The Proceedings of the Old Bailey

 

507. (L.)   John Clark was indicted for high treason, in feloniously and traiterously impairing and lightening a guinea and a half guinea, the current coin of this realm, contrary to the statute in that case made and provided , Aug. 30 . *

  John Garner . I was an apprentice to the prisoner, he lives in Primrose-street; as near as I can guess, he worked in gold last January, and not since; he is a watchcase-maker ; a man brought a job, what we call a pendant hole, to be soldered, about last November; I went up with it into the shop; there was a guinea lay in the leather that is fastened to the board to catch the filings, which lies upon his lap when he is sitting to work; he was then sitting at his work; he was angry, and said I had no business to come up, but when any job was brought, to ring the bell. He sent me out often with guineas; may be in one day, to get two half guineas, and when I had got them, in about an hour after he would send me out with them to get quarter guineas; I thought there was something not right; I bored a hole through the wainscot,

through which I saw him, as near as I can guess, but cannot be positive, with a guinea in his hand, I cannot directly tell the day.

Q. Do you mean you are not positive as to the piece of money?

Garner. I could not tell what it was; it looked like gold, about the size of a guinea; I saw him hold it in his fingers, and use the file to it; I looked through this hole two or three times, and always saw something of the same sort going on, as near as I can guess they were guineas; they were gold, but what pieces I cannot tell: I can speak to looking through this hole four times; he shut the door, and the key was on the outside.

Q. When he gave you guineas, or half guineas to change, did you make any observations on them?

Garner. I cannot say I did; the people have sent me back with them not being weight.

Q. Who did you apply to on this affair?

Garner. I applied to my father, and I believe he went to the solicitor.

Q. Did you ever take notice of any other pieces of money, that was of any other shape than that of a guinea?

Garner. There might be some less, I cannot say to that

Q. Was you ever sent out with any other money besides guineas and half guineas?

Garner. I have with five and threepenny pieces; I have seen him file money, it was bigger than quarter guineas; I am sure it was money.

Q. What leads you to believe that?

Garner. Because he used to send me out so to change money; I have minded sometimes I have been sent back with one of the half guineas, to get two five and threepenny pieces.

Cross Examination.

Q. What distance was the place where he worked from the hole you made?

Garner. About two yards and a half.

Q. Was you near enough to see any sort of impression?

Garner. I was not.

Council. Then you suppose it was money from the size, and the circumstance of being sent out to change money?

Garner. That is all I speak from.

Q. Did he do any thing to the guinea you saw in the skin?

Garner. No, nothing at all as I saw.

Q. Was there any filings in the skin at that time?

Garner. I cannot be positive.

Q. Was there any gold besides the guinea there?

Garner. No, none at all; there were silver filings, no silver money.

Q. Was he working any pieces of silver?

Garner. There were pieces of silver lying near him.

Q. Did he use this skin in his trade?

Garner. Yes, to catch the filings.

Q. Whether the filings do not remain in a file till they are brushed out?

Garner. They do.

  Thomas Rothwell . I am an officer; I apprehended the prisoner the 30th of August, Mr. Nash was with me; we were called up stairs; he was locked into a garret where they worked; we went in suddenly upon him, he heard the noise, and was standing up when we went into the room; we looked about, but did not observe any thing at first; my partner searched him, and found three guineas and a half in his pocket; and in the mean time the prisoner took a guinea out of his pocket, and laid it upon a block where a cloth lay hollow, he seemed to lay it under the hollow part of the cloth, but I saw it between his fingers and thumb before he laid it down; the other three guineas and a half were found in the other waistcoat pocket.

Q. Had that guinea he put under the cloth any particular marks upon it?

Rothwell. It had been just fresh filed.

Q. Was it filed all round?

Rothwell. No, there was but about two thirds of it filed; (the guinea produced) I saw several files, one of which had gold in the teeth, that lay on the bench directly over the skin, near the filing place; the other files lay near to the same place.

Q. Were there any filings in this skin or apron?

Rothwell. I took out the filings and put them in a paper, and brought them away, and delivered them to the master of the Assay-office at the Mint; I have part of the filings that were left, which the gentleman did not take of me; (produced in court.)

Q. Was there any gold work in the shop?

Rothwell. We could not find any, and we searched very narrowly.

Q. Did you ask the prisoner whether he had any gold work about?

Rothwell. No, I did not.

Q. Did you find any books in his custody?

Rothwell. Yes; the next witness will give an account of that.

*** The Last Part of these Proceedings will be published in a few Days.

 

Continuation of the Trial of   John Clark .

  Richard Nash .

I WAS employed with Mr. Rothwell in making this search; we had a warrant against the prisoner, it was some time before we could execute it; when we came into the room, he was very much confused, and stood up; I searched his breeches pocket, and found some silver, but no gold; in his waistcoat pocket I found two guineas and two half guineas; while I was searching his waistcoat pocket, my partner saw something pass, I cannot say I did; I saw some dust in the skin, that looked like gold.

Q. Was it two guineas and two half guineas, or three guineas.

Nash. My partner made a mistake, there were two whole guineas and two half guineas; as to the other guinea, I saw it on the block. I did not see it put there, it was designed, I believe, to be concealed; I took all the books I could find, and brought them to Mr. Chamberlaine; we found no gold-work, notwithstanding we searched.

Mr. Chamberlaine. I received these books of Nash the officer, they are in the same condition I received them (produced in court.)

Q. to clerk of arraigns. Read (it is read.)

April 25, &c.

l. s.

Recd a light 1 : 7

Crowns 18 pennyweights

1/2 Crowns 9

Shillings 3 pennyweights 16 grains

Guineas 5 pennyweights 4 grains

1/2 Guineas 2 pennyweights 14 grains.

Council for Crown Now your Lordship will see by the assay-master, what the proper weight is of the several pieces.

Court. This looks like a rule, how much may be taken off to reduce them; here is one grain upon a port, repeated in different columns.

  Joseph Lucas . I am assay-master.

Q. What is the proper weight a guinea should weigh?

Lucas. A guinea should weigh 5 penny-weights, 9 grains, and very near a half. In the book, against a guinea, is put 5 pennyweights, 4 grains, that is, 5 grains and a half lighter; so that 5 grains and a half must be taken off to bring them down to that weight.

Q. Did you ever weigh this guinea here produced?

Lucas. It weighs 4 pennyweights, 21 grains, and a half, that is, about 11 grains and a half under the true weight.

Q. How much is that guinea worth?

Lucas. About 20 pence short of the real value.

Q. There were some filings found by the man, part of which he delivered to you, and the other part are now produced in court, Did you ever weigh these filings?

Lucas. The whole filings weighed about 10 grains.

Q. How much does that guinea and the filings weigh?

Lucas. It is within a grain and a half of the true weight.

Q. Did you try the filings?

Lucas. I tried a part, which I found worse than the standard, about a ninetieth part below the standard.

Q. I should be glad to know, whether by sweeping the filings from the skin, a small particle of other metal might not get among it?

Lucas. A small particle of another matter might cause it.

Q. What coin is this guinea?

Lucas. It is of   George the first, the date is 1722.

Prisoner's defence.

I acknowledge the files, that they had gold sticking in them; I have files for gold, and files for silver; when I work in gold, I use gold files, and let them lie till I work in gold again; as for the guinea, I believe I can prove where I took it; I always have gold and silver in my shop; I have

two shops, which are always open for any body to come in, the keys are on the outside.

For the prisoner.

- Goadby. I live at Lambeth, and am a grocer; the prisoner received 3 guineas of me the day before he was taken up, for a watch which I bought of him; one of the guineas he scrupled, on account of its being a light one; I agreed to take it back again, provided he did not get it off; how I came by it I do not know; whether this is the guinea in dispute I cannot say.

Q. Was any thing remarkable in that guinea?

Goadby. Yes, it rather looked smaller, some part smooth, some rough, it had a very remarkable look.

Q. Did it look as if part of it had been taken away?

Goadby. It did; I thought it was rather too light, and he proved it to me.

Q. Was it a new guinea or an old one?

Goadby. I cannot tell.

Q. Was any thing particular in the appearance of it?

Goadby. The edges were in some places smooth, in others rough; I do not know how it came so.

Q. Was it dirty, as many are?

Goadby. No, it was a bright guinea.

Q. Was any part particularly bright?

Goadby. Yes, it looked as if it had not been in common use.

Q. Did you take it in your hand, or observe any thing particular in the feel of it?

Goadby. No, I did not.

Q. Did you ever deal with the prisoner before?

Goadby. Yes, we have had dealings.

Q. He has had guineas of you before, I suppose?

Goadby. Yes.

Q. Did he ever object to your money, or you to his?

Goadby. No, never.

Q. What has he dealt with you in?

Goadby. In tea, and other articles in the grocery way; I have received of him to the amount of 14 and 15 shillings at a time.

- Blaney. I went into the prisoner's workshop, and looked through the hole to see if I could see what a person was doing of as he sat at the board; I went again last Saturday, and sat in the same position a person would that was to work. I have known the prisoner about 8 years, I always looked upon him to be a very honest man, and one that lived in credit.

Q. Can you tell the meaning of these words in the book, May 25, began gaming.

Blaney. No, I do not.

  John Buckley . I went into the prisoner's workshop, and looked through the hole, to see Mr. Blaney sitting at work on the prisoner's seat; I looked as nigh as I could into every place, there was no such thing as seeing what he was filing, he sat about 2 yards from the hole, he sat with his back to the hole; we were let into the room afterwards, and stood within a foot of him; if he sat sideways, I could not see what he was filing of; I have known him four or five years; I believe he has pretty good business; I never heard any thing of him but a good character.

Cross examination.

Q. Did you look through all the holes?

Buckley. I did.

Q. Could you discover whether he was filing a tankard, or a thing the size of a guinea?

Buckley. Not if he sat sideways, I could not see his hand nor his apron.

  John Lloyd . I live in Long-alley, by the end of Skinner's-street; I have known the prisoner five or six years, he has dealt with me for coals, he paid me honestly.

Q. What is his character?

Lloyd. I never trouble myself with any of my neighbours, I keep no company, or go to an alehouse once in a quarter of a year; I do not remember I ever had light money of him.

  John Lapier . I live in Primrose-street; I have known the prisoner about seven years, he has bore a very good character.

- Jackson. I keep a public-house in the neighbourhood; the prisoner uses my house, his character is that of an honest man; I have received a great deal of gold of him, I suppose I have changed him an hundred pounds at times, I never had any objection to any money he brought.

- Delacourt. I live in Slaughter-street, I have known him seven years, he has the character of an honest man.

- Brisace. I am a pattern-drawer, I have known him five or six years, he has a fair and just character.

- Harvey. I am a shoemaker, I have worked for him and his family, he always paid me, and he bore a good character.

  Tho Dutfield . I have known him ever since I can remember, he has always had the character of an honest man.

Hen. Aldwin. I live in Primrose-street, I have

known him five years, I never heard any thing of him but that of a worthy honest man.

Guilty , Death .