Stephen Dane.
21st October 1761
Reference Numbert17611021-30
VerdictGuilty > manslaughter
SentenceMiscellaneous > branding

Related Material

ActionsCite this text | Print-friendly version | Report an error
Navigation< Previous text (trial account) | Next text (front matter) >

314. (M.) Stephen Dane , Mariner , was indicted for the wilful murder of Elisha Hannah . He stood charged by the coroner's inquisition, for manslaughter, October 10 . ++

Mr. Jolley. On Saturday se'ennight, being the 10th of this instant, between the hours of 10 and 11 at night, it may be about five or six minutes after 10, it rained very hard. Mr. Esgate and I went in at the Ben. Johnson's-head, Russel-street, Covent-garden; we went into a back-room, there was a woman sat in the left hand corner of the same room. Mr. Esgate sat down by her, and I sat down by the side of him. The prisoner was in the house, he came and insulted Mr. Esgate very grossly.

Q. In what manner?

Jolley. By words, and threatned to pull his nose, or otherwise ill treat him, if he did not immediately leave that woman's company; he took the woman by the arm, but she would not go with him.

Q. Who do you mean by He took?

Jolley. That is the prisoner; upon which he threatned Mr. Esgate and I, to beat us. I desired him not to abuse us, and said, we did not come there to fight, but to stay till the rain was over. He left our company, and went and sat down, and said, we should not go out of the house before we were beat; there was another person there, who is absent, he aggravated Mr. Dane very much against us.

Q. What was his name?

Jolley. I do not know; I imagine he was acquainted with Mr. Dane, he threatened to beat Mr. Esgate, and to turn him out of the house. The woman got up, and went over a table to another man, and went out, and said to him, she was glad he was gone, for she wanted to go.

Q. What liquor had you to drink?

Jolley. We had a shilling in punch.

Q. Did that woman drink with you?

Jolley. I cannot be positive whether she did or not, because the prisoner came up to us, and threatened us, before we had drank ourselves.

Q. Had that woman before been drinking with them?

Jolley. I cannot tell; I never saw the woman before in my life, we were there by ourselves, and sat about 10 minutes after the woman was gone. I got up to go to the door, to see if it rained, or how the weather was. When I got to the door, to my surprize, I saw the prisoner at the bar collaring Mr. Esgate, this I saw by turning my head, hearing a noise. As I was going to go out, there were a number of men, all sea faring people, all together, they wanted him to fight, they were in the passage. I told them, we would not fight, and interceded with the prisoner to be quiet; there were one or two of them challenged me to fight. I said I would not, and desired they would be at peace. I got in, between Mr. Esgate and the prisoner, and it became a little still. Then we all went into the room again, and sat down; the prisoner drank a glass of punch with us, I desired him to be still, and said, it was not worth his while to fall out about a person of the town. The prisoner seemed to express himself, as if he thought we were the chief cause of the woman's going out of the house, and called us bullies, and did not seem well pleased, but got up and went and sat down with his companions; we were all in the same room. Then an officer went to the prisoner, and said, d - n the rascal, pull his nose off, and we will beat them before they go out of the house.

Q. Did he appear to be of the prisoner's company?

Jolley. I imagine he was, he aggravated the prisoner very much, he is the same person I mentioned before.

Counsel for prisoner. For distinction-sake, if you have occasion to mention him again, call him Ratsey, for that I understand is his name.

Jolley. The prisoner and that Ratsey, got up and went out together by themselves; and when they came in, they seemed very much dissatisfied.

Q. How long were they gone out?

Jolley. They returned again in about two minutes, they were very quarrelsome; Mr. Esgate was sitting by me; he said, we were like to get into a very bad fray, and he should be very glad to get out of the house. I heard a man by the fire-side make use of a very bad expression.

Q. What did you hear the prisoner say?

Jolley. I do not remember what he said at that time. Ratsey made use of a great many bad words, and strove to aggravate the prisoner against us. I cannot recollect the very words made use of, but he and the prisoner seemed very much out of humour, and threatned us very much Mr. Esgate spoke to the waiter, and asked him if we were to be beat; the waiter said, very likely, and went out and laughed, and said, there is no fear of it.

Q. Do you think the prisoner heard that?

Jolley. I think he might hear it, Mr. Esgate spake pretty loud; the person Ratsey made a great noise, and threatened us. Mr. Esgate said to me, you had better step out of the house, and see if you can get any body to our assistance; go to Mr. Scott's, at the Black-lion, perhaps you may meet with some body there; they seemed to threaten him the most.

Q. Do you not imagine it was in your power to get away?

Jolley. At that time I imagine it was not; that is, Mr. Esgate could not, for the prisoner had stopped him before I went out to Mr. Scott's.

Q. Did any body offer to hinder your going out?

Jolley. No, no-body; there I saw the deceased, and several others sitting. I spoke to Mr. Bamber, and told him, Mr. Esgate was at the house above, and some seafaring people would not let him come out of the house, and desired him to come to his assistance, to get him out of the house. I returned, and found Mr. Esgate sitting by himself, where I left him, seemingly in very great fear.

Q. Did any body return with you?

Jolley. No.

Q. What show of fear did you perceive?

Jolley. He had been threatened so much of being beat before he went out of the house. I sat down, and presently Mr Bamber came in, and seemed as if he knew nothing of the matter, and shook hands with me, and asked me how I did; then I got up and rung the bell, in order to pay and go.

Q. Was any other person besides Mr. Bamber come in that time?

Jolley. Yes, the deceased, and three or four more followed Mr. Bamber; but they took

no notice at all of any body. After I had rang the bell, the officers seemed to be all in great motion, and particularly Ratsey, they were all in confusion, Ratsey still kept threatning us.

Q. What did the prisoner say at that time?

Jolley. I did not hear him say any thing, but they kept talking to one another: Mr. Esgate was particularly threatned by them. I ask'd that Ratsey, if he was willing to let Mr. Esgate go out of the house quietly, or else go to another house, that we might talk it over; and desired he would behave like a gentleman. Upon which he called out, My Sword, My Sword; I told him I wore no sword, neither did I know how to make use of one; upon that, he with his fist struck at me.

Q. Was the prisoner present then?

Jolley. He was.

Q. Do you think he heard what the other said?

Jolley. I imagine he did.

Q. How many people might be in the room at that time?

Jolley. I believe about a dozen; I kept off the blow as well as I could; I believe it came on my shoulder. Immediately all their sticks were up, beating us about.

Q. Had they all sticks?

Jolley. I believe they had.

Q. Had the prisoner a stick?

Jolley. I believe he had; there was a very great struggle in the passage, and a noise; some of the people called out, there is a sword drawn. Then Mr. Esgate went out of the house as soon as possible, and I after him.

Q. Where was this struggle?

Jolley. This was in the passage, the lamps and glasses were breaking; the moment they saw the sword, they all drove out of the house. I lost my hat in the passage, we were out, and the door was shut. I waited about, to see if any body had got my hat, or saw it, several people then stood at the door. I believe I had been out five or six minutes, then the door opened, and some body brought a hat. I seeing a cockade upon it, said, that is not mine; then my own hat was brought, it was very dirty. Then I observed the door was open again, and the deceased ran into the house, it was so sudden, I did not see him go in, but somebody cried out, Hannah is gone in; and before I turn'd myself about, I heard him cry out, I am stabbed; this was the moment I heard he was gone in, I heard his voice, I am stabbed.

Q. How long do you think he might have been gone in?

Jolley. I imagine he could not have been in a minute, the voices were both at once. After that, I saw Hannah sitting on a bench, and I went for a surgeon.

Q. Do you know who stabbed him?

Jolley. That I do not know.

Q. Did you hear him say who stabbed him?

Jolley. No, I did not; I heard him say some thing, but what I could not discern?

Q. How long did he live after this?

Jolley. He lived till the Tuesday morning, between 12 and one o'clock, and this happened on the Saturday night before.

Q. Whereabouts was he stabbed?

Jolley. He was stabbed in the belly.

Cross Examination.

Q. Whether the deceased had a poker in his hand, when he ran in?

Jolley. I cannot say that; I am very sensible he had nothing in his hand when he first came into Mr. Esgate and I.

Q. How near to the passage was the room you had been drinking in?

Jolley. The passage is from the street-door, leading to the room.

Q. How many people do you apprehend were in the passage, when the call was, a sword is drawn?

Jolley. I imagine there were a dozen or more.

Q. How came it you was drove out of the house?

Jolley. I can speak for myself, I ran out on account of the sword's being drawn.

Q. Were the people drove out; you mentioned the word drove out?

Jolley. I imagine they ran out on the sight of the sword; we drove out, my meaning was, we got out in haste.

Q. How long did the door continue to be shut, before it was open again?

Jolley. I imagine about ten minutes.

Q. Do you know whether the deceased went to the house of Mr. Scott, the Black-lion, and came back again with a poker in his hand?

Jolley. I cannot inform you that, I do not know.

Hosea Esgate . Last Saturday was se'ennight, about 10 minutes after 10 at night, Mr. Jolley, and I being at Covent-Garden end of the town, it rained very hard; we went in at the Ben. Johnson's head, Russel-street, and walked backwards into a back room, where were several people

sitting, and on the left hand corner, there sat a woman, seemingly alone, there were three or four chairs near her empty. I sat down by her, and Mr. Jolley by me; in about a minute, the prisoner at the bar came up to me, and asked me with a great oath, what business I had with that woman; he took hold of her arm, and said, she should not be in our company; the woman insisted upon it, that she would not be in his company, and talked as if she had not been well used by him. He was pleased to say, he would pull my nose off, and before we went out of the room we should be thrashed. She got over the table, and went out of the room; we set about the space of 10 minutes. Then Mr. Jolley got up to go to see how the weather was, I followed him, and immediately the prisoner jumped after me into the passage, and laid hold of my collar, and swore several bitter oaths, that we should not go out of the house. Upon his collaring me, Mr. Jolley interposed; and desired him to be easy.

Q. Did he collar you because you should not follow the girl?

Esgate. I did not understand it so, he seemed determined that we should be lick'd. Mr. Jolley got between us, and begged of him to be quiet; then we all returned to where we was before, and the prisoner drank a glass of punch with us, and seemed very well reconciled. The other officer seemed to be prodigiously angry with us, calling us names, and that we were nothing but 'prentice boys. We were very uneasy, and thought between ourselves, as they seemed determined we should not go out of the house, for Mr. Jolley, to go to the Black-lion, to see if any of our acquaintance were there, to come to our assistance.

Q. Did you direct that?

Esgate. We agreed to do so; he went, I was very much intimidated while he was gone, left they should fall upon me. After Mr. Jolley returned, in a few minutes, Mr. Bamber, and the deceased, and others, came in; Mr. Bamber came up to us, and shook hands with us. Immediately the officers seemed to be alarmed, they got up, and put themselves in a posture, as if they were going to fight us; upon which Mr. Jolley went up to try to soften them; there were blows directly, they had all large sticks of ash or oak, they all up with their sticks, and fell upon whoever happened to be nearest.

Q. Whereabouts in the house was this?

Esgate. This was in the passage; in the scuffle, I perceived the prisoner to draw back, and get up two or three of the stairs.

Q. Was the door shut or open then?

Esgate. I cannot tell that, the officers laid on very unmercifully with their sticks. When the prisoner was got upon the stairs, he drew his sword immediately; I had observed, he drew back in order to draw it, he seemed desperately passionate. At the sight of the sword. I and Mr. Jolley, and all three, forced out of the house immediately.

Q. How many of you got out?

Esgate. I cannot say, there were more there than we knew, or had any manner of acquaintance with. As soon as we got out of the house, the door was shut, I found Mr. Jolley on the out side of the door, he had lost his hat; when the door was opened, it was given out.

Q. How soon was the door open, after you were all out?

Esgate. In about the space of six or eight minutes, it was opened in order to give him his hat; then I was told, that Hannah, the deceased, ran in, but I did not see him run in.

Q. Who told you that?

Esgate. The people at the door said, Hannah was now run in, he came out with us when we got out. Immediately after I had heard that the deceased was run in, I saw him return, and he cry'd out he was stabbed.

Q. How many went in with him?

Esgate. I believe he went in alone.

Q. Did he say who stabbed him?

Esgate. To the best of my remembrance he said, one of the officers had stabbed him.

Cross Examination.

Q. Did you see him have a poker in his hand?

Esgate. No, I did not.

Q. Was there any knocking at the door after you came out?

Esgate. I believe there was, but I cannot tell by whom.

Q. Was there not knocking at the door with sticks?

Esgate. I cannot say there was not; there certainly was knocking as the door, and very likely with sticks; but I believe but little with sticks.

Q. Were there no attempts to force the door open?

Esgate. No.

Q. Were there many people at the door?

Esgate. There were a great many.

Q. Was there a great noise at the door?

Esgate. There was a noise.

Jos. Lewis. I saw the prisoner at the bar insult Mr. Esgate, and Mr. Jolley.

Q. How insult them?

Lewis. With very bad words; they were going out, and the prisoner at the bar, and another man, laid hold of them in the passage.

Q. Where abouts in the passage?

Lewis. About the middle of the passage, to the best of my knowledge, they stopped them both?

Q. How, and by what means did they stop them?

Lewis. There were something of laying hold on the collar or shoulder of Esgate; after that, they seemed to cool a little. I went down stairs into the cellar, to bring up a quantity of wine, and what was wanted: and when I came up again, there had been battling. The first thing I saw, was the prisoner at the bar on the stairs, with his sword in one hand, and a stick in the other; I saw several blows pass and repass, I was in the house, but did not see the deceased at all as I remember. After every thing was quiet and over, I heard the prisoner at the bar say in some sea term, he had pink'd some body. And after that, I heard him swear, and d - n them, I have done for one, I have run one thro' the shoulder; after that, I went about my business, the prisoner and the other officers paid me their reckoning.

Q. Did you see the deceased that night?

Lewis. I did not to my knowledge; I saw him after he was dead.

Cross Examination.

Q. Did you afterwards find an iron poker in the house, that did not belong to the house?

Lewis. There was a poker that was not our own.

Q. What became of it?

Lewis. I gave it to Mr. Scott's maid.

Q. How came you by it?

Lewis. It was given to me somehow, just after the scuffle.

Q. Did the prisoner give it you?

Lewis. I believe it was not the prisoner, it was either the absent person, the officer, or my master.

Q. How came you to deliver it to Mr. Scott's maid?

Lewis. It was sent for by Mr. Scott, at the Black-lion.

Q. Did you observe any marks on the prisoner from a blow he had received with something?

Lewis. I believe I did, if I did, it was on his upper lip.

Q. Did it appear to be given by a blow?

Lewis. If it was by a blow, it was a very slight one; it seemed to be a very little blow.

Q. Might not that be given with a poker?

Lewis. It did not seem to be by a poker, if it was, it was not a very hard blow.

Q. Did it seem as if it had been done by a brush with the poker?

Lewis. It seemed some thing of that kind, but it did not seem to be cone with a hard blow.

John Roberts . I am master of the Ben. Johnson's-head, Russel-street, Covent-garden. I know very little of the prisoner, I may have seen him one or two nights, or thereabouts, he came to my house pretty soon. About seven, eight, or nine o'clock on Saturday was se'ennight in the evening, he was disguised in liquor, and very quarrelsome; there were some words arose between Mr. Jolley and him, on account of a woman that happened to sit in company with him, she did not like the behaviour of the gentlemen, and she moved to the other table, it is a public room; Mr. Jolley and Mr. Esgate came in, and there were some ill language given to them.

Q. What about?

Roberts. About spitting in their faces, such words were mentioned, and shitting in their mouths; very indecent expressions.

Q. How did these words arise at first?

Roberts. They arose between the prisoner at the bar, and they two; there was a person that is absent, that seemed to be very desperate (I wish I could find him) he threatned me after they two had drank their punch and were gone out at the door; they were going about half way out of the passage, the prisoner laid hold of Esgate, whether by his collar, or how, I cannot tell. I was a little confused, seeing my house in this confusion, with the lamps breaking, and I obliged to do all the punch myself, Mr. Esgate was obliged to go in again with the prisoner at the bar. Some time after, I heard them all in confusion, and expected there was some thing extraordinary, I did not venture in among them. I found one of the two first evidences seemed to be put upon, and they were rather too

weak to defend themselves. One of them went out (as it seems afterwards) to the Black-lion, to see if any of their friends were there; after that, I saw a few coming in, and it happened to be at the time, that gentlemen were coming in from the play-house, who came in I do not know some of the deceased's people party came in, and words arose between them and the gentlemen; by and by it came to a general engageing, I was making a bowl of punch, the passage was fall of sticks, knocking one another about. I went from the bar, and saw the prisoner standing on my stairs, up three or four steps, he had a stick in one hand, and a drawn sword in the other. The absent man, and the prisoner, and their party, beat the other people out at the door, and shut the door. I found there were people at the door, they knock'd at the door, I desired them not to use me ill, for I wanted to let Mr. Davis out, he was greatly terrified. I opened the door, and let him out; and with that, that party came in, that is, the deceased and two or three more.

Q. Who came in?

Roberts. The deceased certainly came in, and Mr. Bamber, and a great many that I cannot name, of the deceased's party.

Q. How many of them?

Roberts. Five, six, seven, or eight; the deceased to be sure was very active in the fray.

Q. Could you perceive what he had in his hand?

Roberts. I did not, I cannot swear to any thing he had in his hand.

Q. Was that after the sword had been drawn?

Roberts. It was, but it was a trifle of time afterwards; I went to the back-room to see how the bowls and glasses stood, all the things almost in the passage were broke, the square lamp and other things. After the quarrel was over, he prisoner at the bar came in, and said, he had done for one of them, for he had run one through the shoulder; he had then his naked sword in his hand.

Q. Were there any more swords drawn than one?

Roberts. No, never a one, but one.

Cross Examination.

Q. When did you see the sword drawn in the prisoner's hand?

Roberts. When the last engagement was.

Q. Had he the sword in his hand before the door was shut?

Roberts. I believe he had.

Q. How long did the door remain shut?

Roberts. I believe it remained shut seven or eight minutes.

Q. Do you believe the sword was not put up after the door was shut?

Roberts. I believe it was not put up till all was over.

Q. How many affrays were there?

Roberts. There were two, the hurt was done the second attempt.

Q. In which of the affrays did you see the deceased so active in?

Roberts. In the last.

Q. What do you mean by saying he was active?

Roberts. I saw him rush in and face the other party, he seemed to be the first or second that pushed in when the door was open.

Q. to Jolley. Had you two scuffles?

Jolley. We were drove out of the house, but there was a scuffle in the passage first.

Q. to Eastgate. Do you know who went in after the door was opened?

Eastgate. Those at the door said, Hannah was run in, and others went in.

Q. Did you see them go in?

Eastgate. I cannot say I saw any of them go in.

Q. to Lewis. Did you see the prisoner during the time the door was shut?

Lewis. I did.

Q. Where did he go?

Lewis. I am not clear in that.

Edward Davis . I was in at the Black-lion, when Mr. Jolley came in; he spoke to Mr. Bamber, and Mr. Hannah was in company with Mr. Bamber; I was told he desired their assistance.

Q. Were any body more with them?

Davis. There were two or three more in company; I followed that company to the Ben Johnson 's-head; and two others went with me, that were sitting with me.

Q. How many might go from that house?

Davis. May be about six or seven; we were not of their company; there were four of them, and three of us. I went into the room at the Ben Johnson 's head, and saw all very quiet. I came out again to the door, intending to go away; then I heard a noise; I returned again,

and went into the room; there I saw Mr. Jolley, and a person that is not here.

Q. Did you see the prisoner at the bar?

Davis. I did not remark him at that time; I stood close up by the wall, and let them pass me into the passage, where they immediately began with sticks and sifts; our company retired towards the door.

Q. Who do you call our company?

Davis. That is Mr. Bamber the deceased, and them that I knew. I went behind the officers party, and followed them to the foot of the stairs; and I went three or four steps up. Then the prisoner at the bar came upon the stairs likewise, and drew his sword. He came there for the better opportunity of drawing it I had a stick in my hand, and stood very quiet. He collared me, and said, You dog, I will give it you; and immediately snatched my stick out of my hand. I replied to him, For what, Sir? I am independent of the matter; I have nothing to do with it. He seemed in a very great passion, shaking his sword at me. I went down the stairs, and turned round, and went to the room again where they first came in. I heard our company say, there is a sword drawn I went to go out of the house, and the door was shut; and I was left with the prisoner, and his party. I was after wards let out by Mr. Roberts. During the time I was in the house, I saw the prisoner with his drawn sword in his hand. He and his party went to search if there were any more of our company left, and said. Is there any more dogs? we will clear the house of them; and one of them ran his hand in my face, and said, You dog, have you any thing to say against the king, and his men? When I was let out of the house, I was in a great fright. I came out with Mr. Jolley's hat.

Q. Did Hannah go out of the house with the others before you did?

Davis. I am sure he did.

Q. Did you see him return into the house again?

Davis No, I did not; he had lost his hat and wig in the fray, and the wig was given me along with Mr. Jolley's hat, in the house; so I looked about for him, but he was without.

Q. When did you see him first after this?

Davis. I saw him come out of the house with his hand at his breast, after I was out I was in such a fright, I went immediately to ask for him at Mr. Scott's; there I saw Hannah, and Mr. Bamber, by the side of him.

Q. As he came out of the house, did you remark any body else complain of being wounded?

Davis. No, I did not; he was sitting in a box there; he said, If I die, you are all blackguards.

Q. Did he give you any account who gave him that wound?

Davis. I did not hear him; I never had any conversation with him afterwards, only when the prisoner was brought in, and put in the same box with him; for when we had been in with the deceased, somebody said, We ought to secure the person that has done it. I went back with others to Mr. Roberts's, and brought the prisoner from thence; there were Mr. Bamber, and others with us. The prisoner sat down by the deceased, who waved his hand, and said, How could you use me so? The prisoner said. If it was to do again, I would do it. I said to the prisoner, Why did you assault me on the stairs? He said. I will shew you the way of it; I was robbed. I said, Of what? He said, Of my hat I had brought it to Mr. Jolley; and after that I delivered it to Mr. Scott in his bar and he gave it to the prisoner. I said, Have you any thing to alledge with respect to a robbery? He said, No, but look upon this black mark on my face I saw a black mark upon his upper lip; he said it was done with a poker

Q. Did he say who gave it him?

Davis. He did not

Q. Did he not say the prisoner gave it him?

Davis. He did not, as I know of.

Cross Examination.

Counsel. Then the officers were pretty quiet among themselves, when the other party were gone out?

Davis Yes .

Q. Had the prisoner sheathed his sword, when the others were gone out, and the door shut?

Davis. He had.

Q. Did you see the sword drawn afterwards?

Davis. No. I did not.

Q. What was done after they had searched every room, and could find no more?

Davis. They then began to shake hands, and were all very quiet.

Q. How long were they quiet?

Davis. They were pretty quiet for about two or three minutes, 'till the door was open.

Q. Do you know any thing how Hannah came by the poker?

Davis I was asking for Hannah, when he was in at Scott's; I gave him his wig; he said, he went to Mr. Scott's to fetch the poker, in order to go and fetch his wig.

James Scott . I keep the Black-lion. On Saturday night, between the hours of ten and eleven, the deceased, Hannah, came hastily into the bar where I was, and asked me to lend him a stick. I judging what use he wanted to make of it, refused him; he immediately went into the kitchen; but I being busy in the bar, did not see him return; but in less than two minutes my cook came running to me, and said, Lord, Sir, Mr. Hannah has got the poker!

Q. What is her name?

Scott. Her name is Catharine Guttery ; I believe in less than five or six minutes he returned; I observed his looks to be altered very pale. One of his friends said, Hannah is hurt. I followed him into the kitchen; he took his shirt aside, and shewed me the wound he had received. A surgeon was sent for. I asked if they had secured the person that did it; and very soon after the prisoner was brought into the house, by some of Mr. Hannah's friends.

Q. Whereabouts was the wound?

Scott. It was under his left breast. The people insisted upon the prisoner's giving up his sword; but he refused it, and said, He would give it to none but the landlord of the house. I went, and he gave me his sword immediately. I observed a spot on his face, which appeared as if done with a poker; it was near his mouth.

Q. Did you perceive any thing of a wound?

Scott. No, I did not see any wound.

Q. to Davis. Did you see a wound on the prisoner's face?

Davis. No, no wound; it was only somewhat black.

Q. to Lewis. Did you observe any blood on the prisoner's face?

Lewis. There was something about his teeth; but it did not seem to be done by a blow, it might be done by the scuffle.

Q. Did you see any blood?

Lewis. I don't know that there was any blood, none of any consequence.

Q. to Scott. Did you see a poker afterwards?

Scott. My cook went to fetch the poker a day or two afterwards; it was my poker; Mr. Roberts's servant told me the poker was at their house.

Q. Did you hear the prisoner say who gave him that mark?

Scott. No, I did not.

Catharine Guthery . I am servant to Mr. Scott; the deceased came to me in the kitchen, and asked me if I could lend him a stick; I said I had never a one; then he went and took the poker from the fire-side. I asked him what he was going to do with it. He said he was going to get his wig with it. I fetched it again from the Ben Johnson 's-head, on the Monday following. After he was wounded, he came into our house, and said he was stabbed.

Q. Did you ask him how he came by the wound?

C. Guthery. No. I did not, neither did he tell me; I saw the wound dressed, it appeared to be done with a sword. [She produced an iron-poker, above three quarters of a yard long] This is the poker.

John Fleming . I was at Mr. Scott's, when Mr. Jolley came in; he said, he and his friends were very ill treated, and desired assistance; he said, they declared his friend should not go out of the house, 'till they had beat him. I went along with them; there were striking with sticks. I saw one sword drawn, and no more. The person that had the sword, had a stick in the other hand; it was the prisoner at the bar; he was disarmed of his stick. He ran up four or five stairs, and laid hold of Davis by the collar, and swore he would run the first man through the body that advanced towards him, be he who he would. We all quitted the house, and the door was shut. About ten minutes after, the deceased came back, and went in. He had not been in above two minutes, before he came out, and said, He was wounded, and that he was a dead man. I attended him to the Black-lion; there I saw the prisoner brought in, and sat down near the deceased. I asked the prisoner how he could be guilty of so cruel an action. He said, he thought nothing of that, he had received many such wounds himself; and was it to do again, he would do the same, or worse. The deceased was carried to Mr. Bamber's, in Round-court. I attended him from that time, to the hour of his death.

Q. How was he for health before?

Fleming. He was a man of extraordinary good health before.

Q. What do you imagine was the cause of his death?

Fleming. I think he could die of nothing else but this wound; he was always in great pain after he received the wound.

Mr. Bamber. I was sitting drinking at the Black-lion last Saturday was se'ennight at night, in company with the deceased; we had paid our reckoning, and were going home; Mr. Jolley came in, and told us there were some company using Mr. Eastgate very ill at the Ben Johnson 's-head. I went after him, and found him sitting in the left-hand corner in the room. While Mr. Jolley went to speak to one of the gentlemen, a quarrel began, I don't know how; they fell on with their sticks as hard as they could for their lives. I had no stick, nor the deceased neither. I thought myself in great danger, and thought it necessary to get hold of a stick as soon as I could. I got a stick out of somebody's hand, I don't know who, and defended myself with it. The next thing I saw was the prisoner at the bar, with a sword drawn in one hand, and a stick in the other. Then we all went out at the door, expecting him to come out every minute Some of them had lost hats. I could not well leave them so, and I stood there with my stick; and while I was looking on one side, the deceased slip-ped into the house; and one Ryland, a young fellow, said, Hannah is gone into the house; he will be killed. I ran in directly, for I had a great value for the deceased.

Q. Did you see any thing in the deceased's hand?

Bamber. No, I did not; I saw him when in the passage; before I could get up to where he was engaged, he cried out he was stabbed.

Q. Do you know with whom he was engaged?

Bamber. I do not; it was with the sea-faring gentlemen.

Q. Did you see him strike any body, or any body strike him?

Bamber. No, I saw neither; he returned back immediately, and I followed him out. I went a little way, and returned back again. I thought I could not go and leave the prisoner behind, and my friend in such danger. I stood at the door, and leaned on the stick, as if not concerned at all. The prisoner came up, and asked what was the matter. As soon as I got him from the door, I immediately catched him by the collar, and ordered a man to assist me, because he had his sword by his side. Then I took him to Mr Scott's, and left him there, and went for a surgeon.

Cross Examination.

Q. Might not the deceased have a poker in his hand, and you not see it?

Bamber He might, for what I know; I have very great reason to think he did take the poker, and run into the house with it.

Q. You say you saw him engaged; what do you mean by engaged?

Bamber. I saw him in the scuffle with the gentleman.

Q. You say there were two parties; how many were there of the two parties?

Bamber. I believe our whole party might consist of about six or seven, and six or seven of the other party; but at the same time the deceased was hurt, I do not know of any of our party ingaged besides him, and me, and one more.

Q. When the deceased came out of the house, what did he say?

Bamber. He clapped his hands on his breast, and said, [I am a dead man, and if I die, I look upon you ail as a parcel of scoundrels; because you did not come and assist me?

Q. Where there blows passed on each side?

Bamber. I saw them husling in the passage, but I saw no blows.

Q. If there had been any, was you near enough to see them?

Bamber. I was, but I saw none on neither side. Hannah was a very high spirited young fellow.

Prisoner's Defence.

I went into the house that night, and a girl was sitting at a table; we sat down by her, and asked her if she was engaged for the night; she said no; I said, have you any lodgings of your own? she said, Sir, I have; we had a shillins-worth of punch, the girl drank part of it. After that, another shillings-worth was set on the table; a gentleman that was with me, touched the table with his arm, and spilt some of the punch. She got up, I said, it was not done with any design, I hope you will keep your seat; she went and set down by that young gentleman (meaning Esgate) She afterwards went out; I told him he should not go out after her; we had some words; but after that, I drank with him in good friendship. After that, blows began to ensue; I was struck several times. I

cannot tell by who. After the thing was done, a young man said, the man that is wounded will die: I said, I am sorry for it, for God's sake, send for a surgeon. Said he, Will you go and see the man? I said, with all the pleasure in the world. I went out at the door, they were all ready at the door; they took and knocked me about, and tore my sword from me. When the fray was, he came in with a poker, the end of it went into my mouth; I defended myself with my sword in hand, and when I was trying to get the poker from him, this thing happened, as they were beating with sticks over me. I never gave the least push in the world.

For the prisoner.

John Priestly . I was one of the gentlemen that went with Mr. Dane to this house, on Saturday, the 10th of this month, about 10 o'clock at night.

Q. Who else was with you?

Priestly. There was Mr. Dane, Mr. Ratsey, and me; there was another in the room, that seemed very quarrelsome, and in liquor, but he was not of our company. I saw also one White-head, that I knew; we went first into the back room, and called for a shilling i punch, we drank it out, there was a lady sitting there, she seemed very melacholy; Mr. Dane asked her if she would take a glass of punch, she did, there was some discourse; he since told me, she had ingaged herself to him for that night We called for another shilling's worth of punch, the waiter set it on the table, the sleeve of a coat touch'd the table, and a small quantity of it went upon the lady's cardinal, so she was out of humour, and went from our company; those other gentlemen coming in; they and she sat in another part of the room, I cannot tell whether they came in before she went to that corner of the room or not She seemed not inclinable to come into our company again, I believe that occasioned a quarrel between Mr. Dane, Mr. Esgate, and Mr. Jolley; it was about this girl only, some words past. I got up, and begged of them not to quarrel about any such thing as that, as we came there only to pass away a very little time; I was mostly ingaged with a girl that sat next to me, so that I cannot be positive whether Mr. Ratsey aggravated the affair or not; he was my acquaintance, there were four or five different companies in the house.

Q. Did Whitehead join your company?

Priestly. No, he did not; I began to imagine once every thing was reconciled, and that there would be no more quarreling.

Q. Do you remember the time of Mr. Jolley's going out of the house?

Priestly He went out soon after the girl went out; I cannot be positive whether it was Mr. Jolley, or Mr. Esgate, one of them was going out of the room. Mr. Dane said, he was not to go along with her, and stopped him. Another person came up, and asked him, what he had to say to him; Mr. Dane wanted to know the reason of his interfering; he said, because he was either his brother or his friend, I don't know which. Some time after, I believe one of them had been out, for I saw him returning.

Q. Had the prisoner any sword drawn, before he went out?

Priestly. He had a sword with him, but I did not see it drawn at that time.

Q. Who returned with that person, when he came in again?

Priestly. I saw some others come in, that I took to be Mr. Jolley's friends, there were four or five of them. Then Mr. Jolley came up to Mr. Ratsey, and said, You are the occasion of all this, and come out with me. Mr. Ratsey was knocked down I believe; I desired the quarrel might be made up. Then a tray began with those people that came in, and our company; Mr. Dane was then in the passage.

The Last Part of these Proceedings will be published in a few Days.

Old Bailey Proceedings front matter.
21st October 1761
Reference Numbert17611021-30

Related Material

ActionsCite this text | Print-friendly version | Report an error

THE PROCEEDINGS ON THE King's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery FOR THE CITY of LONDON; And also the Gaol Delivery for the County of MIDDLESEX, HELD AT JUSTICE-HALL in the OLD-BAILEY, On Wednesday the 21st, Thursday the 22d, Friday the 23d, Saturday the 24th, and Monday the 26th of OCTOBER.

In the first and Second Years of His MAJESTY's Reign. Being the Eighth SESSION in the MAYORALTY of The Right Honble Sir Matthew Blakiston , Knt. LORD-MAYOR of the CITY of LONDON.



Printed, and sold by J. SCOTT, at the Black-Swan, in Pater-noster Row.



King's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery held for the City of London, &c.

Q. DID you see him strike any-body?

Priestly. No, I did not; I saw several blows made at Mr. Ratsey. I was more concerned to mitigate the matter, than to take notice of what passed.

Q. Do you remember the deceased's party going out of the house?

Priestly. Whether they went of their own accord, or were drove out, I cannot say; but after that, one or two assisting me, I shut and bolted the door.

Q. What company was in the house while the door was shut?

Priestly. There were Mr. Dane, Mr. Ratsey, and me.

Q. How many companies remained in the room when the door was shut?

Priestly. There might be two or three; we were in the back-room, and some of the company, I believe, went into the front-room. I saw Mr. Whitehead at that time.

Q. Who was that girl that was sitting by you?

Priestly. She goes by the name of Oakley.

Q. How long did the door continue to be shut?

Priestly. I believe it was but a short time before it was opened; it might be shut about four or five minutes; I imagined it was all quiet, only a seafaring person seemed to be very quarrelsome.

Q. Who was he?

Priestly. I can't say who he was, I did not know him, he was a stranger to me, and I believe to Mr. Dane. I said I was very glad they were gone out, and I hoped there would be no more of it.

Q. Whether Mr. Dane had had his sword drawn to that time?

Priestly. I do not remember to have seen it drawn at that time, or before.

Q. How did they get into the house again?

Priestly That I do not know.

Q. Did you hear a noise at the door?

Priestly. No, I did not, I was in the backroom.

Q. Do you remember what happened upon opening of the door?

Priestly. When I went into the passage I found the affray got to as great a height as before; Mr. Dane was then standing on the stairs; I had a stick in my hand; when I went into the passage a person in light-coloured cloaths whipp'd the stick out of my hand, and blamed me for standing idle, that I did not assist. I saw him striking at those that were coming in at the door.

Q. Who was that person?

Priestly. I do not know, it was a stranger to me.

Q. Was it that man that was so quarrelsome?

Priestly. No, it was not.

Q. Was it a seafaring man?

Priestly No, it was not; I believe he had only just come into the house. Mr. Dane told them to keep off, and said he did not want to hurt any of them, but he said, by G - he would defend himself; then I think a person was upon the stairs with him.

Q. What was the next thing that happened?

Priestly. Much about that time I endeavoured to get the door shut; I shut it a second time, but could not get it bolted; another person and I got our shoulders against it.

Q. How many people were there in the passage?

Priestly. I cannot say how many.

Q. Could you keep the door fast?

Priestly. I believe I could but this seafaring person came flourishing his stick. I went to him, and said, Go to your own company. He would have taken our parts; he told me he did not belong to me, but he belonged to the sea, and no-body should use us ill. I do not remember any thing particular that happened afterwards, till I heard a person was wounded.

Q. Did you see a poker there?

Priestly. No, I did not; I could not distinguish a poker from a stick.

Jos. Scofield. I was in the passage when the people came running in at the door a second time.

Q. Did you know the deceased, Hannah?

Scofield. I did; I saw him go in at the door with a poker in his hand

Q. Did you see any thing that he did?

Scofield. I did not.

Q. Look at this poker here produced.

Scofield. I really cannot say that this is the same.

Q. How many people went in with him?

Scofield. There were a number of young fellows went in together?

Q. Who went in first?

Scofield. To the best of my knowledge Hannah did; he went in seemingly in haste; he immediately turned again, and said he was stabb'd, immediately, as soon as he got in.

Christopher Flarty . I live in Bridges-street, Covent-garden; I am a hatter; I was going by with a hat, hearing a noise in the street I stopp'd, and saw the Ben Johnson 's Head door shut, and Mr. Bamber and some other people at the door; every one had sticks in their hands; Mr. Bamber rushed in, and I believe six or seven more; they went down to the bottom of the entry; I believe they were not in a minute before they came out again, and said a man was stabb'd.

Elizabeth Blaney . I was in the house at this time.

Q. Did you see the deceased, Elisha Hannah ?

F. Blaney. I did. he had a poker in his hand.

Q. Look at this poker here produced. (She at it.)

E. Blaney. This is it.

Q. Did you see him do any thing with it?

E. Blaney. He offered to strike the prisoner at the bar with it; I saw him strike at him.

Q. How often?

E. Blaney. Once, and no more.

Q. Did you see him hit the prisoner?

E. Blaney. No, I saw no blow.

Q. How soon after that did he cry out he was stabb'd?

E. Blaney. I cannot say, I was out of the house when he was stabb'd, I was going out at the time.

Q. Had the prisoner then his drawn sword in his hand?

E. Blaney. No, he had not, he was offering to draw it, I saw him put his hand to his sword; I was glad to run out of the house immediately; I saw the deceased strike at him with a poker, and the poker fell, but whether it hit him or not I cannot say; I was very near him, near enough to see the prisoner had a stick in his hand, and that it was wrenched out of his hand by another person.

Elizabeth Philipshill . I was at the Ben Johnson 's Head the night that this happened; I was going out of the house when the deceased came in with the poker in his hand; I asked him what he was going to do; he said no matter to me; he hid the poker behind his coat.

Q. Did you know him before?

E. Philipshill. I had seen him several times before in company, and knew him to be a very quarrelsome person. There was a gentleman who asked who was the gentleman that began the quarrel; they shewed him the gentleman, meaning the prisoner; he said, Now, here I am; you have got your friends about you, I'll fight you now.

Q. Who was that gentleman?

E. Philipshill. It was a tall thin gentleman

Q. Look about, see if you know him. ( She looks at Mr. Jole)

E. Philipshill. That is the gentleman. I saw the deceased lift up the poker to strike a person in the entry; the prisoner was in the fray just by the stair-foot; I can't say whether the deceased struck him or not; at the same time there was no sword drawn; the prisoner had a stick in his hand, and it was wrenched from him his sword being by his side at the same time; I saw no attempt to draw it; but when I returned into the back-room, I heard that the deceased was wounded; I heard the prisoner say he was very sorry

for it, he did not intend it; this was as soon as he was taken in custody.

Q. Did you see the deceased strike with the poker?

E. Philipshill. He struck at the prisoner, but I don't know whether it reached him or not.

Esgate. The witness Blaney says she saw the deceased striking with the poker, and then she was coming out of the house, before the deceased was wounded I am well persuaded there was not time to see a blow given by the deceased, before the deceased was wounded; and I am quite certain no woman came in, or went out of the house, at that door, from the time of the deceased's going in, and coming out again wounded.

Q. How long do you think he was in the house?

Esgate. I don't think he was in the house a minute.

Q. How long is the passage?

Esgate. That is longer than the table in this court. (That is about three or four yards long)

Q. to Blaney. What door did you go out at?

E. Blaney. The street-door.

Esgate. I take upon me to swear no girl came out at that door till after Mr. Hannah came out, and said he was wounded. I was at the outside the door all the time.

Capt. Thomas Summers . I know Mr. Dane. he has failed under my command this war eleven months; he was mate on board the Bellona; he was far from that of a quarrelsome man; he was a very good natured man: he likewise failed under me the last war in the Fortune sloop; he always behaved well, as a good-natured man, or I had never kept him under me; he was mate.

Capt. Edwards. Our ship is now cleaning at Portsmouth: next March Mr. Dane has failed with me two years: he came up now to be examined, in order to be promoted, and he had leave from me for that purpose; I cannot recollect I ever had a complaint against him.

Q. Did you ever find him quarrelsome?

Edwards. No, I never did.

Q. Did he use to beat or misuse your men?

Edwards. I never suffer a man to be struck by an officer on board my ship.

Court. That is very commendable of you; you will never want for men to stand by you in time of action.

Mr. Roper. I am capt. Edwards's first mate on board the Bellona; the prisoner was a very good humane man, and very sober. I never heard any complaints of him.

Guilty Manslaughter .

[Branding. See summary.]

Old Bailey Proceedings front matter.
21st October 1761
Reference Numbert17611021-30

Related Material

ActionsCite this text | Print-friendly version | Report an error

THE PROCEEDINGS ON THE King's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery FOR THE CITY of LONDON; And also the Gaol Delivery for the County of MIDDLESEX, HELD AT JUSTICE-HALL in the OLD-BAILEY, On Wednesday the 21st, Thursday the 22d, Friday the 23d, Saturday the 24th, and Monday the 26th of OCTOBER.

In the first and Second Years of His MAJESTY's Reign. Being the Eighth SESSION in the MAYORALTY of The Right Honble Sir Matthew Blakiston , Knt. LORD-MAYOR of the CITY of LONDON.



Printed, and sold by J. SCOTT, at the Black-Swan, in Pater-noster Row.



King's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery held for the City of London, &c.

Old Bailey Proceedings front matter.
21st October 1761
Reference Numbert17611021-30

Related Material

ActionsCite this text | Print-friendly version | Report an error
Navigation< Previous text (front matter)

THE PROCEEDINGS ON THE King's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery FOR THE CITY of LONDON; And also the Gaol Delivery for the County of MIDDLESEX, HELD AT JUSTICE-HALL in the OLD-BAILEY, On Wednesday the 21st, Thursday the 22d, Friday the 23d, Saturday the 24th, and Monday the 26th of OCTOBER.

In the first and Second Years of His MAJESTY's Reign. Being the Eighth SESSION in the MAYORALTY of The Right Honble Sir Matthew Blakiston , Knt. LORD-MAYOR of the CITY of LONDON.



Printed, and sold by J. SCOTT, at the Black-Swan, in Pater-noster Row.



King's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery held for the City of London, &c.

View as XML