said, "That is not the man"—on 27th June, about midday, I saw Gear at the corner of Leadenhall Market—I said, "I am a police-officer; I am going to take you into custody; you will be charged with being concerned with men

named Forman, Westoby, Price, and Home, with burglariously breaking out of the Guildford Arms, Guildford Street, Russell Square, and stealing a cheque-book with other articles"—he said, "I don't know what you mean"—I put him in a cab, and on the way to the station he said, "Oh, yes, a man of the name of Westoby, with a funny eye, gave Home two or three blank cheques about a week ago; I filled one in for £15 10s; that was brought back, as it was too large; Home then asked me to fill another one in for £5 17s. 6d., which I did, and gave to Home; it was cashed, and I received none of the money."

Cross-examined by Price. If you had been at Leadenhall Market, and had pointed out the man, you would have been made a witness—I and Nicholls told you you would be released on the production of the party from whom you received the cheque.

Cross-examined by MR. GREENFIELD. Gear's statement was not made in Home's presence.

THOMAS WILLIAM LOOK . I am the London representative of Daintree and Smith, ironmongers, of Upper Thames Street—I have known Forman about two years in that name—I have seen him sign his name on several occasions—to the best of my belief the endorsement to this cheque is his signature, but I could not swear to it.

Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. I cannot say whether the endorsement "W. Forman," on the £10 10s. cheque, and the endorsement "Ford" on the £3 cheque are in the same writing—I told Forman that the detectives wanted him—he said he did not care about the detectives—I said, "If you doubt my word, the detective left his card at my house; you had better take the card—he said, "Very well; I will go up and see the in detective"—he offered his address, but I did not take it.

Re-examined. He has paid up to the last account—I cannot say whether he has paid any of these—I never knew him as Ford.

By Westoby. I know that no settlement with Forman has taken place.

HENRY POET . I am a timber dealer, of 53, Richardson Street, Long Lane, Bermondsey—I have known Price eight or nine years—I went with him to Sergeant's office about a reference, and when I came downstairs he said he had got a party not far off, at a public-house, who wanted a cheque changed; could I get it done—I told him I could not get it done myself, as I had not been in the habit; my wife had always got the cheques done; I would see if I could get it done—afterwards he said he did want some money—I went with him to a public-house near Finsbury Circus, where I saw Home, who was a stranger to me—Price said Home was a friend of his, and he had got a cheque he wanted cashed, and could I get it done—I said I would go and ask my wife if she could cash it—Home asked me to go, and we went over London Bridge by omnibus, and I took the cheque they gave me to my wife—it was drawn by Weeks, in Home's favour, for £15 10s. on a bank in Oxford Street—I came back to the prisoners, who were standing in the Borough; and told them my wife would have nothing to do with it, as it was a strange cheque; and I gave it to Price, who gave it to Home—Home said Weeks was a haberdasher in Holborn—I said my wife would have nothing to do with it, as it was not made payable to me, and was not a trading cheque—afterwards he asked if I could get a smaller cheque done, as he had got

some goods to clear, and ho was away from home—I said, "I don't know whether she will or not"—he asked me to come over into the City with him, and he would see if he could get another—I went with him to Leadenhall Market—he was absent about a quarter of an hour, and came back with Gear—he asked me my name, as he could get another cheque if I would do it—I gave him my name—he was away for about ten minutes, and he came back with Gear, and they went away a little distance by themselves, leaving me with Price—they came back and said I was to come with them—we went as far as the Monument, and then they left me and Price and went about one hundred yards off, and looked as if they were going to draw this cheque up—then they came and asked me to go with them, and I went over London Bridge to my wife with this cheque which Home gave me, to ask if she would cash it—she would not have anything to do with it, and I came back and gave it to Home, and told him my wife would not have anything to do with it, as she did not know Weeks. (This cheque was drawn by Charles Weeks for £5 17s. 6d. on the London and County Bank, Oxford Street, in favour of Poet)—Home seemed very much put out, and asked me if Price could go, and I said no, Mr. Fogden did not know me, as my-wife had always got it done—on Saturday, 17th June, Price came to my house with a cheque about nine a.m., and told my wife it would be all right—Home said he was a haberdasher—he wanted this money to clear some goods—my wife said, "I don't know whether Mr. Fogden is come to town, but I will see. Sometimes I have had it done by the foreman, but I have not always had the money; he has given me part till Mr. Fogden is down"—Price went away, and when he came back my wife said, "You can have £3, and the rest when the cheque is passed through the bank," and she gave Price £3—I saw Home after that with Price, who gave Home 35s., I believe, out of the £3—I saw them about twelve or after that, and I did not see thorn again till I saw Home at the Police-station about a fortnight afterwards—I was not at home when Mr. Fogden afterwards called—I saw the cheque at the Police-court—I never saw Price, Home, or Gear after they got the £3.

Cross-examined by Price. I did not see you after the Saturday—I don't know how much the parcel of timber you sold me comes to, I cannot get to measure it; it is buried now with other timber, and cannot be got at—I believe by the way you kept back with me that you did not know the cheque was stolen when you handed it to me—if I had had the least idea it was stolen I should not have attempted to cash it—my wife afterwards got the balance of £2 17s. 6d.; she has paid part of it back—this letter is in Sergeant's writing I believe.

Cross-examined by MR. GREENFIELD. Price introduced Home to me—I had bought timber through Price, not from him—I was not anxious to pay Price—Sergeant had timber for sale—none of it has been paid for—I and Price were not desirous of raising money to pay for timber—Home mentioned something about a promissory note if I would get this cheque cashed—sometimes I want money to convert timber and get it into the market, and at this time I was a little short of money, and was anxious to get some—Home said before the cheque was cashed that if I would get the cheque done he could get me money out of a gentleman who had got plenty—Home wanted money to clear goods—the cheque for £15 10s.

had nothing to do with raising money for me—Price asked me to cash the cheque for Home, whom I had never seen before—I first saw Gear when I gave the first cheque up to Home, and he went to Leadenhall Market—£3 was paid to Price on the cheque, and I heard he gave 35s. to Home—it was not paid to get a bill discounted for me, but to get goods.

Re-examined. Mr. Fogden gave the £2 17s. 6d. as well as the £3 to my wife—when the cheque was discovered to be false, my wife repaid him £2, and she is going to pay it all back.

By Price. It was understood that the balance was to be left with my wife till the cheque was cleared and you called—an appointment was made for Liverpool Street Railway Station—you and I waited there for half-hour or so for Home, who did not arrive—after that I went into the country to look at some timber, but my wife was at home.

CHARLES LANGFORD (14 X). On Sunday, 19th June, about 6.30, I went to 15, Stafford Road, Kilburn—I saw, on the second floor, Westoby and Mrs. Forman having tea—I said, "Westoby, I am going to take you into custody; you answer the description of a man wanted for burglary"—he said, "Burglary!"—I said, "Yes; being concerned with a man named Forman"—he said, "I don't know him"—I said, "Alias Ford"—he said, "Oh, yes; this woman's husband"—I said, "Yes"—he said, "Anything else?"—I said, "No, not that I am aware of"—on coming down the staircase Westoby was behind me—he was taking something out of his pocket, and I turned and said, "Don't do that; put that back in your pocket"—I seized him by the arm and kept him like that all the way to the station—I found that what he was taking out were three cheques; one on the Charing Gross Bank has nothing to do with this matter—at the station I took the cheques out of his pocket and handed them to the inspector; the prisoner ran across the charge-room and said, "Those are mine"—the inspector said, "Wait a moment"—the cheques were open, not in an envelope.

Cross-examined by Mr. ROBINSON. I also found on Westoby three or four pawntickets, one relating to sixty-five gimlets and other property; nothing relating to this charge.

Cross-examined by Westoby. Another constable went with me and stood at the door—you had the cheques in your hand coming downstairs, and you had an umbrella, I think, in your left hand—I did not take possession of the cheques at once, because I did not know exactly what you did have—the other officer was downstairs in advance of me—there was only one flight of stairs.

ALFRED NICHOLLS (Police Sergeant E). On 19th June, about eleven, I arrested Westoby, who was detained at Kilburn Station—these two blank cheques were produced to me, and I said to Westoby, "What account can you give of these two cheques, as they form part proceeds of a burglary?"—he said, "I shall say nothing"—I told him he would be charged with Forman, already in custody, with being; concerned in breaking out of the Guildford Arms on 24th April, and stealing, among other articles, a cheque-book containing ninety blank cheques, of which these formed part proceeds—he did not say anything—after he was committed for trial he made this statement in my presence—Inspector Marshall took it down, and I saw the prisoner sign it: Cecil

Westoby: I am now awaiting trial for burglary and receiving, with four other men, and desire to say that my part in the matter was entirely brought about by the man Forman entrusting me to take charge of eight cheques, similar to these put in evidence, on the London and County Bank; stating that he had two banking accounts, one on the London and South-Western, which his wife was aware of, and the other, meaning the London and County, which he did not want his wife to know of, and if he carried them in his pocket she would find out; so I took them, and as he wanted, so he had them from me. I was never indebted to him, he being indebted to me for selling his interest in property at Cricklewood to a Mr. Willett, of Kilburn; as also for rent due from rooms occupied by me at 98, Cambridge Road With respect to the £10 cheque uttered to the ironmongers in Thames Street, Forman owed that firm money, and asked me for one of the cheques; it was then blank. On the following day I saw the same cheque in his possession filled in, and he then endorsed it in my presence at the Gray's Inn Tavern. With regard to the £3 10s. cheque, I never met him as stated, nor do I know anything of it, nor have I ever received one farthing in respect of same. Forman had five blank cheques from me out of the eight above-mentioned. I sold one of the cheques to Gear for 2s., and the other two were found on me. I don't know where Forman got the cheques from; he got me to take one of the cheques to a paperhanging warehouse in the King's Road, where he owed an account, but the governor was not in, and the shopman would not cash it, and I gave it back to Forman; it was about 90 or 99, King's Road, on the left from Westminster to Hammersmith, nearly opposite a square. I know nothing of the burglary nor the other cheques"—I was with Bannell when he took Price—at the station Price said he obtained the £5 17s. 6d. cheque from a man, and gave a description, owing to which I brought a man to Hunter Street Station—the description was of a man about 40 to 45, about 5 ft. 9 in., clean-shaven over the chin, with whiskers and moustache turning grey, who frequented Holborn, Gray's Inn Tavern, and also Leadenhall Market—Price said that the man I brought there was not the man—on 26th I was with Bannell, and saw Home in Elderfield Road, Clapton, about 1.15 p.m.—I said I was a police officer, and should take him into custody for being concerned with three other, men in committing burglary and uttering a cheque on the London and County Bank for £5 17s. 6d., which he had given to two men named Price and Poet, and which formed part proceeds of a burglary—at first he said he did not know the men, but on the way he said he knew a man named Price, and had introduced a man named Poet to him—he commenced to make a statement—I cautioned him—at the station I took down from him this statement, which he signed: "On Friday, 10th inst., I met a man I knew by the name of Price, in Kingsland Road, Hoxton. He said he had an appointment with a man named Poet, at Finsbury Pavement, and asked me to go with him to meet Poet. I went with him to 99, Moorgate Street, a public-house; he there met Poet. Price asked me to wait inside the house while they went to see Sergeant, a timber merchant. They returned in about ten minutes, and said they were unable to see Sergeant, but they had seen the clerk. Price then produced some letters, and said the references were satisfactory. Poet said he was rather short of cash, and I asked him if he would have a drink, which he did. Price

turned and said to me, 'This is an old friend of mine, he is a timber merchant; we have done hundreds together.' Price said, 'Can you raise me a little cash?' I said, 'In what way?' He said, 'Either by bill or promissory note.' I wrote to a gentleman I know, and gave him an appointment at Liverpool Street Railway Station; the appointment was not kept. He said, 'Can you raise me some cash to-day?' I said I would go to a gentleman named Gear, and they might oblige you with a post-dated cheque till Monday. Poet said, 'Don't get it post-dated, make it Dayable to me; I will then, if you will come with me and Mr. Price, take it to my wife, and get her to get it cashed at the grocer's. We then went to Leadenhall Market, where we met Gear, and explained to him that Poet was a timber merchant and wanted temporary assistance. Gear said, 'I will do it for a consideration'; that was that Poet would get the cheque cashed and give me an amount out of it, which I believe was £1, and Price was to receive £1 5s. Gear went away and returned with a cheque on the London and County Bank, Oxford Street, for £5 17s. 6d., which he handed to Price, and Price to Poet, and Price borrowed a half-crown from me and gave it to Gear. Poet said, 'Come with me and Price over to my house,' and I went with them; I waited in a public-house with Price near London Bridge. Poet left us for about an hour and a half; returned and stated that he was very sorry, but he could not induce his wife to change the cheque; would we allow it to stand over till the morning, which we did. I went home. I met Price next morning at Broad Street Station by appointment; we then went to the public-house where we had been the day previous, and he left me to go to Poet's house; Price took the cheque with him, he having had possession of it all night; he was gone about an hour; when he came back he was with Poet. Price said, 'Me and Poet have induced his wife to get the cheque cashed at the grocer's, but I have only received £3 on account; I have left £2 17s. 6d. owing on the cheque for Poet's wife to receive at twelve o'clock. Poet said, 'I am going to hold it to see if the cheque it all right. 'Price had the £3 in his hand; he gave Poet £110s. and me 10s. We then separated, and I have not seen Poet since. I have seen Price; he came to my house on 22nd at 10.30, and said a detective had been to see him with reference to the cheque, as it was the part proceeds of a burglary. I said I would go to Leadenhall Market and ask Gear for an explanation. He said, 'Don't do that; I have got to meet the detective at two o'clock. He left me to go there, and I have not seen him since. I know nothing about a cheque for £15. "Home made this subsequent statement, which I saw him sign, after it had been read over to him: "I desire to state that the man Forman now on bail had an account at the Peckham and Clapham Branch of the London and South-Western. Bank, where you may be able to obtain information with regard to other matters than those with which he is charged. With regard to the cheques stolen from the Guildford Arms public-house, Guildford Street, I wish to state that Forman went to Walk's and Co., drapers, Holborn Circus, and bought a length of black dress silk, and in payment tendered one of the cheques, but I cannot say if it was cashed; it would be about six weeks ago. About the same date he went to Lewis, silk merchant, in Holborn, and did likewise; to Peter Robinson's about the same time, and did the same; cannot say whether it was the Oxford or Regent Street branch. He bought a white felt hat at Heath's in Holborn, and may have given

a cheque. He also purchased a brown topcoat for about £6, of the West-end or West London Clothing Company, and had a row over one of the cheques." (The statement then went into details as to other crimes and other criminals)—Home said nothing when making that statement about telling me merely what he had heard from Westoby—he made the statement voluntarily; he applied for me to visit him.

Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. Inquiries were made by Bannell as to the statement; he made a report to me.

Cross-examined by Greenwood. Home denied being connected with the burglary, and having knowledge that the cheques were forged.

Cross-examined by Price. Sergeant was at the Police-court—he was not going into the box when the Magistrate adjourned for luncheon.

BALL. I have been six years in Mr. Jackson's employment at the Guildford Arms—when I came down on this Sunday morning I found the bar had been taken down from the door inside; people could then walk out—the bar was in confusion, but I did not go to see—I immediately informed the governor, who came down.

Cross-examined by Westoby. I am not sure one of the young ladies was not down first.

WILLIAM BANNELL (Re-examined by MR. ROBINSON). I made inquiries as to the truth of Home's statements—I found Forman did have an account at the Peckham branch of the London and South-Western Bank about May, 1891; a cheque-book was then issued to him, and he had a balance of 5s. 1d. now; they informed me that during the last six months several cheques from Forman's book have been issued for larger amounts than his balance—Wallis and Co., Lewis, and Peter Robinson knew nothing about any cheques being tendered there—at Heath's, hatters, in Oxford Street, I was handed a cheque that was presented there with a letter for a white hat and umbrella; the cheque for £3 13s. was endorsed Cutler, but it was out of Forman's book, and it was taken into the shop by a man answering the description of Forman—at the West-end Clothing Company, 80, Strand, I was told that a man answering Forman's description had brought a cheque and letter for a brown overcoat, worth £6; the cheque was one of the stolen ones, for £5—the letter purported to come from Cutler—the man took the coat, and left £1 owing—nothing is known of Forman at the paperhanging shop in King's Road—I had a witness from Heath's, but the Strand people failed to identify Forman.

The prisoners' statements before the Magistrate. Forman says: "I know nothing about the cheque for £10 10s., nor the letter; the cheque for £3 was handed to me by the prisoner Westoby. "Horne says: "I should like to say I have never at any time received a cheque from Westoby; I have only seen him occasionally, and know nothing about him."

Witnesses for Forman.

JAMES KENNEDY . I am an estate agent, of West Ham—I lived in the same house as Forman, 98, Cambridge Road—Mr. Westoby was the landlord—Forman had the use of two rooms on the second storey, and the use of the shop and the back parlour as lumber-rooms—I have seen Forman write—one of the endorsements to these cheques is a very fair imitation of his writing, if it is not exact—this is the one—it is not like his writing which he gave me a receipt for, but it is similar; I speak as to the "S" and the "W"—I cannot speak as to the writing of the letter—I received

this letter (produced), in consequence of which I went to Holloway Gaol and saw Westoby—tasked him if he had given Forman the £3 cheque, he said yes—I will not be positive whether he said anything about the three-guinea cheque—I have seen Westoby's writing several times; I have had several letters from him, and. think this is a very fair specimen of his writing, but he was not so well supplied with materials as he would be outside—these two cheques resemble his writing they are all alike; I do not profess to be an expert, but they most of them resemble each other; they are all written by one man, I think—I have known Forman as near twelve months as possible, and never knew anything against his character.

Cross-examined by Mr. HUMPHREYS. Bloom's letters were signed "C. Westoby"; they kept each other's company—this is like Westoby's signature—I think whoever wrote this wrote this on the back of the cheque—I know that Forman received parcels from Daintree and Smith, of Upper Thames Street; I think this is his signature—I cannot show you any difference between these two cheques—when I saw "Westoby in prison he said he gave this cheque for £3, which is admitted to be Forman's writing—I asked him-about the £10 cheque; he said he knew all about it, but had not time to talk about it.

Cross-examined by Westoby. I left Cambridge Road some time in December or before that; I am not positive—after that Forman came there to live; I brought him—I took you to Cricklewood about some houses which were to be disposed of, and introduced you to Mr. Willett, who purchased the equity—Forman was living at my place—the date of the letter I have produced is July 12th—I went and saw you before that letter, because you wrote and ordered some collars—you have said many times that Forman was indebted to you—I did not claim any commission—I was the means of the introduction—you made a complaint to me; you said he owed you money—you told me you gave him the £2 cheque to get cashed, and paid him something for it—you did not say that you received any benefit for it—when I went to see you I sent you a day's meal, and promised to see you again—I have never seen you again—you wrote me two letters, to which I did not reply—I have seen Forman two days this week.

FLORENCE FORD . The prisoner Forman is my father; I lived with him in Cambridge Road, at the very top—he put some things in the other rooms—I went downstairs one morning to get a pail of water, and saw Mr. Westoby there; he took some papers and put them in a black bag, and I went up and told my mother.

Cross-examined by Westoby. I have not been told to say that my father made use of those rooms—I do not know that you also had things there, little cases of drawers and paints—you only used the shop.

Forman received a good character.

Westoby, in his defence, stated that Forman was introduced to him two or three months ago, and having got into difficulties he allowed him to come and reside at his house out of kindness, but afterwards tried to get rid of him, as he got in debt to him, but could not do so; that he knew nothing about giving him a cheque for £3, nor did he participate in it; that he never tried to negotiate the two cheques found on him; 4 at Mr. Kennedy was indebted to him many pounds for rent; that he wrote to him, and

Kennedy came to see him, but when Forman came he heard no more of Kennedy; that there was none of his writing on the £3 cheque, and he knew nothing about it, and had not participated in it one halfpenny; that he sold a cheque to Gear for 2s., who was the only man he recognised. Price, in his defence, stated that on June 10th he sold a consignment to Mr. Poet on behalf of Mr. Sergeant, by whom he was employed, and told Poet he should want some cash to go on with that he said he had none, and the prisoner Hall asked him to cash a crossed cheque; that Poet and he met Home, and went to Leadenhall Market, and Home introduced Poet to Gear, and at Poet's request the cheque for £5 17s. 6d. was to be made payable to him, and he, Price, was to call on him the following morning with the cheque, which he would cash, and retain his portion, and the rest was to be divided between Home, Poet, and himself, and the cash was to be paid to Poet after deducting the amount of the discount charged; and next morning Home handed him the cheque, and Poet's wife came to the grocer's, but only got £3; that they agreed that Poet and Price should meet Home at the railway station, where they waited till seven o'clock, and Home did not come, for which he apologised the next day, and said he was going into the country for two or three days, and on his return would discount the bill, and that he saw nothing of Poet till they met at the Police-court; that Gear declared that he obtained that identical cheque from Westoby, which Westoby had just admitted; that Forman, Westoby, and Gear were perfect strangers to him, but having known Home some time, and his relations being in a good social position, he thought the cheque was all right. GUILTY .

WESTOBY** HORNE** and GEAR* then PLEADED GUILTY to previous convictions, Westoby at this COURT on 23rd June, 1884, in the name of Henry Wells; Home on January 8, 1883, and Gear on March 1, 1880, of obtaining goods and money by false pretences— Five Years' each in Penal Servitude. FORMAN and PRICE, Ten Months' Hard Labour each.

NEW COURT.—Saturday, July 30th; and

OLD COURT.—Tuesday, August 2nd, 1892.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-739
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour; Miscellaneous > fine; Imprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

739. JOHN MACHATTIE (39), LAMBERT BARRON (26), ANDREW WHITE (46), and WILLIAM CATTO (46) , Unlawfully conspiring together, and with Alexander Stephen, and David Glass (not in custody), and other persons unknown, to obtain money by false pretences from divers insurers and incorporated insurance companies, with intent to defraud. Other Counts, varying the form of charge, and charging them with obtaining money by false pretences.

THE SOLICITOR-GENERAL (Sir Edward Clarke, Q.C.), MR. C.F. GILL, and MR. T. E. SCRUTTON Prosecuted; MR. H. SHEE, Q.C., and MR. GEOGHEGAN Defended Machattie; MR. ASQUITH, Q.C., and MR. HORACE AVORY Defended Barron; MR. LYNN Defended White; and MR. A. E. DARKER and MR. F. W. SHERWOOD Defended Catto.

MR. SHEE, before the prisoners pleaded, moved to quash the sixteenth and seventeenth Counts, referring to a shipment in the 88. Warwick, as no reference to it was made in the depositions, and no leave had been granted by the COURT to add such Counts to the indictment. THE SOLICITOR-GENERAL raised no objection, and the COURT ordered the Counts to be struck out.

EYRE IEVERS . I am a doctor, of Tunbridge—I attended Harold Augustus Sylvester, a medical man, at Tunbridge in his last illness; he died on 10th July.

FREDERICK HALL . I am a partner in the firm of Gardener and Co., insurance brokers, of 10, Austinfriars—on 23rd February, 1888, I effected an insurance on four horses for £665, for John Machattie, of Aberdeen—those horses were shipped from Hull to Boston by the Wilson liner Persian Monarch; the horses were consigned to Chicago—in consequence of a communication made to me in respect of two of those horses, I claimed for £415; that was settled on 19th April, 1888, and I paid John Machattie £415—I have here the policy of insurance and the bill of lading; the latter is endorsed "John Machattie."

ALBERT EDWARD HARRISON . I am managing clerk at the New York and Boston Outward Desk at Messrs. Thomas Wilson and Sons, of Hull—one of their steamers, the Persian Monarch, sailed on 5th March, 1888, from Hull to Boston—among other horses on board were six entire horses and two mares; the freight on the horses was paid in Hull by John Machattie—four horses out of the six died on the voyage.

FREDERICK HALL (Re-examined). On 27th April, 1888, I effected an insurance for John Machattie, of Aberdeen, on three horses from Glasgow to Montreal for £400, by the Donaldson liner Concordia—I afterwards, in consequence of instructions, claimed for the death of all three horses—the claim was paid on 30th July, 1888, and I paid the full amount to John Machattie, less £4 commission—I produce the two policies of insurance.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. The gentleman I chiefly transacted the business with was not Mr. Graham but Machattie.

NORMAN MCLEOD . I am a member of the firm of Donaldson Brothers, of St. Vincent Street, Glasgow—we have a line running to the States and Canada—in our vessel, the Concordia, in April, 1888, I shipped three horses, consigned by Mr. Mitchell to himself—they all died.

ALBERT EDWARD HARRISON (Re-examined). On 11th May, 1891, I received these communications from John and Adam Machattie with reference to shipping stallions to New York, and as the result I find that in the ss. Francisco, sailing from Hull on 29th May, the stallion and four ponies were shipped, consigned by John Kinney to James Carrol—the stallion died at sea—some time afterwards I forwarded a certificate of the death to Machattie—on the same vessel there were two stallions and four ponies, consigned by and to John Kinney; of that lot two stallions died—on the same vessel were also eight ponies consigned by A. Machattie to James Carrol—the freight for all the three lots was paid at the same time; it was one shipment—two grooms had passages given. them in the vessel.

Cross-examined by Mr. SHEE. Three stallions died on board—Kinney did not pay the freight—he went by the vessel in the saloon—we generally give the man who pays the freight a reduced passage; I think Machattie paid all charges—I said before, "Freight and charges amounting to £67 were paid at the time of shipment; I cannot say by whom"—"Kinney, as owner, had a saloon passage at half fare."

Re-examined. £67 was paid at the time of shipment for all the shipments.

JAMES ORAM . I am a junior partner to W. Leslie and Co., steamship

owners and ship and insurance brokers, Marischal Street, Aberdeen—on 19th May, 1891, I effected an insurance, through Galbraith, Pembroke and Co., of London, on one stallion and four ponies, which were to be shipped to New York by the Francisco—the stallion was insured for £210, and the four ponies for £10 each, making £250 in all—a claim for £210 was made with reference to the death of the stallion on the voyage—it was paid on 9th September by a cheque for £207 18s., paid to Mr. Graham—some commission was due—John Kinney, of Philadelphia, was the name mentioned to us as the person for whom the insurance was effected, but Graham was the person we saw in the transaction.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. Graham told us when he effected the insurance that he was effecting it for Kinney.

HERBERT WATSON . I am a clerk to Galbraith, Pembroke and Co., ship and insurance brokers, of 8, Austinfriars—in May, 1891, we effected for Mr. Oram this insurance on a stallion, valued at £210, and four ponies, for £250—the premium was fifteen guineas per cent.—the horses were to go by the Francisco from Hull to New York—I learned that the stallion died on the voyage—a claim was made for £210, the sum assured, and we paid it to Leslie and Co.—I produced the original policy and bill of lading.

JAMES CRUIKSHANKS . I am employed on the steamers as cattle collector and checker—we shipped some stallions on the Countess of Aberdeen—I saw John Machattie, Barron, and Kinney there when they came on board.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I have been three years in my present employment—the owner of a horse generally delivers it at the ship—the man who has been selling a horse does not always go to the ship and deliver it up—the owner or consignor generally goes or sends a responsible party with them—I have no experience of long voyages, but I have of short—in rough weather at times a high percentage of horses die.

Re-examined. I know Machattie and Barron quite well by sight.

JOHN GRAHAM . I am a partner in Grant and Co., Regent Quay, Aberdeen, corn and commission agents—I have known Machattie for some years as a customer—I also knew Alexander Stephen, a horse dealer, who had a place at Aberdeen, as a customer—Machattie had a horse bazaar in George Street—I knew Barron by sight—he was in a lawyer's office at one time—I don't know what he has been doing since—in May, 1891, I was spoken to by Mr. Kinney with reference to insuring a stallion and four ponies that were to go by the Francisco and in consequence I spoke to Leslie and Co., and effected an assurance, and paid the premium by my cheque on 15th June, 1891—I afterwards learnt that the stallion had died on the voyage and I was paid the amount of the assurance, less commission, £207 18s.—on 22nd September, 1891, I paid to John Machattie £123 of that amount, and I detained the balance of £80 odd in respect of insurances that I was effecting in reference to horses that were to go by the Concordia—this cheque is drawn in favour of Machattie, and is endorsed by him; he filled in the body of it himself.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I had Kinney's instructions to pay this money to Machattie.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I have lived twenty years in Aberdeen

—I know Barron perfectly well by sight—I have known him for ten years—he is the son of an advocate in Aberdeen, and, I have been told, a person of independent means—the Machatties keep a horse bazaar, a place frequented by persons interested in horses, I should say—I have seen Barron there from time to time—I never had any business transactions with him—I never saw him in relation to the shipment by the Francisco—he has kept horses, and I believe from time to time he has done a little amateur riding in races, and so on.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I do not know Catto.

Re-examined. I believe that Barron's father is dead—it might be two or three years ago that Barron was in a lawyer's office—I am not aware what he has been doing for the last two or three years.

ALEXANDER MACKIE . I am an insurance clerk, living at South Mount Street, Aberdeen—I have known John Machattie for some years—in June, 1891, he asked me to effect an insurance for him on two stallions; he was going to send them to the States—I got them insured through Galbraith, Pembroke and Co. for £250—Machattie wished £400—I received the premium, £49 18s. 3d.—I afterwards received this policy from London, and the bill of lading and the captain's certificate of the death of the horse I received from John Machattie—it appears from the bill of lading that the consignor was Thomas Rooney—Machattie said, as my memory serves me, that Rooney was a farmer, and had been justice of the peace, and was a most respectable man in Chicago—I made a claim on the insurers, and received £240 7s. 10d., less commission; I paid it to Machattie on 6th October, 1891.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. Machattie may have said he was only acting as agent for Rooney, who was purchaser and consignor—I cannot remember—if I said at the Mansion House, "I asked who Rooney was; John Machattie said, 'I am only the agent; Thomas Rooney was the purchaser and the consignor,' "that is the case—he went on to say that the horses had gone out in charge of a competent man.

HERBERT WATSON (Re-examined). I effected the insurance which Mr. Mackie has spoken of with Lloyds' underwriters—this is the policy—in consequence of instructions I made a claim for the death of the horse, and settled it, and sent the money to Mackie.

JAMES CRUIKSHANKS (Re-examined). On 4th August, 1891, two stallions were brought down to the Countess of Aberdeen for shipment to Hull by John Machattie's servants—they were consigned by A. and J. Machattie to Richardson and Nettleton's stables, Hull—Adam Machattie made arrangements for shipping them—John Machattie paid the freight when they were shipped—John Machattie and Barron were there before the Countess of Aberdeen sailed—forty ponies did not go at the time the two stallions went.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. Adam Machattie did not pay the freight, he called at my office; I never said he paid me; he never paid me money at that time.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. So far as I Was concerned, Barron had no other part in the matter than just to come and see the horses off.

ALBERT EDWARD HARRISON (Re-examined). On 7th August, 1891, I shipped on the Buffalo, from Hull to New York, forty ponies consigned by John Machattie to Adam Machattie, and two stallions consigned by Thomas Rooney to himself—John Machattie paid the freight

on ponies and stallions—Adam Machattie and Barron were on that vessel as passengers—these are the bills of lading.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. So far as I know, Machattie was interested in both horses and ponies.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I think there were no more horses on the Buffalo than those I have mentioned on that voyage—I think the ponies arrived safely at their destination.

LLOYD FAIRFAX FRANCKLYN . I am a traveller in the corn trade, and I live at King's Lynn—I was a passenger to Boston by the Wilson liner Buffalo, in August, 1891—two stallions and forty ponies were on board, in charge of Barron and Adam Machattie—I have had several horses of my own—I saw the animals every morning—an old man who had been picked up in Hull, so Barron told me, was in charge of them, under Barron—when the horses came on board they looked all right—I first saw anything the matter with them about teatime on 13th August, when a man came in, and in consequence of what he said I went and looked at one of the horses—it was very ill—it was sweating and drawn up in agony—it died before eight that night—Barron and Machattie were there during the illness, and when it died—I thought the horse had colic, and I suggested a colic drench if they could get one—Barron told me to mind my own business; that was on Tuesday, and on Sunday I went and saw Barron, Adam Machattie, and the groom; the other stallion was out of its box—the horse was in agony, and it jumped out of the box and stood very nearly on its head, and then fell on to some hay and laid there—during the night the horse died—the muscles were contracted, the nostrils were distended, the eyes dilated—the stomach and back were both drawn up; it was in a complete sweat—I suggested it was colic; I was told to mind my own business by either Barron or Machattie, I won't be positive which—I had seen nothing in the horses to account for their sudden death—the weather had been very good indeed—I have seen other horses on board ship—there was nothing in their symptoms similar to the symptoms I saw in these horses.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. We sailed on the morning of the 8th—we had dirty weather up to the Lizard—these stallions were worth, in my opinion, about 150 to 175 guineas—either two or three of the ponies were ill, but one was so bad that I made up my mind it was going to die—they had a veterinary surgeon to it at Boston, and it recovered—either Barron or Machattie, I suppose, went for the veterinary; somebody fetched him—it was Adam Machattie, not the prisoner—I thought this was colic at the time—I have had a horse die from colic—I have travelled a good deal—I lived in Austria for five years—I have been twice to America—I have not been at sea with horses for more than a couple of days.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I have not had a horse die at sea, nor seen a horse with colic at sea—I am sure it was Barron who said as to the first horse that I should mind my own business—I would not swear now which it was, I am not certain; I think it was Barron, but I won't swear positively—I cannot say which of them told me to mind my own business when the second horse was ill; I think it was Machattie—I won't swear if Machattie said it both times—it may have been Adam Machattie—an old man of sixty-two or sixty-three, a groom, was actually in charge of the horses during: the voyage—he fed the horses—Barron, Machattie

and the groom fed the forty ponies—they told me they had found this man in Hull, and employed him for the purpose of the voyage—I formed a judgment that the deaths were due to colic—I had no suspicion of any kind of foul play—it first occurred to me that these horses had died otherwise than of colic when I saw this case in the newspaper a few weeks ago—from August till I read the newspaper reports it never entered my head that there was anything wrong' in connection with the hordes' deaths, or that they were due to other than natural causes.

Re-examined. The pony's illness was nothing like the illness that affected the horses—I think it was inflammation of the throat—no pony died—I have seen a horse die in colic—I formed the impression when I saw him first that colic was the matter with this horse—after its death it was very stiff, rigid—those indications did not correspond with what I have seen in the case of the horse dying from colic; he did not stiffen so quickly—I have seen a horse die from strychnine in Austria, where, for the purpose of killing wolves, they give strychnine to an old worthless horse, kill it with a knife, and cut it up, so that the blood shall be impregnated with strychnine and poison wolves—the ultimate destination of the strychnine is the wolves.

FREDERICK HALL (Re-examined). In September I received this letter from Mr. Graham, and as the result of that and further correspondence, I effected an insurance on two stallions for £400—there was also an insurance on twelve ponies—Graham was the name given me as consignor, and Lambert Barron was consignee of the two horses—I received the premiums on the policies, amounting to £83, on 13th September, 1891, from Graham, who was the person I knew throughout the transaction—I had not the slightest knowledge that Machattie was the person insuring—a long time afterwards I heard of the loss of the stallions and six pomes, that was 26th November, as far as I can make out; I ought to have heard some time previously, within three weeks—I received these certificates of the deaths. (One of these certified that the two horses had died at sea on 14th and 17th September, and that their car cases had been thrown into the sea, and the other certified to the same effect with regard to the ponies)—I applied to the underwriters for payment; there was considerable delay, but eventually I received a cheque for £460, being £400 for the horses and £10 each for the ponies; I deducted commission, and gave Mr. Graham a cheque for £454.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. This is the bill of lading for the horses and ponies—Barron was only consignee of the horses—Rooney gave me his name—I only saw it from the bill of lading; it was immaterial to me who was consignee—I got the bill of lading from Graham when we had the loss to settle, in the form it is now—I did not know Barron in the matter—this bill of lading is not endorsed, although the goods are deliverable to Lambert Barron, Esq., or his or their assigns.

Re-examined. The bills of lading might have come by the next boat after the certificate of death.

NORMAN MCLEOD (Re-examined). On 12th September, 1891, we shipped in the Concordia from Glasgow to Montreal two horses and twelve ponies, in the name of John Graham—the horses were consigned to Lambert Barron, and the ponies to David Glass—the two horses died on the passage, and five ponies were entered in the log-book as having died, but six were paid for, and particulars were given in the certificate of

death of six ponies, I understand—I shipped in the same vessel seventy ponies for A. Stephen, consigned to A. Stephen and David Glass—David Glass, A. Stephen, and Farquharson wore passengers, the three names being on one ticket—the freight for these three consignments was paid by Stephen, and by Stephen's cheque for £105 10s.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. Barron, the consignee named in the bill of lading, did not pay the freight—I had nothing to do with him in the matter—if goods are shipped in this way under a bill of lading to a named consignee, we should make delivery without the bill of lading being endorsed, or anything to prove identity, unless we have reason to think there is fraud.

JOHN GRAHAM (Re-examined). In the autumn of 1891 I had conversation with Machattie with reference to two stallions and twelve ponies he wanted insured; I understood the stallions were his own—in consequence I communicated with Gardiner's representative at Machattie's instigation—I knew Barron—as far as I recollect, Machattie said that Barron was out at Philadelphia at the time—I wrote and proposed sending the stallions to a friend of mine, because Machattie said it would save any trouble about the identity of the horses, and I did not consider it out of the usual course to do so—as the result of my correspondence with Gardiner, insurance was effected on the stallions for £400, and on the ponies for £10 each—I paid the £120—I think I saw on the certificate of death the names of Barron and Glass mentioned—I was told that Glass was supposed to be a sort of veterinary surgeon living in our town—I did not know that Stephen was a consignor by this vessel—I knew nothing about his shipping and paying the freight for this lot—I claimed the insurance and got £460, which I paid to Machattie, less my outlays (I charged no commission) by this cheque for £450—I made him sign a receipt on the face of Gardener's credit note.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. All my instructions in the matter I got from Machattie; and so far as I know he told me that Barron was in Philadelphia at the time.

The SOLICITOR-GENERAL proposed next to give evidence with regard to the shipment on the Warwick. MR. SHEE and MR. ASQUITH objected that the Counts relating to this charge having been withdrawn, the evidence should not as a matter of fairness and of judicial discretion be admitted as it was evidence of a specific shipment in support of the first General Count of the Indictment. The Court admitted the evidence.

JAMES HENRY . I am an hotel-keeper in Aberdeen—during the summer of 1891 I was part owner of the stallion Blyth Beaconsfield, Mr. Allen being the other owner; we had each given £30 for it—the horse was used for stud purposes, and in September, 1891, I bought up the other half, and in the same month I authorised John Machattie to sell the horse for me; he told me he had a commission from a gentleman in America to send two horses there—he asked me if I would send it there, and he would go halves with me, and afterwards I had about £100—he paid me about £120 in advance as security—we had some other transactions—I had about £100 in all—I owed Machattie about £100—I have no note of that amount—it was made up with other horse transactions, two horses and other things I had from Machattie—the signatures on these pages are mine—Machattie paid me the £120 about the beginning of October—I cannot remember if I gave a receipt for it—I

entered it somewhere, I have not got my book—we arranged to send the horse, and I bought another horse; we had a commission for two horses—I bought the other man's share in the horse for £30; so that I had given £60 for it and had had a season out of it—I had it standing in Aberdeen for two months, and authorised Machattie to soil him; he did not do so at the time, and then I arranged I would let him have it and send it to America for the £100, and £120 he paid me in advance, making £220—it amounted to my selling the horse for £220—I have not received the money yet; I insured the horse in my own name—I received £120 in money on or about 7th October—I gave an account of the matter to Mr. Mc Math, a detective of Aberdeen; he took it down and I signed it; I did not read it all over; it is not correct—I have seen it since in London at Wetherfield, Son, and Baines, John Machattie's solicitors—I went there on Tuesday, only once—I was shown it there—I went there; no one asked me to go—I had the address from an Aberdeen friend—I have been to Machattie's place since I gave this statement—the friend who told me the address was Mr. Wilson, the witness—I saw him in the Court—I heard the address before, but I asked him the address here—I went to Mr. Scott, in Aberdeen, a solicitor, to take his advice, to see how I did in the matter, and I got his advice to come to Wetherfield and Baines if I wanted advice—I was not afraid of getting into trouble—I thought I had better have some one here I could consult—in September, 1891, I owed Machattie £19 on another horse-dealing transaction, £3 for stabling, and £1 14s. for some horse rugs—he was to give me £55 in addition to the £23 14s. I was due to him—I have not yet been paid the £55; I told Mc Math that; it was true—I did not "give Machattie a receipt for £150 as the price of the horse, because he asked me to do so—I did not say I did—I did not read over the statement when I signed it; it was not read over to me—I never gave Machattie a receipt, and he never asked me to do so—I swear I never said I did—Machattie did not say anything about insuring the horse at the time he bought it—he told me to get an insurance on the horse—"at the time that Machattie bought the horse he bargained with me that I was to insure the horse in my own name for £250," that is true, he told me I could—I have not received any money up to now; I bought the horse for myself—"I bought the horse for Machattie for £150; I paid the money to Crawford, and got a receipt for the money, which I think I gave to John Machattie"—I gave it to Machattie to send along with the horses to show the price they were bought at on this side, I understood—I did not give Machattie a receipt for £150 as the price of the horse because he asked me to do so—the receipt I got from Crawford I gave to Machattie to send with the horses to snow the price—I did not get the money from Crawford—I have not been paid anything yet—I insured both horses for £390—Machattie showed me the letter from Joseph Carrol in America—I know Carrol—they were consigned to Montreal—I employed a person to look after them—I heard about the end of October by this telegram that the horses had died on the 24th October from the captain of the Warwick—the telegram was addressed to the care of Machattie—I instructed Graham to pay the insurance money to Machattie—both horses did not really belong to Machattie—it had not been arranged that in the event of the death of any of them he was to get the insurance-money; I never said that—I did not read the statement before I signed it—I did not get the insurance

money; Machattie has got it now, but I called for it two or three times.

JOHN GRAHAM (Re-examined). In October, 1891, I received from Mr. Henry instructions to effect an insurance on two horses by the Warwick, from Glasgow to the States for £390, £250 on one and £140 on the other—I received instructions to claim for the loss about the end of December, I think, from Mr. Henry, who brought me the documents, which I sent to London—I had effected the insurance with Gardiner; there was a good deal of delay in paying, and I asked the reason, but they would not say definitely—they paid me £99; it was £100, less their commission—I got a letter to pay the money to Machattie, and when I received it I immediately handed it over by this cheque, with the policy, to Machattie—that left £290 still due on the policy.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I have often seen the horse at or near Aberdeen—I knew it before Henry bought it—I always understood it to be a very valuable animal—I did not know Henry had bought it—its owner, when I knew it, was Mr. Steward, a friend of mine, who has since died, and I saw the horse at his premises for years.

Re-examined. Steward died eighteen months or two years ago; I could not be certain—I saw the horse at the sale, or before the sale, after Steward's death; I don't know what it was bought for.

FREDERICK HALL (Re-examined). As the result of instructions from Graham, I effected an insurance for Henry on two stallions, valued at £250 and £140, by the Warwick—Graham paid the premium—I made a claim, by Graham's instructions, and in January the underwriters agreed to pass the loss at £100—the claim was made on January 16th; much later than it should have been, according to the ordinary course of business—I afterwards received this letter from Glasgow solicitors, Borland, King, and Shaw, claiming the balance; and the underwriter then settled the balance of the claim by a payment of £287 2s., I think, which I forwarded to the solicitors on behalf of Graham.

NORMAN MCLEOD (Re-examined). We shipped by the Warwick, on 10th October, 1891, two horses, consigned by Henry to James Mitchell, who was a passenger on the boat—the freight for the horses was in the name of Henry, and for Mitchell's ponies in Mitchell's name—it does not appear who paid the freight—I sent this telegram to Henry, care of Machattie—the log shows two deaths on 20th and 24th October.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. The horses were shipped by Henry; I don't know who insured them.

JOHN GRAHAM (Re-examined). About 4th November I received a visit from Alexander Stephen, with reference to the insurance of some horses to be consigned to the Cape—the Donald Currie line agents in Aberdeen are John Cook and Son; Stephen said he had an order for about twenty horses, and he did not care for it to go to the other dealers in the town, and would I do it direct with London—in the result I insured four horses for £2,000—I got the premium from him, and paid it to Donald Currie and Co—he told me the horses were American trotters; stallions, as far as I recollect—he said he was sending them to Mr. Charles White, of Cape Town—after they had been shipped, Machattie asked me once or twice whether the horses on the Hawarden Castle had arrived—I rather think Stephen, told me who was the man in charge of the horses; I would not be positive—he told

me he had not heard from the man—I happened to be in London at the end of January or beginning of February, and I was asked by Stephen to find out whether the horses had arrived, and I telegraphed to Donald Currie and heard that all the horses had died—I communicated that fact to Stephen—he told me to apply for the insurance-money, and gave me the certificates of death and bill of lading, and I sent them to Donald Currie in the usual way—Stephen called to ask whether the money had been paid—it was not, so far as I know—he proposed to take legal proceedings, and I saw him repeatedly previous to coming to London—eventually there was a point-blank refusal to pay the money, and after that Stephen disappeared—I have not seen him after my return to Aberdeen about 6th February—Machattie told me he had sold one and all of the four horses to Stephen.

JOSEPH ROBERT CHAPMAN . I am manager to Donald Currie and Co.—I received a communication from Graham in regard to these horses to be shipped by the Hawarden Castle, and we insured them for £2,000—boxes were prepared for them, and they left on the 17th December—later on I received another proposal of insurance from Mr. Graham—before that I had heard of the death of one of these horses on the Hawarden Castle—I delayed consideration of the proposal, and afterwards we received intelligence of the death of the other three—eventually we declined to effect the insurance, except under certificates from veterinary surgeons, and at a very high premium—I afterwards heard from a Lloyd's underwriter of an intended shipment by the Pretoria—I then gave some information to the Union line, and as a result of my communications with them Mr. Waddell was sent out in the Pretoria.

JAMES GILMORE DICKIE . I am a M. R. C. S., of 42, George Street, Aberdeen—I examined some horses for Mr. Stephen, and gave this certificate, which is correct (This certified that the four horses were in good health).

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I know Machattie's horse bazaar—he is in a good way of business; I should fancy he is among the largest in the town.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I think Catto did a little dealing at one time in a very small way—he does odd jobs—I believe he has been taking charge of horses going abroad.

DAVID GIBB . I am a parcel agent for the Caledonian Railway, Aberdeen—on 14th December, 1891, I delivered four horses to John Machattie, and they went by the afternoon train, and John Machattie went by the train to London and paid for the horses—they had been ordered by Adam Machattie.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. Machattie sends, I should say, 700 horses a year, going and coming, by our line alone—there are three railways altogether—he gets a cheap ticket according to his traffic, a trader's ticket—the carriage was £18—there was nothing unusual in he or his men going to the train to see it properly loaded.

Re-examined. He travels a great deal by our railway—I do not know whether he sends horses by the other railways.

JOHN KING . I am coachman to Robertson and Fox, of 79, Commercial Road—I saw Barron and Machattie about putting up horses for the night—Machattie said that the horses were going on board ship next day—I saw them in the stable, and next morning four men came for

them—I recognise Machattie and Barron—they paid 22s.—the place where the horses were put was in good condition, and well drained—two other horses were there which I have got there now—there was no trouble of pink eye in the stable—nothing happened to any of the other horses.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I never had a horse of my own, but I have kept stables many years.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. Machattie paid £1 2s.; I did not speak to Barron.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I have come from Limehouse—I have not been in Holloway Gaol lately.

HENRY KELSEY . I am in the employ of a butcher in the Commercial Road—I took one horse from Rochester's stable—a boy who has gone to sea went with me, and one of the grooms, and the prisoners Machattie and Barron.

ROBERT GREEN . I am a baker, and live in Aberdeenshire—I know Catto; he lived in George Street, opposite Machattie—I saw Machattie, Catto, and Barron put four horses on board—a few days before we got to Madeira one of the horses died, and Machattie said that it had died of pink eye, contracted in the stable in London; and he was afraid all the others would go the same way, and they all died—they seemed to suffer a good deal before they died; they kicked and vomited—they smelt a good deal after death—we had good weather on the passage—I told Catto in a joking way that the horses were poisoned; I thought they had had an extra dose—I would not have given £130 for the four horses, but Catto said they were worth some thousands—he did not tell me that they were insured—it was said that they belonged to Stephen and Machattie, and came from Machattie's stable—I went ashore at Madeira, and Machattie went into the telegraph office to wire to Stephen that one of them had died, but I do not know who he did wire to—he said if any officers or passengers asked anything I was to say that a gentleman and a white servant came down to take charge of them—he said on board the ship that he thought the horses had been poisoned—I knew Charles White when he was a young lad—Catto said he was going to telegraph to White that his father might make some inquiry—Catto only stayed a week ashore at Cape Town, and came back.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I continued on friendly terms with Catto—he understood perfectly well that I was chaffing—no one went ashore with me at the Cape in the small boat, but I met a passenger named Barclay ashore; he got rather tipsy, and I lost him—we wanted to get rid of him because he was rather a nuisance—I said that I had to leave him that I might meet the grooms who came down for the horses—I went to the Cape for a change; I do not know much about the price of horses; I have had one or two.

Re-examined. I did not take Mr. Barclay ashore with me; he came afterwards—Catto suggested the story about a white man and two black men coming down to meet the horses, but, as a matter of fact, nobody came to meet them.

CHARLES WHITE . I am a railway storekeeper—I went to Cape Colony about three years ago—I used to live at Aberdeen, and knew John Machattie there very well, and Catto also—I did not know that four horses were consigned to me in 1891 by the Hawarden Castle, and had

not made arrangements for them—I afterwards saw by the papers that Catto had been taken in custody, and communicated with the Union Company's agent at Kimberley.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. Catto was a small cattle doctor some years ago.

ALEXANDER SPENCER MACDONALD . I am a merchant and insurance agent at Aberdeen—up to last December I did not know any of the parties in this case—I communicated with London, and afterwards with Mr. Stephen, who proposed to send three horses by the Scandinavian—he valued them at £750—I ultimately arranged for an insurance of £500, and arranged with Messrs. Allen, of Glasgow—Mr. Stephen gave me the freight, and I received these policies of insurance (produced) from Messrs. Barker—Stephen told me that White was going out with the horses by the Scandinavian—I did not see White, but I gave a letter of introduction for him to Allan—I afterwards received information of the death of the horses—I received this bill of lading (produced).

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. Stephen underwrote part of the insurance himself, £212.

WILLIAM BARKER . I am one of the firm of W. A Barker and Co., insurance brokers—I received this letter of December 24th, making inquiries about insuring horses—I made inquiries among insurance brokers and underwriters, and eventually insured three horses by the Scandinavian for £500—I afterwards heard of their death at sea—the claim was not paid.

Cross-examined. The claim was resisted on the ground that the horses had not been identified—this is the certificate from the master of the ship:—"S. S. Scandinavian. This is to certify that Mr. A. S. White paid every possible attention to the horses; he stayed with them night and day till they died. The death was caused by the heavy rolling of the ship.—N. STINAT, master."

DAVID GIBBS (Re-examined). On January 27th, 1892, I sent a horse to Glasgow, consigned by John Machattie—I produce the counterfoil of the contract note, signed "Andrew White"—the charges were paid in Glasgow.

Cross-examined. That means that White was sent with the horses.

THOMAS JOHN HOWIE . I am in the employ of Messrs. Allen, shipowners, Glasgow—a correspondence took place, and on January 29 some horses were shipped by the Scandinavian—the groom in charge came to our office with the letter of introduction—I received a letter from Stephen, asking whether the horses had arrived safely—on the day before that James Mitchell came to inquire about the horses—it appears from the log that the noises died on the 2nd, 4th, and 6th of February.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. There were two or three days of rough weather—these were the only three horses on board.

WILLIAM MCDONALD . In February, 1892, I, saw Stephens; he asked me to get the lowest rate of premium for freight to the Cape of Good Hope; he was desirous of insuring three horses—I entered into communication with Barker and Co., and eventually the horses were insured for £2,000.

WILLIAM SMART BARKER (Re-examined). From the instructions of the last witness, in February, 1892, I insured three horses for the Cape, £1,000 in one transaction, £500 in another, and £500 in another, in the name of Stephen—I afterwards effected an insurance of £650 on a horse said to

belong to Mr. Glass—those four horses were sent by the Pretoria—I received the money from MacDonald and Co.

J.G. DICKIE (Re-examined). On January 19th, 1892, I examined three thoroughbred stallions, and gave a certificate that they had no infectious disease—I did not certify them for soundness—I never examined their legs or their gallop—they were not worth £2,000—at the same time I examined a stallion for David Glass, and certified that he was in health—he was not worth £650; nothing like the half of it.

Cross-examined by Mr. SHEE. I have examined horses for Machattie—he has sold valuable horses, and I have seen valuable horses in his yard—lie sold one pair for £220—he supplied the Aberdeen Fire Brigade with two horses—Stephen is a Shetland pony dealer.

DAVID GIBBS (Re-examined). On February 24th, 1892, four horses were consigned from Stephen to Catto for the steamship Pretoria at Southampton; the carriage was paid and the horses left by the afternoon train.

W.N. DIXON. I am superintendant of the Union Steamship Company, Southampton—I saw four horses in the dock shipped by the Pretoria—I have had experience of horses, but these were sheeted all over except their head's—so far as I could form a judgment, I think they were worth about £25 a-piece—in consequence of what I heard and saw I gave instructions to Mr. Waddell, who went out on the Pretoria the following morning.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. They were covered up with blankets and leg bandages, but I can form a very good idea of a horse from hit head—I looked at their teeth, but cannot tell you offhand how old they were—I have shipped forty or fifty horses to South Africa; the most expensive one I shipped was Buxton, for Captain Dixon, who gave 500 guineas for him.

By the JURY. I can tell whether a horse is thoroughbred or whether he is a cart horse.

ALEXANDER HENRY WADDELL . I am a veterinary surgeon, and have lately retired from the Army—in consequence of instructions, I went to the Cape in the Pretoria—there were four horses on board in Catto's charge—I saw them several times every day till they died, but never spoke to Catto—when I first saw them they appeared to be in good condition—horses do not suffer from sea-sickness; a horse cannot be sick, but they get what is called the funk; they get off the feed from fright—we got to Teneriffe on March 4th, and I looked at one of the horses, and I noticed that he was in pain, and there were symptoms of aconite poisoning—he was leaning his head on the box, and blowing and sweating tremendously—when I saw him again he was foaming at the mouth; he got worse till the middle of the day, but was better at night, and could eat his food—about 4.15 a.m. I was awoke, and went to the horse and found him dead—Catto was there—the captain determined to have a post-mortem made, which I did, and found the muscles flaccid—strychnine symptoms had not developed themselves, because there was not room for the horse to bend—I found the heart, liver, and spleen healthy; I did not examine the stomach, because it was sealed up; the bladder was empty, which suggested aconite and strychnine poison—there was not the slightest disease to account for his death—I cut out the stomach and part of the liver and intestines, and part of the heart, and they wore hermetically sealed and taken to the ice-room—the blood was dark,

which is a symptom of strychnine poison—when I had finished the post-mortem Catto asked me what the horse had died from: I did not reply—I went to the captain; Catto was there, and his luggage was searched, and a ten-ounce bottle was found of Fleming's tincture of aconite, which is four times as strong as that of the pharmacopoeia—the proper dose of it is ten minims, ten drops practically—two ounces were missing from the bottle—I asked Catto what he had given the horse—he said, some nitric ether and ten drops of aconite, which he got from the man who employed him—I asked how he applied it—he said with a bottle and a syringe—it would not be possible to measure out drops of aconite on board a snip—there had been no bad weather; horses are good sailors, they very seldom die at sea—I would not have had the horse as a gift, but if it was put up for sale a cab proprietor might have given £10 or £15 for it—£600 was nothing like its value—Catto was removed from the care of the horses, and they were all well—when they arrived there was no one to claim them, and they were sold at Cape Town; one fetched £50 and another £25, and I think one fetched only £8—when they were sold they had been on shore some time, and had been well looked after—the jar in which I put the horse's stomach was taken to the Governor, who took about a quarter, and the rest was sealed up again and brought to London in the Garth Castle.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I was sent out to watch Catto and the horses—I examined them every day, walking past them as a casual passenger—they were screwed up in a narrow box with their heads sticking out—I could tell how they were going on when they were eating their grub—I knew that the horse died from poison, but I was not fool enough to open the stomach; I tied it up, as if there had been aconite it would have been absorbed and gone—I said before the Magistrate, "Symptoms which I expected I did not find"—I expected arching of the back, erection of the tail and arching of the neck, symptoms of strychnine poisoning, neither of which had room to develop—the tail had not room to stick out—the poor brute had no room to do anything—Catto was alongside when the post-mortem was made—I will take my dying oath of that; he was in an infernal funk, shaking and shivering and not able to speak.

Re-examined. There was nothing in the weather or the place the horse was in to account for death, and nothing in any of the organs to suggest a reason for his having died—I recognised aconite poisoning the first day, but the horse got better—the horses were in very narrow boxes—this is accurate: "The muscles from the shoulder down to the knee were tense and rigid; other symptoms I expected to find I did not find owing to the narrowness of the box and the restricted space"—I found congestion of the brain of the horse—the portions of the body where the remains of poison would be found I kept carefully sealed, and they were delivered to Dr. Stevenson.

ROBERT REYNOLDS . I am the master of the Pretoria—I sailed in her from Southampton on 6th February last—I had some communication with the owners as to the horses on board, and when Catto came on board I asked him what previous experience he had of the charge of horses at sea—he said he had been to America with horses—I asked him if he had been to the Cape before; he said no—I spoke to him every

morning about the horses—we arrived at Teneriffe at five or six p.m.—it was very hot, and Catto had kept the clothing on the horses all day—I spoke to him about it next morning, and he said he had rather horses got killed than have wet sweaty cloths on—after we left Teneriffe I asked him if he had given the horse anything—he said he had given him sweet spirits of nitre—I looked at the horse, he was clothed; he got better towards the afternoon, and in the evening he was feeding, but at four a.m. I was called, and told that the horse was dead—he was foaming at the mouth, and his nostrils were distended—I communicated with Mr. Waddell—I was asleep in my cabin when the death of the horse was reported—when I got up Catto was smoking a pipe—he reported that the horse was dead, and I saw it dead afterwards—I am not a judge, but I should say the horse would have fetched £50 or £60.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. Catto did not consult me when the first horse was ill—I do not profess to know how to treat sick horses—he said he had given it sweet spirits of nitre, because, he thought it was suffering from inflammation—the horses were not carried half-way between the bow and the stern; they were more forward than that, and in a part which passengers had access to—there was not a good deal-of complaint among the passengers about the horses occupying space which they should have had—there were about forty passengers; I do not know that their feeling was in favour of Catto; one of them told me he did not know whether I had any right to interfere with Catto—I did not find among Catto's effects a statement signed by some of the passengers—I think there was a passenger named Harvey Holmes on board—I held a sort of inquiry—Catto was present at the greater part of the post-mortem; he went away for five minutes; and came back again—Catto said that he had been to America three or four times.

Re-examined. I am quite clear that he said he had never been to the Cape before—I have seen three or four hundred horses at sea from time to time; they never suffer from bad weather unless you have a fortnight or three weeks of it, but we only had forty-eight hours' bad weather—there was nothing to account for this sort of illness.

ROBERT OUTRAM (Police Sergeant). I was present on June 9, 1892, when Dr. Sylvester was examined at the Mansion House—the defendants were present, and had the opportunity of cross-examining him. (The deposition of Dr. Harold Augustus Sylvester was here read, as follows: "I am a M. R. C. S. England, of Tunbridge, Kent. I am surgeon on the ss. Pretoria. I sailed in her in February last. There was a consignment of five horses on board. On 5th March all were in good health, as far as I could judge. There had been a gale; they suffered in a measure from it, but I noticed nothing like ill-health amongst them. On the morning of March 5th I noticed one of the horses; it appeared to be very ill. It looked in a very dazed condition. It was perspiring, frothing at the mouth, and it was hanging its head down, and resting it on the front of the box. This was between nine and ten a.m., and I saw it again at eleven a.m.; it was worse then, but was not foaming at the mouth; otherwise the symptoms were the same. Captain Reynolds was with me at eleven o'clock. He made a suggestion to Catto that I should supply him with any medicine he required. He said, 'I don't require any for this particular horse, but should like some quinine for one of the other horses, which has a cold. He gave us to understand that the horse had not passed

any water. Afterwards I asked him if he had any instruments for it or could use them. He said, 'I have not any'; I gave him some quinine for the other horse. In the evening I saw the horse again who had been ill in the morning; it then seemed all right and was feeding. My attention was called to the death early next morning, and I was present at the post-mortem examination. The body of the horse was perfectly healthy, with two slight exceptions; there was a small area of redness in the right lung on the superficial part, and the suspensory ligament of the bladder was stained as if by the rupture of a small vessel. There was also a slight congestion of the superficial vessels of the brain and spinal cord. There was nothing in those to account for death; I could discover no disease in the body to account for this. I do not pretend to understand horses, but if I saw similar conditions in the human being I should be led to the conclusion that death had occurred from poisoning, and not from natural causes, and that the poison had been a non-irritant one. I was present when a portion of the stomach and intestines were taken by Mr. Waddell and placed in a jar and sealed hermetically. I was also present when the prisoner Catto produced a syringe which he said he had used on one of the horses.—HAROLD A. SYLVESTER."

CHARLES WHITE (Re-examined). I received this letter at Cape Town (From Catto, saying that he had been arrested)—I went to the prison and saw Catto—I did not know of any horses being consigned to me by the Pretoria, and I asked him for the bill of lading—he said he did not understand what the bill of lading was—I gave evidence at Cape Town when the charge was made against him—I saw three horses sold which were supposed to be consigned to me; they fetched their value.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. Catto's solicitor accompanied me and Mr. Reed, the agent of Cape Town—the solicitor for the prosecution was not with me that I know of—I put one or two questions to Catto, but he refused to answer by the advice of his solicitor.

A.S. MCDONALD (Re-examined). On February 29th I received instructions from Stephen and wrote this letter to W. L. Barker and Co., of London: "Dear Sirs,—John Machattie purposes shipping three horses value £2,000, for which insurance will be wanted"—next day I got further information, and sent this telegram to Barker's on March 1st. (Telling them to open an insurance on two American trotting horses)—Stephen had told me that—I wrote this letter the same day, which Barron afterwards signed. (Asking Messrs. Barker to order an insurance to be opened for him on turn American trotting horses.)—Stephen took it away next day, and got Barron to sign it, increasing the limit to twenty guineas—I saw Machattie in the matter—on March 4th I got the covering note informing me that the insurance was effected; he gave me the premium on that covering note in a shop in Aberdeen—Stephen called on me on a Monday with Barron, who made a declaration. (This was signed by Barron, and stated that the horses insured for £1,400 cost him £1,640.)—I sent that to Messrs. Barker, with a draft for the premium—I got the policy and bill of lading, and sent it to Barron—when news came of the death I bought a passage for the Cape for Stephen and Barron: Stephen gave me the money to pay for the tickets.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. Barron was introduced to me by Stephen; I had never heard of him before—Stephen said that Barron lived in Aberdeen, and that these were two trotting horses, race-horses,

and that Barron was going out to the Cape to ride or drive them—I had done business with Stephen before—I knew that the horses which went out by the Scandinavian had been lost—I received this letter from Messrs. Barker. (Inquiring whether the horses insured for Mr. Alexander Stephen were by the same shipper as those shipped by the Donald Currie, which had been lost.)—after Stephen introduced me on March 1st I saw Adam Machattie and Stephen together—it was to Adam Machattie I gave the amount of my charge; I never received any money from Barron—in estimating the value it is customary to include the premium, freight, and profit; there is nothing fraudulent in that—I did not regard myself as dealing with Stephen and Machattie; I got the premiums from Machattie on behalf of Barron: I never asked Barron—a trotting machine was mentioned, or light vehicle, and I was instructed to ask the company if it could go out with the horses; the reply was that they could not take it out free of freight—I saw Barron from time to time; he told me he was going out to trot these horses—I did not see them—Barron did not tell me the name of the chestnut horse, but Stephen told me it was Edwin Q—Stephen showed me a leaf from a book in reference to the pedigree of that horse, "Edwin Q"was written on the top of. the leaf in pencil, a name had been scratched out with a knife, and Edwin Q. put in—it professed to give a pedigree, but I did not know what it was—it had a record of some kind—I told Barron that one of the horses had died on the voyage, and he came and asked me if I had any further particulars, and said, "I hope it is not the chestnut; "I did not know which it wag—he asked me for further particulars—Barron and Stephen afterwards got tickets to go out to the Cape—I have got all the policies of insurance in reference to this transaction—this is one of them, and this is another for £1,000; they are made out in the name of Barron, and they are both endorsed by Barron—these ere the two bills of lading—Lambert Barron is the shipper and consignee—I believe this to be his writing, and the policies also.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I never had any communication with White—I never heard of Catto.

Re-examined. I wrote my instructions, and Stephen took away the letter and brought is back signed by Barron—I went to Barron's hotel on 2nd March, and saw him and got this endorsement—I was acting on his behalf—I wrote several letters to Barron at the Waverley Hotel, reporting what I was doing on his behalf with respect to both the horses, they were one consignment a small leaf of a book was produced to me, and there were, as far as I recollect, three pedigrees in it; the name which had been in was scratched out with a knife and Edwin Q. inserted in pencil—no evidence was given to me that that leaf referred to the horses sent out to Cape Town—I simply passed it on.

Cross-examined. I forwarded that leaf to the underwriters, believing it referred to this horse—Stephen told me so, and I believed he was telling the truth—I wrote the letter giving the order for the insurance by Stephen's instructions, and handed it to him, and he brought it back signed by Barron.

WILLIAM SMART BARKER (Re-examined). On February 24th, by McDonald's request, I inquired about these two trotting horses and obtained a policy in the British and Foreign Insurance Company—they were sent out in the Bane from Southampton—there was a correspondence

between the last witness and myself, which I communicated to the insurers.

(Adjourned to Tuesday next, Monday being Bank Holiday.)

Tuesday, August 2nd, 1892.

JAMES GILMORE DICKIE (Re-examined). I examined two horses, a chestnut and a brown, at Machattie's stables, for shipment for Perth—I heard they belonged to Mr. Barron—some of the Machatties sent word to me of that—I gave a certificate that they were in good health and fit for shipment—I did not form any opinion as to their value—I left the certificate in Machattie's office.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I formed no idea as to their value—I said, "I don't advise as to value"—I said that just to look at this horse he might be worth £60 or £70 as a carriage horse.

Re-examined. I was not there to look at their value, but only to see there was no disease about them.

DAVID GIBBS (Re-examined). I am agent of the Caledonian Railway at Aberdeen—on 9th March I sent two horses to the south consigned by John Machattie—Adam Machattie pro L. Barron signed the counterfoil of the contract note—L. Barron, at Southampton, was the consignee—John Machattie paid the freight.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. John Machattie gets reduced rates on account of his considerable horse traffic—he is continually going away with horses; oftener than once a week.

FRANCIS JOHN SYMONS . I am captain of the ss. Dane, of the Union Steamship Company—she left Southampton on 11th March for Cape Town—I had two horses on board in charge of the prisoner Andrew White—they were consigned to James Wilson, of Cape Town, by Lambert Barron—I produce the copy of the bill of lading—on 15th or 16th March (the weather was tine) my attention was first attracted to one of the horses as having something the matter with it—I noticed he seemed to be suffering very much—he had a glazed eye and was very uneasy, and had a great quivering in the nostrils, and was sweating profusely, and altogether looked as if there was something wrong with him—I asked White what was the matter with him—he said he thought he was only suffering from sea sickness—in consequence of what the doctor said to me I went to look at the horse again—he had slipped back on his haunches in the box, and was kicking, and seemed to be suffering from violent paroxysms of pain—he died about two hours after that—I was present when he died—I should say he died suddenly, collapsed—I directed the doctor to make a post-mortem examination, and it was made in my presence—I noticed a most disagreeable., offensive, and pungent smell—the contents of the stomach were placed in a jar while I was there—it was sealed by me with the doctor's signet ring—that was the day before we reached Teneriffe—at Teneriffe I despatched the jar to Captain Dixon, by ss. Nubian, sealed up—we had no weather to account for the death—on the two days I noticed it ill the weather was fine—the other horse arrived safely at Cape Town.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I know nothing about horses—I never saw one die at sea before—I cannot say I have seen one ill before—I did not ask White to attend the post-mortem; I did not tell him it was going to take place—I did not tell him I had taken the stomach

out—I think I told him about two days after that I had sent it to England—I saw him at the examination—we had a tarpaulin cover round the horse at the time—White attended the other horse till it reached the Cape.

Re-examined. I have often carried horses before, and this was the first horse I have had die on board—the weather was better than it is sometimes—the post-mortem took place on the deck where the horse bad been standing—White was close to us, in the canvas—he knew what we were doing perfectly well—I saw him there; if he had not been there I should have called him.

ROBERT HALL . I am a M.R.C.S. of England, and was surgeon on the Dane on the voyage when she started from Southampton on 11th March—on the day that the horse died I noticed it was tossing its head about a good deal; it appeared to be very restless, and sweating a good deal, and its eyes looked strange—I went to see it again, and as got three or four yards from the box I saw it fear up and fall back in a kind of convulsion, kicking—two hours after that it died—I had observed nothing in the state of the horse before to account for it—I made the post-mortem; the butcher cut it open, and I examined all the organs—I found nothing in the organs to account for death, no signs of disease—they appeared healthy, but the liver looked a little congested; that was the only thing I could see wrong—I opened the stomach, and I and the captain put the contents into a jar, which was sealed up, and a seal affixed to it—the device on my ring is a Venus and Cupid—a piece of liver was put in spirits in a bottle—there was a good deal of smell, more than that of ordinary decomposition—I have not experience, but the butcher, who has experience of animals, got sick over it—I asked White the first day what these horses were, and he said they were American trotters, and I said, "What are they doing out at the Cape?" because as far as I knew there was no trotting there, and he muttered something, I don't know what he said; he did not give any answer to it—the weather on the way to the Cape was fine.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I do not understand the diseases of horses—I had the impression that the horse was suffering pain; I cannot say I thought very much about the animal—I thought it probably had colic, as far as I could judge—I never cut up a horse before—it was not bled before it was cut up; it was dead—I believe a horse unbled smells more strongly than one that has been bled—I never saw a horse die before—I don't know if special diseases in horses produce special smells—I did not inform White that a post-mortem was about to take place—he must have seen it, I think—I swear he was present at it; he was on the deck—there was a canvas screen round the carcase—I cannot say if he was within the screen, because I was so engaged in the postmortem that I did not notice who was there—I said, "I, the butcher, a Dr. Kotze, from Cape Town, and the captain were within the screen; the chief officer, chief steward, and the butcher's mate were also within the screen; that is all I remember," that is true—White was not present when I sealed the stomach.

ALEXANDER HENRY WADDELL (Re-examined). I had gone out to the Cape in the Pretoria and landed, and was there when the Dane arrived—at the request of the Attorney-General of the Cape I examined a horse that came ashore from the Dane—it was about fourteen years old, unsound

from its shape and make in every possible way—his knees were not broken, but he was over at the knees, and very narrow-ribbed, and constitutionally unsound—I do not think from his appearance that he was one of the fastest trotters who ever came into England—I formed an opinion as to its value—I was present at its sale—I think it fetched £8—I would not have taken it home for anything—I would not have had it as a gift—I think it fetched very much more than its value—the disease pink eye is a form of influenza; I never knew a horse to die of pink eye; I have done nothing but nurse them, and I never knew one die—they might if neglected—red water is a very different disease, a disease of the kidneys and bladder.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I examined the horse at Barn's stables—it was constitutionally unsound—I could not gallop the horse for its wind, and could not tell whether its lungs were unsound; it was not fit to gallop; I did not try—it was standing in a stable—I took it out and saw it trot, but it was not fit to gallop; it could not have galloped, it would have tumbled down and broken its neck; I knew better than to try—it was a narrow-ribbed beast that I would not give sixpence for; I did not get on his back, I was not going to risk my own neck—I have seen thousands, scores, hundreds of trotting horses before, horses that ran in trotting races—I have had my experience in Ireland—this is not a photograph of the horse—these look like photographs of trotters; this one has broken knees—the big chestnut that went out with me had knees a great deal worse than these in the photograph—this horse's knees are slightly inclined to stand over,. but the other is straight in the legs—a great number of colonial people were present at the sale, which was on the Parade, by auction—my opinion of the horse was formed from what I saw of it when it stood in the stable yard at Barn's, and when it was sold by auction.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. It was a chestnut horse that arrived from the Dane—I heard Mr. Dickie's evidence, and I heard him say it was worth £60 or £70 for a carriage horse—that surprised me very much—in its young days it might have been fit to ride—I said at the Policecourt, "I think he had never been a good horse; he was always a very inferior beast, and in his very best days was never worth £5"—he might have been worth £5 in his young days—I disagree with Mr. Dickie, and I am sorry to do so with one of my professional mends—I am a veterinary surgeon—strychnine is very often given to horses as medicine under skilled 'hands—one to three grains might be administered without any fear, and that might go on for several days—the average weight of a horse's liver is about twelve pounds, I believe.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. Pink eye is infectious—there would be greater difficulty in treating it at sea than on land—it would aggravate the danger, and the nursing apparatus would not be so handy as it is at the Royal Veterinary College—symptoms of strychnine and aconite are very similar, and the symptoms you find are very characteristic of either of those poisons—I made a written report of the appearances I observed immediately afterwards, I have the notes in my pocket now—I expressed my opinion that the symptoms pointed to aconite poisoning—I found the bottle with two ounces missing, which was enough to kill half-a-dozen horses or more, and symptoms of aconite and strychnine poisoning are so closely allied that I came to that conclusion—I did not examine its

stomach—I did not think it had died from strychnine till I heard what Dr. Hahn found, and examined the stomach myself—I certainly was not under the influence of liquor when I gave evidence before the Magistrate.

Re-examined. Strychnine is not a remedy for pink eye nor red water—before Catto's things were searched I had in my own mind come to the conclusion that the horse was ill from poison, from the symptoms I observed, which might have been those of aconite or strychnine poisoning.

JAMES HUGH WILSON . I was staying at the Waverley Hotel, King Street, Cheapside—I am still staying in London—I am head waiter at Poole's hotel at Cape Town—Machattie is a nephew of mine; he was a waiter at Poole's hotel, and combined that with a wine merchant—I knew Stephen when in Aberdeen—I did not know Barron, Catto, or White—I have left England close on five years—before I went to Poole's hotel I lived at an hotel called His Lordship's Larder—while I was at Poole's hotel I found a letter waiting for me—that was about the 12th of April—this is the letter—(This was from Barron, stating that he had been recommended by Machattie to ship two valuable American horses by the Dane, and on hearing of their arrival would call upon him)—before the receipt of that letter L. had no knowledge that any horses were coming to me by the Dane—I believe I received that letter after the Dane arrived—I did not know Barron at all—in consequence of that letter I made inquiries—I heard at His Lordship's Larder' that two horses had been expected—I found one was in Barn's stable—I went to see it, bat could not, as I had not the bill of lading; it was not enclosed in the letter—I made an affidavit of facts, and shortly after Stephen and Barron called upon me together—Barron introduced himself to me; he told me he was Mr. Barron, and asked if I had seen the horses—I told him I had gone to the stable where I heard one of them was put up, and they refused me admission unless I had a pass or note to that effect from the steamship company or their solicitors—I said nothing to Barron or Stephen as to whether I wanted the horses or not, as far as I remember; of course I did not want them, they were not my property—Barron said he had come out to see what he could do with the horses—I said they were no good in that country, that there were no trotting horses in the country—Stephen said he had come out to sell some blood stallions—nothing else passed, it was a brief interview; I could not afford them, and I don't suppose they could—they said they would call and see me again, but they did not.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. This is the only time I have given any evidence here—I gave evidence at the Cape—I don't think I was present when Oscar Stein was examined, I only had about a quarter of an hour's notice to be in the Court—the only persons I recollect giving evidence were the captain of the steamship, the doctor, and Mr. Waddell.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I had been to some extent engaged with Machattie in the horse business in this country—I had not had dealings with him, I had for him—at the interview at Capo Town Barron made a remark about the chestnut horse, I don't remember what it was—I don't know whether he had seen the horse—he told me he had heard that one of the horses had died at sea.

CAPTAIN WILLIAM DIXON (Re-examined). I saw the horses that went out by the Dane in the livery stable at the Dolphin, at Southampton—I

had them stripped and looked them over; they are described on the bill of lading as two horses shipped by Barron in the steamship Dane, and that he paid the company's representative thirty guineas each, freight—I looked at their mouths; the chestnut was an aged horse, I should think about ten years old, and the black and brown colt I should think was between three and four—I have sent a good many blood horses out to the Cape—I turned out my papers this morning and find I have sent out thirty; the value of these horses was, I suppose, £10 a-piece—I gave instructions to have the horse cut open, and subsequently received by the Nubian a jar sealed up, which I sent to Guy's Hospital.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I received thirty guineas freight—that freight is paid whether the horse is valuable or not—the age is not mentioned in the bill of lading.

CAPTAIN ROBERT DUNCAN . I am captain of the Hawarden Castle—she only came in on Sunday morning—on 17th September I took on board four horses at the East India Dock—they were placed in new boxes specially made for them, two on the port Bide and two on the starboard—Catto, I think, paid for them—I saw the horses from time to time on the voyage—the weather was fine throughout; the ship did not roll above two or three degrees—the weather in the bay was very fine—the first horse died on 21st December, at eight p.m., two days before we got to Madeira; I saw that horse shortly before it died; it did not seem to have anything the matter with it; it seemed lively enough—I sent for Catto after breakfast the morning after it died, and asked him what it died of—he said it died of "pink eye," and he took the horse's eyelid and turned it up—I asked what he meant by "pinkeye"; he said, "You see the pink in the horse's eye"; I said, "If you turn your eye up it would turn pink as well as this horse's"; I said it seemed as if it wanted a drink of water—he said it must have contracted it in the stables in London where they were put up for the night before they were put on board; the next horse died after we left Madeira, at six a.m. on 26th December—that was the horse that Catto turned up the eyelid of—I noticed that the horse-box was stained, as if the horse had been discharging blood—I had not seen anything the matter with that horse to account for its death—the third horse died on 31st December, at one a.m.—it was kicking violently some time before it died—I had seen nothing the matter with it to account for its death—that horse's box was also blood-stained—I asked Catto if he could give them anything—I think he' said that he gave them spirits of nitre—the fourth horse died at two a.m. on 3rd January—I bad seen that horse shortly before; there was nothing to account for its death; it was also kicking in its box—I spoke to Catto about it; he was sitting at the main hatch smoking; I said, "Well, you have got rid of them at last"; he said, "Yes," quite coolly—I have taken out horses before—I never had one die that I remember—it was fine weather and smooth water on the voyage—I have the log here.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I never saw a horse suffering from "pink eye"—I don't know what the symptoms of the disease are; I never heard of it—I prescribed a drink of water, not as a medicine; bat it was frothing at the mouth, and I thought wanted water—when anyone's eye is turned up it looks red or pink—the passengers and the crew were all talking about the horses dropping off so sudden; we could not understand

it, and when I spoke to the captain about it he said, "Better say nothing about it; it is a serious charge to make against a man"—nothing suspicious is recorded in the log; I wrote a letter to the company on arrival, to say that the horses had died; in that letter I did not raise any question as to how they had died.

WILLIAM MACDONALD . I was carpenter on board the Hawarden Castle—I knew Green as a passenger on board; I remember the four horses dying; they all died at night—Catto told me that they died of "pink eye"; he said one of them belonged to Machattie, and they came from America to Aberdeen—the voyage was very fine.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. The horse-boxes were the usual size, about 4 feet by 8—Catto appeared to attend to the horses fairly, well, as far as I knew—he did not say at what American port they had been shipped.

ROBERT BARRY STAFFORD . I am an estate agent at Bedford, and am a Magistrate for the borough; on the 19th September I left Southampton by the Hawarden Castle—I take a good deal of interest in horses—I saw the four horses on beard, with Catto in charge—he told me they were trotters going to the Cape; that he had brought them, I think, from San Francisco, and reshipped them in London; I saw the horses pretty constantly during the voyage—I remember their dying—I saw nothing to account for their death—the weather was very fine indeed, so I was told; it was the only voyage I ever went—they were eating well up to shortly before their deaths—Catto told me they were suffering from red water"—I advised him to give them a bran mash, with a little nitre in it, as the best thing if the water was wrong—he told me at the very last, if they did not recover, he gave them half a pint of turpentine; I said I thought that was about enough to kill a horse; I did not know aaything about it—they all died at night; the first, I think, died in the evening—from my knowledge of horses there was nothing I could see to cause death; there was nothing in the weather.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I have had no experience of horses at sea, I have only been that one voyage.

ROBERT DOWELL PRESSLIE . I am a bachelor of medicine and pharmaceutical chemist, of 61, East North Street, Aberdeen—I have known Alexander Stephen for a number of years—I do not know Barron, White, or Catto—I have known Machattie for some time—I have from time to time on several occasions sold strychnine to Mr. Stephen—I have a note here of the dates (referring)—on 25th July, 1890, I sold him an ounce of strychnine—he said it was an American remedy or tip for a disease called grease in horses' legs—he signed my poison-book on that occasion—on 8th September, 1891, he ordered four ounces of strychnine from me—I took it down to his place and gave it to him—he said the quantity was a trifle too large, and to lock it up in his safe—he said it was for export to America; that he was going out there, and it was to be used in America—between the 8th and 11th September he called again and ordered four ounces more—he said it would be all right if I delivered it to Machattie—on 27th November, 1892, I supplied him with three ounces more strychnine—on 17th December four ounces—on 6th February three ounces, and on 13th February three ounces—I gave those parcels to Stephen—I personally delivered them, with the exception of the 27th November when I was confined to my bed—I sent them by an assistant—on 23rd March this year

Stephen called upon me and said he wished to see my poison-book; his reason for asking that was he said that his man had been found smuggling strychnine into America, and that they had put him in. prison; I showed him the poison-book—directly this became public I gave information to the proper authorities, within twelve hours.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I stated in my deposition that with regard to the strychnine between the 8th and 11th I procured it and delivered it to Stephen—Machattie never bought anything of me—I delivered all the parcels of strychnine to Stephen except that on the 17th December.

WILLIAM WALLIS . I am a chemist, of King Street, Aberdeen—I have known Stephen a good many years—on 23rd February this year I sold him sixteen ounces of Fleming's tincture of aconite—he signed my poison book—I have it here.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. X knew Stephen as a large horse-dealer—he has bought tincture of nitre and aconite from me.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I know that Fleming's tincture of aconite is a common thing in use by veterinary surgeons, it can be bought at any chemist's.

HENRY SMITH . I am an assistant to Dr. Stevenson, of Guy's Hospital—on 25th May I received from Police Inspector Rowbottom a tin plate box hermetically sealed, marked with Mr. Waddell's name, also a stone jar marked with the name of Mr. Bateman, Chief Inspector of Police, also a sealed bottle labelled "Fleming's tincture of aconite," another containing three and two-fifth grains of strychnine, and on the 24th the contents of a stomach, and a parcel marked "Care of Andrew White"—I handed all those things as I received them to Dr. Stevenson—I opened them—I have experience in these matters, and by Dr. Stevenson's instructions I made some preliminary arrangements.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. There was nothing else referring to Andrew White other than the name on the parcel.

THOMAS STEVENSON , M. D., F. R. C. P. I am professor of chemistry at Guy's, and scientific analyst to the Home Office—on 29th March last I received by rail a packet from the Union Steamship Company, containing a jar sealed with a Venus and Cupid seal, labelled "Care of Captain Maloney," and sent to Captain Dixon—there was also a bottle secured with a leather label, containing a portion of liver—the first jar was labelled, "Whole contents of stomach of dark brown horse, Dane"—I have carefully analysed the contents of both those vessels—the first contained the stomach contents, apparently of a horse, a lot of fodder and grain, and it also contained about two grains of strychnine—the second vessel contained about an ounce and a half of liver, with some spirits of wine; it contained one-twentieth of a grain of strychnine—taking a liver at 12lbs., that would be about six grains in the liver alone—I have been in Court, and heard the description of the symptoms of the horses that died on board the Dane—taking my analysis into consideration, I say the horses died of strychnine—I was away ill for some time—certain packages were handed to me by the last witness as coming from the Pretoria—I analysed them in the same way—in the stomach contents I found a large quantity of strychnine—I extracted thirteen grains from one-third of the contents; that would be about thirty-nine grains in the whole—I also found two and a third grains in about four

ounces of the liver—that would work out at something very large in the whole liver if the viscera had been in one vessel—I don't think that quantity had been absorbed during life—in one of the jars was Fleming's tincture of aconite; that is the strongest known—the earlier symptoms described of the horses on the Pretoria I think were those of strychnine—they might be referable to aconite; I am not positive as to that.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I found one-twentieth of a grain of strychnine in the liver of the horse on board the Dane—in the whole stomach I found two grains—I do not remember whether I stated at the Policecourt that I estimated in the stomach and liver that there were five grains—probably I put that as a minimum—I assumed then that the liver weighed one hundred and fifty ounces, or nine or ten pounds—I said I did not know exactly the weight—I have learnt since that I rather understated it; I have learnt since that it is twelve pounds, that is forty-two ounces more than I estimated—I say now, if the liver weighed twelve pounds, the stomach and liver would contain about eight grains—I have never known eight grains of strychnine to kill a horse—I have had no experience of killing horses; I have not had experience of fatal disease in horses—fifteen grains is the smallest dose recorded—I have never known strychnine given for horses; I am not a vet.—I have had experience of gentlemen who have had horses, and I have never known it given them, but I have heard it.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. I tested for aconite in the Pretoria horse—I did not find any—the later symptoms might be accounted for by strychnine without aconite; I am not sure about the earlier ones—they looked like aconite, but they were not sufficiently definite; they did not look look like strychnine—Fleming's tincture of aconite is much used for human beings.

JOHN ROWBOTTOM . I am an inspector of the Cape Town Police Force—I caused the arrest of Catto on the Pretoria—he was charged by Waddell, and made no answer to the charge—I received a vessel, kept it and brought it over in the Hawarden Castle, and gave it to Dr. Stevenson—I also brought over the prisoners White and Catto.

Cross-examined by MR. BARKER. White was arrested by Sullivan—I was present at his examination—I heard Oscar Stein give evidence—I heard him say that when he arrested the prisoner he cautioned him, and he made a statement; that statement was read in the Court—I have not heard it read in this case.

WILLIAM GORDON . I am sub-inspector of detectives in the central district of Glasgow—in consequence of instructions, I endeavoured to arrest Barron and Stephen—on 10th May I was in Glasgow, when I saw Machattie—I followed him from the shipping office to the Central Station in Glasgow—in consequence of something I saw in the Victoria Hotel, I went in and made inquiries—I went into the billiard-room, and saw Machattie, Barron, and two other gentlemen—I went up to Barron and asked him if Lambert Barron was his name—he said it was—I said a warrant had been granted for his arrest in London—Machattie said, "Is there a warrant for me?"—I said, "Not that I know of"—I took Barron up to his room, took possession of his luggage, and found certain telegrams upon him—the first was handed in at the Aberdeen office at 1.12. (These were from "Jack"and "John,"asking Barron to come to Aberdeen, and then not to come)—there was also a telegram to Machattie

found on Barron, and this envelope and this third-class ticket from the Cape to Southampton by the steamer Tartar—the Southampton and Glasgow label was on the luggage.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I found Barron, Machattie and two other gentlemen in the hotel—previous to that Barron had been at the Allan Line office—I knew that Machattie had been at Glasgow shipping some American horses—I saw the horses come off—Tom Smith was there—I do not know whether he was running a horse at Alexandra Park that day—I know that there are races there.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH, I examined Barron's luggage at the hotel at Glasgow, and found a riding saddle, I don't believe it was an ordinary one—it was in a package by itself—I found some horse clipping machines among his luggage, and brushes for horses; the sort of things a man would have who was going to ride horses.

By MR. SHEE. This is the original telegram: "Write me particulars; see Tom Smith. Alexandra Park to-morrow. Tom's horse Andrew has got togle Will try to come to-morrow—JOHN."

ROBERT OUTRAM (Re-examined). I received a warrant for the arrest of Barron, Stephen, White and Catto—I went to Glasgow on May 10th, and on the following day found Barron in custody of the Glasgow Police—I told him I was a City Detective Inspector, and showed him the warrant, and said he would have to go to London—he said, "Yes, I see; that is where I want to go"—he was taken before a Magistrate—I asked him when he last saw Stephen—he said, "Not since I saw him off for the Cape; finding what a mess he got me into I thought it best to come back"—I have endeavoured to find Stephen, I have failed.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. The warrant for Stephen was dated May 29th—it was not till afterwards that I got one for Machattie.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. Barron said that Stephen had got him into a mess, and when he found it out he thought it best to come back.

ALEXANDER MCMATH . I am a detective officer of the Aberdeen Police—I arrested Machattie on a warrant; I said I had come to arrest him on a charge of conspiring with others in custody on a charge of poisoning horses—he asked if I was in earnest—I said, "Yes"—he asked me to come to his house, and asked how long I had had instructions—I said, "About an hour or two"—he asked if I knew it last night—I said, "No"—he said, "Barron must have told; I saw him in the train yesterday going to London"—I knew Barron—I have seen him in Machattie's company a good deal—I know Machattie—I took down a statement from James Henry, which was read over to him. and he signed it in my presence.

Cross-examined by MR. SHEE. I got my instructions on the 24th, and Outram arrived with the warrant on the 25th—I said before the Magistrate, "Barron must have said something"—Stephen was not to be found, he was away from Aberdeen and Glass had gone too—Glass has never been seen in company with the other men in Aberdeen so far as I know—I apprehended John close to the bazaar—I saw him leave his place of business—he did not require any officers to go with me—I had no warrant or telegram, but I had instructions.

Cross-examined by MR. ASQUITH. I knew Barron both by sight and by reputation—I believe he is a gentleman of independent means, and is fond of horses—I have seen him at the bazaar—I am not certain

whether he kept horses, but I saw him riding and driving about Aberdeen.

Cross-examined by MR. LYNN. I saw White about the end of the year as groom and working about the yard, he was generally engaged in grooming.

The prisoners' statements before the Magistrate:—Barron says, "I sold the two horses that were shipped in the Dane to Alexander Stephen, and it was on his behalf that I insured them. "Machattie says, "Under my arrangements with Mr. Stephen the horses I sold to him I undertook to deliver free at the ship's side on board the Hawarden Castle; beyond this I reserve my defence."

J. GRAHAM (Re-examined by MR. SHEE). I said before the Magistrate, "It depends on the sale up to what period the vendor's risk remains, but it generally remains till the horses are put on board ship"—that is my opinion—I effected this insurance for Stephen with regard to the Hawarden Castle, and he said that the horses belonged to him—I wrote this, "Mr. Henry has been known to me for years, and is not a dealer; I know the £250 stallion has been in his possession a considerable time, and is a very valuable animal"—he got the first prize at some show—I wrote this letter and Stephen signed it:—"Mr. John Graham. I hereby authorise you to take what steps you think necessary about the horses shipped by the Hawarden Castle.ALEXANDER STEPHEN."

GUILTY —MACHATTIE and BARRON— Twelve Months' Hard Labour and £250 Fine each.

WHITE and CATTO— Three Months' Hard Labour each.


Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-740
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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740. GEORGE FREDERICK MATTHEWS (25) and JOHN FRANCIS ALMEEDA (23) , Stealing two tins and other goods of the Peninsular and Oriental Steam Navigation Company, on a vessel in the port of London.

MR. LOWE Prosecuted.

The evidence was interpreted.

GEORGE WILLIAM MILLINGTON . I am store-keeper on board the P. and 0. Steamship Peshawur—on 6th July I was on board all day—I left the store-room just before four; the door was secured by a padlock outside—I left the ship before five—I did not go to the store-room again until Friday, the 8th, about twelve mid-day—I found the iron gates half open and the padlock gone; there was a mark or two on the door; I missed four and a half pairs of Wellington boots, two odd Blucher boots, eight pairs of stockings, and two tins of Ghee—the average weight in each tin was about forty lbs.—Almeeda was employed on the ship as an iceman, he attended to the ice—Matthews belonged to the next ship to mine as mess-room steward—he had nothing to do with our ship—this (produced) is one of the tins supplied to me; it is the only kind of tin in the ship—we have not found any of the other property—we arrived in London on the 28th April—Ghee is an article used for the crew, for diet—neither of these men have it.

SHEIK AHMED . I am a native cook on board the steamship Peshawar

—on Wednesday, 6th July, about eleven at night, I was asleep in my galley—Almeeda came and woke me up and said, "Here is some Ghee I have got, will you take some of it?"—I said, "How much have you got?—he said, "I have got half a tin"—he brought it in, this is it—he said, "You take this and give me 5s."—I said, "I don't want it"—he said, "It is mine, take it, and don't trouble about it"—I gave him 5s. and took it—Matthews was present at the time, he came in directly after Almeeda—he did not say anything.

SULIMAN. I am a fireman's boy on board the Peshawur—I was in the cook's place on this Wednesday with Ahmed when the prisoners came in—Almeeda woke Ahmed up; and both of them said. "Do you want any Ghee?"—Ahmed asked whose it was—Almeeda said it was his—Ahmed gave him 5s. for it—Almeeda then said to me, "Here is a pair of boots, give me 2s. for them"—I said, "I don't want them"—saw the boots, he had got. them on, they were high boots—he also offered to sell some soap—he had some in his hands, and so had Matthews—this is the tin of Ghee that Ahmed bought.

KAUROO MORU . I am storekeeper's man on board the Peshawur—on this Wednesday, about nine o'clock, I saw the prisoner—Almeeda had some high boots in his hands—he said, "Give me 2s. and take the boots"—I said, "I don't want them."

FEREZ ROOSOFF . I am employed on board the Peshawur—on a Wednesday, at the beginning of this month, I met Matthews about four in the afternoon—Almeeda was with him and had a half tin of Ghee, and some sugar—he asked the cook if he wanted any Ghee—Matthews said, "It is my allowance, and I got it from the Mazapore"—Matthews offered it to me for 2s.—I offered him 1s., I gave him 18d. for it.

JOHN CONDON (Detective). On 9th July I received information and went with Gray to the Peshawur; I examined the door of the store-room and found marks on the woodwork, and the padlock was gone—I received from Ahmed this tin of Ghee, which Mr. Millington afterwards identified—I took Almeeda in charge—he said the Ghee was given to him by Matthews, and that he had sold it to Ahmed—he said it was Matthews' allowance.

THOMAS CRAY (Detective). I was with Condon and took Matthews into custody—he told me that he had given Almeeda a small 7-lb. tin of Ghee which was part of his mess allowance, and that they both sold it to Ahmed.

JAMES LAW (326 K). On 9th July the prisoners were brought to the North Woolwich Police-station—Almeeda made a statement which I could not understand—the charge was interpreted to them—they made no reply.

MATTHEWS, in his defence, stated that the Ghee teas part of his allowance, and was his own property.


25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-741
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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741. ANDREW KIERNAN (22) , Stealing a watch and chain of Thomas Mayley.


THOMAS MAYLEY . I am a fireman, of 9, Bolton Road, Canning Town—on Sunday, 17th July, about 7 p. m, I was out with a friend, and at ten we left the Custom House public-house—at about 11 a.m., a man. who

lived on the Marsh, that is Victoria Dock Road, struck me with a stone, and two men jammed me up on both sides, and the prisoner snapped a watch out of my breast, breaking the chain, and then ran away—I gave information to the first policeman I met—I next saw the watch at the police-station, where I saw the prisoner amongst twelve other men and picked him out—this is my watch—it is worth about £3.

By the COURT. I had been drinking beer in the Custom House, and was turned out at closing time, when I took a bottle of whisky and a bottle of beer with me.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I am sure it was you who snatched my watch and chain.

ANTONY GILLIMIN . I am a baker, of 16, Barking Road, Canning Town—on this Monday I was packing the cart outside, and the prisoner came and asked me if I would get him up on to the roof—I said I did not see there was a way of getting up—I told him to go next door to the Distillery and try there—he said he had something belonging to him up there—he then went away, and came the next day and asked the same question—I gave him the same answer—he said he would ask someone next door.

Cross-examined. You did not ask if you might get on the roof, because you only have one arm.

JESSE HOLLAND . I am a potman at the Barking Road Distillery, near the bakery—on Tuesday, 19th July, between 8.30 and 9, the prisoner came to me and asked me if I would do him a favour by going up on the roof and getting a watch and chain down—I said, "All right"—he then left, and said that the next day would do; but when he left I went on the roof, and got the watch and chain and brought it downstairs—next morning I took it to the police-station—the prisoner is the man; I hare seen him in the Distillery once or twice before—he said a party across the road, with whom he had been drinking, asked him to get it from the roof—he did not say it was his own.

By the COURT. The Distillery is one story high—there is a trap door, but I went up the back way over the cistern and over a pigeon-house—when I got there the watch was on Lucas's roof, the next to ours—it was in the gutter—the roof had a pitch to it—you could not get to it without a ladder unless you went from our place.

Cross-examined. I have known you by knocking about the neighbourhood for a good many years—I have never seen you do anything wrong—you said a gentleman had sent you across—you said you would call again the next day, which you did—I knew you as a customer.

Re-examined. The Distillery is in a street turning out of Barking Road, and is called the Barking Road Distillery.

JOHN DON (Police Sergeant). I am stationed at Plaistow—I saw the prisoner at 1.46 on the 20th, in Victoria Dock Road—I told him I was a police-officer and should take him into custody for stealing a watch, at about eleven p.m. on the 17th, from a man in the Barking Road—he said, "You have made a mistake, I do not know anything about a watch"—I took him to Plaistow Road—I told him that the potman at the Distillery told me that he had been inquiring about a watch and chain, and that it had been found upon the roof of the Distillery—I said, "Do you wish to be

placed amongst twelve others, for the potman to identify you?"—he said, "No, I may as well speak the truth; yesterday afternoon a gentleman asked me if I knew the potman of the Distillery, and I said I did—he asked me to ask him to go on the roof of his house, because he said he had a watch on there—I told the potman the same, and that I would see him to-morrow"—he made no answer to the charge—before being charged he was placed amongst twelve others, and Mayley immediately identified him—the watch must have gone about twenty-five yards; it is dented where it struck—the height was about thirty-five feet—just then a uniform officer came up.

Cross-examined. I did not say you asked to climb the roof—I suggested that the watch was thrown up—you asked the potman to get it.

Witnesses for the Defence.

ELIZABETH KIERNAN . I am your mother, and live at 4, Saburton Street—you are a donkey-man on board ship—on Sunday night about 10.20 or 10.30, or perhaps a little later, you came in and asked me for a light, and said, "Good-night, mother." and went to bed—you did not go out again that I am aware of—I went to bed shortly after.

Cross-examined. My home is about five or ten minutes' walk from Barking Road—I might do it in ten minutes.

ROBERT WALMER . I live at 49, Halsley Road, and am a labourer—I am a friend of yours—you were with me from about eight o'clock on Sunday night to twenty minutes to half-past ten—I met you about 8.15, and we went together as far as the. White House at the back of Victoria Dock Road, and from there we went to the Royal Oak in the Barking Road, and from there we went home—I saw you go indoors and shut the door after you at 10.20 or 10.30.

The prisoner, in his defence, said he knew nothing about the watch and chain and that he had never been in trouble before.

GUILTY **— Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-742
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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742. WILLIAM CHARLES MARTIN (21) , Unlawfully, by false pretences, procuring Alice Middleton, an unmarried woman, to have connection with him, she not being a common prostitute.

MR. A. GILL Prosecuted.

GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-743
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

743. JANE MURRELL (55), ELLEN JOHNSON (26), and HENRY JAMES STOCKDALE (24) , Stealing £4 10s. 4d., the money of Norways Ali, from his person.

MR. BLACKWELL Prosecuted.

NORWAYS ALI (Interpreted). I am second boatswain on a ship—on Sunday, 17th July, at about ten p.m., T came with Adur on shore, and Stockdale asked us to come with him, and he took us about a mile, into a house—Johnson was there; she said, "John, do you like me?"—I said, "Yes"—she said, "Come upstairs"—I went up, and she asked me for 3s.—I said, "I won't have anything to do with you; I won't give you 3s.," and I came down and we sat in the room below—an old woman there said, "Do you like beer?" and I said, "No; Mahommedans do not

like beer"—she said, "We like beer; you give us money"—I said, "No, I won't give you any money for beer"—I took my bundle off the floor and said, "I shall not stop; I shall go to my ship"—the three prisoners were all in the room—Johnson and Stockdale seized me, and said, "Where are you going?"—Johnson tore my things—Stockdale put his hands into my pocket and took my money away, and gave it to Johnson—I seized Stockdale by his belt, and said, "Give me back my money"—Murrell took a knife and cut the belt, and Stockdale escaped—I and Adur went outside the house; Adur stopped there while I went and found two policemen, who came with me—we went into the house and pointed out Murrell.

Cross-examined by Johnson. A taller woman was there as well—you took the money.

ADUR. I was with Ali on 17th July about ten—Stockdale took us to a house and said, "If you want a woman you must pay 3s."—I said, "I won't give 3s.; I will go"—Stockdale and Johnson both seized Ali and held him, and Stockdale put his hand into Ali's pocket and took out his money, and gave it to Johnson—Ali seized him by the belt, and Murrell cut the belt and released the prisoner, who fled out of the house—I went outside with Ali, and waited till the police came.

DANIEL WILKIN (151 K). About 10.30 on 17th July, from what Ali said to me in Victoria Dock Road, I went to 10, Fulton Street, where Ali pointed out Murrell, and showed me the leather belt; he could speak English enough to say she had cut it, so I understood it—I said I should take her into custody for robbing the prisoner—she said, "I did not do it; I did not cut the belt"—on the way to the station, she said, "I don't see why I should be blamed for all of it; there was that piggy Dooley"—she made a statement on the way to the station—she was charged there.

ALBERT WOOLEY (189 K). I was with Wilkin, and went with him and the prosecutor to 10, Fulton Street, where I took Johnson—I told her I should take her into custody for being concerned with others in robbing a dark man—she said, "This is all right; you ought to have the others"—when charged at the station she said, "All right."

MARY ANN CLARK . I am the searcher at Canning Town—about two a.m. on Monday, 18th July, I found on Murrell a half-sovereign in gold, 10s. in silver, 5¼ d. bronze, a man's silver watch, and several pawn-tickets; and on Johnson I found one penny and a pawn-ticket.

JOHN HAFFY (Sergeant 15 K). On 19th July I went to 13, Scot Stmt, where I saw Stockdale in bed—I said, "I want you to come with me to the station, on suspicion of being concerned with others in robbing a foreign seaman on Sunday evening"—I placed him among other men at the station, and the prosecutor identified him without any hesitation—he was charged.

The prisoners asserted their innocence. GUILTY .

STOCKDALE** then PLEADED GUILTY to a conviction of felony at Chelmsford in March, 1891.— Three Years' Penal Servitude. MURRELL and JOHNSON— Twelve Months' Hard Labour each.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-744
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

Related Material

744. JAMES CHILVERS (27) , Robbery with violence, with other persons unknown, on Frederick Spanner, and stealing a watch-chain and 2s., his property.

MR. WARBURTON Prosecuted; MR. COLLINS Defended.

FREDERICK SPANNER . I am a plater, of 175, Redcliffe Square, Southampton—about 11 p.m. on Saturday, 16th July, I was in a beer-shop in Canning Town—the prisoner and another man, strangers to me, were there—I came out and had lost my way; the two men followed me—I asked the prisoner for a respectable lodging—then I thought I would turn back, and when I did so the prisoner and the other man came off the road, and one came one way and one the other and knocked me down and robbed me of my watch and chain and £2, a half-sovereign in gold, and the rest in silver—I am certain the prisoner is one of the men—I holloaed out "Murder!" and said they were robbing me—the other man ran away—I was knocked about the head—this spade half-guinea is mine.

Cross-examined. The prisoner ran away and was caught forty to fifty yards away—I am sure he is the man who was in the public-house—I had drank hardly anything—I could not find my way home, and had been walking round and round and wanted refreshment—I had only come to London that day—I had not taken lodgings—the prisoner did not come and help me to get up at the time of the assault—I am sure he is one of those who knocked me down—only the prisoner and his mate were there—the prisoner did not take my watch and money; they asked him at the station whether he had any money and he said "No; my mate had the watch."

EDMUND BIGG . I live at 30, Malmesbury Terrace—at midnight, on Saturday, 16th July, I looked out of my window and saw the prosecutor coming on the opposite side of the road; he crossed the road; there is no thoroughfare at the other end—shortly afterwards the prisoner and another man followed very closely up, one of them went round the turning—the prosecutor turned back, and the two immediately rushed at him, shouting "Here he is," and knocked him down; he shouted for. help and police—I ran after the prisoner over two railings—he asked me what I wanted—I said, "I want you"—he got over the railings, and I caught him on the other side, about fifty yards down Oak Road, and held him till a constable arrived—when I caught him he had a hat on, but after our scuffle, when we got off the ground together, he had no hat on—he was knocked down.

Cross-examined. The prosecutor certainly staggered a little; he was slightly intoxicated, I think—the prisoner helped to knock him down; both men did it—I did not see the prisoner take his watch and money.

FRANCIS CARLINE (634 K). At midnight, on 16th July, I heard shouts of "Police," and for help; I went in their direction, and found the prisoner held by Bigg—the prosecutor was standing by, and appeared very much ill used; his trousers were torn and his coat covered in mud—he said he wished to charge the prisoner, that he had been followed down the road by him and one of his companions, who had assaulted and robbed him—I said, "Are you sure this is one of the men?"—he said, "Yes"—I said to the prisoner, "You hear what is said"—he said, "Yes, I have not got a farthing of his money, search me"—on the way to the station the prisoner said, "I did not nick his watch, the other man did"—I found on him 10s. in gold, £1 9s. 6d. in silver 9 1/2 d. in bronze—he said, "That is my money; my landlady can prove it"—a hat was afterwards handed to me which the prisoner identified as his.

Cross-examined. As far as I know his character is good.

GEORGE BINGLEY (40K R). I picked up this piece of chain at Malmesbury Terrace, close to the spot spoken of by the other witnesses. Witnesses for the Defence.

SAMUEL BEDDLNGTON . I live at 4, Alfred Street, Tidal Basin, and am a police sergeant on the Midland Railway—the prisoner lives next door to me, and I know him intimately—the house belongs to him—he is fond of carrying money about with him—he pays me 10s. a week for his house—about nine o'clock, on Saturday, 16th July, I saw him in his yard; I was in my yard—I saw him pull out some silver, there might have been 14s. or 15s., and a half-sovereign—I have known him eight years, and never knew anything about him.

Cross-examined. There is a small fence between our houses—I believe he took the money out to give his old lady twopence to get some beer.

JOHN BRAY . I am a labourer, of Silvertown—I am the prisoner's lodger; I pay him 10s. a week—on Saturday, 16th July, I paid him half a sovereign in gold—about 2.15 he had about 29s. in silver at the time and a few coppers—I saw it in his hand about two minutes; it was a large handful of silver—he pulled it out to give the girl twopence to get beer—I left him in the house about 7 or 7.30.

GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Hard Labour. The COURT awarded Edmund Bigg twenty shillings for doing his duty to the public.


Before Mr. Recorder.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-745
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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745. GEORGE JOHNSON (19) , Robbery, with violence, on John Thompson, and stealing 9d., his money.

MR. C. MATHEWS Prosecuted.

JOHN THOMPSON . I am a carrier, of 5, Cowen Street, Camberwell—on June 1st, between one and two a.m., I was in London Road; I had had some liquor, but I was sober—I was attacked by three young men, one throttled me, another pinioned my arms, and the other passed his hand over my clothes from the top to the bottom—I afterwards missed 9d. from my trousers pocket, which was all I had—the prisoner was the one who was at my throat;—there was a I amp close by, and I saw his face distinctly; I have not the slightest doubt of him.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. I said at first, at the station, that I did not know you.

FREDERICK CARTER (145 M). On June 1st, at 1.20 a.m., I was in the Borough Road and saw the prisoner with two others by the Duke of Clarence public-house—the prosecutor was standing by a coffee stall, he was not drunk, but he had been drinking—the prisoner and his two companions followed him and caught hold of him by his throat and backed him against a shop window—they saw me coming and ran; I ran after them through several streets, and blew my whistle, and Smith stopped the prisoner; we took him to the station and found on him eight pawntickets and 1s.—I am sure he is one of the men who attacked Thompson.

Cross-examined. I did not lose sight of you till Smith stopped you.

ALBERT SMITH (336 M). On June 1st, at 1.30, I heard a whistle in

York Street, and saw three persons come round the corner; the prisoner was one of the three—on seeing me they doubled back; I followed them and caught the prisoner—he said, "You have made a mistake, you have got hold of the wrong man"—Carter came up in about three minutes.

The prisoner's statement before the Magistrate: "I am guilty of being concerned with these men, but had no intention of robbing the man."

Prisoner's defence. A man stopped me and asked me if I knew him; he had been doing six months when I did my time; I walked short to get out of his company; I did not know they were going to rob the man.

GUILTY .—He then PLEADED GUILTY**† to a conviction at this Court of being found by night with housebreaking implements on February 9th, 1891.— Twelve Months' Hard Labour.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-746
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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746. WILLIAM JOHNSON PLEADED GUILTY ** to possessing counterfeit coin, after a conviction in September, 1885, of feloniously uttering counterfeit coin.— Five Years' Penal Servitude.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-747
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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747. ELLEN WILMOTT (30) ,. Unlawfully uttering a counterfeit crown.

MR. PARTRIDGE Prosecuted.

WILLIAM WARRINER . I am a clerk in the Post Office, Porchester Road, Bays water—at 5.15 on Wednesday, 8th June, the prisoner asked for a 5s. postal-order and six stamps, tendering this counterfeit Jubilee 5s. piece and seven coppers—I gave her the order and stamps, put the coppers in the till, and tested the crown, but not sufficiently—the prisoner went out, and I ran out and went to a large drapery firm—I afterwards spent about a quarter of an hour looking for her—I went out of the post office not three seconds after her, and did not see her—the following evening I took the crown to the police-station and gave it to Detective Puller, with a description of the person—I afterwards saw her at the station, and identified her from eleven or twelve other women.

ROBERT FULLER (Detective F). On 9th June Warriner gave me this 5s. piece about eight p.m.—I have kept it ever since.

DAVID COX (Detective E). On 24th June I went with Camber to 100, Lancaster Street, Borough, and arrested the prisoner on the first floor back room on another charge—I took her to the station—100, Lancaster Street, is a private house, where the prisoner and Johnson were living together; the landlord pointed out a room to me.

JOHN SHELTON . I am a pensioner from the Metropolitan Police Force, and am landlord of 100, Lancaster Street, Borough—the prisoner and Johnson took a room there on 1st June, as Mr. and Mrs. Wilmott, and lived there as man and wife till 24th June—on the Wednesday, 23rd, before she was taken on the Friday, Johnson said he thought the woman was going wrong, and he was going to leave her; she said he was going wrong, and she should have to leave him—they did not leave my house till they were taken; the man was taken first.

WILLIAM JOHN WEBSTER . I am inspector of coin to H. M. Mint—this is a counterfeit crown of the Jubilee type, very well made.

The prisoner, in her statement before the Magistrate, and in her defence, said that she did not know the coin was bad.

GUILTY .— Three Months' Hard Labour.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-748
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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748. WILLIAM JOSEPH PIKE (32) , Feloniously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Joseph Robert Bradley with intent to steal.

MR. WOODGATE Prosecuted.

JOSEPH ROBERT BRADLEY . I live at 4, Bramcote Road, South Bermondsey—at 12.25 a.m. on 19th July I went home—on opening the front door and going into the parlour I found the prisoner under the table, covered over partly by the table-cloth—I immediately seized him, and we both fell and I held him there until the police came—he said, "It is all right, governor"—on examining I found the window latch had been forced back, and the window broken from the outside—the plants that were inside were moved—the prisoner was sober.

Cross-examined by the prisoner. The public-houses were not closed at this time—people were passing casually—it was a low window—I did not find anything moved as if to be taken away—you had not time, I was too quick—I went out about 9.30—everything was safe then.

JOHN WATKINSON . I lodge with the last witness—at about 12.15 on 19th July I heard a noise of glass breaking—Bradley came in about ten minutes afterwards and I spoke to him about it—I was in the room when the prisoner was found under the table—he appeared to be under the influence of drink—I asked him why he was there—he said, "He had an ambition"—a constable was fetched and he was given into custody.

JAMES FARROW (P.C. 106 N). I was called to 4, Bramcote Road—I found the prisoner under the table—I told him to make his statement, and he said, "All right"—some glass was broken and lying on the carpet inside—the flower pots had been moved to get in—I only found on him a pocket knife and eight matches—when the Inspector read the charge to him he said, "That is about right"—he had been drinking—he knew what he was about.

Cross-examined. On inquiring about your character, I find you have been convicted once for committing an assault on a tram conductor—I made inquiries of Mr. Hubbard, at the Surrey and Commercial Dock—he gave you a very good character—certain tradespeople also give you a good character.

The prisoner, in his defence, said he knew nothing about it, and had no recollection of it, and had never stolen anything in his life. The prisoner received a good character. NOT GUILTY .

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-749
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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749. ELIZABETH GOSDEN (20) , Feloniously wounding John Tracey, and causing him bodily harm.

MR. WILKINSON Prosecuted.

JOHN TRACEY . I live with my wife at 44, Albert Embankment, Lambeth, on the fourth floor, and am a coal porter, employed by the Gas Light and Coke Company—on the evening of 18th July I was coming downstairs, and when I got to the second floor I saw the prisoner and her sister beating my wife with their fists—I never knew either of them before—I went to her assistance, and tried to shove the prisoner away, and she stabbed me in my head with a knife—I felt myself bleeding—before stabbing me the prisoner said, "What is it to do with you?"—I said, "It is all to do with me"; and I immediately felt the blow, and then I saw this knife in her right hand—I had my hat on, and when she shoved

me it fell off—she then stabbed me again in my forehead, and that time I saw the knife—a policeman then came up, and I went to the hospital, where I saw the prisoner and her sister—Dr. Milton, the house surgeon, attended to my wounds—I gave the prisoner into custody—she said, "I did not do it, it might have been done by a quart can I had in my hand, or a stone in the ring I was wearing at the time"—I did not see a can in either of their hands—the same evening a little girl, Elizabeth Pinching, brought me my hat—I went to Mrs. Goodliff, where the prisoner and her sister had been staying for some time, and obtained from her the knife the prisoner had in her hand when the blow was struck—I identify this as the same—I suffered great pain, and have not been able to go to my work since.

By the COURT. I said in the Court below, "I saw her throw the beer out of a quart can over my wife"—the prisoner might have fallen against the railings as she went downstairs—I did not knock her against them.

MARY TRACEY . I am the wife of the last witness, and live with him—on 18th July I was going down from my room, and the prisoner and her sister were on the same landing—the former struck me a blow with her fist on the side of my head, and her sister threw a can of beer over me—my husband came to my assistance—I was struggling with the sister—he took the prisoner from me—she said, "What is it to do with you?" and when I looked round he was covered with blood—I did not hear him say anything to the prisoner—I did not see the knife until after she stabbed my husband the second time on his forehead—he then struggled to take the knife from her—this is it—I had seen it before this fight at Mrs. Goodliff's, where the prisoner and her sister were staying on the 18th.

ELIZABETH PINCHING . I live at the same house as the prosecutor—on the evening of the 18th as I was going upstairs I saw on the first landing Mr. Tracey's hat and this knife under it—I picked them up, took the hat to Mr. Tracey, and threw the knife in Mrs. Goodliff's passage—there was blood on the blade, which was still wet—it came off on my fingers—I did not wipe it with my fingers—there was a good light on the stairs, but it was dark outside.

WILLIAM MILTON . I am a house surgeon at St. Thomas's Hospital—en the evening of the 18th the prosecutor was brought to me—he had a wound on his forehead about three inches long and another about two inches—both superficial and clean wounds, such as might be inflicted by this knife—I have never seen the rings, but I do not think they could have been done by a can or ring—he also had a graze on the knuckle of his left hand—the prisoner was there, and I examined heir—she had a scrape on her forehead and apparently a blow on her upper lip—the wounds might have been caused by hitting against any blunt instrument or by a fall against the bannisters—Tracey left the hospital when his wounds were dressed.

THOMAS MEAD (168 L). On the evening of the 18th I was on duty on the Albert Embankment shortly after seven—on hearing a noise in 44, I went in and saw the prisoner and some other females struggling on the first floor landing—the prosecutor was bleeding very much from his forehead—the prisoner was bleeding from the left temple—she slipped away behind me, and ran off—I then took the prosecutor to St. Thomas's

Hospital, where we saw the prisoner and her sister—Tracey charged her, in my presence, with stabbing, and gave her into custody—she said it might have been done wüh a ring that was on her finger; she did not say anything about a knife—when charged at the Police-station she said the same thing—the prosecutor gave me this knife about 9.30 the same evening.

The Prisoner called.

SARAH GOSDEN . I am your younger sister, and live with you at Mrs. Goodliff's, 44, Albert Embankment, and am a factory girl—I am eighteen next birthday—on this Monday evening I was going upstairs with a can of beer in my hand for Mrs. Goodliff—Mr. Tracey said that he would knock me about for hitting his wife on the Sunday—instead of going upstairs I went for a policeman, and then went to go up again, when Mr. and Mrs. Tracey rushed on me and both began to knock me about—I then threw the beer over his wife, and in so doing hit him with the can—I halloaed out for my sister, and when she came from Mrs. Goodliff's room Mr. Tracey said he would pay for the lot—he then got her up in the corner, began bashing her head against the railings—a policeman then came and Mrs. Tracey left go of me, and when doing so tried to throw me downstairs—they then went to make their way upstairs—I went down, and asked my sister to go to the hospital, and from there she was taken to the Police-station.

Cross-examined. We had been staying with Mrs. Goodliff about a month—Mr. and Mrs. Tracey were strangers to me up to the night of the fight—we left Mrs. Goodliff's on the 19th—I saw her in Court the day before yesterday, when my aunt, with whom I am now staying, asked her about this—until then I bad not seen Mrs. Goodliff since except at the Police-court—we did not "talk over what I was going to say to-day—Mr. Tracey was standing at the street door of 44, Albert Embankment—he was the first to speak—he said he would pay me out for hitting his wife on the Sunday—I did not mention this threat before the Magistrate, because he said he did not want me to—he said he only wanted what happened on the landing—I said, "Mrs. Tracey was standing at the street door, and she slapped my face as I went in"—I did not mention it to-day because I was not asked.

JULIA GOODLIFF (Examined by the COURT). I was examined at the Police-court—I occupy two rooms at 44, Albert Embankment—my husband maintains me—we are living apart—I took the prisoner and her sister in for a few nights, and they stopped over three weeks—I knew Elizabeth before.

By the Prisoner. On the night of the fight I asked you to part your sister and Mrs. Tracey—I saw no knife in your hand, but I missed one out of the table drawer on the Monday—this is it—I also missed a small white-handled one, but I don't know when that was lost.

By the COURT. The prisoner went out on to the landing in consequence of something I said to her.

Cross-examined. I said to her, "Your sister is fighting, you had better go out"—both Mr. and Mrs. Tracey were on the landing—I cannot say when the white-handled knife disappeared, but this is the one I missed on the 18th—the prisoner must have passed the drawer where the knife was, in order to have got on to the landing, and that is not kept locked.

The Prisoner, in her defence, said site did not remember seeing the knife produced

that day, and did not use a knife the whole of that day, and that the wounds must have been caused by a can or a ring that she was wearing.

GUILTY.—Recommended to mercy by the JURY.— Four Months' Hard Labour.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-750
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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750. THOMAS POTTER , Feloniously marrying Lydia Emma Sibbett during the life of his wife.

MR. DRUMMOND Prosecuted, and MR. SANDS Defended.

LOUISA COOPER . I live at Gorton, Upper Lovell, near Bath, and am wife of George Cooper, a groom—I saw the prisoner married in 1870 at the parish church of Fisherton, Wiltshire, to Mary Ann Axford, my sister—I saw her this morning.

Cross-examined. I suppose she is not prosecuting—she married again November two years ago—I have not seen the prisoner for twenty years till quite lately, and my sister, whom I have seen frequently, had not seen him for twenty years—he went to South Africa, and she stayed here.

JAMES POTTER (574 W). The prisoner is my brother—I was present at the parish church of St. John, Clapham, on 23rd June last, when he married Lydia Sibbett.

Cross-examined. I knew he had been away about twenty years.

ELLEN POTTER . The prisoner is my father—on 4th June last I met my father at Whiley Station, and went with him to his mother's house—he asked me how my mother was, and I said she was quite well; I told him she was married again—he said he was glad to hear it—on 7th June I came back with him to London, and went with him to my uncle's house at Clapham, and stayed with him there until the Thursday, 9th June—he would often talk about mother—he said ho was glad she was married and comfortable, and that he knew he had not done right in leaving her, and he would like to see her before he went back—I said she would see him if he wished, but it would be better not to—he sent his best respects to her, and wished her well—when I left Vauxhall Station with him he told me to tell my mother he would meet her on Monday week at Salisbury Station in the waiting-room—I saw the woman he is now married to at Clapham one evening—nothing was said about my father being married.

HENRY JENMAN (Detective Sergeant W). I arrested the prisoner on Saturday, at 97, Kimberley Road, Clapham—I said I should take him into custody for committing bigamy—on the way to the 'station he said, "Well, my first wife has married again, and I don't think I have done any harm."

Cross-examined. The second wife did not set me in motion—she made no complaint as far as I know—Mr. Lloyd, the solicitor, gave him into custody.

GUILTY .— Discharged on Recognisances.

25th July 1892
Reference Numbert18920725-751
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > hard labour

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751. JOHN SMITH (61) PLEADED GUILTY to burglary in the dwelling-house of Thomas James Kane, with intent to steal; also to a previous conviction of felony.— Six Months' Hard Labour.


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