Old Bailey Proceedings.
15th August 1870
Reference Number: t18700815

ActionsCite this text | Print-friendly version | Report an error
Old Bailey Proceedings front matter.
15th August 1870
Reference Numberf18700815

Related Material


Sessions Paper.








Short-hand Writers to the Court,








Law Publishers to the Queen's Most Excellent Majesty.



On the Queen's Commission of



The City of London,





Held on Monday, August 15th, 1870, and following days,

BEFORE THE RIGHT HON. ROBERT BESLEY, LORD MAYOR of the City of London; Sir SAMUEL MARTIN , Knt., one of the Barons of Her Majesty's Court of Exchequer; Sir JOHN BARNARD BYLES , Knt., one of the Justices of Her Majesty's Court of Common Pleas; THOMAS SIDNEY , Esq., Sir RORERT WALTER CARDEN , Knt., WARREN STORMES HALE , Esq., and THOMAS DAKIN , Esq., Aldermen of the said City; The Right Hon. RUSSELL GURNEY , Q.C., M.P., Recorder of the said City; WILLIAM JAMES RICHMOND COTTON , Esq., and THOMAS SCAMBLER OWDEN , Esq., Aldermen of the said City; THOMAS CHAMBERS , Esq., Q.C., M.P., Common Serjeant of the said City; RORERT MALCOLM KERR , Esq., LL.D., Judge of the Sheriffs' Court; Her Majesty's Justices of Oyer and Terminer and General Gaol Delivery of Newgate, holden for the said City, and Judges of the Central Criminal Court.

Sir JOSEPH CAUSTON , Knt., Alderman,








A star (*) denotes that prisoners have been previously in custody—two stars (**) that they have been more than once in custody—an obelisk (†) that they are known to be the associates of bad characters—the figures after the name in the indictment denote the prisoner's age.


OLD COURT.—Monday, August 15th, 1870.

Before Mr. Baron Martin.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-619
VerdictNot Guilty > directed

Related Material

619. WILLIAM HARDING (59), was indicted for the wilful murder of Isabella Tewson, by administering a certain noxious drug, and using a certain instrument, in order to procure abortion.

MESSRS. POLAND and BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. METCALFE the Defence.

The Court considered that there was no evidence to call upon the prisoner for his defence.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-620
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

620. WILLIAM HARDING was again indicted for feloniously using a certain instrument, and administering noxious drugs, to Isabella Tewson, with intent to procure her miscarriage, upon which no evidence was offered.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-621
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation

Related Material

621. REUBEN MARTIN (18) , B——y with a man unknown.

MR. LEWIS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. STRAIGHT the Defence.

GUILTY. Recommended to mercy by the Jury, thinking he was drawn into it by others.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-622
VerdictNot Guilty > non compos mentis
SentenceImprisonment > insanity

Related Material

622. JOHN DUKE (52) , Feloniously cutting and wounding Eleanor Duke, with intent to murder her.

MR. STRAIGHT conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COLLINGS the Defence.

ELEANOR DUKE . I am the prisoner's wife, he is a cigar maker, at 28, Bridgewater Gardens—we have been married about twenty-three years—on Monday, 20th June, I got up about 8.30, and my husband just before 9—he lit the fire and made the breakfast, but neither of us had any—after I got the children to school I finished dressing myself—my husband stopped by the fireplace, and I asked him if he was going into the Park, in the afternoon, with my little girl—he said "The flowers will last a long while yet"—I had no more conversation after that time—I turned to pull the blind up, and received a blow on the side of my head—before that he said he was going to work on the morrow—I thought it was a stranger in the

room, I did not think it was my husband—I turned round to try and get the stick from him—I screamed, and after that I had two more blows—he laid me on the ground, put a pillow under my head, and stabbed me on my throat and on my face, with a penknife—this is the stick and this is the knife (produced)—he has had them for years—it was after he stabbed me that he put the pillow under my head—he then went straight across to the fireplace, took a razor from a bird cage in the cupboard, and cut his own throat—he had locked the door—I heard footsteps coming up stairs, and when the knocking was at the door he told them they could come in now—I had called out when he first hit me, or it would never have been known—a policeman came in.

Cross-examined. Q. Up to and before 20th June were you in the habit of getting drunk from day to day? A. No—I have never pawned things in my life, only for food—my husband had been out of work about seven months and a week—he fell out of work about a fortnight in October—he had another fortnight's work before Christmas, and nothing since—I had five children all down with the fever at that time, and I lost one in October—I never saw anything wrong in his mind, he had nothing to cause it—the loss of the child, and the illness in the house, did not prey upon his mind more than on mine—I was laid on a sick bed three weeks, and not able to go down stairs—this was in November, and I fell bad afterwards through waiting on them—I suppose my husband felt it as any other father would, but he had no cause to be put out by it—we never quarrelled.

MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Was he at work at this time? A. No—we had had no angry words for weeks.

COURT. Q. Had you said that you would leave the house, or was there any talk about your leaving? A. No—my friends are in the country, and he knew that they sent me money once a year to go to see my father, but there was no talk of my going away and leaving the prisoner—there was no cause for it.

WILLIAM WILSON (City Policeman 167). I was called by a woman living next door, and went to 28, Bridgewater Gardens, I heard a scuffling in the first flour front room, I tried to open the door and found it locked—I said "Open this door"—I received no answer—I said "If you do not open this door I shall burst it open"—I received no answer, forced the lock of the door, and found the prosecutrix lying on the floor, and the prisoner standing up behind the door with a razor in his left hand, cutting his throat on the right side, he then changed the razor from his left to his right hand—I siezed him and put him down on the floor; he said "I know you very well, if you will let me alone and let me do it, I won't hurt you'—I still held him, he became very violent, got his right hand at liberty and inflicted a light wound on the left side of his throat with the razor—he then made a second attempt to cut his throat, which I prevented by securing his hand—I then culled out for assistance and a young man came up stairs; I sent him off immediately to fetch Dr. Mason, who sent his assistant—the prisoner then said again "I know you very well, if you will let me alone and let me do it, I will not hurt you"—I got hold of the razor, and asked him to let me have it, he said "I will not, I am determined to do it"—I drew the razor through his hand, which cut four fingers to the bone—a woman came into the room, and he said "Mrs. Jonah, this is all through you"—she is not the landlady—she went away and he repeated it a second time, and said to his

wife, who was still on the ground, "I have warned you of this before, as you have been preparing your things to go and leave me; she has driven me to it, to cut her throat and then my own"—she was taken to St. Bartholomew's Hospital, and then I came back and took the prisoner on a stretcher to St. Bartholomew's Hospital—he was very week from loss of blood—the room was in a very clean and tidy state—there was nothing peculiar in the prisoner's manner, he seemed very calm; I have known him some time, that is why he made those remarks; I have also known his wife three years—I have not noticed anything in his manner to lead me to conclude that he is of unsound mind.

Cross-examined. Q. Had she been drinking? A. No, I do not believe either of them had.

ALPHONSE ELKIN CUMBERBAD . I was house-surgeon at St. Bartholomew's Hospital—on 20th June, Mrs. Duke was brought there, in a semi-unconscious state, and I found a wound on the left side of her throat and also a trifling scratch—the wound was in a very dangerous position, penetrating the gullet, it could be inflicted with a penknife; she also had a cut on the top of her head, on her eyebrow, and on her right temple, and a slight cut on her right forefinger—she was, I think, perfectly sober—she remained there till 15th July, and is now in a sound way to recovery, but rather weak—the prisoner was brought in a short time after her, and I found a wound on the right side of his throat, about 4 inches long, and half an inch deep, and a slight incision on the left side of his throat; he was quite unconscious, and for a considerable time his life was in jeopardy; he did not appear to have been drinking.

COURT to ELEANOR DUKE. Q. Do you know Mrs. Jonah? A. Yes, my husband and I had not had any dispute with her at all, she was the only person who came when the children were buried, and we had three doctors at the time—she has never interfered with me and my husband in any way, she has befriended us instead of harmed us—my husband and I had had no dispute—I was not packing up my things to go away—nothing had passed which could irritate him, we were out on Sunday evening and went to chapel together, and he was as calm as possible in the morning.

NOT GUILTY, being insane. — To be detained till Her Majesty's pleasure be known.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-623
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

623. ARTHUR GROVES (17) , was charged on the Coroner's Inquisition only, with feloniously killing and slaying Edward Yaxley. The Grand Jury having ignored the Bill against the prisoner for the same offence, MR. KEEN, for the prosecution, offered no evidence.


NEW COURT.—Monday, August 15th, 1870.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-624
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

624. WILLIAM WEBB (18) , Unlawfully uttering counterfeit coin.

MR. WEIGHTHMAN conducted the Prosecution.

SUSAN GALL . I am the wife of Charles Gall—on 29th July the prisoner came in, about 7 o'clock in the evening, for a half-pint of beer and a penny-worth of tobacco—he tendered me a half-crown—I did not like its appearance—he said "It's a good one"—I told him I would not take it—I refused to return it, sent for my husband, and detained the prisoner.

CHARLES GALL . I am the husband of the last witness—she sent for nle,

and when I arrived at home she gave me a bad half-crown—I detained the prisoner, and gave him in custody with the coin—he struggled hard.

Prisoner. I did not struggle, I laid on the ground.

JAMBS HEWITT (Detective Officer K). On 29th July I saw the prisoner down, struggling with Mr. Gall, who gave him into my charge—I searched him and found a bad half-crown and two bad shillings in his pockets, about 4s. 1d. in good silver, and some coppers—the good money was in one pocket and the bad in the other, wrapped up in paper, separate.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . I am Inspector of Coin to Her Majesty's Mint—the coins produced are bad.

Prisoner's Defence. I did not know they were bad, I picked them up in a yard, in a piece of paper.


Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-625
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

625. WILLIAM BAILEY (19), was indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. WEIGHTMAN and ST. AUBYN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. GRIFFITHS the Defence.

SAMUEL THOMAS LEE . I am a tobacconist, at 20, Cockspur Street—on 24th July the prisoner came in for half an ounce of tobacco, and threw down a half-crown—I saw it was bad—I gave him in charge with the coin.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you ever seen him in your shop before? A. I cannot say.

HENRY CURRELL . I am shopman to Thomas Bates, 141, King's Road, Chelsea—I know the prisoner as having worked at another shop belonging to Mr. Bates—on 25th July he came into my shop and had beef and bread, and afterwards asked me to give him two shillings for a two shilling piece—he said he was getting on very well in the world, and making 1l., a day—he put his hand in his pocket and pulled out a handful of bad coins, saying "That is well got up?"—I said "This is a very bad game to be at"—I remarked about the badness of the coins—he said "They are pretty tidy, we buy them for fourpence each"—he said he traveled about to Portsmouth, Margate, &c.; that he never went twice to the same town, that he and his companions had passed thirty at Barnes's, in the Haymarket, and that when they went their rounds the one who went into the shops only took one bad coin with him, so that if caught no more would be found on him; and the one who remained outside kept all the base money—all the coins he had in his hand corresponded with the one he threw down to me.

Cross-examined. Q. How many people were there in the shop? A. He did not speak when there was anyone in the shop, he waited till they went off—he was not very chaffy—I knew him as working for Mr. Bates for about six months.

JOHN CLEARY (Policeman A 122). I took the prisoner—Mr. Lee said he was nearly positive, but would not like to swear, that the same party had been in his shop a week ago—I found on him one penny and a handkerchief—he said he got the half-crown in change of a sovereign.

Cross-examined. Q. When Mr. Lee said he had seen him, he thougt, in his shop before, what did the prisoner say? A. That he had never been in the shop before.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . This is a bad half-crown.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-626
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

626. ISAAC GOMPERTZ (21) , Robbery with violence, on Julia Wood, and stealing from her person, one puree and 4l. 19s., her property.

MR. BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BROMLEY the Defence.

JULIA WOOD . I am single, and reside at 6, Devonshire Street, Islington—I was in Lombard Street, between 11 and 12 o'clock, on a Saturday—the prisoner was hawking sponges—he asked me to buy one, I at first declined, but he urged me and I consented—having no change we repaired to a confectioner's shop, where I got change for a half-sovereign—I came to the door of the shop to give him a shilling, and he followed me in several times, to induce me to buy more sponges—I refused, and he sat down in the shop—my purse was then in my right hand, and he pushed a sponge in my face and was off in an instant with my purse—he ran up Lombard Street, like a dart—I gave information to the police—I saw him the same evening at the station, and picked him out from among twelve other men—my purse contained part of 5l.—it had a steel chain hanging to it, about 5 or 6 inches.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you see several other persons selling sponges about in Lombard Street? A. I did, but I am quite sure he is the man.

WALTER HENRY RAY . I am 15 years of age, and live at 212, Green Street, Bethnal Green—I was passing by this confectioner's in Lombard Street, between 11 and 12 o'clock, and saw the prisoner with a basket of sponges—I saw him run out of a shop, and saw a steel chain between his fingers—he ran up the street—I went into the shop and saw a lady, and afterwards I went out in search of the prisoner—I have seen him about before, and am quite sure he is the man.

JOHN F. MITCHELL (City Policeman 858). I apprehended the prisoner about 2 o'clock in the afternoon—he had no sponges then—I told him I was a police officer, and mentioned the charge—he said "All right, Sir, I know nothing about it"—I found on him two sovereigns, three half-sovereigns, sixpence, and some coppers—when at the station Miss Wood picked him out, and the inspector turned to the prisoner and asked him if he had ever seen the lady before—he said "I have, I sold the lady a sponge; and then he said, turning to the lady, "Do you say I stole your purse?"—she replied "I do"—he gave a right name and address.

The prisoner received a good character.

GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-627
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

627. JAMES MALONEY (19), and JOHN SULLIVAN (24) , Robbery, with violence, on Charles Sims, and stealing from his person 3s., his property.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution.

CHARLES SIMS . I am a sailor, and live at 230, High Street, Shadwell—on Monday, 8th August, about midnight, I was in Betts Street, St. George's—I was tipsy—when I came out of a public-house I saw Maloney, whom I asked the way to Charles Street—he took me up the street—he had hold of one arm and Sullivan the other—another person came behind me—I did not recognize him—he put his hands into my pocket and took three shillings—I called out "Thieves!"—they ran away—a policeman, standing at the corner, went after them, and brought them back towards me—Maloney and Sullivan are the men.

Sullivan. Q. How could you identify me if you were drunk? A. Because I saw you—I recognize you by your face—I saw you all together, in the street, before—I had spent 12s., and had 3s. left.

Maloney. When at the station you told the inspector that you had 15s.,

but you could not say whether it was English or Belgian money, and he told you to say English.

MR. GRIFFITHS. Q. When did you see your money safe? A. When I was having my last glass of ale with them.

FREDERICK STETENS (Policeman K 84). About midnight I saw the prisoners in Betts Street—they came, running through Cable Street, and the prosecutor ten or fifteen yards behind them—he came up and spoke to me, and I ran after them, caught Sullivan, and brought him back, and Sims said "That is the man"—Sullivan said "You have made a mistake"—I said "No, I have not."

Sullivan. Q. When I was coming down Cable Street you were going up? A. No, no, you ran up Cannon Street, and I came behind and chased you through Cannon Street, and never lost sight of you—you dodged under a place where the. railway is being repaired, and when I came up to you, you accused me of making a mistake; but I said "No, I know you by the plaid scarf"—you were about five yards in front of me, and ceased running, to get through the crowd—I followed as quickly as I could—you walked then, because you thought you were safe when you had got through the crowd.

FREDERICK GROOMRIDGE (Policeman K 441). I heard a cry of "Stop Thief!" ran up, and saw Maloney running—I heard a rattle spring—I followed him up Chapel Street, towards Cannon Street, caught him, and took him to Sims, who identified him.

MARTIN RYAN (Policeman K 281). I saw three men running, followed by Stevens—I ran after them, and saw Maloney stopped by Groomridge.

Sullivan's Defence. The prosecutor was drunk, and it is not feasible that his words should be taken as evidence of my guilt. I am a ticket of leave man, at large. I hope you will make allowance for that. I am as innocent as an unborn babe.

COURT to M. RYAN. Q. When the prosecutor charged the prisoners with highway robbery, you saw nothing to lead you to suppose a robbery had taken place? A. No—I searched them, and found a few halfpence on one, and 10s. on the other; not Belgian money—Sims could not say how much English money he had lost; he said he thought it was 3s.; but it might have been less.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-628
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

628. WILLIAM CAREY (17) , Stealing a watch, the property of Joshua Nunn, from his person.

MR. BROMBY conducted the Prosecution.

JOSHUA NUNN . I am a messenger, of 1, Royal Hill, Greenwich—I was standing outside Myddelton Hall on 21st July; there was a crowd—I saw the prisoner there; he stood in front of me, looking me fully in the face—I felt a tug at my watch-guard, and found it was gone—the prisoner then turned round suddenly—I caught hold of him by the shoulders—he said "What's up now, what do you want now?—I said "Come with me, I will soon show you what for"—he immediately dropped the watch at my feet, and the witness here picked it up—this is my watch (produced).

Prisoner. Q. Did I take the watch out of your pocket? A. I concluded you did—I saw you drop it—there was a crowd of people standing by my side at the time.

ROBERT JOHN RALPH . I live at 78, Kingsland Road—I was at the door of Myddelton Hall on 21st July, at 9 o'clock—I saw Nunn there, and the prisoner standing in front of him—I saw him turn suddenly round, and elbow his way through the crowd—Nunn caught him near the kerb—I

heard something fall—the crowd opened a little way, and I picked up this watch at Nunn's feet.

JOHN DELLON (City Police Sergeant 27). I took the prisoner from the two last witnesses—he gave a correct address.

Prisoner's Defence. I am innocent. Before I was in prison I had been out of work many months.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-629
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

629. HENRY SMITH (24), PLEADED GUILTY to stealing a handkerchief, the property of William Henry Sanders, from his person, having been previously convicted— Fourteen Years' Penal Servitude.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-630
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

630. WILLIAM BAKER (30) , to embezzling the sums of 40l., 42l. 15s., 16l., 35l., and 33l. 10s., the moneys of Samuel Prettyman Mumford and another. He received a good character— Seven Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-631
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

631. JAMES BROWN (21) , to stealing 132 lbs. of beef, and 132 lbs. of mutton, and a mare, cart, and harness, of Thomas Peterkin— Twelve Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-632
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

632. JOHN HORSESHOE** (25) , to feloniously uttering counterfeit coin— Seven Years 'Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-633
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

633. CHARLES FRANCIS** (37) , to a like offence— Ten Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-634
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

Related Material

634. WILLIAM PRIME (24) , to unlawfully uttering counterfeit coin— Judgment respited. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] And

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-635
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

635. GEORGE COCKETT (24) , to a like offence— Twelve Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

THIRD COURT.—Monday, August 15th, 1870.

Before Mr. Recorder.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-636
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

636. SARAH STURCH (27), PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously forging and uttering a cheque for the payment of 6l., with intent to defraud— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-637
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

637. GEORGE GORFENKLE (29) , to unlawfully obtaining, by false pretences, from Charles Man, two smelling bottles, and from Butler Adams, four boxes of cigars, with intent to defraud — Twelve Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-638
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

638. ALFRED CHURCH (18) , to feloniously forging and uttering an order for a cheque-book and a cheque for 68l., with intent to defraud— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] And

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-639
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

639. GEORGE THOMPSON* (23) , to feloniously forging and uttering an order for the delivery of goods, with intent to defraud— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-640
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

Related Material

640. ELIZABETH EMMERSON (29) , Unlawfully having counterfeit coin in her possession, with intent to utter it.

MESSRS. COLERIDGE and J. WILLIAMS conducted the Prosecution.

ELIZABETH SABILE . My father keeps a stationer's shop at 132, Boundary Road—in July the prisoner came in, and asked for a sheet of paper, an envelope, and a stamp, which came to 11/2 d.—she gave me a bad half-crown—I told her it was bad, and she took it from me; as she did so a policeman came in—I told him she had bad money—she said she would take it back where she had it from—the policeman said he would follow her—she went out and the policeman after her—she afterwards came back with the policeman and asked for a sheet of note paper, an envelope, and a stamp, and gave me a 3d. piece, and I gave her 1 1/2 d. change—she came back afterwards with another constable, and I charged her with passing bad money.

CHARLES TURNER (Policeman S 338,). On Thursday, 14th July, I went into the last witness's shop and saw the prisoner there—the last witness

showed me a half-crown, and said "This person has just given me this bad half-crown"—the prisoner took it out of her hand, and said "I will take it back where I got it from"—she left the shop, and I followed her to 125, Alexandra Road, which was about 300 yards—she did not go into any place before she got there—she spoke to a woman there, and went into the home—it was a doctor's house—Darvell came to the door while the prisoner was in, and I spoke to her—the prisoner came out shortly after, and I said I was a policeman, and I should take her in custody for trying to pass a bad half-crown—I was in plain clothes—she said "Very well," and at the same time I took the bad half-crown out of her hand—she said "Come and bad a drop of something to drink, and let me go"—I gave her into the custody of 62s. with the bad half-crown, and we all three went back to the shop.

LOUISA DARVELL . I am cook at 125, Alexandra Road—on 14th July the prisoner spoke to me about 7.30, and I let her go into the watercloset—while she was there I heard money rattle—she came out and asked me if that man was gone—I told her "No," and she went out—she went away with Turner—a policeman came to the house afterwards, and I pointed out to him the water-closet where the prisoner had been—no one had been in there after the prisoner till he went there—I saw him make a search, and he found two half-crowns in a glove.

Prisoner. I know nothing of those two.

WILLIAM ROBINSON (Policeman S 62). On the evening of 14th July Turner gave the prisoner into my charge with this bad half-crown (produced)—I took her to the shop and charged her with trying to pass bad money—I searched her, and found 3s. 6d. in silver and 5d. in copper, good money—about an hour after I went to Alexandra Road, and found these two bad half-crowns, wrapped in a glove, down the pipe of the closet—I got it up with a stick—one was bent nearly double, and in trying to straighten it it broke.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . I am Inspector of Coin to Her Majesty's Mint—these half-crowns are bad.

Prisoner's Defence. I am innocent of the two found; I gave one, I was not aware it was bad; I had a three years' character from my last situation. I was out of a situation at the time, and that the officer knows.

COURT to LOUISA DARVELL. Q. Had you any previous knowledge of the prisoner? A. No—I was close against the door when I heard the money rattle—the policeman made a communication to me, and I listened at the door on purpose—no one else could have access to the closet from the street.

GUILTY.— Judgment Respited.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-641
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

641. HENRY THOMPSON (20) , Unlawfully uttering counterfeit coin.

MESSRS. COLERIDGE and J. WILLIAMS conducted the Prosecution.

HARRIET BROWN . I am the wife of Frederick Brown, of St. George's Terrace, Fulbam—on Saturday, 16th July, the prisoner came in for a bottle of ginger beer, and gave me a half-crown—I gave him change, put the half-crown in my teeth, and found it was bad—the prisoner had gave then—I gave the half-crown to my husband—a little girl came in and gave me information, and I went to Mr. Stonely's shop, about five minutes after the prisoner had been to my place, and found him there—I said "You have given me a bad half-crown, I want my change"—he put his hand in his

pocket and took out some money; amongst it was a florin—I took it out of his band and said, "I want 5d. more."

FREDERICK BROWN . On Saturday, 16th July, I received a bad half-crown from my wife, and gave it to 379 T, after I had cut a hole in it.

FANNY STONELT . My father keeps a shop at 8, St. George's Terrace, Fulham—on Saturday, 16th July, the prisoner came in for a bottle of ginger beer—I said I had not got a penny one, and he said he would have a twopenny one—he gave me a bad half-crown in payment—I took it down to my father, he came up to the shop, walked round, shut the door, and asked the prisoner if he had any more money about him—he said "Yes, I have plenty"—father said "Have you got twopence—he said "I have plenty of small change," and he gave my father twopence—my father said "I will not give you the money back"—he said "Why, Sir?"—my father said "It is bad," and showed it to him—a constable came in afterwards.

Prisoner. I put down a penny and a half-crown.

EDWARD STONELY . On 16th July my daughter brought me a bad half-crown—I went into the shop, shut the door directly, reached over the counter and tried the half-crown, and it broke—the prisoner was at the further end of the shop, drinking a glass of ginger beer—I asked him if he had got any more money about him, and he said "Yes, plenty"—I asked him to give me 2d., the value of the bottle he had—I asked him where he got the half-crown, and he said he got it in change for a half-sovereign—Mr. and Mrs. Brown and a constable came in directly afterwards, and charged the prisoner with passing a bad half-crown, and Mrs. Brown took a florin out of his-hand—I gave my half-crown to the constable.

HENRT BURRELL (Policeman T 379). On 16th July, in consequence of information, I went to Mr. Stonely's shop, from Mrs. Brown's—I found the prisoner there, and Mrs. Brown charged him with passing a bad half-crown—he held out his hand with some money in it, and Mrs. Brown took a florin out of his hand, and said "I want 5d. more"—Mr. Stonely said "I have taken a half-crown also, and I mean to give him in charge"—I asked the prisoner how he accounted for them—he said "I don't know; I got change for a half-sovereigns, and I suppose I must have got those two"—I found a shilling, two sixpences, a fourpenny piece, and 6 3/4 d. in copper, on the prisoner, all good—I received a bad half-crown from Mr. Brown, and one from Mr. Stonely.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . These coins are both bad.

Prisoner's Defence. I never uttered the piece at Mrs. Brown's shop, but I am guilty of the one at Mr. Stonely's.

GUILTY .— Nine Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-642
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

642. ELLEN LEWIS (33) , Feloniously forging and uttering a promissory note, for the payment of 30l., with intent to defraud.

MR. MOODY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. GRIFFITHS the Defence.

GEORGE WILLIAM CHATTELL . I am a grocer and wine merchant, at 62, Portman Square—I knew the prisoner by the name of West—she had been a customer of mine two or three years—I have known, her as Mrs. Lewis for sometime—I supplied goods for the lodging-houses she kept at 12, Portman Street, and 70, Welbeck Street—she was indebted to me in the beginning of the present year in about 160l.—I was unable to get the money, and I instructed my solicitor to take proceedings against her and her husband;

hat was done, and a judgment was obtained—on 15th April an arrangement was entered into with Mrs. Lewis and her husband by which 15l. a week was to be paid to me—two sums of 15l. were paid, and then there was an irregularity in the payments—a sum of 55l. was paid off altogether—I made many communications to the prisoner throughout the time the payments should have been made, and were being made—I had interviews with her—I told her I should press my judgment unless she made up the difference—she called at my shop about 27th May, gave me a cheque for 10l., and asked if I would take an acceptance if a lady would give her one—she named Mrs. Saunders, who, she said, was living with her in Welheck Street, at that time, but she resided at Torquay when at home with her mother, and that she had a banking account at Messrs. Childs'—I said I would give her an answer when I had made inquiries at the bankers'—she said that the lady knew her; that she had explained that she was hard up, and owed me an account which was due, that I had threatened proceedings, and that the lady had promised to give her a bill if I would accept it at payment—I made inquiries—I was satisfied, and accepted the bill—I drew out a bill for acceptance and gave it to the prisoner—I received these two letters, marked "A" and "B," from the prisoner—they are in her writing—I have seen her write frequently (Read: "70, Welbeck Street, Friday morning. Dear Sir,—When I got home Mrs. Saunders was out, and did not return till past six this evening, and when I named to her that you would have to forward the bill to her bankers, she objected to it, but proposed another plan, which I will show you in the morning, E. West"—"70, Welbeck Street. Dear Sir,—Can you do the bill; the lady is going out to lunch, and I shall be glad to get it clear before she goes; I have sent a bill if you will draw it, and send it back by bearer, to accept, E. West")—This is the bill I drew—I saw the prisoner after the first letter was sent, either the same evening or the next morning—the wording of that letter refers to a misunderstanding about the bill being presented it the bankers'—Mrs. Lewis understood that I should present it at the bankers', and she stated that Mrs. Saunders objected to that, and I was to accept the bill and present it at Welbeck Street; and I informed her that the bill would be presented at Welbeck Street by my own bankers—after I had drawn up the bill I sent it to the prisoner by a messenger, and it was endorsed by the prisoner in the name of West, and by her husband—I asked her why she did that, and she informed me that Mrs. Saunders did not know she was married—I knew she carried on her business as West, and she endorsed it as West—she brought the bill to me in the state it is now—(The bill was dated May 8th, 1870, drawn by Laura Mary Saunders, 70, Welbeck Street, payable to Mrs. West, or order, for 30l., one month after date, and endorsed James Lewis and Ellen West)—I received information respecting the bill from Mrs. Saunders—I went to her, and in consequence of the communication I received I took proceedings against the prisoner for forgery—I saw the prisoner, and spoke to her on the subject of the forgery, the same day that I heard from Mrs. Saundors that she had not signed it—I did not tell the prisoner that I knew it to be a forgery, but I asked her if the signature was given as Mrs. Saunders', and she said "Yes"—I told her I suspected that it was not, and I should take it to Childs'—she said "Don't take it down to Childs', because I signed the bill, and I forged my husband's name at the back of it"

Cross-examined. Q. She told you that the name of Saunders was not in

Mrs. Saunderes' writing? A. Yes—the bill had about a fortnight to run before it became due—the prisoner was given in custody about ten days after I had the conversation with her—the bill was not due then—the prisoner's husband was indebted to me in about 100l.—I brought my action and recovered judgment for 87l. 15s.—I was paid 55l. by instalments—I was not paid anything after the conversation about the bill—there were four bills on which I obtained judgments, and then there was the costs and interest, making the amount about 100l.—an agreement was entered into that I was to be paid 15l. weekly—the first instalment was paid in two amounts, one of 10l. and one of 5l.—after I had received the 55l. there was a balance of 129l. 11s. 10 1/2 d.—that is still due—the last payment made to me was 5l., which was written off as the second payment against an I O U for an instalment.

MR. MOODY. Q. Was the prisoner given in custody by you? A. Yes—on 25th June, I think.

LAURA MARY SAUNDIRS . I reside at Torquay, in Devonshire—in April and May I was staying at Mrs. Lewis' house, in Welbeck Street—the signature, Laura Mary Saunders, on this bill, is not my writing—I never authorized the prisoner to sign my name to a promissory note—she never represented to me that Mr. Chattell was pressing her, or asked me if I could give her the benefit of my acceptance—I did not say that I wished the bill not to be presented at my bankers'—I did bank at Childs'—I had paid the prisoner a bill by a cheque on Childs'.

Cross-examined. Q. She did ask you to advance bar some money on account? A. She did at one time—I did not do it—I paid three guinsas a week for my rooms—the gross amount I paid per week was between 8l. and 9l.—I was there a month—there were a great many lodgers in the house—I was on the second floor—the drawing-room floor would be more expensive—I left in the beginning of June, I can't recollect the date.

MR. MOODY. Q. Did you ever owe her 30l.? A. Never—the last payment I made was 3l. for the four days I was there over the week—36l. was what I paid during the whole time I was there.

PATRICK STRONG (Policeman D 64). The prisoner was given into my custody on 25th June—she said she had signed her own name to the bill, and not that of Mrs. Saunders—she said Mr. Chattell could not have been defrauded as the bill was not due.

GUILTY .— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-643
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence

Related Material

643. JAMES LEWIS (22) , Feloniously forging and uttering a receipt for 250l., with intent to defraud.

MR. MOODY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. GRIFFITHS the Defence.

JOHN BENJAMIN SMITH . I am a solicitor, at Bexley Place, Greenwich—I am concerned for Mr. Chattell, the prosecutor in the last case—judgment was obtained against the prisoner on 5th April for 100l., which was executed and lodged with the Sheriff the same day—I saw the prisoner Lewis on that day, after having received a telegram—he asked me to hold over the execution—I told him I could not do so unless he made some proposal for the payment of the amount of the execution and the book debts and accounts, and also that I was to be satisfied what had become of the bill of sale of Mrs. Tenant for 300l.—he then told me he had paid her 250l. off the bill of sale; that he had received 50l. from the house in Welbeck Street, from the lodgers, and had paid back 200l., part of the 300l. he had received from Mrs. Tenant—he left me to see my client, as he told me he would arrange with him—I had several interviews with him and his wife afterwards,

and negotiations took place with reference to the liquidation of the debts, and it was finally arranged that the execution should be held over, provided 15l. per week was paid on account of the accounts and book debts and the judgment, until the whole was liquidated, and on 12th April both the prisoner and his wife came to me to sign a letter, and brought with them the receipts for 250l., and also for the last quarter's rent—next day, the 13th April, the prisoner called by himself, and signed this letter at my request—previous to that I asked him for the receipts—he stated that he had forgotten the one for the rent, but he produced a receipt signed "Mary Ann Tenant"—he told me he must take it away again, and I made a copy of it.

HENRY CASK . I am clerk to Mr. Venn, the solicitor for the prosecution—on Saturday, 13th August, I attended at Newgate, and served the prisoner personally with a notice to produce his marriage certificate and a receipt for 250l. purporting to be signed by Mary Ann Tenant.

JOHN BENJAMIN SMITH (re-examined). This is the copy I made of the receipt—(Read: "March 24th, 1870. Received of James Lewis the sum of 250l. on account of bill of sale. Mary Ann Tenant."—The signature was written across a penny receipt stamp—I put some questions to him about the receipt—I asked him if it was Mrs. Tenant's writing, he said "Yes"—I asked him whether he saw her write it, he said "No," but that Mrs. Lewis hid taken it to her—on the faith of that I held over all proceedings from that time, the 13th of April—I found that the bill of sale was not paid off afterwards, and that the 250l. had not been paid.

Cross-examined. Q. Was his wife present when the prisoner produced the receipt? A. No—he clearly stated that he did not see Mrs. Tenant write the receipt, but he said that it was her writing.

MARY ANN TENANT . I reside at 2, Belmont Cottagee, Wandsworth Road—I advanced 3001. on the security of a bill of sale on the property of Ellen and James Lewis—I have never received any portion of the 300l. that I advanced—I never signed a receipt for 250l. received on account of the bill of sale—I did not authorize any one to sign a receipt for me—I did not know till recently of such a receipt having been tendered—I have the furniture, but that is in Chancery.

GUILTY of uttering. — Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-644
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

644. JOHN KITCHENER , Unlawfully, and within three months of his bankruptcy, making away with certain goods with intent to defraud his creditors. Other Counts, for unlawfully obtaining goods upon credit within that period, with intent to defraud.

MESSRS. METCALPE and WOOD conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BESLEY the Defence.

BERTRAND ROBERT JOHNSON . I am Clerk to the Registrar in Bankruptcy—I produce a file of proceedings—the prisoner filed his own petition on 21st July, 1869—he gave the address 10, Northumberland Park, Tottenham, late of Edmonton, both in the county of Middlesex, baker, now out of business—he was adjudicated bankrupt on the same day—he made the usual affidavit, and filed his three days' statement, which purports to contain a list of the names and addresses of his creditors, and states his engagements—the amount of his liabilities was 892l. 15s., and the reason mentioned for the cause of his inability to meet his engagements was pressure of creditors and bad debts—the first meeting of creditors was 11th

August, 1869—Mr. Pettis was chosen creditors' assignee—the amount of liability in the ten days' statement is 1002l. 4s. 6d.—that consists of, creditors unsecured, 938l. 14s. 6d. (there is nothing to creditors holding security); on bills discounted, 27l.; on accommodation bills, 25l.; to creditors to be paid in full, 9l. 10s.—on the credit side there is, good debts, 71l.; doubtful debts, 58l. 0s. 5d.; and bad debts, 266l. 3s. 4d.; there is nothing in the hands of creditors; the total of those amount to 129l. 0s. 5d., excluding the good and doubtful debts—there is a deficiency of 873l. 14s. 1d.—after that he was called upon to file a cash and deficiency account, on 30th October—on the debtors' side I find, as per list, 892l. 4s. 3d. and 25l., making 917l. 4s. 3d.—on the other side, to creditors by cash, 45l.; stock estimated at 35l.; book debts, 168l. 9s. 10d.; bad debts, 244l. 2s. 7d.; and 27l. household furniture; making 566l. 14s. 5d. deficiency—that is dated 21st July, 1868—amongst the creditors I find the names of James Bowman, of Baldock, miller, for 645l. 0s. 9d.; Messrs, Carr & Sons, of Waltham, for 33l. 11s.; Messrs. Hunt & Gammon, 141l. 18s.; and D. G. Young, 36l. 14s.—there is a detailed statement, signed by him, showing hit transactions with the several creditors—on 23rd July there is 17l. 10s. to Messrs. Hunt & Gammon, for flour; on 8th July, D. S. Young, 17l. 15s., and on 14th May, 17l. 10s.; on 22nd April, 46l. 6s. to Bowman—there is no account of any assignment made to any creditor—the good debts are made up, with one or two exceptions, of sums under 2l.—it was Mr. Pettis, the assignee's, duty to receive those amounts—I also produce a visiting order of the Court on 22nd November, 1869—there is also an order directing a private examination of all parties.

Cross-examined. Q. What books did be give up? A. Six ledgers, three day-books, three miller's books, sundry vouchers, receipts, &c.—I can't say whether they are here, they were given into the assignee's hands—in October a goods, cash, and deficiency account was filed by order of the Court—he gave the particulars of the goods—the date of the private examination is 1st December, 1869—that was after the accounts had been filed—the prisoner's accounts seem to have been made out by an accountant—Mr. Bowman's debt of 645l. is referred to in the ten days' statement—it was for flour, extending over some years; and the tame observation applies to Messrs Hunt & Gammon's account for 41l. 18s.—I only produce the papers.

CHARLES LEGGATT BARBER . I am official short-hand writer to the Bankruptcy Court—my office is at 15, Basinghall Street—I produce an order, signed by Mr. Commissioner Holroyd, to take the evidence of John Kitchener—I took his examination, question and answer—I have the original notes that I took—they are correct. (The bankrupt's examination was put in and read.)

JOSEPH BRISTOW GAMMON . I am a partner in the firm of Hunt & Gammon, of Chingford Mills, Essex, millers—the defendant dealt with us, and at the time of his bankruptcy owed us 41l. 18s.—17l. 10s. was for goods supplied on 23rd June—the previous order was on 27th April, for 18l.—at the time I sold those goods, on 23rd June, I knew nothing about the transfer of the business; if I had I should not have parted with my goods.

Cross-examined. Q. How long had the bankrupt been dealing with your firm? A. Two or three years—I think not more than that; I have not got my ledger here—I was not present when the goods were delivered on 23rd

June, but I have the bankrupt's receipt for them—it was ten sacks of households—I had 20l. from him on 30th June—Mr. Hunt would receive the money—on 5th May we had 22l. 10s., and in February 21l. 10s.—I received 60l. or 70l.—I have nothing to do with this prosecution, personally, only as a creditor with the others.

GEORGE DILLEY YOUNG . I am a miller, at Ponder's End—the defendent dealt with me—I received a payment from him on 1st June, 1869, which balanced the account up to 7th April—on 8th June I supplied him with goods to the amount of 17l. 15s., and on 14th May to the amount of 17l. 10s.—there was also 1l. 9s. on. 5th May, making altogether 36l. 14s.—he was indebted to me in that amount at the time of his bankruptcy.

Cross-examined. Q. How long had he dealt with you? A. A year, or a year and a half—there were no particular terms—he used to pay as quick as he could; his payments were pretty regular—he paid me 18l. 5s. on 1st June, which settled up to April—I have nothing to do with this prosecution, personally.

ROBERT COSSER . I am manager to Mr. Bowman—271l. 14s. is the account owing to him by the defendant—that was the amount proved in the Bankruptcy Court—there was money owing previous to that, which was not included in the account—the last amount supplied was 42l. 13s. on 26th May, 1869—the previous account to that was April 13th, 42l.

Cross-examined. Q. Were you examined before the Magistrate? A. No—I can't say whether the disposal of the house was known to Mr. Bowman or not—I do not know how much the defendant paid to the firm in 1867—he has dealt with Mr. Bowman ever since he has been in business—it is not ten years—he has paid money regularly to Mr. Bowman—Mr. Bowman is not here—he did not give any larger orders latterly than he did at first, but he did not pay money equal to the goods supplied.


OLD COURT.—Tuesday, August 16th, 1870.

Before Mr. Baron Martin.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-645
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown; Guilty > with recommendation

Related Material

645. ELIAS LIPMAN (30), and MARY ANN LIPMAN (22) , Feloniously killing and slaying Joseph Lipman; they were also charged on the Coroner's Inquisition with the like offence.

MR. HUMPHREYS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.

HANNAH SULLIVAN . I live at 13, Hebrew Place, Whitechapel—I was in the prisoner's service three weeks, in May, and the deceased child, Joseph Lipman, was in my charge—when Mrs. Lipman had her meals she used to give him a slice of bread and butter, and a drop of water, and one day he began to cry, and she went over to him and said "As soon as Hannah is gone I will get rid of that little b——"—Hannah is the child's mother—she left him some clothes—the deceased slept on a little bed with shavings and wood, between the cupboard and the bureau—it was changed every morning—it used to be taken down the yard—the child's skin was peeling off with the hardness of the wood, and I asked her to go to some cornchandler's to get some straw—she said "B——r him, the little sod, let him die"—the child's face was wiped with a flannel every morning; his mother left him a bath before she went away, but it was only used on Fridays, for Mrs. Lipman to wash her clothes in; the child was not washed at all, only his face wiped—his mother left 2l.—I saw that—I do not think he had enough to eat and

drink, he could eat by himself, there was no occasion to push it down his throat—I left the prisoners' service because I could not get paid my money.

Cross-examined. Q. How long were you in their service? A. Three weeks—the child was always in the same state of health, as far as I could see—I saw the 2l. paid, but I did not know what it was for—the two prisoners and their children, and the deceased, and I, all lived in one room—the male prisoner is a fishmonger, I think—he was generally away from home—there were in the same house a man and his wife, two children up stairs, and two old women and a daughter in the back, and I do not know how many were down stairs—the place was very poorly furnished; the prisoners had four children of their own.

WILLIAM SMITH (Policeman H 52). In consequence of information I received I went to 11, Boar's Head Court, on 24th July, at 10 o'clock at night, and found the deceased alive, lying in the left-hand corner of the first-floor front room, in a small space between a cupboard and a chest of drawers, upon some rags or old garments—he was very emaciated and thin, and appeared very weak, and in a very filthy condition—there were numbers of bugs, lice, and fleas on his body, and scabs on his head, apparently old sores—I called in the divisional surgeon.

Cross-examined. Q. Are the prisoners Germans? A. The male prisoner is an English Jew and his wife is Irish—I first went to Mr. Findlater, the relieving officer of Whitechapel; he refused to interfere because it was not in his district—I then went to Mr. Steddeford, the relieving officer of the proper district, who was not at home—I can scarcely say that there was a great appearance of want in the room, it was what you usually see in a poor man's room; there were a few chairs, tables, and a very good bed and bedstead.

HANNAH LIPMAN . I am the wife of Joseph Lipman, a traveller, of 5, Churchfield Place, Margate—I am the mother of the deceased, and the male prisoner was his uncle—I gave the child into the prisoners' charge in May last, as the male prisoner offered to take him, and I paid him 3l. 15s. for the ten weeks he was there—when I parted with him he was very weak, but perfectly clean—I made no arrangement to pay so much a week, but I was to send to him when I could any nourishment that he might require—he took him as his own, and I was to send some money when I could—the child could eat anything large out of his hand, such as a slice of bread and butter—he was an idiot, he never spoke in his life—I did not see him from the time I parted with him till his death, I was not in London—his hair was quite close to his head when I parted with him—there was no vermin in his head, and he never had a sore that I know of.

Cross-examined. Q. Was he always sick and weakly? A. Yes; he was an idiot, and deaf and dumb from his birth—he would only eat bread and butter, potatoes, and fish—the male prisoner has always been very kind indeed, he treated the child as his own from the time I came to England with him—the child was with them ten weeks, during which time I was travelling about with my husband in search of employment—Lipman is a very poor man—my child was so ill at times as to have to be fed with a feather; I have done that occasionally when he has been very bad—he sufferred from diarrhoea at any sudden change in the weather, and then he has gone several days and not been able to take food—I gave 2l. 15s. to his uncle, and I wrote to a friend to advance 1l. to him for me—when the child was with me I used to change his bed very often, on account of the

state he was in—it was sometimes a bed of shavings, and sometimes of straw, whichever I could get—he was always thin, through suffering from diarrhoea and going for days without proper nourishment.

MR. HUMPHREYS. Q. Except when he was suffering from diarrhoea he could eat?. Yes—the male prisoner was always very kind to him in my presence—I only saw part of the child's face after death—I did not see his head, as it was after the post-mortem examination.

COURT. Q. Was the child capable of attending to himself? A. No; he was more helpless than a baby.

RACHEL HARRIS . I am the wife of David Harris, of 43, Middlesex Street—I received a letter from Mrs. Lipman, asking me to advance the male prisoner 1l., which I did, I do not know what it was for—I saw the child before the prisoners had it, it was perfectly clean then, as far as I saw.

Cross-examined. Q. The child was thirteen years of age; was it so weak as always to have to be carried about? A. Yes, it did not look more than four or five—I never saw it walk or sit, only lie.

JAMES SCOTT SEQUIRA , M.R.C.S. I live in Leman Street, Whitechapel—on 24th July I was called to the deceased, and found him lying on some clothes, in the left corner of the room, between a chest of drawers and a cupboard—he was very much emaciated, and exceedingly weak and prostrate, and on turning his shirt up I found his body in a very dirty condition—his head was covered with old sores and scabs, and infested with vermin—I asked the female prisoner what she was in the habit of giving the child—she said that not long ago it had had some milk—I asked her where the vessel was that the milk had been given in—she looked round, and not seeing any vessel there, she said she supposed the girl had washed it out—I suppose it was the prisoners themselves who sent for me to see the child; but the message was left in my absence—this was on Sunday, and I believe it died on the Wednesday—I ordered nourishment and medicine—I noticed an abrasion of the skin on, I think, the left elbow—I did not notice any other marks, except from dirt and the scabs on the head—I only saw the female prisoner and a little boy—I said that the child ought to have had wine—she said that she gave it a little wine yesterday, and it threw it up, and therefore it was of no use getting it, and that it was of no use getting other things, for he could not take them, or words to that effect.

JOHN BOYNTON PHILLIPS , M.R.C.S. I am surgeon to the H division of police—on Sunday, 24th July, about 11 p.m., I was fetched by the police to 11, Bull's Head Yard, and found the child lying in the left hand corner of the room, between the drawers and a cupboard, on an old rng, which was full of vermin, which ran over the child in dozens—there was body lice on its body, and the whole surface of its skin was covered with dirt and effete scales of the skin, scurf which had been accumulating for a lone time—the head was scabbed with old sores, and vermin were running over the scabs—the body was in a very emaciated condition; in fact, the child was dying from exhaustion—there were only some children in the room, and I did not derive any information from them—I made a post-mortem examination—the stomach had between one and two tea spoonsful of thick fluid in it, undigested, and none of it had passed into the intestines, therefore the inference is that it had been there only a short time—from the rest of the alimentary canal being empty, and the intestines transparent, I gather that there had been no food given for some time—in my opinion the cause of death was disease of the lungs, and an ill-develope of state of the nervous

system, accelerated by want of the administration of proper food and the neglect of the child generally.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you ever seen the child before? A. I believe I have, at the corner of the street; not professionally, merely in passing—the disease of the lungs was chronic—an unhealthy state of the body would predispose it to body lice.

JOHN HOSKISON (Police Inspector). On 21st July I saw the prisoners at their house—the female prisoner said "We are no gainers by the affair, we were to have had 10l.; but we only got 2l.; some money was left with someone to bury it; but I do not know with whom"—the male prisoner said "I never received a penny, and I did not expect anything."

HANNAH LIPMAN (re-examined). I paid the 2l. to the male prisoner.


M. A. LIPMAN— GUILTY of causing death by wilful neglect; strongly recommended to mercy by the Jury — Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-646
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

646. WILLIAM JUDD (32) , Rape on Charlotte Stedman.

MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.

GUILTYRecommended to mercy by the Jury. — Five Years' Penal Servitude.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-647
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

647. DENNIS HURLEY (16) , Robbery, with violence, and with two other men unknown, on Henry Cant, and stealing from his person a watch and chain, his property.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. M. WILLIAMS the Defence.

HENRY CANT . I am a bank-note printer, and live at 1, Meredith Street, Clerkenwell—on 12th June, about 2.15 a.m., I was returning home, and when in Farringdon Street, I became aware that there was someone behind me—just at that time a young man came along the middle of the road, walking at a sharp pace, some remarks were made by those behind me as to where he was going—he took no notice, but walked on to the corner of Charles Street, where he turned and stood under the light of a gas lamp—by that time those behind me, who were the prisoner and two others, had got to the front of me, they surrounded me, and I felt a tug at my watch chain; I distinctly saw the prisoner do that—I caught hold of the chain, which, being slight, broke, leaving a small portion of it in my hand, and the prisoner took the other portion, and my watch, and ran off with them up Charles Street—I tried to follow him, and was struck by one of the others—the blow was intended for my face, but I received it on my arm—it staggered me very much, and they all four ran away—I described them to the police, and on 13th July, a month afterwards, I went to the station, and picked the prisoner out from six or seven other young men about the same size, build, and age—I had no difficulty in identifying him as I had such facilities of observing him.

Cross-examined. Q. Were the men all strangers to you? A. Yes; it did not take many seconds—I had been to Camberwell to see some friends.

JAMES ALDAY (Detective Officer). On the morning of 12th June, I received information and the description of a person from Cant, in consequence of which I apprehended the prisoner about 10 o'clock p.m., at the Clockhouse public-house, Leather Lane—I had not seen him before that, though I had looked for him—I told him I was a policeman, and should

take him for stealing a watch and chain from a gentleman in the Farringdon Road—ho said "I know nothing about it"—I took him to the station, placed him with six other boys and young men, from the street, as near his size as I could get, and Cant picked him out immediately, and said "That is the man who stole my watch.

GUILTY **— Nine Months' Imprisonment.

NEW COURT.—Tuesday, August 16th, 1870.

Before Mr. Recorder.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-648
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

648. GEORGE THOMAS SMITH (24), PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously attempting to steal a watch, the property of Thomas Veness, from his persons— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-649
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

649. FREDERICK WALLIS (29) , to five indictments for forging and uttering orders for the payment of money, with intent to defraud— Seven Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] And

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-650
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

Related Material

650. FREDERICK HASLEY (16) , to stealing a purse and 1l., the property of Elizabeth Harvey, from her person, having been before convicted— Judgment respited. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-651
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

651. JAMES HENDY (59), was indicted for that he, having been adjudicated a bankrupt, did not duly discover all his property, real and personal, and did not deliver up his books.

MR. LEWIS, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-652
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

652. ELLEN GALE (35) , Robbery, with violence, on Edward Forster, and stealing a purse and 26l. 10s., and a watch and chain, his property.

MR. KELLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BROMBY the Defence.

EDWARD FORSTER . I am captain of the Anniversary, a ship lying in the West India Docks—on Thursday night, 11th August, between 9 and 10 o'clock, I was in a public-house in the Commercial Road—the prisoner was there when I went in—I had a glass of rum before I went there, and I had some ale there—when I came out I found myself the worse for liquor—I had a pocket-book in my pocket, and a purse containing 26l. 10s. in gold, and from 16s. to 20s. in silver—these (produced) are my pocket-book and purse—I also had a silver watch, and a gold guard—when I came out, the prisoner took hold of me, and began to take these articles away—a young man called "Police!" and two men came to me—I carried my purse and pocket-book in my breast pocket—my watch was in my waistcoat, and the guard round my neck—I am quite sure I had them in my possession when I was in the public-house.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you not been drinking a good deal that day? A. No, I had not had much—perhaps I was a little the worse for drink—the prisoner was in the public-house when I went in—perhaps I might have followed her in—I saw two other men; they got hold of me in the street—I did not see any other woman—the two men got hold of me after I left the public-house—I can't say how far I was from the public-house—the prisoner was walking with me when the two men came up—the two men begun to beat me about, and I went into a house for shelter—I was beginning to get the worse for drink then—I remember what happened in the street, but not much after.

RICHARD PARKINS . I live at 68, Heath Street, Stepney—on this Thursday night, about 9.45, I was standing at my door—I saw the prosecutor—I also saw the prisoner and another woman coming down the street, and they caught hold of him, and began pulling his coat about—he ran away into

a little shop, and they ran after him, and the prisoner took his pocket-book out—the old man belonging to the shop took it out of her hand and put it on the counter, and they gave it to the gentleman back again, and a police-man came up—when they got into the street, I saw the prisoner doing something to her pocket—she then went away—the police came up, and I went with the gentleman and the policeman towards Arbour Square—the prosecutor saw the prisoner, and gave her in charge.

Cross-examined. Q. You did not see anything of the prosecutor before you saw the two women with him? A. I saw one woman besides this one, and a man—I did not see him before they joined him—I was standing in Heath Street, and I saw them come up the street together.

WILLIAM POPE (Policeman K 288). About 10.5, on this Thursday night, I was called to a newspaper shop in Heath Street, Stepney—I found the prosecutor there—I brought him out—he was almost insensible, from drink—on the way to the police-station, Parkins pointed out the prisoner to me, at some 50 yards distance—she was running away—someone called out "There is the woman"—I followed her, and brought her back—I said "What is this about robbing this man?—I received no reply—I requested her to walk to the station with me—we walked together, and going into the station she stood against the prosecutor, and I saw something in her hand—I took hold of her hand, and she had this purse containing 26l. 10s. in gold—she afterwards said "He gave me 5s. to go home with me"—when the prosecutor became more sensible, she said "I have taken nothing, or if I have, there it is for you again"—she said to the female searcher, "So help me God! I did not take his watch and chain."

GUILTY Nine Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-653
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation

Related Material

653. ROBERT BORLAND (17) , Embezzling the sums of 8l. and 15l., the moneys of Her Majesty's Postmaster General.

MESSRS. METCALFE and SLADE conducted the Prosecution; and MR. STRAIGHT the Defence.

HANNAH ELIZA HARMAN . I am daughter of the sub-postmaster at West Wycombe—on 24th June I sent a remittance of 8l. to Beckenham in a registered letter by the mail at 9.5 in the morning—I received this acknowledgment of it (produced) the same evening—it is signed "R. Borland"—on 29th June, I sent 15l. in the same way, and received an acknowledgment to it—the first remittance was a 5l. note and three sovereigns, and the second was three 5l. notes.

THOMAS SWEETING DAY . I am postmaster at Beckenham—the West Wycombe office remits to me the surplus money, amongst other offices in that district—I make up the total and remit it to the general office—the prisoner was under me, engaged in post office duties—he had been there about three months—when a remittance cornea in with an advice-note from the West Wycombe office it would be the prisoner's duty to receive it in my absence, and to send a receipt to the West Wycombe office—it would also be his duty to send notice to the general office of having received it, and make an entry of it in the cash-book—the cash itself was to be put in the till—this receipt for 8l., and this letter from Beckenham are in the prisoner's writing—this is his signature—the letter of 29th June is also in his writing—it was his duty to enter the amounts in the cash-book—there is no entry in the cash-book of 8l. on 24th June, or on any subsequent day—there are other entries on that clay in the prisoner's writing—I have looked through

the book—there is no entry on 29th June of 15l. received, or any subsequent entry—there are no other remittances on that day in the prisoner's writing—the other remittances are in my writing—the 46l. entered was received from other offices—the book is made up on the following morning, and I compare the cash in the till with the book—the book was cast up by the prisoner first on 24th June—I found the cash in the till corresponded with the book on that day and also on the 29th; there was no excess—having made up the book and compared the cash, I forwarded these two lists of those two days to the general office—the lists are made up by the prisoner and signed by me—the heading is "Remittances received this day from G.P.O. and from other offices"—there does not appear to be anything received on 24th June from the West Wycombe office—on 29th June, under the head of "Remittances from other offices "there is 46l., which was all received by me, and did not include the 15l.—the lists are all in the prisoner's writing, except the signature—he has never accounted to me for those sums, or entered them as received or paid over to me—when money is remitted from the West Wycombe office they enter in their cash-book the amount sent—they do not advise the general office—inquiry was made about the 15l. and the 8l., and I then told the prisoner there was an amount of 23l. short in the account, and asked him if he could account for it—he said he could not—that was on 20th July—I said nothing more to him then—I thought at first it might be a mistake, and I wrote to the General Post Office first, to make inquiry—I showed him the receipts in his writing on the 22nd, he said he could not account for it, and he was subsequently given into custody.

Cross-examined. Q. He came into your service, I think, in April? A. About that time—he came to me from the post office at Worthing—he is about seventeen years old—he had 14s. a week, and 7s. 6d. overtime—his hours were from 7 o'clock in the morning till 9 o'clock at night—he had half an hour for breakfast, an hour for dinner, and half an hour for tea—when he came in the morning it was his duty to see the state of the telegraph wires, to sign all bills and letters that had arrived over night, to dispatch all remittances and receipts to the sub-offices and to London, and to stamp the letters out of the bags arriving by the 7.45 train—he did not sign remittances, they were not opened until I came down—I did not open them in these cases, otherwise I should have sent the receipts—he used to do that occasionally when he received the money—the opening of the remittances was not confined to myself—I keep a chemist's shop—the postal arrangement is on one side of the shop—I do a considerable business as a chemist—I have an apprentice—he lends a hand in the post office work—I keep two tills; one for the chemist's business, and one for the post office—on several occasions I have changed a 5l. note for a customer out of the post office till—I am responsible to the post office for the money that passes through my bands, therefore the money of the post office would be my own for the time being—I remember a piece of paper being picked up, in my writing—if I took money out of the post office till I should put a piece of paper in, showing that I was debtor to the till in that amount—the till with the post office cash was taken into my back room during the night—my till was simply locked—I have found, in going over the accounts with the prisoner, a surplus of a few shillings in the post office till—I asked these questions of the prisoner on 20th July—he was given in custody on a Saturday, I forget how long afterwards—someone came down from the

post office, and put me through an examination—the numbers of the notes remitted from West Wycombe would be kept at that place—they would be kept at our office if they were sent to the General Post Office—the reserve amount is 20l.—on 29th June there was 41l. 2s. in reserve—I should send up 21l. 2s. to the office—I can't say whether the larger portion was in gold or silver—my book would not tell me that—the post office people make mistakes sometimes—there is here balance of arrears to be inserted at the General Post Office, that is an error, at our place—the prisoner lodged at a person's named Flatt, about a quarter of a mile from us—at far as I know, since he has been with me, he has worked hard and conducted himself as an honest and respectable young man—he was attentive to his work—he was earning 7s. 6d. overtime regularly.

MR. METCALFE. Q. If you do go to the post office till to get change, or for any other purpose, you either put in a paper over night, to show what you have taken out, or else pay the sum corresponding? A. Yes., always—I tear the paper up when I put the money in—the prisoner instructed them to cross-examine me about this on 22nd July, the day of the second conversation.

RICHARD JUDE . I am a clerk in the ledger branch of the post office—I received a letter of advice from Beckenham, on 25th June last, for 8l., and charged the postmaster of Beckenham to that amount—I entered it on a sheet called the remittance sheet—I also received an advice for 15l.—I received a daily account from the Beckenham post office—I have to inspect the cash book—there is no entry of 8l. on 24th June—on 29th June 46l. was entered from other offices, and the postmaster at Beckenham was charged with those two amounts of 8l. and 15l. at the end of the month—I produce the letters of advice sent up by the prisoner—they were received on the 25th and 30th respectively.

Cross-examined. Q. The postmaster at Beckenham would be responsible to the post office authorities for the money passing through his hands? A. Yes—the balance was made up at the end of the month—he had notice about it about the middle of July, I think.

THOMAS S. DAY (re-examined). These two letters of advice are in the prisoner's writing.

WILLIAM EDWARD HOWSAN . I am a travelling officer of the missing letter department—on 30th July I went to the Beckenham Post Office to investigate these two sums of 8l. and 15l.—I saw the prisoner there, and I said "It is my duty to give you in custody for embezzling, on 24th June, the sum of 8l., and on 29th June the sum of 15l., received by you for and on account of the Postmaster-General; you are not obliged to say anything; but what you do say may be given against you"—he replied "I can't say. anything against it"—I gave him in custody.

Cross-examined. Q. You had been down before, had you not? A. Yes—I asked him some questions then, and Mr. Day, too—I took down the papers signed by the prisoner on the first occasion, and showed them to him—I showed him all the evidence against him, and his own writing—he said he sometimes signed the receipts for the amounts; they were sometimes placed on his desk by Mr. Day, and he signed the remittance papers that were opened by Mr. Day—I said "How is it you have not entered these amounts from the remittance papers?" and he said he could not give any explanation.

WILLIAM FORSTER (Policeman). I took the prisoner by Mr. Howsan's

direction—I afterwards went to his lodgings and found a Savings' Bank book, 10l. in gold, 2l. in silver, and a bill for 5l. for a silver watch—it was receipted—(This was dated July 8th, from Borland to E. Butcher, for a second-hand silver watch, for 5l. paid by instalments)—the entry in the bank book is "July 20th, 1l.—I received this from the officer of the post office, "R. Borland, Post Office, Beckeuham, Kent. I beg to acknowledge receipt of P. O. O. for 1l., June 30th, 1870."

Cross-examined. Q. Were you examined before the Magistrate? A. Yes—I had been to his place to search at that time—I did not say anything about it—I was not asked—I knew what I found there—I live at Beckenham, and have been making inquiries about this matter.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Did you find any new clothes there? A. I found two suits of clothes, and about a dozen or ten neckties, nearly new, and about two dozen collars.

The prisoner received a good character.

GUILTY. Strongly recommended to mercy on account of his youth and good character — Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-654
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

654. SUSANNAH GROVES (26) , Robbery, with violence, on Ann Rush, and stealing 1s. 5d., her money.

MR. MOIR conducted the Prosecution.

ANN RUSH . I am a widow, and live at 10, Parker Street, Drury Lane—a few minutes before 11 o'clock at night, on 10th July, I came out of my house for some candles—the prisoner was on the step of her own door, No. 9—I got the candles, and was coming back again—I had 1s. 5d. in my hand—the prisoner knocked me down on my left side—I screeched out, and a young man, a companion of hers, came across the road, and put his hand on my mouth, and knocked two teeth out—I went to my own place and rested for a few minutes, and then went to Bow Street, and came back with an officer—she was on the step again, and I gave her in charge—I did not pick my teeth up, I was not able to pick myself up—she took my money from me, and the young man was with her—I am quite sure the prisoner is the woman.

Prisoner. She struck me in the face with a bundle of candles and a basin.

COURT. Q. Did you strike her in the face? A. No—I bad a basin in my hand, and it fell out—I live at No. 10 and she lives at No. 9—I should know the young man if I was to see him—he put his hand over my mouth when I screeched, and she took the 1s. 5d. out of my hand.

JOHN BOOKER (Policeman E 382). About 11 o'clock on this Saturday morning the prosecutrix came to me at the station—I went to Parker Street and saw the prisoner—the prosecutrix gave her in charge for knocking her down, and taking 1s. 5d. and two candles from her—she said she did not know anything about it.

COURT. Q. Did you find any candles? A. No—the prosecutrix's mouth was bleeding, and one of her teeth was nearly out, just hanging—I said before the Magistrate I did not see the prosecutrix bleeding—I saw some blood on the prosecutrix—she was quite sober—the prisoner was a little the worse for drink, but she knew what she was about—I saw no mark on the prisoner—she did not say she had been struck.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate. "I came to call my little girl to go to bed, and saw the prosecutrix with a white basin in

her hand; she said "I will slay you, you bastard bearing w—." I turned round to see who it was, and I saw her with the basin to strike me; she cut me in the hand. I stood at my door till the constable came. I never moved from the time she struck me; there was no one standing by what ever. I did not know she was giving me in charge for robbery. I know nothing about the money or candles, I never saw them."

Prisoner's Defence. I have nothing further to say than that; she came at me with the basin, and said she would slay me. I looked up, and she struck me with the basin from the top step, and here is the mark.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-655
VerdictsGuilty > unknown; Guilty > pleaded guilty
SentencesImprisonment; Imprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

655. WILLIAM HAM (29), and WILLIAM GIBSON (40) , Stealing two bottles of honey, six bottles of sauce, and other articles, of Francis Blackwell and others, the masters of Gibson.

MR. MOODY conducted the Prosecution.

WILLIAM NEWNHAM (City Detective 579). I went with Sergeant Hancock to 5, Fisher Street, Red Lion Square, the prisoner Ham's place, and found in a cupboard two bottles of honey, six of sauce, two of jelly, six of French capers, two of catsup, two of mixed pickles, one of preserved currants, four tins of preserved lobster, three boxes of sardines, five boxes of preserved ham and chicken, one box of fruit, and other articles.

Ham. Some of the things belonged to me.

EDWARD HANCOCK (City Detective). I took Ham—he gave me a wrong address at first, but subsequently I found he lived at 5, Fisher Street, Red Lion Square, and went there with Newnham—I took all the goods to the station, and showed them to Ham, and asked him to account for the possession of them—he said "I sha'n't say anything about them"—on the way to the Mansion House, next morning, he said "Those things were left at my house, by a man named William Gibson, to be taken care of"—he said William Gibson had been employed at Messrs. Crosse & Blackwell's, and had left about a fortnight—I asked him when he saw Gibson last—he said "Last Tuesday"—I then went with Newnham to Crown Street, Soho, where I saw Gibson—I said I was a detective officer, and had a man named Ham in custody—I said "He has been examined before the Lord Mayor to-day, charged with stealing cigars, and remanded; I have been to Ham's address with another officer, and searched it, and found a large quantity of essence of coffee, sauces, and other goods, bearing the name of Crosse & Black well; Ham accounts for the possession of them by saying that you left them at his house to be taken care of; how do you account for them?"—he hesitated for a minute or two, and then said "I sold them to Ham"—I said "Where did you get them from?"—he said "From Messrs. Crosse & Black well's, I bought them over the counter"—I said "How did he pay you?"—he said "Principally in cigars; he still owes me a little money"—I said "He says that you called there last Tuesday, at his house, and you left two bottles of Madeira jelly; was he to pay you for those?"—he said "Yes, 2s., but he has not paid me"—I took him to Bow Lane station, and showed him all the goods mentioned in the indictment—directly he saw them he said "Why, he has kept all the things he had from me; he should not have had them if I had known this; he told me he had a customer for them"—Mr. Bell, manager to Messrs. Crosse & Blackwell, arrived then, and he repeated that statement to him—Mr. Bell said "Can you name anyone who supplied you with such articles as these; you know

the counter men very well?"—the prisoner said "No, I can't; but really it is the truth about them"—I took him in charge—when I showed him the goods at the station, he picked out three articles; he pointed to those he did not pick out, and said "Those goods I had from Messrs. Crosse & Blackwell"—I produce all the articles.

Gibson. Q. Can Liebig's extract and cocoatina be bought in any shop in London? A. I believe so.

HENRY JOSEPH BELL . I am manager to Messrs. Crosse & Blackwell, 21, Soho Square—the firm consists of Francis Blackwell and two others—Gibson was in our employ, first as a loader, and afterwards he had a van—I have seen these goods—they are such as our firm deal in, and have our labels on them—they were kept in stock—Gibson would have access to all of them—we allow persons in our employ to purchase, over the counter, such goods as they might require for their own use—they have to obtain a pass before purchasing, which they have to give up to the gate-keeper—the passes are kept a week or a fortnight—a person in the employ would be allowed to purchase a bottle of jelly, under peculiar circumstances, such as illness in his family—if he wanted goods to supply other persons, he would not be allowed to have them.

EDWARD LETTFORD . I am one of the counter men at Crosse & Blackwell's—I have heard the list of the things found at Ham's place read—Gibson has purchased none of those things mentioned of me.

Gibson. I have had several things of you. Witness. You perhaps have had half a gallon of pickles—I don't deny serving you with such things as those.

COURT. Q. Has he ever had any Madeira jelly of you? A. No; nor French capers, nor essence of coffee, nor boxes of preserved fruit; and I don't remember four tins of preserved lobster.

THOMAS FLETCHER . I am a counter man—I have heard the list of the articles read—I have never sold articles of that character, to Gibson, over the counter—I have not sold him anything for some months—I never saw him purchase any such articles as have been mentioned—he has purchased jars of pickles, but that was some time ago.

JOHN HALL . I am third counter man to Crosse & Blackwell—I have heard the list of articles read—I have not sold such articles to Gibson—I have not sold him French capers, or four tins of lobster at one time, or three tins—I never sold him cocoatina, or essence of milk—to the best of my belief I never sold him three tins of preserved lobster at one time.

WILLIAM JOHN STOPFORD . I am gate-keeper at Messrs. Crosse & Blackwell's—any workman bringing out any parcel or jar of pickles would produce a pass to me—Gibson has produced several passes during the last few months for half-gallon jars of pickles—he has not produced posses for such articles as Madeira jelly, essence of milk, or capers—I see the men all out of the premises at night.

Gibson. He is not always there. Witness. I get a week's holiday during the year—I have not been abesent since January—my holiday is to come.

GEORGE ROGERS YOUNG . I am cashier to Messrs. Crosse & Blackwell, and Mr. Fish is the deputy cashier—it is my duty to give passes to workmen purchasing goods over the counter, on receiving the cash—I can't say whether I ever gave Gibson a pass for Madeira jelly, or tins of lobster, or French capers—I never had occasion to give passes to any one with tins of milk—the majority of these things I swear I have never given passes for.

WILLIAM DAVID FISH . I am deputy cashier to Messrs. Crone & Blackwell—I furnish passes to employees—I don't remember ever giving Gibson a pass at all.

GUILTY .—GIBSON Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

HAM was further charged with having been before convicted, in April, 1857, to which he


He also PLEADED GUILTY to another indictment for stealing 193 cigars, of Charles Stephen Hodges and another, his masters. — Seven Years' Penal Servitude.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-656
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

656. WILLIAM DASH (29) , Feloniously cutting and wounding Selina Ford, with intent to do her grievous bodily harm.

MR. MOODY conducted the Prosecution.

SELINA FORD . I was living with the prisoner as his wife, at 19, Devon shire Street, St. George's—on the night of 10th July I was in the Clyde public-house—the prisoner came there and wanted me to go home—I would not go at first—we then went to a beer-shop at the corner of Star Street, and got home about 12.30—we were both the worse for liquor—we had some words, and I opened the window and was going to jump out—the prisoner was sitting at the table—he had been cutting up some tobacco—when I opened the window he pulled me in, and tore down the back of the frock I have got on—I took the frock off and put on my black jacket—I took up the knife, and he ran down stairs after me, in the dark, and we fell down, and I felt I was cut—I did not know I was cut till I saw the blood, and I did not know where till after I was in the hospital—I found I was cut on my breast then—I was three weeks all but a day in the hospital—I don't know how the wound was inflicted.

WILLIAM GUILFOYLE (Policeman K 190). At the time of this occurrence I was a police-constable, I have since resigned—on 10th July, about 2.45 in the morning, I heard screams in Devonshire Street—I went there, and saw the prisoner in the street, bleeding from the chest—he handed me this knife (produced), it was shut—there were marks of blood on it—he said "I have stabbed my wife and myself three times; I don't care for myself, I hope she will get over it. God forgive me!"—I took him to the hospital, and when I got there I found the prosecutrix had been taken there before—the prisoner was sober then—there were appearances of his having been drinking.

JOHN ROUSE (Police Inspector K). On 10th July I went to the London Hospital and saw the prisoner—he was sensible, but very ill indeed—I said "I have come to take your statement, as the doctor says you are likely to die. You are charged with attempting to kill yourself, and also with stabbing Selina Ford"—he then made this statement, which I wrote down—(Read: "I, William Dash, aged 29, now an inmate of the London Hospital, state as follows:—That at about 2 a.m., of the 12th instant, a quarrel took place between Selina Ford and me. She threatened when I came home from work about a quarter past 11 p.m. We then had some words; she was in a beer-shop with a man. I asked her to come home, but she would not. I pushed her. Got home about 2 a.m.; had more words. She left the house, I fetched her back; she was then nearly drunk, and said she would get drunk when she liked. She was going to leap out of the window. I pulled her back. She took my pocket-knife, which was on the table; I took it from her. She was about to leave the house again, and in the struggle I saw she was wounded, and I then stabbed myself three times."—I took that and read it to Selina Ford, who was in another part of the hospital—she made a statement

to me, which I also took down—I then went to the prisoner's bedside and read over to him what Sclina Ford said; this is the statement—(Read: "I, Selina Ford, aged 29, lived with William Dash as man and wife about nine months. About 11 p.m. on the 9th instant I was in the Clyde public-house, Commercial Road. Dash was passing, when he saw me in there; he said 'Come home.' I said 'All right, wait a minute.' He said 'If you don't I will make you.' I said 'I sha'n't go at all for you.' He pushed and hit me in the mouth. A policeman was near, I said 'I will give him in charge;' he said 'I shall not take him, I will take you if you don't go home; never mind him.' I went down to the beer-shop at the corner of Star Street; both entered with other persons known to us. At 12 at night we took a pot of beer and went home. We then had a quarrel. I left the room; he ran after me into the landlady's back room, where he stabbed me. I said 'Bill, you have killed me.' He said, 'You have made me do it; kiss me.' I did. I ran into the street. I saw him plunge the knife into himself I fell, and two men picked me up. I did not see any knife until I was stabbed. Selina Ford, + her mark."—She afterwards said "I hope he will not be punished."—I read that to Dash, and he said Ford did see the knife previous to his stabbing her—when he was charged at the station, he said that he did it, that he deserved punishment, and he wished the case to be got over—that was what made him come out of the hospital before he was ordered—he came out on the Sunday instead of the Tuesday.

Prisoner. He did not know my meaning when I said I had done it and I deserved punishment. I said I had stabbed myself, and the Lord had punished me for it; he was punishing me for it.

WILLIAM LEAPINGWELL . I am house-surgeon at the London Hospital—on 10th July I was called, and found the prosecutrix suffering from a stab in the chest, between the third and fourth ribs, penetrating into the lungs—it was a dangerous wound for some time, and must have been given with some degree of violence—she is perfectly well now—the wound could have been caused by this knife—I also examined the prisoner; he had three wounds, two in the chest and one under the arm-pit—one of the wounds pierced the lungs—that might have been done with this knife also—he was in danger for some time—I saw him at Arbour Square about ten days ago, and I did not consider he was well then—he went out before I told him to.

Prisoner's Defence. I don't see how I could want to stab Selina Ford, when she was going to jump out of the window, and I tried to save her life; and if she did not have some bad thoughts in her head, why should she take the knife off the table? If I had let her jump out of window there would have been no blame, I should not have been here.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-657
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

657. WILLIAM DASH was again indicted for unlawfully attempting to kill and murder himself.

MR. MOODY conducted the Prosecution.

WILLIAM GUILFOYLE (Policeman K 190). On 10th July, about 2.45, in the morning, I heard screams in Devonshire Street—I saw the prisoner in the street—he had a knife in his hand, and he was bleeding from the chest—he gave me the knife, which I produced in the last case—he said "I have stabbed my wife, and myself three times; I don't care for myself; but I hope she will get over it; God forgive me"—the knife was closed when he gave it me; but it had marks of blood on it—I took him to the hospital.

JOHN ROUSE (Police Inspector K). I went to the London Hospital, and saw

the prisoner—I told him I had come to take his statement—he made a statement, which I took down in writing—this was part of it: "She was about to leave the house again, and I saw she was wounded, and I then stabbed myself three times"—I read it over to him, and he signed it—on the Sunday he was brought from the hospital and charged; he said "I did it, and I deserve punishment; I am anxious that the case should be settled."

Prisoner. On both those occasions when he came to me I was in a very low state, and did not know what I did say. Witness. He was in a low state; but he knew what he said as well as he does now.

WILLIAM LEAPINGWELL . I found the prisoner suffering from a punctured wound in the chest, puncturing the lungs between the third and fourth ribs, one just below that, and one under his arm-pit—he was in danger for ten days or a fortnight—the punctured wound must have been done with a considerable degree of violence.

GUILTY Four Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-658
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

658. ALFRED REYNOLDS (23) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Arthur Yeldham, and stealing therein four pairs of boots and other articles, his property.

MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution.

THOMAS WILCOX (Policeman T 251). On the morning of 28th July, about 5.15, I was in the Great Western Road, Kensington—I saw the prisoner carrying this bundle on his shoulder—I asked him what he had got in it—he said they were some things he was going to carry to a female institution—there is one near there—I said "Let me see," and I took it off his shoulder, put it on the footpath, and opened it—there was a coat, three table cloths, two covers, a shawl, and other things—I said they were men's things, and not likely to be taken to a female institution—he said "All right, I had them from a Mrs. Riley, at 2, Castlenau Villas," and he said his name was Reynolds; but after that he said "My name is not Reynolds, I sha'n't give you my name and address," in consequence of getting other people into trouble as well as himself—he said "I have been made a dupe of by other men"—I found a paper in the pocket of the coat, relating to some brandy had in at Mr. Yeldman's house—I took him to the station.

ALICE SCUDDER . I live at Mr. Arthur Yeldman's, 50, King Street, West minster—the things in this bundle are his; they are worth 5l. altogether—I saw them safe on 27th July, about 11.15 at night—I went down stairs about 7.15 next morning, and found the house had been broken open, the shutters and the windows wide open, and the things taken—I shut the windows and barred the shutters inside the night before.

WILLIAM BROOKER (Detective Sergeant T). On 28th July I received information, and examined the premises—Mr. Yeldman gave me this coat and knife, and showed me the window where the thief had entered—I went with her to Kensington Station, and she was shown these things by the inspector.

ALICE SCUDDER (re-examined). I identify this coat, which the prisoner was wearing, as Mr. Yeldman's.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate: "I met three respectablydressed men near Turnham Green; they asked me to have a glass of ale. I consented. They asked me to convey the parcel to Hackney, told me to take off my coat and put on that coat, and they would give me my coat back when I delivered the parcel."

Prisoner's Defence. I came in possession of the articles in the way you have just read. I am innocent of it, or of any idea that the things were stolen.


He further PLEADED GUILTY to having been before convicted in January, 1869, in the name of William Thrower— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-659
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

659. HENRY THOMAS HESTER (28), PLEADED GUILTY to stealing nine dozen pairs of socks, and other articles, of Charles Frederick Gross— Nine Months' Imprisonment.

THIRD COURT.—Tuesday, August 16th, 1870.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-660
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

660. WILLIAM KEY (20) , Robbery, with violence, on Maurice Rudoff, and stealing a watch and chain, and a necktie, his property.

MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution.

MAURICE RUDOFF . I am a tailor, of 9, Duncan Street—on 23rd July, about midnight, I was going down Petticoat Lane—the prisoner came up and caught hold of my coat sleeve, and asked me for some money for beer, I said "I won't give you any"—he knocked me down on the pavement, and kicked me with his boot till blood ran from my mouth—I got up and walked away—he followed me down Whitechapel, knocked me down again, and caught hold of my watch and chain—I called out "Police!"—a crowd came round, and he ran away—I got up and went to the station—I walked about till 2 o'clock in the morning, but could not see him—I was looking for him with a policeman on Sunday, and I saw him sitting in a public-house—he came behind me, and gave me a blow on the ear—I was frightened and went out the back way—I got a policeman, and gave him in custody—in the course of the struggle on Saturday my watch was broken; the chain was broken in three pieces.

Prisoner. I have known him this last six months, he kicked me in the neck, and left me bleeding. I saw him on the Sunday, and asked him what he struck me for, and I made a blow at him; he took out a knife to me.

Witness. I never had a knife in my pocket; I never carry one.

JOSEPH TANS . I am a traveller, at 2, Goulstone Street—on Saturday evening, 23rd July, I saw a crowd in the street—I found Rudoff on the ground; the prisoner had him by the neck, and had got his watch in his hand—Rudoff took it away from him.

JOHN REEVE (Policeman H R 16). I took the prisoner—the prosecutor charged him with assault and robbery—he said "All right"—on the way to the station he said "I did not assault him, but the prosecutor and several others assaulted me"—at the station he asked the prosecutor not to charge him, and he would pay for whatever he had lost, and he said he had no intention of robbing him.

COURT. Q. Was there anything lost? A. A necktie—I did not find it on the prisoner, or at his lodgings—he lodged at a common lodging-house—I went to his employers, and inquired about him, and they said he had been at work there, on and off, for the last five weeks.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-661
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

661. JOHN HAYES (45) , Feloniously receiving a watch, the property of Henry Masterman, well knowing the same to have been stolen.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. F. H. LIWIS the Defence.

HENRY MASTERMAN . I am a solicitor, at 26, Austin Friars—on Saturday, 23rd July, I was at Wimbledon—I had a gold watch with me worth 14l. or 15l.—I missed it at the Wimbledon Station, on my return home, about 8.40—I had seen it safe about ten minutes before—it had been attached to a chain, which I found hanging down—I did not see the prisoner at the station.

HENRY SMITH . I am assistant to Mrs. Barker, pawnbroker, 91, Houndsditch—on Monday, 25th July, the prisoner came and pawned a watch for 5l. 10s., in the name of John Allen, 6, New Street—I gave information to the police the same day.

ANTHONY WILSON MONGER (City Detective). I was in Mrs. Barker's shop with a man named Fluister, and saw this watch pledged by the prisoner—from what Mr. Smith said we followed him—I told him I should apprehend him on suspicion of stealing a gold watch at Wimbledon, on Saturday, the 23rd, the same watch that he had pawned on the Monday—he said "I pawned a watch on Monday, and you saw roe pawn it"—I asked him where be got it—he said "A man named Allen gave it to me, a betting man"—I asked him where he could be found—he said he did not know, unless it was at some of the places that betting men frequented—all that he knew was that he came from Birmingham—he gave a correct address.

Cross-examined. Q. You knew the prisoner, did not you? A. Yes, as a betting man, and he knew me—it was on the 25th I saw him pawning the watch—I will not say that I did not see him on the 26th, I might, and I might not—he spoke to me when I went into the shop, and when I took him on this charge he reminded me that I had seen him pawn it—he offered to go to Fleet Street with me to find Allen—he said that Allen wanted him to pawn the watch because he wanted to make a bet.

Witness for the Defence.

ERICUS WILLIAM HALE . I am traveller for Messrs. Barker & Sons, vine distillers, of Bishopsgate Street—I have known the prisoner going into different public-houses—I have a slight recollection of a person named Allen—I don't know him particularly—on Saturday, 25th July, I was going through Primrose Street to a customer—I met the prisoner—he had promised me previously to take me to a customer over the water—he disappointed me several times—I upbraided him for not taking me there—he said he would take me on Monday—we went into the Grapes and had a glass of ale together, and he promised to meet me on the Monday morning at 11 o'clock—I met a man on the Monday, and we went to the Crown in Liverpool Street—the prisoner came in there—there was a conversation between the prisoner and the other man—I did not see a watch pass—the prisoner left the public-house and came back again, and they had some more conversation together—I told the prisoner I could not wait any longer, and I left—that is all I know about this.

Cross-examined. Q. All you can say is that the prisoner frequents public-houses, and was talking to a man named Allen? A. Yes—I know a person named Allen.

GUILTY .— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-662
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

662. MARY ELIZABETH STRATTON (17) , Unlawfully endeavouring to conceal the birth of her child.

MR. F. H. LEWIS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. PATER the Defence.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-663
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

663. JAMES HURLEY (19) , Robbery, with violence, with others, on Hermann Lopez, and stealing a watch and a cap, his property.

MR. KELLEY conducted the Prosecution.

HERMANN LOPEZ . I am a seaman, and live at 87, Pennington Street, St. George's—about 10.30 on 24th July I was in Ship Alley—some men came up, knocked me down, and robbed me of my cap and watch, which was worth 2l.—the prisoner was one of them—they ran away—I ran after them, and kept the prisoner in sight—I caught him—he kicked me, and I gave him in custody—I have not found my watch.

COURT. Q. Had you been drinking? A. Yes—I was not drunk.

GILES PETTIT (Policeman H 23). On 24th July, about 11.20, the prisoner was given into my custody by Lopez, who complained of being knocked down, his watch having been stolen—the prosecutor's cap was taken, and the hat of a witness who has gone to sea—I said "If you know the man run after him and catch him, and he caught hold of the prisoner"—I asked him if he was sure he was the person, and he said "Quite sure"—I asked the prisoner if he had got the watch—he said no, he knew nothing about it.

Prisoner. The policeman knows me as a hard working chap. Witness. I have known him as working down the yard—when I went up there were six or seven men about, but I did not see the prisoner.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-664
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

664. JAMES JOHNSON (18) , Stealing one watch and one chain of John Lynch, from his person.

MR. KELLEY conducted the Prosecution.

JOHN LTNCH . I am a tailor, of 30, Camomile Street—about 12 o'clock on 31st July, I was in Duke Street—the prisoner and another man followed me—the prisoner snatched my watch and chain from my waistcoat pocket—I followed him, and never lost sight of him till he was caught by a policeman—this (produced) is a portion of my chain—the value of the watch and chain was thirty guineas.

Prisoner. Q. You say you never lost sight of me; what did I do with your watch? A. I don't know, ask the man who was with you—I did not see you give him anything—I was coming up Duke Street, and you were following.

JESSE GRANT . I Jive at 5, Rutland Street, Whitechapel—about 11.30 o'clock, on 31st July, I was standing at the corner of the Minories, talking to a friend—I saw the prisoner and another man, following the prosecutor—they followed him into Duke Street—I afterwards heard cries of "Stop thief!" and saw him running after the prisoner.

THOMAS VENESS (City Policeman 709). On Sunday night, 31st July, I was at the corner of the Minories—I heard cries of "Stop thief!" apparently in New Square—I went down a passage leading into New Square, and saw the prisoner running across the square towards the Minories—I stopped him, and asked him what he was running for—he said "The boy struck me first; the boy I was fighting with"—the prosecutor came up and gave him in charge for stealing his watch and chain—I searched him at the station, but found nothing on him—he gave a false address.

WILLIAM BALDWIN (City Policeman 735). About 2.30, on the morning of 1st August, I was in Duke Street—I found this portion of a chain tying in the carriage way.

Prisoner's Defence. I was going home, and the policeman took me.

GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-665
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment

Related Material

665. GEORGE EVANS (22), and SAMUEL EVANS (20) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Charles Panzer, and stealing therein six coats, four pairs of trowsers, and other articles, his property.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution.

CHARLES PANZER . I occupy two parlours, at 34, Rowland Street—on the morning of 11th August, about 3.30, I heard the bell ringing—I went down and saw the police—from what was said I searched, and missed six coats, four pairs of trowsers, three jackets, a waistcoat, and a tablecloth, worth about 10l. altogether, from the front parlour—they were all safe the night before, when I shut up—when I went to bed I left the parlour window a little way open at the top—the lower window was shut down—this property (produced) is mine.

JOSEPH DEATH (Policeman E 166). About 2 o'clock on the morning of 11th August, I saw the two prisoners in Howland Street, and Samuel was carrying a bundle—I followed them to 20, Union Street—they stopped there, and Samuel put down the bundle he was carrying—I asked them what they had got, and they said "A bundle of old clothes"—I asked where they got them, they said "At the King's Head public-house, Bow"—I asked if they knew the person they bought them from—they said they could not tell me—Samuel said they gave 27s. for them—I took them to the station, and George said he gave 25s. for them—I found a knife on Samuel, and a latch-key on George.

EDWIN CHAPELL (Police Sergeant E 25). The prisoners were brought to the station about 2.45—I asked Samuel what he had in the bundle—he said "Three coats, and two or three pairs of trowsers"—I sent George in the yard, and asked Samuel where he had bought them—he said at the King's Head, at Bow"—he said he gave 27s. for them to a Jew, and he refused to give me his name and address—I went to the prosecutor's house, and found an entry had been made by the parlour window by climbing over the railings—there were marks of dirt on the window sill—the blind was on the floor—the door leading to the passage was looked—I read the charge over to the prisoners, and Samuel said "You can't say it is a burglary, nobody saw us get in."

Samuel's Defence. I am only guilty of unlawful possession; I gave 27s. for them.


George Evans was further charged with having been before convicted.

JOSEPH KING . I produce a certificate (Read: "Guildhall, Westminster, George Buffer, convicted of burglary. May, 1860.—Penal Servitude, Four Years")—the prisoner George is the man—I was present at his trial, and had him in my charge afterwards—I have no doubt about him—he was fifteen years old at that time.

George Evans. I never was in such a place as this before in my life.

GUILTY.**— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.

SAMUEL EVANS— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-666
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

666. JOHN TAYLOR (26) , Stealing 2s. 6d. of Catherine Leary, from her person.

MR. WOOD conducted the Prosecution.

CATHERINE LEARY . I live at 11, John Street, Cannon Street Road—on 4th August, about 5.30, I was on Tower Hill, near the Tower Subway—I saw the prisoner close to me, and felt a hand in my pocket—I had a half-crown and a shilling in my pocket—I had seen them safe two minutes before, because I put my handkerchief down on them—I looked down, and

he pulled his hand away, and walked off—I missed the half-crown—Jane Cuttenden was with me—I told a constable—he took me to a public-house, and I pointed out the prisoner—that was about three minutes after—I could tell him by his moustache and whiskers—he is the same man.

JANE CUTTENDEN . I live at 9, Lower Well Alley, Wapping—about 5 o'clock, on the morning of 4th August, I was with the last witness, standing near the Subway—I saw the prisoner put his hand against her pocket—I looked down, and he moved his hand away—he kept there two or three minutes, and moved away—I did not notice where he went to—we spoke to a policeman, and went with him to a public-house, where I saw the prisoner—he is the same man I had seen with his hand against the pocket.

DAVID BELL (City Policeman 740). On the night of the 4th August, some time after 5 o'clock, the prosecutor and last witness came to me and described a man—I took them to the Tithe public-house, and they identified the prisoner—I had not seen him go in—the house was full of customers—I asked if they could identify the man, and the prosecutrix pointed out the prisoner—I took him to the station—he was charged, and said "No"—I found two shillings on him, a farthing, and a knife.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-667
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence

Related Material

667. EDWARD NED (22), (a black), Feloniously wounding Julius Wriedt, with intent to do grievous bodily harm.

MR. HORACE BROWN conducted the Prosecution.

JULIUS WRIBDT . I live at 34, Betta Street, St. George's, and am a seaman—on Sunday evening, 17th July, I was standing opposite my door, reading a newspaper—three darkies came up, two with glazed caps, and one with a cluese-cutter—I said to a young girl "There is Jolly coming up the street"—one of them slewed round and said "What have you got to do with it?"—we told them to go away, and I walked alongside this young woman—one of them came up and kicked me, and I did not feel the knife go into me then—I went home, and found I was stabbed in the left breast—a man with a glazed cap on kicked me—I did not know I was stabbed till I felt the pain afterwards—I only had to go about two steps to get home—the man who kicked me was the smallest of the three.

Prisoner. I was not the man.

MABY COLLINS . I am the wife of Dennis Collins, and live at 38, Betts Street—I heard this row, and went out into the crowd—I saw the prisoner kick Wriedt, and he ran like this, and stabbed him in the left breast with a penknife—I saw the knife in his hand—I could not tell where he got it from.

COURT. You said before the Magistrate "I saw him take out the knife from his pocket, and open if." Witness. I could not see where he got it from—I saw it in his hand.

MORRIS MICHEL . I live at 34, Betts Street—on Sunday evening, 17th July, about 10.15, I heard this row, and went out—I saw two dark chaps, the prisoner and another—I saw something in the prisoner's hand, which I believed to be a sword stick—it was something like steel—I went in the house and said "Jolly's in danger, I believe they have got knives out"—the prisoner rushed at him with what he had in his hand, and he kicked him—I can't say whether he stabbed him; but he rushed at him with his hand to his breast.

Prisoner. When I came up the row was over, and they said I was not the man.

LOUISA BARTSCH . I am the wife of Odo Bartson, and live at 34, Betts Street—I heard this row, and came out in consequence—Michel came into my house and said "Jolly's in danger"—I went out, and saw the prisoner and prosecutor having a row together—the prisoner kicked him—there were three darkies there, he was the smallest—he had something in his fist, and he knocked the man in the chest at the same time as he kicked him—there were two dark men besides the prisoner—one ran away at first, and the other went for assistance.

JOSEPH METCHAN . I live at 120, Cable Street—on this Sunday night I was in Betts Street—I saw the prisoner there, with two more like him—I saw Mr. Wriedt there—they were rowing—I went up—I saw the prisoner pull out a knife and strike the prosecutor just about the breast.

Prisoner. The boy is wrong, I had no knife on me.

JAMES THORALD (Policeman H 30). At 10 o'clock on this Sunday evening I was in Betts Street—I saw the prisoner—he was stopped before I got up—I took him to the station and searched him, and found this knife in his waistcoat pocket, open, and some fresh blood on it—at the time I apprehended him he said he did not do it.

Prisoner. When the policeman took me he asked me if I had a knife, and I said I had it to cut some tobacco. Witness. I found no tobacco on him.

GEORGE PHILLIPS . I am a surgeon, and live in Spital Square—on Sunday, 17th inst, I was called to the Lime Street Police Station, and examined the prosecutor—he had a wound on his left breast, about three inches from the nipple, and there was a great welling of blood under the skin, which placed his life in danger—a knife was produced at the police-station, with wet blood on it—it was such a weapon as would have caused this wound.

JOHN GALES (Policeman H 56). The prisoner was brought to the station—he said to me "If I tell you anything, will you say?'—I said "No"—he said "I stabbed the man in the left breast with a knife; and I would stab b——white man in a row if I got hold of him."

Prisoner. I never said that.

Prisoner's Defence. I had no knife on me; a man that was working with me lent it to me to cut tobacco.

GUILTY of unlawfully wounding — Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

OLD COURT.—Wednesday, August 17th, 1870.

Before Mr. Baron Martin.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-668
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

668. HENRY BANKS (34), JOHN HARRIS (30), and JULIUS LAWRENCE (39) , Unlawfully obtaining 50l. and 55l. of the Earl of Romney and others, by false pretences.

MESSRS. METCALFE and JELP conducted the Prosecution; MR. STRAIGHT appeared for Banks, MR. ST. AUBYN for Harris, and MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH for Lawrence.

JOHN HILL . I am a confectioner, of Market Street, Guildford—last November I was in pecuniary difficulties, and was recommended to the prisoner Banks—I saw him at his office, 2 A, Wells Street, Cripplegate—he is an accountant—I told him that I was in difficulties, and he said that he could get me through the Bankruptcy Court for 5l.; but I should have to go into Whitecross Street Prison—an appointment was made to meet him at his house that night, which I did; and signed a plain paper which he

produced—I believe this to be it—(produced)—one of the officers of the prison was there at the time—these other two signatures were put to it at his office, next day—(This was a consent to the plaintiff, Henry Banks, signing judgment for 20l. 5s. debt, and 1l. costs, signed John Hill, Henry Teece, and M. Beckett,. 18th, November, 1869)—The purport of that paper was not explained to me at all—I had never seen Teece or Beckett before—I owed no money to Banks—I had never seen him till the day before, and did not know who he was—I paid him 2l. 10s. the second day—we all three met by appointment, and Bates took us to the Peacock public-house, just opposite Whitecross Street Prison—while we were there a Sheriff's officer came and took as over to the prison—we spent the night there, and the next morning one of the officers told us we were wanted in the solicitor's room—we went there, and saw the prisoner Lawrence, who asked our names—I had never seen him before—he asked us to sign some papers, and this is my signature to these five sheets (produced)—they were all procured from me by Lawrence—there are more signatures of mine at the bottom of the accounts. (The petition of John Hill, dated 19th November, 1869, a prisoner in Whitecross Street, to be allowed to file a petition in Bankruptcy, was here put in, signed by John Hill, in the presence of J. Lawrence, solicitor, 50, Lincoln's Inn Fields.) I cannot say whether I saw Lawrence sign that. (The affidavit of John Hill, stating that he had not the means of paying the fees for his adjudication in bankruptcy, was here put in, also an affidavit of John Hill, stating that the allegations in his petition were true, and that his debts did not exceed 300l.) Mark Beckett and Henry Teece were in the room with me, and I saw them sign papers—I heard no explanation given to them of what they were signing—next day I went before the Bankruptcy Court, before Registrar Bacon—I do not know Henry Brooks, of Chatham, who was mentioned as my detaining creditor—I owed no one the sum of 24l.; my largest debt was 22l.; 6s. 1d., to Bassett & Co., of Sheffield. (The witness's deposition, before Registrar Reche, stated that he was imprisoned at the suit of Henry Brooks, of Chatham, for a debt of 24l., and that judgment was obtained against him in the Court of Common Pleas.) The deposition is all true, except as to Mr. Brooks and his debt, and there was no judgment against me in the Common Pleas—Harris made out my accounts in bankruptcy; I saw him write them—he also made out my list of creditors—Harrris was with Mr. Banks, in his office; he was his clerk, I suppose. (In the list of creditors appeared the name "Brooks, H., Chatham, 24l."). I did not tell Harris that Henry Brooks was to be put into the list, I did not know the name; I gave him the list of my creditors, but not that one—after I had been before Mr. Registrar Roche, I got out of prison the same day, as no one opposed me—I saw no one there but Mr. Banks; he answered the questions which the Registrar, I suppose it was, asked—my bankruptcy proceeded, and I got my final discharge—Beckett, and Teece, and myself, were taken before the deputy-governor, and none of us knew who our detaining creditor was—after my first hearing, I think it was in December, Banks told me that there was a society for the relief of debtors, and he believed I should get a donation of 50l. or 60l., and would try and get it for me—after my discharge two petitions were drawn up in Banks' office, one by him and one by the boy—it was obliged to be presented in duplicate—this is it (This was dated February 22nd, 1870, to the President and Governors of the Society for the Discharge and Relief of Persons in Prison for Debt, signed John Hill,

and stating that he was a prisoner for debt in Whtiecross Street, and had a wife in, delicate health, and five children under fourteen years of aye, entirely dependent upon him, and requesting help to the amount of 60l.")—Banks said "If I get you 50l. you will give me 5l."—I said "Yes"—he said "If I get you 60l. you will give me 10l."—I said "Yes"—on the day the petition was drawn up I saw Harris in Banks' office, and went from there with him to a public-house—I was telling him how badly I was off, and the position I was in, and he said "You will be sure to get the charity, for I have had it myself," and he showed me a letter he had from the secretary of the society, to say that the cheque was ready for him—he said that he would do what he could do for me, and would write out my petition, and do what he could—I said "If you do anything for me, and I get (60l., I will give you a sovereign, independently of what I give Mr. Banks"—I took these two petitions to Mr. Lund, the secretary of the society, in Craven Street, and afterwards received a cheque for 50l. from the society, which I took to Coutts', and got it cashed—when I came out of Coutts', Banks and Harris were standing at the door, and Banks said "Have you got the money? what have you got?"—I said "I have got 50l."—he said "You have got to give me 5l."—I said "Will you come in somewhere?"—he said "No, we can settle our business in the street"—it was raining very heavily—I gave him 5l., and he said "Give Harris a sovereign"—I said "No, I cannot; I have only got 50l."—when I left Banks, Harris came up to me, and said that I had got to give him a sovereign—I told him I should not give it to him, I had only got 50l., and I promised him one if I got 60l.—this was on 4th March—I afterwards received this letter from Harris, but I cannot swear to his writing.

GEORGE WILLIAM READER . I was a clerk in Banks' office, and was there some time with Harris—this letter is in his writing.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. How long were you in the office with Harris? A. Five months—I used to write sometimes, and to take letters occasionally (Letter read: "March 5, 1870. To John Hill: Sir,—I am surprised at your refusing yesterday to pay me the 1l. arranged, and unless you do so at once I shall see your creditors, and get the bankruptcy annulled, and shall explain the particulars; I am not in the habit of being humbugged, and shall not allow you to do so with impunity. J. Harris.")

JOHN HILL Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. You really were in pecuniary difficulties; you had not got a shilling in the world? A. No—I could not have paid for any stamps or fees in the Bankruptcy Court—I have said in regard to these documents, "I did not know what I was writing, nor did I care"—I wanted to get through the Court as quick as I could; I did not know what to do—I did not know till I went to Banks' that I must be arrested, I knew it then—I knew how many creditors I had, but I cannot tell you exactly; I know I owed about 130l.—I did very little business at Hounslow—I knew nothing of the Society for the Relief of Debtors till after I came out of prison—all the particulars in my petition are perfectly correct except the five children under fourteen; there are only four under fourteen.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. How many times were you in Banks' office? A. About half-a-dozen—Harris acted in the capacity of clerk, but I did not see him when I first went, it was some little time after—he was generally writing—both Banks and Harris said that I should be sure to go the charity, they both said that they had got it—it was Banks

that told me about the Society and that he had got 50l. or 60l. for some one else, but Harris said he had got it himself, and showed me the letter—I saw that at Guildhall—Harris had nothing to do with writing my petition, but he wrote out the accounts at my dictation.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Did you know that he had added the name of Brooks to them? A. No.

RICHARD JAMES PAWLEY . I am Deputy Registrar of the Lord Mayor's Court—I produce the proceedings from the files of the Court in "Banks v. Hill and others"—the proecipe is dated 18th November, 1869; the consent to judgment is signed J. Hill, Henry Teece, and Mark Beckett, as for a joint debt—the next is a docket filed at the Court on signing judgment—(This was for debt 20l. 5s., and costs 1l. Judgment signed the same day.)—The execution ca. ca., appears to have been issued the same day—this fourth document is the order for entering up judgment, and execution would necessarily follow—all the documents appear to be on the same day.

COURT. Q. Was that a common transaction? A. The proceedings seem to me to be perfectly regular—it was Henry Banks in person—I did not suspect anything at the time; we could not tell what was going to follow.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Are there a very large number of judgments by consent in the course of the year? A. A great number, you may say a thousand.

MR. METCALFE. Q. How many have there been in this case of Banks? A. A great number—I do not think there have been any since the beginning of this year.

JOHN FITCH . I am Deputy Serjeant at Mace in the Mayor's Court, London, and am officer for executing judgments—on 18th November I received a ca. ca. against John Hills, Henry Teece, and Mark Beckett, from Mr. Banks' office—(Read: "Signed 'Henry Banks,' and endorsed 'Levy, 22l. 5s.'")—when I received that document, I went, by instructions, from Banks' office to the public-house opposite Whitecross Street Prison, and found the three prisoners that were to be there—I walked over with them to Whitecross Street and lodged them at the prison—I produce the authority for their discharge—(Read: "Dated 20th November, 1869, and signed 'Henry Banks.'")—I also took in custody a number of other people, and have all the warrants here, my brother took the greater part of them—I arrested Robert Savage, George Everest, John Colman, and Joseph Barker—these are the writs—Barker is sued alone; the writ is to levy 21l. 5s.—the next writ is "Henry Banks v. John Sparks "for 22l.—the next is "Banks v. Edward Couch," dated 25th November, 1869, to levy 22l.—I took those writs from Banks and Harris—here are twenty-seven besides those I have handed in, and some of them contain the names of two or three defendants.

COURT. Q. In the Lord Mayor's Court is there any rule requiring the writ to be endorsed by an attorney? A. No, it is the plaintiff in person—here is a blank left for the attorney's name, which is struck out.

MR. METCALFE. Q. As to these eight which you have handed in, did you arrest them all at the Peacock? A. Either inside or outside the Peacock, and I took them all over in the same friendly way.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Did it not strike you as strange that there should be the same plaintiff in so many actions? A. It did strike me, there being so many writs in the same office—I used to execute them all at the Peacock—the appointment was mode for me there, and in the parlour I found the gentlemen waiting to be shipped over the way.

BENJAMIN CONSTABLE . I am Governor of Whitecross Street—debtors have to be lodged with me when brought in—I have the warrant for detaining Mark Beckett, John Hill, and Henry Teece, lodged on 18th November, at the suit of Henry Banks—the affidavit is sworn before me, and then an order is received from the Court of Bankruptcy, and they go up to the Court—I also received George Everest, Bartholomew Sylvester Sainsbury, and Edward Couch, at the suit of Henry Banks; Robert Savage, at the suit of Henry Banks; William James Barker, at the suit of Henry Banks; and John Sparks and William Cotterell, at the same suit—the defendants in the suits appeared before me to swear to their affidavits—the attorney did not attend before me—I referred to the petitions to see who the attorney was, and can tell you by the attestation—the attestation it not made before me, but it is exhibited before me—every one of those petitions is attested "J. Lawrence, 51, Lincoln's Inn Fields," as the attorney—I do not swear the affidavit unless the petition is attached—I only saw those people in the prison, when they came to my office to be sworn and discharged—I have seen Banks there, but I cannot say that I have seen the other prisoner there at all—I remain in my office, and persons are brought to me.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. I believe you have been abolished? A. Yes, Whitecross Street is done away, and another prison substituted—Banks was a prisoner there, in the early part of 1868, I think—he was a bankrupt in formd pauperis, and was there six weeks or two months—I know him perfectly well—he was in the habit of coming to the prison after he was discharged—Hill, Cooper, and a good many others did the same, acting as accountants—I allowed them to come into the prison, I had no rule against it.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Was Harris also under your care last year? A. Yes, as a debtor, for I should think two months—I have heard that after his discharge he was employed by Banks as his clerk; but I do not know it of my own knowledge—Banks has not asked me to let him come in and act in that capacity for him.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Is it a common thing for solicitors to go there and attest the papers of bankrupts? A. Yes, in a room appointed for the purpose—exactly the same form is gone through both in formd pauperis and when they find their own stamps.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Do you mean that other solicitors bring them ready cut and dried? A. I cannot say that—it is a petition stating that the man is actually in custody, and it is not supposed to be signed at the time.

MARK BECKETT . I am a basket maker, of Hammersmith—I was recommended to Mr. Banks in November last, and went to see him at his office in Wells Street—he agreed to take me through the Court for 5l., and said that I should have to go into prison, and if I liked to go in then, there were some more going in—I did not want to go in quite so soon, and I went on the Thursday afterwards, and found Hill and Teece there, waiting for me—I signed a paper at the office—I did not read it; but this is my signature to this paper (The consent to signing judgment, previously read)—we then all three went to the Peacock, and were taken from there into the prison—we were all three sent for next day into the solicitor's room, and I believe I saw Lawrence there; but am not certain—he asked me if my name was Mark Beckett—I said "Yes," and he asked me to sign some papers, and I signed them—I did not see whether they were filled up, and I did not know

what I was signing—this is my signature to these two other papers—(The petition for adjudication, which was attested by "J. Lawrence, solicitor," and the witness's affidavit, stating that he was a pauper)—Next day I went before the Bankruptcy Court, and answered some questions which the Registrar put to me—(The witness's examination, dated 20th November, 1869, before Registrar Roche, was then put in, in which he stated that his detaining creditor was George Wilkins, of Claverton Street, Pimlico, who had obtained judgment against him in the Queen's Bench for 24l.)—It is not true that George Wilkins was my detaining creditor—I know no one of that name living in Claverton Street, Pimlico—I had a debt of over 24l.; but that was to a Mr. Robey—he was pressing me; but no action in the Queen's Bench was brought to recover it—I saw Banks when I was before the Registrar; but I did not hear him say anything—I was taken to the prison, and got out the same day—as I went out I was asked who my detaining creditor was; but I did not know—the bankruptcy proceeded, and I got my final order of discharge—I think I first heard from Hill about the society for the relief of poor debtors—I went to Banks' office about other affairs, and it was mentioned—Mr. Banks said he would write my petition out, and he did so—he told me he had presented it; but I went to the society to ask, and found he had not—I then went to Banks'; but he was not in—I asked the boy to let me see my petition, and I took a copy of it—I afterwards saw Banks, and told him my petition had not gone in—he said that there was something wrong, and that eight more were sent back—I got no money from the society—before I was examined by the gentlemen who represent the society, Harris gave me this piece of paper—(Read: "George Wilkins, Claverton Street, Pimlico, 29l. 10s.; money lent")—Banks and Harris were then together, and Banks told me I should have to mention Mr. Wilkins' name—they asked me the name of my creditor, I could not answer them, and they said that I had better take that piece of paper; but it was not of service to me before the gentlemen, as they did not ask me about George Wilkins—I do not know Harris's writing—he was sitting at a desk, as if he was writing, and he handed it to me just as I was coming out—he and Banks were both together.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Did you go with the friend who recommended you to him? A. Yes—he did not stand apart and have a private conversation with Banks—I said before the Magistrate, "I will not swear my friend did not have a private conversation"—I was in great pecuniary difficulty; I had no money to pay for any legal charges at all; I had the officers after me, and I went to Mr. Banks for advice—Banks did not say that it was desirable to include me with the other men in one judgment, in order to save money—the Registrar asked me one or two questions; I do not think he asked me all that appears on this examination, I cannot say—my memory is pretty good at times.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Was not Harris acting as clerk to Mr. Banks? A. I did not see him there till I had been there once or twice—when I first saw him he was not acting as clerk, he was walking about—I do not recollect seeing him writing—the boy answered the door—it was Banks who told me something about the name of Wilkins.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Had you seen the prisoners at Banks' the day before they were brought to the prison? A. No—Mr. Banks put one paper before me to sign—I do not know whether he had other papers before him—I did not read them—I cannot tell whether the

papers I saw in Mr. Lawrence's hands were those I saw the day before at Mr. Banks'.

HENRY TEECE . I am a dentist, of Chester—I became bankrupt, and went to Mr. Banks' office, and signed this paper, with Mark Beokett—this is my signature—I went with Beckett and Hill to a public-house opposite Whitecross Street Prison, and then went over to the prison—I saw Lawrence, the attorney, next day, and signed some papers, and made some affidavits before the governor, I believe—I went up to the Bankruptcy Court, and was whitewashed, and made a free man—I signed this deposition, and swore to it—I state there that I was in prison at the suit of Henry Thompson, of Lower Thames Street, and that I owed him 32l.—I never saw Henry Thompson, and did not owe 32l. to any gentleman in Lower Thames Street, for money lent—there was no judgment against me in the Queen's Bench, that I am aware of—I am described as living at 134, Fulham Road, Brompton; that is untrue; I lived at Chester, but I have taken a lodging opposite Euston station—I was before the Registrar of the Bankruptcy Court, and saw Banks there—I then went back to prison, and was discharged, after which Banks told me about the society—I went there, but did not get anything—nobody told me that Lawrence would be at the prison next morning—I wrote this letter to Banks—(This enclosed a list of creditors, signed "H. Teece")—That list did not include the name of Thompson—I received this letter in reply (Read: "Dear sir, You will require to go into Whitecross Street under a friendly arrest. The whole of the costs of passing you through the Court would be 5l. You would only want to be in London six hours, and in Whitecross Street thirty hours, Tours truly, H. Banks.")

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Had you known Banks some time? A. Yes, through being in prison—some Chancery proceedings got me there—I do not know whether he or Mr. Johnson memorialized the Chancellor, and got me out—I knew that I had to be arrested, but I did not know how—I had been there, and of course I was acquainted with the practice of the establishment—no petition was presented to the Insolvent Debtors' Relief Society.

ROBERT SAVAGE . I am a cab proprietor, of Sermon Lane, Liverpool Road—I went to Banks in October, and he said that he would take me through the Court for 5l.—he made out my accounts in his office, and I think I put my mark to it—I put my mark to another when I had been in prison two days—I believe this to be my cross to this paper—(This was a consent to the plaintiff", H. Banks, signing judgment against the defendant, R. Savage, for 20l.")—I went to the Peacock, and from there I was taken to the prison—on the second day they called me into a private room, and I saw Lawrence, who read a paper over to me, which I did not understand, and asked me to put my mark to it—this is it—(This was the witness's petition for adjudication, dated 6th October, 1869, signed by and witnessed by J. Lawrence, solicitor, 50, Lincoln's Inn Fields)—I saw Lawrence with a pen and ink in his hand, but I cannot tell what he wrote—after that I went before the Bankruptcy Court, and the little boy who worked for Mr. Banks appeared for me—the result was that I went back to prison, and was let out—I believe these five crosses to these five sheets to be mine—(This was the witness's examination before Registrar Murray, dated 8th October, 1869, in which he stated that he was imprisoned at the suit in the Queen's Bench, of Henry Brooks, of Southgate Road, on 5th October, for 5l., money lent)—I do not know any

person named Henry Brooks—I told Banks so, and he said that I must not forget the name—when I came out of prison he told me about the society, and I got 55l.—he wanted me to give him something out of it, but I did not—the prisoners did not prepare it, it was a young man who used to work with me—I got the cheque cashed at Coutts', and when I came out I saw Banks and Harris—Banks asked me what I was going to give him out of it—I said "I am going to make good use of it, and do the best I can to support my wife and family"—I would not give him any, and he sent a man to me two or three days afterwards.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Had you paid him anything? A. Yes, 3l. 10s.—he did not issue a writ against me for 5l. 5s., nothing of the sort—I had not known him before—Mr. Madden introduced me to him—he had been in pecuniary difficulties, and was just about going through Whitecross Street—he did not accompany me through.

GEORGE EVEREST . I live at Cherry Orchard Road, Croydon, and am a furniture dealer—I got into difficulties at the end of 1869, and in conesquence of some suggestions made to me by Mr. Banks I told him what I came for, and he asked me what amount I owed—I was to pay him 5l. to take me through—I went again on the Wednesday, and he said I was to come again next day, Thursday—I went again on the Thursday, the boy Reader, who was at the office, said "They are waiting for you up at Whitecross Street—I went there, to the Peacock, and signed a paper—I found a Sheriff's officer there, and went to Whitecross Street with three or four others, who I had never seen before—this is my signature to this second paper—I will not be sure whether Sainsbury signed with me—his signature is there and so is Coleman's—I had no joint or single debt with them—(This was dated December 8th, 1869, and signed George Everest, B. S. Sainsbury, and——Colcman, consenting to the plaintiff, Henry Banks, signing judgment against them far 20l., and 1l. costs.)—I did not see Lawrence till I saw him at Guildhall, that I know of—I was not aware that he described himself as attesting my petition, and being present when I signed it—I went before the Registrar and signed some papers—I do not know Henry Brooks, of Balls Pond Road, nor did I owe him 24l.—I gave a list of my creditors to Mr. Banks, but it did not contain the name of Brooks or Banks—Mr. Harris, I believe, made up my accounts and my ten days' statement—I furnished no other list—I did not know that at the end of list of creditors, the name of Banks, of Wells Street, is added for 21l., for money lent—on the afternoon I came out, Coleman told me about this society, and after I came out, Banks told me that there was a society, and he thought he should be able to get me some money, but he could not do anything then—he sent me to Craven Street to get a printed form, and when I came back he asked me to sign my name on two blank sheets of paper, the forms—I did not see them again, Banks presented them to the society, and I found them there when I was called before the society—before I went there Banks told me to say that Brooks was my detaining creditor, and that I was not to know him or Harris; never to have seen him, and not to know where his office was—Harris also said I was not to know him—I was to know Mr. Lawrence, and to remember he was my solicitor—when I went before the society they said "Who is your detaining creditor?" and I said "Mr. Brooks"—neither of the defendants were present—I did not get any money—(The petition was here put in, signed by the, witness, stating that he had a wife, and six children under fourteen years of age, and

that with the help of 60l. he could support his family, and giving references.)—I did not give Banks information what to put in the petition—I never knew what was in it.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Is it perfectly true that those gentlemen you referred to are known to you? A. Yes, they have known me a good many years—I was in very impoverished circumstances—I paid the legal fees by instalments—I paid Banks 2l. at first—I have a wife and six children, and I told Banks so, and gave him the names of the references—I went to the Society's office and had about two hours with Mr. Doyle, the solicitor, who put me through a cross-examination.

JOHN SPARKES . I am a harness maker, of Somers Town—I went through the Bankruptcy Court, and was a prisoner for twenty-eight days—I heard of Mr. Banks as a man who could carry me through the Court, and sent for him—he said he could carry me through for 5l. and I gave him 28s.—I signed this paper—(This was a content to a judgment for 21l. in "Henry Banks v. John Sparkes, Richard Savage, and—Cotterell")—I did not owe Banks 21l., and I did not know Savage or Cotterell—a little while afterwards I saw Lawrence, I do not know whether it was the same morning or the morning afterwards—I signed three or four documents in a little room, and was taken before the Registrar in a day or two.

Q. Your petition is attested by J. Lawrence, of Lincoln's Inn Fields, and your deposition represents you to be in custody at the suit of Philip Poile, who is said to carry on business at Drury Lane, who you owe 27l., did you know him? A. No—I know him now, I have seen him during the case—the judgment is said to have been in the Queen's Bench, but there was no judgment there against me—when I was discharged I petitioned the Society—neither of the prisoners had anything to do with that—I got nothing.

Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Did you know a friend who had a writ served upon him? A. Yes; Mr. Bigden, who is in Court—I took him to Banks, who recommended him to put himself in the hands of Mr. Lawrence, the solicitor.

WILLIAM JOSEPH BARKER . I am a cabinet-maker, of Hackney—in the latter part of last year I was in difficulties, and a friend of mine took me to Mr. Banks, in Lower Whitecross Street, nearly opposite the prison, he said "Is this the gentleman who wishes to go through the Court?"—I said "Yes"—he said that he would take me through for a sum of money, and I was to go there in two hours time—he said "How much is your debt, 300l.?" I said "No, not much over 100l."—he said "You will stand for the charity"—on the same day I saw Banks at his office, with Lawrence; a small paper was written out, and I put my name to it—(This was a consent for the plaintiff, H. Banks to enter judgment against W. J. Barker, defendant for 20l. 5s., and 1l. costs)—I paid Banks 50s., and signed a paper—a little while after that I was arrested and taken to prison—I see my signature to my petition (dated 16th November), and see Mr. Lawrence's name to the attestation clause, but I do not remember seeing him in prison—I do not know where I was when I signed it—I went through the Bankruptcy Court and got out of prison—before I went into prison Lawrence said "I am your solicitor, you must bear that in mind; and if anyone asks you who is your solicitor, you will say Mr. Lawrence"—Banks was present then, and, to the best of my memory, they both said the same—I took a petition to the Society, Banks told me what I should have to put in it—it was delayed, and I asked Banks the reason; he said that there was something wrong at

the office—before I was examined by the gentlemen of the Society, Banks told me that they would ask me if I knew him, and I was to say "No" and if I was asked who my detaining creditor was, I was to say Mr. Brooks, of Southgate Road, and that Mr. Lawrence was my attorney.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Have you seen Harris at Banks' office? A. Yes, he was Mr. Banks' clerk, I believe.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. After you were taken to prison, were you not taken into the solicitor's room next morning? A. Into a very small room, I thought it was the governor's room—I only found a short gentleman there, who, I believe, Was the governor, and a person who, I believe, was another prisoner—I do not think any papers were produced, but I signed so many I do not know where I did sign them—I believe I signed one paper in that small room—it was on the table—I either signed it or swore to it—I swear positively that the other man was not Lawrence, it was a man named Sawyer, who I do not know—we were both brought there together as prisoners—I cannot undertake to swear that he was in custody, but he was brought out of the prison with me—I will undertake to say that Lawrence was not there—I cannot tell whether the other person signed any paper in the little room—I cannot tell you whether we were all three in the room at one time, but we were all three brought from the prison—I will undertake to say that the governor was there—I have seen him since—if I saw him I could tell whether it was Mr. Constable.

EDWARD COUGH . I am a coachmaker, of Hounslow Heath—I was in difficulties towards the end of 1869—I was recommended to go to Banks by George Weston, of Hounslow—I went and saw him at his office—he undertook to take me through the Bankruptcy Court for a certain sum, and I signed a blank sheet of paper—I saw Mr. Lawrence the same day, in the street, and Banks said "This is Mr. Lawrence, your solicitor"—Lawrence said "I am your solicitor; I live at 50, Lincoln's Inn Fields"—I said "Very good, Sir"—I did not see Lawrence again for four months—I never saw him in the prison—I signed no paper but the blank sheet—this is it—(This was a content to the plaintiff entering judgment for 20l. debt, and 1l. costs, in the case of "Banks v. Couch")—This is my signature to these bankruptcy proceedings.

Q. This is your petition; in the corner of it is written "Signed by the petitioner, in the presence of J. Lawrence," and here is the signature of "J. Lawrence, 50, Lincoln's Inn Fields," do you know whether that was signed by Lawrence or not? A. I never saw Lawrence when I signed my petition—I never saw him in the prison at all—my petition states that I was imprisoned at the suit of George Fouracres, but I was not—no judgment had been obtained against me in the Common Pleas for 24l., or for any sum.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Have you been to Banks' office? A. Yes—I saw Harris there—he did not act as Banks' clerk, that I am aware of.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. If you did not sign this petition in the prison, where did you sign it? A. I signed two papers in the prison, and I signed that one—I was sent for the morning after I was taken to prison, and brought into a little lobby by the warder, and taken to the constable's office, and there I signed this—I did not see Lawrence there, I only saw him three times altogether; once when I was introduced to him, the next time was four months afterwards, and the third time was

at Guildhall—there was nobody but myself present when I signed this—I was all alone.

Q. You found a paper lying on the table, and you signed it in the proper place, without anybody telling you the meaning of it? A. Mr. Constable asked me if my name was Couch—I saw no one but Mr. Constable—I will swear that no one else was there—I swear that Mr. Constable was present when I signed it.

THOMAS COBBOLD . I am a watchmaker, of Hounslow—I got into difficulties in December, went to Banks' office, and signed this paper there—(This was a consent to sign judgment, for 21l. debt and 1l. costs, in an action between J. Harris, plaintiff, and Thomas Cobbold, defendant. Witness, H. Banks)—I was arrested after that, and taken to Whitecross Street, and signed a petition, attested by Lawrence—I also signed my deposition, in which I say that I was in custody at the suit of John Harris—I did not owe him anything, I never saw him till I saw him at Banks' office.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Did you sign some papers in prison? A. I was called into a room, and signed one paper—I do not remember Lawrence being present—I signed some papers out of the prison—some person was present when I signed the paper in the small room—I cannot say that it was or that it was not Lawrence.

MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH to G. EVEREST. Q. Will you undertake to say that Lawrence is not the person who brought the paper you signed in the prison? A. I am not certain one way or the other—four or five of us went in—the other prisoners signed it—I do not know whether the gentleman signed it—I have no recollection of seeing Lawrence till three weeks ago; but I will not undertake to swear it was not Lawrence.

MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH to B. CONSTABLE. Q. Were you present when either of these persons signed their petitions? A. Never.

MR. METCALFE. Q. I suppose one of your own officers would go and fetch them into the room when the papers came? A. Yes—the oath would be taken before me simply.

WILLIAM ARTHUR BROWN LUNN . I am secretary to the Society for the Relief of Small Debtors—the Earl of Romney is one of the trustees—I produce a number of petitions to the society, for pecuniary relief, and among them petitions from Hill, Everest, Barker, Savage, Sparkes, Couch, and Harris—this (produced) is the list of rules for petitioners—we give it to all applicants—it gives full directions for obtaining relief, and states who are eligible—these rules were always adhered to—money was paid to Hill and Savage.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Are those the only two? A. Yes—we do make inquiries.

BERTRAM JOHNSON . I am a clerk in the Record Office—I produce the proceedings in the cases of Hill, Beckett, and Teece, from the Bankruptcy Court; also the proceedings in the cases of the persons from the Mayor's Court—I produce sixty or seventy in which Banks is the accountant and Lawrence the attorney—they are all in formd pauperis, and all within four months of last year.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. What is the last of that series of proceedings? A. The last day of December.

GEORGE W. READER (re-examined.) I was clerk to Mr. Banks about eighteen months, and left about May this year—Harris was there about five or six months of that time, and Lawrence used to sec him there; sometimes

he came once in the day, and sometimes twice—that extended over four or five months—when be came, he generally used to go out with Mr. Banks—he sometimes did writing there—I took messages once or twice a week, sometimes written and sometimes verbal, from Banks, to Mr. Lit., rence's office in Lincoln's Inn Fields—I do not remember seeing Banks and Lawrence together at the Peacock; I have seen Harris there, and I have taken papers, once or twice, from Banks' office to the society's office in Craven Street—I know Banks' writing, and Lawrence's—I believe this signature (To Hill's petition) to be Banks' writing—this is Harris' writing (The ten days' statement of accounts)—I have seen forms like this petition in Banks' office, but have not seen Lawrence do anything with them—I have only seen him write notes and letters there.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Do you know where Harris came from, before he was in the office? A. He was in Whitecross Street—he was Mr. Banks' clerk—I do not know what wages he got—I got 4s. a week.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Sometimes Mr. Lawrence did not go there once in a week, and sometimes twice in a day? A. Yes.

ALEXANDER STREEMER . I live at Queen's Road, Dalston, and was in Banks' employ during October, November, and December—Harris was constantly at the office—Banks lived at Clapham Junction, and he removed from there to Southgate Road, Ball's Pond—I often saw Lawrence at the office—there were a good many of these bankruptcy forms at the office—I filled them in as well as Mr. Banks—I never saw Lawrence do any writing there; he spoke to Banks when he came—I have heard Banks say that he paid Lawrence for his services; for attesting petitions in bankruptcy—I do not know what he paid—he paid him about once a month; but it is only what I have heard, I cannot exactly say—I think Lawrence was there once when I heard Banks talking about it.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Had not you left before Harris came there? A. No—I was a clerk; but I never knew that Harris was a clerk—I was a fellow clerk with Reader.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. The boy Reader would be sent for Lawrence, and he would come? A. Yes—sometimes he did not come for two or three days, if he was not sent for—Banks sometimes employed other attorneys to attest petitions—Mr. Biddle was one—I never knew that he employed Mr. Drake—he employed two besides Mr. Lawrence.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Biddle and who? A. Kimberley—they were paid I should think—I do not think they would give their services without.

Harris's Statement before the Magistrate was that he succeeded Streemer as Banks' clerk; and being totally ignorant of the business, took all his instructions from Banks; that he received a small salary; but got no remuneration or benefit for allowing his name to be used.

The Law Lists for the last four years were put in evidence, to show that Lawrence's name did not appear in them.

Lawrence received a good character.

GUILTY Eighteen Months' Imprisonment each.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-669
VerdictNot Guilty > directed

Related Material

669. HENRY BANKS, JOHN HARRIS , and JULIUS LAWRENCE were again indicted for unlawfully conspiring to steal the goods and moneys of Caroline Hill. Other Counts—To steal the property of Robert Savage, and to defraud him. Other Counts—To defraud John Smith.

(The same Counsel appeared.)

RICHARD JAMES PAWLEY . I produce the proceedings in an action of "Banks v. Savage"—the prcecipe is dated 5th October, 1869, and the consent and judgment bear the same date—I also produce the proceedings in the second action of "Banks v. Savage"—(This was dated 5th April, 1870, between Henry Banks and Robert Savage, to recover 7l., signed "J. Lawrence, plaintiff's attorney, Lincoln's Inn Fields."—The affidavit in the same case was also put in, dated 20th April, 1870; also the order that the plaintiff might be served in any part of England and Wales; alto an affidavit in the same cause, that the action arose within the jurisdiction)—This parchment document purports to be what we term the bill original—when a cause of action arises within the jurisdiction, and the defendant resides out of the jurisdiction, there is a process by which the cause can be changed into another Court—the judgment must bear the signature of the officer of the Court, which is sworn to—I have carried it as far as I can, as we cannot tell whether they will take it there or not.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Do you know in whose writing that "J. Lawrence is?" A. No.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Have you the proceedings in relation to Caroline Hill? A. Yes—J. Lawrence appears upon them as lolicitor—(A similar set of documents in the Lord Mayor's Court were here put in, in relation to the case of Caroline Hill, upon all of which the name of J. Lawrence appeared as solicitor.)

ROBERT SAVAGE . I petitioned the society, after going through the Bankruptcy Court, and got 55l.—I got' the money at Coutts'; and as I came out I saw Banks and Harris—they asked me what I was going to reward them with out of it—I said I would think of it—neither of them had drawn my petition for me—I went to a public-house with them, walked out at the back door, and ran away—a little time after that a man called on me for eight sovereigns—I had seen him in the street with Banks—I did not give them—afterwards another man called on me, and said that I had received a loan of 55l. from Craven Street, Strand, that he was the solicitor from Craven Street, and that Mr. Banks had been to the office and stated that I had received the money under false pretences—when he left I watched him down the Goswell Road, and saw Banks come over the street to him, and they stood talking together—some little time after that my wife sent for me to come home—I think it was on 20th April, and a Sheriff's officer had taken possession of my two horses—I had to pay 12l. 5s. to Mrs. Strong, the Sheriff's officer's wife—he then gave up possession—I owed Mr. Banks 30s.—I had not got it, and he demanded 8l.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Was that the balance of taking you through the Bankruptcy Court? A. Yes—he had told me about the petition to the Society—Harris spoke to me first when I came out of Coutts'.

CAROLINE HILL . I live in Wilmington Square—I was taken to Whitecross Street in May, 1869, for a debt due to some tradesman—while I was there I saw Banks—he proposed to take me through the Bankruptcy Court for three guineas, which I paid him—I got a receipt for the money, but I have lost it—Lawrence acted as his attorney in the action against me—I saw him—Banks prepared my petition to the Bankruptcy Court, and it was dismissed for want of residence or something that was not described—I subsequently paid my detaining creditor in full, and I paid my other creditors

—I paid everything I owed at that time—my petition was dismissed, and I heard nothing further, but some few mouths after Banks sent me this letter—(Read: "26th April, 1870. From H. Banks to Miss C. Hill. I send you, on behalf of Mr. A. H. Bromwich, the bill of costs, amounting to 21l. 10s. I must request you to pay it to-morrow afternoon, or I shall proceed to enforce it without further notice."—(The letter enclosed an attorneys bill of costs for? 21l. 10l.)—I sent this answer to Mr. Banks—(Read: "Sir—I received a letter from you this morning. I am at a loss to understand your villainous attempt to extort money from me. If you write again, I shall take steps to have you punished. I have plenty of friends who will take immediate steps to punish such rascality. Caroline Hill."(The letter was not dated, the post-mark was April 27th)—I heard nothing more till the Sheriff's officer came in, about 9th May—I never received any process—he seized, and took some articles of-jewellery away—I went to the Mayor's Court, and employed a respectable attorney—I paid 24l. odd into Court, and then obtained my jewellery back—I only got back 2l. 4s. 6d. out of the 24l.—I did not owe Banks a farthing—I had paid him the three guiness—Harris came with the Sheriffs officer, and told me I had better pay the money, and I said I did not owe it, and I should not do so, and desired him to walk out—Mr. Lawrence acted as the attorney against me in the second case—he said nothing to me about Banks having received the money from me.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. I believe the detaining creditor was a gentleman named Little? A. Yes—a linendraper who supplied me with various goods—he said that I owed him 30l., and it was on his behalf that Lawrence appeared before the Bankruptcy Court—I was sent back to Whitecross Street, and ordered to pay the costs of the proceedings—I can't remember how soon afterwards I went up again—I was detained in White-cross Street for a bond fide debt to Mr. Little—I don't remember going to Banks' office and getting 15l.—I received 25l. of my money back—one of my friends suggested that I should pay Mr. Little all the money I owed him, and then I should got him to take less than the actual debt, and I went with my friend, who paid 25l. to Mr. Banks, but he said, "As you have arranged to pay 4l. a month, you had better keep to it, "and he gave me back the 25l.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Was the only time you saw Harris when he came with the Sheriffs officer?. A. Yes.

JOHN MILLER . I am clerk to the master of the Court of Exchequer—I produce the proceedings in "Banks v. Savage," which was removed into the Exchequer for the purpose of execution—I produce an affidavit, the proecipe, and also a prcecipe in our Court on which the execution issues—execution did issue on 20th April, 1870—Mr. Lawrence's name appears on the affidavit upon which it was removed—the execution was carried out—here is the execution stamp—in the action of "Banks v. Caroline Hill" there are similar proceedings, dated 9th May—(These were put in, the action was for 18l., and 2l. 5s. 8d. costs.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Do you know whose writing that "J. Lawrence" is on that document. A. No.

WILLIAM STRONG . I am one of the officers of the Sheriff of Middlesex—my brother officer levied on the goods of Savage, but I received the money, 12l. 5s. altogether—I paid it to Mr. Lawrence by my cheque, which I produce, with his endorsement on it—it was levied in the suit of, "Banks

v. 'Savage "(The cheque was dated 23rd April, 1870, for 9l. 1s., in favour of J. Lawrence re Savage, and endorsed J. Lawrence)—Banks came the next morning, and asked me for the money before I paid it over—I declined to pay him, and insisted on paying the attorney, which I did—I also levied on the goods of Caroline Hill, at the suit of "Banks v. Hill, "and seized jewellery to the amount of 20l. 2s. 4d., and 1l. 0s. 7d. for the writ, besides the Sheriff's charges—that was discharged by payment into the Lord Mayor's Court, and I had an order to withdraw and deliver up the jewellery, which I did.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Was a warrant to levy the execution brought to you by Banks? A. Yes, in both cases—I have known Lawrence some time—he has always conducted himself as an honest practitioner, as far as I know—I wished to be regular in the matter.

FREDERICK CHARLES BRETT (Detective.) Since Banks was arrested I found in his office, 2, Cripplegate, this parchment judgment, also this letter from Caroline Hill—there were two letters in one envelope (Read: "28th April, 1870. To H. Banks. Dear Sir,—'Sherrington'—I have received notice of appearance—'Savage'—I will see you to-day. Yours truly, J. Lawrence.")

GEORGE WILLIAM READER . The signature to this letter is Lawrence's writing, but I can't say as to the letter itself—this affidavit, in the Mayor's Court, in "Banks v. Savage," is mine—Banks told me to make affidavits that the cause of action arose within the jurisdiction—he told me that the cause of action arose in his office, and I believed him.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Do you remember Mr. Bromwich, a clerk in the office? A. Yes—it "was his duty to swear this affidavit, but I never heard that he had anything to do with Miss Hill's case—he and Mr. Banks told me to swear it, but Mr. Banks told me first—Bromwich was at the office when I left.

THE COURT considered there was no evidence against any of the prisoners

NOT GUILTY . There were other indictments against the prisoners. (See page 414).

NEW COURT.—Wednesday, August 17th, 1870.

Before Mr. Justice Byles.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-670
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment; Imprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

670. EDWARD JONES (30), and FRANCIS THOMPSON (24), PLEADED GUILTY to unlawfully conspiring to obtain goods under false pretences, from Jacob Lazarus, with intent to defraud.

JONES— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

THOMPSON— Five Years Penal Servitude.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-671
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

671. PHILIP JAMES DINTE (24) , Stealing 728l. 10s. of Joseph Lawrence Counsel, on the high seas.

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; and MESSRS. MONTAGU WILLIAMS and STRAIGHT the Defence.

ARTHUR WESTON . At the time I was examined at the Police Court I lived at 11, Agar Street, Strand—I come from Melbourne, Australia—I am a native of England—on 10th February, this year, before I left Melbourne, I saw Mrs. Counsel hand a cheque for 925l. to her husband, to be applied to the purchase of a house on the Ballarat gold diggings—I went with Mr. Counsel to his bank to have it changed—it was changed first into 50l. notes and after into gold—I can't say when that was, I was not present—about three weeks before I met the prisoner, I was with Counsel when the prisoner was present—he proposed that the three of us should go to England

—he said he was a very clever wizard; but that he would never perform in Australia, as he wanted to perform in the best parts of the world, if he only had the money to buy his apparatus—he mentioned England and the Continent—he said he could do tricks that no man ever did before, that he could cut a man's leg off, and throw it to the audience—Counsel said that he would go; but he would not go without me, and that we could all three go together—Counsel then took two 50l. notes out of his pocket-book, and banded them to the prisoner, to take the passage—I was present—the cost of the passage was 25l. each, total 75l.—the ship was the Kent—the passages were taken, and I Counsel, and the prisoner went on board on the evening of 16th February—all the money was placed in this box—it was changed into Australian sovereigns—the prisoner opened the boxes and showed us the gold, and said "It is all safe"—the money was placed in a large nest of boxes, one within another, I believe there were nine altogether—we put it in the innermost box—it was in either three or four chamois leather bags—this box (produced) is the smallest of the nest—it is the box the gold was in, and this is how it was broken open—it is still locked—I saw the money counted on the ship—I could not swear exactly how many sovereigns there were—I should think there were about 850 at that time—the box was deposited in our cabin—all three of us were in the same cabin, which was confined by a door—after we had been on the ship some little tune the prisoner said that he wanted to say "Good-bye" to his friends—he was going to tell them he was going to Queensland, and Counsel agreed with him to go up in the town—I said "Don't go, let us stay on board while we are safe"—the prisoner then called in the storekeeper, and he said "Ned, what time will the ship sail?"—he said "She won't go away until to-morrow, I am sure, and very likely not till Friday, because the captain won't go away until he gets the mails"—Counsel, the prisoner, and myself then went to Melbourne, about four miles from where the ship lay—the prisoner left us at our hotel, where we went to have tea—he said he was going round to see his friends, to say "Good-bye," and he appointed to meet us at the corner of the Charlton Gardens, at 9 o'clock—we went at 9, and waited till 11.30, and he did not come, and we then walked to a place called Sandrich, and there slept—when we woke the next morning we found that the ship had cleared that very night—we went to the telegraph office, and afterwards took a special steamer, and reached the ship at the Heads—we found the prisoner on board—we counted the money, I think, on the following day, and it was all right—we were all three present—we counted it, I believe three times before 29th March, at intervals, and found it safe—on the afternoon of the 29th we counted it, and missed fifty-one sovereigns out of the bulk—we did not mention it at the time, we thought we might possibly have made a mistake in the counting—in June two of the crew of the ship were tried here for stealing the money, and we recovered back 44l. 10s.—their names were Chalk, Daley, and Randall—one was acquitted, and two pleaded guilty. (See page 135). On 30th March I had a dream—I dreamt that the gold was stolen, and that I saw a portion of it in a certain man's hands, the one that received the twelve months last Session—I awoke at daylight, and the dream was so impressed on my mind that I felt for the box with the gold in it, and it was gone—I felt for the prisoner and he was out—he was gone and the money too—the box had become smaller—some of the larger boxes had been taken off to put clothes into, and there were only the smallest

three or four remaining, and they were deposited in a large clothes box, and I felt in that box to see if the smaller ones were there—I then woke Counsel, and asked him a question—at this time the prisoner made his appearance, from the direction of the storekeeper's room, from the ladder, and shouted out, "Arthur! Joe! get up, we are robbed!"—(Arthur is me; Joe is Mr. Counsel)—we went outside the cabin—the boxes were lying on the table outside our door, broken open—there were six sovereigns lying in the bottom of the box, and two others were afterwards found on the ladder leading up to the deck—nothing further occurred during the voyage—we searched the ship and posted a notice—we arranged to watch the ship every night in turns, to see if we could observe anything—we made out nothing, and we eventually landed in England—we were somewhere about the Cape of Good Hope when this robbery took place, I can't say exactly where—on reaching England the prisoner Counsel and myself lodged at the same house, 10 and 12, East Road, City Road, up to the trial of those men—we continued in England until we had spent all the money that we recovered out of the first robbery, 44l. 10s.—after that I and Counsel took shipping at Gravesend, in order to return to Australia—it was about 16th of June, I think—the prisoner told me that he would be able to borrow some money from a rich uncle of his to take us out—he suggested our going out, not for any purpose, only that Australia was our home, and we had no means of subsistence in England—he went with us as far as Gravestnd, and returned back to London—Counsel and I went to Plymouth, and on the vessel reaching Plymouth Mrs. Counsel came to us—Mrs. Counsel and I came up to London by ourselves; we left Counsel' behind, as he was ill—we went to the prisoner's uncle, Mr. Underwood—I watched at the house all night, because, by the way his uncle spoke to me, we believed the prisoner was in the house—he would give us no information at all—the following morning I saw the prisoner at his lodgings, and Mrs. Counsel came in after me—I did not hear what she said—she charged him with the robbery—the prisoner came in and said to me, "Oh, my God I she is going to arrest me; what shall I do, Arthur? I can't stand it, I'll bolt!"—he said that to me, in his uncle's presence—he was jumping out through the window—I said "It is no use your bolting, for she will have you"—he jumped over the fence and hedge and went away.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. What are you? A. A lawyer's clerk, at Melbourne—I was in a lawyer's office at the time we started—I did not pay anything towards the expenses of the voyage—I represent that Mr. Counsel would not go without me—we did not take Mrs. Counsel with us—I knew this money was given to Counsel to buy a house with, when I went on board to go to England—the house was not in England—I did not believe the prisoner when he said he could cut a man's leg off and throw it at the jaudience, and then place it on its proper owner again—he said the apparatus would cost 200l.—I don't say for that, but he wanted it for his other conjuring—Counsel is in Court to-day—I was present when Chalk, Daley, and Randall were tried—two were seamen, and the other was a cabin-boy, who used to clean out our cabin—the prisoner was the prosecutor at their trial—Counsel was examined as a witness—the prisoner prosecuted for stealing 50l. belonging to him—it was so arranged—I had the dream on 30th March—I am sure it was not the 1st of April—I was not examined as a witness—the prisoner was—I was in Court when Counsel was examined—I made no objection to go back to Australia, nor did Counsel—having lost nearly

800l. we were content to go back, and thought we were very lucky to get back—we did not communicate with the police concerning our loss before we wont—we parted on good terms with the prisoner—he said he would be out in the next ship—we were always on good terms—we never thought he could have been guilty of stealing our money—he had access to it, and the use of it, as much as he liked—during the time we were on the vessel we occasionally lived pretty freely—it was all paid out of that money—sometimes Counsel paid, sometimes the prisoner, and sometimes myself—whenever there was any money taken out, there was generally three sovereigns taken out and handed to each—I should think 20l. or 25l. was spent on the voyage—we were on board about ninety-six days—we did not spend much after we lost the money, and we were only a little over half our journey—Mrs. Counsel is here—I had known her about nine months before I left Australia—she is a lady of property—Counsel had been married about a week before he sailed—I don't know that it was three days before he left Melbourne—I was present at the ceremony—I had some luggage on board of my own, clothes—we used to wear each other's clothes, like three brothers together—the prisoner did not sleep with this box under his head—it was in our cabin—all our clothes were in the box—there was nobody else in the cabin besides us three—I am living now in Bouverie Road, Stoke Newington—I have not been living there ever since I have been in England—I was living at 11, Agar Street, Strand—before we sailed in the Essex we lived in East Road, City Road—I am living in the same house with Mr. and Mrs. Counsel now.

MR. COOPER. Q. Do you know how Dinte came to be the prosecutor in the case tried last Session? A. I do—after the robbery the prisoner said to Counsel and me "For God's sake, say it is my money, for if you don't I shall lose the widow"—he was making love to a very rich widow on board the ship—Counsel agreed to say that because he did not want it made public how he had left his wife—I advised them to tell the truth about it, but they arranged it between themselves.

MARY CECILIA COUNSEL . I was married to Mr. Lawrence Counsel, in Melbourne on 9th February last—I had property of my own—when I married him I agreed to give him a cheque for 925l. to buy a house in Ballarat—he was going to settle in business—I am aware that he left Melbourne with Watson and the prisoner—I had known Watson a long time before—Counsel was married to me on the afternoon of Wednesday, 9th, and he left on the Friday evening—I only saw him once after—it was not by my consent that he left—after that I learnt something, in consequence of which I sailed for England on 24th April—I landed at Folkestone on 12th June, from France—I then heard that my husband and Watson were going book to Australia in the steerage of the Essex, and bad gone as far as Gravesend—I went straight to Plymouth, and there met the Essex, went on board and found they had landed—I found them on the following day, and my husband being ill, I came up with Watson to London—Watson and my husband were intimate long before I knew either of them—on coming to London, we went to 11, Agar Street, Strand—we did not expect to find the prisoner there—I went first to his uncle's, and then I found his lodgings, and went there, Bouverie Road, I think—I there saw the prisoner in the breakfast room, on the ground floor—he came in and asked me to shake hands with him—I said I would not—ho said "Why?"—I said "I have pomp to England to punish you for a great crime"—I had heard nothing

from my husband before that—the prisoner asked me to have some breakfast with him, and to listen to what he had to say, and I refused, and he then said "I will do something fur you; for God's sake arrange it with me in the afternoon"—I said "You know you have taken my money, and you know what is honest; you can do nothing for me unless you can do what is honest"—he said "Nobody in England can hurt me, Counsel and Watson have sailed for Australia"—I said "My husband is in Plymouth; he is in safe custody, and I will arrest you before the afternoon; I will not see you after I leave this room, except with the police"—he said "I can get to Liverpool"—I was standing with my back to the door, trying to keep it closed—he dashed past me up the stairs, and I did not see where he went to, but the woman of the house called out that he had jumped out of the window—he went out of sight—about half an hour after that I saw Inspector Silverton at the police-station, as soon as I could get there in a cab—I told him all about it.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. How long had you known your husband before you married him? A. Some considerable time—I could not tell you exactly, long enough to care about him—I had property worth 450l. when I married, and I have got 50l. a year from an annuity—I have 500l. a year—it was appointed to me by my mother, who held it for twenty-six years of for life—I was the only child—she had power to appoint it to me, irrespective of the debts of any husband and trustees—it was for my own use to spend as I liked—both came from my mother—I agreed to marry my husband on 12th January—he said his family would give him 1000l. to start in business if I would buy a house to live in, and he would settle that house on myself—I gave him the money to buy this house at Ballarat—I raised the money on mortgage between 12th January and 9th February—I don't think I gave this conversation that I had with the prisoner before the Magistrate—I was not asked—I believe this is the first time I have given it—I have not got the cheque which I gave to my husband for 925l.—I bank at the Union Bank of Australia, they always hold the cheques as receipts—I have never paid money to Watson—I often lent him money, and he often paid it back to me—as often, perhaps, as it was requisite to do so—I could not tell you how much I have lent him altogether—I gave him 3l. once, and he gave it back to me—I suppose I might have lent him 50l. altogether—I have not had the whole of it back, and never expect it—I did not give it to him, but it is hard to get money from those who have not—I never paid any money to the Age newspaper for him—he was going to take a small agency business in Melbourne—he had a widowed sister dependent upon him, and I wished to assist him—he was a lawyer's clerk, in Messrs. Anderson and Mr. Grant's—I never know him as anything else—he was with Mr. Gallot, my solicitor, when I first knew him, and he was then articled to Mr. Grant—I never was in any business—when I told Dinte I had my husband in safe custody, I meant that he was safer with his wife than with him—I meant that I had him under my care, and he required it just then.

MR. COOPER. Q. You knew this firm, where Watson was clerk? A. Yes—they were respectable people.

COURT. Q. Had you been married before? A. Yes, for a week—I was six years a widow—I was living with my father, a doctor, in Melbourne—I was born in this country—my first husband was married prior, and I did not know it, and I left him at the end of a week, and he subsequently died.

GEORGE SILVERTON (Police Inspector.) On 15th July Mrs. Counsel came to me—in consequence of what she said, I looked out for the prisoner—I saw the uncle on the night of the 15th—he handed me a telegram—I sent one to the prisoner, at Liverpool—I went to Liverpool, and found the prisoner coming towards the railway station, where I had appointed to meet him—I crossed the road, and said "Mr. Harper," and he said "Yes"—he was then in the name of Harper—I told him that I wanted him for stealing a large amount of gold on board the Kent—he made no reply—I brought him to London the same night—on the road to the station, from the railway station, he said "I am glad it is over; is is a b——clever capture"—he said it would be a feather in my cap, and he had suffered much agony since the thing had been on—on taking him to the Worship Street Police Court the next day, he told me that he did not steal the money, but he found it in a sock, on the day they went to search for it—I found my telegram on the prisoner, and received certain property from the uncle—the prisoner did not say anything to me as to what had become of the money—Mr. Underwood handed me 186l. in Australian sovereigns, a gold watch and chain, and these diamond studs—at the prisoner's lodgings I found a diamond pin and several suits of bran new clothing—when I apprehended him he was wearing this diamond cluster ring, and he had 1l. 11s. on him.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. Did you say one word, before the Magistrate, about the prisoner saying it was a b——clever capture? A. Yes; I said it in cross-examination by Mr. Sidney, and about a feather in my cap—I signed the deposition—I don't think the cross-examination was read over to me—I did not caution the prisoner—we had a half-pint of brandy, to share between the three of us, from Liverpool to London—he drank as I drank—I treated him as I thought I ought to treat a man—no one knew he was a prisoner—I said before the Magistrate, that the prisoner had refreshment several times, when I had it; that alluded to the brandy—on the Monday I told the officer, Newman, who had him in custody, to keep a sharp look out on him—the prisoner could hear that—it was between 2 and 3 o'clock.

JOHN WILTSHIRE (Police Sergeant.) I had charge of the Kingsland police-station, on 18th July last—the prisoner was in a cell there—I visited him repeatedly—on the first visit I asked him the usual question, "All right in there?"—he said "Yes, I am in for it this time"—I said "What are you in for?"—he said "That gold from the ship"—I then left him—I afterwards heard a rapping at the cell door, and somebody calling out—I opened the prisoner's cell door, and he said "Has my uncle been?"—I said "No one has been for you"—he said "I wish he would come, then he would square it," or "then it would be square; all the old b——wants is her money back"—that was all.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. Were you in plain clothes? A. I was in the same uniform as I have on now—I said nothing to him before he spoke to me.

GEORGE NEWMAN (Policeman M 218). On 18th July I had charge of the prisoner, at the Worship Street Police Court—he told me he was very sorry, there was no one to blame but himself; if he had given the money up when he found it on board the ship, he would not be in the position that he was then—he said "I took the money, and hid it in the ship, "he named the part of the ship, but I quite forget it, "and when we set to search, I was away from the rest some time, and I took it and put

it in my under pocket, thick coat"—he said "They accuse me of taking 925l., I believe, but I did not take it; it might be 800l., or it might be more, or less"—he said when he met Silverton in Liverpool, he knew he was going to take him for stealing the money on board the ship—he saw me with Silverton, because I visited him at 9 o'clock on Monday morning.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. Do you remember Silverton telling you to keep a sharp look out on him? A. I do; that was between 1 and 2 o'clock on the Monday—it was after that that he made this communication to mo—I did not caution him in any way—my number is still 218—I have be on in the force about four years—I was in the Kent County Constabulary, I think, about eighteen months—I was not discharged—I was reported for fighting, and I was discharged for it, with the benefit of the service and character good—after that I was a mounted patrol—I was reported for being under the influence of drink, and sent back to my former place in the police—I was a groom before I went in the force—nobody was present when the prisoner made this statement to me—he forced his conversation on me.

MR. COOPER. Q. I believe since you have been put back you have been made a detective? A. Yes—that is a step in advance.

GEORGE CRADDOCK UNDERWOOD . I live at 118, Church Road, and am a brush maker—I am the prisoner's uncle—on 2nd June he brought me 667l., in gold, in a sock or stocking, the greater part in Australian sovereigns—he said he had found the money—I have given the prisoner cheques for gold—the first was for 7l. 10s. one for 2l., and one for 20l., 29l. 10s. altogether—he lent me 130l., in gold, which I made use of—altogether, about 210l. or 220l. would be due to the prisoner—on the 11th June he came to me for some money for the passage of Counsel and Weston to Australia, and I gave him 20l.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. I suppose they were strangers to you? A. I never saw them—the gross sum that I had was 667l.—the prisoner's father is a merchant tailor, in Melbourne, in a large way of business—he is an only son—his father is a man of means.

JOSEPH LAWRENCE COUNSEL . I am husband of Mrs. Counsel—I was married to her in Melbourne last February—I received a cheque from her for 925l., after the marriage, which I changed into notes, and the notes into gold, mostly Australian sovereigns—I afterwards went oo board a ship with the prisoner and Weston, induced by what the prisoner said about his skill in the art of legerdemain—we sailed for England—up to 29th March we had looked two or three times, and seen the gold safe—it was kept in this box, enclosed in four others—on the afternoon of 29th March we missed 51l.—after the trial of the three men who were charged with stealing it here, I received 44l. 10s., which was found on them—on 30th March I was awoke by Weston, and found the prisoner and the money both gone—I heard the prisoner call out from outside the cabin "Arthur, Joe, we are robbed"—we never found the money—we searched several times, and also posted a notice on the ship, offering a reward—I had no suspicion of the prisoner—on arriving in England I lodged with him and Weston—we divided the 44l. 10s.; and after we had consumed it, the prisoner suggested that we should return to Australia—when we missed the money we found six sovereigns in the bottom of the box, and two placed on the ladder, leading to the quarter deck, where they could not have been dropped, or they would have rolled to leeward—they must have bean placed there—the

prisoner accompanied Weston and I to Gravesend, on board the Essex—he said he would follow by the next ship—we understood he had got no money, and his uncle was to pay his passage—he afterwards left us to go to London—he borrowed a half-crown of us before leaving, and left us with very little money—we went to Plymouth, and there unexpectedly met my wife—she made a communication to me—I was very ill at the time—I remained in Plymouth, and she and Weston went up to London.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. What were you in Australia before you were married? A. I was in the law part of the time, and then in a commercial house—I was not in business at the time I married, I was living with my father—he enjoys a pension from the Government—he knows my wife—he was not at the wedding—I was married about a week before I left her—I did not tell her I was going—I told her I was going to purchase a house with the money—that was my intention, until told what I was by the prisoner—the box that the money was in belonged to the prisoner—the prisoner induced me to leave Australia—he never spoke of my wife, to my knowledge—I left her of my own accord—the prisoner told me he could cut off a man's leg, and throw it to the audience, and join it on at the thigh again—I did not believe it—I believed he could do several other things, which were rather clever—he led me to believe that he was a very clever wizard, and that he could make a 1000l. a year for each of us, in England, or on the continent—that was what induced me to leave my wife in Australia—Weston had no money—I agreed to pay Weston's expenses with the money I got from my wife—it was purely out of friendship—I suppose I did not want my fortune made without Weston's fortune being made too—I believe he had some clothing on board—he occasionally wore mine, and occasionally the prisoner's, and I wore theirs—I was examined as a witness when these three men were tried, and gave my evidence on oath—I did not prosecute, I was induced by the prisoner not to—I was sworn—I know I acted wrongly—the prisoner took care that I was almost always intoxicated—I may have said "I am interested in one share of the money, I did not give Dinte any security for it"—I am not aware what I said—it is not true—I was interested in the whole of the money—the prisoner requested that I should say so, and also took care to make me intoxicated when I gave my evidence—I may have said "I did not give Dinte any security for it"—I did not give him any security, I had no necessity, as it was my own money—I mean to say I was nearly drunk when I gave my evidence before the Magistrate—I gave no evidence to that effect before the Judge, at the trial—I was not drunk then—I did not say anything about the money belonging to me—it was agreed that we should say the money was the prisoner's—I believe it was agreed that I should swear to it, if necessary—I believe I was drunk when I agreed to that—we all had the 44l. 10s.—it was given to the prisoner because he was the prosecutor—it was all my money—I believe I had one third of it—Weston had a third, and the prisoner a third—we were all mates together—I am twentyfour—I was going to Australia when I left England; going back to my wife—she has money, about 500l. a year—I came to England because the prisoner said he would not perform in Australia—I mean to tell the Jury that—I have seen him do a few tricks with coins and cards.

MR. COOPER. Q. How came it to be agreed amongst you that the money should be considered Dinte's? A. As soon as the robbery was found out the prisoner said "For God's sake say it is my money, for I shall be able to

marry the widow if you do, and will refund it"—there was a rich widow on board, a Mrs. Ellis—he was paying great attention to her—I never noticed whether she smiled on him.

GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

THIRD COURT.—Wednesday, 11th August, 1870.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-672
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

672. ALFRED DUMBBELL (51), PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously forging and uttering an order for the payment of 16l., with intent to defraud; also to stealing 6l., the moneys of Henry Bergh and another, his masters.

Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-673
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment

Related Material

673. WILLIAM JAMES (20), and ELLEN HALL (22) , Breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Maria Payne, and stealing therein two shirts, and other articles, her property.

MR. HORACE BROWN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. KELLEY defended James.

GEORGE KING (Policeman D 79). On 22nd July, about 9.20, I was in Devonshire Street, with a young man named Crouch—I saw James there, carrying a large bundle under his arm—Hall ran by us and joined him—she was carrying a clock and other things—I asked them where they got the things from—she said she was removing, "They are my things, and he has nothing to do with them; he is carrying them for me"—he resisted, but I took them to the station.

Cross-examined. Q. In the account you have given, you said that from first to last the woman stated she had employed him to carry those things, and that he knew nothing about them? A. Yes.

CHARLES CROUCH . I am a blacksmith, of 17, Paradise Street—I was with King, and assisted in taking the prisoners—they tried to get away.

FREDERICK PAYNE . I live at 17, Nottingham Street, and am a hairdresser—that cloak and things produced are mine—they were quite safe at 8.45 on the 24th July—King came to me, and I saw a robbery had taken place—I was down stairs, having supper—when I got home I saw the street-door open—I accused my servant of leaving it open—she said "No one has been up stairs"—King showed me two envelopes, with my name and address on them, which I usually keep in my coat pocket—the detective called at 9.45.

HENRY AUGUSTUS JENNER . I am a clerk in the Probate Court, and live at 17, Nottingham Street—this property is mine—my room was on the second floor—the things were quite safe in the morning when I left.

The Prisoners' Statements before the Magistrate. James says: "I found the female with the clothes, and she asked me to carry one of the bundles; I said "Very well," and when I got to the street this officer stopped me. I don't know the name of the street He asked me what I had got tied up in the bundle; I said I was carrying it for the woman." Hall says: "This young man has nothing to do with it; I met him just after the things were given to me. A man gave them to me who said he was going to Euston Street."

GUILTY .—They were both further charged with having been before convicted at this Court in June, 1867, to which they


JAMES*— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.

HALL**— Two Years' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-674
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

674. ROBERT VINT HASTIE (32) , Feloniously forging and uttering an order for the payment of 15l. 10s., with intent to defraud.

MR. LEWIS conducted the Prosecution.

FREDERICK SMITH . I am proprietor of the Stamford Hotel, Harrow Road—I knew the prisoner as a customer—on 11th June, he asked me to cash a cheque for him, which I did—he endorsed it in my presence—I give him 15l. 10s. for it, and paid it into my bank—it was returned unpaid—he gave me an address which turned out to be his mother's, 12, Warwick Crescent—I have never seen him.

H. B. MACMULLEN. I am a solicitor—I am acquainted with the prisoned writing—that cheque is in his writing—I have seen him write.

Prisoner. Q. On what occasion? A. At my office—I have some things of yours in my possession with your writing on them—I positively assert that "John Scott" to be your writing, and also the endorsement.

THOMAS DALY . I am a commission agent—this cheque was originally in my possession—it was issued to me by the London Joint-Stock Bank, with forty-nine others, blank ones—I never parted with one to the prisoner.

DAVID FORD RUTTER . I am an accountant at the London Joint Stock Bank, City—we had a customer named John Scott—that signature is not his writing—the cheque-book was issued to Mr. Daly on 13th May, 1865—he closed his account on the following Saturday.

Prisoner's Defence. That cheque was given to me by John Scott, in payment of some money due to me.

GUILTY .— Two Years' Imprisonment.

FOURTH COURT—Wednesday, August 17th, 1870.

Before Mr. Recorder.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-675
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

675. FREDERICK BROWN (26), PLEADED GUILTY to stealing three pairs of boots, the property of George Rayner Bastard, having been before convicted in June, 1869.

Seven Years' Penal Servitude:

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-676
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

676. MARY BRYANT (21) , Unlawfully endeavouring to conceal the birth of her child.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BRINDLEY the Defence.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-677
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment

Related Material

677. JOHN AUSTIN (21), THOMAS LATHAM (19), and HENRY SMITH (18) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of John Smith, and stealing eight spoons, five knives, and six forks, his property; and one ring, a pair of earrings, a locket and chain, of Annie Portwood.

MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. HOLLING defended Austin.

ANNIE PORTWOOD . I am servant to Mr. Smith, 2, Wrotham Villas, Camden Town—these forks and spoons (produced) are his property—they were safe on the evening of 13th July, in a box in the kitchen cupboard—these earrings and ring are mine—they were safe also, in a small box on the kitchen table—me and my mistress locked up the house about 10.30—the things were then safe in the places I have mentioned—I went to bed, and was awoke next morning, about 4.30, by the police coming—I went down, and found the kitchen window broken open—the drawers were all turned out—the box where I kept my earrings and ring was broken open, and the things gone—the kitchen door was burst open, and the breakfast-room door, too.

GEORGE KENNY (Policeman Y 52). On the morning of 14th July, about 1.30, I met the prisoners in Charrington Street—I stopped Austin, and asked him what he had got, as he looked bulky—he said "I have got nothing"—I felt in his coat pocket, and felt these spoons, and took them out—I took him to the station, searched him there, and found the ring and earrings in the watch-pocket of his trowsers—I asked him how he came by the spoons—he said a woman gave them to him, but he did not know her—he said his sister gave him the ring and earrings—the other two ran away—I have no doubt whatever that they are the two men.

Latham. It is quite true what he says, I was coming by at the time.

Smith. Q. Did I stand as I am now, in the same clothes? A. I did not see the clothes.

COURT. Q. Had you known him before? A. No—I took another young man up first—I did not swear he was Smith—I found he was not the man—when I took him I suspected he was the person I had seen over night—I could not swear to him, and he was discharged—they were very much alike, the prisoner and the man I took.

CHARLES TAYLOR (Detective Y). On the morning of 14th July, about 7 o'clock, I went to Wrotham Villas, Camden Town—the back kitchen window had been forced by some instrument placed between the two sashes, and the catch broken off—the door leading to the parlour from the kitchen had been forced open—I apprehended Smith on 21st, at 21, Drummond Crescent—I found him in bed—I told him I wanted him for committing a burglary with young Latham and Austin, last Wednesday week—I called him Tackle, knowing his nick-name—he said, "I know nothing about it; I was in the country at the time, and I have witnesses to prove it."

Smith. I said I had been in the country a week, and came home last night Witness. No, you said you knew nothing about it, that you were in the country at the time.

JOHN REID (Policeman Y 406). On Wednesday, 13th July, I was at the corner of Cleveland Street and St. Paul's Terrace, Camden Town, about 400 yards or 500 yards from the prosecutor's—I saw the three prisoners come out of a urinal at the corner of Prebend Street—when they saw me they held down their heads and crossed the road—I followed them to Wrotham Road, and then went back to my beat—I left them about twenty yards from Wrotham Villas.

Smith. I was not there.

CHARLES FARENPEN . (Detective Y). I apprehended Latham, on 21st July, at 8 o'clock in the evening—I told him I wanted him for being concerned with John Austin in committing a robbery in Camden Town—he said "I know nothing about it"—on the way to the station, he said "Have you taken Tackle?"—I said "Who do you mean by Tackle, Smith—he said "Yes"—I said "No, I have not"—he said "I don't see why I should suffer myself, as Tackle was there, and he has got the best part of the stuff, and ought to be locked up as well as me."

Latham. I never uttered such a thing as that.

COURT to ANNIE PORTWOOD. Q. Are those all the spoons and things that were taken? A. No, there were other things besides, and more spoons and forks.

Latham called

THOMAS LATHAM . I am the prisoner's father—on the morning of the 14th he got home between 12 and 1 o'clock—I had sent him to Mr. Lister's

about 9 o'clock—he has worked for Mr. Lister some time, on and off—I was in bed when he came home.


They were further charged with having been before convicted, Austin in December, 1865, Latham, in July, 1809, and Smith, in September, 1866, to which they


AUSTIN** and SMITH**— Seven Years' Penal Servitude each.

LATHAM*— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-678
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > lesser offence

Related Material

678. HENRY SMITH was again indicted with MERCY WEBB (20) , for burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of William Dance, and stealing therein six nightgowns, and other articles, his property.


MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution.

MARY ANN HARRIS . I am servant to Mr. Dance, 146, Great College Street, Camden Town—I ironed and aired a quantity of clothes on the evening of 8th July, and put them in a basket in the hall, about 10 o'clock—I went to bed soon after, and the other servant and myself fastened the house up securely—I got up about 6 o'clock in the morning, and found the basket of clothes gone from under the hall table—the kitchen window was broken open—that was shut and fast the night before—the window was wide open, and the blind down, and the door open—these are some of the things that I left safe in the basket (produced).

SUSANNAH DANCE . I am the wife of William Dance, of 146, Great College Street, Camden Town—these articles are my property—these two pocket handkerchiefs belong to my niece.

CHARLES TAYLOR (Detective Y). On 21st July I went to Drummond Crescent, and took Smith into custody—Webb was in bed with him—I saw a box in the room, and asked whose it was—Webb said it was hers—I opened it and found several duplicates—I called her attention to one, for a sheet—she said "It was mine, I pawned it off my bed"—Smith said "I don't see why you should take possession of the things, they are mine, and I paid for them"—I went again on the 23rd, and took Webb into custody for stealing the things—she said she knew nothing of it.

CHARLES FARENDEN (Detective Y). I examined the premises, 146, Great College Street, on the morning of 9th July, the window had been forced open by the fastening being broken—a burglary had been committed—I went to Drummond Crescent, and took possession of a box—I found two handkerchiefs, four towels, and three parts of towels—I asked Webb if there was anything in the box that did not belong to her, and she said there was not.

STEPHEN SPICE . I am a pawnbroker's assistant, at 96, Charlton Street, Euston Road—I produce five handkerchiefs, one sheet, and two pillow cases, pledged on 14th July, by the prisoner, for a shilling.

Webb's Defence. There are two or three parcels there I did not pawn; I only pawned one.

WEBB— Guilty of receiving.—Recommended to mercy.— Eight Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-679
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > pleaded guilty
SentencesImprisonment; Imprisonment

Related Material

679. WILLIAM DOW (38) , Stealing a bottle of blacking, a bottle of sauce, two bottles of pickles, and a quantity of other articles, of Elizabeth Burgess, and others, his employers; and WILLIAM GILHAM (25), and HENRY SABEY (37) , feloniously receiving the same.

GILHAM and SABEY PLEADED GUILTY.—Recommended to Mercy — Nine Months' Imprisonment each.

MR. POLAND conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BROMBY defended Dow, who withdrew his plea of


PLEADED GUILTY . Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-680
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

680. WILLIAM DOWNS (22), was indicted for wilful and corrupt perjury.

MESSRS. STRAIGHT and HOLLING conducted the Prosecution.

EDWARD THORNTON BARNETT . I produce a transcript of the evidence of William Downs, given on the trial of Ellen Jemima Downs—it is correct.

HENRY RICHARD HARKER . I am one of the ushers of the Court—I was present at the trial of Ellen Jemima Downs—I swore the prisoner on that occasion, and he gave evidence.

(The evidence of William Downs being read stated that in the month of July or August, 1869, at the time when Ellen Jemima Downs was charged with stabbing her daughter Ellen, he saw Mary McKeon give E. J. Downs two bonds, that Mary McKeon then said 'Take these, Jemima, you might want them, as you might get into trouble;' that Mary McKeon then gave her two of the bonds to become bail for a week; that in July, 1869, Mary McKeon lad a conversation with Robert Lea, in the presence of William Downs, with reference to the Crown public-house, Back Hill, Clerkenwell; that Mary McKeon then said 'Let us get out of this cursed neighbourhood, and take a public-house in some quiet place; and that Lee, Mary McKeon, E. J. Downs, and William Downs, went to look at the Crown public-house before they took it.)

MARY McKEON . I am the wife of Daniel McKeon, of 39, York Street, Westminster—in 1867 I was in possession of eighteen Russian bonds, value 900l.—I kept them in a little iron box, which I bought from my landlord—when I first became possessed of them, at my mother's death, I was living at 6, Stibbington Street, Somers Town—I have known Mrs. Downs thirty-eight years—I knew the prisoner as her son—I went to stay with her it Barrett's Court, Wigmore Street, and took my bonds with me—that was in 1868—I don't know the date—I counted my bonds before I went there—Mrs. Downs put the box under a little place in the bedstead; but she kept the key—I was stripped of everything—I never thought she would touch the bonds—I remember the prisoner's mother being charged with stabbing her daughter Ellen—I did not give her two bonds to hold as security—I never gave her two bonds for anything—I did not say "Take these, Jemima, you might want them, as you might get into trouble"—I never gave her any bonds, to procure bail for her when she was in difficulty—I signed that I would pay 25l. for her; but I never thought of giving her the bonds—she wrote to me, saying she had taken a public-house, and said she should like me to come and mind the bar—I did not want a public-house—I never said in the prisoner's presence, or at any time, "Let us get out of this cursed neighbourhood, and take a public-house in some quiet place"—he was never present at any such conversation, and there never was such a conversation—I never went with Lea and the prisoner to see the public-house.

HENRY AVORY . I produce the indictment and the caption of the Session against Ellen Jemima Downs, who was charged with stealing eighteen valuable securities for the payment of 50l. each, namely, eighteen Russian bonds, and a box, the property of Daniel McKeon—the prisoner Ellen Jemima Downs was tried and convicted. (See page 288).

ROBERT FREDERICK LEA . I live at Kentish Road, Kilburn, and am a

solicitor's clerk—I know Ellen Jemima Downs well—I was present last Session when she was tried for stealing eighteen Russian bonds—I gave evidence against her—I don't remember any conversation taking place with reference to the purchase of a public-house—no such conversation took place in my presence—I never went with the prisoner and his mother and Mrs. McKeon to look at the Crown public-house, before it was taken—I sold the bonds for Ellen Jemima Downs, through a stockbroker, and handed her the money—I never went to a public-house with them at all, until the bonds were sold, on 23rd July, and the prisoner was in the country then—I did not go to see a public-house before it was taken.

Prisoner. Q. Did not you ask mother about taking a public-house? A. Most certainly not—I went to your mother's public-house two months after it was taken.

GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

OLD COURT.—Thursday, August 18th, 1870.

Before Mr. Baron Martin.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-681
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence; Not Guilty > unknown; Guilty > unknown

Related Material

681. HENRY BANKS and JULIUS LAWRENCE were again indicted, with BARTHOLOMEW SYLVESTER SAINSBURY (58) , for unlawfully obtaining money by false pretences. Other Counts—for a conspiracy to obtain money.

MESSRS. METCALFE and JELF conducted the Prosecution; and MR. CUNNINGHAM the Defence.

MR. METCALFE offered no evidence against Laurence.

WILLIAM ARTHUR LUNN . I am secretary to the society for the relief of small debtors—the Earl of Romney is one of the trustees—on 28th June the prisoner Sainsbury presented this petition to the society—(This was dated 25th June, and signed "B. S. Sainsbury" stating that he was an estate agent, at 186, Walworth Road, was married, and had one child, under sixteen, that he was a prisoner in Whitecross Street, at the suit of Robert Woods, in formd pauperis, requesting a donation of 30l., 40l., or 50l., and giving references. The petition in bankruptcy was also put in, in which Sainsbury stated that he was imprisoned at the suit of Robert Wood, for 25l., money lent, judgment recovered in the Queen's Bench; and in the accounts appeared "Robert Woods, of Kent Street, Borough, 25l., for money lent, has sued me in the Queen's Bench")—I gave Sainabury a copy of the rules for petitioning the society, perhaps a fortnight before his petition came in—he was then summoned to be examined before the governors, on 6th July—he attended—the Earl of Romney was in the chair, and other governors were present—I heard Sainsbury asked certain questions, and made these notes on the very day—(Read: "Have you been imprisoned for debt, and gone through the Court of Bankruptcy, in formd pauperis? I have. What is the name of your detaining creditor? Robert Woods. What address? Kent Street, Borough. What was the debt for? Balance of money lent. What Court were the proceedings taken in? The Queen's Bench.") Mr. Doyle, the society's solicitor, than said 'Now, mind how you answer; were you not really and truly arrested at the suit of Henry Banks, under process of the Lord Mayor's Court, imprisoned on the 8th, and discharged by Banks on 11th December last?" 'No' A governor then said 'Who prepared your petition to this society? 'I, myself.' 'And the copy of your petition?' 'Myself, too' Mr. Doyle, for the last time, cautioned

him, and said 'Now, Mr. Sainsbury, will you leave this room, persisting in asserting that you have stated the truth to the governors? His reply was 'I have'—He was then sent away, and told that he would be communicated with.

Cross-examined. Q. Was the copy of rules given to him about a fortnight before his petition? A. I should think so, when he made application to know whether he was eligible at all—he was informed that he could not lend in his petition until he had obtained his discharge—it seemed to me that he always called his detaining creditor Woods, and not Wood—I did not notice that it was spelt both ways.

RICHARD JAMES PAWLEY . I am Deputy-Registrar at the Lord Mayor's Court—I produce the proceedings in "Banks v. Sainsbury," "Banks v. Everest," and "Banks v. John Coleman," dated 8th December, 1869—consent to final judgment is apparently signed by those three, on the same date; upon which judgment is signed for 21l., and execution would necessarily follow.

WILLIAM ARTHUR BROWN LUNN (re-examined.) I never saw Sainsbury write; but, to the best of my knowledge, the signature to this consent is his, by comparing it with the signature to his petition—when the governor said "Who wrote the petition?" he said himself—(This was dated 8th December, 1869, and was a consent to a judgment for 21l., and 1l. costs, signed "B. S. Sainsbury witness, H. Banks")

JOHN FITCH . I am Deputy Serjeant at Mace to the Mayoris Court—I produce a warrant for the arrest of Everest, Sainsbury, and Coleman, at the suit of Henry Banks dated, 8th December, 1869—I arrested them all at the Peacock—I told Sainsbury at whose suit I arrested him, and then took him to Whitecross Street—two days afterwards I received this discharge, which I believe to be in Banks' writing, "Please discharge out of your custody the abovenamed defendant."

Cross-examined. Q. Do you know that there is a distinction between a detaining and an execution creditor? A. If the man is in there, I lodge it and detain him; but if I take him there, I say, "I lodge the defendant mentioned in the warrant," although he may have been arrested at the suit of Henry Banks, it may be true that some other person is his detaining creditor.

BENJAMIN CONSTABLE . I am Governor of Whitecross Street Prison—I produce a warrant under which Sainsbury was brought to me in custody on 8th December—no detainer was lodged against him, and he was discharged on the 11th—two affidavits were sworn before me, one verifying the petitioner, and the other stating that he was a pauper—they purport to be signed by B. J. Sainsbury—this is my signature.

MR. CUNNINGHAM to JOHN FITCH. Q. When you arrested Sainsbury, are you sure you said it was at the suit of Banks? A. Yes—I cannot say whether he understood it—I said it in his hearing, and in the prison I said that it was at the suit of Henry Banks—he made no remark.

HENRY CHARLES BRETT (Detective Officer). I searched Sainsbury at Moor Lane Station, and found these documents on him, and this one he gave me—(The Society's directions, and a letter dated 6th July from the Society to Sainsbury)—I found this draft petition on him.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you arrest Sainsbury? A. Yes, in company with Sergeant Bull—the warrant was read to him, and he said he was quite Billing to go with us—he said nothing about Woods—(Letter read from Mr. Lunn to B. S. Sainsbury: "Sir,—With respect to your petition to this Society

for donation, I am directed to inform you that the Governors refuse to make a grant in the case.")

Witness for the Defence.

ROBERT WOODS . I am a coach trimmer and harness maker, of 11 and 12, Kent Street, Borough—Sainsbury is my brother-in-law—about May last he owed me 25l.—I had an interview with him on the subject; I wanted my money, and things were very bad with me—I was recommended to a man named Bacon, who recommended me to Banks—I saw Banks, and told him I wanted to get my money from Sainsbury—he said "Very well," and mentioned Mr. Lawrence as a respectable attorney—in a few days I saw him again, and paid him 3l. 10s., for costs to go on with the case, and instructed him to bring an action in my name, and a very few days afterwards Sainsbury was arrested and taken into Whitecross Street Prison—I did not give Banks the slightest authority to bring the action in his own name—after giving those instructions to Banks, I had an interview with Sainsbury before he was arrested—I referred to my interview with Banks when I met Sainsbury; I told him I should want my money, and he had better go and see Banks, through the recommendation of Bacon—I cannot remember what he said—I do not remember referring to any proceedings—I heard of Sainsbury's arrest, and I thought he was arrested at my suit—I always believed that—after his arrest I had an interview with him in Whitecross Street Prison, but nothing particular was mentioned in the matter of the action upon which he was arrested—I also communicated my belief to Sainsbury that he was arrested at my suit, and he did not contradict me or differ—I do not think he mentioned the name of the suit under which he was arrested—I did not see Mr. Lawrence on the subject of that action—some papers were signed in my presence, somewhere about 8th "December, I should think—nothing was read over—Banks said "Make haste and sign them"—this was in a little dark room in his office at Cripplegate—I told Sainsbury that Banks was going to arrest him; he said "All right"—it was at my own suit—I was surprised when I heard Banks' name down, inasmuch as I put it into Banks hands to arrest him and put him in Whitecross Street—the end of it was, that he was there some little time and then came out again—my 25l. was a loss to me.

Cross-examined by MR. METCALFE. Q. Were you present when the document, was signed, for Banks to sue him in the Lord Mayor's Court? A. Yes, I recollect some papers being signed—two strangers were present—I cannot say who they were—I did not notice whether there were three persons included in the same judgment, to be sued by Banks—I intended to take Sainsbury through the Court, though he had nothing to pay, because I thought I might get my money from some of his friends—what I wanted was, that Banks should take him through the Court—Banks told me he would get me my money, and I suppose I gave Banks the 3l. 10s. that he might take him through the Court—after seeing that consent to judgment signed, I think we went straight to the Peacock—I do not know whether the boy, Reader, went with us—we all had a glass at the Peacock, and then went over to Whitecross Street, and I was not troubled any more afterwards—I do not know whether there was an action of mine in the Queen's Bench; I know nothing at all about it—I live in Kent Street, Borough; I have lived in the Borough thirty-four years—I do not live in Judd Street, but I have a brother-in-law there, a brother of the prosecutor; his name is George, and he lived at 82, Judd Street—my name is Woods, but letters

sometimes come in the name of Wood—my brother-in-law ought to know how to spell my name—the debt was 10l. borrowed in 1861, and 15l. in 1867, which I let him have to pay two quarters' rent—this is the receipt for the rent I paid in 1867 (produced); it is for 7l. 10s. on each side of it—I lent Sainsbury the money for it.

MR. CUNNINGHAM. Q. When the quarter's rent was paid, was the receipt handed over to you? A. Yes, as an acknowledgment—this is two receipts in one, if you turn it over—he also gave me an I O U, but I thought the money was a dead loss, and I burnt some other papers with it—whatever my object was in instituting proceedings, I directed Banks to bring an action, in my name, against Sainsbury, and I believed he was arrested in the proceedings on that action—I communicated that to Sainsbury.

COURT. Q. Did you really go to Banks for the purpose of getting your own debt paid, or for the purpose of getting him through the Court of Bankruptcy? A. For the purpose of getting him through the Court of Bankruptcy, and without the slightest expectation of getting my own money.


SAINSBURY received a good character

GUILTY Three Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-682
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

682. THOMAS MUSGROVE (53), and SAMPSON ISAACS (51) , Stealing 148 yards of cloth, of Frederick Bidgood, the master of Musgrove.

MESSRS. STRAIGHT and MOODY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS appeared for Musgrove, and MR. ST. AUBYN for Isaacs.

CHARLES WALKER . I am undergoing a sentence in the House of Correction, Clerkenwell—I was in the service of Mr. Bidgood, of 6, Vigo Street, Regent Street, ten years—I have known Musgrove about twenty years, and Isaacs rather more than three years—Musgrove was in the habit of calling at Mr. Bidgood's twice a day, from 12 to 2 o'clock, and from 6 to 7 o'clock, for goods to damp, for Joseph Sparrow—he introduced me to Isaacs at Mr. Bidgood's—in March, this year, I took forty-eight yards of cloth from Mr. Bidgood's to take to Isaacs—I stole it, and gave it to Musgrove, from 1.30 to 2 o'clock—I gave him a largo sheet of brown paper to wrap it in—this was at the back door, where the vans come—he had Sparrow's van with him, and I told him to take it down to Isaacs—he had taken goods before to Isaacs—he had other goods for his master there—Isaacs knew I was a warehouseman there—I went next day to Isaacs' house, 10, Commercial Street, Whitechapel, a little dirty tailor's shop—I told him I had sent him a piece of cloth, and he found fault with it being so thin, he also found fault with Musgrove for driving right up to his door with the van, and said he ought to have sent it by Parcels' Delivery Company, or carrier—we went out and had something to drink—he told me to meet him two nights afterwards in Finabury Square—I did so, and took him two vesting lengths, and two lengths of trowsering, which I had stolen from my master, for which he gave me a little parcel with eight sovereigns in it; that was for the piece of goods and the trowsering and vesting—he told me to give Musgrove 35s., and next day, when Musgrove came to Mr. Bidgood's, I gave him 30s. then and 5s. in the evening—he said "All right"—this (produced) is the doth I took, and these other articles are the same pattern and colour—I was taken in custody on 16th May, and charged at Marlborough Street with stealing six yards of cloth from my master—I was sent to prison for six months with hard labour—I took the cloth to a little public-house where

I used to dine, and in the evening I took it down to Isaacs, and told him what length there was, and he promised to meet me on Sunday morning, but I could not because I was in custody—I informed the police where the six yards of cloth was—I was fint introduced to Isaacs in the King's Arms public-house three years ago—Musgrove came into Mr. Bidgood's, and asked me how I was—I said I was hard up—he told me to let him have a piece of cloth, he knew where he could get rid of it—I refused, but on being asked two or three times more, I consented, and gave him 15 yards or 20 yards of cloth at 16s. or 17s.—when he came in the evening, he said there was a man in Warwick Street, Regent Street, at a public-house, waiting to see me—I went over there, and saw Musgrove come outside the door; he met me before I went inside, and told me he was not there but at the King's Arms, Glasshouse Street, as there were two or three people in the public-house in Warwick Street who knew me and knew Sampson, and he thought we had better not be seen together, somebody in our trade—I went to a public-house in Glasshouse Street, and saw Isaacs standing in the bar; Musgrove drove up with Sparrow's cart, pointed me out to Isaacs, told him I was the man, and drove away—Isaacs asked me to take a walk—we walked round the back streets in the neighbourhood, and I looked round to see if anybody was coming—he told me not to be afraid, as I was perfectly safe in his hands—we went and had something to drink, and he said that anything I could get he could do with—he told me to meet him two nights afterwards, in Jermyn Street, Piccadilly, about 7.30—I did so, and he gave me a little parcel containing 7l. or 8l., and told me to give Musgrove a sovereign, and said he had given him one, or would give him one himself—I gave Musgrove I next day, at Sackville Street—there were never any bills in these transactions between us—I do not suppose that Isaacs knew that my name was Walker, at the first transaction—I also took 11/2 yards of figured velvet from my master, and gave it to Isaacs myself—this is it (produced)—no inducement whatever has been made to me to make this statement; I am telling the truth.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Is Mr. Bidgood's a wholesale or retail shop? A. Wholesale—he sells to tailors, and has a very large business—the usual custom when goods are sent out is, to enter them in the day-book, or on approbation—I sometimes superintended sending goods out—very small quantities were sent out sometimes—I have known Isascs three years and upwards—I have sold him lengths of trowsering, at his house, about six times—I have been in his house twenty-five or thirty times—on one or two occasions I told him that I had bought them of Mr. Bidgood, one or two lengths—that was to get more money for them—I did not deal with Isaacs as if I was coming direct from my employer—I did buy one or two lengths of Mr. Bidgood—I gave Mr. Isaacs to understand that I had come by them honestly—his sons and daughters were sometimes in his shop when I took things there—there are shelves there, and one or two paper parcels on them—I said before the Magistrate "I cannot say I told him I had stolen the property, there was no occasion"—I said that there was no occasion, because he was in the habit of buying stolen property of me—I have not seen my deposition from Marlborougn Street since I have been in prison, nor has it been read over to me—I have had no communication with my solicitor, or anyone connected with it, since I left Marlborough Street—I have been carrying on the system of

robbing my employer about five years, and have robbed him to a very considerable extent—Isaacs sometimes paid me when I sold hit goods in the shop, and sometimes he put me off for another time—he generally brought me the money to Finsbury Square—he said that it was the beat and quietest place to meet—he has also met me at a public-house in Montague Street, Whitechapel, and paid me there.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. What is the name of the house? A. I do not know, it is a little house on the left side—these conversations took place three years ago and upwards—I have only been charged at present with stealing six yards of cloth—Mr. Bretton, the solicitor who conducted the case, come to me at the House of Detention, and I asked him to ask Mr. Bidgood to let me off—he said that Mr. Bidgood would not prosecute me for the other cloth, if I told—I then gave the whole statement that' I have given to-day.

MR. MOODT. Q. Does Mr. Bidgood allow persons in the employment to take away damaged goods? A. Yes—the things I sold to Isaacs were obtained in that way, and some were bad lengths.

JOHN WILLIAM CRUMP . I work for Mr. Sparrow—Musgrove was his carman, and I used to go with him in the cart—he used to call it Mr. Bidgood's back door, to get cloth to damp—I went there with him on 3rd March, between 1 and 2 o'clock, and saw Walker bring out a large roll of black cloth, and afterwards some paper and string, with which Musgrove tied up the goods, and put them in the van—it was not usual to wrap up the cloth taken away, except when they were scarlets—we took that roll of cloth to Isaac's place, Commercial Street, Whitechapel—I had been there two or three times before with Musgrove—Mr. Sparrow does not work for Isaacs—this is the cloth.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. Has Musgrove been in the employment a great number of years? A. Yes—there is nothing extraordinary in a carman delivering a parcel on his road, if asked—it was in the open day.

JOSEPH SPARROW . I am a cloth worker—Musgrove was in my employment seventeen years, and up to this transaction—he had to collect goods, and deliver them to me—I worked for Mr. Bidgood—Isaacs was not a customer of mine—Musgrove had no business to call on him on my account—I had no customers in that part of the town—it is beyond my radius—I have no customers in Whitechapel.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. Had you Clark & Co. and Hopkins, in Bishopsgate Street? A. Yes.

BENJAMIN CRIDDLE . I am manager to Mr. Bidgood—I recognize this piece of black cloth as similar to his—I missed a similar piece from the stock.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBYN. Q. Does Mr. Bidgood allow any of his men to sell any kind of cloth? A. Yes, but it is entered in a day-book on the desk—we sell any lengths that tailors require.

Cross-examined by MR. M. WILLIAMS. Q. He allows the men to sell on heir own account, and to account to him for it? A. Not on their own account, only the regular travellers.

COURT. Q. He does not allow the shopmen to carry goods down to Whitechapel? A. No.

WILLIAM HBNRY LAW . I am a woollen manufacturer, of Huddarsfield—I made these nine pieces of vesting for Mr. Bidgood only.

ARTHUR SMITH . I am book-keeper to Mr. Bidgood—a quantity of goods were missed from the stock, and among them forty-eight yards of cloth, nine pieces of vesting, and some velveteen—some portion of the same goods have been sold.

THOMAS PICKLES (Detective Officer C). On 20th May, I went with Peachey to Isaacs' house, and asked for some black cloth—there was some lying on the counter, and we asked him if he had any more—he said "No"—Peachey put his hand on a pile of cloth lying on the counter, and took down three or four pieces, among which was this six yards of black cloth—Mr. Wackley identified it—I told Isaacs we were police officers, and that I believed he had bought this piece of cloth from a man named Walker—he said no, he bought it of a traveller, and gave 2l. 10s. for it—he, did not know his name, but he would call again, as he had only paid him part of the money—I asked him if he had got an invoice of it—he said "No"—I said "If you do not produce it I shall take you into custody for receiving it with a guilty knowledge"—he said that we were very wrong, and he could produce the invoice at the proper time, and that he never bought of thieves of bad character—we took him in custody, and this waistcoating and trowsering were found on the premises at the same time.

Cross-examined by MR. ST. AUBTN. Q. Were you in plain clothes? A. Yes; the cloth was among a pile of remuants.

(Isaacs received a good character.)

GUILTY.—Strongly recommended to mercy by the Jury on account of their good characters. — Ten Years' Penal Servitude each.

NEW COURT, Thursday, August 18th, and

OLD COURT, Friday, August 19th, 1870.

Before Mr. Justice Byles.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-683
VerdictMiscellaneous > no agreement

Related Material

683. THOMAS PEARCE (35) , Unlawfully concealing and embezzling his property, with intent to defraud his creditors, he having been adjudicated a bankrupt.

MESSRS. GIFFARD, Q.C., BESLEY, and STRAIGHT, conducted the Prosecution; and MESSRS. BROMBY and FITZMAURICE the Defence.

The Jury, after consulting upwards of five hours, being unable to agree, were discharged, and the trial was postponed to the next Session.

THIRD COURT.—Thursday, August 18th, 1870.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-684
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

684. RICHARD BOYELL (55) , Unlawfully, by false pretences, obtaining from Alfred Maddux the sum of 1l. 2s. 6d., and other sums amounting to 24l.

MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. KELLEY the Defence.

ROBERT ADAMS . I am a mechanical engineer, of 25, Falmouth Road, Southwark—I have known the prisoner twelve months—he was in the service of Messrs. Michelmore and Reap, engineers, of the Borough Road—they are manufacturers of hinges—I left them at the end of March—I have invented a hinge of a better character than any existing—this is it (produced)—I lodged to the Patent Office, on 11th April, a specification with respect to it—I paid 5l. for it—before 11th April I spoke to the prisoner about an idea I had which I would work out and show him—my brother showed him the model in my presence, on 8th April—I told him I should

get a certificate of lodgment the next day—my brother read over the specification to him on the 9th—the prisoner thought it a good idea—he said he was well connected with people who required these kind of things, and he could sell any amount of them—through that I supplied him with four of these hinges—they had plates like this (produced)—that plate exactly fits this hinge; the holes for the screws also fit—my plates had the words "R. A., 25, Falmouth Road, Borough"—he said he had been round making people acquainted with the nature of the hinge, and that Mr. Mathews, engineer of the North London Railway had given orders to have them tried, and he would get a testimonial from him—he came to me on 18th July, and said they were to be fixed on the following Thursday—he came that day and received wages—he was my servant as a traveller—I paid him a percentage—I paid him 3l. in all, for the hinges he sold for me—he came on the Wednesday following, and said the hinges could not be fixed as Mr. Mathews was going into the country—I went to the North London Railway and saw Boyell there—I made inquiries at the station—I saw one of my hinges fixed without the top plate to it—I saw the prisoner on the following Saturday—I told him I wanted an explanation, as he had not come to me by appointment—he said "I want an explanation of yours"—he told me the patent was not mine, that I should not have it—he said he had been to the country that week and ordered 1000—I said I would prevent his receiving one of them—I used to meet him in coffee-houses, and talk of other hinges—I have a drawing of a design of his.

Cross-examined. Q. Is that hinge there in accordance with the specification you had lodged at the Patent Office? A. In principle it is—I had several meetings to look at the working of the prisoner's hinges at St. Thomas's Hospital—the prisoner gave me an order to make him four hinges, and on those hinges I put the brass plates bearing my name.

The Court considered that there was no evidence against the prisoner.


FOURTH COURT.—Thursday, August 18th, 1870.

Before Mr. Recorder.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-685
VerdictMiscellaneous > no agreement

Related Material

685. JAMES ANDERSON (55) , Indecently assaulting Thomas Mundenhall, with intent to commit an unnatural crime.

MR. LILLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MESSRS. RIBTON and MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.

The Jury, not being able to agree, were discharged without giving a verdict, and the trial was postponed to next Session.


Before Mr. Baron Martin.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-686
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

686. ANDREW FERRIN (53) , Feloniously killing and slaying Mary Ferrin.

MR. BROWN, for the prosecution, offered no evidence.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-687
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

687. ANDREW FERRIN was again indicted for unlawfully assaulting Mary Ferrin, and causing her actual bodily harm.

MR. BROWN offered no evidence.


Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-688
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

688. CHARLES MOUNTEER (18), PLEADED GUILTY to breaking and entering the shop of Spencer, Holdsworth & Co., and stealing therein two pumps, and twenty brass cuttings, their property.

Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-689
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

689. WILLIAM BOFFEE (37) , Breaking into the dwelling-house of John Webb, and stealing therein 1 lb. of tea, and other articles, his property.

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; and MR. LANOFORD the Defence.

JOHN WEBB . I am the prosecutor—I carry on business at Marsh Street, Walthamstow—the prisoner was my landlord—on 24th June I left my shop at 6.30 in the evening, fastened up as usual, all the doors secured—I went to my shop at Forest Hill, and afterwards went back to Walthamstow, and got there about 9 o'clock in the morning, and went to my shop—I entered by the back door—as soon as I entered the parlour leading to the shop, I discovered the parlour window thrown up, and saw the prisoner helping himself to my goods, and putting them into a bag—I said "Mr. Bofiee, this is too bad; I have often been robbed, now I have caught you in the very act"—he looked confused, and said "Come let me out"—I unlocked the door leading from the parlour into the shop, and he came into the room—he came from the shop into the parlour—he said "We can settle this matter"—I told him I could not accept of any settlement at all—I looked into the shop again, and saw all the things about in disorder—I returned—he was still pleading for me to let him go—I said I could not do any more, but that I intended putting the matter in my solicitor's hands—he then seized me by the back of the neck, clutched his fingers under my throat, caught my beard, pulled me to the ground, and hit me a blow on the head with the door-keeper or some hard instrument—he said "You b——y b——r, I will do for you"—I said "Pray don't"—he said "You b——r, I will do for you"—he then hit me on the head once or twice, and put his hand into my mouth, caught me with his nails under the tongue, and loosened all my teeth—I screamed out "Murder!"—he gave me another blow on the nose and lip—I called till exhausted—my next door neighbour, Mr. Judd, came to the front door, a glass door—he could not get in there, and went round to the back premises, and just as he entered the prisoner made a violent blow at my temple—he disabled my left-hand, separated the ligaments of two fingers, and rendered them useless—he ran off when Mr. Judd came—I raised myself, and asked him to go for aisiatance.

Cross-examined. Q. Have you been thrown out of your cart this morning? A. Yes—the prisoner came down the staircase from the skylight of my bedroom window—it had been fastened down for more than twelve months, and I found it wide open—he had been pretending to repair the skylight the day before—he never had kept my place in very good repair—I had only been in the shop about ten months—he was a baker—I took the grocery business of him—in order to get in the back way you have to go through his premises—he was not painting the skylight when I returned that morning—he did not tell me a quarter's rent was due—he did not tell me I must prepare to leave, because he was obliged to sell the houses—I did not say I would charge him with stealing, if he did not remit the quarter's rent—I did not assault him when Mr. Judd came in to help me

I said "See what Boffee has done," and pointed to the blood on my hand and face—I did not say a word to him about the robbery—the day of the assault was quarter-day—my son helped me in business—he was my partner, and he has taken goods from my premises, thinking they were at much his as mine—he is twenty-three.

MR. COOPER. Q. When was he there last? A. He has not entered my shop for eleven months—I have often been robbed—I was prepared to pay my rent that day—it was 5l. a quarter.

JOHN JUDD . I am a coal dealer, of Marsh Street, Walthamstow—on this morning, between 9 and 10 o'clock, I heard cries of "Murder!" in Mr. Webb's voice—I went to the door of his shop, and looked through—I saw them scuffling together—I went round, and got over the wall at the back.

Cross-examined. Q. How long have you been in Walthamstow? A. Since 1853—during that time I do not know anything against the prisoner—he bears a respectable character among his neighbours.

FRANCIS WAGSTAFF . I am a surgeon, of Walthamstow—I was called to the prosecutor, and found six large scalp wounds on his head, the skin of his nose was abrased, his eye discoloured, his right hand severely injured, the two bones being separated, his front teeth all loose, his beard came out in handfuls; the gums were in an inflamed state, showing he had had great violence inflicted on him—a blunt instrument caused the blows.

MATTHEW NUNAN . (Detective Officer). I took the prisoner on 13th July, on the landing stage of the Liverpool Docks—before that I went to a public-house at Dartford, and ascertained that he had pasted himself off there as a detective, in search of a prisoner who had committed a burglary and maimed an old gentleman—I told him the charge, and he said "All right, you need not tell anybody; if I had money, you should never have caught me"—I searched his house on 24th June, and found these clothes (produced) covered with blood—I went into the prosecutor's house, and he produced his whiskers (produced) which the prisoner had pulled off.

GUILTY Seven Years' Penal Servitude.


Before Robert Malcolm Kerr Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-690
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

690. GEORGE WILLIAM STANLEY (21) , Stealing a copper, 3 ft. of lead pipe, and a metal tap, fixed to a building, the property of James Battishall.

MR. MCDONALD conducted the Protection.

STEPHEN JOHN EDWARDS . I am a waterman, and live at I, West Row, Deptford—on Thursday morning, 7th July, I was in bed in my house, which as in a row of houses, with gardens behind, which are separated by a low fence—about 4.30 I heard a noise, and I went towards the water closet of the next house, which was empty, and saw the prisoner looking out from behind the water closet door—I asked him what he did there, and he said he was doing nothing—I saw him that a knife up, and put it in his pocket—I did not see him doing anything with the knife; but I noticed the lead cut off adjoining the washhouse—I also saw a copper boiler—I took the prisoner, and gave him in charge to 329 R.

Prisoner. I own being in the yard; but the property was there when I went into it.

WILLIAM NORMAN . I am agent to Mr. James Battishall, the owner of

2, West Row, next door to Mr. Edwards—it is unoccupied at present—I have seen the copper and the lead pipe belonging to it—they were safe in the washhouse when I saw them last—the lead pipe has been cut as with a knife—it corresponds with the pipe left at the house—the lead cut off is worth about 10s.—there is a brass tap attached to it.

DAVID EVANS (Policeman R 329). The prisoner was given into my custody on the morning of 7th July, by Edwards—I asked him what business he had in the empty house, and he said he merely went in to see what he could see—I found a clasp knife in his pocket, which would cut lead pipe.

Prisoner's Defence. I am not guilty of the robbery; I own to being in the place.


He also PLEADED GUILTY to having been before convicted, in March, 1869— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.


Before Mr. Baron Martin.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-691
VerdictMiscellaneous > unfit to plead
SentenceImprisonment > insanity

Related Material

691. ANN MESSER (46), was indicted for the wilful murder of Fanny Messer.

It appearing, by the evidence of JOHN ROWLAND GIBSON, surgeon of Newgate, that the prisoner was of unsound mind, and incapable of pleading, she was ordered to be detained till Her Majesty's pleasure be known.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-692
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

692. JAMES MONKS (53) , Feloniously killing and slaying Henry Coomber. He was also charged on the Coroner's Inquisition with the like offence.

MR. BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.

WILLIAM BUCK . I am assistant engineer to the Brighton Railway—I made these plans of the line at the point in question—they are correct—the line is practically level at Croydon—the red is the Croydon line—these are the signals, and here are the signals on the green line—all the signals shown on this plan are worked from the Sydenham station signal-box—we call the signals at the box the "home" signals; the next, towards Sydenham, are the "stop" signals, and the next, going towards Penge, is the "distance" signal—when the signal is at "all right" on the green, or Crystal Palace line, it is necessarily at "danger" on the red line, from the mechanism—these signals have been at work for three years before the accident—I examined them after the accident, and they were working perfectly—I am acquainted with the line—when a train is pulled up at the Penge station, the driver can see the distance signal—a train of ten vehicles, engine, tender, and two break vans, going at the rate of twenty miles an hour, on a gradient of 1 in 600, could be pulled up, in ordinary weather, in about 350 yards; it depends upon the break power—the distance signal is 700 yards from the point of collision, and if the break power was applied, there would be 400 yards to spare—the stop signal is 126 yards from the point of collision—when the driver is alongside the distance signal, he sees the stop signal, and if by any accident he overlooks the distance signal, he would still have 600 yards or 700 yards to pull up in—a driver coming up from Penge would see the home signal, if at "danger," quite as soon as he saw the stop signal, if not before, from the Croydon line—the home Signal is the highest from the ground, and is visible as the driver passes the

distance signal—with regard to the Crystal Palace, the green line, the same rules apply—the distance signal on the Crystal Palace line is 700 yards from the home signal, and it is 126 yards from the stop signal to the fouling point—the gradient there, on the Crystal Palace line, is 1 in 60 for a certain distance, and 1 in 100 at the point of collision—the driver of 10 vehicles, with two breaks, could pull up his train in about 500 yards, when travelling at twenty miles an hour on a gradient of 1 in 100.

Cross-examined. Q. Did they point out to you the spot where the deceased jumped off the train? A. No; but I know it within a few yards—I have not measured it; I should think it is about 100 yards from where he jumped off, to the point of collision, where the trains first touched; I do not think it would be more.

COLONEL YOLLAND . I am one of the railway inspectors of the Board of Trade—I investigated the cause of this accident, and made a report to the Board of Trade—I have seen the signals—it is impossible for them to show "all right" for the Croydon line and "all right" for the Crystal Palace line also.

CHARLES JUDGE . I am a signalman in the employ of the Brighton Railway—I have been in their service fourteen years, at Sydenham—our telegraph lad, Smith, was with me in the signal-box, and I was to be relieved by another signalman—a Crystal Palace train was timed to run through Sydenham Station without stopping; it was given out to me at 1.31, but it was a little late—we expected it to run under our signals about 1.28, and the Croydon stopping train at 1.32, about four minutes later—before the trains come we receive notice of their, approach from the Crystal Palace bank top, and from Penge—before the departure of the trains from the Crystal Palace they indicate it by four rings from the Crystal Palace, and one ring from Croydon, both which signals indicate that a train is coming—I received a signal on this day from the Crystal Palace at 1.31 to indicate that a Crystal Palace train was coming—that was three minutes after the time that it should have been with us—I also received, at 1.31, a signal from Penge of the starting of the Croydon train—at that time all the signals on both lines were at danger, and, on both trains being signalled at the same moment, I opened the Crystal Palace road and put all the signals for the train to run through—I dropped the home signal, the auxiliary signal, and the junction signal, and put them at "all right" for the Crystal Palace train to come through—all the Croydon signals stood at "danger," I could not alter them—I watched for the Crystal Palace train, so that when he came in sight I could put the distance signal on to protect her behind—I saw both trains coming—they were inside the distance signal when I saw them first—I did not alter the signals, I never touched them; but when I saw that there would be a collision, I threw the auxiliary up on the Crystal Palace line—I threw the arm up to "danger"—that would not affect the signals on the Crystal Palace side at all, they stood at "danger" still—"danger" was up on both auxiliaries—I threw up the home signal as well on the Crystal Palace line, the Croydon one was already at "danger"—that left both the home signals at "danger"—I do not think the Crystal Palace train could have stopped after I gave the signal—while this was doing, the Croydon train was coming on—I could hear the beat of the engine, and that was when I threw the auxiliary up—I saw the collision—it took place, as near as I could sec, below the auxiliaries, nearer the points—at the time of the collision the Croydon engine was leading by five or six carriage lengths, from

what I could see—the Croydon train was due to stop at Sydenham at 1.32—it was due to leave Penge at 1.29—both trains were late, the Croydon train was three minutes late—three minutes was the allotted time between Penge and Sydenham for the stopping train—if the Croydon train was leading, the Crystal Palace train would run into it—I saw nothing of the deceased man Cooper—the prisoner was the driver of the Croydon train.

Cross-examined. Q. Then if the trains had kept their proper time this collision could not have happened? A. No—we have no book time—we expected the Croydon train at 1.27 or 1.28, and it was given out at 1.31—it never reached my box—the collision was between 1.33 and 1.34, as near as I could say in my hurry.

JAMES TOWNSEND . I am a signalman in the employ of the Brighton Rail-way Company—on 8th July I was going to relieve Judge at his signalbox, and I was walking along the line from Penge towards the signalbox—the Croydon train was not at Penge when I left at 1.23 or 1.24—the distance signal was against the Croydon driver, and the auxiliary and the home signals were also at "danger"—when I was about twenty yards on the Penge side of the stop signal and before I got to it, the Croydon train passed me at, I should think, fourteen miles an hour, but I am not a judge of the pace—the steam was on when it passed me until I called the driver's attention to the signal being against him by halloaing to him, and likewise to the fireman who was on the engine—the prisoner was the driver—I saw the signals pulled off on the Crystal Palace line, for "all right"—the fireman of the Croydon train ran to the break directly and put it on, and the steam was shut off for about half a minute and then it was put on again, and it whistled—the Croydon train had not passed the stop signal before the steam was shut off—the steam was shut off first, and it ran some twenty or thirty yards past the signal before the steam was put on again, but I don't know whether the engine had been reversed before the steam was put on again—I did not notice any alteration made in the home signals after I called attention to it—I saw the collision, I was close to it—the driver was almost foul of the junction when the steam was put on again, and the Palace train ran into the Croydon train—I did not see the deceased jump out—the front break of the Croydon train was off, and the wheels were free; but I don't know anything about the hinder break—at the time I saw the fireman go to the tender break the engine whistled, to call his attention to the break—both trains whistled about the same time.

Cross-examined. Q. Would the effect of shutting off the steam be to stop it before it reached the Junction? A. Yes, and putting on the steam would be to try and clear it.

DRAYTON SMITH . I have been in the service of the Brighton Railway Company twenty-seven years, and eighteen years a driver—on 8th July I was driving the Crystal Palace train—I had eleven vehicles, besides the engine and tender, of which two were breaks, one at each end—I got to the Crystal Palace at 1.27, and left at 1.29—the proper time for arriving was 1.23, and for leaving, 1.25—I can see the distance signal soon after I leave the Crystal Palace signals—it was at "all right" when I first saw it—I lost sight of the distance signal for a little time, on account of the trees, and when I saw it again it was "all right," as before—when I got opposite the distance signal I saw the Croydon train going up to the auxiliary signals, which were at "stop"—they were against him—he had no steam on, and he seemed to be going to pull up—my signals

were "all right," for me to go through—I shut my steam off when I passed the Crystal Palace box, on account of the decline, and I ran down at eighteen miles an hour—I was going at about fourteen miles an hour when I shut off the steam; but the train would have a speed of eighteen miles, on account of the incline—the home signal was "all right," for me—I then saw the Croydon train going up to the signals; but it had no steam on; and when I was going close towards the signals I saw that he had steam on, as if he was going to pull into the station—the driving wheels were going ahead—I could tell that by the rods—directly I saw that he had steam on I reversed my engine, and gave the alarm to the guard to put on the breaks—if I had seen that he had steam on before, I could have pulled up sooner—I thought he had mistaken my signals for his—I had not passed my auxiliary signal—I could have done so before any alteration was made in it; but it was altered to "danger" just as I came to it; and I could not do anything more—the Crystal Palace trains are very heavy upon an incline, and it takes a greater distance to pull them up than on the level ground—I went on, I daresay, for 100 or 130 yards after the wheels were reversed, before the collision took place—by what I had done I had reduced the speed of my train very much, and I expected we should have stopped before we got to the Croydon train—we were going about three miles an hour at the time of the collision—as soon as my engine touched the train it threw it off the road, into an embankment—Coomber, who was killed, was riding in the break nearest to the engine, the first break, which has a glass front to it—the Croydon carriages and the Crystal Palace carriages came fide by side—they were thrown off the line; but no carriages were upset, and no one was injured, only pressed together—the steps of the carriages and the handles of the doors were broken—I made a great alarm, and the first guard put on his break, and immediately he had done so he went to the door and jumped out of the carriage—that was before the collision, about 100 yards before it, I should think—at that time I could do nothing to prevent the collision.

COURT. Q. Did you do all that you possibly could? A. I did all I could to stop our train, when I saw the other one was going across the road, which I ought to be gaining myself.

MR. BESLEY. Q. Will the breaks stay on without being held? A. I got down after the accident, and looked at the break, and it was on then—Coomber got out on the left-hand side, coming from the Crystal Palace—he seemed to stumble down the bank—I did not see the carriages touch him, and don't know how he received his injuries—my attention was called to the passengers looking out of the windows of the Croydon train, when I made the alarm—I afterwards saw him lying, perhaps thirty yards from the hind part of the train, when we struck—he was not dead—they were putting him into the break, to take him to the hospital.

Cross-examined. Q. I believe you said that if he had remained in his box he would not have been hurt? A. Yes, because the break was not hurt—in my opinion he jumped out about 100 yards before the collision—he jumped out at the stop signal, or it might be a little bit further back—I could have stopped my train before the collision—a larger proportion of break would have stopped it quicker—I was one minute late at starting from Victoria Station, and I was delayed one minute on the Thames bridge which caused me to be four minutes late—I was examined at the Coroner's inquest—the prisoner was examined there.

COURT. Q. Which of the two trains ought to have been first, yours of his? A. I ought to have been first, mine was the express train—he ought to have been about four minutes behind me—he was just at the time he ought to have been at the station when this occurred.

WILLIAM BENJAMIN SAUNDERS . I am junior house surgeon at Guy's—the deceased was brought there on 8th July, suffering from crushed foot and ankle—his leg was amputated about 3 o'clock, a little after his admission—amputation was perfectly necessary, but he died under it.

Cross-examined. Q. He died under the operation, after the administration of chloroform? A. Yes—I think he might have had a chance if the chloroform had not been administered.

MR. BESLEY. Q. What was the cause of his death? A. The shock of the accident and the chloroform, the two together—I do not think you can put it down to either specially—in my judgment chloroform was necessary—Mr. Cooper Foster performed the operation.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Coroner: "I am willing to tell the Jury all I know; I was driving the Croydon train; I left Penge at 1.29; the distance signal was off before I started from Penge; I ran on through the bridge, and then saw the auxiliary signal off. I went on towards it, and when I got about ten yards from it, it was raised up, showing 'danger.' I then went on. I saw that mine was lifted up, and the Palace signal lowered. The Palace signal had been at 'danger' before that. I then saw the Crystal Palace train coming; Naylor, who was on my engine, said 'For God's sake, Jem, get on, that train will not stop.' I shut the steam off to stop at the station, but seeing the Crystal Palace train I put the steam on again in order to go through the station, ahead of the Crystal Palace train. The home signal was at 'danger;' I could not stop between the auxiliary signal and the points; I was going from sixteen to twenty miles an hour; I was never going less than sixteen miles an hour; I knew that I could not stop between that signal and the points, and I thought that all would be killed, so I put the steam on as the safest way of trying to avoid the mischief. It is not right to run against the signals. I had nobody in the hinder part of the train. I had five empty carriages behind. I had just pulled the engine up and let her go again. I have been on railways thirty years; if I had not gone on as I did the mischief would have been much worse."

MR. M. WILLIAMS contended that there was no case to go to the Jury, at the cause of death must be a complete art of negligence on the part of the accused, whereas had the deceased not jumped out, his death would not have occurred.

THE COURT left it to the Jury to consider whether the deceased's jumping out of the train was the act of a firm-minded and courageous man, in order to avoid impending peril, in which case the prisoner would be responsible; but if they thought the deceased jumped out through terror acting upon him, the prisoner would be Not Guilty.


Before Mr. Recorder.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-693
VerdictGuilty > unknown; Guilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment; Imprisonment

Related Material

693. GEORGE THOMPSON (18), and JAMES HEDLER (15) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of James Woodman, and stealing therein a pair of trowsers and 5s. 7d., his property.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution.

JAMBS WOODMAN . I am a licensed victualler, at 170, Union Street, Southwark—last Tuesday week, I was awoke about 5 o'clock by a constable

—I found the door leading to the stage of the music hall open—a person could get in under the stage by removing some boards—I missed 6s. or 7s., in silver and copper, from the till in the bar—I had seen it safe four hours and a half before, when I closed up and went to bed—a parcel of clothes had been taken from the bar into the music hall—I know the prisoner by sight as coming into the music hall—I found the hasp of the lock on the door leading to the cellar broken.

SAMUEL COLLINS . I am in the prosecutor's employment—a little after 12 o'clock on the morning of 9th August, I shut the premises up securely—the door leading to the stage was fastened by a wooden bar and the door under the stage was closed by a wooden button.

Thompson. Q. Do you always go under the stage to see if it is fastened or not? A. Always—I am quite sure it was fastened that night.

MATTHEW FOX (Police Inspector M) On 9th August, about 5 o'clock in the morning, I was in Ewer Street—I saw the prisoner Hedler put his head over a gate at the rear of the prosecutor's premises—I did not know him before—as soon as he saw me he jumped down from the gate, and ran back into the music hall—the door was open then—I am sure he is the man—I went into the music hall with a constable, and I saw the two prisoners on the roof—a ladder was placed against the window where they got out—I endeavoured to follow them, but the aperture was so small I could not get out—I pointed them out to the other constable, and he got through, and I as them chased down to the South-Western Railway—you can get from the music boll into the house without going out of doors—it was quite light.

THOMAS SUDBURY (Policeman M 142). I saw the prisoners, and followed them—I lost them at the railway station—I afterwards found them detained at the station-house—I searched Thompson, and found 51/4. in coppers, and 9d. in silver—I am quite sure they are the two men.

COURT to JAMES WOODMAN. Q. What was there in your till? A. About 5s. in coppers, a sixpence, and a 3d. piece in silver.

Thompson'g Defence. I went to the music hall on the Monday night, and fell asleep. I woke up about 4.30, and did not know how to get out We saw the policeman, and we got through the window and went over the railway line. We did not break in, or force the window or doors open.

Hedlers Defence. I went to sleep, and woke about 4 or 5 o'clock. I went to see how I could get out. I looked over the top of the gate, and law the policeman. I came back, and got away. I don't know anything about the money.

THOMPSON— GUILTY Eight Months' Imprisonment.

HEDLER— GUILTY Six Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-694
VerdictGuilty > unknown; Guilty > with recommendation
SentenceImprisonment; Imprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment

Related Material

694. JOHN MASON (20), RICHARD NEALE (29), and JAMES LAWRENCE (21) , Unlawfully assaulting James Austin and George Jordan, constables, in the execution of their duty, and occasioning them actual bodily harm.

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; MR. STRAIGHT appeared for Mcuon, and MR. COLE for Neale.

GEORGE JORDAN (Policeman L 77). On 28th June, about 12.45, I was in the Blackfriars Road—I was called by L 97, and went with him to Duke Street, opposite the Oxford Arms, where I saw Mason and a man named Collins, fighting—I told them to go away—they stopped for a time, and

then began fighting again—I pawed through the crowd, and took Mason in charge—he was very violent, and kicked me hard on the knee—Mason called for assistance—some of his friends came up, and amongst them Lawrence and Noale—Lawrence struck me over the left eye—I knew him by sight, and I am quite sure he is the man—Neale did nothing to me, but I saw him with half a brick in his hand—he threw it at Austin, another constable, and it struck him on the left temple—he fell down insensible—I took him to the station.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. When you first saw the disturbance were Mason and Colling having a fight? A. Yes—I told them several times to desist—I took hold of Mason gently—there were persons all round, costermongers and such like.

Cross-examined by MR. COLE. Q. Were there a great many people there? A. About twenty-five—I knew Neale by sight before—I did not know his name.

Lawrence. Q. Where did you see me first? A. In the Waterloo Road—you struck me in the eye with your leather arm—I saw your leather arm—your sleeve was tucked up—I was lying on the ground insensible after that—I was knocked down in the first place by Austin, and as I was recovering you knocked me down with your leather arm—I had seen you before.

MR. COOPER. Q. Was there anything at the end of his arm? A. A bit of iron, or something—that was what unsensed me.

CHARLES AUSTIN . I am a police officer—on the 28th I was on duty in the Blackfriurs Road, and saw Mason and Collins fighting in Duke Street—there was a crowd outside the Oxford Arms—I went there and requested them to go away—they took no notice—Neale came up and said "If you interfere I will settle you"—I called to Jordan for assistance; he came across the road, and we tried to separate the men who were fighting—we did so for a minute or so, and they went away, and met again in the Waterloo Road—on going round the Waterloo Rood I saw the crowd again, and Mason and Collins were fighting—I requested them to go away again, and they took no notice—I took Mason in custody, and was struggling with him, when my brother constable came up and gave me some assistance—we went down towards Tower Street Station—Mason was very violent, and commenced kicking—ho called for assistance several times—Neale came up and said "Will you let him go?—I said "No; he is our prisoner and we shall take him to the station"—Collins called out "Don't let the b——r take him, for it was a fair fight, and let us have it out"—Neale went behind me, and something struck me on the left temple; I can't say what it was—it knocked me down insensible—I found myself at the hospital when I came to my senses—I have been off duty ever since, and am still in the surgeon's hands.

FREDRICK GREENFIELD , (Police Inspector B). On 2nd July, about 8.30, Mason was brought to the station—I told him he was charged with violently assaulting two constables belonging to the L Division—he said "I know nothing about it"—I said "Were you not fighting outside the Oxford Arms with another man?"—he said "Well I was, but I had nothing to do with beating the constables"—Neolo was apprehended on the 5th, and Lawrence on the 7th or the 6th, by my direction.

CHARLES CORBETT BLAYDES . I am surgeon to the L Division of Police, 171, Kennington Park Rood—about 4 o'clock a.m., on 28th June, I was called to the station, and saw Charles Austin in bed—he was just recovering

his sensibility, and had been vomiting—I found a slightly punctured wound on the left temple, with a bruise round it—I ordered him to be kept there for some time, and then sent home—I attended him twice a-day for a considerable time—on the 4th day he was so bad that I recommended his removal to the hospital, thinking he had inflammation of the brain—I thought he had fracture of the skull at that time—I kept him to his bed, and since then he has been doing pretty well—he will quite recover, but I was at one time doubtful about it.

Witnesses for Neale.

ANN GUTTERIDGE . I am a charwoman, of 22, White Lion Street, St. Martin's Lane—on the night of 27th June, or the morning of 28th, about 12.30, I saw Neale in White Lion Street, with his young woman, standing at the door where she lives—I said "Good night, Jane," and "Good night, Dick," and went up to see my baby, which was ill—I know it was 12.30, because I saw the clock in the fried fish shop next door—I was talking to them till about 12.45, and then went in to see my baby—I have known Neale since Christmas.

Cross-examined. Q. Does he live in the same street? A. No—he lives over the water, in the Borough Road somewhere—I have been there—I am married, and have two children—I have known Neale since Christmas, coming backwards and forwards to see his young woman—she lives opposite to me—I heard of his being taken six weeks ago—I knew he was before the Magistrate—I was there, but the Magistrate would not let me speak—we were in the waiting room, I did not hear them call out for witnesses—me and this young woman and his mother were there.

JANE LANGLEY . I am a single woman, and live at 64, White Lion Street, St. Martin's Lane—I know Neale—I saw him on 27th June, about 7 o'clock in the evening, when I went to his mother's, and we removed his mother's goods from Duke Street to Martin Street—we were removing them till 8.30—we waited till 10.30, and then went to a friendly meeting at the Two Bears, in John Street, Blackfriars Road—I am Neale's young woman—we stayed at the Two Bears till about 11.30, and went round to his mother's house again, at 27, Martin Street, in the Blackfriars Road, and wished her "Good night"—we stayed there five or ten minutes, and then he walked home with me to St. Martin's Lane—we got there at 11.55 or 11.50—I remained in his company till about 12.45—there was a young woman with us—I called her over—I noticed it was about 12 o'clock when we came along at the public-house in St. Martin's Lane—it is about a mile ami a half, I should think, from the Oxford Arms to St. Martin's Lane.

Cross-examined. Q. I suppose you often walk with him? A. Yes—I have since Christmas, night after night—I have never been charged with anything—I beard of Neale being taken before the Magistrate—I went there—I did not give evidence, I was not called upon—they said it would do just as well at his trial—his mother told me that—that is the reason I did not give evidence before the Magistrate—when he left me he was going straight home to the other side of the water.

ELIZABETH RANDALL . I am married, and live at 5, Duke Street, Westminster Bridge Rood—I know Neale—I was present, and saw this fight—I did not see Neale there—I have known him twelve months.

Cross-examined. Q. How many people were there there? A. Twenty to thirty, I should say—I did not see any of the other prisoners there—I only know Neale; the others are strangers to me.

Witness for Lawrence.

GEORGE LAWRENCE . On 27th June, about 11 o'clock, I was in the Globe public-house with my brother—we went indoors about 11.30 to go to bed—he had on a white cap and white smock—he got up about 7 o'clock in the morning, and I went to work.

Cross-examined. Q. Is he not cohabiting with a woman at his mother's house? A. No—he slept with me—that was his regular bed—I went to work at 4 o'clock, and left him in bed—that was the morning of 28th June—I don't know the day of the week—I think it was on Thursday—I did not go before the Magistrate; I did not know whether I should be allowed.

GUILTY .— Lawrence and Mason recommended to mercy.

MASON**— Twelve Month's Imprisonment.

NEALE**— Five Years' Penal Servitude.

LAWRENCE*— Nine Months' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-695
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

695. ELLEN GROSVENOR (19) , Robbery, with violence, on Thomas Wilks, and stealing a watch, his property.

MR. BOTTOMLEY conducted the Prosecution.

THOMAS WILKS . I am a labourer, and live at Bermoudsey—about 11.30, on 1st August, I was going down Tooley Street—the prisoner came up to me and sold she had come all the way from Scotland, and was very faint, would I give her something to drink—I took her into a public-house, and gave her a glass of ale and some halfpence, to pay for her lodging—I went out—after I had got about 200 yards she came up and touched me on the left shoulder, and said "I can't leave you without thanking you"—my watch was then safe in my pocket, attached to a chain—she went about ten yards with me and said "I have got it"—I received a blow on the side of my head, and fell down—a man passed me—I saw his face as I fell—I caught hold of the prisoner, and missed my watch directly, and saw the prisoner hand it to the man—I kept hold of her till a constable came—my watch was worth about 5l.

ALFRED TURNER (Policeman M 109). The prosecutor gave the prisoner in charge for stealing his watch—she looked at him and said "I don't know you, I have never seen you before"—I said "Do you mean to say you have not been in his company to-night?"—she said "Yes, I have not"—she said she lived in the Commercial Road, and had lost herself.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate: "He took indecent liberties with me; and because I would not go with him he gave me in charge."

Prisoner's Defence. I am innocent of it. I get my living honestly, by hawking in the streets.


She also PLEADED GUILTY to having been before convicted in March, 1870, in the name of Ellen McHugh— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-696
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

696. JOSEPH GRICE (36) , Feloniously receiving three metal taps, 100 metal nuts, and fifty screws, the goods of John Walker and another. (see page 343).

MR. BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. WOOD the Defence.

DAVID JOHN LEWARNE (Detective M). On 21st June I went to Grice's house, in Rodney Road, Walworth—I saw him at the door—I said "I want those throe tap you bought to-day"—he hesitate I for a moment, and then

gaid "I did buy three"—I said "Where are they?"—he said "Indoors"—he went indoors—I followed him into the back parlour, and he produced these three tape—I said "How much did you give for them?"—he said "I did not buy them, a man brought them and offered them for sale; I told him they were of no use to me—he said 'I sha'n't take them away, and will leave them here"—I asked him if he knew the man—he said "Yes, he worked for me at one time"—the prisoner keeps a smith's shop—Knowles was with me at this time—we took the taps away and went to Tudor's house, and took him in custody, and also a man named Finch—I took the prisoner into custody the next morning—I told him he was charged with receiving three metal taps, knowing them to be stolen—he said it was a bad job for him, he had got a very large family—he denied buying them—when he was taken before the Magistrate he said "I did buy them, and gave 2s. for them—I was here last Session, when Finch and Tudor were convicted—I had some other property which I found in Finch's house.

Cross-examined. Q. Were the tape all found at the prisoner's house? A. Yes—I don't know the prisoner—I have made inquiries, and he has been in trouble—I did not know Finch or Tudor—a party told me that Grice had bought some taps, and I went to his house—he was at the door—he showed me the taps—he said "They were offered for sale, and I refused them"—I saw his wife the next morning—I never spoke to her.

THOMAS KNOWLES (Detective M). I went with Lewarne to Grice's house—when spoken to by Lewarne, he said he bought them—he showed us into the room, and when he was asked what he gave for the taps, he said they had been left by a man who used to work for him, he did not know where he lived—I took Tudor and Finch.

HENRY ANDREW REYNOLDS . I am a clerk, in the employ of Archibald McLaren & Walker, iron merchants, of 2, Old Swan Lane, Thames Street—Finch was in their employ as a stovefltter—I know these taps produced—they are exactly like those sold by my employers—I have a tap in my pocket like them—I never missed them—they were kept in a cupboard—I don't know that Finch had access to them—we sell them at 2s. each—I did not examine the cupboard, to see if there were any missing.

Cross-examined. Q. Are you wholesale dealers in these things? A. Yes—they are sold very largely—McKnight, of Birmingham, is the maker—I could not tell whether they are sold or not—I could tell by going over the book—I have not done so.


15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-697
VerdictGuilty > unknown; Not Guilty > unknown

Related Material

697. MARY ANNE SELFE (35), and JANE GREENE (67) , Stealing one chain value 6l., and other goods value 14l., belonging to John James William Simmons, in his dwelling-house.

MR. LILLEY conducted the Prosecution; MR. MOIR and MR. BROWN appeared for Self; and MR. COLE for Greene.

MARY ANNE DEANE . I am the prosecutor's servant—on 30th June Selfe came to nurse my mistress, who was ill—she, nursed her for a fortnight—she died on 12th July—Selfe left on the 13th—on the 14th I examined my late mistress's wardrobe, and missed a number of articles, jewellery and other things—these things (produced) are my mistress's—amongst them is a night dress which Selfe asked me to give her for the purpose of laying Mrs. Simmons out—when Selfe came on Tuesday, I asked her where the night dress was—she said "It is somewhere about;" but never mentioned it as having been given to her.

Cross-examined by MR. MOIR. Q. How long had you seen these things? A. Every day—Selfe waited on the deceased about one month, and was

very kind to her night and day—I did not know that Mrs. Simmons promised to give Selfe certain things for her attention to her—Selfe was highly recommended from different institutions—I believe the deceased died with her hand in Selfe's, and appeared fond of her.

MR. LILLEY. Q. Were you present at her death? A. No—Mrs. Selfe did not say one word in my presence of having had anything given to her by the deceased.

WILLIAM PECK (Detective Officer). On Thursday, 21st July, I went after Mrs. Selfe, at No. 12, Bouverie Street, Paddington—she was at home with Greene—I told her the charge—she said "I never had any of the jewellery, and what wearing apparel you find has been given to me"—she said that Greene was her laundress—I found a box in her room, searched it in her presence, and found the articles produced—I found these ear-drops at the bottom of the box—she jumped up and said "Take it and put it in your pocket, and say nothing about it; I trust to your honour"—I found a number of things had been pawned by Greene, at Smith's, in the Edgware Road.

Cross-examined by MR. MOIR. Q. Did Selfe say to you "I know nothing about it? A. No.

Cross-examined by MR. COLE. Q. What was Greene doing when you went into the room? A. Washing—I took her on the 26th July, some time after Selfe—I told her I had ascertained she was not Selfe's laundress, but her mother, and told her the charge—she said "I know nothing about it"—I told her what I had found at the pawnbroker's, pledged by her there—she replied "Yes, I pawned the things; but I did not think there was anything wrong."

WILLIAM GREENE . I am assistant to Mr. Smith, a pawnbroker of the Edgware Road—Greene pawned those things on 14th July, in the name of "Sell, 5, Call Street, Paddington."

Cross-examined by MR. COLE. Q. Is it a very common thing for customers to pawn goods in other names than their right ones? A. Yes, and to give false addresses, too.

JOHN JAMES WILLIAM SIMMONS . I am the prosecutor—I identify this jewellery—I put it into the drawer when my wife was ill—she never told me she gave Selfe anything before her death.

Cross-examined by MR. MOIR. Q. Did you give Selfe anything? A. A half-sovereign, because I thought she was a good nurse—I had two ladies besides Selfe attending on my wife.

The prisoners received good characters.



15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-698
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

698. MARY ANNE SELFE was again indicted for stealing one bracelet, and other articles, value 70l., belonging to Mary Aplin, in her dwelling-house.

SARAH ANDREWS . I am the wife of Mark Andrews, and was employed in Queen's Gardens, Bayswater, when Mrs. Aplin lodged there—Selfe came to nurse Mrs. Aplin, in March—Mrs. Aplin removed from our house to Ealing, and Selfe helped her, and went with her—these articles (produced) were all packed in a black bag—they belong to Mrs. Aplin—I have seen her wearing the shawl.

ANN LEICESTER . I am the sinter of Mary Aplin, the prosecutrix—she is an invalid now—she was ill in March, and I went to stay with her on 24th

May—Selfe was nursing her then, and on the 26th she went away—Mrs. Aplin was lodging at Nettley Villa, Ealing—Selfe had access to her wardrobe—I searched my sister's wardrobe, on 6th June, by her directions, and missed a velvet mantle and a black silk dress—on 9th July we missed seven bracelets, a pair of earrings, a necklet, and other articles, worth about 100l.

Cross-examined by MR. MOIR. Q. From the day Mrs. Selfe left till 6th June, had your sister another nurse? A. Yes—that nurse would have access to the things.

FANNY BEAZLEY . I am a milliner and dressmaker, in Regent Street—I made this velvet mantle and this dress for Mrs. Aplin, at her residence—I recognize my work and trimming.

WILLIAM PECK (Detective Officer). On 21st July I took Selfe in custody, and told her she was charged with stealing a quantity of things from Mrs. Aplin—she said "Jewellery! I never had any, and what wearing apparel I have has been given to me"—I searched her box, and found these articles, and at Smith's, the pawnbroker's, these other articles—I produce' a deposit-note for 100l., and one for 50l.—I found 8l. in Selfe's box, and 2l. 10l. in cash she gave to me.

CHARLES JOSEPH WILLIAM GREENE . I am assistant to Mr. Smith, a pawnbroker, of the Edgware Road—this shawl, mantle, flannelpetticoat, and articles produced, were pawned at my establishment, on 30th May, in the name of Anne May, Store Street, Paddington, to the best of my belief by Greene.

Cross-examined by MR. MOIR. Q. You cannot swear that? A. No. (A letter was put in, written by the prisoner Selfe to the prosecutrix, purporting to be an explanation of the whereabouts of the mitring things).

WILLIAM SAMUEL BEANE . That letter is in Selfe's writing—I have seen her fill up forms at the institution when she was engaged as nurse.

ANN LEICESTER (re-examined). I wrote a letter to Selfe, when I could not find the missing things, and received the one produced in reply.

GUILTY Two Years' Imprisonment.

15th August 1870
Reference Numbert18700815-699
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

699. PATRICK CONNOR (50) , Feloniously cutting and wounding John O'Brien, on his head, with intent to do him some grievous bodily harm.

MR. KELLEY conducted the Prosecution.

JOHN O'BRIEN . I live at 30, Francis Street, Westminster—on 1st August, the prisoner and a Mr. Mead were in a public-house, drinking—Mrs. Mead called her husband—he came out and struck me—I said "I don't want anything to say to you; I mind my business, you go about yours"—he was stripping off his clothes when Connor came up and hit me on my cheek-bone—ho knocked all the sense out of me for some time—I went home—at 1 o'clock in the morning a gang of them came to my door, and Connor among them—they gave three knocks—I went down to answer, and when I got there a fight was going on—Mead and me got to blows—we rolled across the road—Connor was in the act of picking up Mead—he gave me a dart with something sharp he had in his hand, and the blood came—"Mead and me fought on because I could not get rid of him—my daughter was there, and said "Connor, you have struck my father"—a policeman came up—they had stripped me nearly—I was going in doors; Connor met me in the passage and gave me a blow like a lion—I was sober.

Prisoner. I was inside a public-house. I came out to help you, and you

hit me. Witness. No, I did not—I did not know that you had a knife—I usually go to bed at 10.30—this night my daughter and a friend had gone to the play, and I stopped up for them.

ELLEN O'BRIEN . I am a daughter of the last witness—I remember this fight with my father and Mr. Mead—Connor got his knee on my father and gave him two blows—I screamed out "Mr. Connor, you have stabbed my father"—he gave me a scratch with a knife he had in his hand—I am distinct about seeing the knife—I saw the blade—it was a short narrowbladed knife.

Prisoner. Q. Do you know the meaning of an oath? A. Yes—I did see a knife in your right hand, and I caught hold of your hand, and you threw me into the road, and the knife scratched me—I have never seen it since, it has been in the hands of the police—(produced)—I cannot say if this is it; I only saw the blade—three knocks are for my father, and two for you—we all live in the same house.

DINORAH CASEY . I live in Princess Street—I remember the row—Mr. Connor interfered, and I saw him and Mr. O'Brien on the ground, and Mr. O'Brien bleeding.

CATHERINE O'BRIEN . I am the prosecutor's wife—I saw the fight between my husband and Mead—I saw Connor stab my husband twice with a knife—I saw the blade by the gaslight—it was something like the one produced.

Prisoner. Q. Did you see a knife in my hand? A. I did—you stood in front of my husband—you pretended to pick him up and gave him a stab twice.

———GODDARD (Policeman L 40). I was called—I saw the prisoner and prosecutor there—the prosecutor was smothered in blood—they had ceased struggling when I arrived—I charged the prisoner with stabbing O'Brien—Mrs. O'Brien said "For God's sake! mind, Mr. Constable, he has got a knife"—Mrs. Casey also said he had used a knife, and he did not make any answer.

Prisoner. Q. Did you see a knife in my hand? A. No—I saw you on the ground—O'Brien was under you—I should have taken you then had I had any assistance—when help came, and I took you, you did not go cheerfully—a candlestick was thrown out of a window at me—you arc a shoemaker, and this is a shoemaker's knife.

EVAN OWEN (Policeman L 204). I went to Goddard's assistance—there were from 300 to 400 people there—the prosecutor was bleeding—I was told he had been stabbed—I assisted in taking Connor to the station—I afterwards searched and found this knife in a pool of dirt, ten or fifteen yards from where the fight had taken place.

Prisoner. Q. Did Mrs. O'Brien take you and show you where the knife was? A. No—I should say it is used by cobblers—there are tallow marks on the handle.

———DONOGHUE. I am a surgeon—a knife of this kind would have produced the wound—it might have proved dangerous—there were several contused wounds about the prosecutor's head.

The Prisoner's a Statement before the Magistrate: "My God, I never had any other knife than my two hands."

The prisoner called

MR. MEAD. I went down to O'Brien'd door—his daughter followed me, calling "Father"—his daughter and wife came into the street and kicked

me in the face, and someone struck me on the head—the prisoner said that he dreaded going down Princess Street, for fear the O'Brien's would hurt him—I persuaded him to go, and when we got to the door Mrs. O'Brien said "Here is the b——Mead"—the daughter ran out, and her father nearly killed me—I did not see a knife with him—by my God, there was no knife in his hand.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you stab O'Brien? A. No—I struck O'Brien over the head—I never saw Connor near at all—I am certain he had no knife, because he did not want a knife.

MRS. MEAD. My husband and O'Brien were the two that fought.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you see everything take place? A. No—Connor did not interfere in the bother at all—I did not see the prisoner with a knife.

BRIDGET CONNOR . My father and mother were out—I heard Brien and his wife say they would stab the thief, Mead—when my father came down the street, they said they would watch all night for him—they did watch for him—they cried out "Here comes b——Mead"—they all rushed down stairs, and opened the door—Brien said "You're the man I want," and Mead and him fought—the prisoner was not inside our house from 3 o'clock in the day till he was taken.

Cross-examined. Q. I believe you have had seven days on account of this transaction? A. Yes, for nothing.

ELLEN CONNOR . About 10 o'clock my two sisters and me were up stairs, and heard Mr. Brien say that he would knife father when he came down the street, and about 1 o'clock they came down the street—father knocked two knocks at the door—I went down to the door, and heard Brien say "Here are the b——Meads"—they all ran down stairs, and father was at his door, and never interfered at all.

Prisoner's Defence. The prosecutor waited up till that hour of the morning, intending to have a fray with me. It is not likely that I could carry a knife about with me; I never had one at all.



View as XML