Old Bailey Proceedings.
26th October 1868
Reference Number: t18681026

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Old Bailey Proceedings front matter.
26th October 1868
Reference Numberf18681026

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Sessions Paper.








Short-hand Writers to the Court,








Law Publishers to the Queen's Most Excellent Majesty.



On the Queen's Commission of



The City of London,





Held on Monday, October 26th, 1868, and following days,

BEFORE THE RIGHT HON. WILLIAM FERNELEY ALLEN, LORD MAYOR of the City of London; Sir JOHN BARNARD BYLES, Knt., one of the Justices of Her Majesty's Court of Common Pleas; Sir ROBERT LUSH, Knt., one of the Justices of Her Majesty's Court of Queen's Bench; Sir ROBERT WALTER CARDEN, Knt, Sir BENJAMIN SAMUEL PHILLIPS , Knt., SILLS JOHN GIBBONS, Esq., JOSEPH CAUSTON, Esq., and THOMAS SCAMBLER OWDEN, Esq., Aldermen of the said City; THOMAS CHAMBERS, Esq., Q.C, M.P., Common Serjeant of the said City; and ROBERT MALCOLM KERR, L.L.D., Esq., Judge of the Sheriff's Court; Her Majesty's Justices of oyer and Terminer and General Gaol delivery of Newgate, holden for the said City, and Judges of the Central CriminalCourt.









A star (*) denotes that prisoners have been previously in custody—two stars (**) that they have been more than once in custody—an obelisk (†) that they are known to be the associates of bad characters—the figures after the name in the indictment denotes the prisoner's age.


OLD COURT.—Monday, October 26th, 1868.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-873
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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873. ROBERT CECIL EWIN (49), was indicted for embezzling the sums of 20l. 15s., 14l. 17s. 6d., and 9l. 15s., received by him on account of John Stead and another, his masters.

MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON, with MR. POLAND, conducted the Prosecution; and


SAMUEL PURVIS RENTALL . I am clerk to Messrs. Tarn & Co., of Newington Causeway—on 10th July, last year, our firm was indebted to Messrs. Stead & Co. 20l. 15s. 6d.—on that day I sent a crossed cheque for that amount, by post, to 4, Bread Street, their London house—I afterwards received the account receipted, and the cheque was passed through our bankers, and paid; this is it—on 10th August I sent this other cheque, for 14l. 17s. 6d, drawn by our firm, to the same address—it has been paid—I received by return this receipt signed by Pearman.

JAMES HARRISON . I am warehouseman to Messrs W. & R. Morley—on 9th September, 1867, they were indebted 9l. 14s. to Messrs. Stead—that was paid in cash—I did not pay it—I produced the receipt at the Mansion House—it was given up there—it was signed, "Robert C. Ewin."

ALFRED WILLIAM PEARMAN . I am clerk in the service of Messrs. Stead & Co., furniture printers, carrying on business at Comersdale, near Carlisle, and at 4, Bread Street, London—the prisoner was the manager of the London part of the business; I was under his orders—I received these two cheques from Messrs. Tarn by post, the one for 20l. 15s. 6d., dated 10th July, 1867, and the other for 14l. 17s. 6d., dated 10th August—I handed them to the prisoner, and sent the receipts—the prisoner kept a cash-book; it was his duty to enter in that all sums received—neither of these sums are in it, nor the 9l. 14s. on 9th September—the cash-book is here—in

December last, about 5th or 6th, Mr. Hodson, the manager of the Carlisle business, came to London—some accounts were made out to post; I did not send them, I held them back—I made a statement to Mr. Hodson why I did not send them—I knew as a fact that some of the accounts to which they referred had been paid; that was why I did not send them (The cheques were on the London and County Bank, payable to bearer, and crossed "National Bank, Camden Town branch."

Cross-examined. Q. Did Mr. Harper, an accountant, go through these accounts? A. I believe so; I know it—the prisoner went through them with him—I believe he was engaged in doing so for some weeks at Mr. Harper's office—the books were taken there for the purpose of being investigated—I cannot tell you the result; Mr. Harper is here.

ALFRED CUBITT PIGOTT . I am ledger clerk at the National Bank, Camden Town—the prisoner kept an account there in his own name—these two cheques were paid in to the prisoner's own private account.

Cross-examined. Q. How long had the prisoner an account with you? A. I can't say; it was before I went there—I have been there a little over two years—at the time of the discovery of these matters he had no balance at the bank—I can't say whether there were any bills of exchange to his credit; I have no book that will tell me.

ROBERT GIBSON HODSON . I am manager to Messrs. Stead & Co., of Comersdale, near Carlisle—we have a branch in London, at No. 4, Bread Street—the prisoner was the manager of that business—he has been in the service of the firm since 1864, I think—his salary was 280l. a year—the rent of the place in Bread Street was paid by the firm—the prisoner was the general manager there—he kept a cash-book—the goods were generally delivered from the place in Cumberland—it was the prisoner's duty to receive orders, and, after the goods had been delivered, to receive the money—it was the prisoner's duty to enter in the cash-book the monies received; to send out invoices, and send down statements, and collect the monies.

MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Was the engagement, whatever it was, reduced into writing? A. No—I am quite sure about that; I made it.

MR. POLAND. Q. How often was the prisoner to send the accounts to you in Cumberland? A. Monthly—those accounts ought to be a copy of the cash book—when he received money he was first of all to pay all current expenses, and remit the balance down to the works—there were no stated times; as remittances were made, it was his duty to remit them down—he had no authority to trade on his own account,—on 5th December last, in consequence of something that occurred I came up to London—I saw the prisoner on the same day, at 4, Bread Street—the conversation at first was somewhat general, but the principal portion of it referred to accounts that were not settled—I asked him why there was so much money owing—he said, "I can't say, the statements have been regularly sent"—we agreed to send out statements to customers who owed balances—the prisoner read the accounts from the ledger, and I made them out; they were then directed, and put ready to be posted by Mr. Pearman; I found afterwards, that night, that they had not been posted—Mr. Pearman made some statement to me next morning—I saw the prisoner that morning, I told him that his accounts were wrong, that his books were falsified—he said, "He wished to speak to me privately"—we went to the Cannon Street hotel, and he there handed me this letter, it is his writing—I read it—this cash account was enclosed in it—(The letter was dated 6th December, 1867; it acknowledged the

commission of a great wrong, and expressed his desire of making good the amount he was deficient, which he stated to be about 3000l.; the statement annexed referred to sources from which the re-payments were to come, viz;—Mr. John Ewin, 500l.; Mr. Ball, 500l.; Mr. Benham, 800l.; Messrs. Tabet Freres, 500l.; myself 200l.; Goodman & Co., 1000l.—total, 2500l.)—When I had read that I walked out and signified to him to follow me, which he did, to 4, Bread Street—I asked him to make out a list of the various sums owing to us by different parties, all the sums he had received—he proceeded to do so—this is the list he made out (produced)—the amount of money stated here to be owing from country customers is 1845l. 8s., that is from twenty or thirty different persons, and 2042l. 18s. 8d. received from London customers, about twenty-two in number—the list contains "Tarn & Co., 189l. 16s. 10d.," and "W. & R. Morley, 120l. 14s."—he also gave me a list of the promised securities—I have looked at the cash book and found that the 20l. 15s. is not entered on 18th July, 1867, or on any other date, nor does the monthly list contain that sum—the 14s. 17s. 6d. on 16th August is not entered in the cash book or contained in the monthly list, nor the 9l. 14s. on 9th September—the Mr. Ewin mentioned in the statement, is one of the prisoner's bondsmen, we have received that 500l.; the other 500l. is put down to Mr. Ball, he was the other surety—we have not got any money from him, we have tried to get it—we received no money from Mr. Benham, not a farthing; we tried to get it—we have not received anything from Tabet, Freras, of Beyrout, rather a denial of the debt—we have received 200l. from the prisoner—altogether we have received 348l. I think; I have a memorandum with me, I don't know the exact amount—I have not received any money from Goodman & Co., we have received altogether about 800l.—I was not at all aware that the prisoner was trading on his own account, or consigning goods abroad—I saw the prisoner in the presence of Mr. Bailey, Mr. Stead's solicitor, I think about the 7th or 8th, after Mr. Stead had come up from Cumberland—the prisoner made a general statement as to the manner in which he had disposed of the money he had embezzled: he simply went over the letter that he had handed to me, and endorsed it—I think he gave Mr. Bailey some bills at that time: he was not represented by a solicitor, and Mr. Bailey advised him to get one, and he told him that whatever he might say or do would not alter the case, at all, that he was still criminally responsible—I think he replied that he knew it, or something to that effect; he did not dispute it: he said he was quite content to allow the matter to remain in Mr. Bailey's hands, he wished to do all he could to recoup Stead & Co.

Cross-examined. Q. May I take it, that in realising the property of the prisoner, Mr. Bailey was the person who was employed by your firm to do it? A. He was—there was no agreement by our firm to get as much as we could out of the prisoner, and then to send him to gaol when he was of no further use—he was not given into custody at once, because it would not have suited our purpose to have done so—our purpose was to get our books put right in the first instance; it was also desirable to try and get as much as we could—there was no understanding that when those two purposes were effected we should carry out the ends of justice—the prisoner was told to hand us over the securities he proposed, and we, or Mr. Bailey, rather, went through them and tried to recover the money they were said to be worth, but we found they were worthless—this matter was found out

in December—the prisoner was given into custody in July—we gave him into custody because we found insult was being added to injury, bad was being made worse, we were simply being trifled with—I do not know that there is an agreement in existence as to the terms upon which the prisoner was engaged; as far as I know, there was none—I will not swear that I have not seen one, I don't remember it—the prisoner handed over other securities besides those mentioned in this list, they are in Mr. Bailey's possession—it did not turn out that in the account the prisoner gave he had overstated the amount due by him to the firm by 180l., or any amount—he allowed a servant who was in our employ 1l. a week, supposed to be from his own private income, and afterwards he debited it to the firm—there was a sum overcharged—I am not prepared to say how much, but a great portion of it was not legitimate; some portion I have no doubt was, I am not prepared to say how much—I found that he had given a most ample account of every single halfpenny that he had misapplied—I said to him, "The amount you set forth which you can hand over does not amount to the sum you are deficient, have you not anything more?"—this was before I knew Mr. Bailey—I told Mr. Bailey everything I had done, and left the matter in his hands—the prisoner afterwards handed me this paper, it contains these items: "H. Burgees & Co., 180l.; Gillard & Co., 150l; Austin, 139l.; my bond, 200l."—he gave me 200l., I think, in January or February—that was not after the accountant had reported—I think at the time he gave me the list he gave me a promissory note, a bill, or something for 200l.—the 200l. has been paid over to me; I gave it over to the firm—the prisoner told me it was raised by a bill of sale on his furniture—I knew at that time that he had committed a felony—I knew nothing about compromising it, I thought my duty was to get as much of the firm's money as possible; it was simply to get back the firm's own money—I did not intend to get the money and also to prosecute—the matter was not in my hands—my intention was to get as much money as I possibly could—I had no right to do anything—I did not do it with the authority of Mr. Stead; he did not know I was doing it—he got the 200l.—he refused it at the time I took the bond—when I handed over the 200l. he knew it came from the prisoner, and he took it—I have seen the prisoner's wife about half a dozen times—I think she came, to see me, I don't remember exactly what about—I went on one occasion to get some information respecting some accounts which we had presented, and which were said to have been paid, and we found no record of them—I did not go to obtain information that would enable us to realize the amount, it was about a matter referring to our books—I wanted to know where Mr. Ewin was, so that I might get the information—I think that was about February or January—it was after he had absented himself from Mr. Harper's, that was in February, I think—Mrs. Ewin did not tell me where her husband was, she said she would communicate with him—I think I went to her once again with Sergeant Haydon—he had a warrant at that time—he was not told not to execute it, or to hold it over, or to abstain from using it for any time, that I aware of—I am not aware of any arrangement that it should not be served for four months, or two months—I have not heard that such an arrangement was discussed—I applied at the Mansion House for a warrant—I am not aware that I told the officers there anything about the arrangement for giving up the securities—I won't swear that I did not—it is so long ago I don't remember—I may or may not, I have no idea.

MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. Were you examined at the Mansion House by Mr. Merriman? A. Yes; very much the same questions were put to me as now—I knew that an advertisement was put in the paper to endeavour to find where the prisoner was—the 200l. I received from the prisoner on the promissory note formed part of the 348l.—Mr. Stead was in Carlisle at the time I received it—the prisoner said that these investments of his had been made with money belonging to the firm—at the time I came to London I had no means whatever of knowing the state of Mr. Stead's London affairs, except through the prisoner—I had no means of ascertaining what the assets were without his assistance—when I speak of his adding insult to injury, I referred to his representation that 500l. was due from Tabet, of Beyrout, when, in fact, it had been paid, for I opened a letter from them to him, by his authority, denying the debt—it was upon that the warrant was applied for—this (produced) is the letter, it bears the London post mark of 17th February—at that time I had also got further information with regard to Mr. Benham and other persons—the prisoner never said that he had any authority to use this money of Mr. Stead's.

JOHN RAND BAILEY . I am solicitor to Mr. Stead, and have been for some time—on the 9th or 10th December, Mr. Stead, Mr. Hodson, and the prisoner came to my office—an explanation was given by Mr. Stead of the purport of that visit, and I said to the prisoner, "This a very serious case, and I think you ought to have some solicitor representing you here"—he said, "I don't want one, I have well thought over what it is my duty now to do. I feel the seriousness of my position, and I am prepared to give you, without any solicitor being present, the fullest information, to enable Stead & Co. to recover back the monies which I have defrauded them of"—I said that before my clients could determine what course to adopt, they must have a full investigation made into their books, and the course I had advised them to adopt was to place the books in the hands of an accountant; that if he was disposed to give every information and assistance to that accountant to make up the books, he could do so, but he must plainly under-stand that that course would not prevent, in any shape or way, the adoption of criminal proceedings if they determined upon investigation to adopt them—he said he was willing to assign all his property over to Messrs, Stead—I asked him whether he owed anything to anybody else—he said nothing but a few trifling debts to his tradesmen—I declined to listen to any assignment, and said, "I only want to know what are the assets in your hands belonging to Messrs. Stead"—I went through the list of assets seriatim, and he stated that each of them was the produce of monies belonging to Messrs. Stead—I mean the list appended to the letter which he produced on the first occasion—he said as to one of them, the 200l. from himself, he would give a bill or a bond for it, which I pooh-poohed, and said it was nonsense his proposing to give security to my clients—as to the others, he said they were all the produce of Stead & Co.'s money—I said I would appoint an accountant, and make an appointment for him to go into the matter, and if he chose to attend, I would give him notice, so that he might do so—I appointed Mr. Harper, and gave notice to the prisoner to attend—I believe he did attend at Mr. Harper's, according to Mr. Harper's report, that I received from him on 10th February—I have it here—substantially it amounted to what the prisoner stated originally, with some trifling difference—it has been subsequently mentioned by Mr. Harper that there was some discrepancy which arose on a question of discount being allowed, that would reduce the sum

with which the prisoner debited himself some 80l. or 90l.—I think with that exception the list of defalcations he had furnished was substantially correct—no doubt as to sums debited to any particular firm it could on inquiry have been ascertained whether they owed it or not, but I did not examine the books myself—the prisoner offered on that occasion three bills of 50l. each, accepted by a person of the name of Gillard, that he said he had discounted with Messrs. Stead's money—I made inquiries about Gilard, found they were worthless, and refused to take them—500l. has been received from one of the sureties, and Mr. Hodson received some 340l, altogether about 900l. has been realized—I subsequently put the matter into the hands of Mr. Humphreys, and about the 24th February, by his advice, a warrant was applied for and obtained—that was after I had received a communication with regard to Mr. Tabet, and after I had entered into correspondence with Mr. Benham.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT BALLIANTINE. Q. How long have you been a solicitor? Q. I was admitted in Trinity Term, 1852—I carry on business at 8, Tokenhouse Yard—one of the first things I saw, in this matter, was the prisoner's letter—I subsequently saw the detailed list of his defalcations—these matters have been gone through by an accountant, and it turns out that the account that the prisoner gave Mr. Hodson was correct, with the exception of the overcharge to himself of 80l. or 90l.—I don't know that there was any difference in the prisoner's position, in a legal point of view, when I gave him into custody, than there was when he first admitted his defalcations—I did not give him into custody at first, because I did not know whether the defalcations might not have been ten times as much; it was therefore necessary for the firm to have the whole of their books amply investigated by an accountant—I advised my clients to give him into custody at once, but they did not do it; that was for the purpose of using his information—the list he gave contained, as he positively stated, property which was my client's, not his—they took it—I told them not to refuse anything that he said was theirs—we gave him into custody because we found he had deceived us in every respect about than various sureties being forthcoming—we did not find any deception as to his defalcations—I do not say that we should not have given him into custody if there had been no deception as to the sureties—I advised my clients throughout to prosecute him—I should not have advised my clients to let him go—I was simply dealing with what was their own property, not his—I took care, throughout the whole interview, to state that I would not have anything to do with any property of his; I only wanted to know what was the property of my clients—I know nothing whatever, personally, about the state of his property, or of the 200l. realized by it—I heard from Mr. Hodson that 200l. had been paid him, and that the prisoner had told him how he had raised it on his property—it was not earmarked as his property—I did not advise Mr. Hodson to take it; he took it without my knowledge—I did not recommend him to return it—I must have known about it before the warrant was applied for—I had interviews with Mrs. Ewin—I don't think I ever wrote to her; she wrote to me—I did not tell her that if Mr. Stead could see her husband an arrangement would be made, nothing of the kind—I probably wrote to her to call on me; I can't tell; if you wish to know I will refer to my books—I may have written to say I was ready to receive her—I certainly never wrote any detailed letter—I really am in doubt whether I wrote at all or not—I have had notice to produce

certain letters, and they are here—I will refer to my letter-book—here is a letter that was written by a clerk of mine—Mrs. Ewin called on me, and I read to her extracts from a letter from Mr. Stead—I may hare read words to the effect: "Mr. Hodson will be in London shortly, and if he has any interview with Mrs. Ewin, an arrangement may be effected, and the matter must stand over till then"—I have no doubt that was about the 22nd July—I acted in two actions as the prisoner's attorney under these circumstances, he stated he had applied some of Stead & Co.'s monies to discounting a bill for a man named Austin, and he brought an action against him—the proceeds of that action were Stead & Co.'s, and he himself suggested that I should be changed as the attorney, so that I might carry on the action that was virtually Stead & Co.'s action—I acted in his name, but it was an action simply brought by him as trustee for Stead & Co.—there was another case in which I acted in that same manner; that was an interpleader summons under precisely similar circumstances—I got 17l., which I paid to Stead & Co.—I did not get my own costs, not a farthing—it was an interpleader summons, and the money was in Court—the prisoner told me he had made an advance of Stead & Co.'s monies to Benham, exceeding 800l., for which Benham had agreed to give him a mortgage—upon that I gave Benham notice that the advances were made out of my client's monies, and that, in point of law and equity, they were entitled to the charge—Benham proceeded to give me evidence of his title—the other letter appeared long after the prisoner had absconded—I stated that I refused to enter into the title until I had received 30l. for doing so—Mrs. Ewin told me her husband was in France or Spain, and out of our reach—I did not entertain some proposals by which he should give information—I told her I would not put my clients to any-further expense, because I believed it was all moonshine about Benham't security, unless she deposited 30l. with me—I may possibly have said, "I won't open the papers unless you give me 30l."—that was at a very late period, when he was in Spain, or Pimlico—I had opened the papers, and considered them—I did not hear from Haydon that he could serve the warrant when it was obtained—I did not instruct him, Mr. Humphreys did—I learnt from Haydon that he could not find the prisoner anywhere until three or four days before his arrest—I did not tell Haydon not to serve the warrant, or hold it over; I swear that—Haydon asked me if the reward was still in existence—we had offered 20l. in February, and advertised for the prisoner continually—Haydon said that persons came and volunteered to give information if they could get the 20l.—I said I would communicate with Mr. Stead, and see whether he was tired out of the matter, or whether he would still insist upon prosecuting—I did communicate with him, and in the meantime the man was arrested—I did not tell Haydon not to execute the warrant, or to delay it—he told me the parties would not give information without knowing that the reward would be paid—I did not convey to him that I wished it delayed, not in any way—I told Mrs. Ewin that we were willing to keep the warrant back for two or four months—she did not say that if we did so he would be able to clear the whole debt, nothing of the kind—I offered to hold over the warrant because she told me he was in Spain, and we were unable to arrest him—I wanted information about these various securities—I suppose there is a firm of Tabet abroad—I don't know it of my own knowledge; I have no doubt of it—I presume they are merchants at Beyrout—I don't know whether they are Greeks; the name is more like

a French name—I had negotiations with a view to utilize the 1000l. in the name of Goodman & Co.—we have got the 500l. from J. Ewin—Ball had made a deed of composition—the 800l. to Benham referred to the Grapes public-house—I investigated the papers with reference to that so far as to see that it was all moonshine—I don't mean to say there are no transactions between Benham and the prisoner—I know nothing about that, but the security offered to me was entirely imperfect, and the title worthless—I required the 30. because further information was volunteered to fill up the gap in the title, and I would not put my clients to the expense of investigating it—there was a letter from Messrs. Tabet Brothers in which they stated the account had been settled long since—no doubt there was an account two or three years ago—the transaction as to Goodman & Co. was this: the prisoner stated that he had advanced money to Baker, trading as Goodman, Baker & Co., and that, to cover him, he had taken the house and business of an auctioneer carried on under that name—the sum of 200l. was offered for that, under the guarantee of possible possession by Mr. Stead; that I advised him not to give, as there were rival claims to the property—there was an assignment of a debt due from Warry & Burgess for 70l.—I did not get a farthing from that—I did not demand 70l. from Mrs. Ewin in reference to that transaction; I swear that; nor any other sum.

MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. With reference to the 200l. on the bill of sale, was that received by Mr. Hodson? A. I don't believe it was received on the bill—I believe 200l. was received—I told my clients not to refuse any money he brought them and said was theirs—with regard to the action against Austin, not a farthing was recovered—as to the other, 17l. was obtained, and that went to Mr. Stead's account—not a farthing has been realized from Goodman & Co., or Benham—a summons was taken out by Mr. Merryman, the prisoner's attorney, to show cause why I should not deliver up the papers to the prisoner as his attorney, and that was dismissed by Mr. Justice Willes.

JOHN STEAD . I carry on business at Comersdale—there was no written agreement between myself and the prisoner when he was engaged—the statement made by Mr. Hodson with regard to his duties is correct—in 1867, in consequence of finding there were very small remittances, I sent Mr. Hodson up to town, and in consequence of what I heard, I came up to town—I was present at the interview with Mr. Hodson, the prisoner, and Mr. Bailey, at Mr. Bailey's office—I have heard what Mr. Bailey has stated—with regard to what took place it is perfectly correct.

Cross-examined. Q. Was there never any written agreement? A. No, not of any kind, I have no partners at present; the prisoner was engaged at a salary of 280l. per annum—I don't remember what reserved notice there was, whether it was three months or a month.

MR. HARPER. The prisoner attended at my office almost every day for the purpose of going through the accounts—an appointment was made for him which he did not keep—I did not see him again.

Cross-examined. Q. Before you lost sight of him was the investigation thoroughly completed? A. Not quite; there were one or two more ques-tions to ask him; substantially he had told me all I required to know—he was present day by day, and gave me the fullest possible information—I found that his original representation was in the main correct—there were some things that I could not prove, but I stated in my report that upon

the whole what he had stated was quite consistent with the facts, as I could elicit them from the papers that he handed in.

MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. All the explanation he gave you was with reference to accounts that appeared in the books? A. Yes, and with reference to the appropriation of monies which he avowed that he had embezzled—any amounts that did not appear in the books would have been ascertained in the course of time—I never valued the securities.

MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Have you the slightest ground for supposing that there was any defalcation to the amount of sixpence that you had not fully investigated? A. I stated as much in my report—a large sum of his own, more than 700l. must have been absorbed in the monies that were lost; that is quite independent of the 3700l.

MICHAEL HAYDON . I am an officer of the City detective force—on 24th February I had a warrant given, me for the prisoner's apprehension; I endeavoured to execute it—I succeeded in doing so on 27th July, at pimlico—I told him I was an officer, and held a warrant for his apprehension—he asked to see it—I showed it to him and proposed reading it to him—he said there was no occasion for that, he was quite content—I had not any instructions not to execute the warrant, nothing whatever was said to me about it.

GUILTY.—Strongly recommended to merry by the Jury, on the ground that if he had had more time, he might perhaps have made the accounts good.— Seven Years' Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-874
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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874. ARTHUR JOHN SAMUELS (34) , Stealing 1992 tassels and other goods of Alfred Rosenthal, and another. Second Count—Receiving the same.

MR. METCALFE conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence

RICHARD PARKER (N 317). In consequence of instructions, I went on Sunday, 7th August, to No. 1, Smart Street, Green Street, Bethnal Green, occupied by George Lane, and on searching the house, I found a portmanteau, two bags, and three paper parcels, containing a quantity of silk tassels and bobbins; there were 116 dozen tassels in the portmanteau, 298 bobbins of silk in the two bags, and about 73/4lbs, of black tram, which is a kind of silk, and a few tassels of various colours—I took Lane into custody, and he was ultimately discharged by the Magistrate—I afterwards went to the prisoner's house, I waited till 2 o'clock in the day, when he returned home—I went to the door and he put out his hand to shake hands—I told him I wished to have a word with him—he said, "All right, Mr. Parker, come in"—I went into the back parlour with him and said, "I have come to take you into custody"—he said, "What!"—I said, "I have come to take you into custody"—he said, "You are joking"—I said, "No, I was joking with you the other day, I am not now"—he said, "What are you taking me for?"—I said, "For being a receiver of stolen property, stolen silk and other goods"—he said, "Well, you have got to prove that, old boy"—I said, "I shall be able to prove that; do you know a man named Lane, living in Smart Street, Bethnal Green?"—with that he rushed to the sideboard, took hold of a piece of paper and wanted to go to the water-closet—I said, "You can go where you like, but you won't go out of my sight till you get to the police station"—I went with him to the water-closet, and as

soon as he came outside, he said, "When did you see Lane?"—I said, "I have just left him at the police station, and the property he had in his possession"—he made no answer to that, but asked me to allow him to have his dinner, which I did—I afterwards took him to the station—I afterwards went back to the house, and found three keys, one unlocks the portmanteau and another one the bag produced.

Cross-examined. Q. You knew that Sutton had been convicted, at that time, of stealing this property? A. I did.

GEORGE LANE . I live at 1, Smart Street, Bethnal Green—the prisoner is my brother-in-law—the police took from my place this portmanteau, and other things—they were brought there by the prisoner about ten or twelve days before—he asked me if I would mind these parcels for him for a few days—I said "Yes," and he left them—I saw him four or five days after. wards, and he told me they were port of a bankrupt's stock that he had bought up without any invoice, and he would fetch them away in a day or two.

MARY LANE . I am the mother of last witness—the prisoner brought the portmanteau there about two months ago; I can't recollect the time exactly—he said, "Will you let me put this under your bed?"—I was in bed at the time—I said, "What is the matter; have you got an execution in the house?"—he said, "No, no, it is nothing; a person who owes me a good bit of money has turned bankrupt, and he has sent for me to take a certain amount, and I took this, but of course I shall return it"—he fetched it away about eight or ten days afterwards.

Cross-examined. Q. I suppose you only saw the outside of the portmanteau? A. Only the outside—he is my son-in-law.

ALFRED SUTTON . I am a prisoner in the House of Correction—I was convicted, before the Magistrate, of robbing Messrs. Rosenthal of tassels and silk—I was in their service for about twenty years, engaged is the factory, and had access to their goods—I was taken into custody on a Monday evening in July; I don't know the date—I have known the prisoner for the last twenty years—his place of business is in Parson's Street, Kingsland—he worked for Messrs. Rosenthal about twenty years ago—he carries on the business of a small trimming manufacturer—Messrs. Rosenthal are wholesale trimming manufacturers—the goods produced I sold to the prisoner—I stole them from my employer—these white things I took about a month before I was apprehended, and the black about three months—I took all the things to the prisoner at different times—I received from him from 2l. to 3l. a week—sometimes I went twice a week, and sometimes three times—that has been going on for a little over twelve months—it commenced by my meeting him accidentally in the street—we went to a public-house, and he arranged that I should rob my employer—he knew that I was at Rosenthal's—he was to take the things from me and give me so much a down—I can't say how much I have received from him during the twelve months—I had from 2l. to 3l. a week; it averaged about that—he always knew where I brought the things from—I knew the price of the things—the real price of these was from 10s. to 11s. a dozen—the prisoner gave me 3s. 6d.; that was about the price he generally gave me.

Cross-examined. Q. You were taken before the Magistrate, and charged with robbing your employers; were you convicted? A. No, I pleaded guilty, and had six months' imprisonment—I am doing that now—it was about a week or fortnight after my accidentally meeting the prisoner that

I commenced to rob my master—he proposed it to me, and I consented—I was timid at first—I only saw him once or twice before I commenced to rob; it might have been three times—I thought it was my duty to inform my master, but I did not do it—I have not a brother-in-law in the trade—I never told the prisoner that I had, and that the goods belonged to him, and that he was hard up for money, and wanted to borrow some money upon them, nothing of the sort—there was no one present when this conversation took place about robbing my master—I kept it secret for twelve or fifteen months.

MR. METCALFE. Q. How recently, before you were given into custody, had you dealt with the prisoner? Q. I think it was a week—I can't say the quantity of bobbins that I took.

WILLIAM WELSH . I was in the prisoner's service as errand boy—I have on Sutton come there about once or twice a week for about nine months—I have been there eighteen months or two years—I did not see what he brought at any time; it was a black bag—he generally went into the back room by himself—the prisoner used to be out sometimes—Sutton used to walk in, and come out and go away—I did not notice whether the bag was full or empty—my master was there sometimes—I have seen the prisoner's little girl running off silk from bobbins on to other bobbins, pretty nearly every day.

ALFRED ROSENTHAL . I am in partnership with Mr. Gardener, as warehousemen and trimming manufacturers in Addle Street, City—I have inspected the property which was taken possession of by the police in the portmanteau and bags, and I identify it as mine—some of it is of a peculiar make, and exclusively our own pattern—I have missed property of this kind to a very large extent, much more than there is here—this paper parcel of beads has our own private mark upon it, in my handwriting—10s. 9d. is the selling price, to the trade, of these white tassels, and 7s. 9d. the black—I have not valued the things found, but I should say it is over 100l.

Cross-examined. Q. Do you identify the whole of the property there as your manufacture? A. Deeidedly—to the best of my belief this has never been sold—it would be impossible for me to say that, but we have lost property to a very large amount—I should say it has not been sold—I swear it because we have missed a much greater amount of the same pattern—we have sold quantities of the same pattern.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Did you ever sell any to the prisoner? A. Never—we do not take off the private mark when we sell goods—some of the silk is wound on to other bobbins after being taken off ours—I am positive this is our silk; the bobbins are stamped with our initials.

Witnesses for the Defence.

CAROLINE HUCKS . I have been in the habit of making tassels and such work for the prisoner—these goods look very much like my manufacture—I identify them by the finishing—some of the black look like some that I have made—they are very like them—I make them for the prisoner from time to time with his own materials—I have frequently made goods of this description for the prisoner.

Cross-examined. Q. Then you are not positive about it? A. I have made tassels like these—mine are generally about three inches and three and a half inches long—sometimes they may be four inches or five inches—I

told the officer they might have been three and a half inches or four inches, but I can't exactly say, it is so long ago since I made them—I may have made some as long as six or seven inches, but I really cannot say without the meshes before me—I never saw these since they left my hands, if they are mine—I never said I never made them beyond three and a half inches—these are the same description of tassels I make for the prisoner.

GUILTY The prisoner received a good character. (See page 586).

The following Prisoners PLEADED GUILTY.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-875
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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875. FREDERICK WILLIAM TURNER (20), and HENRY ELDER (16) , to two indictments for forging and uttering five orders for the delivery of goods with intent to defraud—. Judgment respited[Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-876
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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876. WILLIAM TAYLOR (18) , to embezzling and stealing 11l. 2s., 13l. 12s. 8d., and other monies, the property of Edward Hagen, his master— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-877
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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877. ANN GREEN (48) , to stealing fifty-two yards of cloth, the property of David McVicar, and also to having been before convicted in June, 1867*— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-878
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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878. SAMUEL KING (23) , to feloniously marrying Ann Mansfield, his wife then being alive— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment . And

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-879
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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879. WILLIAM POPE (37) , to stealing two canisters, 18 lbs. of compound scent, and 6 ozs. of essence of lemon, the property of William John Bush, his master— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Twelve Months' Imprisonment .

NEW COURT.—Monday, October 26th, 1868.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-880
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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880. JANE FERGUSSON (31) , PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously uttering counterfeit coin— Two Years' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-881
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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881. JOSEPH HAMILTON (22) , to unlawfully uttering counterfeit coin— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Twelve Months' Imprisonment. And

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-882
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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882. THOMAS WILLIAMS (22) , to a like offence.— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Two Years' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-883
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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883. CHARLES KING (25), was indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. COLERIDGE and BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution.

CLARA HOUGH . My mother keeps the Fortune of War—on 22nd October, about 7.30, I served the prisoner with a glass of ale—he gave me a florin, which I put in the till—there was no other florin there—about half an hour afterwards I took out the same florin, and sent the potman out with it—he brought it back, and I gave it to my father when he came in—it was pat on the mantelpiece—next day, Sunday, I saw the prisoner outside the door.

Prisoner. Are you sure that is the same piece? Witness. Yes—I did not mark it.

THOMAS ADDINGTON . I am potman at the Fortune of War—on 22nd August I received a florin from Miss Hough to buy some articles, and when I got to the shop I found it was bad—I returned it to her.

Prisoner. Are you sure it is the same piece? Witness. Yes, it was not out of my sight—I never put it in my pocket.

ISABELLA HOUGH . My husband keeps the Fortune of War, Giltspur Street—on 22nd August my daughter Clara brought this florin into the kitchen—I left it with her—on 23rd, about 9.45 p.m., I served the prisoner with a pint of ale—prisoner put down a half-crown—I broke it in half, and

asked if he had any more—Mr. Hough laid hold of him, and sent for a policeman—my daughter came down and recognized the prisoner.

WILLIAM REESON HOUGH . On Saturday, 22nd August, between 8 and 9 o'clock in the evening, my daughter gave me a bad florin—I put it on the mantelshelf—on Sunday, the 23rd, the prisoner came in, and I saw my wife break some money—I went round and took hold of him, and my wife gave me these two bits of a bad half-crown—I gave them to the officer.

Prisoner. Who takes the money out of the till? Witness. When 1l. worth of silver is taken, it is taken out of the till and taken up stairs.

JAMES FOREMAN (Policeman 316). I took the prisoner and found only 2d. on him—he said that he had no home—Mr. Hough gave me this broken half-crown and florin.

Prisoner. Did not the first witness tell you at Guildhall, that she could not recognize me? Witness. No; I told the clerk of the Court that Mr. Hough said that he did not know whether his daughter could recognize you or not.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . I am Inspector of Coin to Her Majesty's Mint—this florin and half-crown are bad.

Prisoner's Defence. I am a painter, and sold my diamond for 3s. 6d.; the half-crown I received was bad. I never saw the florin, and was not in the house.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-884
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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884. SARAH PHILLIPS (17) was indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. COLERIDGE and BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution; and

MR. GRIFFTHS the Defence.

HARRIET BROWN . I am in the service of Stephen Sadler, of Brick Lane, a sweetstuff shopkeeper—on 18th September, the prisoner came in for one pennyworth of sweets, and gave me a shilling, which I put in the till, where there was no other shilling—about an hour afterwards, Mary Ann Sadler found two bad shillings in the till in my presence, one was nailed down to the counter, the other was broken to pieces, and thrown away—the prisoner came again next day for a halfpenny worth of biscuits, and gave me a shilling, I tried it in the detector, and told her it was bad—she said she did not know it—I gave it to Mrs. Sadler, who asked the prisoner where she got it—she said she had been cleaning steps—she was given into custody.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you not say before the Magistrate, Mr. Sadler asked her where she got it, and she said that she worked for it? A. Yes, I had never seen the prisoner before—it was between 6 and 7 o'clock when she came on Friday evening, and about 11 on Saturday evening—two or three other persons serve in the shop as well as me.

MR. COLERIDGE. Q. Were there other shillings in the till? A. No, it had been cleared between the time of the prisoner coming in and these two shillings being taken out; they were found about an hour after she left—no money had been taken out in my presence between the time the two shillings were taken out and the time the prisoner left the shop.

COURT. Q. Had any money been put in in the mean time? A. No, we did not sell anything for the whole hour—I was there the whole time and did not take any silver, only halfpence—if the other persons took silver, they would put it in the till.

MARY ANN SADLER . I keep a confectioner's shop—on Friday evening, 18th September, two bad shillings were shown to me, a piece was broken out of one of them, and when we went to nail it to the counter, it broke again, and we chucked it away—next night, about 11.15, I was called into the shop, the prisoner was there; the last witness gave me a bad shilling and I said to the prisoner, "What a bad girl you are to bring a bad shilling"—she said, "That she did not know it was bad, she had been at work for it"—I said, "How could you work for such money as this?"—Brown said, "You were here last night"—she said, "No, I was not"—she was given in charge.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you given change for a sovereign out of the till on Friday night? A. Yes, that is the way the 2s. were found—we had taken 20s. in an hour, we often take 30s.

MR. COLERIDGE. Q. At what time was the sovereign changed? A. About 7.30—there was change for a sovereign in money of all sorts when I cleared the till, among it were the two bad shillings.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-885
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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885. JOHN BURKE (35), was indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. COLERIDGE and BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution.

MARIAN PEARCE . I am the wife of John James Pearce, who keeps the Albion public-house, Caledonian Road—on October 1st, I served the prisoner with a glass of ale, and he gave me a half-crown, I gave him 2s. 41/2d, change—I looked at him quite two minutes before giving him the change, because I suspected the half-crown—he left the bar, I put it in my mouth, and found it was bad—it was put on the shelf, and afterwards in a cupboard, which was kept locked—on 5th October the barmaid showed me a bad half-crown—I went into the bar, and the prisoner was there—I recognized him at once, and he was given in custody—I gave the half-crowns to the constable at the Police Court.

SOPHIA PYE . I am barmaid at the Albion—on 5th October, I served the prisoner with a glass of ale—he gave me a bad half-crown—I gave it to Mrs. Price, and before I said anything, the prisoner asked me if it was a bad one—I said, "Rather"—he was given in custody.

JOHN JAMES PEAROE . I keep the Albion public-house—on 1st October, my wife showed me a bad half-crown—I searched the till and found another bad half-crown—I put them together in a cupboard, which was kept locked—on 5th October, my wife gave me a bad half-crown—I saw the prisoner in the bar, and gave him in custody with that half-crown and the two others—I put the half-crowns back in the cupboard, and my wife took them to the Police Court next day.

JAMES MARVIN . I took the prisoner, and received this half-crown and two others next morning from Mrs. Pearce—I found on him a good florin and 1d.—he said that he came from Chatham on Friday night, and got change for a half-sovereign.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . These three florins are bad, and from the same mould.

Prisoner's Defence. I changed a sovereign at Chatham. If I had known the half-crowns were bad, I had plenty of opportunity of walking out.

GUILTY .—He was further charged with having been before convicted in May, 1867, to which he PLEADED GUILTY.— Two Years' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-886
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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886. JOSEPH ROGERS (28), was indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. BRINDLEY and GRAIN conducted the Prosecution.

PROVIDENCE MUGGLETON . I am a widow, and keep the Bricklayer's Arms, Tottenham—on 12th October, prisoner tendered me a bad half-crown for some beer—he said that he did not know it was bad, he took it in change—he gave me 1d., and I took back the remainder of the beer and gave him back the half-crown.

MARY ANN TAYLOR . I am a widow, and keep the Swan at Ponder's End—on 12th October, I served the prisoner with a pint of beer—he gave me a half-crown—I put it in my pocket and gave him the change—it remained there till next morning, when I gave it to the policeman—I had no other large money.

EDWARD LOWS (Policeman Y 271). On 13th October, at 6.15 a.m., Mrs. Taylor gave me this bad half-crown from her pocket, where she had about 1l. in silver, but no other half-crown.

MARY HILL . I am the wife of Alfred Hill, of the Plough, Enfield Highway—on 12th October, about 11 o'clock at night, I served the prisoner with some beer—he gave me a half-crown—I asked him if he had a penny, he said "No"—I took it to my husband to change it, and he said it was bad—I think the prisoner could hear that, but he did not leave the bar directly—my husband went out for a policeman, and when he came back the prisoner was just outside the door.

ALFRED HILL . My wife gave me this half-crown in a room behind my bar—I tried it with my teeth, and said to the prisoner, "This is a bad one; your have stopped here too long, my man"—I went to the station, and when I came back he was gone.

Prisoner. I was close again the door when you came back? Witness. I did not see you till the constable brought you into the station.

HENRY FRY (Policeman Y 80). On 8th October, Mr. Hill came to the station, and gave me a bad half-crown—I ran before him to his house, but the prisoner was gone—I overtook him 100 yards off, walking away, and took him in charge—he said he did not know the half-crown was bad—I found nothing on him.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . These half-crowns are bad, and from the same mould.

Prisoner's Defence. I only know about one half-crown, and I did not know that that was bad.

GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-887
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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887. THOMAS PHILLIPS (49), was indicted for a like offence.

MR. BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution.

GEORGE EDWARD MURRAY . On 12th October, I was serving in Mr. Harris's bar, 15, Broad Street, Bloomsbury—I served the prisoner with one pennyworth of gin and some water—he gave me a shilling—I put it between my teeth, it bent readily, and I told him it was bad—he took it up, and said, "Yes"—he put it in his pocket, threw down another shilling, and said, "Try that"—I did so, and that was bad—he said that it could not be, and asked for it again—I would not let him have it, but gave him in custody—he was sober—he told the policeman he took them last night when he was drunk, he did not know where.

Prisoner. Did I look at the second shilling before I gave it to yon? Witness. I do not know—you moved towards the door, and I immediately opened the flap—I told my master you had the first shilling—you laid it on the counter, I picked it up and gave it to the constable.

GEORGE DALEY (Policeman E R 38). The prisoner was given in my custody—he said that he had been out drinking the night before, and was not aware where he took them—I found two on him.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . These two shillings are bad.

Prisoner's Defence. I met some friends, and got too tipsy to ride in an omnibus. I took a cab, but having only a five shilling piece, I stopped the cab, and changed it at a public-house, but did not get out. I received 2s., four sixpences, and 1s. I never looked at the money. On the Tuesday I received a letter from Lord Grosvenor's committee respecting my vote, and went into this public house to get change for a shilling, that I might answer the letter. I showed it to this publican at the time. I have been thirty-five years in the same house, and have brought up a young family. I had no occasion to pass bad money, as my wife has an annuity.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-888
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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888. GEORGE ATKINS (34), was indicted for a like offence.

MR. BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecutions.

JANE SOMERS . I am the wife of Charles Somers, who keeps the Duke of Clarence, Old Street, St. Pancras—on 17th October, about 12 o'clock, I served the prisoner with some rum-and-water—he gave me 1s., which I put in the till—there was no other shilling there—about 2 o'clock in the afternoon, my daughter Frances, who was serving in the bar, brought me a bad shilling—I looked at the prisoner, who was there, and recognized him directly—he said, "I want my change"—I said to my husband, "We will lock this man up, it is the second coin he has passed on us to-day—the prisoner went out; my husband went after him, brought him back, and he was given in custody with the two marked shillings.

FRANCES SOMERS . On 17th October, about 2 o'clock, I served the prisoner with three-halfpennyworth of gin—he gave me a bad shilling, which I took to my father—my mother said, "This is the same man who gave me one—the prisoner was going to walk out; my father followed him, and brought him back.

CHARLES CLARENDON (Policeman Y 116). The prisoner was given into my custody with this second shilling—he was charged with passing one at 12 o'clock, and the other at 2 o'clock—he said that they were deceived, he had not been there before that day—I found 1d. on him—he had been drinking, but knew well what he was about.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . These two shillings are bad.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate was, that he was not the man who had the rum-and-water at the house, and that he did not know that the shilling which he paid the girl was bad.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-889
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

889. ISAAC MORRIS (24) , Unlawfully uttering a medal resembling a sovereign, but of less value.

MR. BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution.

ELIZABETH DEWING . I am waitress at the Crown coffee house, Bishopsgate Street—on 12th October, between 5 and 6 o'clock at night, the prisoner

came and had a half-pint of coffee and two slices of bread and butter, which came to 2d.—he paid me with this medal, which I took to be a sovereign, and I gave him 19s. 10d. change—he left the house—I put the medal on the shelf, and afterwards gave the medal to Mr. Wybrow.

Prisoner. A gentleman gave me 24s. for a pair of boots, I paid away the 4s. and gave you a sovereign. Witness. You did not.

JAMES WYBROW . I manage this coffee house for my brother-in law—I remember the prisoner coming in, and after he left the last witness gave me this coin; it was put on a shelf, and was not found out till after he had gone—it was the only sovereign we changed that day—I found the prisoner next morning, sad asked him what it was he gave my waitress last night—he said "I gave her a sovereign"—I said, "No, you gate her a medal"—he went with me, and she said "He is the man."

Prisoner. Have you not known me for a long time? Witness. For eighteen Booths or two years, but I do not suppose you have been in the place half a dozen times in that time—I once gave you a pair of shots to mend.

GEORGE NORTON . The prisoner is a customer of my employer's—on 12th October he was served with some goods in the shop, and put down a medal saying, "For a sovereign you shall give me change"—I took it up, saw it was worthless, and threw it back to him, at which he laughed—this medal looks like it—he paid me with other money.

JAMES PAICE (City Policeman 866). I took the prisoner—he said he had received 24s. for two pairs of boots on the day previous, but did not know the man of whom he took it—Wybrow handed me this medal.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . This coin is the size of a sovereign—here is the head of the Queen, as you find it on a sovereign; but, on the other aide, is "To Hanover"—it has the knerled edge of a sovereign.

Prisoner's Defence. I gave her a proper sovereign. I cannot speak proper English.

GUILTY .— Four Months' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-890
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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890. JOHN CONELLY (32) , Unlawfully uttering a counterfeit coin.

MR. BRINDLEY, conducted the Prosecution.

LAURA JANE DALE . I am barmaid at Lake's dining room, Cheapside—on 7th October, about 4 o'clock, the prisoner came in for a glass of stout, which came to 2d., and put down 1s.—I tried it, and told him it was bad—he said he was not aware of it, and gave me a good one—I sent for a constable, as the prisoner had been in on the 3rd and on the 10th, and tendered a florin each time for a glass of stout—I tested them, they bent and were soft—he begged my pardon the first time, and said he was not aware it was bad, and gave me a shilling—I bent the second florin and threw it away—I am sure he is the same man.

Prisoner. She is entirely mistaken in saying I was there twice before—there are sometimes 30 people in the bar.

WILLIAM NEWER (City Policeman 577). On 27th October the prisoner was given into my custody with these bad shillings—I told him the charge, he said he did not know it was bad—I found on him a 6d, and 6d. in halfpence—he gave his name, but refused his address.

Prisoner. My address would not have benefited the case, as I was staying at a lodging house.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . This is a bad shilling.

Prisoner's Defence. It is very strange she did not have me apprehended

the first and second time. I was not there at all Mr. Lake did not want to give me in custody, he only wanted to have me searched.


OLD COURT, Tuesday, October 27th, 1868.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-891
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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891. JACHEL ZIBARSKI (35), was indicted for wilful and corrupt perjury.


WILLIAM LIVINGSTONE . I am chief usher at the Thames Police Court—I remember when the charge against Rewman, Frankle, Harris and Cohen was investigated before Mr. Benson—they were in custody—the present prisoner was produced as a witness against them—there were several remands from time to time, and he gave evidence on those several occasion—his evidence was taken in writing—these are the depositions that were taken in the case—he was sworn through an interpreter.

JOSEPH SOLOMONS . I interpreted the evidence of the prisoner at the Thames Police Court—I interpreted it fairly, just as he told me. (The deposition of the prisoner was put in and read: it stated in substance that he came to this country as an agent for the Russion Government, to discover forgeries of Russian rouble notes; that he became acquainted with Frankle, Harm, Cohen, Rewman, and others, and detailed various interviews with them on the subject of forged notes; that on one occasion he saw Rewman at Harris's, that Rewman promised to send him specimens, and that afterwards he received is an envelope, through the post, two forged rouble notes, which he handed to Inspector Thomson.

OSCAR REWMAN . I live at 29, Stock well Park Crescent, Stockwell—I have an office at No. 2, Mason's Avenue, Coleman Street—I am a commission agent—I have been living in England for eleven years—up to the present time, when this charge was made, nothing of any kind had over been said against me—I was taken into custody on 27th May, I think, upon a charge of forging Russian noted—I was afterwards taken to the Thames Police Court, and remanded from time to time—I was kept in custody for thirteen weeks on a charge of having these Russian notes in possession—I was indicted with Frankle, Harris, and Cohen, against whom the prisoner gave evidence at the Police Court—I was afterwards sent for trial here—Cohen was discharged by the Magistrate, and another man I do not know—I have seen him, but I cannot remember his name—Harris, Frankle, and myself were committed for trial—I was bailed by the Magistrate—when I came to this Court, Frankle and Harris pleaded guilty to a minor offence—I was acquitted of everything—I think I saw Zibarski during the early part of this year—I will swear that I did not see him five times—that is the utmost—I may have seen him four times—it may have been five—I saw him at Harris's place, 92, Leman Street, Whitechapel—Harris carried on business there, on a large scale, in woollen cloth—I had several dealings with him years ago, not at 92, Leman Street—I had no business with him there—I did not buy at that place—I went there to see him on business,

but did not buy of him—years ago he bought several articles of me—not jewellery, that was later—I remember five or six yean ago, he brought some woollen jean, and some few pieces of cloth, which I sold him at that time; and on the Saturday before the Tuesday when I was arrested, he bought of me a gold watch, for which I received 16l.—when I went to his place, I went on legitimate business—I never had anything to do with the forgery of Russian notes in my life, or in the engraving of them—I never was connected with them in any way in my life—I did not know at all until I was taken into custody, that any forgery was going on, or that Zibarski was engaged in it—on my solemn oath I never spoke one syllable to the prisoner in my life—he never spoke to me on the subject of Russian notes, or in my presence—it is utterly false that he saw me at Harris's, and that any arrangement was come to about fake ten rouble notes—not a syllable passed about my airing 40,000l. worth of ten rouble notes—I will swear on my solemn oath that I never had a 100-rouble note in my possession in my life—Harris never gave me 6l. for any purpose—I did not say that I only had two ten rouble notes at present—I did not send two false ten rouble notes to Zibarski by post—I did not send them in any envelope by post—I did not send him an envelope by post, either with or without ten rouble notes—I never said to him that I was angry with him because I could not get back the envelope, that I did not want to be known in the affair—it is not true that Harris bought any notes of me; there is not one word of truth in his story—I will swear that I saw Frankle for the first time in my life, on the 26th May, when I was arrested—I never saw him until that day when I was in the dock—I did not go in a cab with Frankle, Harris, and Zibarski—I did not say that I would send him either, a 100 or a ten rouble note—I never spoke one word to the man in my life—he may have seen me go to Moses's place, that I cannot say, but I never made any signs whatever—on one occasion when I was at Harris's, I remember being asked to write some-thing—Zibarski was present, and Harris's female servant, and a gentleman named Goldberg; he went with me to look at some goods, because he was a little more of a judge of dry goods than I was—I looked over some goods while I was there—Harris came up to me and said, "Will you oblige this poor fellow, a Jew, or something, he wants to send a letter away to Beyrout, and cannot use a pen"—Zibarski was sitting there on a bale of goods—Harris gave me a piece of paper at the time, about half the size of the envelope—I there and then sat down at a small desk and wrote on the envelope from the piece of paper—this is the envelope and my writing (produced)—I simply copied what was on the piece of paper—I had seen Harris receive a communication from the prisoner just before, and that piece of paper was handed from the prisoner to Harris; and knowing that Harris could not write, I wrote on the envelope—he can write, but he cannot write legibly—I saw the envelope given back by Harris to the prisoner—I afterwards saw that envelope on 26th May, when it was produced by Mr. Robins, and that very day I made the statement to Mr. Wontner, that I am making now on oath—I never saw it from the time I gave it back to Harris until it was produced then—it is not true that I posted it—I never put a stamp on it, nor anything in it—there was no stamp on it when I wrote it—this was done a very long time before I was arrested—I should say at least between six and eight weeks—that is every word I know about that envelope—Zibarski was not dressed then as he is now—he was dressed like (if I may use the expression, being a Jew myself) a poor Polish Jew—a miserable Jew,

dirty and ragged—he looked poor—he had a beard something like he has now; a little longer—when he was afterwards confronted with me as a witness, he had shaved off his beard, and appeared with gold spectacles—he did not wear gold spectacles when I saw him at Harris's, or on any occasion—he wore a new suit when he was a witness, and was, I may say, properly dressed.

Cross-examined. Q. How long have you lived at 29, Stockwell Park Crescent? A. The last twelve months, but in the parish at least ten years—I was asked at the Police-Court whether I had had only two transactions with Harris, and I said "Yes"—I now say that I never had any other transaction with him—when I made that statement at the Police-Court, I was under the firm belief that the only two transactions I mentioned, the diamond ring and the watch, were the only two I have had; but since that, it came to my recollection that about eighteen months ago I had a parcel of watches, on which I raised some money, and out of those watches Harris bought several, I think twelve or fifteen—he paid the money to the other party—that transaction quite slipped my memory—the woollen cloth transaction was seven years ago—I have heard Harris examined at the Police-Court—I heard him say he had had several transactions with me within the last three or four years—I did not say I did not know Harris—I did not know him intimately at all—I never had him at my private residence—he would know nothing of my private affairs—I never saw Frankle in my life, till the day I was arrested—my only motive for writing the address on the envelope was good nature—I am positive I never saw it again until I was at the Police-Court—Inspector Thomson did not show it to me; that I am sure about—I swear, to the best of my belief, that he did not show it to me—I will swear my attention was not called to it by Thomson—as far as I know about the matter, I will swear positively it was not—I will not swear to that point positively—I could only have been shown it at the police-station, and what happened there I don't know—I did not say to Thomson that I had never seen it in my life, certainly not; I swear that positively, nothing of the kind—I never said so to anybody—on my solemn oath I did not know anything about these Russian forgeries—I say, most distinctly, I was not acquainted with the system of Russian forgery that was going on; I knew nothing at all about it—there never was anything against me before this charge; I swear to that, no charge of any kind in this country—I am a Prussian—there was a charge against me, in Prussia, for forging a bill of exchange—I did not run away; I went away—I did not keep out of the way—no reward was offered for my apprehension—I never heard of it; I swear that most distinctly—I was not convicted, or found guilty, or sentence passed on me—it is utterly false that a sentence of three yean was passed upon me in my absence; no sentence of any kind was passed, it is utterly false—I was not advertised for in the Belgian papers; I never heard of it—I was charged with forging several bills of exchange, which were accepted by my brother-in-law and drawn by myself—I never have forged a bill in my life, and I will tell you how it was—the case was not tried—on my solemn oath, there was no trial upon it, nor any legal investigation, to my knowledge—this was in Berlin—I left there on 24th December, 1857; I remained away to the present moment—(Looking at a paper) this is quite correct; I was advertised for—you asked me if I was advertised for in Belgium; I was advertised for in my own country—I absconded from justice, through advice I had on very high

authority—I preferred to do that which I have done up to this present moment, to stop away, to save my family, not myself—I have been back to Germany—my brother accepted, for me, about 10,000l. worth of bills, about 70,000 thalers—when the panic of '57 began, I could not meet my engagements, and my brother-in-law said, "You go away for a short time, I will arrange it"—an uncle of mine, of the same firm, accepted the bills, and when I was three or four days away, my brother-in-law turned round and said, "I will not pay," and declared that he did not sign the bills, and that my uncle had no authority to sign—that was the forgery I was charged with—my brother did not charge me with forgery—my uncle accepted the bills—It behaved as badly as my brother—he was my wife's uncle—they both behaved very badly to me, not quite so bad as Zibarski—they did it to save their name, and he did it only to please Mr. Robins, that honourable gentle-man, and Mr. Thomson, and to get money—I have never spoken one word to my brother or uncle since—they are still in Berlin—I am a commission agent—I mean by that, buying and selling, and making profit, and making my living by it, watches, jewellery, diamonds, and almost anything—not old clothes—I have dealt with cloth a great deal—I knew of Frankle and Harris being taken into custody the night before they were arrested: I had been told about the case—I was arrested the following day—on 25th May I bought about 800l. worth of foreign stock, and sold it that same day at the Stock Exchange—they were Italian and Turkish bonds—I bought them of a gentleman living at an hotel in Panton Square—he was introduced to me by the landlord—I had not known him before, the landlord had—I gave about the full value for them—I gave 400l. in hard cash, and 400l. in some mining shares—I bought them in the City, and sold them in the City—this was on the Monday—on the Sunday previous a gentleman came to my office and asked whether I had some money to spare—I said, "Yes," and he came the following day—the circumstances were inquired into, and I bought the stock and sold it—I sold it through a broker, Messrs. Burningham, of Throgmorton Street, and they sold them to Mr. Louis Cohen, the broker of Rothschild's—it is not the fact that I took a good deal of interest in these Russian forgeries; none whatever, except interest in what is in the papers, when there are speeches made by Mr. Serjeant Ballantine, they are always interesting—I took no interest in, and knew nothing about these matters—I have been lucky and unlucky in my acquaintances—I knew Holchester, I made his acquaintance at a German coffee-house—I know that he was sentenced to twelve years' penal servitude for forging Russian notes—I never had any business with the man in my life—I had seen him, but never bad any transaction with him—I had known him some months before he was taken into custody—I used to see him very often, meeting him in the coffee-house in the afternoon—he was of my persuasion—he was not from Germany, and I don't know where from—he was not an English Jew—I used to see him pretty constantly at the coffee-house—to my astonishment he was taken of for forging Russian rouble notes—I should think that is three or four years ago—I did know that such things were going on—the knowledge of forged rouble notes did not come upon me entirely by surprise—I have read of a great many cases—I was not in communication with Holchester's wife while he was in prison—I will swear I was not—I did not call upon her by his desire while he was in prison—I did not see him while he was in prison—I say most distinctly that I did not see anything of Mrs. Holchester during the time he was in prison—I swear most distinctly I was not at the house—

if it is in the depositions that I said, "I will not swear one way or the other," I will not say it was not so—I am a widower—I was courting the sister of Holchester's wife—I used not to be a good deal at the house, the sister did not live there—I know a man named Koche, he was a witness in another case of forged Russian rouble notes—I know that he was taken into custody for forging those notes, and became Queen's evidence—I had known him for two or three years, perhaps before that—I did not know him well—I met him at the coffee-house—he offered me sometimes goods to sell, and sometimes I bought—I know him now, and associate with him now, not intimately—when he was taken his wife was poor and penniless, and when the matter came to my knowledge I went to her, and when I saw she was confined the same day, I went to Mr. Wontner, and engaged him to defend him; and I begged him to tell his client if he had done wrong to make a clean breast of it, and he might save himself—that was all I had to do in the transaction, and I have assisted a great many more men in such cases—I did Dot suggest that be should turn Queen's evidence—I said if he had made a mistake—I mean if a man has been in misfortune, the best thing to do is to make a clean breast of it, which he did, by giving evidence against his accomplices—I have been good friends with him since; a man may repent—I last saw Koche on Friday or Saturday; he lives in my neighbourhood, and I see him—I know that he makes his living respectably—I know that a man named Berrens was unfortunate in the same way—I sold him about 200l. worth of goods—I don't know how long he was confined for, for years no doubt—I don't know whether it was twelve years—he was convicted four or five years ago—I did not know him pretty well, not more than he bought of me a parcel of goods which I sold him, and he paid me part cash and part credit—when it was due it was not paid—I heard that he wanted to leave the country, and I had him arrested by a Judge's order, and I saved my money, 70l. odd—I don't know how long that was before he was covicted of forgery—it was between three and four years ago that I had him arrested, it must have been about twelve mouths before be was convicted—on my solemn oath I had not been in company with Berrens within twenty-four hours of his arrest for forgery—I was never in his company at all, except by meeting him in places—I can't help where people assemble—I had no doubt met him in places—I did not meet him in any place within twenty-four hours of his being taken into custody—I don't know how long before, perhaps weeks, or months, I don't know—I knew a person of the name of Cracaur—I think I know who you mean—I know nothing more of him than meeting him—I never had any transactions with in—I used to meet him casually, not privately—I have seen him and spoken to him, but I swear I never had any transaction whatever with him—he was convicted in Paris for forging Russian rouble notes—I knew him, and I knew Roupell, too, and I gave him my vote—you ask me these questions to damage my character—I know these persons, and I know a great many honest men, and I know persons whose characters may not be honest, I know Mr. Inspector Thomson, and I know Mr. Robins—although I knew all these persons, I swear most distinctly that I did not know that the forgery of rouble notes was going on—I did not know Davis—I did not know, for four years before I was myself accused, that the forgery of Russian rouble notes was going on to an enormous extent—I never bothered myself about Russian forged or good notes—I mean most distinctly to swear that.

Q. Did you not, a year and a half ago, call on Mr. Robins and offer to

detect the forgers of Russian notes? A. I did, and I hope you will allow. me to explain: Mr. Thomson sent one day for me, he wanted to see me; I went down to his private office, and after haying several preliminary conversations, he said, "The matter turns upon these forged Russian rouble notes"—I said, "Mr. Thomson, now what is the use of your always going on and finding out the dealers with these notes; why don't you try and get at the fountain head?"—he said, "I should like to find it"—I said, "I tell you what, Mr. Thomson, if a sum of 4000l. is guaranteed in the hands of my trustees, I will make this matter a matter of study, and devote my time to it, whether for twelve months or two years; if I succeed I want 4000l., if I don't succeed I have lost my money, my time, and my labour"—I did not know that I would succeed or not—on my solemn oath I was ready to give up two years of my time, without being pretty sure whether I succeeded or not—I knew nothing about them—Mr. Thomson gave me a piece of paper and his recommendation to Mr. Robins, and with that piece of paper I went there—I went there for the purpose of being employed, not as a spy, but, if a crime was in existence, to suppress it—I did not rely upon the gratitude of Koche—he could not tell all about it, he did not—Mr. Robins did not say that he would have nothing to do with me—he said he would propose the matter to his chiefs, whoever they may be, and they declined—I afterwards met Mr. Thomson in the passage of the Old Bailey, and he said, "Mr. Robins don't want to have anything to do in it," and the remark I made to Mr. Thomson was, "I can pretty well guess what the meaning is, neither you, nor Mr. Robins, nor Mr. Kamenski want to get at the bottom of it, for the simple reason that you don't want to lose the goose with the golden eggs"—I thought I could get to the bottom of it, if I devoted two years' or twelve months' labour to it.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. You speak of some coffee-house, were you in the habit of meeting a number of German Jews at a particular coffee-house? A. Everyday, between fifty and sixty—there are several coffee-houses in the City where German Jews resort, merely to take a cup of coffee; it is 5, Bloomfield Street, Liverpool Street—no, I beg your pardon, I did not mean Bloomfield Street, but Liverpool Buildings, Liverpool Street, where I met these persons, all the persons that have been mentioned, including Cracaur, who was convicted in Paris—I had known Koche several years; I had met him at this coffee-house, I had dealings with him, I bought goods of him and he sold goods for me—on my solemn oath I did not know of Holchester and the others being connected with Russian forgeries until their arrest and conviction—as to Koche, since he gave evidence I have no doubt he has been making a legitimate living—I never had any transaction with Berrens except the 200l. worth of goods; I arrested him for that, and made him pay me—I don't remember the time when he was arrested—I think it must have been about September or October when he was arrested by me—when I went to Thomson he sent for me—Mr. Robins did not send for me—Thomson gave me a piece of paper to go to him—he declined my proposal about a fortnight afterwards—the stock I purchased was Italian and Turkish—that was transacted through highly respectable brokers, in fact, the stock was delivered to Mr. Louis Cohen, the stockbroker of Messrs. Rothschild: the purchase was made of the principal, and the sale was by Messrs. Burningham—they were sold and dealt with regularly in the public market—I had some money at that time, not in the funds—to my knowledge, no trial took place against me at Berlin in my absence—about three years after I

left Berlin I was there visiting my own family—I have only been once in Berlin, but, perhaps, twenty times in Prussia—I was the drawer of the bills—my wife's uncle accepted them—they were supposed to be in partnership—I was first in partnership with my uncle and brother-in-law; he was, in fact, a sleeping partner—he gave the money to establish the factory—it was a trimming factory—my uncle accepted the bills—afterwards, when the crisis came, they could not be met—the estate was a bankrupt estate—it did not become bankrupt—when I left Berlin I had 15000l. drafts on my customers, every one has been met at maturity, and not one complaint has been lodged against me, except about these bills—I had nothing to do with forging the bills, nor did I know that my uncle had no authority to sign the acceptances; the charge was made after I left—both my uncle and brother-in-law consulted with me before I left: there was a family council—both my uncle and brother-in-law were perfectly aware that I was leaving Berlin, in fact, it was their advice to go away—they wanted to arrange the matter.

SAMUEL FRANKLE . I am come out of gaol now to give evidence—I am under a sentence of seventeen months' imprisonment—I pleaded guilty to a misdemeanour last sessions—I know Zibarski—I knew him before the end of last year—I think it was about the end of October or November—I had never known him before—he introduced himself to me—I carry on a pawn-broking business in Liverpool—when he came he brought me some certificates—(Looking at a paper) I can't exactly swear whether that was it—I have seen a great many more—he had about three forged certificates—I have seen three or four—I can't swear that is the same—he brought several certificates and several letters—this is the certificate he swore to at the Police Court, which he afterwards confessed was forged—I cannot translate it into English, I am not a sufficient scholar—I know the Hebrew very well—I afterwards saw him in London, at Mr. Harris's—Harris is no relation of mine—he carries on the cloth business, at 92, Leman Street—I know Oscar Rewman now—I never saw him in my life till I was arrested, and never spoke to him—I never drove or rode with the prisoner and Rewman in a cab—I never saw him at Harris's in my life—I knew nothing at all about him until he stood by me in the dock at the Police Court—that was the first time I ever knew him—I was never in company with a person named Moses in my life—I never knew the man—I heard his name—Rewman, Moses, and I, were never together in my life—if I saw Moses now even, I should not know him—he was mentioned by Harris—I never conversed with Rewman about Russian notes, I tell you I never saw him, nor did the prisoner in my presence—I never went with the prisoner in search of Rewman—I never was in a cab with Zibarski, or anywhere when Rewman made signs to me I never saw Rewman in my life, and never heard his name.

Cross-examined. Q. Have you seen Rewman to day? A. To-day—yes, I saw him in the coffee-house opposite—he was not doing anything there—he was only coming in—he treated me with a glass, that was all—there was nothing else, no more passed between us—he did not read anything to me to-day—he did yesterday—he read from a German paper, translated into English, about this case of forged notes, about their taking him into custody, and so on—he read it me to show that in Germany, where he was born, they gave him a good character—it was not anything about his evidence—it was only to say that he had a good character from there—I did not know him at all before—I am not a forger, or a dealer in forged notes—I have never done such a thing—I never had anything to do with

forged notes—I have seen them—I should think every person has seen here in this Court forged notes—perhaps I have seen them before—I have—I don't remember who has shown them to me—perhaps when I was at home in Russia I saw them—there are plenty there—I did not sea them in England—never at all until they were produced in Court—I know nothing about them, and nothing about the forgery of them—I know nothing about Rewman or forged notes—I do not deal in forged notes—I never had any in my possession—I never made any arrangements to circulate them—I never made any arrangement with anybody to part with the; such a suggestion is an utter falsehood—if I said myself that I was guilty of it, it is untrue—I was represented here by counsel when I pleaded guilty, and by an attorney—I don't know a man of the name of Berrens—may be I know such a name—I don't know what Berrens you mean—I know the Berrens who got into the misfortune about Russian notes—he was engaged to a girl at Liverpool—I was there at their engagement—I know Davis, he was living in Liverpool—if he met with a misfortune what was that to me—I saw him one time perhaps, or two times—I don't know him pretty well—I was not a friend of his, or of Mrs. Davis—I was never in his house—(Looking at a paper) I don't know whose writing that is—I swear that—I cannot write English—it is not in my writing—I am quite sure of that—I don't know whose writing it is—I swear it is not mine—I did not go to Mrs. Davis when her husband was in prison—I did not see her at all—I don't know Holchester, I never saw him in my life—I know a daughter of Davis's, she came to me in Liverpool while Davis was in prison—I don't know what for—let her say, I don't know—she came because I was acquainted with her father—she asked me to help him—I did not—I said I could not do anything for him—I did not give her money—I only gave her money that was owing to him—I don't remember how much it was—he was in charge for forging Russian notes—I did not owe money to him—I owed some to Berrens—Miss Davis came from Berrens—she did not say I owed Berrens money for forged notes, it was for cash he had lent me, and I owed it to him—he did not lend it me in Russian rouble notes, it was in English money, 50l., and I gave her 50l.—you asked me whether I gave money for Davis, I did not give it for Davis—she did not threaten to give me into custody, or to charge me with anything—she did not threaten me at all—I objected to let her have the money at first, because I did not want to give her money that I owed to Berrens—at last she brought me a letter from Berrens—I have not got that letter—she came down a second time—I would not let her have it at first—I would not let her have it before she brought a letter from Berrens—perhaps I should know the letter if I saw it—it was 50l. I gave her—I don't remember whether she left the note from Berrens, or whether she gave it to me—it is two or three years ago—I think this (produced) is the note—I see it is 30l., there—it was 50l. that I gave her—he wrote once for 30l., and I gave another 20l.—50l. was owing to him, and I gave him 50l.; he wrote at one time 30l., and another 20l.—she was twice in Liverpool—I don't remember whether she brought a second letter—I think she first applied for 20l., and then for 30l.—this (produced) is not a letter sent by me to Mrs. and Miss Davis—it is not my handwriting—I don't know whose it is—I never wrote to either Miss or Mrs. Davis.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY Q. You say you were not guilty, and yet you pleaded guilty to a misdemeanour, a minor offence? A. Yes, I pleaded

guilty because I was afraid there was a person come to give false evidence against me, and perhaps I should get fire or seven years for nothing—I was at the coffee-house yesterday, with the officers who had charge of me—they were present when Rewman read something from the paper.

BARNARD HARRIS (interpreted). I carry on business in a large way as a cloth dealer, in Leman Street, Whitechapel, and have done so for about six or seven years—I was, previous to that, in Whitechapel—I know Mr. Oscar Rewman; he has had dealings with me in a little way—I remember his coming to me, but I cannot recollect the date—it was five or six weeks previous to my arrest on this charge; I am sure of that—I knew Zibarski at that time, he was at my place, day and night—I knew him a little before and after Christmas—he was there when Rewman called—I remember that envelope being written—it is my envelope—ray servant was present when it was written, and a young man who came in with Mr. Rewman—this is Mr. Rewman's handwriting; I asked him to write it—Zibarski asked me to write an address; I said I could not write it—Zibarski said, "Ask one of those two gentlemen, and they will write it for you"—I was not to well acquainted with the other young man as I was with Rewman, so I asked Rewman to write it—Zibarski gave it on a piece of paper, and I gave it to Rewman, and he put the address down—I have a lot of envelopes, and I took one of them—I took the same piece of paper, with the envelope, and the address, when Rewman had written it, and returned it to Zibarski—I did not see what he did with it; it had nothing to do with me—Zibarski never spoke a single word to Rewman, at that time, about forged Russian notes—he did not understand his language, and the other one did not understand his—I never saw Zibarski speak a word to him—Rewman never conversed with me, in Zibarski's presence, about rouble notes, or anything of the kind—he never went with me in a cab to seek after Rewman—Frankle never knew Rewman—I never took Rewman into a back shop, and showed him a five or ten rouble note.

Cross-examined. Q. Do you know anything about forged rouble note? A. I have cloth to sell, but I do not know about forged rouble notes—I have known Rewman four, five, or six years—I have sold him perhaps twenty articles, perhaps more, perhaps less—he has bought articles of me—the last transaction was a gold watch and diamond ring, which I bought the tame week; and I bought some watches of Moses, which belonged to Rewman—a few years back he bought some wool of me—I don't know a man of the name of Holchester—1 can swear I never saw him—a few years back I heard his name mentioned—I don't know whether it had something to do with rouble notes—I see what is written on the envelope—when it was written I took it from Rewman and gave it to Zibarski—the same was written on it that is there now—it was two or three lines; that is all I know about it.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. Do you remember a person of the name of Moses Packholder being examined as a witness against you and Rewman, it the Thames Police Court? A. Yes.

LEOPOLD GOLDBERG . I have known Mr. Oscar Rewman about as long as I can remember, perhaps twenty-five years—I knew him in Berlin—I am a commission agent; I buy and sell cloth—I consider myself a fair judge of the quality and price of cloth—I remember going, with Mr. Rewman, to Mr. Barnard Harris's, in Leman Street, Whitechapel; I can't tell you the date, but it was about five or six weeks before Rewman was taken—I

remember the circumstance of an address being written, but not of this address—Mr. Rewman wrote an address—when I went with him to Harris's shop, there was somebody else present—Harris went and spoke to him; I did not hear what he said—Harris came back—I don't exactly recollect whether he brought a piece of paper, but he spoke to Rewman, and Rewman went to a desk by one side of the door, and wrote an address, and gave it to Harris—I don't know whether he wrote an address: he note something on an envelope—I could not swear whether he made any remark to me, at the time, about the name on the envelope—when he had written it, according to my belief, it was passed from Harris to the man that was sitting in the shop—I don't think I could recognise the man again—I observed his appearance, he had the appearance of a Polish Jew; a long coat, a long beard, and so on; a poor person—it was my impression that Harris gave the envelope back to him—Rewman did not speak to the man, or have any conversation with him while I was there—I think there was a girl in the room behind the shop—when Rewman was to be tried I was here as a witness—before that I went to Mr. Wontner, who was attorney for Rewman—I began to make a communication to him.

Cross-examined. Q. You were not examined at the Police Court? A. No—I am a Christian—I was a Jew—I come from Prussia—it is perhaps fifteen years since I took to Christianity—I am a commission agent—I used to carry on business in Monkwell Street—I have no City address now, because I don't require it for my business—my address is 9, Caxton Road, Wood Green—I carry on my business in the City, but I don't require an address—I had an address in the City, in Monkwell Street, and Coleman Street, and Coleman Street—I gave up ray City address because I was unfortunate in business; that is about a year ago—it was something like 6000l. or 7000l.—I don't know what my estate pays; I gave up about 4000l.; I don't know how much it has paid—the estate is in Central America—they have sent out to the French Consul, and I only passed my examination upon receiving an answer from him that my statement was correct—I don't know whether it has realized anything.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. How long were you in business before you failed? A. About two years—the cause of my failure was that I made a shipment to Central America, consigned to the son of the Vice President of Honduras, Lopez, to whom I was introduced by the Ambassador at Her Majesty's Court, here; it was not even negligence on my part that was the cause of my misfortune—I had references with this young man—I entrusted him with about 4000l. worth of goods—I never received a farthing back; therefore I was obliged to suspend—I have passed my examination and got my discharge, in consequence of my statement being corroborated by the French Consul, in Central America—I had money of my own, and a friend advanced me 400l., with which I traded.

ST. JOHN WONTNER . I acted as attorney for Mr. Rewman at the Police Court, when he was charged by the Russian Government—Mr. Warner Sleigh attended on behalf of the Russian Government, and made a statement of the case—in that statement, to the best of my belief, the envelope was alluded to; after that, and before the next examination, Mr. Rewman made a communication to me—Mr. Goldberg afterwards called upon me, and I believe I took down a statement from him in writing.

SARAH STOCKER . I have been in the service of Mr. Harris for seven Years, come Christmas—I am still living with Mrs. Harris, but I am doing

the tailoring—I remember being in the shop when the prisoner was there, and Mr. Rewman; it was five or six weeks before Mr. Harris was arrested; there was Mr. Harris, Mr. Rewman, another gentleman, and the prisoner in the shop—I cannot swear to the writing on this envelope; I remember something about an envelope—I saw the prisoner go up and speak to Mr. Harris; Mr. Rewman was looking over some cloths at the same time; and he went and spoke to Mr. Rewman, and went to the desk, took an envelope from the desk and gave it to Mr. Rewman; it was an envelope similar to this; I showed two of them at the time I was at the Police Court, to show they were similar—I saw Mr. Rewman writing on the envelope, and when he had done writing, he gave it to Mr. Harris, and Mr. Harris passed it to the prisoner—I am sure of that, I will take my oath of it.

Cross-examined. Q. Are you still living with Mrs. Harris? A. I lodge with her; I am not in service with her now—I work as a tailoress; I take work from the shop and take it home—I had known Zibarski several months, by coming there begging; he was there almost every day—I don't think my master ever went out with him—I could not say whether they went out together or not—they might have gone to have a glass of anything to drink, but I don't know anything about that—I have never seen them go out together, unless they went across to the public house—they might have gone out of the door together, whether they went further I don't know—I have seen them go out of the door together—Harris might not have come back immediately, perhaps—I did not go to the public-house—I can't tell how often they might have gone to the door together in this way—sometimes Zibarski stopped till I closed the shop at night, and then he went away—Mr. Harris did not go with him then; he would remain some hours, till 8 o'clock at night—I know Mr. Frankle, I have seen him there; the last time I saw him there was a month before Christmas—I did not see him there often; I have not seen him there since February—I can't say how often I have seen him there altogether, he very seldom came unless it was to buy some goods of Mr. Harris—if he came to buy cloth I packed it up and sent it by the rail—I assisted in the shop—I have seen Mr. Rewman there about three or four times, not more—he came to buy some cloth; he new came on any other occasion than to buy cloth—when he came, he always came to look at some cloth—the two envelopes that I took to the Police Court, I got from Mrs. Harris's writing desk—I asked for them, and she told me to take them—I asked for them because Mr. Rewman told me the; were speaking about the envelope which Harris gave to Zibarski, and I said I had got some similar—I had not seen the envelope produced before I saw it at the Police Court—I took the envelopes there to show that they were used in the business—Mr. Rewman told me to do so—he said, "Take some up with you, and show them"—he said that at the time he came to me to give him one—I gave him one similar to that—that was while Zibarski was in custody—I gave it him out of Mrs. Harris's desk.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. Were those envelopes similar to the one you have seen this morning? A. Yes, they were produced to the Magistrate.

ESTHER COHEN . I reside with my father, at 62, Royal Mint Street—my father is a glass cutter—I remember the prisoner coming to ray father's house at the latter end of March—he said, "Mr. Cohen, do you like the tobacco?"—father said, "I don't care for it, because it is too dear for me"—I did not know anything about the tobacco before that—the prisoner said, "If this business don't suit you, I have a better business for you, which you can make

a fortune by"—father said, "What is this business?"—he said "Can I talk before this person," meaning me—father said, "You are quite safe before her, she is my daughter"—then he said, "Do you buy shymers?" that if a Hebrew word, it means torn Hebrew books—he said, "Don't you know what I mean?"—father said, "No"—he took his pocket book out of his breast or some pocket, and took out four Russian notes—he said, "I mean this"—father said, "I don't know what that is"—he said, "These are Russian notes"—father said, "If these are good Russian notes you can get them cashed anywhere: you don't want me"—he said, "No, these are false, but they can pass for good"—so father said, "If you don't get out I shall break your neck, and the next time you come on such business I will have you locked up"—he said, "For heaven's sake, Mr. Cohen, you need not mention to anybody what I have been saying," and he went out—he was sent out by my father—I don't remember that he Motioned the value of the notes—he said, "I can export them to any amount, from three roubles to one hundred roubles"—two of the notes were red and two were blue—he said the blue were five roubles, and the red ten roubles.

Cross-examined. Q. How old are you? A. I shall be sixteen in December—be bad not known my father before, to my knowledge—I had never seen him but once—he was talking to father in the back parlour—I heard him, and father said he need not mind me as I was his daughter—he spoke in HebrewGerman—father said, "I don't deal in such things, and if you don't go out I till have you locked up;" and he said he would break his neck—I never made a charge against anybody, not to my recollection—I have never been into any police Court—I have made a charge—that was twelve months ago, I believe—it was not against a man for attempting to ravish me; it was for indecently exposing himself—my father gave him into custody on my charge.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. I believe you did not ultimately appear against him? A. I did not care about going into a Court—I had never been there, and I would not go—that was the reason, there was do other reason—the charge was true, on my solemn oath.

SAMUEL COHEN . I am a glass cutter, and live in Royal Mint Street—I know the prisoner—I first saw him in March last—I did not deal with him—he gave me a sample of tobacco, to try whether it would suit me, at Mr. Harris's home—he saw me smoking, and gave me a sample—I saw him afterwards at my house in that same week—I can't say what day it was—it was between 2 and 3 o'clock—he came in and asked how I liked the tobacco—I told him I did not care about it, it was no business of mine—he said, "Very well, if that business don't suit you, I have got some better business for you that you can make a fortune out of"—I said, "I should like to know what that business is"—he said, "Would you like to do business with any shymers?" that is a Hebrew word, meaning leaves from Hebrew books—I said "I do not deal in such things, it is no business for me, I am not a merchant in such a thing"—he said, "You are a foolish man if you don't understand what I am talking to you about; shall I show you a sample?"—I said, "Yes, you can show me"—my daughter was in the shop at the time, and he said, "Who is that young woman?"—I said, "That is my daughter"—he said, "Can we talk in Hebrew before her"—I said it was no harm, she was my daughter, I was not ashamed that she should see what it was—I said he could show me—he then took out his pocket book, or a paper; I did not take much notice; and he took out some Russian notes, and said, "That is the thing you can make your fortune out of"—he showed me five roubles and ten roubles—he said, "Any amount I can have if you want to do any business, from ten to one hundred roubles"—I told him that

business did not suit me, and said, "Don't you come to my house any more on such business as that"—he said he could sell them to me at a shilling a piece very cheap—I told him I did not like such a business, and if he came on such a business again, I would kick him out, and give him in charge—he told me they would pass for good.

Cross-examined. Q. You were quite shocked at the suggestion? A. I never did business with him—I did not know what it was at first, when he spoke about shymers—he explained afterwards that he meant forged notesI was very angry—I had only seen him once before, at Harris's place—I am no friend of Harris's—I went there to buy a bit of cloth—I have been a trouble—not for robbery—I was unfortunate—it was about an action—a man exposed himself before my daughter, and I did not go against him, because his wife came to me, crying bitterly, and begged mo not to do so—and he afterwards entered an action against me for false imprisonment—it was not a false charge—he recovered damages against me, 25l.—I was examined—my daughter was not—we had no trial at all, and no notice of trial—I did not pay, because I was not able, and I went to Whitecross Street—I was never in prison except upon that occasion—I am quite sure of that—there was never anything about furs, that I swear—I was never tried.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. You say your damages were 25l., what were the costs, do you remember how much it was altogether? A. About 64l. or 65l.—I was not able to pay—we did not appear at all, because we had no notice of trial—I acted on the information my daughter gate me—I had witnesses, and I saw it myself—I did not go to the Police Court, because the man's wife came and cried bitterly for me not to go.

MORITZ HARRIS MOSES . I am a merchant, and carry on business at 14, Union Court, Old Broad Street, and have done so for about eight years—I know Zibarski—he has altered in his face, but he is the man, I know—I first saw him at Harris's place, in Leman Street—I am an acquaintance of Harris's, and have had dealings with him—I know Mr. Rewman—I have never been in company with him and Zibarski, and I never saw Frankle until the day he was brought to the Court—it is not true that Frankle, Rewman, and Harris were together with me conversing about Russian rouble notes, or anything of the kind—Zibarski came to me one night, at my office, at the latter end of May—I think about the 19th or 20th—he and Harris were outside my office, and when I came in they were standing there—Harris said, "Mr. Moses, this gentleman has some good bills that he wants to have an advance upon; can you make an advance?"—I said, "Let me see the bills?—Zibarski took out one bill, which was dated St. petersburg, it was a bill for 3200l.—I saw it in his hand—he did not mention the amount, but he gave one bill into my hand and then another—I examined them—he said, "I have here a Russian merchant, and he wants to buy some goods; and I have here some good bills; can you make me to advance upon them?"—I said I would make inquiries—I did make inquiry; I did not make any advance.

Cross-examited. Q. Had you known Harris before? A. Yes, about six or eight years—I have done business with him—I am a merchant—I buy merchandize, and sell it again—if I can see to make a profit on certain goods, I buy and sell again—I deal in goods generally, merchandize, and I discount bills as well—I am a money-lender—I have an office and a warehouse as well—I have things in them—I have pictures, and all sorts—I

have cloth—I deal in pictures, and in wine and brandy—not in cigars—if anyone offers cigars to me, and I can make a profit on them, I buy them—I buy what anyone offers me—I have clothes in my warehouse at this moment, and wine, and pictures, and marble ornaments, statuary—they do not go in the way of discounts—I buy them—I do not discount bills with wine and pictures—I pay money for them—I do not import, and I do not export—I do bills—I have had several transactions with Harris—I don't recollect advancing him 160l.—I never had anything to do with engraved plates—I don't know what you mean—I never tried any speculation of Harris's about engraving plates—I don't recollect lending him 100l., a cheque, or about that sum—I am quite sure of that—I have lent him money sometimes, sometimes 800l., whatever he wanted, and when he had money to spare he gave it back to me—that was not a profitable business—I have known Rewman about eight years—I have done business with him of different kinds—if he wanted money I lent it to him, and he paid it whenever it was convenient—I have done that all the time I have known him—I have done nothing else for him—I have lent him money several times on his word—I did not take his bill—there was nothing between us but dealings in money—when he wanted money I lent it to him—I have not made up my accounts, so I don't know whether there is anything between us now—I am not finding any money for the expenses of this trial—I advanced some before he was arrested; not afterwards—it was about a fortnight before he was arrested—I can't say how much, without my books—I believe it was 150l.—it has not been paid yet, it is owing now—I never heard of his paying 800l. for Turkish and Italian Stock.

MR. SERJEANT PARRY. Q. Did you know Rewman's late wife and family? A. I did—I was very intimate with him, indeed—I believe it was a little more than 150l. that I lent him about a fortnight before his arrest—I have not lent him any since his arrest—he has not asked me—if he had I would have lent it to him, on his word only—I have been in England since 1853—no suggestion has ever been made of improper conduct against me.

GUILTY Judgment respited .—.

NEW COURT.—Tuesday, October 27th, 1868.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-892
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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892. GEORGE FAIRBURN (27) , PLEADED GUILTY to breaking and entering the dwelling house of William Hutchinson, and stealing two coats, value 21l. 15s., his property— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-893
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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893. OAKLEY BRINSLEY** (50) , to stealing a watch and other goods, of James Kennard; also a watch and chain, of Joseph Scott, in his dwelling house; also one watch of Alfred James Crawley; also a watch and other articles, of Eliza Cumberland, in her dwelling house; also a watch and chain, of Richard Burke; having been before convicted— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Fourteen Years' Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-894
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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894. WILLIAM CLARK** (34) , to stealing one coat, of Neate Wymond, having been before convicted— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Seven Years' Penal Servitude.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-895
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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895. JAMES GRANT (65) , to stealing four coats, of David Goldstein, his master— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-896
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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896. ALFRED BOULET (42) , to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling house of James Boone Rowe, with intent to steal— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-897
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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897. FREDERICK COMLEY (19) , to unlawfully obtaining by false pretences, a quantity of locks and other articles from Thomas Daniel— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Twelve Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-898
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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898. ROBERT JOHNSON (30) , to stealing a portmanteau, a coat, and other articles, of William Kingsworth; also four portmanteaus, a bag, three bracelets, and other articles, of George Reynolds— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprison.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-899
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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899. RICHARD WILLIAM WAY (20) , to feloniously forging and uttering a bill of exchange for 278l. 14s. 10d., with intent to defraud— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Twelve Months'Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-900
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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900. GUSTAVUS JULIUS CHARLES HARE (27) , to feloniously forging and uttering an order for 35l.; also an order for 25l.; also an order for 50l., with intent to defraud— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-901
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment > penal servitude

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26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-902
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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902. CHARLES PEARCE" (16) , to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling house of Sarah Price, and stealing six handkerchiefs, her property; also to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling house of William Henry Walker, and stealing therein, 14s. 6d. his money, having been before convicted— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Seven Years' Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-903
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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903. CHARLOTTE BURGINS (35) , to stealing twenty-six yards of alpaca, and fourteen yards of merino, of John Crotty and another, her masters— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Fifteen Months' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-904
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

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904. CHARLES AUSTIN (23) , to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling house of Mary Ann Roper, and stealing one needle case, and divers coins, her property— [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.] Eighteen Months' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-905
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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905. JOHN WOODEN (46*), and JAMES TORRENT (39) , Stealing thirty pieces of wood, of the London and South Western Railway Company.

MESSRS. POLAND and MACRAE-MOIR conducted the Prosecution; and MR. M. WILLIAMS the Defence.

William Spires, Edward Sedgwick, John Phillips, and Robert Allison repeated their former evidence.—(See pages 506 and 507).

Witnesses for the Defence.

ALFRED BOYDELL LAMB . I am a wine merchant, residing at Staines—on Friday, the day before the prisoners were given into custody, I saw some timber on Mr. Andrews' premises at mid-day, similar to this—Andrews was building some concrete walls, and was using a parcel of timber—I went to watch the construction of the walls, and saw similar timber to this, forming a casing to the concrete walk—I know that timber occasionally floats down the river.

Cross-examined by MR. POLAND. Q. How much have you seen floating down? A. Very small quantities, a piece of wood sometimes—Andrews is a tenant of mine; I am his ground landlord—I had no reason for noticing the wood he was using—I was there sometimes an hour, and sometimes a couple of hours—there was some similar to this, and some old—I will undertake to say that some of it was like wood used for a platform; when I went the following day, I was told that the wood had been taken away from the walls by the police—I did not attend before the Magistrate actually as a witness—I was here on the last trial, but was not called—Wooden is a sawyer.

MR. WILLIAMS. Q. Is it a fact that the case against Andrews on the last trial was stopped before I addressed the Jury? A. Yes.

THOMAS FLETCHER . I am a fisherman, at Egham, and have been many

years water-bailiff of the City of London—on the evening of 5th September, I was sitting by the water, with a friend, and asked him to go with me in my punt to pick up two pieces of wood which were coming down the stream—we picked them up, and afterwards saw two pieces of timber like this, but much larger—the police came and took it away from me—they did not charge me with stealing it—I have picked up many pieces of wood on the river at different times—I picked up timber from 400 to 800 yards above where the timber was found—it was from 500 to 600 yards from Staines railway bridge—there is no tide there, and wood does not float up the stream.

Cross-examined. Q. Was it 500 yards above the railway bridge? A. Yes, the stream goes down—the police told me that they had found the owner of the wood—I never picked up a cart load of wood in a day, nor yet a barrow load.

MR. WILLIAMS. Q. Do you know of your own knowledge, that fisherman do pick up wood and treat it as lost property; have you done it yourself? A. Yes, it is not valuable—the wood which I picked up above the iron bridge could not have been part of the wood which was under the dry arch; it could not have floated up; it must have floated from elsewhere.

MR. POLAND. Q. Did you hear the splash of the wood you picked up when it was thrown into the water? A. Yes, it was forty or fifty yards from where I was sitting—I did not see where the splash came from; it its dark; it was 9 o'clock on Saturday night.

MR. WILLIAMS. Q. At that time, 9 o'clock, were the prisoners in custody? A. Yes.

PERCY DANDO . I am a builder, of Staines—I have at times lost timber by it floating away—I have picked up timber on the river and burnt it—I Dover found any other use for it—the prisoners are in my employ as sawyers—they earn from 3l. 5s. to 3l. 15s. a week the two—they have been on bail since the last Session, and are defended through the kindness of the clergymen of the place, and other persons.

Cross-examined. Q. Have you picked up wood? A. Yes, a dozen times in the last two or three years—pieces of timber frequently float down the river—I saw a good cartload floating about last Sunday week—I did not pick it up, I had not got my punt—if I lost a cartload of timber I think I should have a good deal of difficulty in getting it back.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-906
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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906. THOMAS BARRETT (31) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling house of James Haysman, and stealing therein one shirt, of James Ward; one shirt, of William Parslow; one shirt, of James Bell; and eight pairs of boots, and other articles, of the said James Haysman.

MR. PATER conducted the Protection, and MR. WILLIAMS the Defence.

JOHN KEARNEY (Policeman 386 K). On 18th September, about 5 am, I was on duty in plain clothes in the Burnet Road, and saw the side gate of St. Alban's Lodge open—I went to the back and found these two bundles of wearing apparel, a dark lantern, a center stock, and a dagger (produced) in the garden—I found another constable and a sergeant in the garden—on 19th October, about 6.30 p.m., I went to 11, Buck's Row, Whitechapel, and saw the prisoner—I said that I had received information that he had part of the proceeds of a burglary, which had been committed at East London College, at his house—he said, "A young man came here about two hours ago and left a bundle"—he went to the bed, removed the bed clothes,

and produced six shirts with the boys' names on them—I said, "You have some more things besides these," and he said, "Yes," and went to a chest of drawers, and said, "Yes, there are some forks and spoons;" and produced three forks and six plated spoons, saying, "This is the whole"—I had told him previously that I intended to search his place—I asked him whether he knew who the young man was, or where he lived—he said that he did not, but should know him if he saw him again.

EDWARD KIDDELL (Policeman 680 K). On 18th September I was in the play, ground of Burnet House, and saw the kitchen window open—there were two marks of a center-bit on the shutters, and I found the stock of a centre-bit—a pane of glass had been out some time, and the shutters had been forced through the broken pane; they were seven feet wide; and the crossbar inside being pulled one way, and the shutters pulled the other, they had been forced and an entry obtained.

GEORGE WARD . I am a pupil at Burnet House—the master then was Mr. James Haysman—this is my shirt, my name is on it.

JAMES BELL . This is my shirt.

WILLIAM PARSLOW . I am also a pupil—this is my shirt.

EMMA PALMER . I am cook at East End Cottage, Burnet Road—one morning in September, I missed some spoons and forks, which were safe the night before—I fastened up the house at 9 o'clock.

Witness for the Defence.

ANN LOWMAN . I live at 11, Buck's Row—on Saturday, 19th September, I was at the prisoner's house all day—I was sitting at the door about 13.30, eating a piece of bread and butter, and the prisoner, was sitting on the floor, sorting his goods—a young man came in and asked him to mind a bundle for half an hour—we did not know what was in it—the prisoner did not get up, but said to his wife, "Jane, take them"—she took them and threw them on a chair—I moved them off the chair, and put them on the foot of the bed in the other room, because I was cleaning the room—my little boy took them up, and was playing with them—there were two or three forks, and two teaspoons—I took the forks and spoons and placed them in the bottom drawer—I gave evidence before the Magistrate—I did not know the young man, but I thought he looked very deplorable—I had a pot at my side, and I gave him a drop—I am not a charwoman—I had been helping to clean the house.

Cross-examined by MR. PATER. Q. What relation are you to the prisoners? A. He is my son in-law—he deals in locks and files, not in old clothes—only one bundle wag brought in—the child undid it by playing with it—no one put the shirts under the bed clothes—I placed them on the bed, they were there longer than an hour and a half—his wife put the bundle on the chair, and we both went out—after telling his wife to take care of the bundle he remained there an hour and a half, waiting for the young man to come for it, and then went out—he was not present when the child played with the bundle—he was not in the house when the child moved it—he did not know that the bundle had been disturbed—his wife was not in when the child played with the things—the spoons and forks dropped out, and I put them away—the bed was made—I will go on my knees and swear the prisoner was not at home.

MR. WILLIAMS. Q. Did you go before the Magistrate, when you heard the prisoner was in custody? A. I went up to the Magistrate, but was not

asked any questions, only who it was came in—the child is the prisoner's on, and my grandson.


He was further charged with having been convicted at Clerkenwell, in 1864, to which he PLEADED GUILTY.— Seven Years' Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-907
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceCorporal > whipping; Imprisonment > penal servitude

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907. WILLIAM FURZE (23) , Bobbery, with others, on James Jones, and stealing from his person one watch, one piece of paper, and 2l. 10s. in money, his property.

MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution.

JOHN JONES . I am a baker, of 127, Queen's Road, Whitechapel—on 24th September, about 12.40 a.m., I was in Osborn Street, and saw the prisoner—I was going to ask what he wanted, but my arms were twisted, my legs tripped up, and the prisoner took my watch and money, and an 10 U for 50l. from my brother—he did not hurt me, it was the others who twisted my arms and kicked my legs from under me—there were from four to six of them—my chain was broken off—one of them put his knee on my kidneys, and pulled me down—they ran away, and when I came-to I was robbed—I saw the prisoner next day at the Police Court with about even more, and knew him the moment I saw him.

FRANCIS ROBBINS (Policeman H 119). I took the prisoner, and told him it was on suspicion of being concerned with four or five others in robbing Mr. Jones, in Osborn Street, Whitechapel—he said that he knew nothing about him—he was placed with seven others, and Jones pointed him out—to said at the Police Court that we had got it well up for him, and what he got he was able to do.


He was further charged with having been convicted at Workship Street, in June, 1867, to which he PLEADED GUILTY.**— Forty Strokes with the Cat, and Seven Years' Penal Servitude . (There was another indictment against him for a like offence).

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-908
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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908. JOSEPH KNIGHT (17) , Feloniously forging and uttering a request for the delivery of goods, with intent to defraud.

MR. PATER conducted the Prosecution.

THOMAS DANIEL . I am an ironmonger, of 196, High Street, Poplar—on 23rd February, the prisoner called on me, and presented this order to my wife in my presence—I read it, and asked him where he got it—he said that I man outside gave it him—I sent a man to accompany him—(The order was for the delivery of bolts and locks to the bearer, signed Mr. Hall for Mr. Brooks)—I knew Messrs. Brooks and Ran.

BENJAMIN RAN . I am a joiner, of 6, Dewsbury Street, Bromley—this document is not my writing—I never authorized anybody to sign it for me, and did not give it to the prisoner.

ROBERT LEAKEY (Policeman K 434). I took the prisoner—he said that he had got the note from a young chap outside.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate: "A man said he would give me a shilling to get the things; I said I would. When I went out, the man was gone."


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-909
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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909. WILLIAM GALLIVAN (22) , Stealing one puree and 29l., of Thomas Staines, from his person.

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; and MR. WILLIAMS the Defence.

WILLIAM CUSHNEE (City Policeman 774). On 5th October I was on duty near the shipping office, Hammett Street, Minories, and saw the prisoner loitering about—I told him I believed he was wanted for robbing t marine of 29l., about a month previously—he said, "All right"—I said, "You quite understand the nature of the charge against you?"—he said, "I hear what you say, but I know nothing at all about it"—I searched him at the station, but found nothing—he was placed between two others, and the prosecutor identified him—he gave a correct address, and said that be was in the marine's company on the day in question.

Cross-examined. Q. Was not what he said, "It is quite true I was is his company on the day in question, but I know nothing of the robber?" A. He said so when I apprehended him—I did not hear him say so at the station.

THOMAS STAINES . I am a private of the 100th Royal Marines, stationed at Woolwich—on Monday afternoon, 7th September, I came up to London Bridge, as I had two months' leave—I wanted a cab, but they were all on strike—I wanted to go to the Waterloo Road, but was bewildered because St. Thomas's Hospital was not there—the prisoner came up, and I said, "I cannot get a cab"—he said, "I will show you the nearest way"—I said, "All right, old chap," and I relied on him—we went across the river, and went to house after house, and at last I got tired of it, and said, "Look here, I am not going further with you, I have had enough of that sort; before I send you away we will have a glass of something else to drink"—we had a pint, or a half-pint, of sherry—I was going to have another; I pulled out my purse, and he snatched it away—there was five 5l. notes in it, and four sovereigns—I was obliged to go book to Woolwich—I met the sergeant, who paid my fare back.

Cross-examined. Q. How many public-houses had you been into? A. One, before the Mitre—I did not stay there long; I did not leave Woolwich till 2 o'clock, and the robbery took place before 4 o'clock—I was not the worse for liquor—I did not have the chance to have any of the sherry, the prisoner mopped it all up—I had had nothing else all the time I was in his company, and was as sober as I am now—I went after the prisoner, and so did the publican—the door was shut, but on the hinge—the prisoner got away—I think there were two more people in the bar—I had paid for the first half-pint of sherry, but had not a chance to drink any of it—I was going to pay for another half pint—to the best of my knowledge, I had nothing to drink during the whole time I was in the prisoner's company, but I had a half-pint of beer at the canteen at Woolwich—I only went into one public-house with the prisoner; I am certain of that—I had something to drink in the prisoner's company at the Mitre—the sherry was are talking about—I did not say that I did not drink any of it.

MR. COOPER. Q. Where have you come from? A. From the east Indies, and I saw an alteration at London Bridge; the hospital was gone, and it was all railings.

CHARLES THORPE . I keep the Mitre, 38, Fish Street Hill—on 7th September, the prisoner came in with the soldier—they called for a half-pint of sherry, which the soldier paid for, and he got a sip of it—another was called for, and the soldier felt in his pocket for odd money, but did not seem to have any—he took his purse out, opened it, and the prison

snatched it out of his hand, and ran out at the door with it—I said, "Are not you going to look after your purse?"—I sent the potboy after the prisoner, and for the police.

Cross-examined. Q. Was the door open? A. Yes, on the strap—I suppose he and the soldier, and the men with him, drank the sherry—there were six of them, all drinking together—they all came in together—I followed the prisoner; the soldier did not attempt to catch hold of him; he was not very sober.

MR. COOPER. Q. Did the others leave with the prisoner, leaving the soldier all alone? A. Yes, he was on one side of the bar, and I on the other—it was done in a moment—I had seen the prisoner there before.

JOHN REED . I am a porter at the London Bridge Station—I have often seen the prisoner about there, taking boxes off busses, and taking them inside the station—on 7th September, about 4 p.m., I took a penny boat on the Surrey side, and saw the prisoner on board, and the soldier talking to him; and the man was with him who I had seen with him before—they got out at Paul's Wharf.

GUILTY .**— Seven Years' Penal servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-910
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceCorporal > whipping; Imprisonment > penal servitude

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910. CHARLES PAIN (20) , Robbery on Rebecca Helsdon, and stealing from her person a purse, 9s., and a half-pound of tea, her property.

MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution.

REBECCA HELSDON . On 16th October, about 7 o'clock, I was in Southampton Street, Strand, with the bag (produced) on my arm—I heard somebody come behind me and pull my bag—I was struck on the mouth, tad knocked down, and two teeth knocked out, by a man, who ran away immediately—I got up directly, and called, "Stop thief!"—I am certain that the man who struck me took my bag—I afterwards saw the prisoner in custody, but did not know him—he is like the man who struck me, and the same size—I believe the prisoner to be the man, but I did not see his face—the bag had in it 9s., in a purse, a half-pound of tea, and other things—when I got my bag the purse was gone.

Prisoner. In what way am I like the man? Witness. By your Size and appearance.

HENRY WARD . I am sixteen years old, and live at 13, Newcastle Street, Strand—I was standing at the corner of Burleigh Street, Strand, about 7 o'clock at night, heard a cry of "Stop thief!" and saw the prisoner running as fast as he could towards me, from Southampton Street, with this bag in his hand, and no cap on—I called, "Stop thief!" and saw him throw the bag away in Burleigh Street—I picked it up, and gave it to the sergeant—I saw the prisoner stopped, he is the man.

Prisoner. You said, at the Police Court, that I went round the corner and threw the bag away; how could you see me? Witness. I followed you all the way.

LWRENCE BURKE (Police Sergeant). About 7.30, I was in Burleigh Street, and heard a cry of "Stop thief!"—the prisoner ran towards me without a hat—I planted myself in the centre of the street, he saw me, there being a public-house with great lights, and crossed over—I caught him on the other side, and said, "What's up?"—he was out of breath, and could not speak—Ward came up and said, "He has knocked down an old lady"—the prisoner said, "It was not me"—I took him to the station and found a life-preserver in his coat pocket, and an imitation gold Albert—after

he was taken to the station, No. 87, who had found this hat and umbrella when the lady was knocked down, brought them into the station, and the prisoner said, "That is my hat."

Prisoner's Defence. I was not out of breath. The life-preserver was presented to me by my father, who if a gamekeeper in Northamptonshire. I earn about 30s. a week. I am not likely to go and knock an old women down. I saw a lady on the other side of the way; all in a moment, I saw a cluster, and heard screams. I was going to look at the lady. I was hit on the side of my head, and my hat knocked off; here is a lump now. When I got to the corner there were a lot of men in the street. I immediately ran across the street, and the policeman took me; not a person in Court can say anything wrong against me.

GUILTY .— Forty Stripes with the Cat and Five Years' Penal Servitude .

OLD COURT.—Wednesday, October 28th, 1868.

Before Mr. Justice Byles.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-911
VerdictGuilty > manslaughter

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911. JAMES ANDERSON (25), was indicted for that he, being a seaman on board the Hatfield Brothers, a British ship, afloat, out of Her Majesty's dominions, namely on the river Garonne, at Panillac, in France, did, on the 18th September, murder John Williams, on board the said ship. Second Count—Alleged that he was a British subject. Third Count.—That the murder was committed at Bordeaux, in France, and that the prisoner was a seaman on board the Hatfield Brothers. Fourth Count.—Same as third, only alleged that he was a British subject Fifth Count.—That the murder was committed on the high seas, and that the prisoner was a British subject. Sixth Count.—That it was committed on board a British ship, in a foreign port, namely Bordeaux. Seventh Count.—Same as fifth, but omitting the last allegation. Eighth Count.—That the prisoner was a subject of her Majesty, on land out of the United Kingdom, namely at Bordeaux. Ninth Count.—Murder in the ordinary form.

MESSRS. POLAND and BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and

MR. MONTAGU Williams the Defence.

JEFFERY POWERS . I was one of the crew of the Hatfield Brothers—I joined her on her last voyage—she sailed from Philadelphia—she belonged to Yarmouth, Nova Scotia—she carried the English flag—William Hatfield was the master, the same person that I saw before the English Consul at Bordeaux—on 17th September the vessel was in the Garonne, on the 18th she anchored about half way up the river towards Bordeaux, near Panillac—she was afloat about 300 yards from the shore, on the nearest side—the river is about half a mile wide at that point—the tide flows there—the prisoner was one of the crew, also John Williams, the deceased—the crew consisted of four seamen, two mates, and the captain—the four seamen were myself, Wellesley, the prisoner, and Williams, the deceased—he was a bigger man than the prisoner—previous to this occurrence, on the 18th, the prisoner and the deceased were on good terms—up to that time the prisoner was well-behaved, and a quiet, orderly fellow—the deceased was in good health previous to this occurrence, doing his duty on board as usual—I did not see the commencement of the dispute between the prisoner and deceased on the 18th—Wellesley called me and said there was a row in the forecastle and to go in—I ran from the fore part of the ship to the forecastle, where they

were, and saw the two men in a struggle together—the prisoner had only just come on board, we had been ashore, I went forward, and he went into the forecastle—when I went in they were struggling together—Anderson had Williams by the whiskers, and Williams had Anderson by the throat—they were on their feet at that time, they were standing about the middle of the forecastle—Williams said, "Take the knife, he has cut me; I did not think he had a knife"—I went between them and took the knife from them—they were both holding the knife—I held it in my hand, and opened the man's palms and had a look at the cut—I kept the knife in my hand about a minute before I hove it overboard—I thought it was the prisoner's knife, I did not know of my own knowledge—I took it out of both their hands—I afterwards found another knife on the forecastle; it was not in its proper place, it was in a place where we keep our pots and pans, a kind of shelf—it was naked—it is not here—it was put in Williams's bag among his clothes, it was his knife—we put it with his other things and sent them altogether to the Consul—it was a sheath knife—I found it about two or three feet from where the struggle took place—I did not look at it, to know whether it had been used recently—after separating them, I turned to Anderson, and said, "You have done it now"—Anderson said, "Why did he not let me alone?"—I went for a doctor—I saw a wound in Williams above the groin—I could not say on which side, I think it was on the right side, but I am not certain—it was about two inches long—I could not say whether it was a serious wound—when we opened his clothes it was all blood—I could see the mark of the cut, but I could not say how serious it was; blood was flowing from it—the prisoner was very excited at the time—I saw marks on him—his eye seemed a kind of swelling and blood underneath it—it appeared to be a recent injury—the doctor attended to Williams's wound, it was a doctor we got from Panillac—we went ashore and brought him on board—the ship was towed up to Bordeaux that night, and I saw Williams taken ashore there—I helped to take him—we only took him ashore, and there was a party there to take him to the hospital—I don't know the day of the month that we got to Bordeaux, it was the same day the accident happened—we put him ashore about 2 o'clock in the morning—the struggle occurred about 12 o'clock—I never saw him again alive—he seemed quiet when we left him—I did not think he would die—we were obliged to carry him—I afterwards attended before the Consul, at Bordeaux, twice—the captain was there on both occasions—the vessel was going to Bordeaux with staves—I don't know where she was going to from there—I left Bordeaux on 25th September—I saw the captain the day before—I left him at Bordeaux, in charge of the vessel—I came to this country in a steamer.

Cross-examined. Q. How long had the prisoner served as a shipmate with you on board this vessel? A. Five and a half months—he had served on board another ship with me—I have said of him that he was as generous a man as I ever met with, always ready to forgive—each of us had a knife—they were not knives that opened with a spring, but naked knives in sheaths—it might sometimes occur that the bottom of the sheath would wear out and the knife drop through—the place where the struggle took place was very narrow—the deceased was a good deal bigger and taller than the prisoner, and more powerful—I was examined twice before the Consul, and once before the Magistrate here—I have stated before to-day that Williams said, "I did not know that he had a knife"—I did not hear anything said, except Williams saying, "Take the knife"—at that time they each had hold

of it with one hand—the prisoner was not much cut about the face—his eye was swelled, and a little blood underneath it—the blood was not trickling down, it was only just the mark of blood right across—whose blood it was I could not say—I did not see any marks on the deceased's face.

MR. POLAND. Q. Did you afterwards see any wound on the prisoner, or any bruise? A. I saw a cut on the knee—next day I saw that his eye was swelled, but there was no cut.

GEORGE WELLESLEY . I was one of the seamen on board the Hatfield Brothers—I am an American, born in Virginia—I was on board on the Friday when this unfortunate affair happened—I first heard a noise in the forecastle, like two persons wrestling—I sung out to Powers, "You had better go to the forecastle"—I was sick at the time, but I followed shortly after him, and when I got to the forecastle I found the deceased, the prisoner, and Powers, all three standing there—I did not see anything of the knife then—the deceased said, "He has cut me"—I did not hear the prisoner say anything; in fact, I did not stay; as soon as I saw the cut, I ran out and fetched the captain—he went at once to the forecastle—I saw the deceased's wound before I went for the captain—I could not tell what sort of wound it was, it was all covered with blood, and I was too much excited—I saw that it was ail covered with blood, and there was something bulging out of it—I did not see any cut on the prisoner; I saw he had a black eye, as if he had had a blow—I afterwards saw he had a cut on his knee; I could not say on which leg it was—his trousers were cut; it was only a slight scratch—I never saw the deceased after he was taken ashore—I came to this country, with last witness, by direction of the Consul—the captain was left behind in charge of the vessel—I don't know where the vessel was bound to.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you heard the deceased grumbling at the prisoner that day? A. No; the night before I heard him say, "I will come and commence my old games again"—I don't know who he said it to; the prisoner and second mate were standing together—I have heard the deceased say that he had struck the mate and officers of other ships—the prisoner had sailed with me about five and a half months in this vessel—I always found him a quiet, inoffensive man—I had never sailed with him before—Williams was a good kind of man, only he was a little disagreeable at times—he weighed about 180 lbs., double the size of the prisoner.

JOSEPH DADE . I am a clerk in the office of the Registrar General of British Seamen, one of the departments of the Board of Trade—I produce some depositions which purport to have been taken before the British Consul at Bordeaux—I do not know where this vessel went to after she left Bordeaux—we have no record of her having been to this country; I can't say that we should have if she had been.

GEORGE WELLESLEY (re-examined). I came to London on 3rd or 4th October, in the steamer Aurora, in order to be a witness in this case—the captain was at Bordeaux on the 25th, when I left—the vessel was then discharging her cargo: his presence was necessary—I don't know whether she has left Bordeaux yet—the captain is a British North American.

MR. WILLIAMS objected to the reading of the captain's deposition (tendered by MR. POLAND under 17 & 18 Vic., c. 104s. 270) on the ground that it must first be shown that he could not be found in the Queen's dominions MR. POLAND submitted that reasonable evidence had been given that the captain was not in this country, which was sufficient to satisfy the requirements of the

statute, and referred to "Reg. v. Conning," Sessions Paper, 3rd Session, vol. 67, p. 204. MR. JUSTICE BYLES considered the evidence sufficient.

The deposition of the captain, Frederick Hatfield was then put in and read, certified by the Consul to have been correctly taken in presence of the prisoner, who was represented by counsel. It stated that on 18th September he had been ashore, and returned about 11.30 or 12.0 in the forenoon; that he had only sat down for a few minutes, when, hearing Wellesley call out "Run for the doctor," he went to the door of the forecastle, and saw Williams standing there holding his belly with both hands, and his clothes partly down; he was bleeding from a wound in the belly, from which his entrails were hanging out; that he directly went ashore for a doctor; that when he returned, he asked the prisoner why he had done such a deed, and he replied, if the man died he must be hung; that he put him in irons, and sent him to this country.

JOHN HICKMAN (Thames Police Inspector). From instructions I received, I went on board the Aurora, off Deptford, on Sunday, 4th October, and took the prisoner into custody—I took from his bag the trousers which I now produce—there is a cut on the right leg, just above the knee, about an inch in length—the trousers were amongst the things which I took possession of.

JOHN ROWLAND GIBSON . I am surgeon of Newgate. After Anderson was brought to the prison he called my attention to two marks on his right knee—I examined them; they were marks of wounds, evidently inflicted by some cutting instrument—it is impossible to say distinctly within what time they were inflicted, but I should say within a few weeks—one was a small wound beneath the knee-cap, not half an inch in length, a transverse wound; the other was quite three-quarters of an inch long, lower down, on the outer circle of the knee.

WILLIAM CHAMPION PARSONS . I am a clerk in the Custom-house, London—I produce a duplicate of the registration of the Hatfield Brothers; it is a certified copy—it is registered as a British ship, "Port of registry, Yarmouth, N. S.," that is, "Nova Scotia," British built, 200 tons, Frederick Hatfield, captain and part owner, No. 51, 997.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate was read as follows:—"I have not murdered the man—the man followed me into the forecastle and attacked me—I was sitting on a chest cutting tobacco—the deceased said, "Who were you talking to when ashore?"—I said, "To you"—he said, "I will never give you a chance to talk like that to me again"—he took me by the throat and dashed me down on the cheat, striking me all the time with his other hand: I had no chance—I put my hand behind me. to save myself—it lighted on the bunk, where I put my knife and tobacco—I was almost senseless at the time—he stopped my breath completely—I can't say how the knife was used—I knew nothing more till Powers came—I was cut myself in the leg, twice; I showed it to Powers."

MR. WILLIAMS submitted that there was no can for the Jury; first, because the prisoner was not a British subject. [He had, on arraignment, stated himself to be an American, and elected to be tried by an English Jury]—and on the authority of "Rex v. De Pando," 1st Taunton, also reported in Russell and Ryan, p. 134, and "Q. v. De Matos," 7, Carrington and Payne, 458, there was no jurisdiction in this Court to try an alien for an offence committed in a foreign country. As to the Counts alleging the offence to be committed on the high seas, the evidence showed the vessel to be in the port of Bordeaux.

MR. POLAND, after referring to the cases cited, in both of which it was clear the person charged was not a British subject, submitted that there was no evidence that the present prisoner was not a British subject; but that, being on board a British ship, in this river, "where the tide ebbs and flows, and where great ships go," he must be so considered. If the offence had been committed when the ship was on the high seas, he would dearly be answerable to the law of this country, because the flag carried with it a territorial jurisdiction, and for the purposes of criminal procedure, he would be a subject of Her Majesty. The question was, whether he ceased so to be when the ship entered this river, where the tide ebbs and flows. He contended that as the man served under the protection of the English flag, and acted as a seaman in as English ship, he owed allegiance to Her Majesty, and was, for that purpose, a British subject. (See "Rex v. Allen," 1st Moody's Crown Cases, 494, and 7 Car. and Payne, 664). He also referred to "Kent's Commentaries on American Law," vol i., page 400 (10th edition), to show that the American Legislature had enacted a similar law to that contained in 17 & 18 Vic, c. 104s. 267.

MR. JUSTICE BYLES. "My impression is strongly in favour of the prosecesstion, but, lest I should labour under a mistake, with this complication of statutes and decisions, I think it is open to allow you to have a case, if it becomes necessary. I think the prisoner is rightly tried here: it seems to me that a ship is a floating island, and the prisoner, being a seaman on board, is as much under the law as if this happened in the Isle of Wight.

The statutes referred to were "The Merchant Seamen's Act" 17 & 18 Vic, c. 104s. 267; 18 & 19 Vic, c. 91s. 21; and 30 & 31 Vic, c. 124s. 11.

GUILTY of Manslaughter, under circumstances of great provocation. Strongly recommended to mercy by the Jury.—Judgment reserved .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-912
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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912. ELIZA MOORE (40), was indicted for feloniously killing and slaying Edward Moore. She was also charged on the Coroner's Inquest with the like offence.

MR. DALT conducted the Prosecution.

SARAH ELIZABETH MOORE . I am turned thirteen years of age, and am the daughter of the prisoner—I live with her, at 4, City Gardens—my mother had a baby, nine months old, named Edward—she fed it at the breast—she was not a sober woman—she was sometimes drunk—very often, a good many times a week—she would go out to drink, and drink in the house, too—when she went out she left the baby at home, only my little brothers and sisters had the care of it; the oldest is turned nine, and the other turned seven—while she was away it did not get anything to eat—she would remain away all the morning, from about 9 till dinner time, 1 o'clock—I was not at home—I used to go over very often—I only lived on the other side of the way—I used to see her go out and come home—she used to go out again in the afternoon, and stay about three hours, and then she very often came back drunk—I have seen her feed the baby a little when she came back, with her breast—I don't know why she only gave it a little—she took it away—the baby used to cry a good deal when she was away—sometimes I have seen it lay on my sister's arm, and sometimes in my brother's arms, crying—I saw no milk or sop, or any kind of food—I have seen

my mother with money—I have never seen her buy any milk for the baby, or any food—I have seen my father give her money, 15s. 6d. a week he used to allow her, while he was away—I did not see him give it to her; my brother used to bring it, but when he was at home, he used to allow her 30s. a week—I have seen him give it to her—I have seen my mother smack the baby with her hand when it was crying, it hurt it; sometimes on its arms—I did not see the baby after it was dead—I have seen my mother put the baby to her breast, and it has refused to take it, I could not say how many tunes—my father was in work.

COURT. Q. Did your father see this going on? A. He was obliged to leave—she behaved very well to the child while father was there—she works at the envelope folding; sometimes she used to earn 10s. a week—I worked at the cementing; the most I ever earned was 3s. 8d. a week—there are eight of us alive—the oldest is nearly eighteen, he keeps himself—the next is a boy, he is out of work at present, and was then, but he used to get jobs, and give mother the money—there were five of us, with baby, to keep—I have heard my mother say that father earned 2l. a week, but he only earned 36s., and he used to allow her 30s.—my mother has beaten me.

LOUISA SCOPE . I am the wife of James Scope, of 4, City Gardens—I have known the prisoner about four years, and I knew the dead child; I saw it after it was dead—I never saw the prisoner ill-use it—she used to go out and leave it with the little ones, sometimes for two or three hours, just as it happened, not always alike—sometimes I have seen her come home in drink, a great many times—she is very much given to drink—I very seldom went up stairs; I have gone up sometimes, when I heard her beat the children, to take their parts—she was very cruel to them—I never saw her hit the baby—I have seen the baby lying on the floor, when I have by chance gone in—I have heard it crying; it was very ill a little time before the prisoner went away; it could not cry then; it was too ill to cry—it had measles—I think it was too ill to cry, about a week or a fortnight before the mother left it; it was in that time that I found it lying on the floor—it was not warmly dressed—it had nothing on but a little frock and petticoat, no flannel, or anything of the kind, when I took it to the workhouse—there were other children in the room at the time I saw it lying on the floor—I never saw the prisoner feed the baby.

COURT. Q. You say she used to go out for two or three hours at a time, was that to work? A. She did not go out to work since she had this last baby—she had had none to do for some time—I believe the baby was very much neglected, and wanted a good deal more nourishment than it had.

ELIZA MOORE . I am the prisoner's daughter, and lived with her—I am turned fifteen—I earned something—I gave mother 3s. 6d. a week, and kept the rest for my clothes—my brother used to earn something, till he fell out of work—he was out of work nine weeks before mother went away—he was out of work at the time baby died, and a good while before—mother was away about a fortnight before baby died—she was away for a month in prison, for giving Mrs. Scope a black eye—grandmother had the care of the baby while mother was in prison.

GEORGE EUGENE YARROW I am a surgeon—the deceased child was brought to my surgery on the evening of the 7th, ten days before its death—I weighed it on the 10th—it weighed 11 lbs., including its clothes and a scarf shawl—that was not the proper weight for a child of that age—it is about the weight of a new born child—I should imagine it was a fully born

child, it was fully developed—if properly fed, it should have weighed sixteen or seventeen pounds—it was very much emaciated, and suffering from exhaustion, I should imagine from privation of food—I prescribed stimulants, but it was unable to retain them on the stomach—it could not retain anything—I attended it to its death, on the 16th—four days privation would not cause the symptoms I saw—we endeavoured to keep it by nourishment between the 7th and 16th—the grandmother had charge of it during that time—I saw it daily—I believe everything was given it in the way of food and medicine that it ought to have, so far as I observed—I believe it died from starvation—I examined it after death—I found no traces of fat in any portion of the body, and no disease that would account for death-measles is not in itself a dangerous disease; children usually die of inflammation of the lungs when suffering from measles, but here the lunge were perfectly healthy—the child did not die from measles—there was nothing in the stomach but a small quantity of medicine and mucus—it was very much contracted—the appearances were consistent with death from starvation; I cannot assign any other cause.

ELIZA MOORS (re-examined). When mother went out she did not leave any food for the baby—I have never seen her feed it—I used to be out at work, from nine in the morning till seven or eight at night.

Prisoner. You know I have fed it with the nourishment I received, and you have given it brandy and beef tea. Witness. No, I have not, unless I brought it myself for the child—I have not had any dispute with my mother.

JAMES TAYLOR (Police Inspector). I was at the Islington Police Station, on Tuesday, 1st September, when the child was brought there by Mrs. Scope—it was very much emaciated—I accompanied her with it to the workhouse, and then went to 4, City Garden Row, where I found the prisoner, drunk—she was in the room of a lodger—I found four other children there.

Prisoner. The baby was very ill from the first About the latter end of June it had a sudden attack of diarrhoea. I had not the means of paying a doctor. I got an order from the Islington Workhouse, for the parish doctor, Mr. Turner; he attended it for several weeks. The child was very much reduced by the diarrhoea, because it would not keep anything, even the milk from the breast, on its stomach. It was getting a little better, and then the other children had measles, and the baby took it, and never retired afterwards. On 1st September, I left it on the bed for a few minutes, and while I was away, Mrs. Scope took it to the workhouse. No doubt the baby was fatigued and exhausted, and caught cold. I was locked up for an assault on Mrs. Scope, and I never saw the child afterwards. I was very much ill-used by my husband, both by blows and kicks, while I was pregnant with this child; and it was never well from its birth.

GUILTY Eighteen Months' Imprisonment .

NEW COURT.—Wednesday, October 28th, 1868.

Before Mr. Justice Lush.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-913
VerdictMiscellaneous > unfit to plead
SentenceImprisonment > insanity

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913. EDWIN GABB (41) , Feloniously killing and slaying Thomas beach.

Upon the evidence of DR. CHARLES WILLIAM PHILPOT, and MR. JOHN ROWLAND GIBSON, surgeon of New gate, the Jury found the prisoner to be of unsound mind, and unfit to plead .— Ordered to be detained during Her Majesty's pleasure .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-914
VerdictNot Guilty > directed

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914. WILLIAM TUNN (36), FRANCIS LAWSON (28), and DEVREAUX ALLINGTON (37) , Feloniously killing and slaying Mary West.

They were also charged, on the Coroner's Inquisition, with the like offence.

MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution; and MESSRS. RIBTON and TURNER

the Defence.

JOHN HEMMING . I live at Bull Row, Somers Town, and sell oysters—in July last, the deceased sent my child across the road to get some cheese, and then ran across the road to call her back—as she went across three wagons came along, going very fast—I did not see the men, they went too quick—I do not recognize any of the prisoners—I called out to them, but they never offered to stop—it was about a quarter to twelve at night—there was a light at the shop door, where the child was going—I saw the woman knocked down by the horse's head, or the shaft of one of the vans—they were following one another—the first one knocked her down, and the next one ran over her—the last one did not touch her—I pulled her away picked her np, got her into a cab, and sent her to the hospital.

Cross-examined. Q. Where were you standing? A. In Great College Street—I was selling my oysters to the persons who were going past—the vans turned into Great College Street—I saw them turn into Lime Street then—it was opposite the grocer's that the accident happened.

MR. DALY here stated that none of the witnesses identified any of the prisoners as the men who were driving the vans, upon which, MR. JUSTICE LUSH directed the Jury to find a verdict of NOT GUILTY .

THIRD COURT.—Wednesday, October 28th, 1868.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-915
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded guilty

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915. HENRY WARREN** (24), PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously forging and uttering a request for the delivery of articles of clothing and furniture; also a request for the delivery of shirt collars and other articles; also a request for the delivery of handkerchiefs and wearing apparel, with intent to defraud; also to obtaining one sword, three belts, and two suits of clothes, by false pretences.— Two Years' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-916
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

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916. FREDERICK EVERETT (38) , Unlawfully obtaining, by false pretences, an order for 151l. 6s. 3d., with intent to defraud, upon which, MR. METCLAFE, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence.—NOT GUILTY .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-917
VerdictsNot Guilty > no evidence

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917. JOSEPH SMITH (28) , was charged on five indictments for forging and uttering orders for the payment of money; also with stealing one piece of paper, the property of Her Majesty's Postmaster General, upon all which, MR. METCALFE, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence.—NOT GUILTY .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-918
VerdictGuilty > unknown; Guilty > unknown

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918. JOHN JONES (33), and ANN DONOGHUE (40) , Stealing a post letter, the property of Her Majesty's Postmaster General.

MESSRS. METCALFE and SLADE conducted the Prosecution.

GEORGE HANMER (City Policeman 76). On 29th September, I was on my beat at 8.20, p.m., and on turning the corner of Billiter Street, into Leaden hall Street, I saw the prisoners standing close by the Post Office receiving house, apparently in conversation; they passed me, and walked in

the direction of Aldgate—I put my hand in the aperture of the letter-box, And found it sticky; I followed the prisoners, and Jones divided from Donoghue—I overtook him in the middle of the road, and said, "Let me look at your hands"—the thumb and forefinger of the right hand were sticky—I said, "Do you know that woman?"—he said, "No"—I said, "I must have her as well"—he called out, "Ann, stop"—she stopped, and I went over to her—she dropped a piece of paper, which I put in my pocket, but it was of no consequence—I said, "Do you know the man?"—she said, "No"—I said, "You must accompany me to the station"—she said, "What for?"—I said, "I will tell you, by-and-bye—I took them to the station, and found in Jones's hat, this fork and table spoon, containing adhesive matter—I then went back to the receiving house, 37, Leadenhall Street, scraped some adhesive matter out of the letter box, And put it on a piece of paper—I afterwards went to the pillar post, Trinity Square, Tower Hill, and scraped some adhesive matter out; the letters were adhering to it—I afterwards went to the pillar post, Leadenhall Street, where I found some more of the sticky substance, scraped some of it out, and put it on a piece of paper—I accompanied Threadgold to 26, Jewry Street, Tower Hill, the address that Jones gave, and on the mantelpiece, on the third floor, occupied by the prisoners, I found this letter (produced), with some adhesive matter on it—the stamps were off it, and the envelope was torn open—Donoghue gave her address, 15, Queen Street, Tower Hill.

JAMES THREADGOLD (City Policeman 759). I have known Jones a year and a half as a letter carrier—it is twelve months since he was a letter carrier—I accompanied Hanmer to Jones' place, and found this ladle under a broken pan in the dust bin, covered over—it was very sticky, and smelt the same as the sticky stuff on the letters—after the first examination, I went to Jones's place, and found three postage stamps at the bottom of a small box on the mantelshelf—they have not been defaced, and there it no gum on the back of them.

Jones. My father sent me the stamps. When have you seen me before? Witness. Being on the beat where you live, I have spoken to you, and said, "Good night," very often.

JOEL BENJAMIN . I am a merchant, of 20, St. Mary Axe—on 29th September, I wrote this letter, and posted it myself at the pillar letter-box, near the hide market, Leadenhall Street, about 8 o'clock at night—I put three penny stamps on it.

JOEL HUTCHINS . I am in the employ of Charles Granger, a wine merchant, who occupies the cellars of 26, Jewry Street—Jones lives in the house, with his wife and three children—no one else lives there—he occupies the top room.

JAMES POND (City Policeman 164). On 10th September, about 11 o'clock, p.m., I saw the two prisoners together in Finsbury Circus, standing near the letter-box—I noticed them for some time, and at about 12.45 I put my hand in the letter-box, and found a sticky substance—I told my sergeant, who instructed me to remain there till he could get a man in plain clothes—while I was waiting the two prisoners came up from London Wall towards the letter-box, but when they saw me they turned away towards Liverpool Street, and I saw nothing more of them that night—I have seen them together on two or three occasions since.

Jones. What he says is false; she was never in my company. I do not know why they should make more of the case.

Donoghue. We were not together that night.

GEORGE WILLIAM REED (City Policeman 173). I saw the prisoners together on the 10th, in Finsbury Circus—in the first place I saw Jones by himself—the other constable told me something—I watched Jones, and saw him speak to Donoghue, and after some conversation they went away—on other occasions I have seen them, both together and separate.

Jones's Defence. Why did not the constable take me in custody if he had suspicion of me? They have made the case up. I know who took the letters, but I do not like to say.

Donoghne's Defence. It was his wife who was with hint I was coming, as innocently as I could, from Leadenhall Market, and of course he would speak to his sister-in-law.

DONOGHUE received a good character.

JONES.— GUILTY —(See next case).

DONOGHUE.— GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-919
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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919. JOHN JONES was again indicted for feloniously forging and uttering a request for the payment of money, with intent to defraud.

MESSRS. METCALFE and SLADE conducted the Prosecution.

EMMA SLATER . I am the wife of James Slater, of 35, Colet Place, Commercial Road—on Monday, 7th September, I wrote this letter (produced) to Mrs. Balderson, 3, London Road—I put it in an envelope and gave it to Mrs. Pailes to post, at about 7.45 in the evening—it is not now in the same state, this postscript has been added since—this envelope is not my writing, but it is addressed exactly in the same manner in which I addressed mine—it is a good imitation of my writing—here is the initial "S." on this envelope which was not on mine—I saw the letter, as it now is, on the Wednesday or Thursday following—Mrs. Griffiths showed it to me—I did not receive any money or post office order from Mrs. Balderson.

MARY ANN PAILES . I am a widow, and live at Gower's Walk, Whitechapel—on 7th September, I posted a letter for Mr. Slater at the general receiving house for the district, in the Commercial Road, in the state in which I received it—I did not write a postscript to it.

MARIA GRIFFITHS . I live at 3, Marlborough Road, St Alban's—on 8th September, I was staying with Mrs. Balderson, who is the aunt of the lady to whom this letter is addressed—I was sitting with her when it arrived—the opened it and said, "Read that"—I noticed the postscript, and was very much surprised—we talked it over between us, and I went and saw her niece, Mrs. Slater, and then communicated with the Post Office authorities.

DAVID LLOYD . I am a letter sorter, at the office in the Commercial Road—on 7th September, I was the superintending officer on night duty, and my attention was called to the state of the letter-box—there was some sticky stuff in it to which a letter was adhering—this letter was posted between 10 and 11 o'clock on the morning of 8th September—I see the 12 o'clock stamp on it—it would be dispatched to St Alban's by the afternoon mail, and would be delivered on Tuesday evening.

THOMAS COLSON . I am assistant to Mr. Oakley, who keeps the receiving house in Whitechapel—on Saturday, 26th September, a woman came to the office for a letter addressed in the name of Statin—I told her to call again—we came again on Monday evening, about 5.30, with the prisoner—I asked them if the letter contained money, and if the name of Slater would do—the female said that it did contain money—I said to the prisoner,

"Where did you expect the letter to come from?"—he said that they were travelling about the country, and it was impossible to say—I had no letter for them, and I told them so—I had received instructions from the General Post Office, and if they had said St Alban's, I should have given them in custody.

WILLIAM GEORGE DUNSTALL . I am inspector of letter carriers to the E.C. district—I know the prisoner—I was formerly in the W.C. district, and knew him at both offices—I know his writing, and believe this envelope and the postscript to this letter to be his—I am sure of it—I have the official book here.

Primmer. Had I left the service? Witness. Yes, nine months—you had been in the service fourteen years—you were discharged.

WILLIS CLARE . I am inspector of letter carriers at the General Post Office, and am acquainted with the prisoner's writing—this postscript and envelope are his writing—(Postscript read: "My dear aunt. I shall be exceedingly thankful if you can forward me a money order for a small amount, and address it to me at the Post Office, Whitechapel, to be called for; I shall return the money as soon as possible.")

Prisoner's Defence. I deny stealing any of the letters; and I did not take the stamps, but I know who did do it.

GUILTY .— Seven Years's Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-920
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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920. JAMES BROWN (35) , Stealing four bobbins of silk, of William Ritchie, his master.

MR. STRAIGHT conducted the Prosecution; and MR. RIBTON the Defence.

RICHARD PARKER (Policeman 317 N). I received information on 8th or 9th July—I watched Mr. Ritchie's premises, and saw the prisoner come out to his dinner, about 1 o'clock—I followed him to an eating house, in Nile Street, Hoxton—I went in, sat on his left side, and had some dinner; he had some dinner also—I talked about the weather, and felt something in his pocket like bobbins of silk—I left after dinner, and followed him to Old Street Road, when he looked behind, and I think he had an impression that I was following him, for he turned short round, and was making back for the City Road—I touched him on the shoulder, and said I wished to speak to him—he said, "I don't know you"—I said, "I am a police officer, and wish to know what you carry in your left hand coat pocket"—he seemed very much confused, and said, "A bobbin or two of silk"—I said, "I will not expose you in the street, and took him to the Nelson public-house, where I asked him to show them to me—he took out three small ones—I said, "Have you any more?—he hesitated, and said, "Yes, I have another," and produced this big one—I said, "How do you account for having them in your possession?"—he said, "I brought them out for patterns"—I said, "I shall take you in custody, for stealing them from Mr. Ritchie, your master.

Cross-examined. Q. When you said that, did he not say that he did not steal them? A. I believe he did, I am not quite certain.

WILLIAM RITCHIE . I am a silk trimming manufacturer, at 31, Murray Street, Hoxton—the prisoner has been in my employ upwards of fourteen years, and for upwards of five years has had the absolute control; I left the entire charge of the silk stock to him—I missed some silk on 29th July—I had previously communicated with the police—these four bobbins are mine, they have my brand, "W. R." on them, and the silk is my own dyeing—it is worth 10s. or 12s.—he had no authority to take out silk for patterns,

nothing leaves my premises without being entered in my work book, which is here—my wife, myself, and my nephew make the entries in it—I cannot tell who made entries in it on 29th July, without referring, and there are so many names, it will be difficult to trace it out; it is a kind of ledger, under the names of the work-people—the prisoner had no business to take these bobbins off the premises—one of them belongs to a job which I gave him to do shortly before 12 o'clock, on the day he went out to dinner at 1.

Cross-examined. Q. You gave it to him? A. I gave him the order, and selected the silk for the purpose—I know his brother, Benjamin Brown, perfectly well, he has worked for me for several years as an out-door hand—I never had a conversation with him about patterns—he may have made a pattern for me as additional work—he is a weaver, and I have told him if he likes to make a pattern at the end of his work he can; from the materials which have been given to him; the excess may be employed to make a pattern or patterns, at the end of his work—if he wanted materials for pattern making, he would come to me or to the prisoner, and they would be properly entered—I did not say to him, about eighteen months ago, "If you want materials, ask your brother, and he can take them to you "—the rules in the factory are absolute.

Witness for the Defence.

BENJAMIN BROWN . I am the prisoner's brother, and have worked for the prosecutor twelve years, up to June—when I had time, I used to make patterns and new designs, and in, I think, 1864, I got a prize of 1l. from Mr. Ritchie for doing so—I had frequent conversations with Mr. Ritchie about patterns—he told me I was to let my brother know if I wanted materials for patterns, and I should have the materials from my brother; my brother would bring them to me, to save my time in coming up and down—I lived at 6, Tyson Street, Bethnal Green Road at that time—I am quite sure he told me that—on this day I had an appointment to meet my brother opposite the Lying-in Hospital, at the corner of Old Street—the appointment was made the Saturday previous, at his mother's, to receive from him materials to make French patterns for Mr. Ritchie—my brother wanted me to come to the place of business, but I told him I could not afford to lose my time to run up and down for the materials to make the patterns with—the Lying-in Hospital is about seven minutes' walk from Mr. Ritchie's—he was to bring a pattern with him, which I was to make from—I have never seen this fringe pattern (found on the prisoner)—he did not show it me, but I told him that when he brought the silk he was also to bring a pattern—he said he would bring two—he designed this pattern—I kept my appointment on the 29th, but did not meet him, and afterwards went home to work—I did not go to Mr. Ritchie's because I did not think it was any consequence—not seeing him, I thought he would bring them to me at night, when he had done his business.

Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. When did you last do anything for Mr. Ritchie? A. Five or six months ago—I do not think I received that order from Mr. Ritchie himself—I have been doing work for other persons, since I left, in the fringe line, but not the same patterns—the last work I did for Mr. Ritchie was on the 3rd—I have done nothing for him since my brother was taken—I saw my brother frequently, but not every day—this is the pattern I was to make—my brother had mentioned a pattern he was to bring with him, or else I should not know his ideas—it was to be made of sewing silk.

MR. RIBTON. Q. As soon as you have made the patterns do you take them back? A. I do not take them myself, perhaps my brother would call for them—I might have taken them to Mr. Ritchie, or I might have sent them, as I have done before—I am not paid for them; if Mr. Ritchie approves of the pattern, and likes it, he gives me an order for a quantity—if he had approved of this pattern I should have got work.

COURT. Q. Would these bobbins of silk have been suitable for making the pattern? A. Yes—when I make a pattern I am not entitled to take it to any person; that would not be doing justice—if I make it for Mr. Ritchie, and he approves of it, I should treat it as his—I was not examined before the Magistrate, but I was there, ready to give evidence—I worked for other persons besides the prosecutor up to April—after I left off working on his premises, I worked for him or anybody else who would give me a job, but I had no job from the prosecutor.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-921
VerdictsNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

921. JAMES BROWN was again indicted for stealing 400 bobbins of silk, of William Ritchie, his master, and ARTHUR JOHN SAMUELS (34) , feloniously receiving the same. . MR. STRAIGHT, for the prosecution, offered no evidence NOT GUILTY (see page 545.)

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-922
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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922. JOSEPH HILL (19) , Stealing, on 5th August, ten printed books, and on 10th August, twelve printed books, of George Routledge and others.

MR. STRAIGHT conducted ike Prosecution.

ROBERT GRAY . I am undergoing a sentence of hard labour at Holloway, for stealing some books, in August, the property of my masters, Messrs. Routledge—I had known the prisoner about three months previous to that, and saw him frequently—in the week previous to 10th August, I took him a dozen "Broadway" Magazines down to Paternoster Row from my master's premises—the trade price of them is 4s. 6d.—before that he said that he wanted some, and I told him I could get him some—I left them at Mr. Procter's public house, Paternoster Row, as arranged, and he called for them in the evening—I saw him next morning, and he said "I sold them 'Broadways,' and here is the money for them, 2s."—he said he had got a little more, and had paid himself—on 10th August, I took' a dozen shilling novels from my master, which I left at Procter's public house, by the prisoner's request—this was the day before I was taken in custody—I was charged before a Magistrate with stealing those novels, convicted and sentenced to two months' imprisonment, which expires on Thursday—I have come here to speak the truth, and tell all I know about it—I did not give him instructions to take them to any particular place—I had been in the service about ten months.

Prisoner. You told me to take them to Atkinson's, in Tudor Street, and you paid me for doing so. Witness. It is not true—I told you where they came from, and you said you would get rid of them—I never told you to take them anywhere.

WILLIAM PROCTER . I keep the Swan and Last, Paternoster Row—I know the prisoner and the boy Gray—I saw them frequently in August, meeting at my public-house—Gray left a parcel there in the beginning of August, and the prisoner came for it—a short time afterwards I received

another parcel from Gray: I do not know the date—the prisoner came and asked for it, and had it.

ISAAC FARLEIGH (City Policeman 442). When Gray was taken before the Magistrate, I went in search of the prisoner, with a brother officer—I found him on 20th September, at 94, Milton Street, in bed—I told him I was an officer, and should take him in custody for receiving books from a man named Gray, who was in prison, and who was in the service of Messrs. Routledge—he said, "All right; I know all about it; I shall tell the whole truth about it"—I told him that what he said I should make use of in evidence—he said "I did take the parcels of books, I think three; the first I took he gave me 2d. and a drink of beer for; the second parcel he gave me 6d. and some beer for: I took the books to Mr. Atkinson, and the third parcel he gave me 1s. for: I also took them to Mr. Atkinson, in Tudor Street: I told Mr. Atkinson I brought them from Gray, the porter at Messrs. Routledge's, and he said, 'All right'"—he asked if I had got Mr. Atkinson—I said "No;" and took him to the station.

Prisoner. You know no wrong of me? Witness. No, I have known you twelve months.

JAMES HANN (City Detective). The prisoner made a statement to me that he met a young man named Gray, in Paternoster Row, who told him he had left a parcel of books at Mr. Procter's, a publican, in Newgate Market, and asked him to fetch them, and take them to Mr. Atkinson's, news agent, Tudor Street—that he fetched the books from Mr. Procter, and took them to Mr. Atkinson's—that he saw Mr. Atkinson in his shop, and told him he had got a parcel of books that he had brought from a young man working at Messrs. Routledge's—that Mr. Atkinson said, "All right," and he left the books on the counter, and left, and met Gray later in the day, who gave him 1s. for taking the books to Mr. Atkinson—I asked him if he had taken any books to Mr. Atkinson before, he said "Yes"—he also said that he took a parcel the Thursday previous.

Prisoner. Have you known me? Witness. Some time—I never knew any wrong of you.

COURT to WILLIAM PROCTER. Q. Would your house be described as in Newgate Market? A. The back entrance is in Paternoster Row, and the other in Newgate Market.

EDMUND ROUTLEDGE . I am one of the firm of Edmund Routledge & Sons—Gray was in our service on 10th August—he was carrying two parcels one of which he was authorized to take, and the other not—the value of a dozen shilling novels is about 8s. 6d.—I have not seen them since.

GEORGE MATTHEW ATKISON . I am a news agent, of Tudor Street, Blackfriars—the prisoner has never brought me any magazines or shilling novels—he has never been in my shop in his life—the statement he mode to the constable is perfectly false—I knew him working at Marshall's office, the publishers, in Fleet Street—I take in the "Broadway" and all Messrs. Routledge's works, but I buy them at Routledge's—I do not know Gray—the prisoner called me as his witness before the Magistrate—nobody but myself takes in books at my shop.— GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Imprisonment .

FOURTH COURT.—Wednesday, October 28th, 1868.

Before R. M. Kerr, EsQ.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-923
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty

Related Material

923. JAMES MURPHY (22) , PLEADED GUILTY ** to stealing a pipefrom the person of Charles Russell, having been before convicted of felony, in October, 1867.— Two Years' Imprisonment .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-924
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence

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924. MARGARET FITZGERALD (26) , Feloniously wounding Cornelius Olausen, with intent to do him some grievous bodily harm.

MR. PATER conducted the Prosecution.

CORNELIUS OLAUSEN (Through an Interpreter). I am a sailor, belonging to the ship Skirna—on the morning of 24th October, between 1 and 2 o'clock, I met the prisoner—I went with her to the place where she lives—I asked her if I could stay the night, and she asked me what money I had—I said, '1s. 8d."—she asked me to let her look at it. and I gave her the purse, containing it; she then said she would not let me stop the night—I wanted my money back, and she struck me—she gave me my purse back, with 11/2d. in it, told me to go away, and struck me again—I insisted on having my money, and she struck me on the side of the head with a poker, and in the struggle I fancied I was struck with a knife in the chin—I had been drinking, but was not drunk.

WILLIAM PYE (Policeman KR 14). On Sunday morning, 25th October, I saw the prosecutor—he was covered with blood and ashes—he gave the prisoner in custody—on the way to the station, she said, "Do you think I was going to stop with a b—boy for" 1s. 8d."—she is a brothel keeper—and it is a most disorderly place.

ALEXANDER RUSSELL . I am assistant to Dr. Ross, surgeon to the K Division of Police—I saw the prisoner at 2 o'clock, last Sunday morning, and found on the left side of his head a contused wound, about a quarter of an inch long, and half an inch deep, and on the left side of his lower lip an incised wound, an inch and a half long and third of an inch deep—that wound had been inflicted by some sharp instrument

TIMOTHY COX (Policeman K 45). I searched the prisoner's room on 25th October, and found a knife and apron—there was blood on both—I found the knife, the poker, and part of a fire shovel, concealed under the fender.

GUILTY OF UNLAWFULLY WOUNDING .— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-925
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

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925. AUGUSTINE BYRNE (32) , Stealing one rifle, a bayonet, and one ramrod, the goods and chattels of our Sovereign Lady the Queen.—Second Count.—Feloniously receiving the same.

MR. POLAND conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COLLINS and

MR. WARNER SLEIGH the Defence.

JOSEPH WILLIAM FAWKE (City Detective). On Monday, 7th September, I searched the prisoner's lodgings, 32, New Union Street, Little Moorfields—he occupied the second floor—the landlady, Mrs. Hodges, was there the whole of the time—I found a number of sword bayonets, gun barrels and ramrods, under the bed, wrapped up in canvas, rolled up tightly—but neither stitched nor tied—they are all here—there were seven bayonets—six or seven barrels, and seven ramrods and muzzle stoppers—I found a long Enfield barrel, and some daggers, under the seat of the sofalin' the front room, and under the bolster of the bed I found a sword—I took them all down to the Moor Lane Station, and on the following day the prisoner was taken there by two other officers—I told him I had found these things in his place, and unless he could satisfy me how he became possessed of them,

he would have to be detained—he said he had been a soldier all his life, and had been in the Garibaldian army, and that they were trophies he had saved—they were all produced before him—he said the sword was presented to him while in the Garibaldian army—I also told him that I had received some ammunition from Messrs. Vyse, of Wood Street, that is where his wife works—he asked to look at it—I then asked him what he wanted with such a quantity of fire-arms and ammunition; he said he kept them for his own amusement—he was asked some other question by the Inspector, and said, he had been a soldier all his life, and a revolutionist, and he hoped he should die as one—I found a small rosette, but I have not got it here—I. found no rifle stocks.

Cross-examined. Q. Were these arms all dry? A., Perfectly dry and clean—I should say they were not greased.

MARY ANN HODGES . I am the landlady of 32, New Union Street—on 17th February the prisoner came to lodge there with his wife—they occupied the second floor front and book rooms—when they took possession the rooms were quite empty—they moved their things in the ordinary way.

Cross-examined. Q. I suppose people came to visit them? A. Sometimes—he said he was a carpenter and joiner.

EDWARD BEARD . I am chief armourer at the Tower of London—we issue arms to the volunteer corps from there—the arms have the name of the corps upon them, and numbered, if ordered—I have examined all these arms carefully, and with the exception of the long Enfield barrel, they all belong to the 28th Middlesex—I am enabled to say that by the marks upon them—they are numbered 555, 867, 903, 223, 63, 201, 64, 84, 228—they also have got a Government mark.

Cross-examined. Q. Have you any memorandum when these rifles were given out? A. No, a man named Hunt would issue them—he is not here—each of the sword bayonets described bear a distinct mark—the rifle is marked upon the plate, and the number of the corps; and also upon the rammer—there is a mark on the bayonet by which we can tell whether it belongs to the barrel—taking up a single rifle-barrel I cannot say, of my own knowledge, that it was issued to any particular corps—no other person can.

COURT. Q. How do you say they ever belonged to the 28th Middlesex? A. There are private marks upon the bar.

MR. POLAND. Q. Take, for instance, bayonet 903? A. Yes; I have it, and this is the barrel that corresponds with it—(trying it.)—no; this does not fit—this belongs to bayonet 867—each bayonet is made to fit each barrel—there is No. 867 on the ramrod—there is a mark of the volunteer corps on the "grip," on the sword-bayonet, and on the scabbard—I am able to speak to them all in that way.

WILLIAM ROWE . I am sergeant-major of the Irish Rifle Brigade, 28th Middlesex, and have been so since 9th May, 1860—I know the prisoner by sight, he was a member of that corps—I have got the books of the regiment here—he was a member from 11th July, 1860, to 1st January, 1862—he was then struck off the strength of the corps, and he returned his rifle—each volunteer has a regimental number, and each rifle has a number; but a man's number in his regiment does not correspond with the number on his rifle—we have got no two rifles with the same number on them; they are numbered consecutively—and no two men have the same number—there is no memorandum in my writing of the man who had the rifle

Cross-examined. Q. When the prisoner left your corps, did he go and join the Garibaldian army? A. I saw him in the Garibaldian uniform, and when we found that out we struck him off the strength of the corps—he delivered up his arms and accoutrements.

PATRICK FITZGERALD . I am sergeant-instructor of musketry to the 28th Middlesex—it is the practice of the volunteers of that regiment to keep their rifles at their lodgings—on reference to this book I find that the man who had rifle No. 84, was a person named O'Brien—the entry was initialed by me—the books are kept jointly by two of us, and sometimes the entries are in my writing, and sometimes not—O'Brien is still on the books of the corps—speaking from memory, I should say he had not attended drill for eighteen months—at the end of last year I made inquiries for him at his lodgings, but could not find him—we have the address of every member—I know O'Brien has not resigned—the man who had rifle No. 555 was Edward Haydon—the entry in this book was initialed by me when the rifle was issued, on 20th May, 1867—he last attended drill some time last year—he has not returned his rifle—it is the duty of every man to bring back his rifle when he resigns—I cannot find out anything about him—rifle No. 201 was issued to a man named John Madden—he attended drill last some time last year—he has not returned his rifle—I cannot tell what has become of him—rifle No. 903 was issued to a man named Kennedy; he last attended drill some time last year—he has not returned his rifle, and I do not know what has become of him.

Cross-examined. Q. How many men have you in this corps? A. Pretty near 1000—I cannot tell the last time every man came to drill, without reference to the book—the book is not here—I have memoranda extracted from the book, which I thought would do as well—it was an oversight my not bringing the book—all the men I have named are on the strength of the corps now.

COURT. Q. Supposing Haydon or Madden were here, could you call upon them now to return their rifles? A. If we could find them, we could take their rifles from them.

MR. COLLINS. Q. Will you, of your own knowledge, venture to swear that not one of these men have been at drill this year? A. I can swear they have not been, because there is no entry in the book, and they have been looked after so carefully—I am not always at drill.

MR. POLAND. Q. How often have you been absent from drill this year? A. As a rule I have attended drill twice a week—I have this year's drill book here; it is principally in my writing.

COURT. Q. Whose duty is it to make up the test? A. It is the joint duty of the staff-surgeons—it is done under the superintendence of Lord Donegal—these men are nominally on the strength of the corps, but not in fact.

MR. COLLINS submitted that there was no case for the Jury, as the only evidence against the prisoner was that of possession. THE COURT left the case to the Jury on the Second Count.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-926
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

Related Material

926. AUGUSTINE BYRNE was again charged, upon two other indictments, with like offences, upon which MR. POLAND offered no evidence.


NEW COURT.—Thursday, October 29th, 1868.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-927
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

927. RICHARD EVETT (21), was indicted for a rape on Hannah Olliff

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COLLINS the Defence.


THIRD COURT—Thursday, October 29th, 1868.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-928
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

928. JOHN MONK (51) , Feloniously having in his possession certain cancelled stamps, and fixing upon each an impression of the head of the Queen, removed from another paper, impressed with a lower duty, with intent to defraud. Other Counts—Varying the manner of stating the charge.

MESSRS. POLAND and BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. STRAIGHT

the Defence.

FRANCIS HERBERT . I am a retired officer—I have been in the army—about a year ago I lived at the Sussex Hotel, in Fleet Street—I left last April—I came back in August—I went there then to call on Mr. Arthur, who lodged there at the same time that I did—we used the same rooms—I had seen the prisoner at the hotel, previous to April, on several occasions—Arthur was generally present—the prisoner was lodging there—when I left, in April, I left the prisoner and Mr. Arthur at the hotel—I left London, and returned in August; I think it was the 23rd—I went to the Sussex Hotel to see Arthur, and I made an appointment to meet him at the Boar's Head on 28th August; that is in Fleet Street, near the Sussex Hotel—on going to the Boar's Head, I saw Arthur, and while I was talking to him the prisoner came in—he spoke to Arthur, and then to me—he said I was better dressed than he was, and asked me to go round to Shoe Lane and pawn some stamps for him—I hesitated, and then said I would go—he said, "A pawnbroker's in Shoe Lane;" he did not exactly mention the name—we were standing about a couple of yards from Arthur when he made that request—I think Arthur could have heard—he spoke in an ordinary tone of voice—up to this time I never knew anything of the prisoner in connection with stamps—I had never seen any in his possession—he gave me a packet of stamps—there were 2s., 3s., 4s., and 5s. stamps, of the value of about 12l.—I did not count them—the envelope they were in was marked outside "12l. 12s.;" that was the value—they were in separate packets of the different values, and the packets were all in one envelope—I went to a Mr Cartland, a pawnbroker, in Shoe Lane, and asked for an advance of 6l. upon them—the prisoner had told me to ask 6l.—the stamps were taken from me by the assistant, and I waited some little time in the shop—I was then requested to go round to Mr. Cartland's private door, and in his office I was confronted with a policeman, and given into custody—I was taken to the police-station, and after some communication which I made there to the inspector, I was allowed to go back to the Boar's Head—the prisoner was not there at first—we went round to the Sussex Hotel, and then went back again, and found him there with Arthur—I said to the policeman, "That is the man who gave me the

stamps"—I said, "Monk, did you give me these stamps?" and he said, "Yes, I did"—the policeman also asked him the same question, and he said he did—he was taken into custody, and I was set at liberty.

Cross-examined. Q. How long have you been in the army? A. Up to 1864—I sold out in 1862—since then I have been to Australia, India, and Ceylon—I was at this hotel from last Christmas up to April—I have known the prisoner since last Christmas—I have seen him frequently; we have dined together, and spent the evening together—I lost sight of him in April, when I went away—I went back in August to see Mr. Arthur, and the prisoner called there—I left on good terms with the prisoner—previous to 28th August, I had not seen him since April—I went to the public-house with Arthur, and he came in about an hour after—he said I was better dressed than he was—that was the first observation he made, connected with this transaction—I said I was glad to see him, and all that—I had not heard him make any observation to Mr. Arthur about stamps before—I looked at the stamps when I took them, and said, "Are they genuine?" and he said, "Yes"—they appeared genuine to me—a good many persons stay at the Sussex Hotel—I should think they were broken-down gentlemen, who have seen better days—I should think there were 120 or 150 there, stopping there the same as myself.

MR. POLAND Q. That was the only transaction you had with the prisoner with regard to stamps? A. Yes; the only one—I had never seen stamps like them before.

WILLIAM HAYES (City Policeman 460). On the evening of 28th August, I was fetohed to Mr. Cartland's shop, in Shoe Lane—I saw the witness Enans in a private room, and took him into custody—in consequence of a communication he made to me, I took him to the Boar's Head, in Fleet Street, and saw the prisoner Monk there—I went and fetched him out—Evans said, "That is the man who gave me the stamps;" and the prisoner said, "Yes, I did"—I told him he would have to go to the station with me, as the stamps were wrong—he said, "Very well, I had them given to me by a man named Davey "—I asked him who Mr. Davey was, and he said he did not know—I asked him where he lived, and he said he did not know for certain, but somewhere in the neighbourhood of Curtain Road—I then took him to the station—at the station I asked him if he could find Mr. Davey—he said he had got an appointment with him that evening at the Windmill public-house, in St John Street, Clerkenwell, and if I went with him there we could find him, and if we could not find him there he was to have gone to the Blue Last, in Camomile Street—I took him to the Windmill, and he inquired for George—he said, "He sometimes goes by the name of George Carter; he takes two names"—he was not there—the prisoner said he would not be there that night, and then I took him to the Blue Last, but be was not there—the prisoner said, "It is no good to-night; if you were to go with me to-morrow morning, he has got another appointment to meet me; if I did not meet him over-night I was to meet him the next morning"—a plain-clothes officer was sent there the next day—I have not seen any thing of Davey.

Cross-examined. Q. What time was it that you took him into custody? A. A quarter past 7 in the evening—he requested me to go to those places—directly I charged him with this offence, he said he got them from a man of the name of Davey—I did not say anything about the man going by the name of Carter before the Magistrate—I was requested not to do so, with

view of getting Carter, if possible—we went to the Windmill first, that is some considerable distance from the Blue Last—he said a man named Wolf had redeemed some stamps previously—he said he had sold some to Mr. Wolf with the ticket he had got in pawn—the prisoner said he had been a butcher, in New gate Market, years ago.

MR. POLAND. Q. He is not in business now? A. No; he has been some time at the Sussex—he has been doing nothing that I know of—he gave a description of Davey to Hann.

JAMES HANN (City Detective). I saw the prisoner when he was in custody, on the evening of the 28th August—he made a statement at the station, and I heard it—it was with reference to a man he was to find on the following morning—he gave me the description of the man—I went the next morning to Camomile Street, Bishopsgate Street, but I was not able to find him.

Cross-examined. Q. What was the man's name? A. He said it was Davey—he did not say anything about Carter to me.

GEORGE DUNCAN ARTHUR . About nine months ago, I was lodging at the Sussex Hotel—the prisoner was also lodging there, and I became acquaintd with him, and also with Evans—the prisoner was not carrying on any business, that I know of—in July last, he spoke to me about some stamps—there was another gentleman with him, when he first spoke to me in the coffee-room of the hotel—they were counting some stamps on the table—he said they were part of a remittance of 100l., that a friend of his had remitted him, in part payment of goods delivered—he asked me whether they were much used, or something to that effect—and I said if the stamps were genuine and all right, there would be no difficulty with them, as they were used in commercial houses daily—they were foreign bill stamps—the other gentleman then went away—I saw the prisoner again next evening, about 7 o'clock—he said, that the gentleman that the stamps belonged to was rather short of money, and wished to pay some bill, and he asked me if I would pawn the stamps that I had seen the previous day—after some hesitation, I agreed to pawn them—he told me to take them to Shoe Lane—he said, that I was likely to get more money on them than he could—he gave me 11l. or 12l. worth of stamps—they were foreign bill stamps, of different values—I took them to Cartland, the pawnbroker, in Shoe Lane, and there pledged them for 6l.—the prisoner said I was to get is much as I could on them—I left the stamps with the pawnbroker, and took the 6l. to the prisoner—he met me as I came away from the shop—he told me that I had better keep the ticket, as it would be safer with me, he might lose it—he gave me some silver for doing it—I don't know the exact amount—I saw him four or five days afterwards-—from time to time he gave me similar stamps—in August, I took some stamps to a Mr. Wolf, at 105, Houndsditch—I sold them to him, and gave the money to the prisoner—I afterwards got some more from the prisoner, and took them to Mr. Wolf—the prisoner said that was the last lot—with that lot I Bold Mr. Wolf the pawn ticket for the stamps I had taken to Cartland—after that, the prisoner said he had a small lot remaining yet; I was to go to Mr. Wolf, to get rid of them—he was to wait for me at the Blue Last—that was some-time at the end of August—I took the stamps to Mr. Wolf, and he found they were fraudulent—he took part of the head off a 10s. stamp, and showed it to me, and I found that the Queen's head underneath was obliterated—I went with Mr. Wolf to the Blue Last, and found the prisoner there—Mr.

Wolf showed him the stamp ripped up, that it was fraudulent—the prisoner said he gave them to me—he never denied that—he promised to pay Mr. Wolf the money for them, and Mr. Wolf did not give him into custody—the prisoner said the money should be returned on the following Thursday—after that, I never disposed of any more for the prisoner—I was at the Boar's Head on the night of the 28th August, and saw Evans there—I saw the prisoner give him a packet—those stamps which I sold to Mr. Wolf, were sold for about half their value—I told the prisoner, on two occasions, that it was a very low price; that Mr. Wolf would not give any more, and he was making a great sacrifice—he said that the party the stamps belonged to was either short of money, or wanted some money to make up wages for workmen—from the beginning to the end of the transactions with the prisoner he never told me the name of this gentleman—he said no more than that he was a respectable man, and a man of means—he gave me small sums of money from time to time—he did not give me any particulars about the goods that the 100l. was sent for, or anything about it.

Cross-examined. Q. You say there was another person in the coffee-room at the Sussex with the prisoner, is that so? A. Yes—he was in conversation with the prisoner, and then the prisoner called me over, and told me what I have told to-day—he said he wanted to get some money on the stamps—that was about the end of July—I pawned one lot of stamps at Mr. Cartland's, in Shoe Lane; and another lot to a friend of mine in Leadenhall Street, 10l. or 11l. worth; and three lots to Mr. Wolf; five lots altogether; and there was the lot that I saw him hand to Evans, in the Blue Last—I did not see anything wrong about the stamps—I never had the slightest idea that they were wrong stamps, till Mr. Wolf showed them to me—I have known the prisoner eight or nine months—I have been on very good terms ith him—I did it partly as a matter of friendship—the prisoner did not introduce me to the man in the coffee-room—I am quite sure of that—they were counting stamps on the table when I went up—they were put in a packet after they were counted—I left a list of them at the pawnbroker's with a view of recovering them at a future time, if necessary—the pawn-broker made not the slightest difficulty about taking them.

MR. POLAND. Q. Do you know a person named Mrs. Fowler? A. I have only known her since this affair—I have not seen her with the prisoner, that I know of.

COURT. Q. The last transaction, the handing the stamps to Evans, was on 28th August; was that after Mr. Wolf had pointed out that they were fraudulent? A. Yes—the prisoner took Evans aside—I could not say that they were stamps he was giving him—it was a packet—the prisoner said he had 100l. in part payment of goods delivered.

ALFRED FLECK . I am assistant to Mr. Cartland, pawnbroker, of Shoe Lane—on 25th July, the witness Arthur brought some stamps to me—about 12l. worth or 11l. 10s.—I advanced him 6l. on them, and gave him a ticket—they were redeemed by some person on 21st August—on the evening of 28th August, Evans came with some stamps—I knew at that time that they were fraudulent, and went for a constable, and gave him in charge.

Cross-examined. Q. You took the stamps yourself? A. Yes, on both occasions.

HENRY WOLF . I carry on business in Houndsditch—I knew Arthur

some years ago—some time in August I purchased some foreign bill stamps of him—only on one occasion—on another occasion I bought a ticket for some stamps—they were redeemed by my brother-in-law's clerk, but I had them in my possession afterwards—the day after they were taken out of pawn I found they were illegal—some time after I had found that out Arthur came again with another lot of stamps, and I accused him of their being illegal—I asked him where he got them from, and he took me to the Blue Last—I had previously pulled off one of the heads from the old stamp, and had shown it to Arthur—when we got to the Blue Last, I found the prisoner there, and I pulled one of the heads off, and showed him that they were illegal stamps—the stamps I pulled the heads from in his presence were the ones Arthur brought me on the third occasion—I found that the ones I got from the pawnbroker's were the same—I destroyed those immediately.

Cross-examined. Q. You made no difficulty about buying them? A. I, gave the value for them—I knew Arther to be a respectable man, and I obliged him, and took them of him—I only bought one lot of him, and a pawn ticket—the last lot I found were illegal before the bargain was made—when I tore the head off the stamp in the public-house, the prisoner said he did not know they were illegal—I said, "I know better than that"—the prisoner said, "What makes them illegal?—I said, "You scoundrel, this makes them illegal;" and then I took one in my hand, and tore off the head that was pasted on the old stamp—the prisoner said, "You need not give me into custody, you shall have the money"—I asked him when I should have the money, and he said "To-morrow, or the next day"—he said the stamps came from a very respectable man—I have known Arthur some years—he was one of the principal men at Caton, Lubbock & Co.'s—he was cashier, I think—he told me he had them remitted from his brother in Barbadoes—if I had thought they were got any other way I should not have taken them—I never saw Evans or the prisoner.

MR. POLAND. Q. Until you saw them at the Blue Last? A. No; not until Arthur took me to the Blue Last—the prisoner made an appointment to pay me the money—I never saw him again—when he said he had them from a respectable man, he did not tell me his name, or anything about him.

JANE FOWLER . I am a widow, and live at 6, Bell Court, Gray's Inn Road—I have known the prisoner about two years—I have been to the Sussex Hotel several times, and have seen him there—on Wednesday, 26th August, I met him in Fleet Street, and he went home with me—on the following day, the 27th, he asked me for a pen and ink—I saw him place some stamps in an envelope—he told me they were genuine articles, and if they came off all right he would make me a present—he left me on Thursday—before he left I agreed to meet him on the Friday, at 10 o'clock, at the Old Bell, in Holborn—he gave me a pocket-book and some stamps before he left—there were about sixty-nine stamps of different kinds—I afterwards gave the pocket-book and stamps to the police—these are them (produced).

JAMES BRENNAN (Police Inspector F). I received this pocket-book and stamps from the lout witness—they are in the same state as when I received them—I also received the stamps that were offered to Cartland on 28th August, by Evans—I also got some from Mr. Wolf's brother-in-law, Mr. Cohen—all those stamps have been submitted to Mr. Delarue, the Queen's printer

. WILLIAM FREDERICK DELARCE . I am a manufacturer of stamps, employed by the government—I have seen all these stamps before—they are all.

stamps that have been obliterated, and the Queen's head, from a 1d. or 2d. stamp has been pasted over the genuine stamps—the head is cut from stamps of a lower duty, and placed on other stamps of higher denomination—the word "penny" has been cut off, leaving only the medallion to be pasted on.

Cross-examined. Q. It was very ingeniously done, was it not? A. should call it very clumsy—I could tell it directly—there are two different shades in the stamps.

COURT. Q. Are not these stamps fastened on bills of exchange. A. Yes, you can damp them off, and then gum them again.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate:—"I never knew that the stamps were not genuine."

The Prisoner received a good character.— GUILTY of uttering, knowing them to be forged.— Ten Years' Penal Servitude. There were other indictments against the Prisoner.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-929
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

929. SIDNEY CHARLES JACKSON (25), Was indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. POLAND and BESLEY conducted the Prosecution.

ALFRED KNIGHT . I carry on the business of a jeweller, at High Street, Whitechapel—on Saturday, the 8th August, the prisoner came to my shop, and asked to look at a watch that was in the window—he looked at the watch, and said, "I have some stamps here, I don't know whether you will take them "—I said, "Let me look at them"—he then took four ten shilling foreign stamps out of his pocket and showed them to me—I looked at them, and asked him where he got them—he said he got them in the way of business; someone paid them to him who dealt in them, and who was over-stocked with them—he said I could get the money directly at Somerset House, by losing a shilling in the pound—it was then 6 or 7 o'clock in the evening—I took the four stamps and gave him the watch—it was a second-hand silver hunting watch—I kept the stamps in my possession until Wednesday, 12th August, and then I took them to Somerset House, and from there to Mr. Biden's, in Cheapside—Mr. Biden held the stamps up to the light first, and then put them in water—the head then separated from the stamp—I left them with Mr. Biden—I have no doubt that these (produced) are the four stamps.

ALFRED EVAN BRYANT . I am a pawnbroker, at 285, City Road; on the 8th August, between 8 and 9 o'clock in the evening, the prisoner brought me a silver hunting watch, and I advanced him 17s. on it—I gave him a ticket—the watch was redeemed by some person on 28th August—it was a second-hand watch—the name of James King was on the ticket when he brought it to me.

JOHN BIDEN . I carry on business at 37, Cheapside—these four 10s. stamps were brought to me by Mr. Knight—on removing the heads I found that the original stamps had been cancelled—I saw it before I removed then, and afterwards—I handed them to Mr. Walters, at the Inland Revenue Office.

JAMES THOMAS SHAW . I am in the employment of Mr. Moses, a clothier, of Islington Green—on Sunday morning, the 9th August, the prisoner came there between 9 and 10—he said he wanted a pair of trousers—he said be had got no money, but he had got some stamps—I said I did not like the

stamps at all—I sent up stairs for my employer, and said he could take the stamps if he thought proper—the prisoner then spoke about having a suit—he gave me three 5s. stamps and a 1l. stamp—when my master came down we examined them carefully and thought they were genuine—he said he had got the stamps from his uncle, who was a traveller to a wholesale stationer at Bristol—I sold him some clothes, which came to 1l. 16s. 6d.—the value of the stamps was 15s.—we wished to have the odd 1s. 6d., but he had not got any more money about him, and be had the coat and trousers for 1l. 15s.—he has the coat on now—I asked him where he lived, and be said his address was Tomlinson Brothers, pawnbrokers, Barking, Essex—we afterwards found the stamps were fraudulent—I went to Tomlinson Brothers, but I was Dot able to find the prisoner—that was about the Wednesday or Thursday after.

NATHAN HARRIS . I am a jeweller, in the Westminster Bridge Road—on 10th August the prisoner came to my shop, to the private door—he looked at a silver Geneva hunter, which was 5l. 5s. 6d.—he handed me some bill stamps in payment of the value of 5l. 15s., with the discount 5l. 6s. 6d.—they were 5s., 10s., and 15s. stamps—this (produced) is the watch I gave him—I afterwards showed the stamps to Mr. McEwen and discovered that they were fraudulent—he said he was living at Mr. Mario's, in the Caledonian Road—I went there, but could not find him—he told me he-had left Tomlinson's about three years—I did not know him previously—these are the stamps he gave me.

JOSEPH SCOTT . I am assistant to Mr. Hollington, pawnbroker, of Walworth Road—this watch and chain was pawned there by the prisoner, in the name of James King, on 13th August.

THOMAS MCEWEN . I am a bullion-dealer, at 15, Fenchurch Street, City—some time in August, a person brought some stamps to my office—to the best of my belief it was the prisoner, but I cannot swear positively—I cannot say what the date was—I have no date to go by, because I did not buy anything—he showed me some stamps—I looked at them, and found they were thick in the centre—I took a penknife and removed the head, which had been pasted on—the prisoner saw me do that—I said, "These are forgeries; this is perhaps your first offence; I will tear these up, and don't do it again"—he gave me his address, somewhere in Islington—I tore up the stamps, and let him go.

FREDERICK CURLEY (Police Sergeant F 10). In consequence of information I received, I went to Ilford Gaol, and took the prisoner into custody, on 5th September—I told him I was a police officer, and should take him for fraudulently transposing bill stamps, with intent to defraud the Commissioners of the Inland Revenue—he said, "I can tell you where I got them; I got them from a man named Monk; he stopped me at the corner of Bryan's Place, Caledonian Road, and told me he had just had some money left him, and part of it was in stamps; he then gave me some of the stamps, and asked me to pledge them for him; I took them to some pawnbroker in the Borough, but he refused to have anything to do with them; I then went to a jeweller's shop in the Whitechapel Road, where I bought a watch for 2l. worth of stamps, that watch I pledged in the City Road; I bought a watch in the Westminster Bridge Road with some more of the stamps"—he gave me this ticket, and said, "This is the ticket for the watch that I pledged; I then bought some clothes of a Mr. Moses, in' Islington Green, with some more stamps; these are the clothes that I have now got on"—I

said, "Have you seen Monk since"—he said, "No, I have not"—I brought him from Ilford to Bow Street—he saw Monk there, and said, "That is the man who gave me the stamps"—he is the man that was tried here to-day.

Prisoner. I have a witness to prove that I had the stamps from Monk.

WILLIAM BUDD . I superintend the business of Tomlinson Brothers, of Barking, in Essex—the prisoner was not in the employ of the firm on 9th August—he left in March, 1865; he has not been in the service since.

WILLIAM FREDERICK DELARUE . These four 10d. stamps hare been obliterated, and have the 1d. and 2d. heads pasted on—there are some loose heads here, and also some obliterated stamps from which the heads have been-taken off—the three 5s. stamps and the 1l. stamp have 1d. and 2d. heads stuck on the stamps of those denominations—all these stamps have been fraudulently altered in the same way.

The Prisoner called

GEORGE BENNETT . I know Monk—I saw him give the prisoner stamp to the amount of 19l. 15s.—there were some 1l. stamps, 10s., and 5s.; 19l. 15s. altogether.

Prisoner's Defence. I plead guilty to having the stamps and disposing of them, but I did not know they were forged. I gave the right address to Mr. McEwen.

GUILTY of uttering, knowing them to be forged.— Seven Years' Penal Servitude. There were other indictments against the Prisoner.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-930
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

930. GEORGE SHIPLEY (25), and JOHN BENNETT (33), were indicted for a like offence.

MESSRS. POLAND and BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. PATER the Defence.

MAURICE SYMES . I am a clerk in the office of the chief examiner of spoiled stamps in the Inland Revenue Department of Somerset House—on 22nd August, the prisoner, Shipley, came to that office between 1 and 2 o'clock—he produced four 10s. stamps, and said he wanted an allowance for them, or wanted them changed—I understood him to say that he got them from a cattle dealer for debt, but I would not be certain—examined the stamps, and discovered that they were forged—they had in extra queen's head on the cancelled one—I showed them to another gentle-man in the office, and he took them to Mr. Walker, and he had some conversation with the prisoner—there was a police officer in the office at the time, about some other matters.

RICHARD WALKER . I am the chief examiner of spoiled stamps at Somerset House—these four stamps (produced), were brought into my room by one of the clerks—I had Shipley brought in, and I asked him if he had brought the stamps for allowance, he said he had—I asked him from whom he obtained them—he said from a Mr. Bennett; I asked him what Mr. Bennett was, and he said a costermonger—I asked him where he lived, he said, some place near King's Cross—I have forgotten the name—I asked him if he knew where Mr. Bennett got them from—he said he believed he got them from a cattle-dealer, in payment for a debt—I asked him where the cattle-dealer resided, and his name—he said he did not know—I asked him where he was likely to be found, and he said somewhere about the cattle-market—I then said, "Why did you bring these in"—he said, "I did it to oblige my friend, Mr. Bennett"—I asked him why Mr. Bennett

did not come in himself, and he said, he did not think it was necessary that two should come in—I asked him why he brought them for allowance—he said he had been to a pawnbroker's in the City Road, and he had recommended him to come to Somerset House to get them allowed—he stated that he was a pianoforte maker, that his name was Shipley, and he lived somewhere near King's Cross, but I did not catch the name—I saw that they were stamps which had been transposed, and I left my room and spoke to one of the police in attendance—Shipley said that his friend was outside, waiting for him—I asked him for a description of his friend, and he said he was dressed like himself, and had on a light coat; that he was waiting under the archway of Somerset House—one of the officers went out, and shortly afterwards Bennett was brought into my room in custody—at first he said he did not send Shipley in with the stamps, but afterwards admitted that he did—I gave them both into custody—Bennett said he got the stamps from a cattle dealer.

Cross-examined. Q. Did he not say he had taken them for a debt? A. Yes—Shipley answered all the questions I asked him.

FREDERICK CURLEY (Police Sergeant F 10). I was in plain clothes at the Inland Revenue Office on the day in question—I received a description of Bennett from Mr. Walker, and went to the Strand entrance, where I found Bennett standing under the archway—I asked him if he was waiting for anyone—he said, "Yes, I am"—I then said I was a police officer, and I asked him if he had sent anyone into Somerset House with any stamps—he said, "No, I have not"—I said, "Will you come with me?" and he did—as we were going in, he said, "I did send a man in with four 10s. stamps"—I said, "Where did you get them from"—he said, "From a man who was lodging with me, in part payment of rent that he owed me"—he did not say who the man was, or give any description of him—I took him into the room where Shipley was—I found on him 4l. 19s. 31/2d., and two pawn tickets—I found nothing on Shipley.

JAMES BRENNAN (Police Inspector F). I was at Somerset House on this day, and saw Shipley there—he gave his address, 33, Ampton Street, Somer's Town—his mother resides there, but he does not—when Bennett was brought in I asked Shipley if that was the man who gave him the stamps, and he said it was—Bennett said his name was George Bennett, and he lived at 4. Fifteen-foot Lane, King's Cross, and was a costermonger—I asked him if he could account for the possession of the stamps—he said "I got them from a cattle dealer, who lodged with me, in part payment of rent"—I asked him if he knew the cattle dealer's name and address—he said he lid not—he said he did not know where he could find him, unless it was up at the cattle market next Thursday—I took thorn both to the static:—I found on Shipley a letter addressed "4, Fifteen-foot Lane, King's Cross"—that was the address that Bennett had given—I went there, and found that Bennett lived there—I did not find any cattle dealer there.

WILLIAM FREDERICK DELARUE . These four stamps are the same as the others—they have the 1d. and 2d. heads on the 10s. stamp—the heads are cut off stamps of a lower denomination, and placed on stamps that have already been cancelled, of a higher denomination.

MR. PATER called the following Witnesses for the Defence

FRANCES DOUGLAS . I live at 17, Brighton Street, Argyle Square, and am an unfortunate—during the month of August last, I was with some cattle

dealer, and took him to Bennett's—I think it was the 6th August—I remained with him from the Tuesday till the Saturday—he was occupying a room at Bennett's—the cattle dealer had 20l. worth of stamps in his possession—they were stamps of this description—there were some 1l., 5s.,10s., 5s., and 1d. ones—he said I could get 19s. 8d. in the pound at a pawn-broker's—I saw him at Guildhall—his name is Monk—I was examined before the Magistrate as a witness.

Cross-examined. Q. Where are you living now? A. In the Caledonian Road—I did live at 17, Bright on Street, Argyle Street—when I was examined before the Magistrate I was staying there—I did not like to give my address there—the one at Brighton Street was a false address—I swore to it—I did not want my address to be known—I have lived in the Caledonian Road ten months—I did not give my proper name—my name is not Brysen, it is Douglas—I do not go by that name—I gave my right name, not the one I go by—I first saw Monk at King's Cross, on 6th August—I met him in the street, in the evening—we went to Bennett's, that is 4, Fifteen-foot Lane—I have been in the habit of going there—I stopped with him a week, from the Tuesday to the Saturday—I went there straight from the street—I did not see anyone else there, only Bennett's wife and daughter—Monk said he was going for some money, and asked me to stay till he came back—he never came back again—he said he was going to bring me 5l.—he showed me these stamps on the Wednesday morning—then was about 20l. worth—I saw a Mr. Jackson at Bow Street—I don't know him—I never saw Shipley.

JOHN MONK . I have been convicted of having these stamps in possession—about the first week in August I went to the house occupied by Bennett—I met some woman, and she took me there—the last witness was the woman—I stayed with her from the Tuesday till the Saturday—I paid Bennett some money while I was there—I think it was a couple of pounds—I paid him in money, not in stamps—I had some stamps in my pocket book, and I gave him that to take charge of—I don't know how many stamps there were in the book, but I missed some out; who took them I can't say—I will swear that I never gave Bennett four 10s. stamps in payment for what I owed him—I had some drink while I was at Bennett's house—I indulged a good deal in drink.

Cross-examined. Q. What was the price of the apartments? A. I am sure I can't tell—I don't know that there was any filed price—there are only two rooms in the house altogether—I occupied the bed room—I paid Bennett in money—I never gave him any stamps, and if any were taken from my pocket-book they were stolen—I gave him my pocket book to take care of—I don't know whether he looked in it or not—I did not know him before—I might have told him I was a salesman in the cattle market, and I might not.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-931
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

931. JOHN SHIPLEY and GEORGE BENNETT were again indicted for unlawfully attempting to obtain certain monies, with intent to defraud.

MR. POLAND offered no evidence.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-932
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

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932. WILLIAM COURTENAY BRUTTON (36), was indicted for feloniously marrying Ellen Bertha Trimble, his wife being alive.

MR. METCALFE, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-933
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence

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933. CHARLES ELLEMAN (32), Feloniously wounding Andrew Philip Nelson, with intent to do him grievous bodily harm.

MR. GRAIN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BESLEY the Defence,

NOAH STANLEY . I live at 5, Edward Street, Islington, and am a cow-keeper—on 5th September, about 8.30 in the evening, I was sitting at my shop door—I saw the prisoner run down the street after some boys, opposite my door, in the middle of the road—he fell down—I walked across the road to see what was the matter, when he got up and struck the prosecutor—he is about 18 years old—he was one of the boys—he struck him at the side of the head with his fist—he then struck him a second time, and the prosecutor turned round to me and said, "I am stabbed"—the prisoner then struck at me, and I saw a knife in his hand, held point downwards, after Nelson was stabbed—I saw blood running from his arm—I saw the prisoner given into custody.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you see anyone selling whelks or potatoes? A. No—I did not see the commencement of it—I saw nothing of a scuffle for money or the falling of the potato-can—the prisoner was running after the boys, and he fell down—I never spoke to him—I did not tell him he was big enough to defend himself—I did not notice a sailor there—I was examined before the Magistrate—the next witness to me was a sailor—I did not see him that night—I saw him first at the Police Court—I am not a friend of Nelson's at all—I am a neighbour—I have known the family some time—I have not spoken to his mother about this matter—I know there was an attempt to settle matters.

JOSEPH CUNNINGHAM . I am a seaman—on a Saturday night in September, I was in Edward Street, between 8 and 9 o'clock, with William Franklin and Nelson—I saw the prisoner and his brother come out of a public-house—Nelson and I were standing at a stall, getting some whelks—the prisoner fell over the potato-can—that was at the end of the stall—the leg was broken off the potato-can—the missis of the potato-can asked him to pay for it-immediately after she said that, he pushed her and she fell flat on her back—Franklin then came up and said, "If you were any sort of a gentleman you would pay for the potato-can"—he then knocked Franklin down—there was a little bit of a scuffle then for about a minute—the prisoner and his brother took hold of Franklin, and he could not beat the two, so he ran away—the prisoner ran after him, fell down and tore the knee of his trousers—there were a good many persons collected—Nelson was close by—the prisoner came and said, "you are one as well as the rest"—Nelson went into his mother's shop, took off his coat and tucked his sleeves up—he came out and said, "Now, what did you hit me for?"—he said, "I am struck"—I did not see him stabbed, but I saw the prisoner with a knife in his hand—I heard Nelson say he was stabbed—a policeman came up—the prisoner was flashing about with the knife in his hand all this time—we got him into a corner of the street, and a constable came up—I called out, "He has got a knife"—the prisoner put his hand down and then took it up again and said, "See, I have not got a knife"—I then said, "Clear the road, here is the knife"—a person named Mrs. Blundell put her foot on it—I picked it up and gave it to the policeman—this is it (produced)—he was then taken into custody.

Cross-examined. Q. How old are you? A. Eighteen—I have been working as a seaman for the last four years—I am living with Franklin, at

17, Barnsbury Street—my mother is out at service—I was not with any more friends besides Franklin and Nelson—it was the prisoner's brother who pushed the woman at the potato-can—I made a mistake if I said it wag the prisoner—a crowd collected as soon as he fell—this is not my own knife—I will swear that I picked it up—Mrs. Blundell saw me—I will swear that I never held that knife in my hand before.

ANDREW PHILIP NELSON . I live at 2, Edward Street, Barnsbury Road—on the 5th September, I was with the last witness and Franklin—I saw the prisoner and his brother come out of the public-house, just below—I did not know them before—there were some persons there selling whelks—we went up to get some—the prisoner and his brother came up—the potato-can was broken, I believe by his brother—the woman asked the prisoner to pay for it—he pushed her down—Franklin said, "If they were anything like gentlemen, they would pay for the can"—Franklin was then knocked down by the prisoner—a struggle took place—Franklin ran down Edward Street, and the prisoner after him—I ran after them both—when they got to the corner of the street, the prisoner fell—he got up, and by that time I was within a dozen yards of him—he came to me and said, "You are one of them;" or, "You are him;" I don't know which—he struck me a severe blow behind the left ear, with his fist—I was squaring up when I felt two sharp terriffic blows—one on the arm, and the other on the left breast—just over the heart—I did not know for a minute that I was stabbed, till my mother caught hold of my arm, and said it was bleeding—I looked down, and saw the blood coming from my arm—I then felt a pain on my breast—I had my coat off and my shirt sleeves tucked up—the knife went through my waistcoat—I did not see anything in the prisoner's hand, but I put up my left hand, and felt a hard substance in his hand, what it was I can't say—I went into a greengrocer's shop, and then to the doctor's—there were plenty of persons round at the time.

Cross-examined. Q. I suppose you saw the whole of it? A. Yes—there was no one else with me but Franklin and Cunningham—the owner of the stall was standing by—I don't know that any money was dropped—I did not see any being picked up—I believe the potato can had four legs—it was not against a lamp poet—I did not hear any one ask for a piece of string to tie it up, or for a knife—I did not hear the prisoner or his brother say that they had not got a knife—it was the prisoner who pushed the woman down, not his brother—I don't know that I ever said that before—I did not say the prisoner was knocked down, he fell of his own accord—my depositions were read over to me, and that is my signature to them—when I said "He was knocked down," I meant Franklin—that is the explanation I give of it—I did not see Franklin go into a house when he ran away—I lost sight of him—it was about that time that the prisoner fell—I called out to Franklin, "Come back, don't run away"—I went into my mother's shop, and took my coat off—I did not see any knife in the prisoner's hand—I felt something hard in his hand—I did not hold his hand a couple-of seconds—this is in my hand-writing; (looking at a paper), I wanted the prisoner to sign a petition, admitting that he had used the knife—I wanted him to sign this—"Sir, I do hereby declare, that on the night of the 5th September, I did stab Nelson, for which I am truly sorry, and I also declare that I struck him on the ear, for which I am sorry"—I wanted him to sign that—he has always said that this was not his knife, and he did not use it—he has also said that it was one of

my friends who used the knife, in trying to stab him—I gave that paper to the prisoner's brother, and he said it should be signed and given to me.

WILLIAM STEPHEN FRANKLIN . At the time that this affair took place, I lived at 16, Barnsbury Road, Islington—Cunningham lodged with me—I am a chemist's assistant—on the evening of 5th September, I was with Cunningham and Nelson, at a stall, having some whelks—I saw the prisoner and his brother there—they knocked the potato-can over, and then the woman went to the prisoner, and asked him to pay for it—the prisoner knocked the woman down—I said, "If he was anything like a gentleman, he would pay for it"—he struck me, and I struck him back—they both set on me, the prisoner and his brother, and I ran away, down Edward Street—the prisoner ran after me—he fell down when he got about thirty yards—I don't know anything more, till I came up and saw the struggle between Nelson and the prisoner—I saw him strike Nelson with his fist, but I saw no knife till after the blow—I saw him back away from the prosecutor with the knife in his hand—a constable came up—the prisoner pushed him on one side, and said, "See, policeman, I have got no knife"—I did not see him drop the knife—I saw Cunningham there, he was joining in the tussel—I also saw Mrs. Blundell.

Cross-examined. Q. You are a doctor's assistant, you say? A. Yes, I was with Dr. Wilkinson seven and a half years—I am in no service now—I left my place last Saturday—I had been there about eight weeks—I saw the prisoner and his brother, both pushed against the can—I think they did it purposely—the legs of the can were broken—I heard nothing said about string—the prisoner was nearest to me when I ran away—I did not run into any house—I heard Nelson call to me to come back—Cunningham gave the knife to the policeman—I have said before to-day that the woman was knocked down—I won't swear that I said it before the Magistrate—I have not talked this matter over with my friends—I have spoken to them about it since, two or three times—I am eighteen years old.

SOPHIA BLUNDELL .—I live at 2, Edward Street, Barnsbury Road—on Saturday evening, the 5th September, I was standing at my door—I saw a struggle between the prisoner and Nelson—I saw the prisoner running after Franklin—he fell; and when he got up from the ground, he struck Nelson—they struggled together for some minutes, and I saw a knife in the prisoner's hand—I saw the policeman come up—I did not see the knife then—the prisoner was taken from the spot—Cunningham came up, and said the knife was missing, and I found it under my feet—it was shut—Cunningham gave it to the constable.

Cross-examined. Q. Then they had gone from the spot where the knife was found? A. About a yard and a half—I did not hear anyone call out "Clear the way"—the sailor said something—I don't know what—I lodge in the same house as Nelson.

EDWARD BARFOOT .—I am a surgeon, at 117, Barnsbury Road—on Saturday evening, the 5th September, about 8.30 or 8.45 Nelson came to my place, and I examined him—he was bleeding from a wound on the arm, and also one on the breast—he was saturated with blood—the wound on the arm was about an inch and a half deep—the wound on the breast was less deep—the knife had evidently struck on the rib and glanced up—the loss of blood was very great—the wound was immediately over the heart, and if the knife had not struck the rib, it must have pierced the heart—a knife like this would produce such wounds as I saw—he is well now.

Cross-examined. Q. He was out of danger on the 9th, was he not? A. I should say so—the wounds were not healed then—I believe there was an attempt to arrange matters—an amount was mentioned and refused—I did not suggest any amount—10l. or 11l. was placed in my hands—the mother said she would take nothing less than 20l.

WILLIAM HITCHINGS (Policeman Y 231).—I took the prisoner into custody on the 5th September—there was a mob—the prosecutor said he had stabbed him—the prisoner said "I should have been murdered unless someone had come up"—I took him to the station—this knife was given to me by Cunningham, in the Barnsbury Road, just after I took the prisoner.

Cross-examined. Q. Did not the prisoner say he had no knife? A. Yes—I was not present when it was picked up—I had gone a few yards away—the prisoner was sober—perhaps he had had a little.

MR. BESLEY called the following Witnesses for the Defence.

JOHN GOODERHAM . I am the proprietor of the potato-can, and live in Edward Street—the can has three legs—I was near the whelk stall—my wife gave Cunningham change for a half-crown, and he dropped it on the pavement—I went away for some vinegar, and the potato-can was knocked down while I was away—when I came back my wife asked the prisoner if he had got a knife to lend her, to cut a piece of string—he said he had not—my wife then went up to him, and said, "You don't go away without paying for the can"—he said, "Go away," and shoved her down—Nelson said, "Don't strike a woman, strike me;" and then a struggle commenced—there were a lot of people—I did not see the prisoner with a knife at any time.

Cross-examined. Q. After your wife was knocked down, did you stop with the can? A. I went to the station.

ELIZA GOODERHAM . I am the wife of last witness—I was selling whelks on 5th September—I also attended to the potato-can—the prisoner came up to the stall with his brother—there was some money fell—it was Cunningham's money—my potato-can was knocked over—it only had three legs—my husband asked for a knife to cut a piece of rope, to tie the can up, and I asked the prisoner if he had got a knife—he felt in his pockets, and said he had not.

Cross-examined. Q. How long did all this take? A. About ten minutes—I asked the prisoner to pay for the can—he refused—my husband caught hold of him, and in the struggle I was knocked down—I did not hear anything said—the prisoner's brother brought me here to-day to speak for him—I was not called before the Magistrate.

COURT. Q. Have you been paid for the damage to the can? A. Yes; the prisoner's brother paid me 7s. 6d.—I don't think that was too much.

WILLIAM ELLEMAN . I am clerk to a solicitor, and have been for seventeen years—I am the prisoner's brother—he is waiting for a Government situation—he is in no employ at present—I was with him on the 5th September, in the Barnsbury Road, near a whelk stall—there were some boys there—one of them dropped some money—they rushed to get the money, and I was pushed over the potato-can—Franklin then struck me, and ran across the street—I ran after him, Nelson and Cunningham following me, one of them tripped me up—my brother picked me up, and while he was doing so Cunningham struck his hat over his eyes—Nelson was then in his shirtsleeves—they threw my brother's hat into the air, and said, "Now we will have it"—

they then knocked my brother down, and five or six fell on the top of him—Cunningham said, "Murder the b—"—a policeman came up—Nelson and Franklin then ran into a house—not a word was said about stabbing, then—someone gave my brother in charge—I did not know what the charge was against him—I had seen no knife in his possession that evening—I heard the potato man ask him for a knife, and he said he had not got one—he was given in charge where the scuffle took place—I am sure he had not got a knife when the row occurred.

Cross-examined. Q. Was there a large crowd there when the hat was knocked off? A. Yes—I was in the midst of the crowd—I was down, and when I got up my brother was knocked down.

COURT. Q. Did you hear anyone say, "He has got a knife?" A. No—Nelson was the ringleader—I did not see him bleeding—I was running after Franklin, because he struck me—the others were following—I never saw this knife before—my brother lives with me—I did not hear Nelson examined—this paper was given me by Nelson—I never promised him that my brother should sign it.

The Prisoner received a good character. GUILTY of unlawfully wounding.— Six Months' Imprisonment .

FOURTH COURT.—Thursday, October 29th, 1868.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-934
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

934. CHARLES STONE (26), EDWIN EARWAKER (22), and GEORGE DONALDSON (23) , Stealing 19 lbs. of tea, the goods of the Great Northern Railway Company.

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS

the Defence.

GEORGE CANDLER . I am clerk to my father, a licensed carman, of 2, Tower Hill—we employ the prisoner casually to do jobs—on 7th October we had to case a quantity of tea that was to be sent by the Great Northern Railway to Liverpool—it was brought in vans to the Great Northern depot, Royal Mint Street—we employed the prisoners, with three other men, to case it—they had to sew canvas over the chests—they began the job between 7 and 8 o'clock, and I gave them instructions to take one chest at a time off the van as they wanted to canvas it—I superintended it at times, but at other times I had to leave, to go after my father's business and to get them canvas—at 8 p.m. I left for a short time, and all the cases were then apparently sound and on two vans—case 132 was amongst them—our errand boy, Jones, was left to assist to fetch canvas—I returned in about three quarters of an hour and found a quantity of cases piled up, which was contrary to my orders—Donaldson and Earwaker were there, and they had the chest in question in their possession—they appeared to be covering it up—I examined the case—the lid had been broken open—the lead bad been torn—the weight is marked on each chest—I weighed it, and found 31/2 lbs. missing—I asked them what they were doing with that chest—they said they were doing nothing—I asked if they had broken it open, and they said "No "—I turned round and saw a coat, which had some tea in the pocket, which I weighed, and there was just 31/2 lbs.—when I took the coat up Earwaker went away, and two others went out—not two of the prisoners—

Earwaker and Donaldson were the only men I saw near the chest—I asked who the coat belonged to, and Stone claimed it—I then took it to my father—Stone said he knew nothing about the tea, he did not know how it came there—Earwaker then came back, and I asked him where he had been—he said "To have some refreshment"—when I found the coat, Stone was on the other side of the bench—soon after Mr. Cox came back, and then the prisoners were given in custody—the tea found in the coat was similar to that in the chest.

Cross-examined. Q. Were there six men working by the chest? A. Not that particular chest—there were six men working where these men were-Stone was working about the length of this Court from the chest—he was casing other chests.

MR. COOPER. Q. How many yards was Stone from the chest? A. About 20—the bench is a platform on which they deliver goods.

WILLIAM JONES . I am errand-boy, in Mr. Candler's employ—I remember these tea-chests coming to the depot—about 8 o'clock, on the 7th, I was at the Great Northern Station, Royal Mint Street, where the prisoners were at work—about 8.30 I heard a noise as if a chest was being broken open, and the prisoners were down at a chest—I could not see them, because there was flock between us—they were near where I heard the noise come from.

Cross-examined. Q. Stone was not near the place at all, was he? A. Yes—I have said "Earwaker and Donaldson were at the chest," but Stone was round there, too—I have said so before to-day.

JOSEPH COX . I am in the service of the Great Northern Railway Company and assistant to Mr. Smith—about 9 p.m., on 7th October, my attention was called to a chest of tea—the lid had been lifted up, the strapping cut away, and the nails wrenched from the side of the box, and some tea was gone—I afterwards saw it weighed, and there was a deficiency of 8 lbs. this is a sample of the tea (produced)—from the statement of young Mr. Candler I gave them into custody—a bag full of tea was afterwards found—it contained 11 lbs—that is not here, but there is a sample of it.

WILLIAM CHAMER (Policeman H 117). I was called to Royal Mint Street, about 9 o'clock, on the 7th—the three prisoners were there, with three other men—I received a coat from Mr. Candler in Stone's presence—there was a quantity of tea in the pockets—I asked Stone if the coat belonged to him—he said "Yes"—I asked him how the tea came there, and he said he did not know—I told the other two prisoners that in consequence of what Mr. Candler, jun., bad told me, I should take them into custody for stealing a quantity of tea—they said they knew nothing about it. NOT GUILTY .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-935
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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935. SAMUEL BROWN (18) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Richard Rylance, and stealing seven leaves, two coats, and other articles, his property.

MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution.

THOMAS GRUNDY (Policeman K 342). From information I received, on 8th October, I went to an unoccupied house in Bark Street, Poplar, about 7.30—I saw the prisoner coming over the back wall of that house—the prosecutor's house is about 400 yards off—I asked him what he had got—he said, "Some old rags"—I said I should take him to the station, and on taking him there, I found these two coats (produced)—these boots I received at the station.

ALICE RYLANCE . I am the wife of Richard Rylance, of 35, Pier Terrace, Poplar—these coats are my husband's—I saw this coat behind the kitchen door, at 11 o'clock on the night of the 7th, and missed it next morning—I fastened the house up myself—the scullery had not been opened, and the back door was bolted—my husband came down at 5.30 and found the scullery window open—these boots belong to me—they were left the night before—I also missed seven loaves, a coat, and other things, most of which are here.

Prisoner. What time did you miss the things? Witness. At 7.30.

The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate: "I was going round the Isle of Dogs, at 7.30 on Thursday morning, and was taken bad in my inside, and had to go to a closet in an empty house, and I found these things tied up in a dust heap; and I thought I might have them as well as anyone else."

COURT to T. Grundy. Q. Did you ask him where he got them? A. He said he found them.

Witnees for the Defence.

EMMA BROWN . I am the prisoner's mother—he was in my house before 9 o'clock the previous evening, and he never left it till between 6 and 7 the next morning—nearer 7 than 6.

Cross-examined. Q. Where do you live? A. In Bromley—I should think that is twenty minutes or half an hour from the prosecutor's—I saw the prisoner several times in the night, and the last time I saw him was 6 o'clock; after that he got out of bed, lit a fire, warmed some cold tea, and sat and smoked his pipe.

THOMAS BROWN . I am the prisoner's brother, and sleep in the same bed with him—he was in bed a little after 9 on the previous night, and never left till between 6 and 7, more near 7.

Cross-examined. Q. Have you got any clock in your house? A. No, I got up about 6, and gave him some cod liver oil out of a bottle—I hear the clocks strike, and I do not know what time it is until I hear them strike again.

COURT. Q. What is your brother? A. A labourer—he works anywhere—at this time he was not working anywhere.

COURT to THOMAS GRUNDY. Q. Who brought the boots to the Police Court? A. A little boy—the boots seem to be the most valuable part of the property.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-936
VerdictsGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > unknown
SentencesImprisonment; Imprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

936. THOMAS HENRY BENNETT (21) , Embezzling various sums of Robert Holdsworth Carew Hunt, and another, his masters, and JOHN BENNETT (25) , Feloniously receiving the same, to which THOMAS HENRY BENNETT PLEADED GUILTY .

MESSRS. METCALFE and STARLING conducted the Prosecution; and MESSRS. M. WILLAMS and BROMLEY the Defence.

JOHN HAWKES (City Policeman). I was instructed in this matter by Messrs. Barter and Co.—I took John Bennett in custody on 8th October, at 200, Regent Street; the Foreign Vineyard Association; I believe he was clerk there—I went there with another constable, named Smart—I called the prisoner out of the office, and said, "I believe your name is John Bennett"—he me "Yes, I will speak to you outside"—I asked him if he

resided at 24, Thornhill Crescent—he said, "Yes, I know you both very well"—I read the warrant to him, and pointed out the amounts mentioned therein—there are three separate amounts—he said "Yes, I did receive them, but not with a felonious intent"—I told him he would have to go with" me to the Seething Lane Police Station—I saw him then place some letters in a drawer—I asked what those letters were—he said they were simply business—next morning I went to his office, and in one of the drawers of the desk I found a diary, some memorandums, a letter from his brother Thomas, and some cheques—the prisoner told me he had the use of those drawers.

EDWARD SAYER . I am clerk to Mr. Robert Holdsworth Carew Hunt, and another, who carry on business under the name of Joseph Barber & Co., at Brewer's Quay, as wharfingers—up to 28th September, Thomas Henry Bennett was in their employ as book-keeper—it was part of his duty, occasionally, to collect money, and he ought to hand it over to the cashier, and I should see it passed into the cash book—supposing he got a cheque in the name of Barber & Co., it was not any part of his duty to sign it—on 28th September, I found out something, and spoke to him about it, and in the evening he left, and did not return—he was told to come next morning—his salary was 100l. a year—his father has been with us nearly forty years, and is a very respectable man—in July, previously, we had discovered a loss, and I spoke to the prisoner about it, but in consequence of his father having been with us so many years, we allowed him to go on—this letter (produced) I received in the forenoon of 2nd October—it is from the prisoner John—he was in our employment about eight years ago—he knew our mode of doing business, and was down at our place almost every day, on business—the Foreign Vineyard Association, trade a great deal through our firm, and John was their dock clerk—(The letter was dated 2nd October, 1868, from John Bennett to Messrs. Barbery and stated that his brother had gone when they could not touch him, and that he, John, would call on them)—John called on the afternoon of the 3rd—Mr. Hunt refused to see him, and told me I had better see him, which I did, in the presence of Mr. Hunt, junior—he said, his intention was to have come to arrange about our loss, but when he found it was so great, he said he would have nothing to do with it—when he wrote that letter, the loss was 140l., but I discovered 70l. since—I had discovered at that time that two cheques drawn upon Faulkner, Dear & Co., had been paid in to John's account—they were payable to Messrs. Barber & Co.—I produced the two cheques, and said, "These have been paid into your account at your bank, and surely you must know something about them"—he said, "I could not know, because Tom paid them in, as the credit-slip will show"—and he produced the credit-slip, which is in Thomas's writing—he said, "Of course, you will see I can know nothing about it"—I said, "Have you had any cheques of Barber's in your hands, besides these?"—he was very indignant, and asked me if I thought he was a thief; and said he had not—I asked him where his brother was—he said, "I know, but through his wife, and I shall not tell you where he is; but he is where you cannot touch him"—I told him he could not have any objection to tell us if we could not touch him, but he would not—I asked him if he had any money—he said, "He was not such a fool to go away without money; he had plenty"—I asked him in whose name the bill of sale was on Thomas Henry's furniture—he said, "I know, through his wife, but I cannot tell you"—I said, "There will be no objection to your telling me,"

but he still refused—he afterwards said he would let me know in whose hinds it was on the following morning—this diary (produced) is in John Bennett's writing—my attention has been called to the entries respecting this matter; they are in his writing—this letter, marked "B," is John's, and this letter, marked "C," is Thomas Henry's—this letter, marked "E," is John's—this promissory note for 300l. is not marked; the body of it is in John Bennett's writing, and the signature is Thomas Henry Bennett's—the endorsement on this cheque for 35l., which is drawn to order, is not genuine; it is Thomas Henry's writing—the counterfoil of the cheque, dated 29th September, for 10l., is, I should say, in John's writing—it is payable to Thomas Bennett or order—we cannot tell what the total amount of our loss is—at present we have found out nearly 700l., but I believe it is considerably over that.

Cross-examined. Q. In the conversation that you had with John Bennett when he first came to you did not he say at first that he had come to settle what his brother's defalcations were? A. No, he said it was his intention had it not been so much—I did not tell him how much I had discovered—he knew it from his father—I had communicated it to the father—he did not say anything to me about bringing an action for libel, but I heard he had said so among the clerks—he did not say "I have not had any cheques of Barber's" meaning cheques signed by Barber—he said he never had cheques with Barber's name on them.

EDWARD FORD . I am a partner in the firm of Edward and Thomas Ford, 3, Mincing Lane—in May last we were indebted to Messrs. Barber & Co. in the sum of 35l. 5s. 4d., and on 10th May I gave this cheque (produced) and received this receipt in exchange—the cheque has been returned as paid through our bankers, (Dated 1 0th May, 1868, for 35l. 5s. 4d., payable to Messrs. Barber & Co., or bearer. Edward & Thomas Ford.)

EDWARD SAYER (re-examined). This receipt is in T. H. Bennett's writing. MR. STARLING to E. FORD. Q. On 17th August did you owe the same firm 22l. 17s. 3d.? A. We did—I paid this cheque for that amount and received this receipt from the same person. (This was dated 15th August, 1868, drawn by Edward & Thomas Ford for 22l. 17s. 3d, payable to Messrs. Barber & Co. or bearer.)

EDWARD SAYER (re-examined). This receipt is also in Thomas's writing.

JOHN BRITTEN . I am a porter with Messrs. Barthes & Co., 1, Savage Gardens—on 8th July, I paid this cheque for 61l. 17s. to some person, and received this receipt—(This was dated 8th July, drawn by A. Barthes & Co., for 61l. 17s., payable to 5, or bearer.

JAMES CAPES . I am cashier to Messrs. W. F. Cousins & Co.—on 11th July, I paid this cheque, for 11l. 13s., to some person, and received this receipt—the cheque has been paid—(This was dated 11th July, 1868, drawn by F. W. Cousins, for 11l., 13s., payable to Messrs. Barber & Co., or order, and endorsed Joseph Barber & Co.

EDARD SAYER (re-examined). This receipt is in Thomas's writing, and the endorsement on the cheque is either a very good imitation, or the signature has been obtained surreptitiously.

JOHN STILL . I am clerk to Mr. Stevens, of 61, Great Tower Street—on 18th April, I paid a cheque for 8l. 11s. to the prisoner, Thomas Henry Bennett, on account of Messrs. Barber & Co.—the cheque has been paid, and this is the receipt—(Cheque read: dated 18th April, 1868, drawn by Richard Stevens, for 8l. 1 1s, payable to Messrs. Barber & Co., or bearer.)

HORACE YERWRTH . I am clerk to Messrs. Saull & Co., of Aldersgate Street—I know the prisoner, Thomas Henry Bennett—on 25th July, paid him a cheque for 4l. 3s. 10d, and received this receipt—(Cheque read: dated 25th July, drawn by C. Godfrey, on Messrs. Saull's account, for 4l. 3s. 10d., payable to 2935, Messrs. Barber & C., or bearer.)

EDWARD SAYER (re-examined). This receipt is in Thomas Henry Bennett's writing.

GEORGE MOORE DANIEL . I am clerk to Messrs. Gorman & Co.—on 25th July I paid a cheque for 5l. 5s. 5d. to some person who gave this receipt.

EDWARD SAYER (re-examined). This receipt is in Thomas Henry Bennett's writing—(Cheque read: dated 25th July, drawn by Gorman & Co., for 5l. 5S. 5D. payable to Messrs. Barber & Co., or bearer: crossed London and Country, Oxford Street.)

LEONARD LIBS . I am cashier to Messrs. Hudson—I know Thomas Henry Bennett—on 1st August, I paid this cheque, for 14l. 9s. to him, on account of Messrs. Barber, and received a receipt from him—(Cheque read: dated 1st August, 1868, drawn by Hudson Brothers, payable to Messrs. J. Barber & Co., or bearer.)

THEODORE FRAY . I am clerk to Carl Bergman—on 3rd June, I paid a cheque for 10l. 5s. 8d, and received this receipt—on 15th August, I paid a cheque for 6l. 18s. 3d., and received this receipt

EDWARD SAYER (re-examined). Both these receipts are in Thomas Henry Bennett's writing—(Cheques read: "3rd June, 1868, pro Carl Berman, E. Kerry, payable to Messrs. Joseph Barber & Co., or bearer"—"15th August, 1868, drawn by Carl Bergman, payable to Messrs. Joseph Barber & Co., or bearer.")

CORNELIUS FELIX YUHORST . I am manager to Messrs. Hooper & Co.—on 29th August, I paid Thomas Henry Bennett, a cheque for 5l. 13S. 6d; and he gave me this receipt for Messrs. Barber & Co.

JOHN PREECE . I am cashier to Messrs. W. & A. Gilbey—on the 4th September, a cheque for 70l. 11s. 0d. was paid to Messrs. Barber & Co., and this receipt was taken from the person to whom it was paid. (Cheque dated 4th September, drawn by W. & A. Gilbey, payable to 38, 681, or bearer.)

JOHN EDWARD SHAND . I am clerk in the Foreign Vineyard Associaation—the prisoner, John Bennett, was a fellow clerk—his salary was 80l. a year, and he had commission on the wines he sold—on 9th July, 1868, I received a cheque from him for 61l. 17s. 0d., drawn on Fuller, Hanbury, & Co.—it was crossed and I gave him cash for it—on 15th July he told me he had paid a cheque for 12l. 13s. 0d. into my wife's account at the London & County Bonk—the account is in my wife's name—she carries on a millinery business—there was no money due to me from him at that time—he paid the two in, and gave me 6l. 1s. 0d., and I gave him a cheque for 80l. 11s. 0d.—he told me he wanted that cheque to pay into the Foreign Vineyard Association, for transactions he had had with them—he said there was a cheque there of Mr. Wheeler's which he was going to withdraw—Mr. Wheeler's cheque was there as security for some wines the prisoner had sold—ray cheque was paid into the Foreign Vineyard Association—on 29th July I received two cheques from John Bennett; one for 4l. 3s. 10d., signed by Mr. Godfrey on Saulls' account; and one for 5l. 5s. 5d. drawn by Gorman & Co., in favour of Barber & Co.—they were afterwards paid into my account at the London & County, Oxford Street branch—I gave him cash for them—on 3rd August I cashed a cheque for him for 14l. 9s. 10d,

drawn by Hudson Brothers, and payable to Messrs. Barber & Co.—I also cashed other cheques before he opened an account of his own—he did not tell me where he got all these cheques from, but I understood he got them from selling wines to his customers—I did not know his brother was at Messrs. Barber's.

Cross-examined. Q. Is it a fact that John Bennett was in the habit of selling wines largely on commission? A. It is—his commission was never less than 71/2 per cent, and sometimes it was as high as 10.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Supposing he sold wines to his brother, would he have commission on them also? A. Yes, any wines.

JOHN WHELER . I carry on business in Bond Street—I have known John Bennett several years, and have been in the habit of cashing cheques for him—on 21st April I cashed the cheque for 8l. 11s. 0d. (produced)—in May he came to me and told me his brother had bought a large quantity of wine, and he came to know if I could give him cash for a bill, a cheque would do for it, dated in advance—I gave him a cheque for 80l. 10s., dated two months forward, and he gave me a bill of exchange for 88l. 10s.—at the expiration of the two months he returned my cheque and I gave him his bill—I have since destroyed the cheque—on 18th May I cashed for him a cheque for 35l. 5s. 4d.—I gave him two of my cheques for that, one was for 20l. 5s. 4d. and the other for 15l.—they were not given on the same day—on 18th August I cashed for him a cheque for 6l. 18s. 3d, and on 15th August one for 22l. 17s. 3d.—at the end of September be came to me and told me his brother had entered into a speculation with a firm at Birmingham in which he was likely to lose a large sum of money, and asked me, considering that Thomas Bennett had only been married a very short time, and out of consideration for his wife, whether I would make myself a party to a bill of sale for 300l.—I assented to that, and referred him to my solicitor, Mr. Fereday, of Bedford Row—John and Thomas were to give me a promissory note for 300l.—John at that time only owed me a few pounds, and Thomas nothing—the furniture named in the bill of sale was removed from Thomas's house, at my directions, to an auctioneer's in Bond Street—I think his name is Robinson—I gave John Bennett directions to have it sold—I believe the sale was stopped by Messrs. Barber's orders—the promissory note was given as an apparent consideration for the bill of sale.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you any interest in this bill? A. Not the lightest, it was merely done for the protection of the lady who had been married such a short time.

COURT. Q. Did you not understand, Mr. Wheeler, that you were cheating his creditors? A. No.

MR. WILLIAMS. Q. Did you, when you heard of this, at once offer to give every assistance to Messrs. Barber to realise the property for them? A. Yes—I had no intention at the time of defrauding anybody; I was told he had no creditors, and that it was merely to protect this lady against this swindling firm at Birmingham—I did not know where Thomas was, and did not inquire—I left the matter in the hands of my attorney—I did not give him any directions about it at all.

MR. METCALFE. Q. I see. your attorney, to whom you referred this matter, is now defending the prisoner, John Bennett? A. Yes.

WILLIAM FREDERICK WHEATLAND . I reside at 28, Nelson Street, City Road—my sister married the prisoner, Thomas, on 19th September last—

I have known him for about twelve months—about six weeks before he married, he began to furnish a house, at 39, Spurstowe Road, Hackney—he did not tell me anything about his carrying on any business, or what he was doing—he did not say anything about a wine business—I did not know from him that he was carrying on business as a wine merchant—I saw the furniture go into the house—he told me it was worth between 300l. and 400l.—on 28th September, he sent for me—I went to his house, and found him there—he said he was glad I had called to see him—after some little conversation, John came in, and he said to him, "I have told Fred, a little about it"—Thomas asked John what he was to do about it, and John said, "You must get away by all means"—there was some question about his not having the means, and John said, he would advance him some money; he also said, "I must have a bill of sale on your furniture, and you had better give me an I O U for 300l."—I believe the bill of sale was to be for 300l.—Thomas said it was too late that night—John said he should come again in the morning, but he should go and see his friend Wheeler, and be believed his man would do the job for him—John said he should advance Thomas 10l. to go away—I believe a rough I O U was made out for 300l.—after John had left, I and Thomas made out an inventory—I wrote it at his dictation—this is it (produced)—I believe there are several things put in that that were not in the house at all—John came the next morning, he said, "All right, I have managed it all, and we must go to the lawyer—we all went to Mr. Fereday's office—Thomas took some clothes with him in a box—Mr. Fereday was asked to draw up a bill of sale—he said he could not draw it up then, as it would take some little while, but that he would get it ready by the afternoon—we then went to Waterloo Station, and left the luggage there, and from there to Oxford Street, where I believe a cheque was cashed—I believe Thomas took the money—from there we went to Mr. Wheeler's—I remained in the street—we then went to Mr. Fereday's, whom we had to meet at 3—Mr. Fereday said the bill of sale was ready, and only wanted signing—it was then signed—I do not think I signed it—a promissory note was drawn up for 300l. and given to Mr. Fereday—after that, and while we were on the staircase, Thomas said be should not go, and that he would stop and face it out—John said, "It is no good talking like that, you must go, or else you will ruin all"—we then went to Waterloo Station, and Thomas left for Southampton, on his way to New York, vid Havre—the goods mentioned in the bill of sale were taken possession of and sent to Robinson's Sale Rooms—some went to John Bennett's house—after that John told me the goods had been stopped by Messrs. Barber—he also said, "Of course, my friend Wheeler has been very kind in the matter, and we must not allow him to lose anything; but as the bill of sale is likely to be contested, he must have something to show that he has a claim"—he also said, "There is a bill amongst Thomas's papers which you must get me; it is for something like 80l."—I told him I had not got the papers—he said, "Do you know where they are?"—I said, "Yes, I do"—he said, "Can you get it for me?"—I said, I will try, and he went with me in a cab to a friend of mine to fetch the bill for 88l.—I got it and gave it to John—he told me the bill had been paid, but he said, "It is so as Mr. Wheeler may have something to show for the bill of sale," and he afterwards told me he had given it to Mr. Wheeler—this is the promissory note—("London, September 29, 1868. On demand we jointly and severally promise to pay to Mr. John Wheeler, or

order, the sum of 300l. for value received. John Bennett and Thomas Henry Bennett." Bill read: "May 12, 1868. Two months after date pay to my order 88l. 10s. for value received. Thomas Bennett, Counting House, Brewer's Quay, Lower Thames Street, E.C")

Cross-examined. Q. Were you not the first to suggest to Thomas that he should go away? A. No—I swear that—I did not say anything about NewYark—John told me he would arrange where he should go to—they spoke in whispers, and I did not hear—I knew so little about the whole business that it came upon me very suddenly—I understood Thomas had been doing something wrong, for which the firm were determined to prosecute him—he did not enter into any particulars—there was no mention whatever about the cheque.

JOSEPH SAUNDERS VIALL . I am cashier at the Oxford Street branch of the London and County Bank—John Bennett opened an account there on 19th August last—on 4th September he paid in this cheque for 70l. 11s. 2d., drawn by W. & A. Gilbey, and payable to Messrs. Barber; and on 29th August he paid in a cheque for 5l. 13s. 6d., payable to Barber & Co.

RICHARD PARIS . I am cashier at the Foreign Vineyard Association—I took this cheque about the first week in June, from John Bennett, in exchange for a 20l. note—it is for only 10l. 4s. 8d, but I took it with some other money.

Cross-examined. Q. Have you known John Bennett some time? A. About light years—I know some of his family, and have been at his house—he occupies a large house, what I should call a 50l. or 60l. house—he makes tome considerable income by letting it in lodgings—his wife makes all the expenses of the house and something over—during the eight years I have known him, his character has been most excellent—he has been an upright and honest man—he sold wine, on commission, to a large extent—I should say he made 30l. or 40l. a year by that.

THOMAS SMART (City Detective). I searched John Bennett and found on him a cheque-book, and this press-copy letter "B."—since then, Thomas Bennett has given up the original—I assisted in searching John Bennett's house, and found this letter and promissory note.

Cross-examined. Q. Had you any difficulty in finding the prisoner? A. None whatever—I walked into the office where he was employed.

(Extracts were read from the diary, which showed that numerous transactions had taken place between the two prisoners—entries were made of the cheques received by John from Thomas—two letters were also read, which had passed between the prisoners since Thomas absconded.)

JOHN BENNETT received a good character.— GUILTY .

The Jury expressed their strong disapprobation of Mr. Fereday's conduct, and also Mr. Wheeler's, in connection with the bill of sale.

THOMAS HENRY BENNETT, recommended to mercy by the Prosecutor.— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment .

JOHN BENNETT— Five Years' Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-937
VerdictNot Guilty > no evidence

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937. JOHN SEDGELEY (26) , Stealing a post letter, the property of John Beale.

MR. COOPER, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence.—


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-938
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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938. ROBERT DUNDRON (20), and JOSEPH TUCK (19) , Burglariouslybreaking and entering the dwelling-house of Edward Murphy, and stealing therein a jacket, 1l. 10s., and other articles.

MR. LANGFORD conducted the Prosecution; and MR. M. WILLIAMS the Defence.

EDWARD MURPHY . On the morning of 3rd October, between 1 and 2 o'clock, I was in bed asleep—I saw my daughter bolt the doors before going to bed—I cannot say whether she fastened the windows—I was awoke between 1 and 2, and I saw Dundron in my room—I had known him by sight before—this knife was in my pocket—it dropped and awoke me—he ran down stairs, and I ran after him—when I got to the door I looked up the court, and I saw both the prisoners—I did not see them both in my house; but I expect they came out of it, for there is no thoroughfare by it—my door is not in the street, but in the court—when I went back to my room I examined my trousers, and I missed a sovereign, two shillings, and sixpence in coppers, and down stairs I missed a jacket.

Cross-examined. Q. Is this right, "I was awoke by a man being in the room. I looked up. The man run down, and was joined by another, and got away?" A. Yes—I did not see Tuck's face.

Q. Have you said this, "I should like to know where Wilkinson was, as the man I saw in my room wore a hat like Wilkinson, which made me doubtful?" A. I never said "doubtful"—I did not say "I should like to know where Wilkinson was"—I did not say "I thought it might be Wilkinson"—this is my answer—I did say that that the man I saw had a hat like Wilkinson—I saw the man by the light of a lamp that is outside, over the door—it shows plenty of light in my room.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-939
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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939. GEORGE COLLINS (36) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Frederick Road, with intent to steal.

MR. LEIGH conducted the Prosecution.

EMMA ROAD . I am the wife of Frederick Road, of 39, Pentonville Road—I have three children, who are ill, and I am obliged to be up the greater part of the night—about 3 o'clock, on the morning of 25th October, I heard a noise of breaking glass—on hearing it a second time I went down stains, and then heard a rattle sprung—I ran back to my bed-room, locked the door, and opened the window—a policeman said, "Will you come down, thieves have broken into your house"—the window was perfectly safe the night before—when I went down I found the prisoner in custody.


(Policeman G 191). I was on duty this morning on Pentonville Hill—about 2.45 I heard a smash—I listened two or three minutes and then heard a second smash, as of glass—I took my lantern and looked in the gardens, and at No. 39 I found the prisoner, down the area—his head and three parts of his body was in the house—I asked him what he was doing, and he said, "Nothing at all"—I sprung my rattle and got assistance—the sash of the window was broken as well as the glass.

GUILTY .—He was further charged with having been convicted of felony at this Court, in July, 1863, in the name of Alexander Munro, to which he PLEADED GUILTY.— Ten Years' Penal Servitude .

OLD COURT.—Thursday, October 29th, and Friday, 30th, 1868.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-940
VerdictGuilty > unknown; Not Guilty > unknown
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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940. FREDERICK AUGUSTUS FARRAR (40), and JOHN HULLETT . (28), were indicted for feloniously forging and uttering an acceptance to a bill of exchange for 800l., with intent to defraud.

MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH, with MR. F. H. LEWIS, conducted the Prosecution;

MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE, with MR. BESLEY, defended Farrar; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS appeared for Hullett.

RICHARD SEYMOUR GUINNESS . I am a banker, of the firm of Guinness, Mahon, & Co., of College Green, Dublin—we have a client in London named Foxall—our firm received from him this bill of exchange for 800l. (produced) before we agreed to discount it we wrote to Mr. Foxall for an explanation about the transaction, and he then sent us this agreement (produced), to show us the bond fides of the transaction—we got the agreement on 14th August, and remitted the proceeds of the bill the same day, amounting to 778l. 13s.—we sent it by draft on the London and County Bank, our London bankers—this is is it—(produced)—on 7th September I happened to be passing through London, from Germany, and in consequence of information, I went to the office of Mr. Newton—whilst I was there the prisoner Farrar came in—I said to him I was surprised to find that Lord Dudley had repudiated any knowledge of Mr. Hullett, who was the drawer of the bill that had passed through his hands—he said that was very strange, as he knew it to be his lordship's bill—I said, "What do you know about the transaction?"—he said, "I know it is payment for an opera that the drawer, Mr. Hullett, was to write for Lord Dudley"—I said, "Do you speak of your own knowledge, or is it what Mr. Hullett told you"—he said he spoke of his own knowledge, and that he knew the opera to be nearly finished, on the point of completion, and I think he said that he had seen it, but I would not like to speak positively to that—I said, "It is very strange, under these circumstances, that Lord Dudley should not know Mr. Hullett, if he is writing an opera for him"—he said Lord Dudley was a very strange man, and he was not surprised at his disowning Mr. Hullett—I then said, "I suppose you were the solicitor who prepared the agreement"—I don't think this agreement was before me at that time; the agreement had been referred to, and he had spoken of a previous agreement—he said the arrangement was made by deed, there was a written agreement, and that was substituted for a previous agreement which was made between Mr. Hullett and Mr. Mapleson for the opera, but after it had been so prepared, Mr. Hullett considered he should have the security of Lord Dudley for writing the opera, and that a new agreement was prepared which was executed by Lord Dudley—I then said, "I suppose it was you prepared this agreement—he said, "No, it was prepared by solicitors in the Temple" or Lincoln's-Inn Fields, "I think the Temple, "a most respectable firm of solicitors—I said, "Who are they; what is the name of the firm?”—he said he would rather not mention their name, as the matter seemed to be a little unpleasant—I said I did not see why he should object, and that I would wish to know the name—he said he must declince to mention it—he then said, "But would it not be much better to end all this business, by taking up the bill?"—I said, "Very well, I should much prefer it—what is it you propose?"—he said, "Well, I will give you half the sum in two days (this was on a Monday; it was to be given on Wednesday) and Mr. Eversfield's bill for the other half, Mr. Eversfield, of Denne Park, Horsham, I think he said; I wrote it down at the instant (referring) it is "Charles Gilbert Eversfield, of Denne Park, Horsham"—I made that memorandum at the time, in Farrar's

presence"—I said, "Give me his name," and he gave me that—I said, "Who is he?”—he said, "He is a gentleman of large fortune, and Mr. Hullett's uncle"—I said, "Who are his bankers?"—he said, "I could not tell that; I know his bankers, but I could not tell you; I would not like any inquiry made of them"—I then said it was impossible I could take his bill without making inquiry about him—he still declined to give the name, and Mr. Newton interposed, and said he thought it was only reasonable that he should give the name—he then told the name—he said, "I will tell you in confidence, his bankers are" so and so—I forget the name, but it was a well known banker, a name I was quite familiar with; I took no note of it, for I did not mean to take the bill—I then said, "As to the proceeds of this bill; I understand you have received the proceeds from Mr. Newton"—Mr. Newton (who had previously told me so), interposed, and said, "Yes, I have given all the money to Mr. Farrar, except 10l."—I looked at Mr. Farrar to answer that question also, and he said, "Yes, that was so"—I then said, "Have you handed over the proceeds to Mr. Hullett"—he said, "All, with the exception of 125l."—(I should state that at the very commencement of our conversation, when I threw a doubt upon the bond fides of the bill, he said at once that he had the materials to make it perfectly plain to me that it was a bond fide transaction as between Mr. Hullett and Lord Dudley, that I need not feel the least uneasy about the bill, that it was quite right and genuine; he knew it of his own knowledge, that he had the means of satisfying me, and would do so)—I then said, "Well, pending the investigation of the genuineness of the bill, (of which he was to satisfy me) I suppose you will have no objection to hand me over the 125l. which you have in your hands?”—he said he did not see why he should do so—he seemed to me to throw a doubt on the safety of handing it to me; so I said to him, "Suppose you hand it over to Mr. Newton, that will be quite satisfactory to me if you leave it with Mr. Newton, to be added to the 10l. that he has in his hands, and he will hold it as a stake-holder, till the genuineness of the bill is proved"—he said that he had no objection to hand it to Mr. Newton, but he had not the money with him at the time—I said, "You can give Mr. Newton a cheque for it, that will do as well"—he said, "Oh, I have not my cheque book"—I handed him a piece of paper that was before me, and said, "Write a cheque, a blank cheque is just as good as a printed one"—he said, "Oh, I never write blank cheques, I could not do so at all; but I will give it to Mr. Newton on Wednesday next"—I said, "I want to leave for Dublin to night, and it would be more comfortable for me to see the money in Mr. Newton's hands before I leave"—he said that I might rely upon it that he should have it on Wednesday"—I again pressed, and said I could not leave London without seeing the money in Mr. Newton's hands—he then said, "I must decline to do so; I will not be pressed so—I will pay it on Wednesday, I think you should be quite satisfied with my assurance"—seeing that he would not give the money, I said, "How do I know that if I leave London, Mr. Hullett may not call upon you for this money, and you will have no answer but to hand it to him"—he said, "I will give you an undertaking that I will not pay the money over to Mr. Hullett"—I said, "Well, give me that written undertaking," and I handed him a sheet of paper—this is the undertaking he gave me—(produced)—I should say that I dictated the writing I required—(Read: "To Messrs. Guinness, Mahon & Co., bankers, Dablin. September 7, 1868. I acknowledge to have in hand the sum of 120l.,

more or less, for and on account of an acceptance of 800l, of Lord Dudley, of Mr. Hullett's draft for that amount, which I shall pay over to Mr. Newton, or to your account, in reduction of the above acceptance, until the bond fides of the matter of same is established to your satisfaction; Mr. Hullett having received the remainder of the money, less discount and commission from me")—That was my dictation, amended by him—for instance, I dictated the words, "Until the bill is proved to be genuine"—he said, "I object to that, because that throws a doubt upon the bill; there is no doubt," and he suggested the term, "bona fides"—about that time, Haydon, the detective officer came in, and he took Farrar to the Mansion House—I don't think he took him into custody, until we arrived at the Mansion House—I did not give him into custody till we arrived there.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT BALLANINE. Q. You used the expression in the early part of your interview, "Have you handed over the whole of the money to Hullett?" Do you pledge yourself to those words? A. No, only to the sense of them; I understood from him that he had been acting as attorney for Hullett, except when he stated that he had not prepared the agreement for the opera; in other respects I understood from him that he was acting as attorney for Hullett—he came to Mr. Newton's of his own accord, as far as I know—Mr. Newton told me he had written to him requesting him to call on him about Lord Dudley's bill—he was not at all confused or embarrased—I dictated to him the form of undertaking that I wished him to sign and he corrected my form and used his own words—he did not follow what I wished him to write exactly, in some particulars—the words "Mr. Hullett having received the remainder of the money, less discount and commission" were dictated by me—I cannot say in those particular words; I wished him to add the disposition of the money; those exact words I think are his—I understood from what he said that he had actually paid over the money to Hullett—I said, "Acknowledge that you have 125l. in your hands"—he then wrote, "120l."—I said, "I thought you said 125l."—he said, "Well, it is really 130l., but as I have written 120l. I won't alter it"

Cross-examined by MR. WILLIAMS. Q. You never saw Hullett in the transaction? A. No, I never saw Hullett.

MR. SERJEANAT SLEIGH . Q. Who made use of the words 125l, you or Farrar? A. Farrar—Mr. Foxall is not our agent, but a customer.

JOHN NEWTON . I have heard nearly all Mr. Guinness' examination; what he has stated of the conversation is substantially correct—I am engaged at the South Sea House, Threadneedle Street as an accountant—I have some connection with financial parties who discount—late in April last Mr. Farrar called on me—I had known him previously—he asked if I knew any channel through which Mr. Mapleson's promissory notes, endorsed by Lord Dudley, could be discounted, and he mentioned an amount of 26, 000l. as the sum likely to be brought forward, as the amount of the bills—I told him that through a channel at the West End I had no doubt such an amount could be discounted—I made a communication to a party at the West End, and subsequently bad another interview with Mr. Farrar—the matter extended from late in April till early in May before it was finally brought to a close—the second interview with Farrar was a few days after the first—I then told him that the bills could be discounted—he said he had not got them, he expected to get them, and he would see me again—I saw him again in the course of four or five days, to

the best of my belief—he called upon me—he then said that the bills were not likely to come forward, he understood that the Earl of Dudley's bankers had heard of the proposition, and that they were willing to advance him any reasonable amount upon fair terms, and that the transaction could not be carried through—I saw him again in June, but it is quite possible he may have called previously—at a subsequent period he brought me a bill of exchange for 800l., purporting to be drawn by Hullett on Lord Dudley—to the best of my belief this is the bill (the one produced)—at the same time he handed me this letter—(Read: "July 25. Dear Mr. Farrar, I enclose you the bill of Earl Dudley, which I named to you before, and should be extremely obliged if you could let me have the cash for it, what you think fair. I ought to add the reason it was not made payable at Dudley's banker's, is that his lordship seems to have a wish it should not be, probably because he did not wish it to be in their hands, being a private one to me on account. It will be met at the bank made payable at, without fail—yours, J. Hullett")—I have since ascertained that the date of this interview was 31st July—under a misapprehension I have said it was in the beginning of August—It was at the South Sea House, where I am engaged—Mr. Farrar asked if the bill could be discounted, and having been informed previously that bills of Lord Dudley's could be discounted, I said I would place it in the same channel, with a view to its being done—I took it up to the same quarter, at the West End, and left it were with that object—the gentleman with whom I left it in the first instance was Mr. Gisborne—Mr. Foxall is in the same office, it is in the Strand—I saw Mr. Farrar again in the course of a few days, four or five, probably: it was understood that the bill was going to be offered out of town, and it would take two or three days to get the answer; therefore it was arranged that he should call again in a few days—he did call, and I told him the terms upon which it could be discounted out of town appeared to be so high that I had not been able to accede to them, and that the bill would be sent to a different quarter, to try it there—on 6th August it was placed with Mr. Foxall—on 15th August I obtained the proceeds of the bill, in a draft from Mr. Foxall for 777l. 13s. 4d.—between the 6th and 15th August I had an interview with Mr. Farrar—it was about the 10th or 12th—I then told him that further evidence was required in reference to the transaction—on the 15th I saw him again—I told him on that day that Mr. Foxall had received the proceeds from Dublin, but that conditions were attached to the transaction, which, without his (Mr. Farrar's) authority, I could not proceed—the conditions were that the agreement should be retained—he said he was going out of town, and knowing that I had only to go up to Mr. Foxall to receive the proceeds, I gave Mr. Farrar these two cheques on account of the transaction, one for 250l. and one for 155l.—they have been subsequently returned to me in the ordinary course as having been paid—Mr. Farrar's endorsement is upon them—on the 21st I saw him again, and on that occasion gave him these two cheques for 225l. and 75l., dated 21st and 29th August—they have been returned in the ordinary course as paid—I did not give him the 75l. cheque on the 21st, I gave him the 225l. then—that makes 705l. altogether—he owed me between 45l. and 50l. previously—the balance of the 777l. 13s. 4d. was made up of that sum and the commission and discount—I know Farrar's handwriting—the endorsement on these different cheques are his writing—they are all endorsed by him—three of them appear to have passed through Williams, Deacon & Co.

—in the month of June, Farrar brought me this bill of exchange for 350l. (produced) purporting to be drawn by Hullett on Eversfield—it bears the endorsement of John Hullett—he asked if I could get it discounted: he had previously told me that Mr. Eversfield was one of Mr. Hullett's trustees, and his (Hullett's) uncle—I dare say that was two months before: he had a bill for a similar amount at that time: that was not discounted, he showed it to me: this 353l. bill was discounted by the firm of Wright and Gamble—Mr. Farror received the proceeds of it himself—they accounted to him for the proceeds.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. You say you are an accountant; does that mean a bill discounter? A. No, I am not a bill discounter—this was an exceptional matter—Farrar left the 800l. bill with me, and I immediately took it up to the West End—I had no inquiries to make; I was simply an agent—if I had retained the bill I might have made inquiries—it was fifteen days before he received the proceeds—after it was discounted, I gave him cheques, in accordance with his request—from the explanation he gave of Lord Dudley's acceptance, it did not attract any suspicion in my mind—I thought Mr. Hullett might want 800l.—it was said to be given for his accommodation; it was so represented—it appeared exceptional, but Mr. Farrar said it was for Mr. Hullett's accommodation—I believed it was Lord Dudley's acceptance, and for the accommodation of Hullett—I did not make any inquiry before I made myself a party to the discount of the bill—I was not acquainted with anyone who knew Lord Dudley's handwriting—I did not try to find anyone—Farrar left me that one letter which enclosed the bill from Hullett—he did not show me other letters, to my recollection—he subsequently brought the agreement—I had not Eversfield's bill a whole month before it was discounted; it was in the possession of the parties who discounted it for nearly that period—I could have made any inquiry during that period—I did not make any—Farrar represented that Eversfield was Hullett's uncle—that was not in a letter from Hullett, to my knowledge—when this acceptance of Lord Dudley's was questioned, I wrote to Farrar on 4th September to come to me—he came to me on the 7th—I told him in my letter that there was a doubt about it.

Cross-examined. by MR WILLIAM. Q. You never saw Hullett at all in the matter? A. I did not.

MR. LEWIS, Q. When you received the 800l. bill what did you do with it? A. I took it up to the West End and left it there; it did not remain in my possession after that—it got first of all into the possession of Mr. Gisborne; that was the last I saw of it; no, I beg your pardon, if I recol-lect right, Mr. Foxall brought it down with him, on 6th August, prior to sending it to Dublin, but he did not leave it with me—Mr. Farrar was aware when he called, three or four days after he gave it me, that I had left it at Mr. Gisborne's.

REV. ALFRED POLE . I am incumbent of Purbrook, near Cosham, Hants—I know Hullett and his handwriting—I believe the body of this 800l. bill to be his writing, and the signature as well—I also believe the body of this 350l. bill to be Hullett's writing—about six or seven months ago Hullett came to me, I believe it was either in April or May, and asked if I would be kind enough to witness his signature to a document which he produced, and which he said I might read if I liked—I saw that it was an agreement between him and Lord Dudley about the composition of an opera upon which Lord Dudley was engaged—this is the document (the agreement produced)—I

saw Hullett sign it, and witnessed his signature—the signature of Lord Dudley was upon it at that time—I see the words "John Hullett" on this blank cheque (produced)—I do not think that 'is Mr. Hullett's writing.

Cross-examined by SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Was Mr. Hullett a gentleman, living with an appearance of respectability in your neighbourhood? A. He was, in very fair style; it was a small house, but very respectable—I don't know what this opera was that he had composed—I don't think I was told the name at the time: I have heard it since—I did not know Mr. Eversfield until I saw him at the Mansion House—I have not seen him at Hullett's—I have heard Hullett speak of him.

Cross-examined by MR. WILLIAMS. Q. You say the body of the bill is in Hullett's handwriting; do you know in whose writing the signature "Dudley" is? A. I do not—I was living opposite Mr. Hullett—I believe he was engaged upon an opera—he had some person down from London to assist—it was a lady, I believe—I saw her there—I think she was there some months—he mentioned the opera to me once or twice, I think—he had told me previously that Lord Dudley had made this agreement—very little was said about the opera—I think, from time to time, I asked him how it was going on—I think he said it was still going on—I remember nothing very distinctly—I did not hear any of the music played over.

FREDERICK AUGUSTUS COWEN . I reside at 11, Warwick Crescent—I am private secretary to the Earl of Dudley—I have been so nearly ten years—I am well acquainted with his handwriting—the signature "Dudley" to this bill of exchange for 800l., and also to this agreement, is most decidedly not his writing—Lord Dudley does not bank at the Bank of England; he banks at Gosling & Sharpe's, Fleet Street—besides being private secretary to Lord Dudley, I am also treasurer to Mr. Mapleson, of Her Majesty's Theatre—I never saw anything of either of the prisoners until April or May last, when one of them, Mr. Farrar, came to Drury Lane Theatre—I can't state the date at all—it was somewhere between the 15th April and 15th May—I was at the theatre, and was requested by Mr. Mapleson to come into the room where he was—on going into the room Farrar was there; he told me that he expected a large amount of Lord Dudley's bills, up to 20, 000l., I believe it was, and asked me if I knew anything about it—I told him that it was perfectly ridiculous; that I had been many years with his lordship, and I 'never knew him accept a bill yet—he made an appointment to see me on the following day, or the day after—he called again, and I saw him on the stage of Drury Lane Theatre—he repeated the conversation, and I then told him exactly what I had told him the previous day; that his lordship never accepted bills.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Does your secretary-ship to Lord Dudley involve a knowledge of the whole of his affairs, or only a particular section of them? A. A particular section of his affairs; I don't manage all Lord Dudley's affairs; they are not more immediately connected with the Italian Opera.

MR. SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. Are you cognizant of the general financial affairs of Lord Dudley? A. I am not; they go through his lordship's solicitors—his London affairs generally go through me; the payment of the tradesmen's bills, and all those things pass through my hands—during the time I have been with him he has never, to my knowledge, dealt with bills of exchange—Mr. Benbow, of Lincoln's Inn, is his lordship's private solicitor.

JAMES HENRY MAPLESON . I am lessee of Her Majesty's Theatre—I recollect Mr. Farrar coming to me—I think it was in the month of April—he sent in a card to me at Drury Lane Theatre, wishing to see me on a matter of business—he then wished to know if I had drawn these bills—I asked him what bills—he repeated, "the bills"—I then ascertained from him that it was contemplated to have 20, 000l. or 30, 000l. worth of bills—I rung my bell and sent for Mr. Cowen, the treasurer, as I thought it would be better that he should be present—the rest of the conversation Mr. Cowen has deposed to—I coincided with Cowen, that his lordship never drew bills, or accepted them either.

JOHN HENRY BENBOW . I am a solicitor, of Stone Buildings, Lincoln's Inn—I am solicitor to Lord Dudley—I have been so for the last twenty-five years—I have seen these documents, the agreement, and the bill—the signature of "Dudley" to them is not the earl's signature.

COURT. Q. Just take them in your hand and look at them, are they good imitations of Lord Dudley's handwriting? A. No; I should say very indifferent imitations.

MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Will you look at that paper (marked "A,") and say whether you believe that to be Lord Dudley's genuine signature? A. Yes, I should say it was.

CHARLES GILBERT EVERSFIELD . I reside at Denne Park, Horsham—the acceptance to this bill of exchange for 350l., is not in my handwriting, or by my authority—I know the prisoner Hullett—it is not true that I am his uncle, or any relation—I am not his trustee—I did not authorize him to put my name to any document—I know the prisoner Farrar—I first saw him at the Horsham railway station in July last, I think, but I have no date—he requested an interview with me on very important business—I had never seen him before to my knowledge—he said he desired the interview very much—I don't recollect that he said why—he said that it would be a benefit to me—I did not have the interview with him—he said that he would remain at the station some hours, or in Horsham; I won't be sure which he said, the station or the Queen's Head.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. You knew Hullett, at all events? A. I knew him—I had accommodated him with my name to a bill—I really can't tell you how long it was before this—it was an acceptance—I can't give you any distinct period when I did it—I believe it was in October, 1867—I have, besides that, lent him money.

Cross-examined by MR. WILLIAMS. Q. Do I understand you to say that you never signed any authority of any sort for the prisoner with regard to any bills or any money? A. Not to my recollection—according to that I may have, and have forgotten it—I never offered to take any of his furniture as part security—he offered to give it—I remember a circumstance about a grand piano—I don't remember the conversation—he was importuning me for help, and mentioned this piano, and wrote a letter, in fact, which I have now with me, to say that he must shortly part with it.

SERJEANT SLEIGH. Q. How did you first become acquainted with Hullett? A. By a letter—I think it was about the month of May, 1866—he importuned me for assistance, and I, from time to time, did assist him—he did not say that he was in pecuniary difficulties, but he must have been to have asked me—that was the only occasion upon which I put my hand to a document for him.

THOMAS HENRY NORRIS . I am ledger-keeper in the employment of the

banking firm of Williams, Deacon & Co., Birchin Lane—Mr. Farrar kept an account there—it was opened on 10th July, 1868, by a payment of 210l.—this (produced) is a copy of the account; I hare the ledger here.

STEPHEN JARRETT COOK . I am a clerk in the City bank—Mr. Newton kept an account there—I here the books here—on 21st August I paid a cheque for 225l., drawn by him in four 50l. notes, No. 68819 to 68822 inclusive, and two 10l. notes, Nos. 94846 and 7, and 5l. in gold—I can't say to whom I paid it—I paid it to the person presenting the cheque.

RICHARD ADYE BAILEY . I am a clerk in the Bank of England—I produce two 50l. notes, Nos. 68821 and 2—one was changed for gold on 26th August—the name of John Hullett, Southampton, is on it—the other was changed on 29th August for ten 5l. notes, in the name of Farrar, Nos.96079 to 88 inclusive—I learn this from the bank books—the books are not here—the Bank of England is exempted from the production of books—I took the notes from a file—I am not the person who changed the notes—I only prove that this is a copy from the books—I have produced note from the bank for 20 years—all notes paid on one day are kept separate from all other notes on the files of the day. I have taken those notes off those files.

MICHAEL HAYDON (City Detective Officer). On 7th September, in consequence of some instructions, I went to Mr. Newton's office, at the South Sea House—I found Mr. Farrar there—I requested him to accompany me to the Mansion House, previous to taking him to Bow Lane station—at Bow Lane I told him that he was charged with forging an acceptance for 800l., purporting to be the acceptance of the Earl of Dudley, with intent to defraud—he said "I am quite innocent of the charge, it should never have been preferred against me"—I requested him to produce whatever property he had about him—he did so—among that property were three Bank of England notes for 50l., Nos. 32841, 73413, 72095, all dated 23rd May, 1868; four Bank of England notes for 5. each, Nos. 96079 to 96082 inclusive, dated 16th July, 1868, 170l. in all—there was other property, but nothing of any consequence, with the exception of the blank cheque produced, with Hullett's name on the back—I subsequently arrested Hullett, in Gower Street, Euston Road—I told him that I was an officer, and that he most consider himself in my custody on a charge of being concerned with one Mr. Farrar in forging and uttering a bill of exchange for 800l. in August last, purporting to be accepted by the Earl of Dudley, with intent to defraud—he made no reply, but shortly afterwards he said, "I am prepared to go with you at once"—I took him to the police station, Bow Lane, and searched him—I found nothing upon him of any consequence in reference to this charge: a small amount of money and some duplicates of articles that he had pledged.

Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Was he passing under a false name? A. No, not then—I addressed him as Hullett—I found upon Farrar some papers signed by Hullett; this (produced) is signed by Hullett (This was dated July, 1868, Waterloo-ville Hall, Cesham, Hants, and was at follows: "Dear Sir, I admit and acknowledge to have received the full value and consideration for Mr. C. G. Eversfield's acceptance of 350l. due 13th September next, after allowing for costs, charges and expenses, fees, payments and disbursements, and journeys, out of the same, I am, dear sir, very truly yours, JOHN HULLETT.")

Cross-examined by MR. WILLIAMS. Q. Did you find any letters on

Hullett. A. There were some papers on him (producing them), those are all I found on him—I found a draft letter on Farrar, this is it (produced)—I do not know whose writing it is—I found both the draft and the letter on Farrar—Hullett did not deny his name in any way.

THOMAS DAVIS . I am a master printer, formerly of Thames Street, now of Oxford Street—I have known Mr. Farrar fire or six years—I have seen him write many times—to the best of my belief the name of "Farrar" on this 50l. bank note, No. 68821, is in his handwriting, and the name of "John Hullett" on this other 50l. note, No. 68822, I also believe to be Mr. Farm's writing—this draft letter, I believe to be in Mr. Farrar's writing—I do not know Hullett's handwriting.

THOMAS HENRY MORRIS (re-examined). I paid a cheque for 200l., drawn by Farrar in favour of Hullett, on 29th August—I have a memorandum of the notes in which it was paid, made by Mr. Blundell, another clerk.

EDWARD BLUNDELL . I paid the notes for this cheque for 200l.—I made an entry in this cash book of the numbers of the notes, they are 72095, 72841, 73413, and 72406; each for 50l.—I can't say to whom I paid them—it was an open cheque, not crossed.

HENRY POTTER . I am clerk in the Albion bank, Princes Street, City—I not this 200l. cheque, drawn by Wright, Gamble & Co., for collection for Mr. Farrar—it was paid, in two 50l. notes and one 100l. note, on 8th July.

The Earl of Dudley being called upon his recognisances, and not appearing, the Court proposed to adjourn the earn to the following day—Mr. Serjeant Ballantine called attention to "Reg. v Parr." 2 Foster and Finlaison, p 541, where an adjournment was refused, after the case had been opened, and an acquittal takenMR. JUSTICE BYLES, however, decided to adjourn the case.

Friday, October 30.

WILLIAM, EARL or DUDLEY. I do not know either of the prisoners—this bill of exchange for 800l. was not accepted by me, or by my authority—I never gave any person authority to accept it—the signature to this agreement is not mine, nor was it signed by my authority—I have never had my negotiation or communication with Hullett in reference to writing the music of an opera—I never heard his name till this case arose.

FARRAR— GUILTY, both of forging and uttering—Judgment respited.


There was another indictment against the prisoners, which was postponed to the next Session.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-941
VerdictGuilty > lesser offence
SentenceMiscellaneous > sureties

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941. PHILIP LUGAR (77) , Feloniously shooting at Ellen Gasner, with intent to do her grievous bodily harm.

MR. PATER conducted the Prosecution; MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.

ELLEN GASNER . I live with my parents, at 3, Haydon Villas, Hounslow—about 4.30, on the afternoon of 9th October, I was in the garden at the back of our house—the prisoner lives next door, at No, 2—I had seen him in his garden about 4.15, and he threw stones at us—Miss Coulet was with me—we had not said or done anything to him—about 4.30, I saw him at his bed-room window, he opened it, lifted up the short muslin blind, and fired a gun at us—we were about nineteen yards from him, at the bottom of the garden—I heard the report, and felt a shot strike me in the temple—I

bled very much, and ran into the house, my mamma was not at home at the time—Dr. Whitmarsh saw me about half an hour afterwards.

Cross-examined. Q. Are you able to say whether it was a gun or a pistol? A. A gun, I think—I have said that I did not know whether it was a gun or a pistol—I did not know which it was at the time.

LUCY COULET . I live at 10, Malvern Villas, Hounslow—on the afternoon of 9th October, I was at 3, Haydon Villas, in the garden, with Ellen Gasner—I saw Mr. Lugar in his garden—he threw stones at us—about half in hour after that I heard a report, and saw smoke coming from his window—I saw Miss Gasner's face bleeding—we had not annoyed the prisoner at all.

SUSANNAH SCOTNEY . I live at Mrs. Gasner's—on the afternoon of 9th October, I heard the report of a gun—I ran into the back room, looked out of the window, and saw smoke coming from Mr. Lugar's bed room window—I had been in the garden previous to that, about 3.45, when the stones were thrown, and I heard him say, "D——little cats!"—I don't know what he meant—he was in his garden at that time—I had never seen a gun in his possession.

WILLIAM MICHAEL WHITMARSH . I am a surgeon, at Hounslow—on 9th October, Miss Gasner was brought to my surgery by her mother—I examined the wound, and found a shot about half an inch from where it had entered, it had traversed along the plate of the bone—I extracted it—I afterwards examined the garden wall—I found six or seven little apertures where shots had entered, in about the position where Miss Gasner said she was standing with her back against the wall—consequently the shot must have entered in front—it was flattened by striking the bone.

Cross-examined. Q. Look at that model (produced) is that correct? A. No, the window is wrongly placed, it should be on the other side—this is the shot I extracted—it is slightly indented—it might have been so indented by striking against a wall, and it might become indented by hitting the bone of the temple—the bone of a child of Miss Gasner's age would not be soft—if the shot was fired point blank it might glance off the bone, it would not of necessity penetrate—if he aimed straight I should expect to find more than one shot penetrate—I should say it was not a rebound.

CHARLES BLAKE (Policeman T 34). On 10th October, I went to Mrs. Gasner's garden, and examined the wall—the spot was pointed out to me where the little girl was standing—this model is not correct—I found shot marks on the bottom wall, rather more than four feet from the ground, and about three yards from the party wall of Mr. Lugar's garden ground—the shots appeared to have scattered—I measured the distance from that spot to Mr. Lugur's window, it was about nineteen yards—I went several times to the prisoner's house before I could get admission—I received this gun from his housekeeper on the Wednesday following—it is not an air gun, it is a common trigger gun—I have tried it since, it is a very good one—it had been recently used, the nipple was quite black—I found four shots on the path on examining the ground.

GUILTY of unlawfully wounding .— To enter into recognizances to appear and receive judgment if called upon.

NEW COURT.—Friday, October 30th, 1868.

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-942
VerdictGuilty > pleaded part guilty

Related Material

942. RICHARD BATES (38) , Feloniously wounding Morris Barrett,with intent to disfigure him. Second Count—With intent to do him some grievous bodily harm.

The Prisoner having stated, in the hearing of the Jury that he was guilty of unlawfully wounding, the Jury found that verdict.

Six Months' Imprisonment.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-943
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > unknown; Not Guilty > unknown

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943. GEORGE BISHOP (29), JOHN PATRICK (55), and JAMES PATRICK (16) , Unlawfully conspiring together that Bishop should steal large quantities of goods, and that John and James Patrick should receive the same, to which BISHOP PLEADED GUILTY .

MESSRS. POLAND and GRAIN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. DALY the Defence.

ALFRD COLUGH . I am in the employ of Hearon and Squires, Whole-sale Druggists, Coleman Street—Bishop was their under warehouseman—About three months ago he gave me a half-dozen-hamper to take to Mr. Carr's, the Norfolk Hotel, about 7 in the evening—it was fastened with string in the regular way—I did not see it packed, and do not know the contents—I took it from the back of the warehouse—drugs are kept in the warehouse, all packed up—I left it with Mr. Carr himself—it was labelled "Mr. Bishop, of Lea Bridge, care of Mr. Carr."

Cross-examined. Q. Are you in the prosecutor's employment still? A. Yes, they did not know that I conveyed that hamper to Mr. Carr; I did not mention to anybody that I had taken it—I thought it was all right.

MR. POLAND. Q. Was it fastened up in the way that drugs ordinarily are? A. Yes.

RICHARD CLOUGH . I am a bottle washer, in the service of Hearon, Squire & Co., and have been in their service about two years—Bishop was the under-warehouseman; I was under his orders, and have been employed by him to carry hampers to various places—the first time was about five or six months ago; that was a one-dozen hamper, but they generally run half-dozen hampers—I only saw one of them packed; it contained a pint bottle, and one square parcel, like a drug box—there were little wooden labels on the hampers; we send all wooden labels out on our hampers—I took the hampers to Mr. Carr, the Norfolk Hotel, Shoreditch, and left them with Mrs. Carr, and sometimes Miss Carr—I cannot say what was on the labels, because I am no scholar—I took hampers there, sometimes once and some-times twice a week during the last five months, and generally on Saturday afternoons—we sometimes close at 3 o'clock, but the porters are generally there till 4, or later. I have also taken hampers to the Great Eastern cloak room—there was writing on the labels, which I could not read—I was in the habit of carrying these hampers to Carr up to the time Bishop was taken—they were not empty hampers, by the weight of them—Bishop was taken on 11th September—I had taken a hamper that evening to the cloak-room, by his direction—I do not know the Patricks.

GEORGE PITTIM . I have been errand boy and porter, in the service of Messrs. Hearon & Co., thirteen months—I was under Bishop's orders—I have taken hampers to the Great Eastern, and to Carr's, opposite to it, and to the Blossoms Inn, Cheapside, and to Wace's—I took hampers to Carr's eight or nine months ago—I have not taken more than one or two there—I gave them to Mr. Carr; they were packed and fastened with a cord, and labelled, "Mr. George Bishop, care of Mr. Carr."

GEORGE SMITH . I am potman to Mr. Carr, who keeps a public-house opposite the Great Eastern Railway Station—I know Bishop by sight—he gave me a hamper about a month before he was taken into custody—it had been left there, and he told me to take it to the old shop, Wheeler Street, Spitalfields, which is about 300 or 400 yards from Mr. Carr's—he said that there was a young man waiting outside to receive it—when I got there, John Patrick was there, with a horse and van—I told him that was the hamper for Mr. Bishop, and helped him put it in the van—about the same date I carried a hamper from Carr's to the Ship—Bishop asked me to do so—I just shoved the door of the Ship open and John Patrick was standing inside—I told him I had a hamper for him for Mr. Bishop—he came outside and I helped him into the cart with it—he gave me a glass of ale and Bishop had given me 4d. to carry the hamper—these hampers were fastened down in the ordinary way—they were not empty.

PHILIP WESTCOTT . I live at 3, King's Bench Walk, Wellington Street, Blackfriars Road—I was formerly waiter and potman to Mr. Carr, of Shoreditch—I have seen Bishop and John Patrick there, but never together—I was there five months and saw Bishop there once a week, generally on Saturdays, and sometimes twice a-week—he has asked me to leave hampers at the Ship Inn, Wheeler Street, to be left till called for, and at the railway station, to be given to the guard to put in his break—I carried them there generally on Saturdays, and occasionally twice a week—they were round hampers, with a wooden label, with Mr. Bishop's name on it—Bishop sometimes gave me 3d., sometimes 4d.—this continued up to the time I left Mr. Carr's three or four months ago—it took place the whole time I was in Mr. Carr's employments.

JACOB CARR . I keep the Norfolk Hotel—I have known Bishop twelve months, John Patrick four months, and James three months—they used my house occasionally—John Patrick has asked me if Mr. Bishop had been there; sometimes he had been and gone, sometimes he came in directly afterwards—he inquired for Mr. Bishop once a week, and generally on Saturdays—Bishop has said, when he came in, "Has anyone been here for me?" but not very often—I do not think he mentioned any name—I have allowed my men to carry those hampers to the Ship when Bishop has not taken them away himself—the labels had on one side, "Squire, Coleman Street, Mr. Bishop, to be left till called for"—I never gave up any hampers to the Patricks—they continued to be left at my house till Bishop was taken, but none came afterwards.

Cross-examined. Q. I suppose parcels are constantly left at your house? A. Yes, daily—I never saw the prisoners together—I do not know that Patrick deals in empties, I know he has a horse and cart—several of the hampers were carried away by Bishop—I did not see any of them opened.

MR. POLAND. Q. Did they appear to be regularly packed? A. Yes, fit to go to foreign parts.

HENRY MARIS . I keep the Ship, Wheeler Street, Spitalfields—I have known Bishop about twelve months, coming backwards and forwards; John Patrick about the same time, and James half that time—hampers were brought to my place once or twice a week, over some months, and I took charge of them—they were regularly packed, with labels on them—sometimes John Patrick fetched them away, and sometimes James—they used to say, "Anything left for me?"—and I said, "There is a basket"—they had a cart or van outside—I have sometimes seen John Patrick and Bishop

together, when the cart was there, and the hampers were taken away—I know they were left for Patrick, because he came in and had something to drink, and said, "There will be a parcel left for me to night," and I let the Patricks have it when they called—I had not had a basket left there for some time before Bishop was taken in custody—when these men were taken I had charge of a hamper which had been there four or five weeks, empty—it was opened in the bar, by Bishop I think, and some poultry and packages like grocery taken out—the hamper was left at my place, as he said it was not worth while taking it away—that was the only one I saw opened.

Cross-examined. Q. Had the one you saw opened just the same appearance outside as the others? A. Yes—I understand the Patricks deal in empties; that is, empty casks, hampers, and bottles.

MR. POLAND. Q. How do you know this? A. I have head it—I do not know where his place of business is—I have heard that he has bought one or two horses and carts.

THOMAS ANGOLD . I am potboy at the Ship—I have seen hampers brought there by Mr. Westcott—I have seen Bishop and John Patrick there in the large compartment—Inspector Russell came to me, and I pointed out James Patrick to him as the boy who used to fetch away hampers—John Patrick came one day and saw the mistress—he said to me, "Did you identify my son?"—I said, "Yes," and that I had been with Russell—he said, "I am going to the station to give myself up."

WILLIAM SMOOTHEY . I am a porter, in the cloak-room of the Great Eastern Railway Station—for some time baskets, like these produced, and smelling of drugs, used to be brought to me for Mr. Bishop, who used to take them away from time to time—all hampers kept in a druggists' warehouse would smell of drugs.

JOSEPH RUSSELL (Police Inspector A). I am employed at the Great Eastern Station—on 11th September, about 8.30 p.m., I saw Bishop leave the station in a Hansom's cab—he had a hamper with him—I did not know him before—I followed him in another cab, to 3, Selby Street, Waterloo New Town, Bethnal Green, where the cab stopped—it is a dark corner—Patrick lives there—Bishop got out there—as I got to the door, I heard a female say, "Mr. Patrick has just gone out"—I remained at the tail of the cab till Bishop returned—he had got the hamper between his legs—I went up and put my foot upon it, and he jumped out of the cab—I had a conversation with him, and took possession of the hamper, and took him in custody—the hamper was labelled "G. E. R., Mr. Bishop, Lea Bridge"—he lived down the line—it was opened, and contained two tin cases, labelled "Quinine," which are in it now—in consequence of what Bishop said, I made inquiries about John Patrick on Sunday, but could hear nothing about him—I left someone to watch his house, and went there myself on Monday, but could not find him—it is a private house, a six-roomed cottage; there is no trade carried on there—I searched, and found this large bottle, and this brown paper bag in a small shed at the back of his house—on the Tuesday morning, I found this letter (produced) in my letter box at the Great Eastern Railway, in consequence of which I went to John Patrick's house, but could not find him—I found James Patrick at his father's stables—he keeps a light cart and a van—I said, "Patrick, I want you for being concerned with a man named Bishop, in receiving a quantity of drugs—you took the drugs away from the Ship public-house, Wheeler Street, Spitalfields, in hampers"—he turned very pale, and was unable to speak for a

minute, and then he said, "I never was at the Ship in my life"—I took him in custody; the charge was read over to him, and he made no reply—between 2 and 3 on the same afternoon, I saw John Patrick coming out of Worship Street Police Court, I said "Halloa, Patrick,"—he stopped, as if startled—I knew him well by sight, and by name, and he knew me—I said, "I want you for being concerned with a man named Bishop, and another, in stealing a very large quantity of drugs; you must consider yourself in my custody, and go with me to the police station"—he said, "I never had any dealings with Bishop in my life"—on the way to the station, he said, "You have got my son"—I said, "Yes, I have"—he said, "What he done was by my instructions"—on the way to Guildhall, he asked me what I had done with his son—I told him he was remanded till Thursday next—he said "What did you take him for, poor little fellow; what he done, he was obliged to do; he knew nothing at all about it"—I showed him the letter—he said that he left it in the letter box last night for me—that would be Monday night—it is in pencil—(Read: "Mr. Russell Sir. When I came to-night, I am imformed you have been to see me respecting Mr. Bishop coming to my house on Friday night. I can explain what he came for, and will be home to morrow morning at 10 o'clock, or will call. Yours respectfully, J. Patrick. It was respecting, I believe, a horse I had for sale; anything else I know nothing about")—I afterwards got this empty hamper from the Ship—this brown paper was wrapped round the cases of quinine.

GORGE BROOKS . I am bottle washer in the prisoner's, service, and my wife and I make brown paper bags for the firm—I have no doubt that this it one of our bags—we fold them, cut them, and paste them.

Cross-examined. Q. Just look at this bag (another) and tell me if that is one of your make? A. No, but it is very like it—they are used in the trade a great deal.

WILLIAM SQUIRE . I am a member of the firm of Hearon, Squire & Co., wholesale druggists—Bishop has been in our service about fourteen years, and had our entire confidence until this occurred; we had not the slightest suspicion of him—I knew he was living at the Lea Bridge Station, Great Eastern Railway—the boys were under his orders—I never saw the Patricks—I was not aware that Bishop was sending away hampers once or twice a week from our premises, to public-houses or to the railway cloak room, to be called for—I have examined the hampers taken from Bishop by Russell—they contain two cases of quinine, which are worth 10l.—it is one of our hampers, which are made for us—I cannot swear to this bottle, but it is a drug bottle, and is exactly similar to ours—the bag found at Patrick's is exactly similar to ours—I have no doubt of it—the empty hamper left at the Ship is one of ours—I know it because it has been used before, and here is the place where it has been lifted up, and a paper placed underneath for the direction, which has since been torn off, and here is a little piece of the paper left; besides that, the hamper is similar in every respect to ours—since the prisoners were taken in custody, we have taken stock, and miss between 500l. and 600l. worth of drugs, and that is only since June—we miss quinine, opium, saffron, and other things.

Cross-examined. Q. Are these hampers the same as are used in the trade generally? A. Yes—the mode of labelling is not an invention of ours, but it is our practice—Bishop would know that they were labelled in that way—I had not to search for the piece of paper, it is visible—any hamper used in our house the paper might stick in—I do not know the practice of other

houses—I have never seen cases of quinine of such dimensions as these—this quinine was sent to us by Bolinger & Sons, of Stutgardt, it is packed in this sized cases by our order—one of these paper bags is ours, the other is not, but the maker would know better than me.

MR. POLAND. Q. Just look at this paper (wrapped round the cans), has that seal your initials on it? A. No, this is the seal of the maker of whom we buy—I find a wooden label on the hamper, out of which the quinine was taken—it has on it "G. E., Cloak-room, Mr. Bishop, London Bridge."

JOHN APPLEKBY . I formerly kept the Greyhound public-house, Lea Bridge—I left it about the middle of May—I know that Bishop was living at Lea Bridge—he used to frequent my public-house, and so did the elder Patrick—I have seen them together there perhaps twenty times, talking and drinking at the bar.

Cross-examined. Q. I suppose they were there then like other customers? A. Yes.

JOHN PATRICK— GUILTY Two Years' Imprisonment .


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-944
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Not Guilty > no evidence
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

944. JAMES PATRICK was again indicted, with GEORGE BISHOP , for stealing a hamper and 2 ozs. of sulphate of quinine, also a hamper and 15 lbs. of opium, to both which BISHOP PLESDED GUILTY Seven Years' Penal Servitude . MR. POLAND offered no evidence against PATRICK—. NOT GUILTY

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-945
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty; Guilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude; Imprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

945. GEORGE SIMMS (17), and JOHN KEEFE (19) , Stealing a purse and 2l. 3s. 6d. of Charles Ambler, from the person of Eliza Ambler, to which KEEFE PLEADED GUILTY **— Ten Years' Penal Servitude .

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COLLINS defended SIMMS.

WILLIAM MOORE . I am a lighterman, of 394, Rotherhithe Wall—on 14th September, about 5.45 in the evening I was coming down the steps of London Bridge into Thames Street, and saw Keefe, in a stooping position, behind a lady who was going up the steps—he had his hand in her pocket—I took hold of him on the front landing-place, and called out to the lady—Simms then rushed in behind Keefe, who passed what appeared to be a purse to Simms—I took him with my left hand, and he flung something behind him down the step—I held them both till an officer came.

Cross-examined. Q. Were there a good many people coming up the steps? A. Yes, they all stopped to look—I had Keefe against the wall, and Simms passed behind him, which was rather difficult.

Keefe. I pitched the purse away. Witness. You did not chuck anything away—I was close to you both—I am positive you passed something to Simms—I had hold of your collar—your hands were free.

ELIZA AMBLER . I am the wife of Charles Ambler, who keeps the Post Office, Deptford—on 14th September I was coming up the steps of London Bridge—Moore spoke to me, and I missed my purse, which contained a sum of 21/2 sovereigns, 3s. 6d. in silver, and a small gold brooch—I saw Moore holding the purse—my brother soon afterwards gave me back my purse—the 21/2 sovereigns were gone—there it is.

RICHARD GIBBS . I am a grocer's assistant, of 9, Church Yard Road, Newington—I was with my sister, Mrs. Ambler, and I heard money fall on

the pavement directly after Moore spoke—the purse was picked up, and I gave it to my sister—two half sovereigns were deficient.

NOAH ANDREWS (City Policeman 742). I saw Moore holding the prisoners, and took Keefe—Simms denied the charge at the station—the purse was handed to me.

Cross-examined. Q. Did Simms give a correct address? A. es.

MAURICE WALSH (City Policeman 730). I received Simms in custody—he said that he was innocent—on the way to the station he said "Keefe handed me the purse and I threw it away; I would have nothing to do with it."

DAVID ISTED (Policeman H 77). I know the prisoners well, I have seen them together every night in Shoreditch.

SIMMS— GUILTY . He was further charged with having been before convicted at Clerkenwell, in August, 1867, to which he PLEADED GUILTY.**— Seven Years' Penal Servitude .

THIRD COURT—Friday, October 30th, 1868.

Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-946
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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946. DANIEL TUKEY (18), and JOHN FITZGERALD (17) , Robbery, with violence, on Hannah Wickes, and stealing part of a chain, her property.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution.

HANNAH WICKES . I am the wife of Henry Wickes, and live at 4, George Street, Hackney—on the 9th October I was walking with a friend, Mrs. Jacobs, in Osborn Street, Whitechapel—Tukey came up and pushed her on one side—he then punched me in the chest and snatched my chain, it broke, and he took only a part of it—Fitzgerald was standing by at the time—they both ran away together—it was a gold chain, and worth 2l. 7s. 6d.—I went to the station, and shortly after I saw them both in custody—I am sure they are the men—they were put with other men and I picked them out—Tukey had no jacket on—I saw his face and can swear to him.

SARAH JACOBS . I live at 16th Cabet's Court—I was with Mrs. Wickes on this evening—I saw the prisoners come up—Tukey pushed me on one side and made a snatch at Mrs. Wickes' chain—he took part of it and then they ran away together—we went to the station and I afterwards saw them in custody—they were put with other persons, and I picked them out.

HENRY FORDHAM (Policeman H 157). I received information from the two witnesses, in consequence of which I went to change my clothes—as I was going home I saw the two prisoners, and they ran away from me, I then went to Flower and Dean Street—the two prisoners came up to me and said, "Will you go and have something to drink?"—"I said "Yes"—I sent them over to the Bell, where I took them into custody—I charged them on suspicion for stealing a piece of chain—Tukey said he did not know anything about it—I took them to the station—they were placed amongst several men—Mrs. Wickes walked up to Tukey and said, "That is one of them, and that is the other" (pointing to Fitzgerald)—I found three pairs of new stockings on Tukey, and 1s. 10d. on Fitzgerald.

Witness for the Defence.

WILLIAM FISHER . On Friday evening the 9th of October, I met the prisoners about 7 o'clock, we went into a public-house and had two pots of beer—there were three of us to drink it—we then Went to Church Street—in Preston Street we met the constable—Tukey and the other one said something to him, but what it was I don't know—they went into a public-house—the prisoners did not run away from the constable.

Cross-examined. Q. What time was this? A. Near about 7—this was about half a mile from Osborn Street.

Tukey. Had I a coat or waistcoat on? Witness. No—we met the policeman and said, "Good evening, young man, will you have a glass of ale?" and he said he would.

Tukcy's Defence. I did not try to get away. The policeman took us to the station, and he would not tell us what for. I slept all night in the cell, without my coat and waistcoat.

GUILTY .— Twelve Months' Imprisonment each .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-947
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

947. CHARLES HUGHES (23), and WILLIAM MURRAY (22) , Robbery, with violence, on Jonathan Birch, and stealing 14s., his money.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. WARNER SLEIGH the Defence.

JONATHAN BIRCH . I live at Iver Heath, near Uxbridge—on Saturday, 3rd October, a few minutes before 2 o'clock, I was in the Dolphin public-house with the two prisoners—they left about five minutes before I did—when I came out, I proceeded on my way home—I stood talking to a man for a few minutes—when I got to the canal bridge, I met the two prisoners—Hughes said he would round on me, when I was in the public-house, because I would not treat them—Hughes said, "Here is the one, we will let him know the reason why he did not treat us"—Hughes hit me on the face and mouth, and on the temple, with his fist; it knocked me down on the ground—Murray put his hand in my left-hand coat pocket, and took all the money I had; that was 14s.—they then jumped up and ran away—I got up, and went home as hard as I could—I went to Uxbridge next morning, and gave information—the prisoners were taken into custody on Monday—I am sure they are the two who struck me—they had been in the Castle, at Uxbridge, with me the same evening; I treated them there—I changed a half-sovereign there.

Cross-examined. Q. You were not sober, were you? A. No; I was not sober when I went to the Castle—there was a woman there, in the tap room—the prisoners said they were going my way home—I said I would treat them, and they went with me to the Dolphin—I staggered down two or three times in the tap-room; I did not fall—the prisoners met me at the canal bridge, as if they were coming from Iver Heath—I remember meeting a man named Russell—he was coming from Iver to Uxbridge—I had been robbed then—I did not tell him so—I was going from one side of the road to the other—the man said he could not stop to talk to me, he must go on to his work—I saw Hughes come out of his own house on the Sunday, and Murray came up at the same time—I won't swear that when Mason asked me if I could identify them as the men who robbed me, I said I did not think I could, as I was not quite sure of the men—I did not like to say anything about it then, because I was afraid my master would discharge

me—I told the constable that I would not charge anyone till I had spoken to my master; and after that I told the constable they were the two men—that was on the Monday night—I gave the prisoners into custody, and then said I could identify them.

WILLIAM MASON (Policeman A R 413). The prosecutor came to the station on Sunday morning, and made a statement to me—his eye was black, and his lip swollen up—in consequence of that description, I apprehended the prisoners on the Monday morning—the prosecutor saw them on Sunday, and said he could not identify them—he said he was afraid of his master dismissing him for being out so late at night—he saw the prisoners when they were in custody, and said they were the men—on the Sunday I asked Birch if he could identify Hughes, and he said, "I cannot; I don't think I can"—he also said he could not identify Murray.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-948
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

948. THOMAS BEVAN (23) , Stealing a horse and cart, and one set of harness, five dead pigs, and 11 lbs. of beef, of John Kern.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. LEIGH the Defence.

JOHN BACH . I live at 37, Fashion Street, Spitalfields, and I mind carts in Newgate Market—on Saturday, 1st August, I had a horse and cart in charge, belonging to Mr. John Kern, butcher, of Lower Road, Deptford—he came to Newgate Street about 6.20 in the morning—some meat was put into the cart; there were five pigs, a quantity of beef, and some suet—the prisoner came up to me about 8 o'clock, and asked if I had seen his governor—I said "Who are you?"—he said "Kern"—I said I had not seen his governor lately—I went away, and came back in four or five minutes—the prisoner was still there; he was taking the nose-bag off the horse's head; he called me and said, "Here is the penny, tell the governor I have gone on steady"—he gave me a penny for minding it—he got up into the cart, and drove away, meat and all—I am sure the prisoner is the man—I saw him afterwards at the Kennington Lane Police Station, and picked him out from a number of other men directly I saw him.

Cross-examined. Q. Had he been pointed out to you before? A. No—I had not seen him before—this case was not heard before the Magistrate, and the prisoner discharged—that was another case, on the other side of the water.

JOHN KERN . I am a butcher, at 184, Lower Road, Deptford—on Saturday, 1st August, I brought my horse and cart up to Newgate Market, and left it in charge of the last witness—there was some meat put in the cart; five pigs, a quarter of beef, and some suet—I did not see the prisoner—I never authorized him to take the cart away—I missed it, and afterwards found it at Smithfield Police Station, the same afternoon—the meat and the nose-bag, scat and whip, were gone; there was only the empty cart—the value of the horse, and cart, and meat together, would be about 24l.

Cross-examined. Q. The cart was not found in the prisoner's possession, as far as you know? A. No.

GUILTY . FREDERICK GREENFIELD , 17L, ated that several carts had been stolen before this, and since the prisoner had been in custody not one had been missed. There was another indictment against the prisoner. Five Years' Penal Servitude.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-949
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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949. CHARLES HAINES (21) , Feloniously wounding James Steer upon the high seas, with intent to do him grievous bodily harm.

MR. GOUGH conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COLLINS the Defence.

JAMES STEER . I am chief officer of the Alice Graham—I was on board that ship on the 29th June last—the prisoner was a seaman on board—I was in the cabin between 12 and 1 on the 29th June—the captain called the prisoner for the purpose of having the official log read over to him—the prisoner came into the cabin—I told him to take his cap off and stand outside the door; he did so—the master then came out—I did not see anything in his hand at that time—the prisoner and the master had some high words between them; the master pushed him into the fore cabin—I then saw that he had a stick in his hand—I saw a knife in the prisoner's hand, and he made two thrusts at the captain with it—I was at the table, writing; I said, "Look out, sir; he has got a knife"—the captain then rushed away from him—I went to get the knife from the prisoner—he thrust it at me, and it went through the fleshy part of my arm—I can't say what became of the knife afterwards; I believe it was pitched overboard—I saw the knife—I had not said anything to him before—I struck him after.

Cross-examined. Q. Did the captain strike him with the stick? A. I did not see him—the first thing I saw was the master shoving him out, to put him in the cabin—when I told the prisoner to take his cap off—I did not knock it off—I did not rise from the table—the master had a stick in his hand—I did not see him strike the prisoner at that time—I won't swear that he did not—I saw them struggling together, and went to separate them—the knife went into the upper part of the arm—I struck the prisoner after ho had done it—I did not see the captain knock him down on the floor and jump upon him—the prisoner was not chained to the foremast for three months afterwards—he was chained, but I forget the number of days—he was chained to the mizen mast in the fore cabin—I don't know for how long—he had no bed—it might have been fifty-one days, or a day more, I can't say—we did not let him loose ten minutes in the morning, and ten minutes in the evening—he had forty minutes if he liked, after we got not afraid of him—he was very quiet in his conduct—he was chained with a small dog chain, round the waist—it might have slipped up under his arm, and left the marks that are there now—we kept him in irons 101 days—all the voyage—I know that all the men were so disgusted that they subscribed funds for his defence—not with me—he was allowed what liberty be liked on the voyage—he used to put the irons on himself—I mean to say that—it was a good, quiet crew—I never ill-used anyone in my life—I never struck the prisoner down to the deck—I struck him with my fist when he stabbed me—the chain was long enough to allow him to lie down—I never went and grinned at him when he was chained—he used to lie on his back—I saw him lying down, day after day.

MR. GOUGH. Q. You were not in command of the vessel? A. No—the captain commanded—I never struck the prisoner, except on that one occasion.

DAVID OWEN JONES . I was second officer on board the Alice Graham—on 29th June, I made a statement to the captain—the prisoner was not present.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you see the captain beating the prisoner with a stick? A. I did—we protected the prisoner from further violence.

DANIEL ROSS . I am Divisional Surgeon of Police—I examined the prosecutor's arm, and found the remains of a wound on the lower part of the right arm, about an inch and a half in extent—it was not dangerous—a knife would have inflicted such a wound.

WILLIAM COLLEY (Thames Policeman 74). I apprehended the prisoner on the 8th October—the mate charged him in my presence—the prisoner said, "I am sorry I did it, but there is a great deal in the log which is untrue"—the captain is not here—he went away on the 20th.

The captain was called on his recognizances, but did not answer. MR. COLLINS submitted that there was no case, as the ship was not alleged to have been a British ship. THE COURT considered that as it was not proved that the vessel was a British ship, no jurisdiction was established, and directed the Jury to find a verdict of NOT GUILTY .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-950
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

950. JESSE GODLEMAN (16) , Stealing a whip, the property of Frederick Spicer.

MR. LEIGH conducted the Prosecution; and MR. STARLING the Defence.

FREDERICK SPICER . I am a hay dealer, at Langley, Bucks—on Saturday night, 17th October, I was going home from London, with my horse and cart, about 11 o'clock—I had a new whip, in a nose bag behind the cart—I was riding in the cart—I saw the prisoner come out of a stable across the road—he snatched the whip from the nose bag, and ran to his own door, and shut the door—I followed, but the door was shut—I stopped a little while, and heard the back door go—I am sure it was the prisoner took the whip—I went for a constable, and went back to the house with him—he went up stairs, and brought the brother down out of bed—I said he was not the one—he went up again and brought the prisoner down, and I said, "That is the right one"—I asked him what he had done with the whip, and he made no answer—it was worth about 6s.—I was quite sober, I only had a cup of tea all the way from Paddington—a piece of the whip-cord was twisted round my finger, and I felt it go.

Cross-examined. Q. On which side of the road was the prisoner's house? A. The-right hand side—the whip was in the nose bag at the other side of the cart—the prisoner came round in front of the horse, and then ran back to the place where he came from—there were no lamps in the road—it was not very dark—the whip was found at the back of the premises—I knew the boy before—I had no quarrel with him—there was a light in the stable where I came from—when I went into the house he was in bed.

THOMAS CHANNER . I was with my master on the 17th October, coming from London—I had the care of a horse and cart—I was in front of my master, about five or six yards—I heard him call out, "Stop, young Godleman has taken my whip out of the nose bag"—I saw the prisoner running away—he was about twenty-five yards from me—we went across to the door where he went in—it is a house at the side of the rood—the whip was found at the back of the house—I have been in the habit of seeing the prisoner—I have been on the road four years, and knew where he lived.

Cross-examined. Q. You were at the back of the cart? A. Yes; at the top—I was looking towards the horses—I did not see the prisoner till my master called out, and then I saw him run across, and shut the door—you have to go through the house to get to the field behind.

DANIEL KNIGHT (Policeman X 295). I met the prosecutor, walking by

the side of his cart, on this night—he spoke to me about a whip, and I went with him to the prisoner's house—his father and mother were at the gate—they said the prisoner had been in bed since 9.30—I went up and brought down George Godleman—the prosecutor said he was not the one—I then fetched the prisoner, and he said that is the one that stole the whip—the prisoner said he knew nothing about it—I searched the house, but could not find it—it was found afterwards, at the back of the house, by Richard Lovell.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-951
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

951. JOHN HOPKINSON (26) , Feloniously wounding Patrick Allen, with intent to do him grievous bodily harm.

MR. LEIGH conducted the Prosecution; and MR. HARRIS the Defence.

PATRICK ALLENN . I live at 8, Boar's Head Yard, Whitechapel Road—on 26th September, between 12 and 1 o'clock, I was coming home with my brother from the Pavilion Theatre—I was very drunk—I did not know I was stabbed—I don't know who did it—I was taken to the hospital, but I do not know how I got there.

JOHN ALLEN . I am the brother of the last witness—I had been drinking with him on this Saturday night—I had a great deal to drink—I knew what I was about—he was going along in front of me—I saw the prisoner draw his hand away from my brother—he called out, "I am stabbed"—I said, "No you are not"—my brother then fell down, and I saw blood coming from him—I ran to the prisoner, and saw him put his hand in his right pocket—I gave him in charge—I did not hear him say anything.

Cross-examined. Q. Were you drunk when you gave your evidence before the Magistrate? A. No—I had some beer; I was drunk—the Magistrate reprimanded me for giving two different accounts—I did not swear to the prisoner—I did not know what I was saying—I don't recollect a word of what I said then—I was not so drunk as my brother on this night—there were several persons round.

JAMES CONNOR (Policeman. H 35). I saw a crowd, and went up—I saw the prosecutor running about, holding his arm, and he dropped down on the footway—the last witness had the prisoner by the collar, and ho was given into my custody for stabbing his brother—the prisoner said, "They tried to mobilize us"—that was the answer he gave—the prosecutor was very drunk—he was taken to the hospital—his brother was excited—I would not say that he was drunk—he could walk straight—there was blood on the prisoner's right hand.

RIBERT SHEFFIELD . I am house surgeon at the London Hospital—about 1 o'clock on the morning, of 26th September, the prosecutor was brought there—he had a wound on the arm—it was a dangerous wound—he was faint from loss of blood.

COURT to JAMES CONOR. Q. Did you look for the knife? A. Yes, I could not find one—I searched the prisoner—there was no blood on his right-hand pocket—I examined it carefully.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-952
VerdictGuilty > unknown

Related Material

952. SAMUEL COUSINS (24), and JEREMIAH SULLIVAN (17) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Albert Neumegen, and stealing a teapot, five coats, and other articles, his property.

MR. WOOD conducted the Prosecution.

GEORGE COTTERELL (Policeman T 322). About 11.15 on the night of

9th October, I was in Oxford Road, Chiswick, near Beaufort House—I saw a light in the house—I went round to the back and found the water-closet window taken out, and a ladder placed against the window sill—I waited there twenty minutes or half an hour—a man came by and I asked him to ring the front-door bell—the prisoner Sullivan then put his head out of the window, and I told him to come out, I was waiting for him—he then put his head back—I sprung my rattle—another constable came up—I had a pistol, and said I would shoot them if they tried to get away—they then came to the front-door and gave themselves up—I searched them at the station—Cousins had this set of studs in his left-hand coat pocket—I found all this property (produced) in the front bed-room, where I saw the light—there were five coats, two pairs of trousers, and other things, lying about the room—the drawers were broken open and the things taken out—Cousins was in his shirt sleeves—his coat was in a building close by—I saw Sullivan three times at the back window.

LUKE MARSH (Policeman T 35). I examined the house, about 12.30 on this night, after the robbery—the water-closet window was forced completely out—I found this poker in the front bed-room—the chests of drawers had been forced open—the poker was on the floor, in the middle of the room—there were matches on the drawers and also on the window.

ALBERT NEUMEGEN . I am the owner of Beaufort House—I live there, but had been stopping away for a time—I had been to the house a few days previously, it was safe then—this poker was left in a room down stairs; it had no business in the bed-room—the house was shut up—all these things produced belong to me; the studs as well—they were put away in a drawer, which was broken open—I found the clothes I had left in the drawers, on the bed and all over the room.

GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment Each .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-953
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

Related Material

953. JAMES READMAN (26) , Unlawfully assaulting Elizabeth Readman, and occasioning her actual bodily harm. (See 11th Sessions, page 439).

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.

ELIZABETH READMAN . I am the prisoner's wife—he is a horse-keeper, at 21, Bell Street, Marylebone—on the evening of the 7th September I went out with a female friend—I returned home a few minutes before 10—my husband had not come home then—he had gone out with all the little money that I had—I went to bed—he came home about 2.30—I was lying down—he kicked me two or three times—I got up and he knocked me down several times—he went across the room and got the poker, and I ran under the table—he knocked the table to pieces over my head—he then went to the mantelpiece and struck down everything that was there—I rushed to the door—he ran after me and brought me back, and put me outside the window—the window is 25 feet from the ground—I held on round his neck, by his collar—I screamed "Murder!" and the witness Oliver came to my assistance—he lodges in the first floor front—I was bruised very much—my arms and legs were black.

Gross-examined. Q. Your husband was tried last sessions and acquitted of attempting to murder you? A. Yes—he is always on to me about going with other men—I never went to the window myself—I said if he

did not leave me alone I must get out of the window, or somewhere—I rushed to the door and he brought me back—he had been striking and kicking me before that—I did not bleed.

ALFRED OLIVER . I am a labourer, and lodge in the next room to the prisoner and his wife—I heard the prisoner come home on the morning of the 8th September, about 2.15—he began using dreadful language to his wife—he then began knocking the things about—the landlady was going to fetch a policeman, but I persuaded her not to—I asked the prisoner to keep quiet, and he said he would smash me if I did not go out of the room—I went out and he began his violence again—I heard the window go up, and I heard screams of "Murder!"—I put on my trousers and went and burst the door open—I found the prisoner's wife half out of window—she was in a sitting position—she had hold of his collar—he said he would stab the first b——man that entered his room—he left go of her, and came towards me—I fought in my own defence—I struck him in the face with my fist—he got me down—I called out for assistance, and they came and pulled him off—he had me by the throat—I got my foot hurt in the struggle.

Cross-examined. Q. You struck him before he struck you? A. Yes, I did, in my own defence.

DAVIED WEST (Policeman D 160). I heard screams of "Murder!" from 21, Bell Street—I went up stairs to the first floor and met the prosecutrix, who said she would give her husband in charge for attempting to murder her—he was close to the door—I told him he would have to go to the station, and he said, "I will stab the first b——man that comes into the room"—I got the assistance of another constable and broke open the door—the prisoner was in the middle of the room with the poker in his hand—the furniture was broken to pieces and covered with blood—I struck him with my truncheon, and he said he would go quiet.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you strike him in the eye? A. I may have done so—his wife was not bleeding at all—the blood was from Oliver's foot.

CHARLES KIRBY . I am Divisional Surgeon to the Police—I examined the prosecutrix on this morning, and also Oliver—he was bleeding from a wound in the foot—I found four or five severe bruises on the woman's legs and arms.

Cross-examined. Q. Could they have been done by a person kicking the furniture? A. I should think they were done with a stick, or something of that sort—the wound on Oliver's foot was probably caused by a piece of broken crockery.

GUILTY Five Years' Penal Servitude .


Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-954
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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954. GEORGE JONES (22) , Unlawfully uttering counterfeit coin.

MR. WALFORD conducted the Prosecution.

ELIZABETH HALES . I am servant to Augustus Harris, who keeps the Prince Alfred, West Ham—on 29th September the prisoner came in, about 11.45, with two men named Stamp and Morton Dick—they asked for a pot of half-and-half, and Stamp gave me a florin—Morton Dick afterwards gave me a florin and had some drink, and I gave him the change—my master was out—about 3.30 the prisoner came in alone for a pot of 4d. ale, and

gave me a florin—he said, "Have any of my mates been in here and left a shovel?"—I said, "There has been one here, but master would not let him have any beer, and put him out because he made a noise—he left, and came again about 6.30 with Jim Stamp—they called for a pint of 4d. ale, and the prisoner gave me 1s.—I asked my master for two sixpences for a shilling, and put the shilling into the private till, where I had put the three florins—these are the coins (produced).

AUGUSTUS HARRIS . I keep the Prince Alfred—on 29th September, I left the house entirely in the charge of the last witness—I returned about 3 o'clock in the afternoon, and between 3 and 4 o'clock the prisoner came in with Stamp—I heard him ask for a pint of 4d. ale, and inquire if his mates had left a shovel there—he came again, about 6.30, with Stamp, who was intoxicated—the prisoner said, "I do not think he wants anything, governor, to-night"—I said, "No," but afterwards said, "You had better let them have a pint, for they will drink it and go"—I saw the prisoner give the shilling—I afterwards went out, and saw the prisoner given in custody—I then went home, and found that the florins and the shilling were bad—I marked them at the station.

RICHARD ROBERTS . I assist my father, who keeps a beer-shop, at West Ham—the prisoner came there between 3 and 4 o'clock for a pot of half-and-half, and gave me 1s.—I looked at it, but did not think it was bad—I afterwards showed it to the mistress—I gave him his change, and he left in about a quarter of an hour—this is the 1s. (produced)—my mistress told me to put it on one side, and I threw it to the back of the till.

MATILDA ROBERTS . I am the wife of Richard Roberts, who keeps this beer-shop—on 29th September, the prisoner came, about 3 o'clock in the afternoon, and again after 8 o'clock in the evening—he asked for a pint of sixpenny ale, and gave me 1s.—it jinked very well, but I put it in the tester in the afternoon, and when the prisoner came in I said, "This is the second bad shilling you have given here to-day; you gave one to my son this afternoon"—I bent it double, and threw it to him—he gave it to his companion, who threw it out at the door—I said, "Have you any more bad money about you? let me look in your pocket"—he put his money on the counter—he had three sixpences and some halfpence—I took some of the halfpence for the 1s., and gave him in custody.

Prisoner. I was not aware I had a bad shilling.

EDWARD HALES (Policeman K 224). I took the prisoner at Mr. Roberts', and received this 1s., also three florins and 1s. from Mr. Harris.

WILLIAM WEBSTER . These three florins are bad, and from one mould; and these two shillings are bad, and from one mould.

GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment .

Before Mr. Justice Lush.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-955
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

Related Material

955. DANIEL STOBIE (28), was indicted for feloniously killing and slaying Henry Hurley. He was also charged on the Coroner's Inquisition with the like offence.

MESSRS. DALY and GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COOPER the Defence.

SAMUEL ANGUS . I am a mason, and live at Freemason's Hotel, Ilford—on 24th August, about 8 o'clock in the evening, in Wellington Road, Forest Gate, I saw three men running after two others—one of the men

said, "We want you, and will have you"—one of the three men made a blow at Hurley, the deceased, with his fist, but missed him—Hurley was one of the two man who were running away—Stobie then went up to Hurley, took him by the shoulders, slew him round with his left hand, and hit him in the face with his right—I have no doubt whatever that the prisoner was the man—the deceased man fell on the ground from the force of the blow, and that cracked his skull—the prisoner struck him while he was on the ground in the face with his fist—I prevented the prisoner from hitting him again—he fell very heavily on the ground—my wife was with me—she prevented the prisoner from striking, and received a blow on her arm—the two men who were with the prisoner attacked the two men as well—the prisoner and his two companions went towards the Golden Horse public-house—the prisoner came back about five minutes after to where Hurley was lying in the road—he looked at him, and went away again—he came back the second time, and said, "I have given the b——something"—I said, "Yes, you have cracked his skull, perhaps you will lend me a hand to put him on the path"—he did not assist me—a man named Hall did—I then left, and the prisoner walked with me up the Wellington Road to my own house—he bid me "Good night" and went up the road—he did not speak about this Affair—all he said was, "If I were you I should not have anything to do with it"—and I said, "I sha'n't get into trouble if I do"—I think Hurley had been drinking—he was quite insensible—he never got his senses no more.

Cross-examined. Q. What time was this? A. About 8 o'clock—the prisoner had a black coat on—I thought he had light trousers, but I must have been mistaken—I did say he had light trousers, but I think now he had black—I did not see him again till I identified him at Guildford, ten or twelve days after—I was close to the prisoner when he struck the blow—the man fell against my feet.

ELLEN ANGUS . I am the wife of the last witness—I was with him on 24th August, about 8 o'clock—I saw two men running along the Wellington Road, and two or three after them—the first one struck the deceased, and knocked him down, and when he was down he hit him again in the face—the prisoner is very much like the man, but I can't swear to him—I prevented him from striking the deceased again—I was struck myself on the arm—I was looking to the man on the ground, and did not notice the other one—I called the man a coward for hitting him when he was down—he spoke to me—I could not say that he was the man, but I think he was.

MR. GRIFFITHS sated that Angus was the only witness who identified the prisoner, and that all the other witnesses swore positively that he was not the man. THE COURT, upon that, said that no Jury could convict upon such circumstances.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-956
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

Related Material

956. MARY REED (30) , indicted for unlawfully endeavouring to conceal the birth of her child.

REV. GEORGE KEOGH . I am vicar of St. Paul's, Stratford—at 8 o'clock on the 28th September, I went into my front yard, and there found a parcel which contained the dead body of a child.

JOHN HORN (Police Constable K R 75). I went to Mr. Keogh's house on the morning of the 28th, and there got a parcel, which I opened—it contained the dead body of a female child—it was wrapped in calico and brown holland—I took it to the station.

THOMAS WILLIAM WRIGGLESTON . On 29th September, I saw the

prisoner at the police station—I asked to examine her—she said if the policemen went out of the room, and I did not examine her, she would tell me all about it—the policeman went out, and she said the child which had been found was her child—she did not wish to do it any injury, and she did not hurt it—she did not know she was so near her time, or she would have gone into the workhouse—she also said she had carried it about in a carpet bag for a day or two, and had then put it in the front of Mr. Keogh's railings.

GUILTY Judgment respited.—


Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-957
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

Related Material

957. WALTER GUNNELL (26), HENRY BALL (43), and WILLIAM ELSON (27) , Stealing forty drain pipes, the property of Henry Doulton, and others. In another Count, Ball and Elson were charged with receiving the same.

MESSRS. METCALFE and STRAIGHT conducted the Prosecution; and MR. LILEY defended Gunnell and Ball, and MR. WARNER SLEIGH defended Elson.

FREDERICK GREENFIELD (Police Sergeant L 17). I had instructions to watch the premises of Ball, who occupies a stable in Lambeth Mews—on 30th September, about 8.30, I saw a van, belonging to Ball, being loaded with drain pipes—it was backed up to his stable—Ball and a man named Savage were loading—after it was loaded it was carefully covered over with sacks and tarpaulin, and the canvas fastened down—I could not then see what was in the van—the van was then driven along Lambeth Walk to the premises of Elson, in Park Place—Elson put his head out of window, and said something I could not hear—the van was then backed up to his yard—Elson came down to the door, and joined Ball and Savage, and I went away for assistance—Elson is a small jobbing builder, and occupies a small yard with two or three sheds in it—in about half an hour I returned with another constable, and then we found Ball had gone away with the horse—I went into Elson's premises, and saw Savage standing there—I told him I should take him into custody for being concerned in stealing a load of pipes that stood outside—he said he had been employed to do a day's work by Ball, and that he knew nothing about the pipes—this was in Elson's presence—he further said that on the previous evening he had accompanied Ball to Astley's Theatre, and while there he saw Elson, and Ball and Elson went away together, and had some conversation—on going home, Ball told him he had a job he wanted to do in the morning, and he (Savage) might just as well come and help him—he also said that Ball had then gone away to get a van to do a moving job—I then said to Elson, "It is very strange that these pipes should be backed up to your yard; how do you account for it?"—he said, "They are not for me; he has left them here while he goes to get another van; you know me, Mr. Greenfield, I have got no money to buy pipes"—I said, "It seems strange that they should be on your premises"—he then said, "I will give you the straight tip; Ball has always been bothering me to buy pipes and jars, and to sell them for him; I took two jars to Munn's, in Carlisle Lane, and he said he had got a lot more; he never gave me the list of how many, or what

price they were to be"—I said, "We will go and we"—I left Savage in charge of the other constables, and went with Elson to Munn's, and there we found two jars, which Elson had taken for disposal—we then took them to the station—after that I searched Elson's premises, and found portions of two new drain pipes, of Messrs. Doulton's manufacture, which I compared with the drain pipes in the van, and they corresponded—Elson gave me a key of a job he was doing at Russell Street, Brixton—I went there and found a water-closet pan, one 4-inch bend pipe, and three 4-inch straight pipes—this is a memorandum I made at the time of what was in the van, viz:—10 9-inch junction pipes; 5 6-inch; 3 4-inch; 12 4-inch bend; 3 6-inch bend; 3 9-inch; 1 6-inch double junction and 4-inch pipe—they nearly filled the van—after I had taken Elson and Savage to the station I went in search of Ball, and about two hours afterwards I found him at his stables, about five minutes' walk from Elson's, and the same from Messrs. Doulton's—I went to the stable-door, and said, "Is your name Ball?"—he said, "Yes, that is my name"—I said, "I am going to take you into custody for being concerned in stealing a number of drain pipes, and other articles, of Messrs. Doulton's"—he said, I did not steal them, I was going down to fetch the van back"—I said, "What were the pipes taken there for?"—he said, "To get a customer for them"—I said, "How did you come by them?"—he said, "They were left here for stowage; one night a man's van broke down late, and he came to me and asked me to warehouse them, and I did so"—I asked him who he was, and he said he did not know—I said, "I shall take you to the station"—he said, "I suppose I must go"—I said, "Have you got any more?"—he said, "No"—I repeated that question more than once, and he said "No"—at that time Serjeant Wood, who was with me, discovered some—the same evening we went to where Gunnell resides, No. 4, Salamanca Place—on the 5th October I received two loads of pipes from Mr. Hinchcliff.

Cross-examined by MR. LILLEY. Q. Have you had any experience in drain pipes, or any such articles? A. Latterly I have—I never was employed in the manufacture—I know Mr. Henry Doulton does a very large business—I had been watching in Lambeth Mews for four days—Ball has one horse and van—I asked him when the man's van broke down, and he said about a month ago; I will not pledge myself positively to the accuracy of that—when I asked him if he had any more, I did not say what of.

Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Have you not left out something Elson said? A. I might have—he said, "Ball has often said to me that when he has been loading from the barges, he has had a lot left which he wanted to sell"—I think he also said that Ball told him he was often hard up in his work, and was glad to sell a lot—he said he knew a man that was hard up—Elson himself gave me the keys to go to Russell Place—I asked him what they were for, and he said, they were for his job at Brixton—I know he jobs about at houses, and uses those materials—when 1 took him into custody, the van had not been unloaded—there was plenty of room in his yard to have unloaded the van.

WILLIAM SAVAGE . I am a carman, and live at 11, Doughty Street, Lambeth Walk—I have worked for Mr. Leftwich—I know Ball—I have only known Elson since this affair—I know Ball's stables—he asked me to go and assist him in a furniture job, but when I got there, he said I was to load

these pipes—they were standing on the right, inside the stables—they were taken from the stables and put on the van—this was between 7 and 8 o'clock in the evening—I then went with Ball and the van to Elson's, and while we were there the policeman came and asked what I knew about it, and I told him—I went with Ball the night before to Astley's theatre—Ball left me and went and spoke to Elson, and it was when he came back that he asked me if I would help him to do a furniture job—after the van was loaded, it was covered with sacks and tarpaulin—when we got to Elson's, the van was backed right underneath his window, and he opened his window and said, "All right, Harry," meaning Ball—a few minutes afterwards, he came down and said something to Ball about the pipes, but I did not hear what it was—the horse was taken out of the van, and the shafts tied up—Ball left, and said he was going to get a van to do this furniture job with—it was a wet morning, or else it was to be done with his own van, and he went to get a covered one—when Ball had gone, Elson said, "Now we had better get on unloading him"—that was when the rain had abated—I said, "I will wait until Harry comes back"—I sat down and lit my pipe, and then Greenfield came up and took me into custody.

Cross-examined by MR. LILLEY. Q. Have you been employed by Ball on various occasions? A. No, not till that day—I have known Ball about twelve months, by using the same house as he does, the "George"—I know he had a job to move furniture that day—it is part of his business to move furniture from one place to another—I have seen him with loads of all kinds.

Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Ball had given you no orders to unload the pipes? A. No—I objected to unload them because it was raining; I had no other reason—I would have unloaded them when Ball came back, because I should be working under his orders then—I am quite sure I have never worked for Ball before—I left my employment with Mr. Leftwich because we had a few words; but he came to the Police Court and gave me a good character, and stood bail three times—the van was not in Elson's yard; but in the public street, where everyone might see it.

JAMES HENRY STEER . I am carman to Messrs. Doulton—Gunnell was in their employment as yardman; he had to load the pipes that went away—on the 25th September, I saw Ball coming from the direction of Messrs. Doulton's premises, with a van—I think it was the 26th—he was about two hundred yards from the premises—the wind blew the straw and sacks off the pipes, and I could see what he had got—the van was about level full—he took it to the mews opposite his stables—when I returned from my breakfast, Ball followed mo down to Doulton's—I gave information to the police—I had seen the van loaded, coming from Messrs. Doulton's, three successive days—he generally came between 8 and 8.30; that is, breakfast time.

Cross-examined by MR. LILLEY? Q. How many yardmen are there in that establishment? A. Nine or ten—they all assist to load the vans—I have seen Ball's van in the yard, but seeing Gunnell with it, I thought it was all correct—vans do occasionally come between 8 and 8.30.

RICHARD MOON (Police Sergeant L R 1). On 30th September, I went with Greenfield to Ball's stables—while he was talking to Ball, I found under some sacks and dung, thirty-seven 2-gallon jars by the side of the house, and also seventeen 4-gallon jars—on another board, I found six smaller jars, a basket bottle, and several smaller articles of crockery—I

took possession of them, and asked Ball how he accounted for them being there—he said they were left there about two months previously, by a man whose van had broken down—I asked him if he knew who the man was, and he said, "No"—I asked if he had seen him since, and he said, "No"—I accompanied Greenfield with him to the station—the same evening, I went to Gunnell's place, 4, Salamanca Place—I knocked at the door, and someone said from within, "Who is there"—I said, "Police"—he said, "I am locked in, and cannot get out"—I waited a few minutes, and then I heard a window opened at the side of the house—I went round, and saw Gunnell in the act of getting out—I said, "Your name is Alfred Gunnell" he says, "It is"—I told him I should take him into custody for being concerned with others in stealing a quantity of drain pipes and jars—he said, "I suppose I must go"—on the way to the station, he said, "I will tell you all I know about it: I saw Ball's van in the yard, between 8 and 8.30 last Saturday morning; Ball was loading pipes; I was the only person in the yard besides Ball at the time; I stopped in the closet when the breakfast bell rung"—that is all he said—I was present when Greenfield searched Gunnell's house—he found four stoneware jugs, a blue jug, a large pitcher, a bottle, and several similar articles—I know Port Place, where Elson lives—it is closed at one end, and Elson's house is at the bottom.

Cross-examined by MR. LILLEY. Q. Did you make any memorandum about this conversation with Ball? A. I did not—I rely entirely upon my memory—he did not say anything about Messrs. Doulton to me—there is room for three horses in Ball's stables—the jugs found in Greenfield's house are jugs that might be found in anybody's house.

WILLIAM HINCHCLIFF . I am an estate agent, at 58, Lower Marsh, Lambeth—I have known Elson nine or ten years—on 5th September he came to me and said he had a quantity of pipes for sale, that he had bought of Mr. Doulton—he said that he had bought them to do a job at Camberwell, and that he had about 40l. worth—he also said that the man for whom he was doing the job at Camberwell owed him 60l., and as he could not get the money he had carted these pipes to his place, and he asked me to go and look at them—I told him I did not want them particularly, but I went to his yard and looked at them, and agreed to give him a price for them, and he engaged a carman and sent them to my place—I paid him 4l. 15s. 1d., and he gave me this receipt (produced)—I have since given those pipes to the police—on the 23rd September he came to me again, and said he had brought all the pipes away from the job, would I take them—I told him I thought I had got as many as I wanted—he said he had not got money to pay his men, and I took them—I had another van load, and paid 4l. 6s. 6d., for which he gave me a receipt—I have given those to the police also—they were of the first quality.

Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. You are a builder, I believe? A. Yes, I am agent for the estate—I have known Elson for a number of years, and never knew anything different of him—I have never had transactions with him before—he is a builder, in a small way—I am sure he said he bought the pipes of Messrs. Doulton, and that he had paid 40l. for them—what he sold to me was only the remainder—it is not unusual, if a man has pipes over, for him to sell them—there was no concealment about it at all—I was told by a labourer that he was doing a job at Camberwell—I have had hundreds of pipes from Messrs. Doulton's, but mine were generally seconds—anyone can go there and buy pipes without giving any name.

MR. LILLEY to the Witness STEER.. Q. Is it not within your knowledge that Ball has been to the yard of Messrs. Doulton, and removed broken pipes at different times? A. No.

JOHN HAMBREW . I live at 41, Paradise Street, Lambeth Walk—I was in Elson's employ until his arrest—on the 5th September, there were some pipes stacked in his yard—I had seen them there about a week or more—I took them to Mr. Hinchcliff's, and saw the money paid, and a receipt given—on the 23rd September; I saw a van belonging to Ball in James Street, Lower Marsh—it had drain pipes in it, and it was taken to Mr. Hinchcliff's—it had not been on my master's premises—I made out both these receipts.

Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Who first spoke to you about giving evidence in this case? A. Sergeant Greenfield—I was not at the Police Court on the first occasion—I have been in Elson's employ on and off for twelve months—he is a builder in a small way, and does jobs all about London—I have been with him to Brixton, Camberwell, and other places—I have seen Ball at Elson's place several times—I have never heard Ball ask Elson if he could sell some pipes for him.

HENRY CHAPMAN . I am managing clerk to Messrs. Doulton—Gunnell was in their employment as yardman—it was his duty to load carts from instructions from the foreman—we have three or four yards, and anyone could get access to the pipes—Elson is a jobbing builder, and has dealt with us at various times—he did not buy the pipes produced of us—the last he bought of us was on the 27th September, and at that time he paid cash—he has bought of us on credit, and he owes us an account now—the last he had on credit was in 1861—Ball has parted for us when we hare been short of hands—he was last employed on the 9th November, 1866—he had no authority to bring his cart there at breakfast time—I identify all the pipes as being the property of Messrs. Doulton—what I have seen are worth about 14l.

Cross-examined by MR. LILLEY. Q. Does every order for the sale of pipes pass through your hands? A. Every order—Ball could have been in the yard legitimately at breakfast time—between 8 and 9 o'clock is sometimes a convenient time for people to come—I have heard that he has been there twice, but I do not know for what purpose—in my absence the foreman would serve anybody who came, and account to me on my return—Messrs. Doulton's business is very extensive—their goods are to be found all over the world.

Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. How long have you been at Messrs. Doulton's? A. 27 years—Elson's father was a builder before him, and dealt at Messrs. Doulton's—I think he had an account once of about 19s.—that was in 1857—I have known Elson about a dozen years—I believe his father carried on business in the same place—he has had several cash transactions with us—it is not customary, when persons pay cash, to always take their names—he may have bought goods without my knowledge, but I think I should have heard of it, because we have an account against him—I cannot say positively that any of the pipes produced had not been sold, but I believe they have not.

MR. METCALFE. Q. Did you send a load, on the 25th or 26th September, to either Ball or Elson? A. Certainly not—the men have no business to load at either breakfast or dinner-time—we do not know how much we

have lost—in 1867 Elson bought 13 12-inch second pipes for 1l. 3s. 10d.—we have marked off his account as a bad debt.

Elson and Gunnell received a good character.

GUILTY Judgment respited.—

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-958
VerdictGuilty > pleaded guilty
SentenceImprisonment > penal servitude

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958. JOHN BETTERSON PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously wounding Mary Ann Porter, with intent to do her grievous bodily harm.— Seven Years' Penal Servitude .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-959
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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959. AARON HENDERSON (38), and WILLIAM MORRISON (28) , Feloniously and maliciously setting fire to two stacks of hay, the property of Charles Blake.

MR. TURNER conducted the Prosecution.

JAMES DABBS . I am a labourer employed by Mr. Blake, of Blue House Farm, Merton—on 24th September I was at work there—there were some stacks on the farm—about 2.30 I saw the prisoners in the road, about 300 yards from the stacks—they came from Barnes station towards the Blue House Crossing—the London and South Western Railway runs across the road there on a level, and there are two gates, the West Barnes Crossing and the Blue House Crossing, about three-quarters of a mile from one another—the prisoners came to within 150 yards of Blue House Crossing, and then turned bock towards the stacks—after they had been gone about 7 or 8 minutes I saw smoke ascending from the stack nearest to the road, about 5 yards from the fence—I ran towards the stacks, and saw that they were both on fire—I saw the two men in the road, and followed them—I saw no other men there—I overtook them on the Merton Road, going towards London, about a mile from the stacks—I told them I wanted them to stop, as I thought they had set fire to Mr. Blake's haystacks—they said they were willing to stop—there were hay-seeds on Henderson's coat and cap.

COURT. Q. Is there a foot-path leading from the fields to the crossing? A. Yes, about three hundred yards from the stacks—I saw the men come up from the road, then go back, and I never saw anyone else—there was a small wire fence between the stacks and the road—there were hay seeds on Henderson's cap, and on his whiskers too—they were walking along the road when I first saw them.

WILLIAM HUTCHINGS . I am signalman and gateman at the West Barnes Crossing—these stacks were about half a mile from the crossing, I should think—I was at the crossing on 24th September—I saw the prisoners about 2.10, or 2.15—they crossed the railway at my crossing, towards the stacks—I saw them again about 3 o'clock—I saw Dabbs soon after—he spoke to me and went after the prisoners—no one had passed me before that for half an hour, except the baker.

Henderson. Did you see any smoke at the time we passed, at 3 o'clock.

Witness. Yes—coming from the stacks—I was not asked that before the Magistrate—I saw the smoke for the first time when you went through.

HENRY WEBB . I am gateman, in the service of the South Western Railway, at the Blue House Crossing—I was there on the 24th September—I saw the prisoners there, about 2.20—they came within seventy or eighty yards of me—they turned and went back towards the West Barnes Crossing—that would be towards the stacks—I did not see anyone else there at the

time—after they had gone about six or seven minutes, I saw smoke coming from the stacks—no one else had passed through the gate but Holt the baker, in a cart—he passed about 2.15, before I saw the prisoners—two young ladies passed about the same time as the prisoners—I knew them by sight, they live at Merton—they came from the stacks and passed in the other direction.

WILLIAM HOLT . I am a baker, at 1, Albert Road, Norbiton—on the 24th September last, between 2 and 3 o'clock, I was near Blue House Farm, and West Barnes Crossing—I met the prisoners close to the hay stacks—they were then going away from the stacks—they were not on fire then—I saw no one else—I went over the crossing, but did not come back that way.

LUCY BAYSPOOL . I live at Merton House, Merton—on 24th September, I was with my sister, in the road leading from the West Barnes Crossing to the Blue House Farm Crossing—we overtook the prisoners on the road, they were going towards Blue House Farm—I passed the hay stacks—the prisoners were about one hundred yards from the stacks—they were walking when I overtook them, but when I passed they stopped and turned to the hedge—when I got to the Blue House Crossing, I saw them turn back—the stacks were not on fire when I passed them—I did not see anyone near besides the prisoners—they had not reached the stacks when I looked back.

EDWARD JAY . I am bailiff to Mr. Blake—the stacks are worth about 450l.—they were not insured.

WILLIAM CRUTCHER (Policeman V 133). On 24th September last I took the prisoners into custody about a mile from where the fire was—I said they were charged with setting fire to two haystacks, belonging to Mr. Blake—both of them said they knew nothing about it—I found three lucifer matches on Morrison, not ignited—on their way to the station Morrison said, "We have got into it, and we must get out of it the best way we can"—Henderson had got some pieces of hay seed down his back.

J. DABBS (re-examined). These stacks were made last hay-making season—the smoke came from the side nearest the road—it could not be produced from the heating of the hay.


26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-960
VerdictsNot Guilty > unknown; Not Guilty > unknown

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960. MARY ANN TOBIN (18) , Feloniously setting fire to the dwelling-house of Thomas Charles Clarkson, on 3rd October, he being therein, Second Count—With intent to injure.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COOPER the Defence.

THOMAS CHARLES CLARKSON . I am a manufacturer, and live at 10, Stamford Street—the prisoner was a servant in my employment—she had been with us about three months—on Saturday the 3rd October, I was away from home from 6.30 to 11.30—when I got home I found the house had been on fire, but was then out and in the charge of firemen—the fire had broken out in the basement—I saw the prisoner, on the Monday, come out of the ground floor office very quickly—she had no business there at all—I went into the office immediately and noticed a fire in the corner near the fire place—there was a quantity of cork in the office which had been set on fire—it was blazing—I had left the office safe ten minutes before—there was a piece of paper and a match box under the cork—they were burning when I went in—I put the fire out—this (produced) is that of the cork that was set on fire—I called out, "You diabolical wretch, are you

going to set my house on fire?"—I then went up stain to the prisoner—she said she did not do it at first, but afterwards she said, "I did it this morning, but I did not do it on Saturday night."

Cross-examined. Q. Did you state that before the Magistrate? A. I believe so—I won't swear it, because the Magistrate was rather sharp—I said I had no doubt she did it on the Saturday—I had left her in sole charge of the house for a fortnight before—my wife was away five or six weeks, and she was left with the house—I found her faithful—I had a good character with her when I took her—the fire on the Saturday was in the kitchen, in the basement.

MARY CLARKSON . I am wife of the last witness—I went out with my husband about 6.30 on Saturday, the 3rd October—the prisoner was alone in the house—we came home a few minutes before 12—I found five or six firemen in the house; everything in the house was spoiled from smoke and steam, and the basement was entirely gutted—the kitchen is not used as a kitchen; my husband uses it for his work; there was a large quantity of cork there, and tools—on the Monday morning I heard my husband call out to the prisoner—I was in bed at the time;—I jumped out, and ran to the door—I saw the prisoner rushing up stairs; I said, "What is the matter, what have you done?"—I told her to go into my bed room, she threw herself down on her knees, and put up her hands, and said, "Pray God, strike me dead! pray God, paralyze me! I don't know what I have done it for!"—I said, "You vile girl! you had much better speak the truth than call the vengeance of God down on you!"—she then said, "I did it this morning, but I did not do it on the Saturday night"—she was then given into custody—when the policeman came, I said, "She has just confessed"—she then turned to the policeman and said, "I did it this morning; I did not do it on the Saturday night."

Cross-examined. Q. On the Saturday night there was a great deal of fire? A. Yes; that was in the basement—there was some naptha, which my husband uses occasionally—several persons work in the house—they all leave at 4 o'clock—I left the prisoner in charge of the house for about five weeks—I stated before the Magistrate about not doing it on the Saturday—I had the utmost confidence in her—there were several boys at work—one was discharged some little time before this—they were not there on the Monday, they had been discharged.

THOMSAS SHARPE . I am engineer to the fire brigade—I was called to 10, Stamford Street, on Saturday, 9th October, about 9.30—I found the basement on fire—we got it out in about twenty minutes—I could not find out what had caused the fire—I did not see anyone else in the house besides the prisoner—the place was full of smoke—there was gas in the house, but it was turned off—there was a grate, but I could not tell whether there had been a fire in it.

FRANK HUDSON (Policeman L 158). I was called to the prosecutor's house, and took the prisoner into custody—she said that she had done it on the Monday morning, but not on the Saturday night—on the way to the station I told her it was a very bad job for her—she said, "Well, I can't help it, I must put up with it."

Cross-examined. Q. Did you state that before the Magistrate? A. No, I don't think I did—I did not take the words down—there was no one else present but Mr. and Mrs. Clarkson when she said she did it on the Monday—I won't swear whether she said she was innocent or not.


The prisoner was again indicted for a like off once on 5th October, upon which the same evidence was given. NOT GUILTY .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-961
VerdictGuilty > with recommendation
SentenceNo Punishment > sentence respited

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961. SUSANNAH BUCKNEY (33) , Feloniously killing and slaying John Buckney. She was also charged on the Coroner's Inquisition with the like offence.

MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution; and MR. WARNER SLEIGH the Defence.

THOMAS FRANKS (Policeman L 106). At 6.30, on Saturday, 3rd October, I was in Lambeth Walk—I was called to Burdett Street—I found the prisoner sitting down up stairs, and she was given into my charge by Mrs. Bliss for causing the death of her child—I asked her what she had to say—she said, "I did not intend to do what I did when I threw the knife across the table"—I went down stairs, and saw the child lying dead—there was blood on his left side—it was a boy named John Buckney—I took the prisoner to the station—she said she was very sorry.

Cross-examined. Q. Where did this conversation take place? A. Up stairs, in the bed-room, not in the room where the child was—the deceased's brother was in the room—I did not see any dinner things on the table—it was about 6.40 when I got there.

HENRY BLISS . I am the landlord of 5, Burdett Street—between 5 and 6 o'clock on this Saturday evening, I heard screams, and ran out of the room, and saw the prisoner in the passage, holding the deceased—he was bleeding—I asked her what she had done, and she said, "Good God! I have stabbed my boy"—we carried the boy into the yard for two or three minutes, and then I brought him in again—I said I believed he was dying, and sent for a doctor—he died before the doctor came—I gave the prisoner into custody.

Cross-examined. Q. She appeared greatly agitated, did she not? A. Very, indeed; she was crying, and in great distress—I believe they had had their tea—the children were very tiresome—I had heard them quarrelling, and heard the prisoner speak to them two or three times—she has a great deal of trouble with them—she was a good mother to them.

THOMAS EDWARD BUCKNEY . I am the prisoner's eldest boy—on the Saturday we were at dinner, and my brother John patted me on the head—I said, "Johnnie, be quiet; he has given me a slap on the face"—mother said, "Go into the next room"—I went in, and then heard somebody screaming—I went back again, and saw my brother lying on the floor, bleeding—my mother pulled him up and took him to the door, and put some vinegar on his head—my brother mumbled something—I don't know what it was—Mr. Bliss then came into the room—I picked up a knife and put it under a chair, against a box—I afterwards gave it to the doctor.

Cross-examined. Q. Did you find the knife on the floor? A. Yes—my mother was very kind to us all—we had just had tea—my mother had been washing up the things—my brother had been sitting at tea with me, and we had been quarrelling.

WILLIAM HARRIS (Police Sergeant L 2). I was at the station on the evening of the 3rd October, when Mr. Bliss charged the prisoner with causing the death of John Buckney, aged 7—I read it over to her, and she said, "I did not intend to hurt him; in my passion I threw the knife across the table at him—it stuck in his back and caused his death."

Cross-examined. Q. Did you go to the house afterwards? A. I did—I found the room in disorder—I merely went to see where the child was—the things were on the table, as if they had finished their tea—the prisoner was in great distress at the police station—I produce the knife which I received from Dr. Richards.

SAMUEL ATKINSON RICHARDS . I am a surgeon, at 153, Upper Kennington Lane—I was called to see the deceased, and found him dead—I examined the body, and found a punctured wound at the back of the chest, between the eighth and ninth ribs—I made a post mortem examination sixty hours after death, and found that the left lung had been punctured—that was the cause of death—I received a knife from the little boy—it is improbable that the wound could have been caused by the knife being thrown across the table—it is possible—I should say that it was done by holding the knife in the hand firmly—I should say that from the depth and character of the wound it was three or four inches deep, penetrating the lungs and the heart—I produce a brace which was found—it has been cut—I can't say whether it belonged to the deceased.

Cross-examined. Q. Were you examined at the Police Court? A. I was—I did not say anything about the brace there—I had not seen it at that time—it was not impossible for the wound to have been caused by throwing the knife across the table—it is improbable—the child had no stays on—he had a flannel shirt, a waistcoat and jacket—they had been cut through—it was a small room where this took place—there was a little blood on the floor.

THOMAS BUCKNEY (re-examined.) This is my brother's brace—I picked the knife up close to where he was lying on the floor.

GUILTY Strongly recommended to mercy by the Jury,—Judgment respited.—

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-962
VerdictGuilty > unknown
SentenceImprisonment; Corporal > whipping

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962. SAMUEL SAVOY (17) , Robbery with violence on Thomas Robinson, and stealing a chain, his property.

MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution.

GEORGE BOWEN (Policeman L 3). I received information on the 28th September last, in consequence of which I took the prisoner into custody on the 1st October—I charged him with being concerned in stealing a watch chain, and he said he knew nothing about it.

THOMAS ROBINSON . I am a commercial traveller, and live at Barnes—on Monday, 28th September, between 4 and 5 o'clock in the afternoon, I was in Waterloo Road—someone, who I believe to be the prisoner, came suddenly out of a court, and snatched my chain—he broke the bow of the chain—I followed a few steps, and then I Was struck by a person from behind—I fell heavily down—it hurt me very much—I was in bed about ten days, and am still suffering.

THOMAS RAGG . I am assistant to Mr. Davidson, pawnbroker, 147, Waterloo Road—on Monday afternoon, between 4 and 5 o'clock, I saw the prisoner and two others coming down the Waterloo Road, walking fast—they stopped at the corner of Thomas Place, and I watched them—I saw the prisoner make a rush down the court—I ran out of the shop, and saw the gentleman lying on his face—I saw the prisoner running away—the gentleman was very much hurt, his face was bleeding—I knew the prisoner before.

GUILTY .†— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment, and Fifteen Lathes with a Cat .

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-963
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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963. WILLIAM SIMPSON (19) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of George Worley, and stealing a coat and other articles.

MR. WARD conducted the Prosecution.

NATHAN GILBERT (Policeman N 491). On Friday morning, 25th September, about 5.30, I met the prisoner in Kent Street, Borough, carrying a bundle—that is about half a mile from Bermondsey—I asked him what he had—he hesitated for a moment, and then said, "Some linen"—I asked him whose they were, and he said, "My own"—I asked him where he got them, and he said, "From the Borough"—I asked him from what part, and he said he did not know—I took him into custody.

JAMES ELLIOT (Policeman M 170). On this morning, I was in Star Corner, Bermondsey—I examined the prosecutor's house about 3.30—it was safe then—a few minutes after 5 o'clock I pushed the door, and it went open—I called the prosecutor up.

GEORGE WORLEY . I live at Star Corner, Bermondsey—I was called up by the last witness, a few minutes after 5 o'clock on this morning—I left the house safe about 10 o'clock, when I went to bed—I am a butcher—I left the back window open for the draft to come through—when I came down I found the door open, and the linen gone—a portion of this linen (produced) is mine—I also missed a coat, waistcoat, and other articles.

MATILDA ELLIS . I am a charwoman, and live at 3, Marigold Court—I know these things to be the property of Mr. Worley—I saw them safe on Thursday night at 9.30—I left them in a basket behind the parlour door.

GUILTY Twelve Months' Imprisonment .

Before Mr. Common Serjeant.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-964
VerdictMiscellaneous > unfit to plead
SentenceImprisonment > insanity

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964. FRANK GRAY (35) , Stealing two books of William Henry Smith.

Upon the evidence of MR. JOHN ROWLAND GIBSON, surgeon of Newgate, the Jury found the prisoner of unsound mind, and unfit to plead. Ordered to be detained during Her Majesty's pleasure .

Before Mr. Justice Byles.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-965
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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965. CHARLES SHEPHERD (17) , Feloniously carnally knowing and abusing Sarah Ann Larner, a girl under the age of ten years.

MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution; MR. RIBTON the Defence.


Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-966
VerdictGuilty > unknown

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966. JOHN LEE (30) , Feloniously cutting and wounding Edward Glossop, with intent to do him some grievous bodily harm.

MR. LEE conducted the Prosecution.

WILLIAM GLOSSOP . I am a musician of 25, Well's Lane, Streatham—on 10th October, I was with some friends at the Greyhound, at Streatham, all the evening from 7.30 or 8 o'clock—when I had been there three quarters of an hour, there was a quarrel on the other side of a partition to where we were—the partition door flew open, and I saw a man on the floor, and the prisoner and several other men beating him—I pulled the man from the floor and got him away—one of the men knocked me, but I took no notice—I fastened the door; the landlord made the men quiet, and there was an end of that—the man I rescued was a good deal hurt—I left the house at a

few minutes before 12—I noticed three or four of the party talking together before I left, and saw the prisoner come there twice—when I and my friends had got about fifty yards from the house, we waited on the tow-path, bidding our friends good night—I stepped into the road and the prisoner came upon me, and said, "You are the b—I want," and assaulted me two or three times in the road—I saw a knife in his hand—he cut my coat; but did not touch my flesh, then—I got very faint, and remember no more until after I had my arm dressed, when I indentified the prisoner at the station—I have not the least doubt of his being the person who struck me; I saw him twice in the house, and saw him receive some bread and cheese from the landlord—my clothes were smothered with blood—some people came to my assistance.

JOSEPH ATKINS . I am a carpenter, of 25, Well's Lane, Streatham—I was at the Greyhound with Glossop—we wished our friends good night at a little after 12 o'clock—and as soon as we left them the prisoner came up to Glossop, and said, "You are the b—we want," and struck him two or three times with a knife—I tried to lay hold of him, but he cut me twice on the hand, and ran away—I ran after him—I am sure he had a sharp instrument like a knife—my fingers were cut clean—I did not lose sight of him—I caught him about a hundred yards off—I saw that Glossop was wounded, and heard the blood rushing from his arm—when I caught the prisoner I saw something shining in his hand—I detained him till the police came.

WALTER WIX . I live at 40, Well's Lane, Streatham—I was going home and saw Mr. Atkins and Glossop talking together on the foot-path—I asked them if they were coming home—they said "Yes"—I bade the others good night, and stepped off the foot-path—the prisoner came up to Glossop and said, "You are the b—."and struck him two or three times—I took Glossop to the lamp—took his coat off and saw a wound in his arm—I sent for a doctor and the police.

RICHARD BUSH , M.D. I live at Streatham—I was called to the station and saw Glossop—his arm was bound up, and his coat, waistcoat and trousers covered with blood—I saw that some large vessel had been wounded, and took him into a room in the station, undid the bandages, and found an incised wound near his elbow—the blood poured out of it, and I saw by the colour of the blood that a large vein had been divided—I thought it dangerous, because it was a large vessel—he was unable, from inflammation, to attend before the Magistrate—it had been caused by a knife or some sharp instrument.

JAMES OTTWAY . (Policeman D 134). I heard cries of "Police," and apprehended the prisoner—I saw Glossop, with blood on him—the prisoner said, "I did not do it"—he had marks of fresh blood on his shoulders where he had placed his hands—I found two stones in his pockets—he appeared sober—he ran very fast—I found no knife.

GUILTY Eighteen Months Imprisonment .

Before Mr. Common Serjeant,

26th October 1868
Reference Numbert18681026-967
VerdictNot Guilty > unknown

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967. GEORGE RUSSELL (37) , Feloniously killing and slaying Sarah Ann Russell. He was also charged on the Coroner's Inquisition with the like offence.

MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. SLEIGH the Defence.

FRANCES KELSEY . I am the wife of James Kelsey, of 58, Bermondsey

New Road—we occupy the top room, and the prisoner and his wife lodge in the next room to us, on the same floor—they came there on 17th March—about a week after they moved in, the prisoner's wife was taken very ill, and I attended on her and made their acquaintance—I persuaded her to have medical advice, and Dr. Babbage was sent for—his assistant came—she was then suffering from spasms, and the prisoner came in, very intoxicated, pulled her out of bed, and kicked her violently on her shoulders and chest, and also on her left thigh—I got her out of the room, and took her into my room, and there she lay till 2 o'clock in the morning, when she went into her own room, and I heard no more disturbance—but in the morning, between 8 and 9 o'cloek, she had a bruised eye, which she had not got when she left my room—I have seen him strike her a very great number of times—once he threw a jug full of water at her, and it caught her in the back—that was on Thursday, and she died on the following Monday, 21st September—I heard a great disturbance on the Saturday; the prisoner came in very drunk, and I heard her say, "Oh! George, don't, you are killing me"—I did not see him strike her, but I heard him say, "If you do not soon die, I will throw you out of the b—window;" and he used very bad language besides—I saw her on the Monday morning, and was with her all day, from 8 o'clock; she was in bed—she was very bad, and had a very bad cut on her ear, and was bruised very much on her right side—she seemed scarcely able to draw her breath—she died that day—she also had a cut on the elbow—she shook hands, and said that she was dying—she did not seem able to take anything, or to sit up in bed—I sent for Mr. Babbage, who came and saw her—on the Saturday night the prisoner asked her for some money; he said he wanted 5s. to go out and get a woman, as she was not fit for him—she gave him 2s. 6d., and he said, "That is no use to me; if you do not give it to me, I will throw you out at the b—window."

Cross-examined. Q. Did you see the water-jug thrown at her on the Friday evening? A. Yes, my door was open—I am quite sure I saw it thrown at her—I was examined before the Magistrate and the Coroner—my evidence was read over to me, and it was what I had said—I did not tell the Coroner I heard the water-jug thrown at her—I told him I saw one water-jug thrown at her, but the other I did not—my door was on the jar; I saw the first one—I cannot say whether one word was read over to me about the water-jug being thrown at her—I told the Coroner that that was a correct copy of my evidence—I might have been agitated—I did not see any blow given—I went by her word—I told the Coroner I did not see any blow—I was in my own room—one water-jug struck her on her back, but the other I could not see—they lived on very bad terms—she complained of him a very great deal—she was a very weak woman—she complained once of spasms and of difficulty of breathing—I never heard her complain of pains in her head—she had the symptoms of a woman in a continual bad state of health—I do not know that she was suffering from consumption—she fed very poorly indeed; she had not a bad appetite, but had not the means of getting much—I occasionally gave her a cup of tea—she has borrowed money of me frequently—she did not ask for meat, or anything else, when I gave her tea—I did not see any blows struck on the Friday, Saturday, or Monday.

MR. DALY. Q. Did you mention what you have said to the Coroner? A. Yes, and I did not observe that it was absent when the statement was read over to me.

WILLIAM BABBAGE . I am a surgeon, of the New Kent Road—on Tuesday, the 15th September, the deceased came to my surgery, she appeared to have a cold, and was rather feverish—on Friday, the 18th, I saw her again; she was no better, and was still feverish—she did not complain of pain—I did not know of any ill-treatment then—on the Monday afternoon, I was fetched to her lodgings—she was in extreme pain, in her stomach from peritonitis, and her end appeared to be approaching very fast—a motion was shown to me, which was very dark, and contained blood—I made a post-mortem examination, and found that the cause of death was perforation of the bowel, and peritonitis—there was a wound on the left car, and a small wound on the right elbow; the back part of the left thigh had the appearance of a bruise—there was congestion of the vessels of the surface of the brain; in other respects the brain was healthy—there was adhesion of the heart to the pericardium, showing that inflammation had taken place, followed by adhesion; there was adhesion of the lungs to the pleura, and there had been congestion of the lungs—the heart was filled with black blood—the liver was in a diseased state; it was softened; I could easily crush it in my hand—there were patches of inflammation on the mucous coat of the stomach, internally, and some ulceration—there was perforation of the intestines, and the contents were escaping through it into the peritoneal sac: that must have arisen from inflammation, ulceration, and bursting, but there was nothing to indicate that.

COURT. Q. Could you trace her death to any violence. A. I saw no external appearances corresponding to the wound internally—I cannot say that death was caused directly by any act of violence—I suppose death was accelerated by the violence that took place on Saturday night, but I cannot trace it to any direct blow—it is possible that the excitement of the fray might have done it.



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