CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT
NINTH SESSION, HELD JUNE 25TH, 1877.
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE,
TAKEN IN SHORT-HAND, BY
JAMES DROVER BARNETT
Short-hand Writers to the Court,
ROLLS CHAMBERS, No. 89, CHANCERY LANE.
THE POINTS OF LAW AND PRACTICE
REVISED AND EDITED, BY
EDWARD T. E. BESLEY, ESQ.,
OF THE MIDDLE TEMPLE, BARRISTER-AT-LAW.
STEVENS & SONS, 119, CHANCERY LANE.
On the Queen's Commission of
OYER AND TERMINER AND GAOL DELIVERY
The City of London,
AND GAOL DELIVERY FOR THE
COUNTY OF MIDDLESEX, AND THE PARTS OF THE COUNTIES OF ESSEX, KENT, AND SURREY, WITHIN THE JURISDICTION
CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT,
Held on Monday, June 25th, 1877, and following days,
BEFORE THE RIGHT HON. SIR THOMAS WHITE , Knt., LORD MAYOR of the City of London; The Hon. Sir ROBERT LUSH , Knt., one of the Justices of the Queen's Bench Division of Her Majesty's High Court of Justice; The Hon. Sir CHARLES POLLOCK , Knt., one of the Barons of the Exchequer Division of Her Majesty's High Court of Justice; and The Hon. Sir WILLIAM VENTRIS FIELD, Knt., one of the Justices of the Queen's Bench Division of Her Majesty's High Court of Justice; Sir ROBERT WALTER CARDEN , Knt., JOHN CARTER , Esq., Sir THOMAS GABRIEL , Bart., Sir THOMAS DAKIN , Knt., WILLIAM JAMES RICHMOND COTTON , Esq., Aldermen of the said City; The Right Hon. RUSSELL GURNEY , Q. C., M.P., Recorder of the said City; THOMAS SCAMBLER OWDEN, Esq., JAMES FIGGINS , Esq., and GEORGE SWAN NOTTAGE , Esq., other of the Aldermen of the said City; Sir THOMAS CHAMBERS , Knt., Q.C., M.P., Common Serjeant of the said City; and ROBERT MALCOLM KERR , Esq., Judge of the Sheriff's Court; Her Majesty's Justices of Oyer and Terminer and General Gaol Delivery of Newgate, holden for the said City, and Judges of the Central Criminal Court.
WILLIAM QUARTERMAINE EAST, Esq.,
CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT.
WHITE, MAYOR. NINTH SESSION.
A star (*) denotes that prisoners have been previously in custody—two stars (**) that they have been more than once in custody—an obelisk (†) that they are known to be the associates of bad characters—the figures after the name in the indictment denote the prisoner's age.
LONDON AND MIDDLESEX CASES.
OLD COURT.—Monday, June 25th, 1877.
Before Mr. Recorder.
The following prisoners PLEADED GUILTY:—
507. CHARLES FREDERICK KING (32) , to unlawfully detaining letters whilst employed under the General Post-office; also to stealing a post-letter, containing a sovereign; also to forging and uttering a receipt for a registered letter.— Eighteen months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
508. WILLIAM WARNER (16) , to four indictments for stealing letters whilst employed in the Post-office; also for obtaining money by false pretence— Six Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
PARSONS— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
SINCLAIR— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment. And [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
MR. BESLEY conducted the Prosecution.
DAVID HANCOCK . I am shopman to Mr. Duerdo, ship chandler, of 138, Miniories, in partnership with two others—on 14th June, about 11.45, a coasting pilot named Wells was in the shop—the prisoner was also there—I was absent for about three minutes; when I returned Wells made a communication to me; I looked and missed a bolt of canvas from a shelf, worth 2l. 15s.; the prisoner was gone—he had no authority to take the canvas.
JOSEPH DUERDO . I have known the prisoner four or five years, he is a block maker—I have given him blocks to repair and have bought new blocks of him—on 14th June I saw him in the shop, Wells was there at the same time; I have known him twelve or thirteen years.
JOHN WELLS . I am a coasting pilot, and live at 3, Evelyn Place, Victoria Road, Deptford—on 14th June, I was in Mr. Duerdo's shop—the prisoner came in afterwards; when Hancock left, the prisoner and I were the only persons in the shop, I went out, leaving the prisoner there—in about ten minutes he came out, carrying a bolt of canvas under his arm—I
said to him "You have got a job, then," he touched me in the ribs and laughed, and went towards the docks—I went into the shop and spoke to Hancock.
FREDERICK LAWLEY (City Detective). I took the prisoner into custody, and told him the charge, he said "I know nothing about it; I have no canvas and no money"—I said "A man named Wells saw you coming out of the shop with it under your arm," he said "I know nothing about it; I don't know Wells"—I said he was a pilot,"—he said "Oh, these old pilots, who knows that he did not take it.
The prisoner received a good character.— NOT GUILTY
NEW COURT.—Monday, June 25th, 1877.
Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq. '
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and EYRE LLOYD conducted the Prosecution; and MR. RIBTON the Defence.
JAMES HARPER . My father keeps the King's Arms, Little Mitchell Street, St. Luke's—I serve in the bar—on April 16th, between 2 and 3 o'clock, the prisoner came and asked for a glass of stout and mild, which would come to 1 1/2 d.—she put down one shilling, drank her beer, took her change and went away—I examined the shilling and found it was bad—I gave it to my father—the prisoner came again about a week after and asked for some stout and mild, and tendered a shilling; I gave her the change, and she went away—the shilling I found to be bad; I did not say anything to her about it; I knew her—she afterwards came again, when my uncle, Mr. Cook was serving—I recognised her; I did not then see the shilling pass on the 19th May she again came; I served her—I afterwards examined the shilling and found it bad; I recognised the prisoner that time also—I was then alone in the bar, but I fetched my uncle out of the yard and he stopped the prisoner—the prisoner then said she took it from some one; I sent for a constable and gave her in charge—I gave the shilling to the constable; the other two I gave to my father.
Cross-examined. The prisoner was a customer—I knew her from her coming; we had kept the house four months—my father marked down the date "16th April," that is how I remember it—I bent the shilling to try it, but before that I put it on the counter over the till, where I left it till she was going out—we had received two or three bad shillings, and I told father I would watch her.
JOHN HARPER . I keep the King's Arms—on April 16th, my son gave me a bad shilling—I marked it, wrapped it in paper and put it in my purse—I afterwards received another bad shilling, which I placed on a shelf in the bar parlour after making a hole in it.
ALFRED COOK . I live at the King's Arms, and am the first witness' uncle—I was serving in the bar early in May last, when the prisoner came and called for a glass of stout and mild; after she was gone I tried the shilling and found it was bad; I destroyed it by throwing it in the fire—that shilling was then the only one in the till—the prisoner had some silver and copper in her hand at the time.
NOT GUILTY .
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and EYRE LLOYD conducted the Prosecution.
ALEXANDER MCDONALD . I am manager of the Eagle Tavern, in the City Road—the prisoner came there on 11th June, about 7.30 p.m.; my wife, who was standing by me served him with a glass of ale; he tendered a shilling—my wife called my attention to it; I examined it and found it was bad—the prisoner said he did not know where he got it from—I gave it him back, my wife having defaced it; and he paid for his ale and left, I followed and told a constable.
ELIZABETH WALLACE . I live at the Napoleon III. beer-house, in Shepherdess Walk—on 11th June, between 7 and 8 p.m., the prisoner came to my place of business and called for a glass of port—he tendered a shilling, and I gave him 9d. change, and put the shilling in the till—Police-constable Crow hurts came in afterwards, and from what he said I looked in the till and found three shillings, one of them bad—I gave the bad one to the constable and he took the prisoner into custody.
MARY MILLS . I live at 67, Norfolk Road, Islington, and let lodgings—a woman named Brown, who is a prisoner here, took lodgings at my house on Monday, 16th October, and paid me the first rent—the prisoner and Brown and another female occupied the room—Brown said she went out to work, but she did not—on the 11th June two constables came, and I shewed them the room; the two females were there—the policemen searched the room and took the females away.
HENRY CROWHURST (Policeman N 156). On 11th June the witness McDonald pointed out the prisoner to me—I followed him into the Napoleon III. public-house, and saw Mrs. Wallace give him change—I took hold of the prisoner, who tried to get his hand into his pocket, but I put mine in, and found another bad shilling—I saw the till emptied, and the other bad shilling taken out—the prisoner gave me a false address, but I afterwards went to 67, Norfolk Road, and on searching a room there found fifty-five bad shillings in blue paper, nine bad florins, and a quantity of new stationery—I took two women into custody—I found on the prisoner 6s.6d. in silver and 1s. in bronze good money.
Prisoner's Defence. I knew nothing about what was in the house or how they got there, I was not there to receive it.
He also PLEADED GUILTY to a conviction of a similar offence in October, 1873. (See next case.)
GUILTY . HARDING— Five Years' Penal Servitude. BROWN and BURT— Two Years' Imprisonment.
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and LLOYD conducted the Prosecution.
THOMAS BANNISTER (Police Inspector R). I was lately of the E Division—on June 11th I saw the prisoner at the Two Spies public-house, King Street, Long Acre, about 9 o'clock in the evening, with three others, one named John Hall, now awaiting his trial—they then went through Covent Garden into the Strand; I followed—Harlington went into a restaurant—I watched them—shortly afterwards they came from the restaurant and passed the Coach and Horses public-house—the prisoner entered one bar and I another—I saw him give a 2s. piece—the barman tried it; it was bad—I posted men outside to assist—the barman called a constable and pointed out the prisoner, and they all ran away—I returned to the public-house, and the barmaid handed me the 2s. piece—on the following Saturday, June 16th, about 3 p.m., I was with Detective Kerley, near Lincoln's Inn Fields—we watched the prisoner—he went to a little boy and gave him something—the boy went into the Castle in Portugal Street—I followed—Kerley waited outside—the boy got some rum in a bottle, and tendered a half-crown—when I came out the prisoner was waiting at the top of the street—I took him into custody—I took him to the public-house, and there saw Kerley pick up the bad half-crown—we got assistance and carried the prisoner to the station—on being searched we found three counterfeit half-crowns in the lining of his coat, loose—the prisoner said "You b——, you put them there"—he afterwards said he picked them up.
FREDERICK KERLEY (Detective Officer E). I was with Bannister—I took the prisoner into custody—I heard the half-crown drop when we pushed the prisoner into the public-house—he said "I know nothing about it"—next morning the prisoner said he picked up the money in Red Lion Street—I said "Last night you accused the sergeant with putting them in your pocket"—he made no reply.
MARY ANN BARBER . I am barmaid at the Coach and Horses in the Strand—the prisoner came there on 11th June, between 10 and 11 p.m., and asked for some stout and mild, and gave men bad 2s. piece—the prisoner said he did not know it was bad and that he had no more bad money—he afterwards put down a good sixpence and ran away without his change—I identified the prisoner at Bow Street.
LOUISA PARRY . I serve at the Castle public-house—on the 16th the little boy in Court came and asked for a quartern of rum and tendered half-a-crown in payment; it was bad—I gave it to Bannister; I saw him mark it.
Market—on June 16 a lad about 12 years of age came, about 4 o'clock, and asked for half quartern of rum in a bottle, and gave me half a crown; it was bad—I bent it and gave it him back, and he went away.
Prisoner's Defence. I did not know they were bad when I picked them up.
GUILTY*— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and E. LLOYD conducted the Prosecution; and MR. WRIGHT the Defence.
WILLIAM WALKER . I keep a refreshment house at 63, Broad Street, Bloomsbury—on 28th May the prisoner bought a penny pipe, for which he tendered a bad shilling to my wife—he said he got it in Holborn—I gave him into custody.
EDMUND BROWN (Policeman 169 E). I took the prisoner into custody—he said he had the bad shilling from a house in the Seven Dials—the prisoner dropped a packet on the way to the station; the prosecutor's son picked it up—it contained eight counterfeit shillings, with paper between—I found 8s. 3d. on the prisoner, 11d. in bronze.
Cross-examined. There was no crowd—it took place in Broad Street.
WILLIAM WALKER . I am the son of the first witness—the prisoner came to our house on 28th May and passed a bad shilling—I followed him—near Brownlow Street he dropped a packet—I picked it up and gave it to the constable.
Cross-examined. There was no crowd—the prisoner is a stranger to me.
The Prisoner received a good character.
GUILTY— Judgment respited.
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and E. LLOYD conducted the Prosecution.
MARY ANN NASH . I am barmaid at the Apple Tree public-house, Mount Pleasant, Clerkenwell—on 19th May the prisoner called for a quartern of gin and tendered a bad sovereign—I gave it to Mr. Reynolds, who gave him in charge—he said he took it of his governor in Fetter Lans; I forget the name.
ISAAH BARLOW (Policeman G 105). I took the prisoner into custody—he said he received the coin from his employer in Fetter Lane; I forget" the name—then he said he got in change for a 5l. note—I found three sixpences on him and 2d. good money—he told me on the 23rd to go to Speight's in Fetter Lane, and after that to a Mr. Hawkins.
Prisoner's Defence. I got the money in change.
GUILTY— Judgment respited.
THIRD COURT—Monday, June 25th, 1877.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
521. JOHN DRAPER (21) , to breaking and entering the shop of William Leake Davis, and stealing a quantity of metal; also to two other indictments for larceny— Twelve Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
OLD COURT.—Tuesday, June 26th, 1877.
Before Mr. Recorder.
The following Prisoners PLEADED GUILTY:—
522. THOMAS BROUGH CAMERON (36) , to embezzling 35l., of Joseph George Raven— To enter into his own recognisances to appear and receive judgment if called upon. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
526. WILLIAM WALLACE MACARTNEY (29) , to unlawfully obtaining the sums of 5l. 6s. 9d., 3l. 9s. 5d., and 3l. 14s. 7d. by false pretences— Twelve Months' Imprisonment. And [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
527. GEORGE HART (26) , to a burglary in the dwelling-house of Alexander Black, and stealing a hat and other articles, having been before convicted of felony— Seven Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
MR. BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. MONTAGU WILLIAMS the Defence.
REGINALD STAPLES . I am a servant at Alford House, Prince's Gate—on 14th or 10th November last I was in the Brompton Road between 4 and 5 o'clock, and saw the prisoners with another man—Williams was dressed as a baker, with flour about his clothes, Cameron was dressed about the same as he is now—Williams had a bird in a bag and Cameron had one in a cage, which he wanted to give, with 10s., to Williams for his bird—Williams would not take it; he walked on—I heard Cameron and the other man say that it was a good bird, and the other man told Cameron to go and bounce Williams out of it—Cameron went after Williams and said that the bird was no good, and he bad better take the money—Williams would not hear anything he had to say about it, and ran on—I went after him, and he turned and said to me "Would you let them have the bird"—I said "No, I heard them say it was a good bird and worth 3l."—he said "You can have it, if you like, for 30s.,"—I said I did not want it—he said he wanted it to have a good home, that he had caught it in the bake house, that it whistled beautifully, but he was obliged to part with it, as his mistress overhead was very ill and could not bear the whistling of it, and as he was obliged to sell it, he would take 30s. for it—at that time Cameron came up and said he very much wanted the bird and he would give 3l. for it, that he had not the money with him, but if Williams would come to his house in the Edgware Road he would give him the 3l.—Williams declined to do
so, as his time was up to be in to his work—Cameron was jumping about I pretending he should lose all chance of buying the bird, and I was induced I to buy it on the condition that Cameron should come in the course of an hour with the money and fetch the bird, and if not Williams was to have it back—Williams said that he lived at Mr. Flack's, the baker's, just over the way, and had lived there five years—he went home with me, and I gave him 30s. and took the bird—the prisoners never came to the house afterwards—I put the bird in a cage with some water, and it got into the water and washed all the paint off, and in three or four days I found it dead in the water—it was a sparrow.
Cross-examined. I am sure it was a common street sparrow—I thought that Cameron would come back with the money for the bird—I parted with my money on that belief.
Re-examined. I believed what Williams said as to where he lived and what he said about the bird—that influenced me in buying the bird.
EDWARD CLOUGH (Detective Officer B). I took the prisoners into custody on 28th May—I had heard of this case—Williams was dressed as a baker and Cameron as a working man—Williams had this paper bag in his hand, and a bird they called a bullfinch—I have seen the prisoners together on several occasions.
Cross-examined. I took them in custody for loitering—I gave the bird up to Williams' wife; it was a bullfinch, but not worth a half-crown.
The Prisoners had been in custody before on similar charges.
WILLIAMS —Three Months' Imprisonment.
CAMERON— Six Months' Imprisonment.
MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution.
JULIUS LINDROP . I live at 116, Minories, and am an hotel-keeper—on 7th June, at 5.30, I was standing on Tower Hill—I saw the prisoner talking to another man—I passed them five or six paces—the prisoner came up and tapped me on the shoulder, and said "Are you the gentleman that came in the Boulogne boat?"—at the same time I felt a sudden jerk, but I. had a walking-stick in my hand, and I thought I had done it myself with that—I walked on a few steps, and then found that my watch and chain. was gone—I turned round and saw the two men talking very eagerly, and the prisoner had a white handkerchief in his hand—there were no other men near me—I gave the prisoner into custody—my watch was worth about 20l.—it has since been returned to me by the landlady of the house where. I was lodging, on the Monday morning; she said she had found it under. my pillow—I told the landlord that it looked very queer—he used rough language, and I went and told the inspector—I am quite sure that I had the watch in my pocket before the prisoner came up to me, and directly afterwards it was missing—the landlady, Mrs. Taylor, is here.
MARGARET TAYLOR . I live at 116, Minories—the prosecutor lodged with me—he was not home all Thursday night, he came home between 12 and 1 o'clock on Friday morning, and told me he had been robbed 'of his watch a few doors up the Minories—afterwards I went to make his bed, and found the watch and chain between the two feather beds—he is a German, and
sleeps between two beds—an old servant, who had called on me that day, was helping me—the prosecutor was not at home then—I have no idea how the watch came there, he must have left it there himself—no one but himself had access to the room—as a rule he always took the key with him, but that day he left it on the table to have his bed made—he had the key in his own possession on the Thursday, and he never came home all night,
JULIUS LINDROP (re-examined). I did not take the key with me when I went out on the Thursday—I hung it in its usual place in the kitchen, where a lot of people are in and out—I was out all the Thursday night—I am sure I had the watch in my pocket when I went out on Thursday—I usually carried it with me, and when I came home I hung it on a nail over the wash-stand, and if it did drop it would fall on the carpet—I never put it between the beds—I had felt it safe about ten minutes before I lost it—I only got the watch back on the 11th.
JAMES KIBSON (Policeman H 183). The prisoner was given into my custody by the prosecutor for stealing his watch—he denied it, and said he had only asked him if he was the gentleman that he had taken a parcel to the Boulogne boat for on the Monday which he was not paid for.
The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate and in his Defence was that he had taken a parcel to the boat for a gentleman, and thinking the prosecutor was the person, he went up and asked him the—question, but denied taking the watch.
MARGARET TAYLOR (re-examined). I did not see the prosecutor to give him back his watch until the 11th; he was out every day—I found it on Friday afternoon and waited till my husband came off duty; he is a policeman, and was on duty at Fishmongers' Hall—when he came home I asked him what I should do with it, and he immediately went and reported it at the Leman Street police-station—the prosecutor was out all Friday night and Saturday night, and came home between 1 and 2 o'clock in the morning—my husband let him in—my husband is now here on duty in the other Court.
THOMAS TAYLOR (City Policeman 722, who had been sent for). I first saw the watch on the Friday evening after I came home, about 8 o'clock—the prosecutor did not come home that night, nor till between 1 and 2 o'clock on Sunday morning—I had to go downstairs in my shirt and let him in—I did not give him his watch then; he was the worse for drink and I did not speak to him—I did not see him all day on Sunday; I was waiting to see him come down—I went on duty at 1.30 and sent my wife up, and he was then gone out—I went to the police-station on the Friday night and told them that I had the watch' and where it had been found—I know nothing of the prisoner or any of his friends.
MARGARET TAYLOR (re-examined). I did not see him till the Monday morning—I went up to his room on Sunday and knocked and no one answered—I told him on the Monday that I had found his watch between the bed and mattress—he said "Who brought it back?"—I said "No one brought it back, sir, I found it."
JULIUS LINDROP (re-examined). It is not true; I was at home on Friday, and Taylor opened the door to me on the Saturday night between 10 and 11 o'clock—I was not the worse for liquor—on the Sunday morning I went to Mrs. Taylor, for my washing and she gave it me, so she cannot say she did not see me.
NOT GUILTY .
WILLIAM ARTHUR ROGERS . I am an insurance clerk and agent, and live at 1, Torrens Street, Clapham—about 1.30 on 4th June I was in Cheapside, opposite Sir John Bennett's—I had a silver Geneva watch in my waistcoat pocket, with a gold Albert chain attached through a button-hole—I felt a push against me; I looked down and caught the prisoner with his hand on my chain—I took the end of the chain out of his hand—I saw his other hand go behind to some one in the crowd and nay watch was gone—I told him he had taken my watch—he said I might search him—I said I did not wish to search him, as he had passed it on.
ARTHUR WEBB . I live at 4, Oakley Terrace, Peckham—on 4th June I was opposite Sir John Bennett's and saw the prisoner passing through the crowd sideways, right in front of the prosecutor—I saw his hand on the prosecutor's chain, and the prosecutor took him out into the road and gave him, into custody—I did not see the watch.
THOMAS REED (City Policeman 658). The prisoner was given into my custody—he said "I have not got the watch, policeman; search me"—I took him to the station and found on him 16s. 3d. and a piece of human hair.
GUILTY — Six Months' Imprisonment.
MR. CROOME conducted the Prosecution; and MR. WARNER SLEIGH the Defence.
ELIZA BEAUMONT . I am the wife of Robert Beaumont, a cabinet-maker, near Leeds—on 31st May, by my mother's direction, I wrote a letter unclosing a post-office order for 5l. to Messrs. Barnett and' Co.; this is it—I posted it myself.
ELIZA ROLANDS . I am housekeeper at 4, King Street, Cheapside—Mrs. Montague Barnett has an office there—there are other letter-boxes to the door besides his; his box has a glass face to it—on the morning of 1st June, a little past 8 o'clock, I was cleaning the stairs—I went down and saw what, was in the box—it is no part of my duty to open Mr. Barnett's box—I saw that there were letters in it; I then went upstairs again—about half an hour after one of the office lads spoke to me—I then went downstairs and looked at Messrs. Barnett's bos, and it was then empty—I did not notice whether it was locked or open.
SAMUEL COHEN . I am confidential clerk to Messrs. Montague Barnett and Co.—when I went to business on the morning of 1st June my attention was directed to the letter-box by the housekeeper—I found it open and the letters gone—I had locked it the morning before—no one had a right to open it, and no one had a key but—myself, as far as I know—the signature of Barnett and Co." to this post-office order is not the signature of our firm or anything like it—I went to Bow Lane and then to the post-office and gave notice.
CHARLES WHITE . I am cashier at the Money-order Office, St. Martin's le Grand—on 1st June, between 10.30 and 11 o'clock, the prisoner presented this post-office order—I had previously received notice from Messrs. Barnett and Co.—it was already signed "Barnett and Co."—I asked the prisoner the address of Messrs. Barnett and Co.; he said he did not know—I then
asked how he became possessed of the order—he said that a man gave it to him to cash it, and was waiting for him at the end of a dead wall—I said "Can you show us the man?"—he said yes he could—on that I called Tye, the constable, and he and the prisoner went out together.
JOHN EDWARD TYE . I am constable and housekeeper at the the Chief Money-order Office in Aldersgate Street—on 1st June Mr. White called me to the prisoner, and I went out with him—he told me that a gentleman asked him to change the order for him and gave him 2d., and if he made haste he was to give him 1s.—I said "Where were you to take it to?"—he he said "Up Bull and Mouth Street, opposite the Post-office, where there was a dead wall"—I asked if he could describe the man—he said he had pepper and salt coat, blue striped trousers, a tall hat, and an umbrella under his arm—I went with him to Bull and Mouth Street, but saw no such person—I then gave him into custody.
Cross-examined. He did not mention Bull and Mouth Street—he said he did not know the name of the street, but he pointed it out.
EDWIN BUTLER (Policeman). The prisoner was given into my custody—I asked if he had got any other letters about him—he produced two or three addressed to himself, and said that was all he had—I then searched him.—I asked him who signed the order—he said it was signed before it was given to him—I then asked him to write the name of Burnett and Co.—he first wrote "Barrett and Co."—I asked him to write Burnett and Co., and he wrote it over again on this paper (produced).
NOT GUILTY .
DAVID WILSON . I am a clerk in the employ of Messrs. Kempster and Co., of St. Bride's Avenue, City—on going to business on the morning of 19th May, at 8.50, I found the letter-box broken open and the letters on the floor.
EDWARD JOHN BIRMAN . I am manager to Messrs. Kempster, publishers—on the morning of 19th May Wilson gave me a number of letters when I arrived, about 9 o'clock—they were all addressed to the editor of the "Good Templars," one of our publications—letters containing money are not, as a rule, addressed to the editor, but to the firm—Mr. Gillett, of Banbury, was indebted to us 4l. 11s. 6d. for temperance works—we had sent him two invoices before the 19th—this (produced) is one of them; it was handed to me by Sergeant Brett—it ought to have contained a cheque for 4l. 11s. 6d.
Cross-examined. I had put this invoice in a letter directed to Mr. Gillett, and put it with others to be posted.
CHARLES JOSEPH STATHAM . I am a letter-carrier of the East Central District—St. Bride's Avenue is in my delivery—on the morning of the 19th May I delivered some letters into the box of Messrs. Kempster, including letters from the country.
HENRY BRICKNELL . I am clerk to Mr. Pearce, solicitor, of Banbury; ho is honorary secretary of the Managing Committee of the Banbury Temperance Hall—I received two invoices from Mr. Pearce, and enclosed them in a letter with a cheque for 4l. 11s. 6d. to Messrs. Kempster—I cannot say that this is one of the invoices.
NOT GUILTY .
There was another indictment against the prisoner for forging and uttering an order for 5l., upon which no evidence was offered.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. BESLEY conducted the Prosecution.
JOSEPH TAYLOR . I am caretaker of St. George's Hall, Barnsbury; it is a public institution—on Tuesday night, 5th June, I left the hall at 8 o'clock; all the doors and windows were fastened except one over the balcony, which was left open about 3 inches to admit air—that window had cords to it—about 5 o'clock on the Wednesday morning I found the cords cut and the window slipped down—I examined the premises and found the harmonium taken out of the case, the library door cut all to pieces and forced open, and this piece of the blade of a knife among the splinters—thirty or forty books had been moved from the shelves, and were lying on the floor as if to be taken away—no property was taken away.
CHARLES SMITH (Policeman N 229). I took the prisoner into custody on Saturday, 9th June—I found on him two knives—this one has a portion of the blade broken off—I have compared the piece found with it, and it fits exactly—I asked him what he used the knife for—he said for nothing, that it was a favourite handle, and he was keeping it to have a new blade put in it.
Prisoner. I never said so. Witness. The sergeant was present and heard him.
Prisoner's Defence. I picked it up in the Liverpool Road.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. BESLEY conducted the Prosecution.
CHARLES SMITH (Policeman N 229). On Saturday morning, 9th June, about 2.45, I was on duty at the corner of Albert Terrace, and saw the prisoner, with two other young men, standing at the corner—I watched them from one street to another, and they watched me for a considerable time—I went down the next street, and saw them all three again at the corner of Russell Court—they went through there, and I lost sight of them for about ten minutes—I next saw them in Chapel Street; the prisoner was on the pavement and the other two were in the court—I concealed myself in a doorway—they all three crossed the road into White Conduit Street, and stayed there about three minutes—the prisoner came back to the corner and looked down Chapel Street—there was no other person in the street—I went back to Albert Terrace and saw the prisoner leave the doorstep of No. 2—as soon as he saw me he ran away, down Albert Street into Denmark Street—I went the reverse way and met him—I took hold of his arm, and asked him what he was loitering about for at that hour in the morning—he said "Nothing," that he lived in Elliott's Place, Essex Road, and he could not sleep for the bugs—I said "Where are those other two men that were with you a few minutes ago"—he said "Gone to work"—I said "Where"—he said "At Batey's Ginger-Beer Manufactory"—I said "Where do you work"—he said "At a milk shop in Camden Terrace"—I took him back to the corner of Albert Terrace, and discovered the fanlight of No. 2 wide open—I rang Mr. Prior up, and when he came down I took the prisoner
into the shop—I noticed that the things were disarranged and the doors open—the strings supporting the fanlight were cut, which would let the fanlight drop so that a person could get in easily—there was a very strong broken bell on the side of the door; any one could easily put their feet on that and get to the fanlight—the prisoner was wearing cloth trowsers, I believe.
HENRY PRIOR . I am a dairyman, of 2, Albert Terrace—on Tuesday night I left my premises secure, except the fanlight, which was open about 3 inches at the top; it was kept open by a cord—next morning I was roused by the constable—I missed a coat and a money-box, belonging to my son, containing 1l.—the back door was open, and a plank placed on the back walls, by which a person might escape.
He also PLEADED GUILTY* to a previous conviction at Clerkenwell in October, 1875— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
NEW COURT.—Tuesday, June 26th, 1877.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and LLOYD conducted the Prosecution; and MR. W. SLEIGH defended Crow.
THOMAS BANNISTER (Police Inspector R). On 14th June, shortly after 10 o'clock p.m., I was on duty in Seven Dials with Roots and Andrews, and saw the prisoners and another man leave the Grapes public-house and go through Covent Garden into the Strand—the man not in custody and Crow entered the Vaudeville Restaurant—I looked through the glass door and saw Crow pass a half-crown in payment for some drink—they came out and joined Hall, and went through a bye-lane down a court to the Gaiety Restaurant—Crow went in, the man not in custody went round the corner, and Hall remained outside—I entered by another door, and heard Crow call for a glass of bitter and tender a half-crown—I went to the door and gave instructions to the officers outside, and as I returned, Crow passed out—I followed him, seized him, and said "I shall take you for passing counterfeit coin in the house"—he said "I have not been in here"—I took him inside and said to the barmaid "This man has given you a bad half-crown"—she said "He has not, I have not taken a bad half-crown"—I said "I saw him give it to you"—she said "He gave me a 3d. bit"—I said "You look in your till and see if you have not a bad half-crown"—she looked, and said "There is only one half-crown here, and that is bad; I made a mistake, he did give me a bad half-crown, and it was a gentleman standing by the side of him who gave me the 3d. bit"—a gentleman there said "He gave you a half-crown, I saw him"—I don't remember that Crow said anything to that—I sent two officers to the station with him, and went in search of Hall—we found him in the Wellington public-house, drinking out of a pewter pot—Andrews and I got hold of him, and I said "We shall take you in custody for being concerned in passing counterfeit coin"—he said "You hare made a mistake"—we took him to the station, and Andrews searched him, and took from his pocket these eight counterfeit half-crowns (produced) wrapped up separately, with paper between each—I found on Crow
6s. 6d., 4 1/2 d. in bronze, a knife, and two keys—I went to the Vaudeville Restaurant and spoke to the proprietor, who opened his till, and I saw three half-crowns in it, one of which was counterfeit—I marked it; this is it.
Cross-examined. No bad money was found on Crow—I never at any time told Mr. Romano that Crow was the man who had passed the bad half-crown in his restaurant—I know that he has a doubt whether Crow is the man—he saw Crow at the station, and he could not identify him—I will not swear whether Crow was placed with others—Crow was standing up in the inspector's room—I cannot say positively whether I told Mr. Romano that that was the man I had in my charge who had passed the bad half-crown at the Vaudeville, but, if I did, it was certainly not till after Mr. Romano had said that he was not the man—I should not have said it before, because It would not have been just to the prisoner—Crow was not standing alone; Hall was there, and several others—I have made enquiries about Crow, and find that he was in the service of Mr. Whitehouse, the optician, of Coventry Street.
Re-examined. Another man was with Crow at the Vaudeville—Crow was nearest the door, and the other man was on the other side—I have no doubt that Crow is the man who put down the half-crown.
By ME. W. SLEIGH. The two men went in together and stood near each other.
ALPHONSE ROMANO . I keep the Vaudeville Restaurant, Strand—on 14th June, about 10.30, two men came in—they each had a glass of beer, which was paid for with a half-crown—I put it in the till, and gave a florin, a 3d. piece, and 1d. in change—the inspector came in ten minutes afterwards, and I found three half-crowns in the till, one of which was bad, and I gave it to him—I think I received it from Crow.
ANNIE GILLOTT . I am barmaid at the Gaiety Restaurant—on 14th June, between 10 and 10.30 p.m., I served a man, who I cannot swear to, with a glass of beer—there were two of them; one gave me a half-crown and the other 3d.—I put the half-crown in the till, where there was no other, gave the change, and they left—Inspector Bannister shortly afterwards brought the prisoner in, but I did not recognise him—he said "This man has given you a bad half-crown"—I said "No," but I looked in the till and found one and gave it to him.
CHARLES ORSICH . I am a photographer, of 352, Strand—on 14th June I was in the Gaiety Restaurant with a friend—Crow came in, called for a glass of bitter, and put down a half-crown on the marble counter—there was a peculiar ring about it, which I noticed—I saw the barmaid give him the change—he drank the beer and went out very quickly—another man was on his right, who paid with a 3d. bit, and stood about a foot from him—I then saw the inspector bring Crow in by the collar, saying "This man has given you a bad half-crown"—the barmaid said "No"—he said "Look in your till," and she did so and found one, but she immediately said "No," it was a 3d. bit "—Crow caught up her words and said "It was a 3d. bit I gave her."
Cross-examined. I did not say that at the police-court about the 3d. bit—I was not asked the question.
WALTER ANDREWS (Detective Sergeant). I was with Bannister and Roots in Seven Dials—I followed the prisoners and saw Crow go into the Vaudeville; Hall remained outside—I stayed outside and saw Crow come out and another man; they joined Hall, and all walked together up Bull Inn Court
and remained talking some time—they then went down Maiden Lane into Southampton Street and the Strand, and Crow went into the Gaiety Restaurant; Hall remained outside—I received a communication from Bannister, and he and I followed Hall to the Wellington public-house, arrested him and partly searched him, and found eight bad half-crowns wrapped in paper, and a pawn ticket, but no good money.
WILLIAM WEBSTER . I am in the employ, of the Mint—these two half-crowns are counterfeit; one is of 1846 and the other of 1874—these eight half-crowns found on Hall are counterfeit; two are of 1846, and six of 1874, from the same two moulds as the first two.
Hall's Defence. A young man asked me to go for a walk. He went into a public-house with another man and came out with a parcel, and said "Just put that into your pocket, and I will treat you in a minute." We went to the Gaiety, and when he came out I ran away.
HALL— GUILTY — Five Years' Penal Servitude.
CROW received a good character.— GUILTY. The Jury recommended him to mercy, but the police stated that he was the associate of utterers of counterfeit coin — Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
MR. DOUGLAS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. T. COLE the Defence.
ETHEL WOUDHUYSEN . I am the wife of Joseph Woudhuysen—on 4th June, about 4.30 p.m., I was on the Holborn Viaduct, entering Messrs. Meeking's shop, and felt a tug at my watch chain—I looked down and saw a watch and chain in the prisoner's hand—I had not noticed him before—he said "I beg your pardon"—I immediately took hold of him and said "You have got my watch"—I saw him give it to another man, who ran away—the prisoner tried to get away, but I called a constable and gave him in charge—he struggled, but not very violently; I held tight on to him—I have not recovered my watch; it was worth 8l.
Cross-examined. I held him by the arm—it was three or four minutes before a policeman came—several people were looking on, and two or three persons came out from the shop—I only had a lady friend with me—I saw my watch safe ten minutes before I lost it—I took it out in the street—it had a gold chain fastened to a button-hole, and it was in a watch pocket—a silver watch was shown me at the station, which was not mine; mine was gold—I had been looking into the shop about three minutes.
HARRY DORMAN (City Policeman 346). On 4th June, about 4.30, the prosecutrix called me; she was holding the prisoner by Meeking's shop, and gave him in custody for stealing her watch—on the road to the station he threw something away—I spoke to another constable, who went to the place and found an old silver verge watch—the prisoner said that he did not throw that away; he threw away the bowl of a pipe—he was asked why, and said that it looked bad for the dirty bowl of a pipe to be found in his possession.
Cross-examined. The prosecutrix said "He has taken my watch and passed it to another man"—he said "I did not take it"—the silver watch which was picked up has not been claimed.
ALICE LINSELL . I am single, and live at 30, Regent Square, Gray's Inn Road—I was with Mrs. Woudhuysen, outside Meeking's shop, and saw the prisoner dodging about, and said "What are you doing?"—he made no
answer, but went away for a short time, but came back to the doorway as we were going in and came against Mrs. Woudhuysen; but before this he came to me, but found that I had no watch—she turned to me and said "My watch is gone," and she took hold of the prisoner—he tried to get away, but she held him till a constable came.
EBENEZER MEERS (City Policeman 254). I saw the prisoner in the custody of another officer—he said something, and I went to a hoarding and picked up this watch (produced)—the bow is broken—the prisoner did not claim it.
Cross-examined. Nobody has claimed it.
Be was further charged with a previous conviction at Clerkenwell in 1875, to which he
PLEADED GUILTY**— Two Years' Imprisonment.
MR. ST. AUBYN conducted the Prosecution.
JOSHUA JOLLY . I live at 13, Mansell Street, Aldgate, and am slaughter boy at Mr. Horwitz's—on 4th June, about 10.30, I saw the three prisoners come from Mr. Horwitz's premises and go in different directions—I knew that there had been a quantity of fat shortly before, packed up in two bags, and hanging on a hook in the slaughter-house—I went into the slaughter-house and missed it, and then found it in a passage 50 yards from the premises—I am sure the prisoners are the men—I knew them before.
Cross-examined by Murray. I did not halloa out because you ran away.
SOLOMON HORWITZ . I am a meat salesman, of 66, High Street, Aldgate—Jolly is in my employ—about 9.30 on this night I saw my fat hanging up in my laughter-house—I next saw it at about 10.30, when a policeman called me—it was worth 3l. 12s. 6d.
WILLIAM HUTT (City Detective). On the morning of 6th June I apprehended Murray at the Three Tuns, Aldgate—a slaughterman came and said "Your mate is taken up by a policeman, you get away as fast as you can"—I told Murray I wanted him for being concerned in stealing fat—he said "All right."
WILSON COCK (City Policeman 730). On 6th June, about 11 o'clock, I took Hubbart in Mansell Street, and told him it was for stealing fat—he said "All right, it is always us, but you make a mistake this time, perhaps."
BRIDGET HENNESSEY . I am servant to Mr. Horwitz—on 5th June, about 9.10 p.m., I went out for some beer—I was only gone five minutes—I only went next door—when I came back Castle was standing in the passage—I said "What do you want?"—he gave me no answer, but said to Hubbart "I thought the man was working here"—I then fastened the door—they could get from that passage to the slaughter-house.
FREDERICK MILLARD (City Policeman 721). On 6th June, about 2.30, I took Castle—he said "All right, I will go with you; I suppose it is being, with them. I left them at 8 o'clock, and was at home at half-past; I know nothing about it."
The Prisoners' statements before the Magistrate. Murray says: "On Tuesday night I went to bed drunk, and cut my head. I was in bed at 9.30 that night, and knocked my thumb up." Hubbart says: "On Tuesday night I was at that public-house drunk, with others, till 11 o'clock." Castle says: "On Tuesday night, at 8.30, I was at home, indoors. I know nothing about it."
Murray's Defence. If the woman never saw me, how did the young chap see me? I was so drunk that they would not let me ride in the cage. I got home at 8.45. Going upstairs I fell, and cut my chin and my thumb, and have been under a doctor ever since.
Hubbart's Defence. I was at home by 10.30.
GUILTY**—Murray and Hubbard were further charged with a previous conviction at Clerkenwell in July, 1874, to which they
PLEADED GUILTY— Twelve Months' Imprisonment each.
539. RICHARD LAMPORT (36) , to feloniously forging an order of a Court of Record; also to using as tamp which had been cancelled— Three Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
540. JAMES HALL (24) , to robbery (without violence) on Emma Matchel, and stealing her watch and chain, after a previous conviction at Clerkenwell in 1871**— Eighteen, Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
541. JAMES LANGLEY (22) , to stealing a coat, waistcoat, and boots, of James Hall; also to stealing a pair of trowsers and a waistcoat of William Turner; also to stealing two waistcoats and two sheets of Edwin Archer — Eighteen. Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
542. GEORGE SULLIVAN (32), and CHARLES CAPEL (38) , to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of John Carter, and stealing therein 6l. 3s. 6d., his money, Sullivan having been before convicted of felony.— SULLIVAN**— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
CAPEL— Twelve Months' Imprisonment. And [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
543. RICHARD BATTEN (31) , to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Saville Lumley, and stealing therein one bracelet and six lockets his property: also to three other indictments for house-breaking, and stealing watches, bracelets, and diamonds— Seven Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
FOURTH COURT.—Tuesday, June 26th, 1877.
Before Robert Malcom Kerr, Esq.
MESSRS. STRAIGHT and HCRACE AVORY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. BESLEY and MR. J. P. GRAIN the Defence.
RICHARD SPARKS . I am an officer of the Bankruptcy Court, and produce the proceedings in bankruptcy of the prisoner—the petition was filed on the 9th October, 1876—the act of bankruptcy was the failure to obey a debtor's summons—I have the affidavit of service of Samuel Daniel—the prisoner was adjudged a bankrupt on 30th October, 1876—the first meeting of creditors was on 14th November, when Mr. John Vale was appointed trustee; December 9th was appointed for the prisoner's public examination—I have here a note that he failed to attend—on 20th December a warrant was issued for his apprehension—there is also a statement filed by the prisoner on 19th May, 1877—the debts are returned as 269l. 3s. 8d., and the assets 890l.
Cross-examined. Bowring, Arundell, and Co. took out the summons, dated 18th July, 1876, by their solicitors, Messrs. Lumley and Lumley—the debt was 74l. 6s. 2d.—there is an affidavit of personal service of the petition, also of the adjudication, and a notice to the prisoner to attend the meeting of creditors—the bankrupt docs not always attend the first meeting; he was
also served with a notice to attend the public examination on December 9th—I do not know how many creditors have proved—a statement of affairs if filed in Bankruptcy, but on Mr. Heathfield applying for a statement to be filed the Court refused to make an order.
JOHN VALE . I am an accountant at 5, Hill's Place, Oxford Street, and the prisoner's trustee in Bankruptcy—besides the 269l. returned, there are other creditors amounting to 519l.; one is for a loan of 250l.; the prisoner denies this liability—Messrs. Lumley acted as my solicitors—in December an application was made for a warrant to apprehend the prisoner—from the 9th December to the end of April I was unable to find him—on 28th April I went to see him at Horsemonger Lane Gaol, when he signed the statement produced—I afterwards advertised and received a letter—the prisoner did not disclose to me until after the prosecution the monies found at various banks, when I received deposit notes of monies standing in various names:—the monies were 200l. deposited with the Stourbridge and Kidderminster Bank in the name of M. C. Williams, 100l. in the name of Mark Long at the National Provincial Bank at Birmingham, and 200l. in the name of M. C. Williams.
Cross-examined. I have been trustee in many bankruptcies—my bill of costs from Lumley's is not sent in—the Bankruptcy Court has restrained the creditors from touching the 800l. assets—the banks have orders not to pay—I was instructed by a committee of investigation to prosecute; I was bound to regard their wishes as well as other creditors—I did not name to the prisoner places where I thought he had property—an application was made to the Court for money to defray the prisoner's defence, which the Court refused—I cannot give you the dates of all the debts—I hope the bankrupt will pay 20s. in the pound. (Several letters were read from the prisoner to Messrs. Lumley and Lumley, stating that he had no assets.)
SAMUEL DANIEL . I am one of the firm of Arundel and Co., of Broad Street, who are petitioning creditors in this bankruptcy—I have heard the letters which have been read; I received some of them—on 9th October I personally served a copy of the petition in bankruptcy upon the prisoner in Conduit Street.
Cross-examined. I sold the prisoner jewellery—I commenced to deal with him early in 1876—he called casually and produced a banker's reference; I knew nothing of his family—he told me after the proceedings were commenced that he had been an actor—I have no copies of letters I wrote to him—Messrs. Lumley have been our solicitors seventeen or eighteen years; I employed them in this matter just before issuing the debtors' summons—there was no agreement for six months' credit—I did tell the prisoner he had laid himself open to a criminal charge—I did not preserve all his letters—I am aware he alleges my threat to be the reason of his non-surrender—I saw him several times between the summons and the adjudication—he offered to pay 50l. besides our account if I would not make him a bankrupt.
Re-examined. There was no threat after the bankruptcy proceedings commenced, only when I first found I had been imposed upon—he said he had no money, having previously said he was a man of considerable means and that he had 500l. a year.
CHARLES JAMES WHITTINGTON . I am the manager to Messrs. Moorlan and Moore, stockbrokers—in August last year I was instructed by the prisoner to sell certain shares of the Lambeth Waterworks Company, for
which I handed the prisoner the cheques produced, which are on Prescott and Co.'s Bank.
Cross-examined. The transfers would go the company—there was only one name.
ADOLPHUS FREDERICK ESSAY . I am cashier to the London and Westminster Bank—on 18th August last the prisoner paid into his account, in the name of Morgan Charles Glyn, at our bank 850l. in three notes of 50l., two of 100l. and one of 500l.; that money was drawn out on 13th November in notes; I paid it to the prisoner, together with 19s. 6d. interest.
HENRY MELVILLE MILLER . I am chief clerk to the Deptford branch of the London and County Bank—I was formerly at the Newington branch of that bank—on 13th November the prisoner opened an account with our bank to the amount of 400l. in the name of Mark Long, of 4, Queen Street, Brynmaur, South Wales—it was drawn out on 4th January in four 100l. notes.
ELIZABETH THOMAS . I am a widow, and live at 1, Belgrade Terrace, Stockwell Road, Brixton—the prisoner is my late husband's nephew—about 15th November he asked me to change a 50l. note which I paid into my bank—I afterwards drew it out in three smaller notes and gave it to the prisoner's sister.
Cross-examined. The prisoner's father died before I married—the prisoner was apprenticed to a grocer in Wales—I knew he was living in Brixton, but nothing of his affairs—he did not tell me of the prosecution—he has three sisters.
GUILTY — Two Years' Imprisonment.
MR. A. METCALFE conducted the Prosecution.
GEORGE LUCY . I keep the old Barge public-house, at Woolwich—on May 31st I retired to rest, leaving my premises safe—I heard the shutter moving next morning about 3.30—I went down and found the house in confusion, and that the bar had been broken into by letting the sash slide down—I missed 30s. 6d. from the bar shelf, mostly in sixpences, some cigars, and about 16 1/2 ounces of tobacco and a bottle with a pint and a half of rum; also some postage and receipt stamps and about 30s. In bronze, including a dozen farthings and a George IV. penny—I have seen Yearley in the house before, I saw him just before the robber—the articles produced are similar to those I missed.
SAMUEL FEETHAM (Policeman K 107). On May 31, about 4 a.m., I was in the Woolwich Station Road, when I met the prisoners coming from the direction of the prosecutor's house—I went there and found the window shutter open and the window unfastened—I examined the place with the last, witness and found it all right—I saw the prisoners again about 5 o'clock, and Hosier said I was at the wrong door, which was the fact, as I was going to call some one—I saw them again, about 12 o'clock the same night, in the Albert Road, going in the direction of the Old Barge public-house—I identified them at Clerkenwell police-court on the 8th.
MARK VARROW (Policeman K 61). On 31st May, about 3 o'clock in the morning, I met the prisoner in the Station Road, North Woolwich—Hosier asked me the time—I was called to the Old Barge public-house next morning and found the place open—I next saw the prisoners at the Clerkenwell police-court.
ARTHUR OLIVER (Police Inspector G). I took the prisoners into custody about 4 a.m., on 1st June, in Whitecross Street—I charged them with loitering; and took them to the station—I searched them and found on Hosier 6s. 10d. in bronze and 9s. 9d. in silver, six cigars, half an ounce of tobacco, thirteen keys, one of which was a skeleton key, two postage and one receipt stamps.
Hosier's Defence. How could I be at Woolwich at 3.30 a.m. when I was taken in Whitecross Street at 4 a.m.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. A. METCALFE conducted he Prosecution.
RICHARD MILLS . I keep the Barley Mow public-house, Blue Anchor Alley. St. Luke's—on 27th May I was called by my potman, about 7.30—I went down and found a number of goods lying about, and that an entrance had been made through the cellar flat and several things had been dropped in the cellar—the flaps were bolted and safe at 11 o'clock the previous night—the handkerchief produced is mine—I missed, among other things, a basket of clothes—I have no mark on the. handkerchief.
HENRY CANNON . I live at 20, Blue Anchor Alley—on the 27th May, I saw the prisoners between 5 and 6 o'clock a.m., about five doors from the public-house; I saw them again, just before 6 o'clock a.m., with a white basket of things.
Cross-examined by Hosier, I did not shake my head when asked to identify you.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. GRIFFITHS conducted the Prosecution; and MR. SIMS the Defence.
WILLIAM INCHCOMBE . I am a licensed victualler in Dudley Strret—a friendly league is held at my house—the prisoner was at. This meeting on Saturday, June 2nd—I closed my house about 12 o'clock that night—I was going to bed about 1 o'clock when a door was opened, forced by a chisel—I afterwards found this piece of candle which had been lighted—on going into the parlour I found the cheffonier had been opened, and the room was in a disordered state; I then went upstairs and found a chest of drawers had been broken open and things thrown about, and 10l. 7s., and two watches taken, one gold, and one silver; also two Albert chains, one gold and one plated, a silver guard, a locket, and a small knife—the articles produced are some of those I missed—the total value would be about 40l.
Cross-examined. I mentioned the knife before the Magistrate on the first occasion; I do not remember being asked about it on the second—about thirty or forty persons attended the league—I found some of my property in possession of the police about 6 o'clock on the Sunday morning—the gold watch and chain are my wife's; I have known the chain eight years.
WILLIAM COUNTER (Policeman E 36). On Sunday, the 3rd June, the prisoner was brought to Bow Street, about 12.30, I received information of this robbery from the last witness between 1 and 2 o'clock—I searched the prisoner and found on him a gold watch and chain, a gilt chain, two knives, a little knife and a sovereign, and 3l. 4s. in silver, and a shilling in bronze—he said he was in charge for disorderly conduct and did not see why he was
searched—I said he perhaps would be charged with a more serious offence—I then fetched the last witness who identified the—watch and chain, and small knife—the prisoner said the watch was his sister's.
He also PLEADED GUILTY to having been convicted in September, 1875— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.
MR. SIMS conducted the Prosecution.
ARTHUR GLEED . I live at 7, Prince's Street, Drury Lane—it is a lodging-house—I am the deputy—on 29th May, the prisoner was lodging there—between 7 and 8 o'clock, I asked him for the money for his lodging—he said "Who are you that I should give you the money'"—I said "All right, if you do not give me the money you shall not go upstairs to sleep"—I went to my duties—about fifteen minutes after I heard him ask a lodger named Regan, if he was an Irishman, and "Do you call this man an Irishman?" meaning me—Regan made no reply; a few minutes afterwards the prisoner said "I'll do for thee," and ran at me, I fell down—on getting up I found I was stabbed in the arm, and my arm and my head were bleeding fast—I have since been in the hospital—on running out of the house I heard Leonard call out that he—was stabbed—I did not see the knife then, but I have since.
DANIEL LEONARD . I am a labourer living at 7, Prince's Street, Drury Lane—on the 27th May, between 7 and 8 o'clock p.m., I was in the kitchen, the prisoner was standing near the window—Gleed was near the sink washing up some things—I heard the prisoner say "You—I hate you and your b——country, before you leave this house I'll put you on the fire and roast you to death"—Gleed crossed to the other side of the kitchen, saying "You will do for me will you, I want nothing to say to you, I have heard of you before"—the prisoner then ran and caught hold of Gleed, and stabbed him—I rushed between them, and putting my hand up received the blow on the back of my hand which was cut—the prisoner then fell to the ground with the knife in his hand; I missed Gleed at that time—I said to the men in the kitchen "He has stabbed me too"—I gave him in charge in the street—my wound was bound up at the hospital—the prisoner had been drinking.
ALBERT WILLIAM DENNIS LEAHY . I am an assistant surgeon at the Charing Cross Hospital—I examined Gleed—he had a scalp wound at the back of his head, caused by a fall, also an incised wound in his left arm, crossing the elbow joint, 5 inches in length and 1 1/4 in depth, and dividing an artery—he would have bled to death if it had not been stopped.
Prisoner's Defence. I had paid a week's lodging the week before, therefore Gleed had no business to ask me for it.
GUILTY — Five Years' Penal Servitude.
OLD COURT.—Wednesday, June 20th, 1817.
Before Mr. Justice Lush.
MR. GRUBBE conducted the Prosecution.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. LILLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. STRAIGHT the Defence.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. HARRIS, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence on the Inquisition, the Grand Jury having ignored the bill.
NOT GUILTY .
No bill having been found by the Grand Jury, MR. HARRIS, for the Prosecution, offered no evidence on the Inquisition.
NOT GUILTY .
NEW COURT.—Wednesday, June 27th, 1877.
Before Baron Pollock
553. PHILIP CROSS (36) , PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously sending a letter to George Alexander Drummond, demanding, with menaces, the sum of 2,500l.; also to unlawfully threatening to publish a libel concerning the said George Alexander Drummond. He received an excellent character—Six Months' Imprisonment, without hard labour.
554. In the case of CHARLES CORNISH (29) , indicted for the wilful murder of Louisa Cornish, it appearing by the evidence of John Roland Gibson, the surgeon of Newgate, and George Wright, a surgeon, that the prisoner was insane and unfit to plead, the Jury found a verdict to that effect— To be detained during Her Majesty's pleasure.
MR. A. METCALFE conducted the Prosecution.
THOMAS LUDLOW . I am a day watchman in the employ of the East and "West India Docks—on 26th May, about 5.30, I was with Policeman Smith at the entrance of the West India Docks, and saw the prisoner coming out at the gate from the docks—Smith pointed to the prisoner's breast, and said "What have you got there?"—he said "What the——hell has that to do with you?"—Smith caught hold of him' by the arm, and said "I want to see what you have got in your breast"—he then struck Smith a violent blow a the face, which caused him to fall back, blood flowing from his mouth, and he fell in the box towards the gate—I took hold of the prisoner very slightly by the arm, and walked away very quietly towards the station—I did not go to the station, as there was a van coming out which I had to examine—I did not see how the struggle began—the prisoner was underneath—I ran to Smith's assistance, and secured the prisoner.
CATHERINE WOOD . I am married, and live at 32 1/2, Silver Town, Barking—on Saturday, 26th May, I was passing out at the gate at 5.30, and heard the policeman say to the prisoner "What have you got there?" pointing to his breast—the prisoner made a filthy answer, and said "I shan't tell you what I have got here"—Smith said "You must come with me to a place where I must take you to be searched," and he up with his fist and said "Take that," and struck him between the jaw and the ear, and he fell just by the wall—I did not see him get up—I walked away, as I was frightened.
was close by Ludlow—Smith was in the company's box at the gate, in the arms of another constable, covered with blood—it was coming from his mouth—I took the prisoner to the station—it was Smith's duty to satisfy himself if he saw anything suspicious about a labouring man coming out at the gate, and if the search was refused, to convey him to the police-office—he would be quite right in taking hold of a man's arm if he refused to go.
ROBERT NIGHTINGALE . I am a surgeon, of 658, Commercial Road—about 5.45 a.m. on 26th May, I was called to the deceased—he had then been dead probably two or three minutes—I could tell that he bad died from haemorrahage—I made a post-mortem examination forty-eight hours afterwards—both lungs were very much diseased, especially the left—there was a cavity in it, and the vessels had given way and caused the hæmorrhage—I have heard the evidence—I have no doubt that the struggle accelerated his death—he might have lived for a month if free from care and excitement, but such a struggle as this would bring about a fatal issue—death was caused by hæmorrhage from the lungs, the predisposing cause of which was longstanding disease, but the exciting cause was the struggle.
Prisoner's Defence. I was coming out of the gate with an engine-driver; the deceased constable stopped him to see what he had in his pocket. I stopped at the same time. He searched him, but did not search me. The deceased had two papers in his hand, and he caught me and said "Where are you going?" and cut my lip. I seized his hand and said "What are you doing?" He seized me, and we went to the ground, he below and I on top. He walked up to his box, and the constable took hold of me. I believe there is a witness here who was coming out at the gate with me, but I do not know his name. Nothing was found on me when Douglas searched me except what I worked with. I suppose he heard that the man was dead, for he came back and said "Put the handcuffs on him." I said "You won't put any handcuffs on me," and he jumped up on a stool, reached a staff, and dealt me a blow over the eye. I sat in a corner, and the handcuffs were put on.
GUILTY — Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
MESSRS. POLAND and BEASLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. KISH the Defence.
JANE HALL . I am eight years old, and live with my father and mother at Dean Street, Soho—I have a brother and two sisters, all younger than me—my brother's name is Frank; he is six years old—the next is Annie, who is four, and the baby is two—I have been to school—we occupy two rooms on the second floor—the prisoner is my father—my mother went out charing on a Friday and left my father at home, and Frank and the baby—my father uses one of the rooms for his business, which is shoemaking—he went out after my mother, and came in again not long afterwards—we were then playing in the front room, and he gave me some stuff to drink—the baby was playing with us, and he took her into the back room and brought her back and laid her on the bed in the front room, and I think I saw some sick on her pinafore—he then gave me and Frank and Annie some stuff to drink—I don't know whether he had given any to the baby, but of us three he gave it first to Annie—it was in a cup; I don't know the colour of it—I saw my father pour the stuff from a bottle into the cup—Annie said she did not like it, it was nasty stuff—before my father gave it to her he said
be would give her a penny—he had three bottles, I think, and I think he. put them in the back room—Frank asked his father to give him some, and he did, out of the same bottle—I think I should know the bottle again if I saw it—Frank drank it and said he did not like it, he thought it was tea—after he took it he was sick—my father next gave some to me; I told him I did not want any—he got it from a bottle, and I drank it from the same tea-cup; it tasted nasty and I was sick—my father saw me sick and gave me some cold tea; I think it was in the same cup—while I was sick my father took my reading-book and sat down in the arm-chair and read it, but not for long—he then put on his hat and went out, and I did not see him again that day—after he went out Annie went on the bed; we were all sick—I was leaning over a pail when my mother came in, and she took me to Dr. Clark, but before that she saw a bottle in my father's work-room—she fetched Mary Ann Tice, who lives in the same house, and who comes to look after us when mother is away—I was afterwards taken to Charing Gross Hospital—I had never seen a bottle of that kind before he put them in his work-room; one of them bad a little drop left in it—he has always been kind to us, and my mother also, but something took place between them a day or two before because there was not enough money to pay father's trade meeting—next day they were friends again.
Cross-examined. We had dinner together in the front room—when my father came in we were all in the front room running about with a ball—we were rather noisy, and he told us not to make such a noise—he did not hold up his hand to his face and say that his face was very bad—he said nothing about toothache—he gave no reason why we were not to make such a noise—I did not see anything in his hand when he came in—he took the bottle from the work-room, the front room—he went out of the room again, but he had nothing in his hand when lie came back—he took the cup off a tray on a table—I have played with his tools and have seen bottles among them, and he has scolded me for playing with the bottles; I have played with them after, he told me not—I had not been in his work-room that day—my mother had left the teapot on the table and my father got the tea from there which he gave me—we had tea for breakfast, and it had been there ever since—my father afterwards put the bottles into his work-room, but I did not go out of the front room at all—after he gave us the stuff he said he was going to fetch mother; I am sure of that—I don't know whether I said at the police-court "My mother came home, my father fetched her"—my father did not say where he was going—I don't think it was very long after he went out that she came back—my mother has had the toothache—I never heard her say that her face hurt her.
MARY ANN TICE . I am the wife of George Henry Tice, of 65, Dean Street, Soho—we have lived there two years—the prisoner and his wife and four children lived in two rooms on the second floor, one of which was a work-room and the other a living-room—the bed was in the front room—the prisoner's wife went out charing, she used to go out about 9 o'clock—I did not see the prisoner on the morning in question—I went into her room between 11 and 12 o'clock to give one of the children something to eat and found the four children there—I gave them some bread and treacle, and stayed three or four minutes; they eat it, and were quite well—I gave them nothing to drink—my rooms are on the same floor—between 3 and 4 o'clock the prisoner's wife fetched me into the room again and I found Jane in the work-room, leaning over a pail, sick, and the other three lying on the
bed, and I could see that they had been-sick—by my persuasion Mrs. Hall took Jane to a doctor—she was away about half an hour, and the three other children were sick while she was away—she came back without Jane, and she and I took the other three children to the doctor and Jane and Frank were taken to the hospital; the other two were brought back—I saw two bottles on the floor in a corner of the work-room that afternoon; these appear to be them. (One of these was labelled "Laudanum.") They are empty—Mrs. Hall took hold of them and took them to the doctor's when she took Jane—the other children were then living there; they are well.
Cross-examined. Mrs. Hall said that Hall had been to fetch her and had brought the keys—anybody would see the two bottles on the floor of the work-room, there was no attempt made to hide them—I have heard about Mr. Hall beng bad with the toothache—I have known him two years last January—he is a sober man, a kind, father, attentive to his children, and liked by his neighbours—I never heard any complaint against him.
Re-examined. I have heard him several times speak about his having face—ache, that is three or four months ago—when Mrs. Hall went out charing she usually returned between 11 and 12 o'clock at night—she told me when she came back that Mr. Hall had fetched her and that he had left the keys for her, those were the keys of the rooms; the rooms were locked—he did not return with her and I never saw him that day.
GEORGE CLARK , M. R. C. S. I live at 23, Gerard Street, Soho—on 8th June, a little after 3.30 Jane Hall was brought to me by her mother—I saw that she was suffering from a narcotic and administered an emetic—the mother showed me these two bottles, which smelt of laudanum—I kept the child three hours and sent the mother to fetch the other three, which she did—Frank and Annie were suffering from a narcotic, but the baby did not appear to be sleepy at all—I sent the other two to the hospital—laudanum would produce the effect I saw—in a child of this age, if it had no assistance, thirty to forty drops would be a fatal dose—I should think Jane had had a large quantity; I cannot say how much, I judge from the effect.
Cross-examined. I only gave an emetic to the eldest child and it acted immediately—the other children were sick in the other room—I did not examine the vomit.
PERCY ANDREW STEADMAN . I am resident medical officer at Charing Cross Hospital—on Friday evening, 8th June, the little girl Jane was brought there; she was holding her mother's hand and staggering, she was intoxicated—the boy seemed very tired, but nothing very noticeable—I looked at their eyes, the pupils of both were contracted, especially the girls', which were contracted to a pin's point; that would be caused by the narcotic, such as laudanum; that would account for the intoxication—they both vomited perfectly clear saliva—after a child has been sick from natural causes that would be the kind of vomit—they were discharged cured on, I think, the 14th—laudanum is a very dangerous thing to administer to young children—I think their lives were endangered.
Cross-examined. Laudanum is frequently taken by people to produce sleep—I observed no traces of treacle in the vomit, it was quite colourless.
FREDERICK EDWIN BOWE . I am in the employ of the executors of Mr. Hartnell, a chemist, of 7, Tichborne Street, Haymarket, but I am not a chemist—about 6th or 7th June a man who I believe to be the prisoner brought a small bottle labelled "Laudanum, poison;" I think this bottle is the same—this label was put on by the assistant who served the laudanum
—the first label bore the name of Cooper, Moor street, Newport Square, and our label was put on over it—I asked him if it was for the toothache—he either said "Yes," or nodded—he asked for 2d. worth—Mr. Bransford served him.
Cross-examined. I heard what he said—I suppose they would give him a drachm—I have heard of laudanum being used in small quantities to obtain sleep.
VERICK GARHARD BRANSFORD . I am an assistant at Mr. Hartnell's—I remember a bottle similar to this being handed to me and I put another label over it and supplied about a drachm and a half of laudanum, which would be 2d.—I do not know the person to whom I supplied it—I do not remember the day of the month, it was a Wednesday or Thursday.
Cross-examined. That is a small quantity—I have heard of laudanum being taken to procure sleep and for toothache.
GEORGE ARROWSMITH . I live at Bonar Road, Victoria Park—I was assistant to Cooper and Co., chemists, of 20, Moor Street, Soho—on Wednesday, 6th June, the prisoner came in for 2d. worth of laudanum—I asked him if he was going to poison himself—he said "No," he required it for faceache or toothache—I told him it was poison and he must be careful how he used it—this bottle is labelled "Cooper and Co., 20, Moor Street, Soho"—I put into it 80 minims, which is a drachm and a scruple.
Cross-examined. One purpose of using laudanum is to get sleep, it is also used for face ache and toothache—2d. worth is a large quantity, even for a person who is constantly using it—the smallest quantity we sell is a 1d. worth.
THOMAS MATTHEW CROW . I am a chemist, of 49, Princess Street, Leicester Square—on Thursday, 9, June, the prisoner came in, threw down 2d. and said "I want 2d. worth of laudanum"—I asked if he knew the nature of it; he said "Yes, it was poison, it was not to take"—I said "That is not sufficient for me. I require a plainer answer than that"—he said "It is for a woman with a pain in her face"—thought that was sufficient, and supplied him with 90 drops in the bottle—this is my label.
NEWMAN WILLIAM TURPIN (Police Inspector C). I produce the various bottles—the one with "Crow" on it, and the one without a label I got from Mr. Clark on Friday, the 8th—I saw the prisoner in custody on the same night, and next day I went to 65, Dean Street, made a search, and found the two bottles produced; one of which is labelled "Cooper and Co., 20, Moor Street"—I found them in a small open box, among a lot of coals, by the side of a work bench; one has two labels, one over the other—I have taken one off—the other bottle has Mr. Hartnell's label—they are in the same state except that the labels have been removed.
Cross-examined. I found them in a box without a lid, anybody could see them—I was on the stairs, but I heard no conversation about the little girl being taught to tell lies.
ALLAN REID (Policeman 113).—On 18th June, about 8 p.m., I took the prisoner in the Watchorne public-house, Westminster Bridge Road—he was quite sober, and said I should take him to the station on suspicion of attempting to poison his four children—he said "I cannot think what you want to take me for"—I said "You will hear when you get to the station"—I took him to Vine Street, in a cab, where he was charged; he said nothing in answer to it.
The Prisoner received a good character.
GUILTY — Fifteen Years' Penal Servitude.
THIRD COURT—Wenesday, 27th June, 1877 Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. DOUGLAS METCALFE conducted the Prosecution.
ELIZABETH STANLEY . I am single, and live at 52, Anchor Street, Blue Anchor Road, Bermondsey—about 7.30 p.m. on 1st June, I was going over London Bridge, towards the Surrey side, with a lady friend—she is not here—I was walking near the kerb when I felt someone at my pocket, and I turned round and saw the prisoner—I seized him by his coat, when he put his foot in front of me and tripped me up—I got up and I put my hand in my pocket and missed my purse—he ran off; I ran after him, and he was caught opposite Fishmonger's Hall—my purse contained 15s. and two farthings—this is it (produced)—a policeman came up.
Cross-examined by the Prisoner. I could not tell whether you were quite sober.
SAMUEL CARTER . I am a clerk, living at 90, East Lane Bermondsey—I was on London Bridge, about 2 yards behind the prosecutrix, and heard her call out "Stop that man! Stop thief"!—I saw the prisoner running away and I chased him, and caught him outside Fishmongers' Hall—we both fell in the road—a constable came up.
By THE COURT. He must have been in his sober senses I think, because it was done so neat.
CHARLES WHITE (City Policeman 741). At about 7.40 on this evening I was standing by Adelaide Place, London Bridge, I heard a cry of "Stop thief!" and saw the prisoner running from the bridge, on the side of Fishmongers' Hall, followed by Carter, who fell with the prisoner, I caught hold of him—he had a purse in his hand, and he got his trousers undone in front, here, and endeavoured to put the purse in there—I took it from his hand and the prosecutrix came up and gave him in charge—he was very violent and had to be carried to the station—he bit one of the constables in the arm; he was very violent—600 or 700 persons followed us to the station; his language was dreadful—he had been drinking, but knew perfectly well what he was about—after he got to the station he shammed drunkenness, and fell down in the dock—he said "I am glad you have got me here, I am tired of this; where I am going I shall get a good bed to lie on, and plenty to eat"—I searched him and found another purse on him and 2s. 8 1/2 d., and a 1d. loose in his pocket.
The Prisoner handed in a statement to the effect that it occurred through drink.
He was further charged with a conviction in August, 1868, at Clerkenwell, to which he
PLEADED GUILTY**— Six Months' Imprisonment.
MR. AUSTIN METCALFE conducted the Prosecution.
BAXTER HUNT (City Policeman 549). On 24th May, at 3.30 p.m., I was on London Bridge, in plain clothes—there was a crowd about three parts of the way over the bridge looking at a horse that had fallen down—I saw Mrs. Pitt and the prisoner there—I saw him go to her right hand side when she was looking at the horse, and put his left hand in her dress
pocket, he then took hold of her dress with his right hand, and removed his left from her pocket—he was about to go across the road, and I saw him look at his hand—he was about a yard from me; I seized his left hand and his collar—I could not see what was in his hand—he wrenched his hand from mine and struggled a little—I then saw five shillings lying on the ground at his feet; I picked up two separate shillings and a little boy picked up another, and another constable picked up a florin—Mrs. Pitt was on the pavement, and I directed another constable to speak to her, and he did so—the prisoner was closely and heard what she said—she said "I have not lost anything"—on the way to the station he said "That money is not mine that you picked up," but at the station he said "That is mine"—I charged him with stealing five shillings from Mrs. Pitt—he said "It fell from my pocket when you caught hold of me," showing me his pocket which had a hole in it—I did not see it fall from him as I was struggling with him—the lady was at the station, and she there said she had not lost anything—she directly afterwards made a different statement which she repeated in the prisoner's presence saying she had lost five shillings, and describing the money—she had seen the money—the prisoner said "Oh, Christ, you have been speaking to her."
PRISCILLA PITT . I am the wife of George Pitt, of Manor House, Mitcham——I was on London Bridge, at 3 o'clock, on 24th May, looking at a horse whish had fallen; I had this money given me at 10 o'clock that morning, in Bishopsgate Street, for a poor family—I put it in this pocket; it is a a loose one, and I do not remember taking it out again—a constable spoke to me in the afternoon on London Bridge, I forgot at first that I had the money, I never thought of it again for five hours—I believe the five shillings consisted of three shillings and a florin—I remembered a few minutes after that. I had had the money in my pocket.
The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate: "I don't say anything, but do give me one more chance."
The prisoner produced a written statement denying the charge, and stating that he dropped the money through a hole in his pocket.
Recommended to mercy by the prosecutrix—Twelve Months Imprisonment.
MR. BESLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. RIBTON the Defence.
JULES LORRE . I am a Frenchman, I understand English—I have known the prisoner about twelve months—he is a Frenchman also; I live at 4, New Cross Road, where I have employed the prisoner—I have owed him no money since December last—in March, I had two pieces of stamped paper across, which I had written my name—this is one of them (produced)—this is my writing across it—there was nothing else written except that—I kept them in my desk in my workshop—I missed them from my desk the Monday, after 24th March—I saw nothing of the one produced until Mr. Grey called on me at the end of May, just before I went to the police-court—in conesquence of what he said I went to the London and South "Western Bank, 16, St. James' Street, where I saw the piece of paper produced filled up, exactly as it is now—I never gave the prisoner, or any one else, authority to fill up the bill, and never gave it to him—I believe the signature is the prisoner's
hand writing—I did not know that lie had anything to do with it until Mr. Gray called and I went to the bank—I had notice from Paris about the other piece of paper.
Cross-examined. I am a druggist and a manufacturer of medicinal capsules—I have known the prisoner about twelve months—I engaged to supply him with syrups—he lived in Astbury road—I heard they were making brandy with the syrups; an illicit distillery was going on—I have given him delivery orders with the syrups—there was another man in the business, named Monet—they were generally golden syrups; I had no business to look to what they made the syrups into that I sold them—there was a still at Astbury Road, by means of which the brandy was illicitly made—I did not take the house; I have been there many times to take orders for syrups, not for brandy—I never had anything to do with the brandy—I never got any of it at my house—Monet and I entered into this written agreement (produced)—I had nothing to do with Monet—a lady came and complained of his taking a diamond ring from her, and he was had up at the police-court; I don't know whether he was fined or imprisoned—I believe he gave back the ring—I told him he should get money in the proper way—I know nothing about the still and other things being cleared out of the house; it was cleared out some time after, but I do not know how long—I don't know whether brandy was taken from it; none was taken to my house—I cannot tell you where Monet is—I saw him last at Bow Street; I had known him more than eighteen months—they asked me to supply them with golden syrups, molasses—I do not manufacture the syrups, I buy them in the markets—the expenses incurred would be the rent of the house, which was 12s. or 14s. a week—they both took the house—I paid no rent; Mr. Monet or Mr. Durand paid that—it was not taken in my name as well as theirs—I supplied them with over 10l. worth of molasses; I only got paid 4l. 10s. for it—they used to show me their book and give me one part of the profits—I sold it to them; that is all I had to do with it—they did not pay me ready money—I should have got my profit on the syrups if I had been paid—I had not an illicit distillery there; I have seen the still there several times—it was sent to my place in a case from the manufacturers in Paris—I cannot say how many days it was there; not quite a week—I didn't open it or pay for it; I don't know who did—I received a letter a few days before it arrived—I did not know that Durand and Monet bad ordered it; I swear I had no idea what it was; I knew some months after—i I asked what it was when I paid the carriage, but I did not ask Monet—the case came some months before the agreement, perhaps four months—it was not at my house for months; it was taken from my house to theirs in Astbury Road—I went there to see Mr. Monet principally; I saw it at work there and have tasted the brandy—I cannot say that I liked it—they had a place at Chelsea where brandy was made—I believe it was put in stone bottles—the bill produced, "Accepted, payable at New Cross Road" is signed and accepted by me in my trading name of Denure—I did not give the bill to Durand after I had signed it, I left it in my desk—I often do so, and send them to my customers and they fill them up—I did not put the date on, only the signature across the face—the prisoner has come to my house once or twice; I saw him at Astbury Road sometimes—they told me they wanted money to carry on the business, and I said "I am ready to supply some goods"—I have heard there were three separate charges tried at Bow Street and dismissed—I was not a witness; they had nothing to do
with my case—I thought of charging the prisoner with forgery before they were dismissed—I don't know anything about information being given to the Inland Revenue or the Excise Office about this affair by Synancore or any one else—I don't know what has become of Synancore; I saw him last Saturday, when I went to Bow Street police-court—he was not mixed up in this affair—he did not go by any other name; he did not prompt me to make this charge—I do not know his writing sufficiently to swear to; I believe that to be his writing on the back of the bill by the "S."
Re-examined. When I said I thought they were doing wrong by having a still, the prisoner said "I have been here twenty-five years and know better than you"—that was after I had signed the agreement, and I did not supply anything after that—I began to supply the syrup at the end of December, or the beginning of January—I supplied three loads altogether—I was not there when the Excise officers seized the still; I heard of it afterwards—I attended at Lambeth police-court, on 29th May, when the prisoner was fined 300l. and Monet 20l. for selling some of the brandy—I was not a witness—I had nothing to do with the seizure—I never sold or had any of the brandy—the 10l. worth of molasses was supplied before 24th March—I mean by "customer" some person to whom I owed money, and when I was not in a position to give" them a cheque I sent an acceptance—there is not truth in the suggestion, that I gave this, or the other bill, to the prisoner—I did not know who took the bill out of my desk.
By MR. RIBTON. After stating before the Magistrate, that we entered into business arrangements with the prisoner for the supply of liquors—I said "It is necessary that cash should be provided," and also "I know that Synar core endorsed that paper" (the bill) because his landlord received it.
HENRY DUMAS . I am a teacher of the French language, of 18, Lower Sloane Street, Chelsea, and have known the prisoner for ten years—I have often seen him write—the writing in the body of the bill is his natural writing no doubt, as also that signature and the endorsement.
ALICE HISCOFF . I live at 10, Kinders Street, New Cross Road, and have been in the employ of Mr. Loire, since 8th January—on the Oxford and Cambridge boat race day the prisoner was in the workshop, and I saw him go to the desk and move the papers about for about ten minutes—some more young girls were present—I did not know whether he took anything from the desk—I had seen him before—the girls pinned some ribbon in his coat—I knew of the bills being taken when the detective came to the house.
Cross-examined. I make the capsules—three more English girls work there—I have seen the prisoner twice before, and have seen him in conversation with Mr. Loire, in the workshop—he used not to remain long; I knew nothing about the business at Astbury Road—the desk was in the middle of the room on a table—I am the only one of the girls here.
Re-examined. No observation was made while the prisoner was at the desk—the prisoner and Lorre used to talk in French—I do not understand it.
JAMES GRAY . I am a horticultural builder, of Danvers Street, Chelsea—this bill was brought to me by Synancore, a tenant of mine, at 289, King's Road, filled up with the drawer's name and endorsement on it—I don't know where he is—I saw him last about a week or a fortnight ago—I cannot get into the premises he had of me—he gave it me in part payment—I afterwards heard from one of my people before it was due, that Mr. Lorre had called at my office and stated that the' bill would not be paid.
Cross-examined. I did not threaten to prosecute Synancore—he knew very well I had no need to frighten him.
GUILTY — Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
MR. GOODMAN conducted the Prosecution.
HENRY BUTLER . I live at 35, Simmond's Place, Portman Square, and am a gentleman's servant out of a situation—about 11 o'clock p.m, on 19th June, I was in Hyde Park, near the Marble Arch, when the prisoner accosted me—he walked part of the way and talked to me—he said "It's a fine evening"—I said "Yes, it is," and he snatched my watch and chain and took me by the throat—I asked him what he meant, and he said "That is what I mean," and he put his leg between mine and threw me down, he falling uppermost—he put his hand in my trousers pocket, took out my purse and a bunch of keys—I had a half-crown and a sixpence, I believe in my purse, and some coppers loose in my pocket—he got up and struck me over the top of the ear with his fist or a stick—a stick was found there next morning—he then struck me a violent blow on the mouth—I asked him to give back my watch and chain, and said "You are welcome to the money"—he said "You have more money on you, and I will have it"—I have not seen the watch and chain since—this is my purse (produced)—there is nothing in it now—the keys were not found—the prisoner walked towards the police-station, and I followed him—he started running, and I said "Whichever way you go, I follow"—he then turned round and struck me twice, and took up his belt and swore he would knock my b——y brains out if I followed him—I followed him some distance and he got away, and the first person I saw was another soldier and I made a communication to him and to a policeman—the number of my watch was 22,631.
JOHN RAWLINGS . I am an assistant to Mr. Amhurst, a pawnbroker, of 32, York Street, Westminster—on Wednesday, 20th June, the prisoner offered a watch and chain for sale—I saw they were valuable, and I asked him whose it was, and he said it was his old man's and he had had it about twelve years, and that it cost about 40l.—the foreman directed me to go to the barracks with the prisoner, and I handed the watch to the Sergeant-Major—Venables, a soldier, who was had up at Marlborough Street, and discharged, and was in the shop when prisoner brought the watch in—he overtook us in the Buckingham Palace Road, and said if he had the watch instead of Jordan, he would have got it away from me and given me a good thrashing and would not have allowed me to go before the sergeant-major—I did go there and the prisoner said it was his, and he had given a civilian 2l. for it—I did not see him produce any document—I took the number of the watch and the name—" Wachtholder, Hull, 22,631."
Prisoner. I didn't mention anything about old man—he asked me who I got it of, a young civilian or an old civilian, and I said "An oldish man."
EDWARD DUTTON . I am a sergeant-major of the 1st Battalion Coldstream Guards—we had a battalion at Chelsea Barracks at this time, which has since been at Aldershot—the prisoner and Rawlings came before me on the afternoon of 20th June—Rawlings told me that the prisoner came to his
shop in York Street with a watch, and offered it for sale for 2l.—I asked the prisoner whose watch it was—he said his own—I asked him how he came by it, and he said he bought it of a civilian the night before in the Grapes public-house for 2l.—I asked him where he got the money from, and he said 25s. of it was his own, and he borrowed the other 15s. of a civilian he knew, and would show me the receipt and fetch the civilian if I required it—he did not show me the receipt—I was present when this purse was found in the prisoner's pocket—having given me this explanation, and I having no further evidence, I gave the watch back to the prisoner, after directing Rawlings to take the number and name on it—it has disappeared since then—the next day, about 2 o'clock, a detective came and said he wanted Jordan, and showed me a description of the watch, and I sent for the prisoner—he was absent on the night in question—hje came in a few minutes after 2 o'clock—he should have been in at 10 o'clock—I know Venables—he is not here—he was discharged the other day from Marl-borough Street police-court, where he was charged with being with the prisoner when he made away with the watch.
WALTER BABROW (Detective Officer B). From information I received from the pawnbroker I went to Chelsea Barracks with the pawnbroker—the sergeant-major sent for the prisoner, and I told him I should take him into custody on suspicion of stealing a watch and chain in Hyde Park—he said "I didn't steal it; I bought it of a man at the Grapes public-house for 2l."—I asked him to produce it; he said he had sold it to a man outside a public-house, but did not know him or the public-house—I asked if anybody was with him, and he said "Yes, Venables, the man who was with me when I went to pawn it; he saw me sell it"—after the prisoner was confined in the guard-room the sergeant major sent for Venables—I told him who I was, and that I should take him in custody for being concerned in disposing of the watch—he said he had nothing to do with the watch, and had only been with the prisoner when he went to pawn it—he went before the prisoner and made the same statement, and the prisoner didn't deny it—I searched the prisoner and found this purse, which I laid down in the guard-room—I asked him how he came by it, and said "How long have you had it?" and he said "About nine mouths"—I took them to the station and sent for the prosecutor, who identified the purse and the prisoner—the charge was read over, and he made some statement about buying the watch.
Cross-examined. I said you stated that you sold it outside a public-house—you told me you did not know the name of the public-house.
Prisoner's Defence. I was not in Hyde Park that night at all. I was then in Westminster, and bought the watch for 2l. What they said about my old man is false. The pawnbroker pointed me out to Mr. Butler at the station, and said "This is him as had the purse, and this is him as had the—watch." If he had let him pick me out from the battalion he would have found them all the same as me, and couldn't tell the one from the tother.
GUILTY . He received a good character—Twelve Months' Imprisonment.
561. ELI SEABRIGHT ASHWOOD (33) , PLEADED GUILTY to four indictments for feloniously forging and uttering cheques for the payment of 26l., 13l. 9s., 18s., and 10l.; also to three indictments for unlawfully pledging three gold rings, five gold rings, and a brooch and earrings, which had been entrusted to him, he having been before convicted of felony— Ten Years' Penal Servitude.
FOURTH COURT.—Wenesday, June 27th 1877.
Before Mr. Recorder.
564. WILLIAM WALTERS * (31) , to burglary in the dwelling-house of John William Collette, and stealing two coats and other goods— Eighteen Months' Imprisonment. [Pleaded guilty: See original trial image.]
BROOKS PLEADED GUILTY .
MR. J. P. GRAIN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. FULTON defended West.
JOHN DAVIES (Detective Officer). I watched the premises of Messrs. Matthieson and Co., and on 15th June, in consequence of what I saw, I called Brooks into a room, where he made a statement—on May 24th I went to West's premises in Golden Lane with another officer and Mr. Raley, Messrs. Matthieson's foreman—I told West that Brooks was in custody for stealing paper, and had told me that he (West) had bought two reams at 3s. a ream—he said "Yes, I bought some from a man I do not know and have never seen before"—I then went upstairs in the kitchen, and Raley took four reams of paper from underneath the counter, and said "That is our paper"—West said "Yes, that is it"—West then produced a book and showed me an entry of 9s. on the 12th May, which he said was the first transaction he had had with Brooks—he said "I suspected it was wrong, and I told him not to bring any more," and he said "I had three or four other transactions with him after that," and he pointed out the entries in the book produced, of 3s. on the 16th May; 19th, 2s. 6d.; and 26th, 2s. 6d. and June 2nd of 4s., and 13th 1s., all for paper—he said "He told me he was hard up and he wanted a pair of boots"—I asked why he suspected Brooks; he said "Because he used to bring the paper before 8 o'clock in the morning"—I asked if he had any more in his place; he said he had not—when I first saw the paper I told West I should take him into custody and cautioned him—on taking him downstairs he said he wanted to speak to his workman, and I heard the words "paper upstairs"—I left him in charge of Halse in a cab, and went back and found the workman West had spoken to, and West's wife moving this parcel of paper—I took it to West, who said "Yes, that belongs to Mr. West, of 128, Cheap-side," and he showed me the bill-head which was underneath the cover—I took him to Bow Lane police-station, where the property was identified, and Brooks said "That is what I sold to West"—West is a printer and employs four or five hands.
Cross-examined. I have heard that he has carried on business for twenty years—the conversation with the workman was in a whisper; I told you all I heard—the prisoner said "No," and not "I do not know," when I asked if he had any more paper—the wife gave me the bill-head and I put it in the parcel.
DANIEL HALSE . I went with Davies to West's premises and took part in the search—I saw the entries in the book, and the four reams of paper brought out from under the kitchen counter—Davies brought West to me, and I took charge of him while Davies went back to look for more paper—West then said "He won't find any more"—Davies returned in a few
minutes with another parcel of paper—West said "That belongs to Mr. Thomas, of 128, Cheapside"—We took the prisoner to Bow Lane-policestation, and Mr. Raley identified the paper—West was then charged with receiving it, well knowing it to be stolen—he said "I did not know it to be stolen."
JOHN RALEY . I am manager to Mr. Matthieson, a printer, in. Bartholomew Close—I went with the detectives to West's Place—when asked if there was any more paper he said "No"—we left West in the cab, and searched and found another parcel of paper—West's wife gave me the bill-head of Mr. Thomas, and I put it in the parcel; I identified the paper at the police-court—the value of the paper at the mill price would be about 2l. 9s. 3d.—it is not all of the same quality.
Cross-examined. Paper is not much cheaper when sold in job lots.
West's Statement before the Magistrate: "I paid more than half the value of the paper I bought of Brooks."
WEST received a good character.— NOT GUILTY .
BROOKS— Nine Months' Imprisonment.
MR. GILL conducted the Prosecution.
CLEMENT WILLIAMS . I am the son of Henry Williams, who keeps a dairy, and live at 58, Swinton Street, about 1.30 a.m., on May 29th, I was awoke by hearing the cry of thieves—I pulled up the blind, lighted the gas, put my coat on and went down—I met my father on the stairs; I went into the office and found the window open and the table cover on the floor, I opened the street door and saw the prisoner, in the hands of a constable; I had seen the house all safe the night before—I noticed the mark of a knife on the sash!
JAMES COBB (Policeman G 181).' About 1.30, I was passing Mr. Williams' dairy in Swiaton. Street, when I heard a noise—I examined the doors and found all fastened, I stopped a few minutes and heard a whisper—I knocked, rang the bell, and called "Thieves"—I then stood back in the doorway and saw three faces at the window—the men then said "Kill him, do for him "—there was a Venetian blind to the window, I took out my truncheon and struck the first that came out, who got up and ran away as I secured the prisoner—Mr. Williams' son then came down, and I took the prisoner to the station—I found this piece of candle in the office, and the piece of wire gauze blind was laid on the floor—there was also a mark on the two sashes—next morning I found this knife stuck in the ground.
Cross-examined. You were in front of the door, and not outside on the pavement when I knocked you down.
By THE COURT. I struck the prisoner, because he was violent—I knocked two down altogether.
HENRY WILLIAMS . On Wednesday morning, May 30th, about 1.30, I was aroused by some one calling "Thieves"—I looked out and seeing the policeman, knocked at the window for him to come to me to say what was the matter—I went down into the office and found the place in confusion and the blind torn—I found the prisoner in custody.
The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate: "Last Tuesday week, T went to the Raglan Music Hall, with a friend. I had some drink and left and friend and was coming home: I sat on a door step and went to sleep." A
man woke me up. I was coming home. I heard the policeman calling thieves, I went to where he was. He said I was one, and knocked me down, and held me by the collar on the pavement; while I was down I saw two men jump over the railings, I was charged with burglary, I can prove that I get an honest living."
GUILTY — Nine Months' Imprisonment ,
MR. DIXON conducted the Prosecution; and MR. PURCELL the Defence.
ROBERT HEWSON . I am butler to Lord Gardner, of 46, Dover Street, Piccadilly—on the evening of 1st April, the prisoner came there—I was waiting at dinner when the second footman made a communication to me, and I went downstairs and told the prisoner to give up the plate—he said he had done it for a lark and gave up eighteen spoons and eighteen forks, which he took from his great coat pocket and from his jacket—he had previously lived with me in service.
Cross-examined. He came to see me—I have had nine months' imprisonment, I was committed at the Surrey Sessions—I have been fourteen months in Lord Gardner's service—the prisoner has been to see me several times—I left Lord Gardner's service on 17th May—there was a robbery that night.
ROBERT GOODBY . I was in Lord Gardner's service on the 1st April, and saw the prisoner there packing up the plate—as I passed the prisoner's coat, which was hanging up, I could feel the plate—I watched him and saw him pack up the plate—I informed the butler, who was waiting at dinner.
Cross-examined. I did not speak to the prisoner about it—I believe he came again about a fortnight after, but I did not see him—I am not in Lord Gardner's service now, I left with the butler—there was an unpleasant event that night.
CHARLES BOTCHER (Detective Officer). I went to Lord Gardner's on 18th May, and from information received I apprehended the prisoner on the 21st for stealing plate about the 1st April—he said it was not true—I told him the second footman and butler saw him do it, and were present when it was taken from the pocket of his coat, which was hanging in the servant's hall—he made no reply to that—he was then living as butler at 93, Cornwall Gardens, South Kensington.
Cross-examined. He said "It is not true, had I done that, why did not they lock me up at the time"—Lord Gardner instructed me to apprehend the prisoner.
Cross-examined. I saw the prisoner there after this night.
GUILTY — Twelve Months' Imprisonment.
MR. POCOCK conducted the Prosecution; and MESSRS. BESLDY and J. P. GRAIN, the Defence.
Blackheath—in June, 1876, the prisoner asked me to discount a bill for 45l. which I did, and have never received any proceeds—I gave him 40l. for the bill, which became due in August, 1876, and on August 23rd I received this letter, stating the prisoner was unabled to meet the bill and asking for its renewal, and an appointment—I afterwards saw him, when he said he would give me a better bill for 51l. 10s. 6d. on a man in Sheffield, and I took it to take the place of the first, intending to pay him the difference—it came due on 29th November, and was not paid—I had received another letter on September 13th. (This letter promised a settlement in about a week.) I afterwards had an interview with the prisoner, who handed me this bill for 62l. which I also found to be worthless, and I instructed my solicitor to issue a writ on the bill for 51l. 10s. 6d.
FITZROY GARDNER . I am a clerk in the Exchequer Division of the High Court of Justice, and produce an affidavit No. 172—1877. (This affidavit contained this passage: "That the bill, the subject of this action, I drew and endorsed purely for the temporary use of the above named Plaintiff, and never had any value or consideration for the same, and I do not owe him one farthing thereon.")
JOHN RICHARD LAMBETH WALMISLEY . I am a commissioner to administer oaths in the High Court of Justice—on 19th February, 1877, I administered an oath to Joseph Prestopino to the affidavit produced, and this bill is the exhibit to the affidavit which I signed.
Cross-examined. I only know the prisoner by sight—a solicitor's clerk was with him when he took the oath—I asked him, and he said he thoroughly understood the nature of an oath—there are two alterations of words, which I initialled—the word "drew" is struck out, and instead of the word "accommodation" "temporary uses" is inserted.
Cross-examined. The 40l. is all I parted with, except the costs—I afterwards sued upon the first bill—I had the second and third bills as collateral security—I discovered the bills were worthless before they became due—I have never sued the acceptors, because both acceptor and drawer have vanished—I had given no pledge not to discount the bills.
Re-examined. The 62l. bill was noted and returned "No account"—there was no agreement not to sue on the first bill, and I did not sue till I discovered it was worthless.
GUILTY — Nine Months' Imprisonment.
OLD COURT.—Thursday, June 28th, 1877.
Before Mr. Justice Field.
MR. GRUBBE conducted the Prosecution; and MR. FRITH the Defence.
NOT GUILTY .
THIRD COURT.—Thursday, June 28th, 1877.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
Upon the evidence of John Roland Gibson, surgeon of Newgate, the Jury found the prisoner of unsound mind and unfit to plead— To he detained during Her Majesty's pleasure.
MR. GRAIN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. LILLEY the Defence.
EDITH WILCOCK . I live with my father at 5, Cricket Field Road, Clapton—on 12th June, about 2 a.m., I was awoke by hearing some one walk up and down stairs—I listened and heard the handle of the dining-room door turn—I screamed and clapped my hands—my parents and my brother came—and I went down with them and searched the house—the back door into the garden was unbolted and the wire taken off the little window, which was open, and it was large enough for a person to get through—from the dining-room we missed three coats, an umbrella, a violin and case, a tablecloth, and two handkerchiefs—these are some of the goods (produced)—I do not know the prisoner.
Cross-examined. There is nothing by which I could identify the clothes—my brother is here—I had no clock or watch.
ALFRED WILCOCK . I live with my father at 5, Cricket Field Road, Clapton—my father locked up the house and I went to bed a few minutes before he did—my sister called out about 2 a.m., and I went down and found the back door and the window open and the wirework of the window pulled away—I missed three coats, a hat, a violin and case, and other things—I called a constable and we searched the garden—I found the umbrella and two coats on a wall two or three doors away—the hat was afterwards found on the Downs, cut up, and a knife by it—I identified a coat and two handkerchiefs at the station, they were in the dining-room when I went to bed; the "handkerchiefs were in the coat pocket.
WILLIAM COCKSEDGE (Policeman M 55). I was on duty about half a mile from this house, about 2.5, and met two persons; the prisoner was one—asked them where they were going, and one ran away—I secured the prisoner—he had a coat rolled up under his arm, with a cambric and a silk handkerchief in the pocket—I asked him how he got them, and he said the other man gave them to him and he did not know him—I took him to the station, and he gave me as his address 17, John Street, Hommerton—I went there with another constable and learned something of the prisoner.
Cross-examined. This was a rainy morning; the prisoner did not show me that he was wet on one side—he had been drinking—there are many brickmakers in the neighbourhood, and I suppose they go to work early—he did not tell me he had been working for a Mr. Waldron—I stepped out into the road to meet the men.
The prisoner received a good character.
GUILTY — Six Months' Imprisonment.
MESSRS. POLAND and HORACE AVORY conducted the Prosecution; MR. BESLEY appeared for Teatheredge, and MESSRS. GRAIN and PURCELL for Payne.
WILLIAM JOHN PAYNE . I am Coroner for the City of London and the Borough of Southwark—on 6th June I held an inquest touching the death of Patrick Twohig—I took the depositions—the two prisoners were examined as witnesses—Mr. Cooper Wyld represented Payne; the other wa
not represented by Counsel—the witnesses were sworn and their statements were read over in the usual way—I produce the original depositions.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. I have had great experience in holding inquests on accidents—there is always a discrepancy as to details of the case—Mr. Wyld called Payne the defendant—Payne was not driving the omnibus which ran over the man—I cautioned Teatheredge.
Re-examined. After I cautioned Teatheredge, he said "I wish to tell the Jury how it happened."
JOHN PHILLIP HENSHAW . I am an auctioneer's assistant at 55, Duke Street, West Smithfield—on Friday, 25th May, I was in Newgate Street, about 8 p.m., and going towards Cheapside on the left hand side of the way—I saw two buses go towards Holborn Viaduct, a yellow and a green one—they were near the General Post-office, and I was near King Edward Street—the yellow one was about the middle of the road, behind the green one, which was near the kerb on the left hand side, and both were going at a furious rate, though I am no judge of the pace of horses; they were galloping—after they had passed me, I turned back and saw them in collision—I walked back and saw the large wheel of one bus caught in the hind wheel of the other, and one of the horses was down with its leg nearly on the pavement, but I cannot say of which bus—there was a man and a barrow against the kerb on the left hand side, going towards Holborn—he was knocked down and run over, and the hind part of the bus was turned round towards the other side of the road—I attended to the man and took him to St. Bartholomew's Hospital—I did not see a mail cart.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. I did not see the buses for any great distance; they were going faster, than they usually travel—I should call 20 miles an hour a furious rate, or anything above seven—I saw them about two seconds and they went over about 40 yards—I believed what I said in my depositions about the horse in the Bayswater bus being dragged down to be true, but I did not notice the colour—I saw the barrow go down before the man—the first I saw of the man was when he was in the road.
Cross-examined by MR. GRAIN. I did not see either of the buses stop to take up passengers—from where I was walking at first I could see to the corner where the buses stop, but they were in motion when I first saw them, and nearer to me than the corner—there is asphalte there—I know the difference between a trot and a gallop—I won't swear they were galloping.
Re-examined. I have never driven horses; a donkey is more my mark—I do not know the drivers—I crossed the road to pick the man up—I never saw an accident before.
JOSEPH SIMMONS . I live at 42, Queen's Road, Dalston, and am salesman in a cigar warehouse—on 25th May I was in Newgate Street, near Warwick Lane, about 7.45 p.m., going west on the south side—I heard a noise, and turned and saw a yellow and a dark green bus very rapidly driven—they were nearly level with each other—the yellow bus was nearest the kerb—I should say "furiously" would be the proper expression as to their pace—I saw the deceased pushing a barrow along near to the kerb, and going west-ward, and away from the buses—the driver of the yellow bus tried to pull into the centre of the road when he was near the barrow, but the dark green bus was in the way, and their wheels got locked—it seemed as if the dark green bus was urging the other forward, and the yellow one could not get out of the way of the deceased, and the horses knocked him down and both wheels passed over him—the barrow was over-turned on to the pavement
and the fruit spilled—I did not see any horses down—I looked to see if the mm was hurt—I was only 2 or 3 yards off when he was knocked down—he was shouting very loudly, and I saw that he was very much hurt, and I saw him taken away in a cab—I took the number on the badge of the driver of the yellow bus, and gave it to the first policeman I saw—I also took the number of the John Bull bus—I saw nothing in the road to prevent the buses passing clear of each other—I am not accustomed to horses, and do not drive—the drivers wrangled after the accident—I did net hear what was said, as I was rather excited at seeing the man run over, but it was something about who was in fault.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. I am accustomed to walking, and have walked five or six miles au hour—I should not call that furious for horses—I would rather not say what is furious—I will swear that the barrow was moving—I saw the buses go more than 10 yards, but I would not swear how many—I should say they passed at least a dozen shops, and 20 yards is nearer the mark—I could not say which wheels were locked—I did not see an omnibus coming in an opposite direction, I saw no other vehicle at all.
Cross-examined by MR. GRAIN. I have seen buses come to town in the morning, and they go a good pace.
EDWARD LEE . I am traveller at 11, Newgate Street, on the south side—on 25th May, about 8 p.m., I was in a front room on the second floor, and heard a clattering of horses' hoofs louder than usual for that time in the evening—I went to the window, and saw the two omnibuses nearly together—the yellow one came towards the kerb and caught a barrow, which was just under the window, and turned it over—a man was pushing the barrow—I next saw the man lying on his back in the road behind the omnibus, which had only gone on about 3 yards—the yellow bus swerved towards the middle of the road—I did not actually see the omnibus horse down—I could not see whether the wheels of the omnibuses touched or not—I could not judge of the pace they had been going, but I should say rather faster than usual—when I first saw them the yellow bus was about 5 or 6 feet from the kerb—I ran down, and saw the man taken away in a cab.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. My attention was centred on the old man—the whole affair was momeutary—the swerving of the omnibuses took place after the old man was on his back—the buses had stopped before I left the window—the noise of vehicles is more noticeable in the evening than in the day when the streets are full—I saw a mail cart horse down.
Cross-examined by MR. GRAIN. I have seen many horses fall on the asphalte.
Re-examined. The mail cart horse was down near the railings; and had been going towards the post-office, on its proper side of the way and very near to the kerb, and 2 or 3 yards from the omnibuses when the collision occurred—I should say the fall was caused by pulling up sharp.
HARRY SILVERWOOD BROWN . I am a hosier's assistant, at 100, Newgate Street—on Friday, 25th May, about 8 o'clock p.m., I was standing in the shop doorway when my attention was attracted by the clatter of horses hoofs coming up the streets, and I saw a yellow and a green omnibus—the yellow one was nearest the kerb, and the green one a yard off—they gradually neared and a collision took place—I cannot say whether the barrow was knocked over before they came in collision, but I saw the man run over and saw him afterwards on the ground—I saw a mail cart coming in the opposite direction with two horses on the other side the way,
and one of the horses fell opposite Christ Church School gates—I never saw omnibuses go so fast—they were going double the speed.
Cross-examined. Our shop is nearly opposite the local post-office—I saw the omnibuses first, about 20 yards off—this court is about 16 yards in length—the accident occurred a few yards further west, nearly opposite Tann's—I did not see the omnibus horse down—the mail cart horse fell about the same time as the accident—it was all done in an instant.
Cross-examined by MR. GRAIN. When I say double the pace, I believe six miles an hour to be the fastest pace an omnibus is allowed to go—I have not noticed Hugh's omnibuses.
JOSEPH WARD . I am in Mr. Bolton's service, who contracts for the mail vans of the General Post-office—on Friday evening, 25th May, I was driving a two horse van in Newgate Street, towards the General Post-office, I was on the north side—I saw two omnibuses coming towards me very fast; I saw a man and a barrow close to the kerb and saw the buses hind wheels locked together—I should say the buses were going 9 or 10 miles an hour, and the drivers were whipping up the horses—I saw the barrow knocked down and the horses stumble and knock the man over—I pulled up to avoid a collision and one of my horses fell, when I was 40 or 50 yards away.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. I am twenty-two years old—I have been in Mr. Bolton's service two and a half years—I started from, Gough Street, Gray's Inn Road about 7.50—was going to get a load and was not timed—when I have got the mails I drive about 9 miles an hour, I do not call that furious—I reach Euston at 9 o'clock in the evening, leaving the Post-office about 8.10 or 8.15.
Re-examined. We have to drive carefully; we do not drive 9 miles an hour over the asphalte.
DANIEL DIXON (City Policeman 278). I was in Phoenix Court when this accident occurred—I ran into Newgate Street and saw two omnibuses pulled up—I took the numbers—I saw a barrow upset and a young man taking the deceased across the road; he was lifted into a cab—I went to the hospital in the cab with the man—Teatheredge was the driver, of the yellow, and Payne of the green omnibus—I took Payne into custody on 5th June and charged him with racing an omnibus and causing a person's death—he said he was sorry, but it was a pure accident.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. I believe I said "racing" before the Magistrate—Payne was there attending a summons for racing this omnibus—I did not see the accident.
Re-examined. I had taken out the summons, which was returnable on the 5th June, and, the man having died the previous day, I took Payne in custody when he appeared in answer to the summons.
JAMES TWOHIG . I live at 4, Charlotte Buildings, Gray's Inn Road, and am the son of Patrick Twohig, who was fifty-six years of age—he used to go about the streets with a handbarrow selling fruit—I saw him on May 25th at 7.45 p.m., in Cheapside, with his barrow—I was sent for from the hospital late on Friday night, where I saw my father very much hurt—he died on 4th June in the hospital.
Cross-examined by MR. BESLEY. My father had not been ill—I was not aware that he had 240l. in the lining of his coat.
found his left thigh was fractured, and there was a severe contusion of the right thigh and other injuries, especially to the head and fingers, such as wont be caused by being run over—he died in the hospital on 4th June the cause of death primarily was congestion of the lungs, brought on by the injury.
Cross-examined. He was in so unhealthy a state that he could not have got over a severe injury—he suffered from delerium, caused by anxiety about; money matters, and the steward showed me a receipt from a bank for 240 which was sewn up in the lining of his coat—his death was the result injuries, and not of the illness.
Re-examined. As a rule, people who suffer from severe injuries die from congestion of the lungs.
FREDERICK CHARLES BRETT (Policeman). I took Teather edge in custody on 4th June, about 12 p.m., at Paddington—I told him it was for causing the death of Twohig on 25th May—he said "I am innocent, the other omnibus ran against my wheel and that caused the accident."
Witnesses for the Defence.
FREDERICK WOODMAN . I am cashier to William Cowhurst and Co., mineral water manufacturers, Whitechapel, and live at Brixton—on 25th I got on the Bayswater bus at Aldgate and sat on the near side box seat—at the entrance to Newgate Street the bus stopped, I cannot say if it was to take up passengers; it then went on at about 6 miles an hour pace; it was certainly not furious driving—I noticed the yellow bus in Newgate Street about 20 yards in front of us—I saw the man and his barrow in front of the yellow bus, which was going 4 miles an hour—we wanted to pass, and pulled out into the middle of the road—the driver of the yellow bus urged on his horses as we were passing and knocked the barrow over in that nj and ran over the man—the off-side horse of the yellow bus then fell with its legs under our bus and the wheels of the buses were together—Payne pulled up immediately—Payne could not have caused the accident, as we had cleared the other bus without any obstruction.
Cross-examined. I did not see our driver use the whip—the road was all clear—I saw the barrow before it was struck, the man was pushing it along close to the kerb—Payne's omnibus was not bearing down, on the other—there was about a foot between the two—I have driven, but am not accustomed to drive—I believe it was the fore wheels of the buses that were locked—three other gentlemen were on the bus.
Re-examined. One's name is Curtis—I was at the police-court when the case was committed for trial and decided to give evidence at the trial—I could not see the passengers of the other omnibus.
GEORGE GREEN . I am a stevedore's labourer—on 25th May I was on the offside of Payne's omnibus—I got up in Whitechapel—we stopped at Wood's corner in Newgate Street—the yellow bus was 40 or 50 yards ahead in New-gate Street when I first saw it—I saw the yellow bus stop and pick up two passengers—the yellow bus was going 3 or 4 and Payne's about 6 miles an hour—I saw the horse of the Post-office van on the ground before the accident—Payne had nothing to do with that—I saw the man pushing his barrow—the yellow bus was then near to the kerb—Payne tried to pass when the near side horse of the yellow bus shot out from the barrow and caught the wheel of Payne's bus and his off side horse fell—I did not see the man run over, but Payne pulled up immediately and the fore wheels came together.
Cross-examined. I am accustomed to horses—the yellow 'bus kept the
road; our driver tried to pass him—he did not use the whip—the other tried to prevent it—they were side by side—when the collision took place.
JAMES NEWELL . I am an omnibus conductor for the General Omnibus Company—on 25th May our bus was coming through Newgate Street towards Whitechapel—I saw a yellow and a green bus, and I saw the deceased come from underneath the yellow bus as we were passing—I was on the left-hand side of the road, going to the General Post-office—when I first saw them the yellow bus was going 4 or 5 miles an hour, the other a little faster—they came in contact, and the horse of the yellow bus fell and caused the bus to swerve—I did not see the mail cart.
Cross-examined. As a conductor, I was behind looking out for passengers—the buses do not race or compete for passengers.
JOHN BALLARD . I was driving the bus of which Newell is the conductor; Terry's bus—Terry was on it; I was on trial—we were going through Newgate Street towards Whitechapel—I saw the yellow and green omnibuses near Warwick Lane, a few yards off, the yellow first; it was going 3 or 4: miles an hour—in less than a minute I saw the green one going 5 or 6 miles an hour—I saw the off-side horse of the yellow bus fall, and the other driver tried to pull up and their wheels caught together—I did not see the mail cart.
Cross-examined. I have driven for the company about three weeks—I saw the man lying in the road—I cannot say if they were trying to pass each other—they were side by side for two or three minutes.
Re-examined. I have had twenty-two years experience in driving—Payne was driving carefully—my 'bus was going 4 or 5 miles an hour.
CHARLES TERRY . Ballard was driving my bus on trial—I saw the yellow bus about 10 or 12 yards off coming towards me at 4 or 5 miles an hour—the green was 2 or 3 yards behind, and coming between 5 and 6 miles an hour—there was no racing—I saw the off-side horse of the yellow bus down when I looked the second time when our bus had passed—I did not see the mail cart.
Cross-examined. I have been in the company's service between twelve and thirteen years—I drove the John Bull bus—I know the prisoners as fellow servants—I do not know which ought to have been first; I do not know their times—I have met sometimes one first and sometimes the other, but usually the yellow one was first—I do not know of any rivalry.
Re-examined. If a driver is guilty of racing or other misconduct, the company dismiss him—Payne has always borne a good character as a careful driver, and I know him to be one.
By MR. GRAIN. The conductor tries to get the business; the driver has nothing to do with it.
ROBERT WARD . I am a draper's assistant, of 79, St. Paul's Church-yard—I was on Tetheredge's omnibus on the off-side in front—I got up at the corner by Good's cigar shop, and we proceeded at the ordinary pace, not quite so fast as I come down in the morning—we proceeded at that pace till we were opposite the Blue-coat School, when the blue bus came against the yellow bus, and. it was like an ordinary street accident; it occurred all at once—I did not see any racing—I did not 'see the whip used, but I was talking to a friend; I was actually on the side—where the collision between the two wheels took place—if the driver pulled one of the reins at all, he seemed to pull from the barrow.
Cross-examined by MR. POLAND. I am not accustomed to horses at all—
the yellow omnibus knocked the barrow over because it was in the war he drove against it and knocked over the man—the green omnibus seemed to knock against it, and the yellow one knocked the barrow over—I could see a long away ahead—there was room enough between the barrow and the kerb for the man to walk—of course in the gutter there would be little space—I do not not think the green omnibus was trying to pass us, but I dare say it would have got by us if the collision had not occurred, it was close alongside—I saw the mail cart coming; I saw him pull up at once to prevent the green omnibus going into him—he palled up suddenly—the green omnibus was then about the length of this Court from here, I should think—I am not a judge of pace; we generally come down faster of a morning—no passengers got out after leaving Sweeting's.
Re-examined. Passengers may have got in without stopping the omnibus—I come down of a morning from Praed Street, Edgware Road, to Warwick Lane, in about half an hour, but it takes three-quarters to return in the evening—I habitually travel by that route.
By THE COURT. I was exactly over the spot over the two wheels which came into collision, but I felt no shock.
EDWIN JOHN HANKAN . I am a draper's assistant—I was with Ward, sitting on the off-side of the yellow omnibus, which was going 4 or 5 miles an hour down Newgate Street—I saw no whipping-up by the driver—I was between the driver and my friend, conversing with him—I felt no shock—I could not see the other omnibus because I was sitting with my back to it, but I saw it come up by the side, and then there was a collision—there was a barrow on the near-side, and it drew off to the off-side, and this other bus came across, and to avoid it, as I imagine, our driver pulled on one side, and he must necessarily pull on to the barrow—two or three people called out to the old man, and he tried to get on to the pavement, which pointed the barrow across, and then the accident occurred, and the horse fell down—it all occurred in a moment.
Cross-examined by MR. POLAND. This occurred on the asphalte—I saw the mail cart, but did not see the horse in it come down—I first saw the green omnibus when it came into collision—I am under the impression that we stopped to pick up passengers after we left the corner of Newgate Street, and then went on again—I did not hear the green omnibus behind us—I saw the barrow actually knocked over, but I did not know that our wheels went over the man—have been brought up with horses, and have driven them—we were going 4 or 5 miles an hour, scarcely more than a walking pace—when the green omnibus came up the driver lost his rein, I do not know how, but the horse drew it from him—he did not use the whip—I did not see him put his hand to the socket.
The prisoners received good characters, and several witnesses testified to their skill and care in driving.
NOT GUILTY .
NEW COURT.—Friday, June 29th, 1877.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
573. ALFRED GLIDDON (43), LEWIS LAZARUS (34), and DAVID DANZIGER (19) , Unlawfully conspiring together to defeat and pervert the ends of justice. Other Count—for conspiring to bribe and intimidate Sarah Hardy, and prevent her giving evidence against Morris Cohen. (See pages 585 and 621).
MR. BULWER, Q. C., and MR. COWIE conducted the Prosecution; MR. SERJEANT PARRY appeared for Gliddon, MR. FRANCIS for Lazarus, and MR. STRAIGHT for Danziger.
JOHN O'CALLAGHAN (Police Inspector K). On 2nd November a man named Morris Cohen was brought to the Bethnal Green station, and I entered the charge, which was unlawfully receiving a pianoforte, value 25l., which bad been obtained by fraud from Jules Gautier—he was brought up at Worship Street on that charge on 3rd November, and remanded till the 10th; bail was accepted, but it was not obtained till, I think, the 8th or 9th—there were three remands, and the last hearing and committal was on the 24th, and on the 25th the depositions were completed—on 4th November I went to Cohen's premises in the Minories, which had the appearance of a wholesale dealer's in boots and shoes, but inside the warehouse I found a large quantity of goods of various descriptions, and musical instruments—on 10th November Ann Hardy attended to give evidence with reference to a piano of hers, obtained by false pretences, but there was no charge entered against Cohen with respect to that—I first went to the City Bank on 10th November, and saw one of the clerks there—I went again on 12th November, and saw the defendant Gliddon there, the manager—I went there in consequence of this letter received from him. (Read: "Private. The City Bank, Aldgate Branch, November 11th, 1876. Mr. Inspector O'Callaghan. Sir,—re M. Cohen. I am sorry I did not see you here yesterday, but I shall feel much obliged if you will call upon me here on Monday between 11 and 12, or Tuesday the same hour. The fact is, that, believing in the entire innocence and integrity of the prisoner, I have agreed to be a witness as to his character, but if he be a well-known receiver of stolen property, and known to the police as such, I should prefer aiding the police to obtain a conviction than to assist one of the worst kind of criminals. I shall be pleased, therefore, to tell you all I know, and would only urge you to thoroughly investigate the character and conduct of Cohen that the real truth may be arrived at, and if he be bad, I should, of course, prefer not being mixed up in it I am, Sir, yours obediently, A. Gliddon, Manager.") I alluded to the receipt of the letter, and he said he was at the police court when I called on the 10th, and had not returned—he asked my opinion about the case—I expressed a belief in Cohen's guilt, and said "There will be a number of other charges with regard to a man named Francis, goods obtained by him having been found on Cohen's premises, and taking that into account, and having regard to all the facts, I have no doubt of Cohen's guilt"—he said "Of course you must do your duty, but you must remember what will be the fate of his wife and daughters if he is convicted, and not press him more than you can help"—he said "Cohen has done only what is done every day in the City, buying goods without asking too many questions, or something like it, but one of the clerks expressed his dissent from that remark—I told him I had not called about Cohen, but about a man named Francis, who had dealings with Cohen, and had an account at the same bank—understood him to say he had no account, but only paid in enough to meet cheques as they were drawn—I found him in John Street, Minories—I was serving a warrant at the time, and I told Gliddon so—on 17th November I was at the police-court—the case was then in the hands of Mr. Wontner, on behalf of the Treasury—when I was at the police-court on 10th November, Danziger was sitting in the solicitor's box, with Cohen's wife and daughters, and Mr.
Gautier's solicitor applied to the Court to allow his client to withdraw from the prosecution—that was at the opening of the case, and Mrs. Hardy had not given her evidence—three pianos had been found on the premises that morning, and J told the Magistrate that there would be other charges forthcoming, and I put forward Mrs. Hardy, and having heard that, the Magistrate declined to allow the case to be withdrawn—I had seen Mr. Barrett, the salesman of the Anglo-Continental Company, and the manager, also; neither of them appeared at the police-court on the 10th or the 17th, they had been summonsed to appear—on the 19th Mrs. Hardy's evidence was gone into, and the case was remanded to the 24th—Gliddon and Danziger were present on 17th; I cannot speak positively about Lazarus—I think they were all three there on 25th, when Cohen was committed on both charges—the case of Mrs. Hardy's piano was proceeded with in this Court.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT PARRY. I have produced this charge-sheet—the charge is "Morris Cohen, 28, St. Peter's Street, Mile End Road, shipper and leather merchant;" I took that description from him—I put Jules Gautier, as of 62, Camden Road, St. Pancras, pianoforte manufacturer, under the head of person charging—he was the only prisoner at the time—under the head of charge how disposed of by Magistrate, and what offence proved; I have entered that there was a remand to the 10th, 17th, and 24th, and then tried Central Criminal Court," that means, the Magistrate committed him for trial at that time; I found that Gliddon was the acting manager of the Aldgate Branch, of the City Bank, the clerk asked my name and address and I told him—I made inquiries about Francis' account and mentioned Cohen's name in connection with him, I then received the letter, and on the Monday, I think the 12th, I went to the bank and Gliddon told me that the bank was opened in May, 1876, and he had been manager since then—he also told me he had been manager of the branch at Paddington, he did not say that Francis' account had been opened by a previous manager and not by him—he said that he had not seen Francis that he could remember except once—the clerk told me that a good many inquiries from banks had been made in regard to Francis, and Gliddon told me the same—he mentioned Mr. Hillman, the previous manager, and said that Francis had a respectable reference—I do not remember whether Francis' account was opened by him or not—it is my impression that he said "Buying goods without asking too many questions," and the clerk differed with him—he told me that he firmly believed in Cohen's innocence, but he said "Of course you know more about him than has been given in evidence"—I did not see Francis' account; I asked the state of it and they said that he had no balance—Cohen's account was not shown to me, and I did not inquire about it—I understood him to say that Cohen had been an old customer of the bank, but he could not be of that branch as it only opened in May.
Cross-examined by MR. FRANCIS. Gliddon and Danziger were there on the 24th, but I cannot commit myself to Lazarus; I had seen him once or twice, but I cannot fix the dates, I knew little about him, and had no reason to fix my attention upon him; I believe he was in the employ of Messrs. Hyams and Co., but do not know for how long.
Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. I think I saw Danziger at the police-court, on, I think, all the occasions, and Cohen's daughters also, taking a great interest in the proceedings and apparently very much distressed; I
know that Danziger is engaged to one of them—I' saw him. generally in her company—I saw the mother there only on one occasion—r—I do not know whether Danziger is traveller for a cigar house—I saw him here with the laughters when Cohen was tried.
Re-examined. I saw Lazarus here also—I went to make inquiries in reference to Francis, at Glid don's bank—when the clerk told me that a lot of inquiries had been made about him, Gliddon was not present, but I asked Geliddon to let me look at the inquiries, and he said that it was contrary to their custom—I said that Francis had drawn a cheque for 10l. in favour of Mr. Penticott, and I was seeking a warrant for his apprehension, and if the cheque was dishonoured it would aid me in obtaining the warrant; at that moment there was no money, but when I called again Francis had deposited the money to meet the cheque; Mr. Gliddon did not give me every facility for elucidating the matter with regard to Francis, beyond giving me the name of the person who introduced him.
LEWIS GAUTIER . I am the Bon of Jules Gautier, of Camden Road—I remember Harris coming and taking a piano away in a cart—I followed it to 28, St. Peter's Road, Mile End, Cohen's house—I gave evidence before the Magistrate on 3rd November, and afterwards here.
PAULINE GAUTIER . I am the wife of Jules Gautier, a pianoforte maker, who was defrauded out of a piano on November 1—I gave evidence before the Magistrate on 3rd November with reference to the charge against Cohen—I remember seeing Gliddon and Lazarus there that day, but not Danziger; we had no conversation—the case was remanded till the 10th and on the evening of the 9th. Gliddon and Lazarus called, but my husband was out—Gliddon asked how long he would be; I said that he might be in a few minutes—he waited some time, and then said "Could I see in the morning?"—I said "You will have to be very early, because we have to attend at the police-court."—he said "'That is just what we have come about; it is a dreadful affair altogether about Mr. Cohen; I have known him myself for twenty-five years and I know he is quite innocent, and this affair has put bis family in great distress of mind, and we have called on you to-night to see your husband to induce him not to prosecute, him as I know he is innocent of the charge"—I did not ask him who he; was he gave me his card—he said "Do you know whether he has instructed a solicitor?"—I said "I think he has instructed some one"—he said "Do you know who it is? "I said "I think it is some one in Gray's Inn Lane, but I don't know the name—he said "Do you know the solicitor's private residence?"—I said "I do not"—he said "We can see the solicitor, which will save your husband the trouble of going to the court in the morning"—he said "What did you pay for your instrument?"—I said "25l."—he said 'Weil, we will pay you the 25l. for the piano, and you must have been at some expense, we will pay all your expenses besides, and see you are not out of pocket by it"—I told him I was sorry, as he knew Mr. Cohen was innocent that he had got into trouble, and I hoped he would be able to prove his innocence—when he said there was no occasion for my husband to appear in the morning, I said "But what about the Anglo-Pianoforte Company? "—he said "We have settled with them, and they will not appear"—he stayed a little while waiting for my husband, and had some private conversation with Lazarus, perhaps a dozen words, and he said "I can't stop any longer, I shall be at Paddington to-night, if you want me you know where to find me," and he went away, leaving Lazarus, who remained till
my husband came, about 8 o'clock; they had a conversation, but I did not hear it all because a customer came in and spoke to him—my husband went for a policeman, as Lazarus would not give his card—I heard my husband say "I believe Cohen is a rogue, and you are another; you want me to compound a felony, and I would not do it fur 1,000l.," or words to that effect—I went to Worship Street next morning and saw Gliddon and Lazarus, but I am not sure Danziger was there—he was pointed out to us one day at Worship Street; I don't know which—they had no conversation with me that morning—the case was heard and remanded to the 17th, and on the evening of the 16th Gliddon came with one of Cohen's daughters—I do to him "What about the old lady?" meaning Mrs. Hardy, who I heard give her evidence on the 11th—he said "We have seen Mrs. Hardy, and she will not prosecute, and you will be left alone, and it will be a great expense to you and cost you a lot of money"—he said he would return at 9 o'clock, as I said I thought my husband would be in then, but instead of returning at 9 o'clock he came at 8 o'clock with Miss Cohen and saw my husband—on every occasion he said that if we could get Cohen out of trouble it would be a good thing for us, as Cohen was a large shipper of pianos and would recommend us—we went before the Court next morning, the 17th, and the case was remanded to the 24th—on the evening of the 23rd Gliddon called with Miss Cohen and Danziger; he introduced Danziger as Miss Cohen's intended and said they were to be married, and said what a pity it was this had happened, and there was the same proposition as before—Gliddon asked whether we had received a subpoena—I said I did not think so—he said "Because if you have had no subpoena, there is no occasion to appear"—he also said there was no doubt that the 25l. could be put in some one's hands until the case was over, or something like it—he went away, but Danziger and Miss Cohen staid till 10.30 and then left without seeing my husband—we went to the Court the next morning, when I believe the depositions were read over and we had to sign them.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT PARRY. I did not know Mr. Gliddon before November 9th—he gave me his card with "Manager of the City Bank, Aldgate branch," on it—he did not say that Cohen had solemnly declared to God that he was innocent—he said that the family were in great distress of mind, but he did not say that they had applied to him—he said he had known him for twenty-five years, not that he was well known in business for twenty-five years—he said "I have known Mr. Cohen myself twenty-five years"—I was present when a great number of witnesses were called to Cohen's character, gentlemen of respectability, Common councilmen in the City, and men who said that they had known him many years as an honourable man—the case relating to the pianos was tried on the following day following the other case on which he was first convicted, and even after the first conviction I believe many gentlemen came forward to give him a character—Cohen's daughter came with Danziger on the 21st and 23rd and remained with him some time after Mr. Gliddon went away—I believe she said that she kept the books and that the entries were correct and regular—she seemed in great distress about the matter—my feelings were strongly appealed to as a mother—she said "I suppose you have a family yourself?"—she said that she had kept the books since her eldest sister was married and she knew all the business—I was quite aware that my husband had engaged a solicitor before I saw Mr. Gliddon—when Mr. Gliddon said that there was no reason for my husband to go next morning if he had employed a solicitor, as lie
could deal with him—Lazarus said that it he liked to appear he could do so before the Magistrate, as whatever was done, whether my husband went or the solicitor, an application was to be made for the Magistrate's permission to withdraw; Lazarus said that in Mr. Gliddon's presence; that was on the 9th, but those were not the exact words—he said there was no occasion for my husband to appear, as he had employed a solicitor—I said "I dn't see very well how he can manage it," and then Mr. Lazarus said if he wished to appear he could appear and say that he had heard that the man was respectable and ask the Magistrate to allow him to withdraw from the case, that it could be done in that way.
Cross-examined by MR. FRANCIS. I had not seen Lazurus before the 9th, I mean that he had never called on me before—Gliddon did not mention Lazarus as a friend of his who had come to speak to Cohen's character, and Lazarus said that he had known Mr. Cohen many years, although he had not spoken to him for three or four years, and that Mrs. Cohen had called upon him the evening previous, and when Lazarus came home the wife begged him to try and see what he could do in the matter, and that was the reason he was taking so much trouble in the affair; that his wife told him O'Callaghan had called and that she had "My dear, go and see what you can do for that poor man"—I will not say it was not "Go and speak to his character"—Lazarus may have stopped an hour and a half or two hours before my husband came back, and when he came back he was rather excited—Lazarus refused to give' his card, and my husband said "I will know who you are"—I do not remember Lazarus saying that he had no right to demand his card, and "I came here to speak to a gentleman and find I have made a mistake, and I won't give you my card, you have no right to demand it," or words to that effect—my. husband turned the key, locked him in, and sent for a policeman—I tried to calm my husband down and said it was no use to bother—I turned the key and let Lazarus out, and as he was going out my husband came back.
Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Mr. Gliddon introduced Danziger as the intended husband of Miss Cohen, that was to explain his presence there, and he sat down and tried some of our pianos after Mr. Gliddon had gone, and said they were very good.
Re-examined. It was on the 9th, that Lazarus spoke of getting the Magistrate's permission to withdraw—we went before the Magistrate on the 10th, and he refused to allow the case to be withdrawn—overtures were made to me on more than one occasion to withdraw, the same conversation took place on each occasion—Cohen was tried on the second charge-in-a separate court by a different jury.
JULES GAUTIER . I am a pianoforte maker, of 62, Camden Road—on 2nd November, I gave Morris Cohen in custody on a charge connected with a piano of mine—I had watched his house, 28, St. Peter's Road, the previous night, with my son Lewis—on 3rd November, I attended at Worship Street police-court, and gave evidence—I did not see the present defendants there that day—on 9th November, the day fixed for the re-hearing, I went home at 8 o'clock and found Lazarns sitting there, and my wife said this is the gentleman who was here with the bank manager—she turned to Lazarus and said "This is Mr. Gautier"—he greeted me in the usual way and said that he had come to speak about that unfortunate affair of Mr. Cohen, it was a most unfortunate affair for him, but he was a very honest upright man—I said "You may say what you like about his honesty, but if it had not been for my son following the van I should have lost my piano"—he said "Oh,
that is very possible, but nevertheless you must admit you were hasty in giving him in charge"—I said "The reason I gave him in charge was because he told me so many falsehoods this morning"—he said "What falsehoods?"—I said "Well, he told me that the piano had gone in the first place to his house, back to the Minories, and back again to his house, whereas we know very well that the piano did not go to his house, but went to a public-house, the Devonshire Arms"—he said "Oh, that is where the mistake is, I can easily explain that to you, it is quite true that the van stopped at the Devonshire Arms, but while the men were there some of the men went to Cohen's house"—I said "I thought that might be the explanation given of that," and rose from my seat—he asked me to sit down and listen to him—I said "No, I have beard quite enough will you oblige me with your card"—he pointed to a card lying on the piano; I picked it up and found it was that of Mr. Alfred Gliddon—I asked my wife whether that was this gentleman's card—she said "No, his friend gave it to me"—I asked him for his own card—he said that he had none—I said "Then give me your name hand address, will you?"—he said "No, I won't, I don't see why I should, in fact when I came here I thought I was coming to speak to a gentleman, but I find I have made a mistake"—I said "Well, I want your name and address, and if you don't give it to me I shall lock you up"—he said that I had no right to demand it—I said "Well, I will show you," and locked the door and went out—I also said "You and your friend have come here for the purpose of compounding a felony, and under those circumstances I consider I have a perfect right to know who you are"—he appealed to my wife and a gentleman who was there, and said "What have I done, I have said nothing—I fetched a policeman, and when I got to my house again Lazarus was coming down the steps, and said "You have imprisoned an innocent man, you will repent if it costs us 1,000l."—I replied "I believe Cohen is a thief, and you are another"—he said "And so are you"—next morning the 10th, I went to the police-court, and Mr. Gliddon spoke to me outside the Court—he touched me on the shoulder and said "Are you Mr. Gautier?"—I said "Yes"—I knew who he was, because he had been pointed out to me—I said "What for?"—he said "On behalf of Mr. Cohen"—I said "You had better speak to my solicitor," pointing to a gentleman with me—I stood close by, and Gliddon said to my solicitor "I can assure you Mr. Cohen is a very honest, upright man. There are many men here, some of them influential City merchants, ready to speak well of him. This is an unfortunate affair for him; he has been made the dupe of either Mr. Harris or Hart"—that is the man who took the piano off the premises—my solicitor said "What is it you want my client to do?"—he said "Well, let him keep away, he has no need to appear"—he said "I cannot advise him to do that"—Gliddon said "Well, you do as you like, but you will find that we are so thoroughly satisfied with Mr. Cohen's respectability and innocence that we shall spare no expense in his defence, and we shall obtain remand after remand, so that it will be a source of trouble, expense, and anxiety to your client"—he also said that the Anglo-Continental Company had withdrawn from the case, and written a letter to the Magistrate to that effect—my solicitor said "The only thing that can be done is to make application to a solicitor, asking his advice whether ray client had not better withdraw the charge"—Mr. Gliddon then said "Oh, that will do, we don't want anything illegal or irregular, and if you do that,
that is all we want you to do"—I afterwards went into Court, and there was another remand—I heard an application made for permission to withdraw the charge, but in consequence of another charge being made against Cohen the Magistrate declined to allow me to withdraw from the prosecution—on 16th November, the evening before the further hearing, Gliddon came to my house with Miss Cohen, and said what a pity it was for Mr. Cohen to have got into this trouble and bother, and it was a bad job for those daughters of his, and he could assure me that he was an innocent, upright man, and no doubt, after he got out of his trouble, he would be a good customer of mine, and would recommend me to his friends, many of whom were shippers or merchants; that the Continental Company had been settled with, and had received the price of their pianos, and would not appear, as they had withdrawn from it altogether, and that Mrs. Hardy also would not appear, as they had arranged that, and there would be no one there; I should be the only one—I replied that those considerations could not have the slightest influence on my conduct in the morning, because if I found myself left alone, the better course for me to pursue would be to cause the application to be made again—Danziger was at my house once; he came with Miss Cohen after the committal.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT PARRY. I said that it would be obviously my best course to ask the Magistrate's advice, and to ask permission again to withdraw—he said that he wanted nothing irregular or illegal.
Cross-examined by MR. FRANCIS. Lazarus did not say that he had come to speak to Cohen's character—he begun the conversation—he was very indignant at being shut up.
SARAH HARDY . I am the daughter, of Mrs. Hardy, whose piano was taken—I went with her to the police-court on the 10th, but did not give evidence—coming out of Court I saw Gliddon and Danziger—they asked the value of the piano—my mother said "Eight guineas"—they said "Dear me, what a small sum"—one of them, Danziger I think, asked her address, and took it down—Mr. Gliddon said that Cohen was a respectable man; he had known him a long time—on 14th November Danziger and Mrs. Cohen called at our house, when Mr. Oliver and my mother were there—Danziger' said to my mother "I should like to see you by yourself"—she said "Whatever you have to say you must say before Mr. Oliver"—he said that he was a friend of the family, and had come to ask her to withdraw, as Mr. Cohen was an innocent man, and he would pay all the expenses, which included about 15l.—Mr. Oliver said he could not decide that evening, and Danziger called again next day about 1 o'clock—Mr. Oliver was there by appointment, and Danziger said that he would go to a lawyer, and he called again the same evening to ask my mother to sign a paper for Mr. Beard to instruct counsel to withdraw the charge—Mr. Oliver was there—my mother did not sign it; she went to the Court again a few days afterwards and gave evidence—on the 20th Mr. Gliddon came and Miss Julia Cohen—Mr. Gliddon said that he had known Mr. Cohen a great number of years, and asked her to withdraw from the case, and said that she should not be the loser—she said that she would, if the Magistrate would allow her to—I was in Court when Cohen was committed—I was present when Harris purchased the piano and gave a cheque for 8l. 8s.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT PARRY. I think Gliddon said "Withdraw, Mrs. Hardy, if you do that you will save a family from ruin, and God will reward you"—he seemed to be in earnest, and, rightly or wrongly,
to take a very deep interest in the matter—he said that even making a charge against Cohen would be a stain on the characters of his daughters.
Cross-examined by MR. GILL. Danziger said that he had come to bring Mrs. Cohen—he came a day or two afterwards and suggested consulting a solicitor, and mentioned the names of several.
WILLIAM T. OLIVER . On 14th Nov. I was at Mrs. Hardy's when Danziger called with Miss Cohen—there was a suggestion that what was said should he said in my presence, and he said that he came to ask Mrs. Hardy to withdraw from the charge, and that they were willing to pay her 15l.—I told him she could not accept the money, it would be compromising the case, and that I did not believe Cohen was innocent, and I bad reason to believe other cases would be brought against him—he said that in order to satisfy me he should like me to see Mr. Gliddon, the manager of the City Bank, who would satisfy me of her innocence—I made an appointment to meet Danziger the next day—I said when he was leaving "I have not the pleasure of knowing your name," he looked at me, and said "Ah! that is where I have the advantage of you"—I heard his name in Court for the first time—he called on the 15th, and I went with him to the bank at Aldgate—I had not arranged to go there, but to a lawyer, and he took me to Gliddon's instead—he had mentioned the name of Mr. Mullins, the solicitor to the Banker's Association, which I mentioned to Mr. Gliddon when I saw him, and he said that he would not advise us to go there, because he was not a good criminal lawyer, and suggested another gentleman in Basinghall Street—he also said that he was perfectly satisfied that Cohen was innocent, and that Mrs. Hardy could withdraw, and the money, 15l. could be deposited with him—Danziger and I went off to see the other solicitor, and Mr. Gliddon went part of the way with us; we walked, and he left us by the Royal Exchange—it was suggested that a paper should be drawn out for Mrs. Hardy to sign, for the solicitor to instruct counsel to withdraw, and Danziger said that he would pay the expense if she would withdraw, but I did not agree to that—as we came down the stairs of the solicitor's office, we met Gliddon, he returned with us, and the lawyer repeated the advice he had given us, and going along Gliddon said that Danziger could deposit three 5l. notes with him, and that he should hold the money—I said that I could not accept that as I knew Cohen was guilty, and it would be compromising the case, and I knew the Treasury were going to take it up—further conversation took place, and we again repeated our refusal to withdraw—in the evening Danziger called at Mrs. Hardy's again for her to sign a paper to withdraw, but I did not see it—I told him it was no use his coming, we should not withdraw under any circumstances—he said that Mrs. Hardy could say that she had been satisfied by Mr. Gliddon of Cohen's innocence; I said that we were not satisfied, we bad no evidence to that effect—on the following Friday, the 17th, the case was before the Magistrate at Worship Street, but I was not called—I saw Danziger there before the case came on, who said "It is all right, you can have the money, it is deposited with Mr. Gliddon"—I said we should repeat our refusal, as the Treasury had taken the matter up, and I had nothing more to do with it—Gliddon was then a short distance off—I spoke to him in Court, and he said "The 15l. is all right with me, you can take it out when you like"—I said "No, it is all wrong, the Treasury have taken the matter up, and we want to have nothing more to do with either of you—I communicated with the Treasury; I did not see them again till Cohen was convicted here—I saw Gliddon then.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT PARRY. I was acting for Mrs. Hardy simply as a friend, she placed herself in my hands—I went with Danziger to consult a solicitor, Mr. Thomas Beard, but we did not see him, we saw his son, Mr. Walter Beard—I had never seen either of them before—I am not in the profession—he said that Mrs. Hardy would receive the money without any risk, and that the best way was to deposit it with, a third party, and she could draw it out afterwards—I said "Suppose the Treasury find that out, would not she be liable to punishment?" and he gave me an evasive answer; no answer at all—he said "I have told you all I can, it is an intricate case, and I can say no more"—Danziger mentioned the names of several solicitors to me—when Gliddon went upstairs with us, Mr. Walter Beard repeated in substance to him what he had said before to us—it was before Gliddon came that Mr. Beard said "I have told you all I can about the case"—what Mr. Beard said to Mrs. Hardy about the money was said, supposing she had a lawyer to apply to the Magistrate for permission to withdraw—Mrs. Hardy said once in my presence that she would withdraw if the Magistrate would allow her—she did not say so twice to my recollection.
Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. We were at Mr. Beard's at least half an hour—it was pointed out to Mr. Beard that I knew the charge was receiving the pianos after they had been obtained by false pretences, so that as a lawyer he could ascertain what the specific charge was—Danziger did not mention his contemplated relationship—Mr. Beard went over to him once and asked his name, and he whispered it, but he never mentioned it to us—he merely said that he was a friend of the family, and that he was convinced of Cohen's innocence—prior to going to the solicitor, some names were mentioned, and I mentioned the name of a solicitor, and the objection was taken that that he was not an able criminal lawyer.
ANN HARDY . I live at 22, Merrick Square—in October last a piano was obtained from me by a man named Harris—he gave me a cheque for it for eight guineas, which was afterwards returned to me from the bank—I communicated with the police, and on 10th November went to Worship Street; where I gave evidence against Morris Cohen on a charge of receiving my piano unlawfully—I saw all three defendants there—Danziger and Gliddon, I think, spoke to me—Gliddon asked me the price of the piano; I told him eight guineas, and he asked my name and address—on 14th November Danziger and Miss Cohen called at my house; Oliver was present—Danziger wished me to withdraw from the case and said he would pay my expenses—I do not remember that any sum was mentioned—he came again next day and took Mr. Oliver to see a lawyer—on the 20th Gliddon and Miss Cohen came, and Gliddon asked me to withdraw from the case, as Mr. Cohen was innocent—my daughter, Sarah, was present at the interview.
The prisoners received good characters.
GLIDDON— Six Months' Imprisonment.
LAZARUS and DANZIGER— Four Months' Imprisonment each.
NEW COURT.—Saturday, June 30th, 1877.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. GILL conducted the Prosecution; and MR. PURCELL the Defence.
HARRIET REBECCA ELSOM . I am the prisoner's wife, and live at 16, Desborough. Street—he came home on Saturday, 2nd June, between 9 and 10 p.m., very drunk—he gave me Id.—my sister, Fanny Lammin,—was in the room—said "Is that all you've got "—he said "Yes"—I wiped out a jug and gave it to my sister to fetch some beer; she did so—I poured out a glass; my husband drank it—I then poured out a little drop; my sister had gone downstairs for a jug of water for my husband—my husband drank the little drop and told me to drink out of the mug—he first told me to open the window, because the room was hot—I drank nearly a glass full out of the jug; I became very sick and queer, and said "I feel so sick and queer"—he said "Yes, you b——, I have poisoned you"—my sister had come back and I sent her for ray mother—raj husband had asked me for the money I had earned, and I refused to give it to him—he was always kind to me when he was not drunk, but he had been drunk every evening in the week—I do not wish to have him punished.
Cross-examined. My husband stutters, and when he is tipsy he stutters all the more, so that sometimes I cannot make out what he says—when I asked what the 2d. was for he said "It's the price of a pint"—I drank out of the jug when I came back from the window—he drank the little drop before 1 drank out of the jug—I do not know what took place when nay mother came; I became very bad.
FANNY LAMMIN . I live with my mother at 5, Desborough Street; I have no father—Mrs. Elsom is my sister—on this Saturday night I was in my sister's place when Mr. Elsom came home; he gave my sister 2d. and said it was the price of a pint—my sister gave me a clean jug and sent me for some beer; when I came back I put it on the table—Mr. Elsom then sent me for a jug of water before any beer was drunk and I fetched it—my sister was then standing near the table, and Mr. Elsom was sitting on the bed with a glass of beer in his hand—he told my sister to drink out of the jug; she did so and said "I am so bad—he said "I have poisoned you"—my sister sent me for mother—Mr. Elsom was drunk.
Cross-examined. The prisoner stutters very much; I can understand him—he drank a glass full of beer and a little drop—my sister poured out the little drop after he told her to drink out of the jug—he said to mother "We have been having some beer; I don't know what is in it"—my mother said "You have poisoned her"—I went for a doctor and did not hear what was said afterwards.
PATRICK O'SHEA (Policeman XR 39). I was in Johnson's Place, about 9.20, on 2nd June—the prisoner came to me and said "Policeman, I have poisoned my wife, follow me"—I followed him to 16, Desborough Street, Harrow Road—he was drunk—I went into a back room on the first floor and saw a woman leaning against the wall—I asked what was the matter—she was too ill to answer—she afterwards said "He has poisoned me"—the prisoner said "Harriet, you b——, you know I have not"—she was taken to the hospital—the mother was present.
Cross-examined. The prisoner stuttered, but not very much—I did not hear him threaten to knock the mother's brains out.
HARRIET LAMMIN . I live at 5, Desborough Street—I was sent for on this Saturday night to ray daughter's place and found her vomiting—I asked the prisoner what he had been doing—he said "Nothing, only having some beer"—I looked at the glass and the mug, and said "You have poisoned her"
—the prisoner was then very violent and said if I dared say such a thing he would knock my brains out—I sent my girl Fanny for a doctor and then for a policeman—the prisoner said "I'll go for a b——policeman myself"—I searched the room on the Monday, but did not find anything.
Cross-examined. I saw some white stuff in the jug and on the glass, and that made me think of the poison—I did not search the room then, it was searched on the Monday.
Re-examined. There was a fire in the room that Saturday night.
JOHN BATTEN COOMBE . I am a licentiate of the Royal College of Surgeons and resident medical officer of St. Mary's Hospital—the prosecutrix was brought to me on Saturday night, 2nd June, about 10 p.m.—she said she felt sick and had great pain in her stomach—I used the stomach pump, after which she got rapidly better—the glass was brought to me on the Sunday evening and the jug two or three days afterwards—I analysed what remained in the jug and glass, and also the vomit—I found in them all a large quantity of ammonia of chloride of mercury, commonly called white precipitate; it is used for children; if it had been absorbed into the system most likely the patient would die; it was sure to have produced intense salivation—there was sufficient in the vomit to have caused death.
Cross-examined. It is insoluble in water and would sink to the bottom of a vessel containing liquor, but would dissolve in time, say twenty-four hours—you would easily see it, it is quite white like white lead—the froth of the beer would hold it.
JOSEPH SPENCER (Policeman X 29). About 10 p.m. on Saturday I was called to 16, Desborough Street, and found a woman lying on the floor—from what I heard I told the prisoner-1 should take him in custody for trying to poison his wife—he said "I shan't go"—I said "You will have to go, and you had better go quietly"—he looked for his cap, and I took him to the station—he was the worse for drink—I took the jug and the glass to the hospital.
Cross-examined. The prisoner stuttered very much.
GUILTY on the Second Count — Eight Years' Penal Servitude.
OLD COURT.—Friday, June 29th; Saturday, 30th; Monday, July 2nd, and Tuesday, 3rd, 1877.
Before Mr. Justice Field.
THE SOLICITOR-GENERAL with MESSRS. POLAND and BOWEN conducted the Prosecution; and MR. GRANTHAM, Q. C., with MR. STRAIGHT, the Defence.
JOSEPH FRANCIS CHANCE . I am senior assistant in the solicitor's office to the Treasury Department—on 26th February this year the legal business of the Admiralty department of the Government was transferred to the Treasury Solicitor's department, and two clerks, who had formerly been employed in the Admiralty Solicitor's office, Mr. Swainson and Mr. Lindsay, were transferred to the Treasury Solicitor's department, where they continued to attend to the Admiralty business—on 9th March I remember Mr. Lindsay bringing me this letter, dated the 8th, which purported to come from Mr. Reeve, of Lowestoft, in reference to some surveyor's charges relating to the
purchase by the Admiralty of some land near Lowestoft called Maid's Acre; the amount claimed was 40l.—in consequence of that I requested Mr. Lindsay to look up the papers, when the conveyance of the property was found to be missing, it was not with the bundle where it should have been—upon that I wrote this letter of 14th March requesting Mr. Reeve to return the conveyance, and on the 16th I received this reply from Mr. Reeve, enclosing the conveyance. (Read: "As requested by your letter of yesterday, and upon the understanding that the costs herein, amounting to 99l. 18s. 10rf., are sent me by return of post, I enclose the conveyance duly executed. (Signed) R. H. Reeve.") That 99l. 18s. 10d. was composed of 59l. 18s. 10cl. legal charges nnd 40l. for the surveyor's charges—upon the receipt of that letter the papers were looked at and Mr. Swainson brought me Mr. Reeve's bill of costs—I am under the impression that he brought it me at an earlier stage of the proceedings, when I received the first letter from Mr. Reeve applying for his costs; I took it only as applying to the surveyor's costs, being aware at that time that his own bill was paid—after receiving the letter of 15th March, enclosing the conveyance, I communicated with Mr. Swainson—I had not seen the cheque before that. (The cheque was uncrossed for 59l. 18s. 10d., dated 27th January, 1877, on the London and County Bank, Victoria Street hranch, drawn, by A. Isaac Bristowe, payable to R. H. Reeve, Esq., or order, and endorsed R. H. Reeve") I spoke to Mr. Swainson on the subject, and he then produced to me the receipted bill and the cheque; that was on 16th March—the receipted bill of costs would properly be in Mr. Swainson's custody, he being the accountant—all the old papers and books were brought over from the old office at S, Richmond Terrace, to the new office at the Treasury, and the old papers, which were very voluminous, were deposited in certain vaults in the basement, and those relating to current business were at once transferred to the room which was to be occupied by Mr. Swainson and Mr. Lindsay—these particular documents were probably in a safe is that room, where the vouchers were kept, the business not being concluded—Mr. Swainson was the person responsible for their custody; Mr. Lindsay had no particular department, he assisted generally in the work under Mr. Bristowe as a clerk, in conveyancing for the most part—on 16th March I wrote this letter to Mr. Reeve, which Mr. Stephenson signed. (This informed Mr. Reeve that the receipted bill and endorsed cheque were in the possession of the Treasury.) I then received from Mr. Reeve a request to forward him the receipt and the cheque, which I did on the 19th—on the 20th I received from him a telegram stating that his clerk would come to London, which he did the following morning, bringing back with him the cheque and the bill—I don't know that I informed Mr. Swainson of each step that was taken, hut the letter-book was open to his inspection, and I have no doubt he knew what was going on.
Cross-examined. In December and January 'last I was in precisely the same position that I now occupy—I had nothing then to do with the Admiralty department—the business was not transferred to the Treasury until 26th February—Mr. Alfred Isaac Bristowe was then acting solicitor for the Admiralty department—his father, up to the time of his death, had been solicitor to the Admiralty, and after his death the son was left acting solicitor, having been in his father's office, and he held that office until February this year, when it was transferred to our department—I think I may say he then retired, his office was abolished; he was not taken over in the same way as Mr. Swainson and Mr. Lindsay—I first heard that anything was wrong on
16th March—as soon as it was discovered that a forgery had been committed the matter passed out of ray hands, as I do not attend to the criminal business of the office, into the hands of Mr. Stephenson; he had the entire investigation of this matter from its discovery on 16th March; I had nothing to do beyond answering any question that Mr. Stepenson might put to me—I know nothing beyond what I have stated—I only saw Mr. Fullagur on one occasion, a few days after the work was transferred, when I went to the office at Richmond Terrace to inquire as to certain papers that had not apparently been transferred; I then saw him for a few minutes.
HENRY SWAINSON . My principal duty is that of accountant, I have been in the department forty-five years next August—I was acting in that capacity during the year 1876—on 31st March, 1876, I paid by Navy bill the purchase money in respect of the site of this Coastguard station at Lowestoft; from that time until January, this year, I had nothing to do with it—on Saturday, 27th January, the prisoner came to me at Richmond Terrace, he brought Mr. Reeve's bill of costs in his hand, and said that he bad looked through it, I believe, and saw no objection and would I draw a cheque for the amount—in the ordinary course it would be my duty to draw a cheque, and the prisoner's, duty to ask me for it if he attended to the matter, he having previously asked Mr. Bristowe about it—I then took out the cheque-book and filled up the cheque—this (produced) is it—this counterfoil is in my writing: "27, January, 1877, to R. H. Reeve, Esq., Lowestoft, Coastguard"—all the cheque is in my writing except the signature, and the endorsement, I know nothing about the endorsement—Mr. Fullager waited while I wrote out the cheque, and I then handed him the book with the cheque in it to take to Mr. Bristowe to sign—he took it and went into Mr. Bristowe's room, he was gone about ten minutes—he then returned and said that Mr. Bristowe declined to sign it, but that he—would do so on Monday—this was between 1 and 2 o'clock, the office closes rather early on Saturday, I used always to go away at 2 o'clock on Saturday—while Mr. Fullagar was gone I got the cash-book and entered the cheque, thinking it would be signed as a matter of course—this is the entry: "27, January, Mr. R. H. Reeve, Lowestoft, Coastguard, 59l. 18s. 10d."—as if it were a cash payment—if that cheque had been brought back to me signed, it would not have been my duty to do anything further with it, Mr. Fullagar would bring it back and write the letter, if I had had to send it, it would have been my duty to cross it; I make it a rule always to cross cheques, either at the time I draw it or before it goes away—Mr. Fallagar brought back the cheque and the book to me on the Saturday, and I locked it up in my drawer till the Monday—on the Monday; he came to me and said "I will take that cheque for Mr. Bristowe's signature"—I handed him the book, he took it in to take to Mr. Bristowe to get it signed—I did not see him do so, he took it away, I saw no more of it that day that I remember—we had separate rooms, Fullagar's room adjoined mine—Mr. Lindsay and I occupied one room, and Peter the messenger had a temporary seat there for a time as we had not any room for him—we had no letter book, a draft is kept of letters sent, which is kept with the other papers—it would have been Fullagar's duty to write that letter—search has been made and no such letter can be found, I was in the habit of entering as cash paid, merely on the signature of a cheque—if I had to send away a cheque it would be the ordinary course to make an entry of it in the day-book, which is a rough book where everything is entered, the whole of the office business; the
prisoner made entries in it, it was open to all, it was the office book, any person sending such a letter would make the entry, but Mr. Lindsay generally made the entries, although others might do the act, and I did it myself frequently—this entry was made by me: "January 29th, letter to Mr. Reeve with cheque for costs 59l. 18s. 10d., and a bill of costs"—I made that entry, seeing that there was not one made, and seeing a letter to Mr. Reeve in the letter-box—the letter-box is on the mantelpiece, in which all letters going away are put—I think I saw that in the afternoon, it was a foolscap envelope with an enclosure of course, a thickish envelope, with "On H. M. Service" printed on it, and with the Admiralty solicitor's blue-seal, one of the official envelopes—I saw the direction on it, it would be in Mr. Fullagar's handwriting, he having written the letter—I saw the address as far as I recollect—I am able to say that I did—I could not say positively in whose handwriting it was, but Mr. Fullagar having written the letter, it would be in his—there was nothing at all unusual in my making the entry, although I did not do the business, it was the usual thing, it was a sort of confidence in the office, we did not think anything about it, we trusted to each other, it is at page 16—the body of the page is Mr. Lindsay's—I had to draw three other cheques on the Monday; these (produced) are them—I had the duty of sending those away—I have crossed them; that was my practice when sending them away—the first one, as to Blake, would be entered to the day-book, not the others, because they did not relate to any particular business; they would be entered in the cash-book—I believe Mr. Fullagar took them in with the other cheque for Mr. Bristowe's signature—Peter Dameral, the messenger, had to take the letters from the box just before 5 o'clock, and take them to Whitehall to go into the official bag—the three cheques are entered in the cash-book on 29th January, "Messrs. Blake, Cromer, Coastguard, 13l. 5s. 4d.; Messrs. Moulton, law stationers' account, 9l. 10s. 11d., and Mr. Hansard, votes, Session 1877, 2l. 10s."—only Messrs. Blake's cheque is entered in the day-book; the latter part of that entry ib my writing, and the former part Mr. Lindsay's—I wrote that letter and enclosed the cheque in an envelope, put it in the rack, and Dameral would take it to the post; that would be the ordinary course—I was examined at Bow Street—do not recollect Mr. Fullagar making up the letter and return, from his room with the envelope and cheque, putting the letter and cheque in the envelope, and leaving it with me to enter; I have endeavoured, as far as I can, to bring my mind back to the transaction—the next I heard of the matter was about a fortnight before we left Richmond Terrace; Mr. Lindsay and I were clearing up the things a bit, and we could not find that Lowestoft conveyance—Mr. Fullagar did not speak to me about it until he he brought me the bill; that was three or four days after—I could not fix the day exactly—he came out of his room and brought me Mr. Reeve's bill of costs, with the receipt to it, and said "Here is Mr. Reeve's bill of costs"—as far as I recollect, he had only the bill of costs in his hand; he certainly did not being a stamped envelope and show it to me and take the bill of costs out of it; he brought it to me open—I took it from him, looked at the receipt, and put it up with the other bundle of vouchers—I don't recollect his saying anything about there being no letter with the bill of oosts—he did not on that occasion say it was great cheek of the postman to leave it downstairs; I am quite sure of that—he had done so on a previous occasion—I put it among the vouchers and put this docket on it—it was about the middle of February when we could not find the conveyance—I
asked Mr. Lmasay whether it had been reported, and he said he had not reported it; that means reporting its completion—when completed it would be reported to the Secretary of the Admiralty, or according to his directions, to whoever it came from—I went into Mr. Fullagar's room and asked him if he knew anything of the conveyance; he said he did not—I then spoke to Mr. Lindsay, and it was arranged that a letter should be sent to Mr. Reeve for the conveyance—I afterwards handed the cheque and the bill of coats to Mr. Chabot—the paid cheques are returned by the bankers every month or so in the banker's book, and they are generally tied up in a bundle and marked as paid cheques—I keep the vouchers until Mr. Bristowe's quarterly account is Bent in to the Accountant-General of the Navy—I remember the prisoner being discharged before Mr. Flowers on Saturday, 31st March—some days afterwards he came into my room at the Treasury and said "My object in calling on you is to personally apologise to you, Mr. Swainson, for the observations of Mr. Straight, and to assure you that they were not made through any directions from me, but you must consider them as only applying to the handwriting and not to anything else, as I am quite sure you had nothing to do with it"—Mr. Straight had said at Bow Street that the handwriting on the cheque was as much like mine as Fullager's—he was represented by Counsel on the second occasion, not on the first; he conducted his own defence then—I have not seen him since that occasion—after his discharge I was, in common with other persons in the office, examined by Mr. Stephenson—the prisoner has borrowed trifling sums from me on several occasions; I think the last occasion was about a fortnight before we left Eichmond Terrace; he had a sovereign of me—these cheques are on the Westminster branch of the London and County Bank—I have to go there from time to time to pay in money—I am pretty well known there; I have been going there nearly two years, off and on.
Cross-examined. I heard the Solicitor-General's opening, as to the crime being between me and the prisoner, or perhaps a third person—I never heard that suggested by the prisoner or any of his friends—Mr. Straight's remarks were only as to my handwriting being as much like the cheque as Fullagar's—when Fullagar came to apologise for it, he said it was not intended to draw any other inference from it; he was as friendly towards me then as he ever had been—the sovereign he borrowed of me was somewhere about a fortnight before the office was transferred—it was repaid shortly after we went over to the Treasury—he was not the only person that ever had a sovereign of me—I paid the petty expenses of the office; Mr. Bristowe used to give me a cheque for petty cash, which I cashed—I kept the cash in an iron safe to meet any petty payments—I had funds in hand to pay petty cash with—the sums he borrowed occasionally were for private purposes, for his own accommodation, not for petty cash—he did not tell me they were for his own accommodation, but I knew from his manner they were—he never wanted money for office expenses unless he told me what it was for—he would give me a list of his petty expenses at the end of the quarter—he generally waited till the end of the quarter before he got the money for them—they were small sums, principally cab hire—it would be about 1l. 5s. a quarter, perhaps, for cab hire—Mr. Alfred Bristowe has occasionally had trifling sums from me for his private requirements, and I: think Mr. Oswald occasionally—Mr. Lindsay has had trifling sums, and I have occasionally lent Peter, the messenger, 5s. or 10s. at a time—it was—common thing in the office, that has been going on for a good time—the
prisoner repaid me all that he borrowed, sometimes within a week or a month, different times—he brought it me back voluntarily; I never asked him for it—the salaries were paid at the end of each month—there was never any difficulty in getting the salary—Mr. Bristowe paid him his salary—it was 350l.; he was also allowed to practice as a solicitor on his own account—after Mr. Flowers dismissed him I went up to him, shook hands with him, and congratulated him on the result—he was in the passage as I passed—my evidence was given on the Saturday—I think he was apprehended the night before—the case was adjourned for a week—he was not out on bail—he came up again on Saturday, 31st March—I had known him from the time he entered the office in 1875—he was not in the same office with me all the time, only from December till February, at Richmond Terrace—that was only a temporary arrangement because we had not got room—we had three rooms at the top of the house; the first floor was unoccupied, the ground floor was the office of the Conservator of the Mersey, Admiral Evans, and the Privy Seal Office; the servants were underneath; I don't know who they consisted of, we were there so short a time—there was a housekeeper, a woman—I used to see a youth there occasionally; I don't know what relation he was to the housekeeper—there may have been others those were all I saw—there were attics above our offices, they were empty—the papers in reference to this and other matters were brought from 39, Parliament Street, to Richmond Terrace—we left Parliament Street somewhere about 31st December, 1876—the principal part of the work in reference to this matter had been done there—those who came over to Richmond Terrace were Mr. A. I. Bristowe, myself, Mr. Fullagar, Mr. Lindsay, Mr. Alfred Bristowe, Mr. Oswald, and Peter; that was the whole staff—Mr. Lindsay had been unwell, and went away for a holiday in August, then scarlet fever broke out in his family, and he did not come back till January, I think—in consequence of his absence there would be more work for Mr. Fullagar to do—I suppose some of it would occasionally get into arrear—there were several letters from Mr. Reeve during the latter part of last year asking for a settlement—if I was there first I should open the letters—they were placed on Mr. Lindsay's desk by the messenger—they were addressed to the Solicitor or to A. I. Bristowe, Esq., most of them—they would be delivered at the house in the morning—Peter was there earlier than the others, and would attend to the offices—they were not locked up at night, they were left open in charge of the housekeeper, who would light the fires and dust the rooms—anybody who was there with her would have an opportunity of going into all the rooms; they were all open, none of them were locked—I don't know what the housekeeper did with the letters the first thing in the morning, whether she delivered them or whether Peter brought them upstairs—the postman occasionally brought them up—I used to be there from 10.30 to 10.40—in the middle of the day the postman frequently left the letters below, and they were brought up by the first person who came in—persons connected with the office were constantly going in and out, so they would not remain long—anybody might come in that liked, it was a private sort of entrance, up steps; the front door was open, there was an inner swing door—Mr. Fullagar has complained of the postman leaving letters below—I could not say that he made that observation as to this particular letter but I believe not—as far as I recollect he did not say a word about the postman leaving letters below on the Wednesday—my memory docs not enable me to say positively that he did not—am positive that he did not
open the letters before me—I was positive before the Magistrate; if I said I did not remember, perhaps I got a little confused and did not quite understand the point—he came out of his room into my room up to my desk and handed me the bill, and said "Here is Keeve's bill," and I took it and looked at the receipt, and put it with the other vouchers—letters brought in during the day would be taken in to Mr. Bristowe if he was there, if he was not there, perhaps they would be laid upon Mr. Lindsay's desk, or whoever might be there to take charge of them—if Mr. Lindsay was there lie would keep them—he and myself and Mr. Fullagar had the right to open them, and we did open them, if Mr. Bristowe was not there, or if he was there, if they were thought to be public or business letters, we did not take them to Mr. Bristowe first; Mr. Lindsay would open them in the morning and enter them in the day-book before they were taken in to him; if I came in before Mr. Lindsay very likely I should open—them, and if Mr. Lindsay was away I should enter them—if the prisoner came in before Mr. Lindsay he would most likely open them—I can't say for certain what time of the day it was when this bill was given to me; I think it was somewhere about the middle of the day; Mr. Alfred Bristowe was in the office—I was the accountant; I had occasionally to write letters and see to the general business of the office sometimes—I have occasionally written a letter to a solicitor as to some purchase of a coast guard; occasionally, if others were absent I should attend to the conveyancing part; in fact, I used to do generally any class of business in the office; that mostly happened when others were absent; I did part of the office work in addition to the accounts—three cheques were drawn on 29th January, one referring to the Cromer Coastguard; I wrote the letter for that, for Mr. Bristowe's signature—I have occasionally acted for the business of the office generally, while any one else was there—it was not my business especially to attend to the Cromer business—did not write in reference to the Lowestoft business, because 51 r. Fullagar was attending to the Coastguard, and Mr. Lindsay was perhaps busy in other matters—Mr. Fullagar had no particular branch, he was the solicitor in the department; I believe he is a solicitor, admitted many years, he was engaged as a solicitor, qualified to do solicitor's work; I was not a solicitor—I should have written the letter with reference to Lowestoft just the same as I did with regard to Cromer or anything else—I have occasionally attended to other purchases or anything of the sort—I attend to any business in the office occasionally; I had nothing to do with this particular matter of Maid's Acre, except paying in the purchase-money—I made the entry in the journal of both the Cromer and the Lowestoft cases—as a rule I only entered the work that I did myself, but I have occasionally entered for others—this is a journal of all the business of the office done in the course of the day—there is no handwriting of the prisoner's here with reference to the Marsdon case—Mr. Fullagar attended to White and Borritt's business; I know that, because I had the cheques to pay the costs—this book was mostly kept by Mr. Lindsay; Mr. Bristowe always signed the letters if he was there—it would depend upon who attended to the matter—if Mr. Lindsay signed he would sign for the solicitor, and if I wrote the letter I should sign "Swainson for Admiralty solicitor"—Mr. Liud say attended to the principal part of the business relating to the Lowestoft purchase—I think it was in consequence of his absence that Mr. Fullagar had this to do—Mr. Lindsay did the principal work in that class of business, the Coastguard business and the preliminary conveyancing—Mr. Fullagar
occasionally did so, and I did occasionally—Mr. Bristowe might occasional hand letters to Mr. Lindsay to write—if Mr. Lindsay had the Lowestoft business. in hand the ordinary course would be for him to carry it out, he would be responsible for it—I think the prisoner attended to part of the Chancery work—the Lowestoft property was a church property, and they had to get the consent of the Court of Chancery, and if I recollect right Mr. Fullagar attended once or twice with Messrs. Gregory's clerk, about the matter at the Chancery office—he had the papers in his room when Mr. Lindsay was absent—I believe Mr. Bristowe handed him the bill of costs to look through—I wrote the letter in reference to the Cromer business, because I had drawn the cheque for the costs; I also drew the cheque for the costs for the Lowestoft business, but I did not attend to that, because Mr. Fullagar had gone through the bill of costs, and was attending to that part of the business—am not aware that he had gone through the Cromer bill of costs—I cannot swear that he had not—I had no power to go through a solicitor's bill of costs and settle it without Mr. Bristowe's authority; I did not get the authority to go through it—I think Mr. Lindsay handed me the Cromer bill of costs to draw the cheque, he having attended to the matter—I wrote the letter because Mr. Lindsay was attending to something else perhaps, at the time—of course I cannot tell whether Mr. Fullagar was not attending to something else, than the Lowestoft business at the time—I did not say I had gone through the Cromer bill of costs and settled it, I cannot distinctly remember—the ordinary course would be for the person who handed me the cheque to write the letter—I have no particular recollection why I wrote that letter—if I sent the cheque away I should enter it here as a matter of course—I believe Mr. Lindsay handed me the bill to draw the cheque—here is 2l. 5s. deducted from the bill—I cannot exactly say whether that deduction was made by Mr. Fullagar—it might be; I cannot swear that he did not go through that bill—I fancy Mr. Lindsay gave it me—I think he had returned then; I think he was in the office at the time—I should not like to swear that the prisoner did not hand me the Cromer bill, but I think it was Mr. Lindsay that did it—I am still of that opinion—Mr. Fullagar got three other cheques signed for me—he did not apply to me to fill up the other two—no one did, I did it myself—I drew them of my own accord because it was business I was attending to—on the Monday, either Mr. Lindsay or Mr. Fullagar asked me for the Cromer cheque—I wrote the three cheques at the same time, and Mr. Fullagar would go with the cheques and the book to Mr. Bristowe, and get his signature and then bring them back to me—I remember his bringing the chequebook back to me and retaining the Lowestoft cheque, Mr. Reeve's cheque—it was out of the book when it was handed to me—he tore it out of the book; I do not recollect whether he did it in my presence, but he had torn it out for the purpose of sending it Mr. Reeve—I cannot tell you why he did not do the same with respect to the Cromer cheque—I believe Mr. Fullagar got Mr. Reeve's bill in his possession; I do not recollect seeing it on the Monday—I believe it was not on the desk—I will swear it was not—I did not say before the Magistrate that the bill was on the table—I have Rome doubts whether it was on my table; I think it was not—I did not write a letter to Mr. Reeve, I am quite sure of that—the prisoner did not in my presence put a letter and the cheque into the envelope and leave it with me to put the bill in, I swear that he did not give it to me—I cannot exactly recollect the hour that Mr. Fullagar brought back
the cheque to me—I think it—was somewhere about mid-day—the usual hour for leaving is 5 o'clock—sometimes one stops longer than the other—the letters were sent up to Whitehall, just before 5 o'clock—it was Peter's duty to take them from the box, and take them there; I made the entry just before the letters went—who put it into the box originally I do not know—the entry was made in the afternoon; I did it because I did not see it there—occasionally we had a good deal of work to do in the office, and occasionally we were slack—persons came to see me; very few friends called at the office to see me—one of my nephews came; he was a clerk in the Admiralty—he occasionally looked in, not frequently, not once a day; on an average, not once a fortnight—he might have called once or twice a week, about January, about his private affairs; I do not think oftener, certainly not every day—I think not, as far as I recollect—he was in debt, I must admit—he came to me in reference to his money matters—I had brought him up with my father—I have another nephew who was in the Post-office—the one who was in the Admiralty had been reprimanded, I believe, for irregularity—the nephew in the Post-office had been dismissed; I afterwards tried to get him reinstated, and they refused—in January two Navy bills were stolen from the Accountant-General's Office in New Street; my nephew was in the Accountant-General's Office there—Mr. Bristowe investigated the matter, I had nothing to do with it—it was sent to the solicitor to investigate—I never was in the Accountant-General's Office—my nephew sent some money lenders to the office to arrange with regard to his money transactions on more than one occasion—I had authority from my nephew to receive his pay at the Accountant-General's Office—I gave an undertaking to one of the moneylenders to pay a portion of his salary to him—there were only two called—I think I gave a written undertaking to one to pay him so much a month for his bill; the other was only a verbal understanding that if he would keep up his arrangement I would pay him the trifling amount—I have not said that it was my practice not to cross cheques unless I was going to send them off—the Lowestoft cheque was drawn on Saturday afternoon in the presence of Mr. Fullagar; I have given my reasons for not crossing it—I drew the cheque in his presence while he waited for it, and thinking Mr. Bristowe was waiting, I handed it to him, I suppose, without crossing it; that was the only reason—it was a sort of accidental thing—I had charge of that cheque in the book from the Saturday till the Monday—he brought the book to me with the cheque; I put it in the drawer and locked it up—on the Monday I drew three other cheques; he was not waiting for them then—I did not cross the cheque then; I presume I passed it over, thinking it was a cheque that was to stand over and I did not notice it, I mean I did not notice the absence of the crossing—I knew it was the cheque I had drawn on the Saturday, but I did not notice that it was not crossed; it was an oversight—it was about the middle of February that I found out the conveyance was not there—I and Mr. Lindsay found it out—Mr. Lindsay said that he drafted the letter to Mr. Reeve—I did not write; I only suggested to Mr. Lindsay, who had to do with most of the matter, to do so, and he told me a few days afterwards that he had drafted the letter to Mr. Keeve and put it on Mr. Bristowe's table; that was at Richmond Terrace—I did not speak to Mr. Fullagar about it; he seemed to be attending to other matters and was indifferent as to the business then, and Mr. Lindsay had been principally attending to it—I do not think he attended to it after he went away—
Mr. Fullagar told mo he had not anything to do with it, that he did not know he should attend to it any more; he told me that some time in the course of February, I think, that he should not trouble himself about the business, he should hand it to Mr. Lindsay; I mean the Lowestoft business—he had the papers in his room; that was in the beginning of February, I think—there was nothing particular for him to do then—he was getting rid of the papers out of his room; I think there was a largish bundle of papers—they were brought out of his room; I do not know by whom—I cannot tell you when—I cannot swear that they had been got out of his room when we found the conveyance was not there—I cannot tell you the reason why I did not speak to the prisoner about it—I did speak to him about it—I went into his room and asked him if he knew anything about the conveyance—when he told me was not going to have anything to do with it, that was about writing the letter—I did not know that he was going to be apprehended on the 23rd March; I had not been consulted as to his being apprehended—I had been asked about the facts by Mr. Hodgson and Mr. Pollard; I did not advise it in any way—this is the Cromer letter (produced)—this seems to be the original letter.
Re-examined. Until to-day it has never been suggested in any way that my nephews had anything to do with this cheque—one of my nephews is at 17, New Street, at the Admiralty; his name is Charles Braybrook Swainson; the other is Walter Henry Swainson; he is living with me—they can both be here to-morrow—I cannot say that either of them were at Richmond Terrace between the 29th and 31st January last—this is the first time my attention has been called to the circumstance—the one who was in the Accountant-General's Office is still there—I shall be able to produce documents in their handwriting if necessary—it—was at Richmond Terrace where the complaint was made about the postman leaving the letters below, soon after we went there—I cannot say how long it was before the 29th of January; it might have been a month before, I cannot say—it might have been a fortnight.
By THE JURY. Mr. Fullagar sent to Lowestoft a similar letter to the one sent to Cromer—I saw the letter in the box addressed to Mr. Reeve; I also saw the blue seal—I did not take the letter out that I am aware of, but I know that it had an official envelope, with the blue seal; I did not see the blue seal upon it—I could not say at what time Peter took the letters from the box to the Admiralty—I did not see him do it that I remember, I did not pay attention; I cannot tell—anyone could have taken the letter from the box—I believe the prisoner was there that afternoon—I do not know whether it was my duty to cress the cheques before submitting them to Mr. Bristowe for signature; I generally did so—I considered it my duty to do it—I think it was about mid-day that the prisoner brought me the cheque—it was in the afternoon that I saw the letter in the box; I think the prisoner was there all the afternoon in and about the office, in his own room, and in mine—the offices are all close together on one floor—Mr. Bristowe had the front room, Mr. Fullagar and Mr. Alfred Bristowe were in the next room, and Mr. Lindsay and I in the next, looking over the Duke of Buccleuch's—the rooms were easily accessible to each other.
composed of Mr. Swainson and Mr. Lindsay, Mr. Alfred Bristowe, a cousin of mine, and Peter Dameral, the messenger—Mr. Swainson was the accountant, but he was not limited to the accounts—Mr. Lindsay was a clerk in the office, attending principally to the Coastguard work, but also to other work that any of them were liable to—he had been seventeen years in the service—my cousin had been eight years in the service, and Dameral two years, but he had been with my father as a clerk before for fifteen or sixteen years—he did not follow my father to the Admiralty; he was brought there subsequently—my cousin principally attended to Greenwich College Hospital, but they were all liable to be called upon for any work that my father or myself might choose to place in their hands—I engaged Mr. Fullagar at the end of May or the commencement of June, 1875; I also engaged Mr. Oswald, I think, in August, 1875—I remember negotiating for the purchase of the site for a Coastguard station at Lowestoft; the purchase was completed some time in 1876 and paid for by a Navy bill—Mr. Swainson would draw all cheques, unless he was away, and I signed them—originally the correspondence relating to the purchase of the Coastguard station at Lowestoft was in the hands of Mr. Lindsay, but he had an illness in his family and was away for some time; I think he went away about 11th or 12th November—he had previously been away with me at Portsmouth—I think we went there twice, once in July and once in August; he then had leave for a time—he was away the great bulk of the time, from the beginning of September till January—I don't think much correspondence about this business went on subsequent to Mr. Lindsay's absence, but I placed the bill of costs in Mr. Fullagar's hands that he might tax the charges—I remember Mr. Reeve's bill being brought to me in January this year by Mr. Fullagar—I had previously urged him to go through it as quickly as possible, as Mr. Reeve had been complaining of delay—I don't remember the date; I think it was a few days before—he brought it in and said "Here is Mr. Reeve's bill, I have been through it"—I asked him if it was a reasonable bill, and he showed me what he proposed to take off—I looked through the amounts and said "They are so small, only 3l. odd, I think we will pay the bill in full," and I directed him to tell Mr. Swainson to draw a cheque for the amount—he said "Yes"—I think we then went on to speak of other business—I remember this cheque being brought to me for signature on Saturday, 27th January—I believe Mr. Fullagar brought it; I am informed so—I don't recollect personally who brought it to me; it would probably be Mr. Fullagar—I recollect it being brought, but I don't recollect who by—I declined to sign it, as I did not sign cheques on Saturday; I would do it on Monday—I would not sign cheques for any considerable amount on the Saturday, as it afforded facilities for their being stolen, by remaining in the post-office until Sunday evening; that was my rule—it was not on the Saturday that I went through the bill—I don't remember the date; it was a few days before, I can't tell you how many—I believe Mr. Fullagar brought the cheque to me on the Monday, but I do not recollect the person: I have no doubt it was Mr. Fullagar, but it is from information I received, not from recollection—Mr. Fullagar himself informed me that be brought it on the Monday, subsequent to the proceedings at the police-court—I saw him two or three times subsequent to his discharge before the Magistrate; once at the Reform Club, and I met him in the street—have now no doubt that it was he who brought the cheque to me on the Monday, and I signed it; that was all—I signed some other
cheques at the same time; I think he brought them—I think they were brought all together to me; I think they were in the book—this is the cheque; it is not crossed—my attention was not called to that at the time, otherwise I should have crossed it—in the ordinary course of things Mr. Swainson would cross it; it was his business—at the time I signed the cheque I believe I signed a letter to Mr. Reeve; I believe that letter was in Air. Fullagar's writing—it was presented to me by the same person that brought me the cheque; it was to accompany the bill of costs and cheque to Mr. Reeve—these other three cheques were signed by me at the same time—in the ordinary course of business a cheque would have a letter accompanying it, stating "Herewith we send you cheque for so-and-so, good enough to acknowledge it"—it would not be in the ordinary course of business to send an envelope without a letter—I heard nothing more of the matter until the prisoner was given into custody—I went and saw him at the police-station the morning after he had been arrested; that would be Saturday morning, 24th March—I saw him iu the cell—I had received a letter from him the night before, telling me that he had been arrested for stealing a cheque, and asking me to come and see him as early as possible in the morning, and I did so—I paid the prisoner a salary of 350l. a year—I have made advantes to him on his salary from time to time, at his request, but not recently—the last time was, I should think, sir months before the office was transferred to the Treasury—should certainly think not subsequent to October or November last—I have occasionally lent him money; not recently—I cannot exactly recollect when—I do not think I have done so for six or seven months from the present time—I am aware that my statement has been taken by a shorthand writer—I say again I do not think I have lent Mr. Fullager any money for six or eight months; if I have done so it has only been a sovereign or a couple of sovereigns—I may have done so since that time; it has only been small sums, but I do not recollect that—I would not swear I had not done so—I think last year I lent him 5l. on one or two occasions, certainly not more than two; he always paid me back—occasionally I repaid myself from his month's salary, but at times when he asked me to lend it him for a time he paid it me back—it was not a common thing for him to do so, but in the course of our acquaintance he has done so several times—I may have lent him a sovereign last January; I do not recollect doing so—the signature to the receipt of Mr. Reeve's' bill appears to be an imitation of his writing—I have looked at it before—my attention has been invited to it more than once—there is no handwriting that I am acquainted with in the office that resembles it—I have looked at the endorsement on the cheque; I do not recognise any likeness in that—that is also an imitation of Mr. Reeve's handwriting—I think it is a good imitation; it is like his writing—I see some handwriting of Mr. Fullagar's in this book; there is one line and a half at page 3, in his handwriting, it is an entry of the 15th January—then on page 15, the first entry is in his handwriting, the subsequent ones are in Mr. Lindsay's—the entry at page 16, refers to Henwood and Childers; that is in Mr. Lindsay's writing—at page 201, the entries are in Mr. Fullagar's, with the exception of one or two—at page 202, about half of it is in Mr. Fullagar's handwriting, and the other half Mr. Lindsay's; not equally divided, it is mixed—I know nothing about these post-office orders—I did not go and get the money, or write any of these documents.
Cross-examined. The signatures purporting to be Mr. Reeve's are not in the writing of anyone in the office as far as I can tell—this letter of the 18th November, 1876, from Mr. Reeve, bears an endorsement in my handwriting in pencil; it is "Mr. Fullagar to draft reply"—at that date no doubt Mr. Fullagar was intrusted with correspondence—I did not remember it before—Mr. Lindsay would be away at that date—in consequence of that, extra work would be thrown upon Mr. Fullagar—the most pressing work would be done first—I said that I thought the letter to Mr. Reeve was in Mr. Fullagar's writing—I signed the letter—the letter would only be sent with, the cheque, and the person who brought the cheque would probably bring me the letter to sign—it would not follow of necessity that that letter should be written by myself—as a rule the person having charge of it would bring both the cheque and the letter—if two cheques and letters were brought at the same time, I should probably sign, both—I should not necessarily expect them to be written by the same person—under ordinary circumstances that would be so—I should suppose the person who presented me the Cromer cheque would write the Cromer letter—the ordinary course is this, for whoever writes the letter accompanying the cheque to bring it in with the cheque to me in order if I wanted any information before sending the cheque, I might have it from whoever had charge of the matter—I have been in Court to-day—I have no recollection at this moment who wrote the letter in reference to the Cromer transaction—I am under the impression that at the latter stage of the Lowestoft matter, Mr.' Fullagar had the correspondence, and I think he had written the letter; I am under that impression—that impression is obtained from the belief that he had the correspondence in hand—I do not recollect it—I do not think Mr. Reeve's is in partnership with anyone—anyone who had the letter would obtain from that the information that it was in payment for the purchase of the Coastguard site—he would see "R, H. Reeve, Esq.," in the corner—I know the handwriting of Mr. Fullagar, very well—I have known it for some years; I do not recognise his handwriting in the two forged documents that have been produced, namely the bill and the cheque—it is very like Mr. Reeve's writing—I say it does not resemble Mr. Fullagar's writing, or the writing of anyone else in the office—that is my opinion—Mr. Fullagar told me in the autumn that he was getting up a Mortgage Reversionary Company—he told me he had incurred expenses in that—I think he repaid me the 5l. I lent him last year—the salary is paid monthly—I know that at different times I have both lent him and advanced him small sums—on those occasions he told me that he did not borrow it as a loan, and I advanced so much—if he had wanted any money in January, I should have advanced it him aa I had done before—there had been nothing to prevent his making a friend of me—as far as I know he was not in want of money then; at all events he did not come and ask me for it—I first heard of this loss on the night Mr. Fullagar, was arrested—I went to him next morning in consequence of his letter—his letter was the first intimation I had that the cheque was stolen—I have not got that letter; I did not keep it—t was very short; I could give you the effect of it—from January to March, I was living, as I am now, at Lewisham, coming up to town every day—I was lot at Portsmouth, at any part of that time—I was there sometimes; I was n London, nearly all the time from January to March, except a few days at frighten, and a few at Tunbridge Wells, but I do not think there wag a
week that I was not in London—there was nothing that I know of to prevent the prisoner asking me about this matter before he was apprehended—I was the responsible person in the office up to the 26th February—this letter (produced) is in my writing—I expressed the opinion that in my belief Mr. Fullagar was innocent; I still believe him to be so—I expressed the opinion to Mr. Stephenson that there were but three persons in my office who could have committed this offence, and think I said I could not tell who had committed it, I believe I declined to give an opinion as to whether I believed Mr. Lindsay did it; I was asked did I believe Mr. Fullagar did it?—I believe I said "I decline to say"—I am speaking from recollection, I think I did—I did not get the letter from the solicitor to the Treasury, the same night I got a letter from Mr. Fullagar—I got it the next morning; I went there after I had seen the prisoner—both letters came to my house, one on the Friday night, the other on the Saturday morning by the early post, before I left house—the prisoner had told me that he had take up a company, and that it had been some expence to him—that was last Autumn, I think about September, but I should not like to speak positively—I cannot swear to the words—that was the effect of what he said—he did not say he had incurred liabilities he could not pay—he told me he was getting up a company, which he thought appeared a very good thing and would lead to a good business, called the Reversion Mortgage Company, and he entered into the details of the company—he said casually that the preliminary expenses he had to pay—I do not know whether he said he had paid them or was liable for them—I cannot suggest any mode by which a person would be able to imitate Mr. Reeve's handwriting unless he was a Lowestoft man—there is nothing in the letter which would give him the model to write by—I think I drew a cheque for Mr. Fullagar's salary on the 29th January, it was 29l. less income tax—with respect to the November bills that were stolen from the Admiralty; I do not know when or how they were stolen—I was employed by the Admiralty to endeavour to detect—we did not find out by whom they were stolen—I do not know that a third had been stolen since January—the two were stolen between November and January, from the Accountant-General's department—the loss was not discovered until January—the Accountant-General himself could not tell the date when they were taken—I believe they were not aware of the date—at all events I do not remember it—I cannot remember the date of the bills—it must have been sometime previous to January—I think it was about two months before they discovered it, consequently I think the date of the theft must have been in November—I believe the bill was cashed in November, speaking from memory—in January I was instructed to endeavour to ascertain about it.
By THE JURY. I have not been in the habit of signing uncrossed cheques—my reason for not signing cheques on the Saturday was because they would be lying in the post-office, or wherever they happended to be—it was not on account of the amount—I heard nothing of this matter until Mr. Fullagar was arrested—I do not know it would have been Mr. Swianson's duty specially to report to me that he could not find the conveyance—anybody who knew that the conveyance was lost should have reported it to me; if Mr. Swainson knew it was lost he should have done so.
GEORGE BENJAMI LINDSAY . I have been in the office of the Admiralty solicitor nearly twenty years—lam now with Mr. Swainson at the Treasury solicitor's office, the business having been transferred—I remember a correspondence
with reference to Maid's Acre, at Lowestoft—I remember Mr. Reeve's bill of costs coming—when the negotiations began, Counsel drew the drafts and I instructed Counsel and examined abstracts of title—I prepared the draft, forwarded it to the vendor's solicitor, and received it back approved—on 28th July, 1876, the management of Maid's Acre was concluded so far as Mr. Reeve was concerned, receipt that he had the engrossing of the deed, and we received a letter with his bill of costs (produced)—up to 28th July I was the person attending to the matter with Mr. Bristowe and his father, but I did not pay the money into the bank—the conveyance was sent to him separately for examination—I opened the letter on the morning of 28th July, which contained the bill of costs; I presume it was dated the 27th—there was a letter with it which I took to Mr. Bristowe, and I assume it is with the papers—Mr. Bristowe directed me to give the bill to Mr. Fullagar to tax, to look through it, and see whether the charges were proper—I took it to Mr. Fullagar on the same day and gave him Mr. Bristowe's message—he said "All right, put it down, I am engaged, I shall want the papers to look through, as I know nothing about it"—I gave him the letter, but not the envelope—I am not a solicitor, nor have I received a legal education—the prisoner, being a solicitor, Mr. Bristowe invariably sent his costs to him to see whether the charges were correct, whoever might attend to the management of the matter—I pat the papers on the floor by the side of his chair and called his attention to them—he said "All right," or "Thank you," or something to that effect—that was all that passed between us at the time—about a fortnight afterwards there was a further entry from me to Fullagar about the bill of costs—he said "I have looked through these costs; I do not see much to object to except full charges for attending the Trustees to sign the agreement, and full charges for the expenses of conveyance"—that was the stationer's fee, which ought to be reduced after the first attendance to execute the deed—the charges were for attending each Trustee, and he thought Mr. Reeve's costs ought to be less—Fullagar had the bill with him—this was in the front' room in Parliament Street, where he sat by himself—I do not remember whether he had the bill in his hand at the time, it is so long ago—on a subsequent occasion he said that the man had been kept so long without his money that he thought he should allow it in full—that was all he could do with the matter—I believe that was about seven weeks before we left Parliament Street—I must alter my answer, I believe it to have been six or seven weeks before January 1st—here is a letter of Mr. Bristowe's dated 20th November, 1876, requesting me to stop away from the office—I had then been away for a month from 20th November to the beginning of January through sickness in my family, and before that for a holiday—refreshing my memory by that, I say that this must have been in September or October—I hope in the course of the day to be able to give you the definite date—I came back on 2nd January, and found that the office had been changed to 8, Richmond Terrace—I had no further conversation with the prisoner about the bill of costs until after he and I had changed rooms, which I think was about the 10th or 12th of January—I, Swainson, and Peter were then in one room, and it used to be Fullagar, Swainson, and Peter, in Parliament Street—in Richmond Terrace Mr. Bristowe was in No. 1, Alfred Bristowe and I in No. 2, and Fullagar, Swainson, and Peter in No. 3—there are steps which go down from the house into Whitehall, and windows looking on to the Duke of Buccleuch's—there are two large windows
(A sketch was here drawn by the Judge from the Witness' description)—mr. Bristowe's is the furthest room inside, nearest the House of Commons—that I call No. 1—the largest room was occupied by Swainson, Lindsay, and Peter when I left—the letter-rack was on the mantelshelf in No. 3—when the change was made Fullager went from No. 3 into No. 2—I took his place in No. 3—his papers were originally taken into the large room, and when he left he left a great portion of them behind—I did not see the papers changed—when we changed rooms I bad a conversation with Swainson, but not in the prisoner's presence—the Maid's Acre papers were also put into the same room, No. 3, and I saw them there until the time I removed them into Mr. Bristowe's room with the draft letter containing the conveyance—I think that was the week before we removed, which would be the 19th or 20th February—before that I had heard from Mr. Swainson that a cheque had been drawn to pay Mr. Reeve's bill of costs—about a week before we removed I looked at the papers in No. 3 room to see whether the deed of conveyance was there—the papers were on the top of a press with a slanting top, without a cover—a great number of papers were kept there, and they were in great confusion, just as they had been brought over—I could not find the conveyance—it certainly ought to have been there—I then spoke to Swainson, and from what he said I drafted a letter to Mr. Reeve about the conveyance, for Mr. Bristowe's approval—I placed that on chair opposite his door for him to look at, but he was not there at the time; I left it there, but have never seen it since—that was on 19th or 20th February—neither the prisoner nor Mr. Bristowe spoke to me on the subject of that letter, but I am not certain whether I spoke to Mr. Bristowe about it—I have a slight recollection of doing so, and of his saying "I am busy and cannot look at it now"—that was not when I took it there, but in all probability it was the same day—after that I bad nothing to do with the matter till after I had got over to the Treasury—the letter was only a rough draft, it was not ready for signature; if approved it was to have been copied, and signed, and sent—I should imagine it would be Peter's duty to copy it—if Mr. Bristowe had altered it it would come back to me, and I should get it copied or give it to Peter to copy—it was on a half sheet of draft paper—I generally open the letters of a morning, such as relate to Admiralty' business; I do not open private letters—if the prisoner or Swainson were at the office before me they would open them, or probably Mr. Alfred Bristowe if he felt inclined—I was generally there next to Peter—I got there about 10.15 or 10.20—I made the principal entries in this book—I have no memory of anything passing about the bill of costs on 31st January, and there is nothing here to prompt me—it was 26th February when we moved over to the office of the Solicitor to the Treasury at Whitehall—I can now say that that was the date when the papers were removed—I continued to do the Admiralty business there—I remember some enquiry being made in March about the conveyance—I have seen the receipt on the bill of costs and the endorsement on the cheque—I do not know who wrote them, but I did not—I know nothing of the cheque being taken to the bank, or of the receipt of the money; I never had a shilling of it—a few days after I gave evidence at Bow Street, on 24th March, and after the remand on the 31st, the prisoner called at the Treasury and saw me and Mr. Swainson—that was after his dismissal—I think it was about a week afterwards—I heard him apologise for language made use of by his Counsel at Bow Street—I left them together as I wanted to catch my train as it
was near 5 o'clock—this draft minute is my writing; here is my mark on it—the face of it is my writing, with the exception of the word "Lindsay" written at the top in red ink.
Cross-examined. While I was away more work would be thrown upon the others—if the work was done somebody must work harder than usual—I found great arrears when I came back, because it had not been attended to—I said before the Magistrate that in all probability in my absence Fullagar would have my work to do; I also said "The most urgent matters would be settled first"—I generally open letters, but I have no recollection of any particular day—I had nothing to do with posting letters; letters for the post were put into the letter-box on the mantelshelf at No. 3; that was my room—all the staff would put letters in there—I have brought the 1876 and 1877 journals here—most of the entries are in my writing, because I used often to enter things by dictation from other people—the journal is intended to be a record of the general business of the office—it was my duty to keep the Coastguard work entered up—if I sent a draft or wrote a letter on a particular day I should enter it in the book—if I was in the office Fullagar used to bring his work to me and I used to enter it—I attended to the Maid's Acre negotiations up to the receipt of the bill—I should not ask Fullagar to make entries of it; I sometimes asked Swainson—if the prisoner was doing work, he would ask me to do it, or they could make the entry themselves, just as they liked—the prisoner might ask Swainson to make the entry for him—he had often asked me to enter things, although he did the work—a very large majority of page 288 is in my writing; I have no doubt that is all mine, except the work done by Fullagar—that does—not make me see I must have been responsible for the book in the first instance—I think I did more work than anybody else—I did more than my work; I did a little of everybody's work—I hold in my hand the draft reports, which will prove it—Mr. Swainson was the accountant—if I asked him to write and send a draft he would do it—he has as much to do with legal work as I had, but he was not so active; I am fond of work, and he is not—Mr. Bristowe used to give things to him to do—I used to take the things up to Mr. Bristowe on a morning, and he would say "Give this to Mr. So-and-So," or "Send up Mr. Fullagar," "Send up Mr. Swainson"—Mr. Swainson would approve of drafts, and would draw licenses and assignments—it was not his custom to enter all work he did; he sometimes did—this book was kept on my table, or by the side of it, unless anyone wished to make entries, when they would take it away and bring it back—was there on 29th January, as I find two entries of mine there—I did more than those two things that day; I was there the better part of the day—I did very little outdoor work at that time—if Fullagar had done work he could come to me to make the entry, or he could do it himself if he chose—if a letter went out of the office I should enter it in all probability—Swainson might enter his work himself, or he might bring it to me—if a draft had been sent to Fullagar and he made it, he would use his own discretion whether he entered it or brought it to me—it was a very irregular office at that time, and I do not know what was the ordinary course—if there happened to be a draft, it would be tied up with the papers, and somebody would enter in the book letter to so-and-so—after I drafted the letter and put it in Mr. Bristowe's room, nothing further was done—the transactions are very numerous; the Admiralty are constantly buying land for fortresses and Coastguard matters.
ALFRED BRISTOWE . I have been twelve years in this office—it my duty to attend to the Greenwich Hospital business; I had nothing to do with the Lowestoft business in the office, but I used to help—I know nothing about Maid's Acre—am not able to say from recollection whether I was at the office on 29th or 31st January, but I was there every day that year until the 26th, when we removed the office—I did not hear of the forgery of this cheque until I saw the report in the newspaper nest inrrning of the proceedings before the Magistrate—up to that time I knew nothing of the missing conveyance; I had nothing to do with any of these forgeries or with the receipt of any of the monies—I have known the prisoner some time, and have been in the habit from time to time of lending him money—we used to have a little account together of monies borrowed—he some times lent me money, and sometimes I him—he did not lend me any money about the end of last year; I think he was in my debt at that time, and he has been so since—he is still slightly in my debt—borrowing money was frequent, being in the same room together—I applied to him to pay me the money he owed me, somewhere about March; I will not say the date, but it was after we left the office at Richmond Terrace—he then owed me about 7l.; I did not get it—this letter is my writing.
Cross-examined. I was on friendly terms with Fullagar, and we accommodated each other with small sums; I also borrowed of Swainson—there was a sort of brotherly love existing in the office—Fullagar owed me money at the end of the year, and very likely I borrowed money of him the next month, but I cannot say; he owes me about 2l. now—he told me that his solicitor said that he had better not pay it while these proceedings were going on—I cannot say that Mr. Swainson ever entered anything in the journal which he had not done himself, but it was not very often that he did it.
Re-examined. I think it was last-Monday or Tuesday that we talked about this 2l.—I heard last year I think that the prisoner was connected with the promotion of a company.
ALFRED DRUMJIOND OSWALD . I am a cousin of Mr. Alfred Isaac Bristowe, and have been in the Admiralty solicitor's office on and off since January, 1876—mj salary runs about 100l. a year; I had no particular office work—I acted as confidential clerk to Mr. Bristowe—I have expressed a doubt whether I was at the office on the 27th or 29th January; I do not think I was, but cannot say for certain—I know nothing of the Maid's Acre business, or of a cheque, or of the bill of cost, or of the forgeries—the first I heard of it was after the prisoner was arrested—I have had to advance him money professionally for work he has done for me, acting as my solicitor, during the time I was in the office, and occasionally he has borrowed small sums of me—I should say he dyes not owe me money now, and I do not think he did in January or February, 1877—I really did not keep an account of it—he may have borrowed a small sum one day and paid it the next; he last borrowed of me some time last Autumn; I really do not know how much; might have borrowed a 1l. at a time on more than one occasion, I kept no account—the larger portion of this paper (produced) is in my writing, but the heading is not.
Cross-examined. I borrowed 1l. of the prisoner a fortnight ago at my club, the Junior Athenaeum; I still owe it to him—I think I paid him 19l. or 20l. about February, on account of work he had done for me, and which required the purchase of conveyancing stamps, and that was the purchase
of some property, the work had been going on since October, it was not finished at the beginning of March; in fact, I have work still in hand—the work done in October was completed in February, and I paid him 19l. on account of a bill of 50l. or 60l., which is still unpaid—I have not received it long, I owe him about 30l.—he is still acting as my solicitor, notwithstanding these proceedings.
PETER DAMERAL . I was in the office of the Admiralty solicitor, at Parliament Street, and Richmond Terrace—I have been in Mr. Bristovee's service forty-five years—I have no recollection of the 27th or 29th January—I did not attend at Bow Street—day duty used to begin at 9.30 and continued to 5 p.m.—I remember the office removing from Parliament Street and Richmond Terrace at the end of December, 1876—I made a complaint to the postman at Kichmond Terrace, as he used to leave the letters on the scroll of the staircase bannister—I used to see them there, and goodness knows how long they had been there, and I told him to bring them up, and threatened to report him to the Postmaster-General for not doing so; that was a week or a fortnight I should think after we went to Kichmond Terrace, it was the first time I had the opportunity of seeing him—after that he used to bring the letters up—I used to put the letters on Mr. Lindsay's desk—there was a letter box in the door for the first delivery in the morning—I used to take letters for the post up to the Admiralty, about 4.4:5—I took them from the box on the mantelpiece—there were three compartments to it—it was an open rack—I used also to go and ask Mr. Bristowe, Mr. Lindsay, and Mr. Swainson if they had any mure letters for the post, I then put them all in a bag, if there were many, or if there were only a few I tied them with string, and took them to the Admiralty, where the post bag hangs in the hall, into which I put them—if there was no bag, there was a deal wooden box, into which I put them—it was not locked, but there was a hall porter there—I do not know how they were gathered from there—I also had some to deliver to the different departments—this paper is my writing—I know nothing of these cheques or post-office orders.
Cross-examined. I was messenger in this office—I was there all day, except when I was sent out with the letters, which I often was—I sat in No. 3 room with Mr. Lindsay and Mr. Swainson, and when I was not out on messages I used to enter reports in the report-book of the director of works, at Mr. Bristowe's dictation, and I used to have copies of the draft reports to enter, in the Accountant-General's office; Mr. Lindsay gave them to me; also reports connected with the Admiralty solicitor's office; they would lay about five or six months, and I had to make them up, as Mr. Lindsay did not enter any reports—I had a little black leather bag, opening with a spring, for the letters, and I used to see that no letters were left behind with it—if there were only half a dozen letters it was not necessary to use the bag; it was not an official post bag, it was left to my suggestion and I used it for safety, but I was never told to do so—I took the letters every evening—if there were eight or ten. letters I should tie a string round them, but if there were only one or two I should hold them in my hand; I never put them in my pocket—the bag at the Admiralty is about 5 feet deep, a regular leather mail bag, and it is put on a hook—the hall porter is enclosed in a little place inside the hall, and the bag was on the opposite side to him—sometimes he would say "Hi, here are some letters for your department"—he was frequently there, he was stationary in the hall, and if anybody came he would say "Go to No. 1 or No. 2"—he sometimes would be away in some of the offices, but generally
speaking he was there; there was always somebody there, messengers or somebody else sitting in the ball—when the bag was not there I put the letters into the box—if there was a letter in the day it was put into the box, but I very rarely posted letters in the day—the box was there in the evening, it was never moved—they used to take letters out of it, I suppose; it was about 2 feet long, 1 1/2 feet wide and about I foot deep—it stood on a ledge 4 feet high—I believe everybody put their letters in there—I believe that was the only bag—a man attended to the bag, and when it was full be put another bag; it was sometimes nearly full; it was the general receptacle for letters from the Admiralty.
CHARLES BRAYBROOK SWAINSON . I am a clerk in the Accountant-General's department of the Admiralty, New Street, Spring Gardens, and have been so nine years—Mr. Swainson, who is in Court, is my uncle; he is a clerk in the solicitor's office in the Admiralty—I have been in the habit of going to his office in Parliament Street, and Richmond Terrace, perhaps three or four times a month to see him on private business—I have no doubt I called upon him at Richmond Terrace two or three times in January, but have no means of fixing the day—I keep no diary—I am not able to say whether I was there either on the 29th or 31st; it is quite possible I may have been there two days so near together—I have been directed to come here since yesterday—I have seen none of the documents—I know nothing whatever about the cheque for 59l. 18s. 10d. in favour of Mr. Reeve, or about the endorsement or the receipt to Mr. Reeve's bill of costs, or the cashing of the cheque and obtaining post-office orders with the proceeds—I was directed to bring some of my writing here, and have done so; this is it.
GEORGE JAMES GREEN . I am a clerk in the Victoria Street branch of the London and County Bank—Mr. Alfred J. Bristowe has an account there—this cheque for 59l. 18s. 10d., dated 27th January, was presented the 30th January; judging from the entry, I should say that it was some time before 12 o'clock in the day; it is my entry, I keep the book—I have no recollection whatever of the person who handed in the cheque; I cashed it with three 10l. notes numbers 05178, 05179, and 05180, dated 24th April, 1876, and 29l. 18s. 10d. in gold and silver—until I saw the prisoner at Bow Street he was a complete stranger to me; I do not remember having seen him before—I cash a great many cheques in the course of a day—I knew Mr. Swainson, Mr. Bristowe's clerk, well at the time—I know the notes by the dates and by our stamp; we stamp all notes with the bank stamp, and the book before me gives me the numbers and dates—these are the notes (produced); they were fresh when I first issued them, we always issue fresh notes.
Cross-examined by MR. GRANTHAM. I have been cashier for ten years—during that time I have got accustomed to see faces—I do not generally look up unless there is anything particular about the cheque, if it is for a large amount or there is anything irregular about it—if a person presented it to me and I saw him a few days afterwards I should recognise that I had seen his face before, but whether in the street or in the bank I should not know—I do not think I should remember him in a month or two afterwards some faces will make a greater impression upon me than others—I do not call Fullagar's an everyday face—his features are well marked and defined, and rather striking than otherwise.
Re-examined. My attention was first called to him on 24th March, at Bow
Street, more than two mouths after the cheque was paid—I cashed forty cheques on that day but I generally cash from 100 to 150—there is nothing particular about this cheque; it was a small amount.
ANNIE TOZER . I live at 55, Commercial Road, Pimlico, and am a clerk in: the Temple Bar branch post-office, opposite St. Dunstan's Church—I have: 'the sheets here—we issued these post-office orders on 31st January—I received the application from some person who came to the office whom I do—not remember—I cannot say whether I saw the person write this, but it is on one of the post-office order forms which hang on a rail, so that persons coming in can tear them off; they then go behind the screen, so that I should not see the person fill it up; when it is filled up it is handed to me—this is a form for 20l. (This was an application for a post-office order for 20l., payable at Piccadilly office, to E. Butler, sent by J. Fuller, Blackfriars Road.) This word "Circus" is in ray writing; I did that to distinguish that from another office, as there are two offices in Piccadilly, but I did not do that till the detective came down to see about it—I knew I had drawn it on the Circus—these are our figures—the number of the order is 39000—we do not issue orders for more than 10l., so instead of issuing one for 20l. I issued two for 10l.—these two orders are for 10l. each, numbers 39653 and 39654, dated 30th January; they were filled up by me and addressed to the post-office, Piccadilly Circus, and I gave the orders to the person who gave me this form—I received from him these two 10l. notes (produced), 05179 and 05180—I entered the numbers of them and put our office stamp on them—they also have my initials on them, so that I know they are the same—I should think it was about the middle of the day, but have no recollection of the person—my attention was first called to the matter about 22nd March—I do not know whether there was any name and address on the back of the notes when I received them—I might issue them again, but we generally keep notes till the close of the day; they are then sent to the Chief Office with the cash of the day—we advise the Piccadilly office in the ordinary way unless any other office is mentioned—"Piccadilly" on the order means the central office—there is another office in Down Street, Piccadilly.
Cross-examined by MR. GRANTHAM. This word "Piccadilly" is written by the same person who filled up the application—I should say it is not stamped—I know nothing about it—I do not remember whether the person had any conversation with me as to where it was to be payable—I wrote "Circus" because I thought it would serve to trace the notes, knowing I had granted the order on the Circus—all that I know is, that the person asked for the order to be made payable at Piccadilly—I do not know whether he knew there were two offices in Piccadilly; I do not remember telling him—if the notes were not backed I should have requested the person to do so—I am under the impression that this "J. Fuller, 116, Blakfriars Road," was there when I granted the order—I do not know anything about "E. Butler" being struck out, or my saying "This is not your name"—I do not remember whether the notes were torn very much—we send the advices as soon as we get a small batch; we tie them together and send them by post—we send all the advices together from the different orders which we draw—we put them in our letter-box all tied together, country and town—the person at Piccadilly office does not know that an order has been drawn until he gets the advice, which he does two or three hours after we start them off—they go to the chief office and are distributed there addressed to each particular office—the chief office sorts them—I cannot say what time we
seat this advice off, but it would not be paid till next morning, because the; never pay on the date of issue—it would be sure to be at the office that it is drawn upon by the time it would be required to be paid—we stamp the order with our official stamp, which is dated—I do not generally look at the per sons whe hand me the money—I should first look at the notes to see if there was a name upon them and I might look at the person's face—unless it was anything out of the way I do not suppose I should look at the person—I daresay my eyes might involuntarily go up to his face—if the prisoner had been the person handing in the money and I had looked up at him think I should have remembered his some days afterwards, but not a month or two afterwards—I issue eighty to 100 orders in a day—I do not sell stamps—I do not think I have ever seen the prisoner before.
Re-examined. I see on this note 01579 "E. Butler, 82, Piccadilly," which is struck out—E. Butler is the payee of the order, not the person applying—I have no memory of what was on the back of the note when it was given to me, and have no recollection of anything passing about the notes, but unless there was a name and address on the back I should ask for it to be put on, decidedly—the whole of this sheet is mine; it begins on 31st January and goes over—I have not the other sheets at the office; they are sent up every day to the General office—20l. is rather an unusual amount for a post-office order; there is nothing so big on this sheet—we very seldom have it—it is quite usual for us to draw orders very close to the place where they are to be paid.
MARTHA HAMMERSLEY . I live at 23, Harrison Street, and am a clerk at the Piccadilly Circus Post-office—on 1st February I cashed these two post-office orders, but I do not remember doing so—I do not remember the time—I have got my sheet here, but there is nothing to go by—I do not write the name down on cashing the order; I make up the sheet towards the end of the afternoon—we received advices from Temple Bar post-office—I do not remember whether both the orders were presented at once, or whether they bore at the time the signature of E. Butler, the payee, or whether it was written in my presence—the ordinary course when an order is presented is to ask the Christian and surname of the sender, but not the address, and on the proper answer being given we cash the order—I cannot remember whether I cashed it in money or notes—there was more than 20l. in the till, and there is always a balance there from the night before—the prisoner's face is familiar to me, as coming to the office, but I do not know on what business—I have seen him there, I think, several times before this date; I do not know how many—my attention was first drawn to the case when the detective came to my house on the same day that I was examined at Bow Street—I dare say I see hundreds of persons in a day—these two orders bear our stamp as having cashed them.
Cross-examined. The person receiving the money generally signs his or her name in my presence, but I cannot say as to these orders—I have no recollection of the person who presented them; I cannot say that it was not the prisoner; I said the same at the police-court—they are both stamped February lbt but I do not remember whether they were both paid at the same time, or whether they were changed by a man or a woman.
CHARLES CORY . I am a clerk in the Bank of England—I produce three 10l. notes, Nos. 05178, 05179, and 05180, dated 24th April, 1876—05179 and 05180 came into the Bank of England, through the General Post-office on February 1, and 05178 was cashed at the Bank by Mr. Pearson.
By THE COURT. There is no mode of telling when the notes of 24th April, 1876, were issued from the Bank—there is no regularity in it; they are issued according to the demand—they might remain a couple of months in the Bank store before they are issued; it can be ascertained when they were issued.
Cross-examined. Notes are punched and cut at the Bank of England, cancelled—they are sometimes in our coffers a couple of months—the London and County Bank invariably get fresh notes from us—it is a rule with some banks to get fresh notes and not to re-issue them, so that if on 29th January they issue new notes, the assumption is that they will he in the Bank of England within a month or two, but I am not in that department—I only produce 05178; I do not know the date it was paid.
FREDERICK PEARSONS . I am a clerk in the Bank of England—on 31st January this 10l. note, 05178, was brought to the Issue department, between 2 and 3 o'clock—I judge of the time by the position of the entry in the book; I gave gold for it—this, "E. Butler, 82, Piccadilly," was on it when I cashed it, but I cannot say whether it was written at the time; if it was not, I should request the person to write his name and address on it—I cannot judge whether the "E. Butler" is written with our pen and ink—I have no recollection of the person or the circumstance—I see hundreds of persons in the course of the day—I was first spoken to about it the day before yesterday.
Cross-examined. The entry in this book is all I know about it—the "31st Jan." in red ink has been written since—I do not know what this "G" refers to; it may have been on the note when I paid it.
MARTHA HAMMERSLEY (re-examined by THE COURT). The prisoner's face is familiar to me, but I had not known his name—I do not know that he had anything to do with our neighbourhood; I think he must have been in to buy stamps, to do which he would have to pass my end of the counter and I might become acquainted with his face—I should see him quite three or four times before I should remark him—stamps are sold at the same counter, but beyond my part of it.
RICHARD HENRY KEEVE . I am a solicitor at Lowestoft—I was acting on the part of some trustees for the sale of a piece of land purchased by the Admiralty, called "Maid's Acre"—I sent in my bill of costs, on 7th July, 1876—this is it, it is in the writing of Charles Thomas Turner, one of my clerks—I received no money in payment of it down to the date of this prosecution—I wrote to Mr. Bristowe, for payment on 11th December, 29th December, and 8th March—I received no answer to the first letter—I was at Loestoft, on 28th, 29th, 30th, and 31st January—I live at 6, Esplanade, about a mile from my office, and London letters by the morning post are delivered at my house in a locked bag—if I am addressed "Solicitor, Lowestoft," the letters would come to my house in the bag—the post-office authorities made me elect and I elected to have a bag, and for my house to be the place of delivery—only the' morning letters come to my house—the country letters are delivered at the office by the postman at 11 o'clock, and letters which are posted late in London, after 7 or 8 o'clock as well, and Otters passing through London—the afternoon mail from London comes in bag to my office—I did not on the 30th January, or any other day receive—he cheque for my bill of costs which, has been produced here, or any letter or envelope—the endorsement on this cheque is not my writing or by my authority—I do not know the writing and can form no opinion about
it—some parts of it are a good imitation of ray writing—the "R. H." is I think, a good imitation—this "Received 30th January, 1877, R. H. Reeve," on the bill of costs is not my writing or written by my authority or in the writing of anyone that I know, nor is any part of it a good imitation of c mine, but the "R. H." is something like—I always write the word "received" at length, and I always cancel the stamp by writing the date on it—this is written above the stamp and my name is written across the stamp—this application for the post-office order and the name on the three bank-notes are none of them mine, nor am I acquainted with the writing—it is not written with my authority—on 8th March, I wrote this letter to Mr. Bristowe, forwarding the letter which I had received from Mr. Clows, respecting the surveyor's charge—it is dated 12th March, 1877—I replied to it—it is "Sir, in reference to your letter to Mr. Bristowe, of the 8th March, I beg to inform you that the business of the Admiralty solicitor have been transferred to this department, Twill make inquiries and will write to you again"—on 15th March, I received a letter dated 14th March, from Mr. Chance, of the Treasury, with a reference to this letter of the 8th "14th March, 1877. Maid's Acre. Sir,—With reference to your letter to Mr. Bristowe, of 8th March, 1877, I find that the conveyance to the Admiralty was sent to you for execution by the trustees, on 25th May last, but does not appear to have been returned. Pray be good enough to let me have it forthwith"—I answered that on the 15th, directed "J. H. Chance, Esq., Treasury: "Sir,—As requested by your letter of yesterday, on the understanding that the costs herein amounting to 59l. 18s. 10d. are sent me by return of post; I enclose this conveyance duly executed"—I received this letter from Mr. Stephenson, dated 16th March, 1877: "Sir,—I beg to acknowledge the receipt of your letter of 15th March, returning this deed executed; I have to-day applied for a bill for the surveyor's charges, and will forward the same to Mr. Clow, when received. With respect to your own charges 59l. 18s. 10tf., I have with the papers your receipted bill under date 30th January, 1877, and I find that the amount was paid to you by Mr. Bristowe, on 27th January, by a cheque on the London and County Bank, to which I have referred, and which purports to be endorsed by yourself"—up to that moment I had had no intimation that the cheque had been drawn by the Admiralty solicitor in my favour—down to the date of the previous letter the conveyance had been waiting in my hands in order that the costs might be charged as I had a lien upon it—immediately I received the cheque and the bill of costs, I telegraphed and sent my clerk to London.
Cross-examined. After I wrote these three letters I heard nothing till 8th March—I did not hear that the conveyance had been wanted in London, and that it was missing—no application was made to me for it—I had no application made to me for it until I received the letter of 14th March from Mr. Chance—Mr. Chance does not say anything in that letter about paying my bill, although I had written to Mr. Bristowe for payment—the letter-bag is opened by myself or by my servant in my presence—the key is kept in a drawer in my bed-room—I generally get the bag about 7.55, when I am still in my bed-room if it is winter; in summer time I am up earlier—I keep the key in my was handstand drawer, which is open—I have not got it with me—when I ordered the bag I told the people to put on a good lock—they have not put on a Brahmah; it is probably an ordinary key—the post-office people keep another key, and I have a third at my office,
which hangs up in a small office as you enter—I have two clerks there—it is an office through which people go to go into the other office—there is a spring door which opens into a vestibule or passage, and from that office they go into mine—whether they would pass through the office in which fbe key was would depend upon who they wanted to see—if they wanted to see anybody upstairs they would go straight up—this is a small room; I do not know exactly how to describe it—the office was originally a bank—that is the office which people not knowing which room to go to would go into—anyone could push the door open—the door is open in the warm weather and shut in winter—the key hangs over the chimney-piece, and there may be a key with it of any house which has been brought there—the boy opens the bag in the morning—the mail at 11 o'clock comes to the office without any bag at all—I have only one bag, which goes to ray house first—my servant takes it up to the post-office, where it remains until the afternoon delivery comes in, and then it is brought back to my office—the office letters do not come in the bag in the morning—I always bring my letters from my house to my office, however many there are, but if I had an abstract of deeds, or anything of that kind, I should not take them, but send them by my servant, or if I had my bag at home I send them in it, January, but I should not give my servant anything so small as this to take to the office—if I had four or five deeds, or a bundle of abstracts which had been copied in London, I sent them up by him—he has been with me eighteen years—he is the servant who takes the bag—it would depend upon who was in at the time who opened the bag in the afternoon—we generally get the afternoon delivery about 3.45—the date of the receipt to this bill is 18th January, 1877—the "January" is a better imitation of my writing than anything else, but it is not like—I do not think the figures "1" and "8" in 1877 are like mine, nor is the "J" or the "y" in January, nor is the upper part of the sevens in 1877—I do not see that there is a little bit of a curl round—these are straight down.
CHARLES THOMAS TURNER . I have been a clerk in Mr. Reeve's service for ten years come January—in January last Mr. Reeve had six clerks, including myself one of whom had been with him thirty-five years one five years, one two years, and another three, and one only a few months—they are all still in his service—I remember this business about Maid's Acre—I attended to the conveyance in the preliminary stage under Mr. Reeve—the transfer of the property to the Coastguard was going on for twelve or eighteen months before the actual completion of the purchase—I remember the purchase-money being paid into the Bank of England—Mr. Reeve held the conveyance until it was paid—I made out this bill of costs, and on 27th July sent it up to the Admiralty solicitor, Mr. Bristowe—I heard nothing more of it till March this year—I saw no letters in the office with reference to the recovery of the deed of conveyance—no application was made about it till March—I do not remember Saturday, the 27th, or Monday, the 29th January—I was attending to business at the end of January at the office, and was not away until Easter-Monday—I remember the application being made by Mr. Reeve in March, and I came up to London at that time the bill of costs and cheque had been sent down—I did not bring them back; another clerk did that—I know the writing of all the clerks doing business with Mr. Reeve—this "Received 30th January, 1877" is not like the writing of any one I know—I do not recognise the
writing of the endorsement on the cheque—the writing on the application for the post-office order is not that of anyone I know, nor is the endorsement on these two bank-notes—I do not know this writing, "E. Butler," on the notes—there was no answer to the letters of 18th November, 11th December, and 29th December.
Cross-examined. The writing is an apparent imitation of Mr. Reeve's signature, but it is not like his usual signature—it is in the same style—if it is an imitation I should think it is not the ordinary writing of the person who made it—we keep a press letter-book which I have here—letters an pressed after they are written—people sometimes acquire the habit of writing similar to one another—I think this must have been written by some person who knows Mr. Reeve's writing.
THOMAS WHITNEY COOMBES . I am a clerk in the solicitor's department of the Treasury—on 23rd June, I served a notice to produce; a copy of which is here, at Giltspur Chambers, at the office of Mr. C. 0. Humphries, and Son the prisoner's solicitors.
HENRY SALT . I am cashier at Hopkinson and Company's Bank, 3, Regent Street—the prisoner keeps an account there—this is my ledger—it is the practice for customers to have their pass-books from time to time to see the state of their accounts, not at any periodical times, but whenever they request it—I have a ticket to show the time when this pass-book was mada up—it was given out on 7th December, when I have a mark against it—the balance in the prisoner's favour on that day was 4l. 17s. 8d., and no fresh money was paid in that year, but more had been drawn out, and there was a debit balance of 2s. 11d.—on 29th January, 15l. was paid in—this (produced) is an accurate account up to the present date. (This showed a credit balance of 10s. 7d. on 29th March.)
Cross-examined. I do not know that the prisoner made an arrangement with the bank, stating that he did not intend to keep a large balance—do doubt there was such an arrangement—on 29th January, the day before this cheque was cashed he had a balance of 15l. (The prisoner's pass-book here put in.) No cheque was drawn that year until February, and on 1st February, 5l. was paid in, I cannot tell you whether that was the cheque, but I can produce a book which will show—I do not know the prisoner's private residence from memory.
JOSEPH ROBERT SAYER . I am a clerk at Bow Street police-court—I was present on Saturday, 24th March, when the prisoner was brought before Mr. Flowers—I took down the evidence of the witnesses—Counsel appeared for the Crown, no Counsel appeared for the prisoner—when Mr. Swainsonwas under examination I took down by the Magistrate's desire the questions and answers—this deposition contains them. (Mr. Swainsorcs cross-examination by the prisoner was read: "I had nothing to do with the business, and I don't know how much of it you had to do—it is not the fact that you told me Mr. Bristowe would not sign the cheque on Saturday without taking the cheque-book—I imagine and think he also took the bill of costs—I had very likely written the two following cheques before I gave Mr. Reeve's cheque to be signed—I don't recollect that you tore out the cheque for Reeve, before handing me the cheque-book, in ray presence—I can't say positively that I did not say "Have you got the bill?" and that you did not answer 'No, there it is on your table'—I" don't recollect it. Q. Did I not go back into my room and return with the envelope; and did I not, standing by you, put in the letter and cheque into the envelope, and leave it With
you to put in the bill and enter? A. I can't recollect; you might have done so, but I have no recollection of it. Q. Did I not leave it with you open on your desk to enter? A. I think not; I should not like to swear, but I have no recollection of it. Q. Do you say certainly you did not put the letter into the box? A. I don't remember doing so. Q. Was it not en the following Wednesday afternoon that T handed the bill receipted back to you? A. I can-not say if it was on that day. Q. Did I not bring it into the room in an envelope, stamped; and did not I say it was great cheek of the postman to leave it downstairs, and it was time the practice was stopped? A. I can't say as to that letter; you did make a similar observation as to the letters being left below. Q. Did I not open the envelope in your presence, take out the bill from it, and hand it to you? A. I don't remember; you handed me the bill Q. Did I not remark on there being no letter enclosed in it?Q. Not that I recollect. Q. Were there not several other people in the room at the time when I gave you the bill? A. I think Peter, the messenger, and Mr. Lindsay. Q. Was it not the practice of the postman to leave our letters at the bottom of the stairs, and did we not frequently complain of it? A. Yes."
JOHN DOWDELL (Detective Sergeant). On Friday afternoon, 23rd March, in consequence of directions I received, I was in Parliament Street; Mr. Lindsay was with me for the purpose of pointing out the prisoner—I said to the prisoner "Are you Mr. Fullagar?"—he said "Yes"—I said that I wished to speak to him—he turned round from Mr. Lindsay and walked down Parliament Street—I told him I was a detective officer, and had been instructed by the Solicitor to the Treasury to take him in custody, and he would be charged with forging a cheque for 59l. 18s. 10d., and I should have to take him to King Street station, and he would be further charged with forging an endorsement for that amount—he said "Have the Treasury anyone to identify me, and shall I see them? I think they ought to have sent for me before this"—I told him I could not answer the question—he was taken to the station and taken before a Magistrate next day—I found on him some private papers and letters, a small amount of money, amounting to a shilling or two. and some keys, one of which was a skeleton, an old key filed; it would open almost any lock in our office in Scotland Yard—I asked him how he accounted for having a key of that description; he said that it was given to him by a gentleman, whose name I forget, some time ago, to open his drawers when he had left his keys behind, or had lost them—after his discharge at the police-court, he called at our office and asked for the things which had been taken from him, and I returned them, including that key.
Cross-examined. The stolen cheque never having been locked up, I cannot imagine what the skeleton key has to do with it, but it was mentioned at Bow Street police-court, and I was asked questions about it by the Magistrate and Mr. Poland—I spoke to the prisoner about it at King Street station; I am quite sure I spoke about it prior to 31st March, when he came to Scotland Yard for his things—that was the day he was discharged, and he called with his brother—I believe I said something about it not being a very nice thing to have in his possession—I handed it to him in his brother's presence and took a receipt for it and the other things which is attached to the other papers—I am doubtful what was said on 31st March, but am positive as to what was said on the 23rd—he mentioned the name on the 23rd of the person who gave him the key; I have no recollection whether it was Peter Dameral, but he said that it was given him to-open
the lock of his drawers—I do not think he mentioned his office table-did not take down what the prisoner said, but I think it was "Why ha not the Treasury; said something to me about this before, and who ha they got to identify me with this?"—I said in my cross-examination "I do not remember your saying 'Why do they fix on me?'" and I may has said I was certainly in and out of the Treasury, why did not they speak to me then," or words to that effect.
PETER DAMERAL (re-examined). About four months ago, Mr. Fullagar gave me a lock to get a key to fit it—I took it off a drawer in his desk, and took it down into the Cut to a locksmith, who fitted a key to it which I took to Mr. Fullagar—I never saw such a curious key in my life: there was only one ward to it—he charged me sixpence for it.
JOHN DOWDELL (re-examined). I made inquiries with a view of finding out whether there was any person of the name of J. Fuller, of 116, Black-friars Road—no such person has been known there for the last fourteen years; I also made similar inquiries as to E. Butler, of 18, Piccadilly—there was no such name known there—it is a private house, I think nobleman's 116, Blackfriars Road, is a brush-makers, it is not let in lodgings, it is occupied by one person.
Cross-examined. I do not mean that fourteen years ago, there was a person of that name living there—the gentleman now living there said he had been living there fourteen years, and he never knew the name; I apprehended Mr. Fullagar, on 23rd March, about 4 o'clock in the afternoon—I had received instructions that day to apprehend him—that was not the first 1 had heard of it—I first heard of it on the 21st, I received the instructions to apprehend him from the Solicitor to the Treasury—Mr. Stephenson, Mr. Pollard, and Mr. Chance, and several persons were present.
GEORGE BENJAMIN LINDSAY (re-examined). Five letters irrespective of reports were sent to the post on 29th January—I have looked through the journal and find that five letters were posted that day—that only shows that they were intended to be posted, I can't say they were posted.
Cross-examined. There may have been others that were not entered in the journal.
By THE COURT. The salaries were paid to the prisoner and others by cheque every month, generally on the 29th—the cheque ends may not be found here, because Mr. Bristowe kept a separate account, a private account.
A. J. BRISTOWE (re-examined). The salaries were paid by cheques drawn on my private account, the salaries did not come into the official disbursements—I will endeavour to find the cheques, I don't at the present moment know where to lay my hand upon them—I think my bankers return the cheques, I don't know how it is with the London and County Bank—these cheques were not drawn on the London and County Bank, but on my private bankers—I think I can get some of the cheques here by to-morrow.
J. F. CHANCE (re-examined). The letter of 29th July from Mr. Reeve to Mr. Bristowe is not with the papers, I have looked for it and cannot find it I believe I have seen it, but it is now mislaid—I have never seen the letter of 11th December, I cannot now find it—the docket on this letter of 29th December is Mr. Swainson's writing, also the docket on that of the 18th—the docket on this letter of 8th March is Mr. Lindsay's writing—I have made search for the draft of a letter sent by Mr. Swainson with a cheque, relating to the Maid's Acre case; it cannot be found; it is the draft letter forwarding Mr. Reeve's cheque I cannot find
it; I found one of the Cromer case, this it (produced); that is Mr. Swainson'a writing—I produce a letter, dated 29th May, from the prisoner to the Solicitor to the Treasury—I believe it is the prisoner's writing—I have only received one letter from the prisoner. (This letter was put in and read. It was a complaint of the treatment he had received in being accused of a charge of which he was innocent, and stated that in the absence of an apology, he should take steps to bring the facts before the public.) This is another letter of the same date, written to the Secretary of the Treasury to the same effect (read)—this is the answer from the Secretary to the Treasury, dated 5th June. (This intimated that criminal proceedings were about to be taken.) I look at these letters marked on the outside, "Re Fullagar," specimens of Mr. Fullagar's ordinary writing for comparison, and marked M 1. 2, 3, 4, and 5—to the best of my belief these are in the handwriting of the prisoner—No. I is a draft report, dated 28th February, 1876; 2 is a letter to. myself, dated 16th February, 1877; 3 is a draft letter, dated 19th August, 1876; 4 is a draft letter, dated 28th May, 1876; 5 is a draft bond of 1875—these letters marked N 1, 2, 3, I believe to be in the prisoner's writing; they are dated 19th February, 1877; 25th April, 1877; and 12th May, 1877; page 97 of the journal of 1876 has a portion of the prisoner's handwriting; a portion of page 332 is in the prisoner's writing; there is nothing in the handwriting of the prisoner at page 288; page 105 is nearly all the prisoner's; page 114 is the prisoner's, with the exception of one item; page 103 partly so; at page 202 of the journal of 1877 there is one of two items; that is the date of 17th January.
Cross-examined. These draft reports are some out of a great many in the prisoner's writing—we have in our possession now a great number of the prisoner's drafts—I can't tell you why these were selected, with the exception of the bond; that was selected, because it has on it the name of Fuller, that being on one of the bank notes—I do not know why the letter of February, 1876, was selected; I did not select it, I don't know who did, I had nothing to do with it personally—I was not present when Mr. Chabot looked them over—I have not been over them with him and have not been present when others have—I do not know who selected these letters—I was not aware of the letter of 5th June being sent prior to its being sent; I knew nothing about it; they are all included in the notice to produce given by the prisoner—I saw a notice in the votes of the House of Commons of a question to be asked by Mr. Gregory in reference to the prisoner's case; I can't remember the date—I don't know whether that was communicated to the Treasury officials, it was not communicated to me—this is the notice I saw, it is dated 4th June: "Mr. Gregory, to ask the secretary of the Treasury, whether it is proposed to institute any further proceeding against Mr. John Edward Fullagar, who was discharged by Mr. Flowers, on 1st March last, from the charge preferred against him, or whether he is satisfied that there are no sufficient grounds for such proceedings, or if an official investigation of the case is still going on whether Mr. Fullagar will be allowed to be heard or represented on such investigation."
By THE COURT. Mr. Gregory is Member for Sussex—I believe the prisoner's family reside in Sussex.
Re-examined. We have in our possession now a considerable number of documents which I believe to be in the prisoner's handwriting—I believe we
have here a large number of documents in his handwriting, and are perfectly prepared to produce any that may be desired.
CHARLES CHABOT . I live at 27, Red Lion Square, I have for many years made handwriting a study, and have given my attention to disputed cases of handwriting—I have had placed in my hands the forged cheque and the forged receipt; I went to the bank and took tracings carefully of the bank-notes, which tracings have been photographed—the bank-notes themsslvea are now in Court—I have seen numerous specimens of the prisoner's handwriting; I have also looked at the journal of 1876 throughout and certain pages—I have acquainted myself with the general character of the prisoner's handwriting—I am inclined to believe that the bill of costs, X 2 is in Fullagar's handwriting, but the writing being an imitation of another handwriting, I cannot express that opinion with any degree of strength, or rather I should say I cannot express a positive opinion—looking at X 1, I say that is undoubtedly in the same hand writing as the receipt—there is no similarity in X 2 with the prisoner's handwriting—the X 1 is undoubtedly the same handwriting as X 2, but taking X 1 by itself I can express no opinion whatever as to its being in the prisoner's handwriting, because it is a servile copy of another handwriting, I mean an exact copy, and the nearer the representation is to the original the more unlike it will be to the natural hand of the person who is making that representation—I make no distinction between an imitation and a servile imitation, both X 1 and X 2 are servile imitations—I have compared this signature "R. E Reeve" with the genuine signature of Mr. Reeve, and it is what I call a senile imitation, and so is the "K" in the word "received"—X 3 a and X 3 bare undoubtedly in the same handwriting; I cannot say that they are in the same handwriting as X 1 and X 2—to the best of my belief X 3 a and X 3 b are in the prisoner's handwriting, but I do not express an absolute belief—X 4 and X 5 are in the same handwriting, I express an absolute belief as to that—X 6, 7, and 8 are all in the same handwriting as X 3 a and b, and X 4 and 5 without any doubt whatever, and I believe they are all in the prisoner's handwriting—I express the same belief as to X 1 and 2 with the same qualification—in a serious matter like the present, I am very careful in expressing my opinion, taking X 1 by itself I cannot form the slightest opinion as to its being the prisoner's writing, I formed my opinion upon it from documents which I have not now in my possession, but which were put into my hands before the Magistrate. (The witness here and in cross-examination entered in detail into a number of similarities existing in the forged documents to the handwriting of the prisoner, especially in regard to the for nation of certain letters; such as E, d, y, B, R, P, the crossing of the "t" and other peculiarities which taken singly would not amount to much, but taken together led him to the conclusion that the forged documents were in the prisoners writing. MR. BOWEN then proposed to ask the witness as to certain dissimtlarities existing between the forged documents and the handwriting of Mr. Swainson and others; to which Mr. Grantluim objected as raising other issues than that which the Jury had to try. MR. JUSTICE FIELD, however, considered the evidence admissible. Mr. Chabot being examined thereon stated that some of the writing shewn to him was unlike, and as to others, similarities existed as would be the case with alt handwritings.)
The following Witnesses were called for the Defence.
----FULLAGAR. I am a solicitor at Lewes, I carry on my father's old business—I am Coroner for the eastern division of the county, and am the prisoner's brother—I believe he has borne a high character, if he had ever wanted money I should have assisted him, he knew that perfectly well, he had only to ask me for it—he was articled to my father and assigned to me at his death—he was admitted in 1867, he spent his last year in London, and has been in London since—he did not take out his certificate for some time after he was admitted, until he went to the Admiralty, where he was allowed to take private practice—I have known his handwriting all his life—I have seen the forged documents and have not a shadow of a doubt that my brother never wrote them, I am sure he did not, I don't believe he could—there is not the slightest resemblance to his handwriting.
REV. HUGH SCALES FULLAGAR . I reside at Erpingham Rectory, near Norwich, the prisoner is my brother, he has always borne the character of a man of honour, honesty, and respectability—I have looked at the forged documents; they are certainly not written by my brother, or any portion of them—I am sure they are not; I know his writing well.
JOHN LORD. I live in Fulham Road, St. John's Wood, and am manager of the Reversion Mortgage Company, 28, New Broad Street—the prisoner was acting as solicitor to that company—in January, he had done certain work in registering the company, the expenses incident to which amounted to 34l. 10s.—the company was registered about November, and that sum was due and owing to him from the company in January; a portion of it was; paid by him on 24th November, 28l. 15s., for the incorporation; the additional expense would only be about 6l., that was paid to him in April, doubtless be would have had his money before if he had applied for it; the company would have been ready to pay it within a week, probably, from the time he applied for it.
Cross-examined. This is the certificate of the incorporation of the company, dated 24th November, 1876; it is the certificate given under the Companies' Act, when the fee is paid; the 28l. 15s. would be paid within a day or two of that date—Mr. Fullagar registered the company, and drew up the Articles of Association, and he has acted as solicitor for carrying out several loans—this is simply a memorandum of the amount owing to him by the company at the time the allotment was made—the account was made out within a week of the date, 24th April, I can't say whether it was made out on the same day or not.
Re-examined. There were other charges owing to him besides the official charges for the incorporation, and there is an amount owing to him at the present time for work as solicitor; these were stated to be payments out of pocket, and 30l. at least was made in November.
By THE COURT. That was paid by a cheque on the Alliance Bank for 34l". in April—he has no shares in the company, and never had, and never applied for any—the company was promoted in November, 1875; he had something to do with promoting it, he paid the expences of the registration 28l. 15s.—he found a portion of the capital; the capital of the company was nominally 100,000l. in about 300 shares, the real capital was from 2,500l. to 3,000l.—he found at least 250l., on or about April, 1877—the company did not go to allotment till then; I found the rest of the 3,000l., about 1,500l. or 2,000l.; at that time the company consists of about ten or twelve shareholders.
FRANK RICHARDSON . I am a solicitor, I have known the prisoner three or four years—J have known nothing at all against his character for honesty and integrity—I introduced him to Hopkinson, who are my clients, and he Diet one of the partners at my rooms one night—I have known his handwriting—I have had letters from him, and I have had one matter of business with him—he introduced a mortgagee to me; I saw the papers is the matter—I have looked at the photographs of the forged documents—of course I am not an expert, but in my opinion I do not think they are written by him, I came to the conclusion that they were not, I looted at them carefully with a desire to come to a correct conclusion—Mr. Humphreys gave them to me with that object.
Cross-examined. The prisoner was introduced to me by Mr. Bristowe, a friend of mine, I think four years ago—I think he was then in the Admiralty solicitor's office; I should not like to say for certain—I was under the impression that he was in Mr. Bristowe's employment when he introduced him to me, and he happened to be a member of the Junior Athenaeum Club, which I belonged to—the only business transaction I had with him was about twelve months ago—I have known Mr. Bristowe for some years—before the prisoner went into his office he was in a situation at Austin Friars, with Messrs. Francis and Bosanquet—I corresponded with him on the subject of the mortgage and have the letters here. (Producing them)—I had other letters which I have destroyed—these are what I speak from in making my companion of handwriting—Mr. Humphreys shewed me a photograph on Friday last, at this Court—I came here on purpose—I compared the forgeries with these letters of Mr. Fullagar—I have seen him many times since his arrest—this document I have produced is a copy of a lease that was given to me by Mr. Fullagar, about twelve months ago—the money was on mortgage—as far as Mr. Fullagar was concerned, the transaction was closed.
CHARLES POPE GREENHILL . I am a solicitor, of 63, Gracechurch Street, I have acted as agent for Mr. Fullagar's father, and for his son for many years—I was originally articled to Mr. Fullagar, as a solicitor in 1848—the prisoner came to London, at the end of 1865 or 1866, and came into my office for the remainder of his articles—he left sometime in the following year—during the time he was with me he transacted many matters of business for me, and very much to my satisfaction—I had the greatest confidence in him—I was constantly in the habit of seeing him write—I saw all the original forgeries at Bow Street police-court, and have seen photographs of most of the originals since, and in my opinion they are certainly not in his handwriting; I feel quite positive about it—I formed that opinion at Bow Street directly I saw the documents, I have since examined them again with care, and that has fortified my opinion—he always bore the character of an honest honourable and respectable man—I never beard anything against him, I have constantly seen him coming to my house, and also upon matters of business—he went from me to Messrs. Francis and Bosanquet, on my recommendation to Mr. Francis—he was upon sufficiently intimate terms with me, that if he was pressed for money he might have asked me for it, and I should certainly have lent it.
Cross-examined. Six or seven years ago, I think he did ask me for 5f. for some purpose, which I had back again—I do not recollect anything else—I carry on business in Gracechurch Street, where I have been for twenty-two years; I think Mr. Fullagar left Francis and Bosanquet's, about two
years ago—he has been on very, intimate terms with me, frequently visiting at my house—he has spoken to me on matters of business, but they have not been completed—I know a little of the Mortgage Reversion Society—I have nothing to do with it—he spoke to me about it and asked my opinion of it, and the best way to carry it out, and I gave him suggestions—that was at the end of last year; I should think in October or November, just before it was registered—he registered it in 1876—he was interested in forming the company, and was solicitor to it—I know Mr. Lord, I believe he and the prisoner were getting up the company and he took my advice upon it, nothing further—I was not asked to subscribe—I went to Bow Street, on the 31st, not on the first day—he did not send for me—I went of my own accord—I have a great many documents in the prisoner's handwriting in my possession—compared the documents at Bow Street, with some letters that his brother had; I did not spend many minutes over the perusal, not five minutes—I was satisfied—at different times, perhaps I have spent half an hour over them—I have not had any business transactions with the prisoner this year.
Re-examined. The letter that was produced yesterday was a private letter from him to me (marked T); it was about some mortgage.
WALTER HENRY BOSANQUET . I am a solicitor, in partnership with—Mr. Mullins—we are solicitors to the Bankers' Association—I have known Mr. Fullagar about ten years—he came to me as a clerk in 1867, after he was out of his articles, that was how I came to know him; I was then in partnership with Mr. Francis—he remained with me until my partnership with Mr. Francis came to an end at the end of 1872—he then remained with Mr. Francis, who was the senior partner, until he went into the Admiralty—he bore the highest possible character—no ordinary language would be too Strong to express the confidence we had in him, and we had to show our confidence in a very practical way by entrusting him with very large sums of money—Mr. Francis is now very unwell and not allowed to come here—I know Mr. Fullagar's handwriting perfectly; I have carefully compared it with the forged documents, and I have not the slightest doubt that he did not write any of them.
Cross-examined. I went to inquire about Mr. Francis, I did not see him; 'last saw him about a month ago; I sent a clerk to his office last Thursday—I have seen Mr. Fullagar constantly since 1872—he was a comrade of nine in the Honourable Artillery Company—I have not seen him in Mr. 'Yancis' company since 1872—I am not aware that he borrowed money rom Mr. Francis; I know Mr. Francis, and I feel confident that he did not, I do not know one way or another—I have not had any pecuniary transactions with Mr. Fullagar in the last year—I do not know Mr. Bristowe.
Re-examined. Mr. Francis has been unwell for years.
CAROLINE KEY . Mr. Fullagar has lodged with me for eight years next November, and is lodging with me still—he always paid his rent, and it was paid in the usual way at the beginning of this year—a gentleman from the Treasury called on me and took down my evidence—during the time Mr. Fullagar lodged with me his transactions have always been strictly honourable.
Cross-examined. He occupied the first floor at 70l. a year; the payments were made quarterly—the last cheque I received from him was a cheque for 12l. he paid me some gold as well at the same time, making in all 12l.—I have my rent-book here—I believe it would be in January when that payment
was made, but I have since been told it was the 1st of February; Mr. Fullagar told me so himself; I have no date in this book of the time at which it was paid, I merely put down "Paid," not the diet—I do not think I sent in the cheque the same day; I cannot bay how long I kept it; I think Mr. Key paid it away in business; the cheque was for 12l. 12s. 6d., and was for the payment of rent up to the end of the preceding quarter, which ended on the 4th November—then there were little items besides—the next quarter would end on 4th of February; that was paid in the latter end of April, about a week or two before the next quarter was due; I think it was paid in a large sum of 40l., or something of that sort, but I really cannot say; that payment included the rent due on 4th May, as well as the rent due on 4th February; it could not have been paid until 4th May, I cannot say the date.
Re-examined. The quarter due on November 4th was paid before the quarter on 4th February became due, and the next two were paid together—up to that time he always paid me one quarter just before the other became due—one quarter never Japped over the other until that time.
MR. A. I. BRISTOWE (recalled). I produce some cheques for salary—they have nearly all been discharged—I produce what I think will do as well—they are old ones, dated in 1875 I think—I have brought the counterfoils of my cheque-books—used to give the cheques to my wife to file, and she destroyed them at the end of each quarter—these are all that I could find—money paid for salaries never went into the official bank—these are the only two cheque-books for 1875 and 1876 upon this bank—I think I paid the prisoner once through Messrs. Kansomes and Rouveries', where I had an account—that was in 1875 or the commencement of 1876—I think that was paid out of a former cheque-book, which I no longer have—I generally tore up the old cheque-books—I have advanced salary to Mr. Fullagar a good many times—except for salaries these are my private cheques—I have not got my pass-book with me; I believe it is at home—I did not look for it this morning, I thought these counterfoils would do—I can obtain it—it was not a constant thing to advance Mr. Fullagar's salary before it was due, but I have done so very often—he would ask me sometimes to let him have some of the money; he said it would be convenient to him, that he would be glad of some of it before it was due—he is not the only one in the office who did so—sometimes I have advanced it a week before it was due, sometimes a fortnight—the Navy bills that were stolen were from the Accountant-General's Department—they were bills that should have gone through the post, but our theory was that they were stolen from the boxes in the hall at New Street by somebody in the department—that was the theory of the Accountant-General and the persons who instructed me to endeavour to ascertain about it—I ascertained that they were cashed at the Postmaster-General's office on the day after—I think they were taken out of the post-box by somebody in the department, and cashed the next morning—investigated the matter myself, and I came to the conclusion that they did not pass through the post at all—the crossing on these cheques "& Co." is not my writing, nor the writing of anyone I know—they have been crossed after they were handed by me to Mr. Fullagar—I was in the habit of paying Mr. Fullagar his salary by open cheque.
FREDERICK. GEORGE NETHERCLIFT . My office is at 17, Maiden Lane, Covent Garden—I have made the study of handwriting a matter of billmiicss fur more than thirty years—my attention has been called to the forged endorsement
on the cheque and the forged receipt to the bill of costs, and also to the photographs of the endorsements on the bank-notes, and the signatures to the application forms—I have not seen the originals—I have also been shown documents in the handwriting of Mr. Fullagar—I have compared the forged documents with that handwriting with care, and in my opinion the forged documents were not written by Mr. Fullagar—I find some similarities to his handwriting, but there are similarities in all handwritings—they were not strong enough to justify me in giving an opinion that he was the writer of them—I have had in my possession letters in the handwriting of Mr. Reeve's clerks—having heard Mr. Chabot's statement in reference to blots, I do not think that should have any influence in forming an opinion as to handwriting, because it is an every-day occurrence—it would not help me at all; I should expect to find similar peculiarities to those mentioned by Mr. Chabot in the handwriting of other persons—I should expect to find a dot and a capital B, exactly as they are here—the capital B is exactly like a woman's B—I have seen such B's made over and over again.
Cross-examined. I say the blots would not affect my estimate of handwriting; why should it? it would not affect my judgment at all, or even be an element in considering it—I was in Court while Mr. Chabot gave his evidence, and I say the similarities he spoke of are not sufficient to justify me in expressing an opinion that Mr. Fullagar was the writer; I allude to the capital E, the open 0, the A, and the D, the R, and one or two other s—I did not verify each letter as he was giving his evidence; I had not the documents, therefore I could not follow him—I had some of them—I do not say that the similarities pointed out-by him do not exist; they do exist—(looking at a letter) I do not know this handwriting; I have never seen it before to my knowledge—it is something like Mr. Fullagar's; I am not quite certain—I am not able to form an opinion; I like to study these things before I give an opinion—I should not be surprised to find that it was or was not; it is very roughly written—it would not bear comparison with the handwriting I have seen of his—(looking at another) I should not think this was Fullagar's—I appeal to your Lordship whether this is not very unfair to put documents into my hand that I have not seen or studied—I never profess to give an opinion at a moment's notice—I observe the crossing of the double letters to and in the forged documents; I have not observed that in the prisoner's handwriting—I have observed that he crosses his t's in all manner of ways—I do not think I heard Mr. Chabot's attention directed to that yesterday; I did not look at it myself.
Other witnesses deposed to the prisoner's good character.
NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Recorder.
MESSRS. POLAND and BEASLEY conducted the Prosecution; and MR. COOPER the Defence.
JOHN MCCARDLE (Policeman K 77). On Whit-Monday, 21st May, I was on duty at West Ham up to 10.30 at night—I have been in the force about six months—I finished my duty at the station at that time; I then left the station and proceeded on my way home—I was in uniform; I had no armlet
on; I was wearing my helmet—on ray way home I called at the Kind's Head public-house; I got there between 10.30 and 10.40—I had two half-pints of beer there; one half-pint I paid for, and the other a gentleman treated me to—I drank both myself—I stayed there about twenty minutes—I was quite sober when I left—when I got into Church Street, about 60 yards from the King's Head, I saw about eight or nine persons standing on the pavement; they were using very obscene language, all apparently drunk, blocking up the thoroughfare—I requested them to go away—the prisoner came out from them and said "You b——sod, who are you?" and struck me a blow and knocked my helmet off—he then ran into the road; I followed him and went to catch hold of him by the shoulder—he knocked me down, and while I was down he struck me on the right cheek, under the left eye, and kicked me on the right side of the head—I managed to regain my feet—he ran down the road; I followed and caught him, when he knocked me down again, and I was kicked in the head and in the lower pait of my body by the prisoner and also by the mob—it caused swellings on my head, black eyes, and bruises all about my body; my face bled—I called out for assistance and Horswell came to my assistance—I was struggling with the prisoner—j—Horswell caught hold of him and he struck Horswell a violent blow on the mouth and cut his lip—I assisted Horawell, and we got bold of him and took him towards the station—on the road he said he should do six months for a b——sod like me, and used very obscene language and called me a great many names—he struck Horswell with his fist and cut his lip and made it bleed, and he knocked me down a third time—Burchell came up and the prisoner was taken to the station and charged; he was very violent going along—he was drunk; lam quite sure of that—Sergeant Nye, the acting-inspector, took the charge—in his presence he prisoner said he was sorry for what he had done to Horswell, but not for what he had done me——like me—he also accused me of leaving off my coat, belt, and helmet, and heaving it down and boxing with him, and said we had a fair fight, and that I had run him in because he had given me a good leathering—it is not true that I had taken off my coat or belt; my helmet was knocked off and left behind, and I saw no more of it till I got to the station—I drew my staff on the way to the station after the second constable, came up and secured the prisoner—I did not use it at all; I hid it—I did not see who brought my helmet to the station; it had my number on it—I was at Ilford when some witnesses were called on the prisoner's behalf; Hipwell was one of them—I saw him on the Monday night, standing against the railings of the church, after I had been beaten—I saw Anderson outside the station door, and Fisher on my way back from the station, after the charge had been taken.
Cross-examined. Before I entered the police I was in the Royal Horse Guards 2 years 155 days—I left by purchase because I did not care about it—I paid 33l.—had no intimation that I was to go—I had committed no serious military offence; I committed a few paltry affairs—I have had as much as three days' drill for being over time, nothing else—before I was in the Army I was a slater—I have not been a fighter—I saw Rogers, the potman at the King's Head, on this night—I did not offer him some beer out of a quart pot—I swear that I did not pour it out into a glass for him—they did not refuse to serve me with any more beer, and say I had had more than enough—they had no trouble to get me out—I saw Rogers many times after that—I can't say whether I was in the private bar drinking on the Wednesday—I did not ask Rogers whether he had seen or heard anythings
of the row on Monday—he did not say "Yes, I heard of it, and I; was surprised to see you with those eyes"—have no knowledge of saying "When I got out of the King's Head I was knocked senseless"—I don't know Mrs. Rogers—I did not say to the prisoner or any young man that night "You bleeding b——, you shall have it before the night is out—; after leaving the King's Head I did not see the prisoner and another man with a stone bottle, and say "Now I am right for a whet"—they did not reply "You are quite welcome"—I will swear I saw no bottle—I did not say to the prisoner "Let us have a spar for a barney. Come on, if I lick you I shall run you in, and if you lick me you shall go free"—I did not, on his refusal, pull him into the road by his collar and strike him in the face—I did not then draw my staff; I did on the way to the station, after the prisoner had been secured by two constables; he was then in custody—I was not separated from the prisoner while I was on the ground only by Horswell, I was on my knees, the prisoner was not, he was up—I was not in the slightest degree the worse for drink—I had had no drink at other places before going to the King's Head—I don't know that Hipwell came to the station and complained of my treatment of the prisoner—I saw him outside—I did not know him before, or the prisoner, or any of them, only Rogers—I had had him in custody—I did not say to Hopwell "You are the man I want," or anything like it—we did not walk together—I swear I never struck the prisoner at all.
ROGER HORSWELL (Policeman K 489). On Monday night, 21st May, about 11.15, I was on duty in Church Street, West Ham—I heard cries of "Police!"—I went to the spot and found McCardle and the prisoner struggling together—McCardle had his coat-and belt on, but no helmet—he said "I have been brutally assaulted by the prisoner"—I said "All right, I will assist you"—I took hold of him; he was very violent, and tried to strike him again—he made use of very bad language, called him a sod, and many bad names—we had great difficulty to hold him—he said "You b——Irish sod, I will do six months for you. You b——, I will knock your head off"—he struck me a violent blow in the mouth and cut my lip open—my lip bled very much indeed; I was spitting blood all the way to the station—my face was covered with blood, and my coat—my helmet was knocked off and thrown over the church wall—McCardle was knocked down by the prisoner, he got up again, and with great difficulty I held the prisoner fast and went towards the station—he still made use of bad language all the way—at that time Burobell came up, and with his assistance he was taken to the station—he still repeated the same words, that he would do six months for the b——; he challenged me to fight, and he has got the worst of it—he said he was sorry for me—he was very drunk—he was very violent at the station, and made use of the same expressions—McCardle was sober, as sober as I am now—he was bleeding very much, his eyes were wollen and very nearly closed, and he was bleeding from the nose very much—his helmet was left behind; it was brought to the station by a gentleman—I received the two helmets together from the gentleman.
Cross-examined. When the prisoner said "He challenged me to fight and had the worst of it," McCardle denied it—he said "No, I did not," nothing further.
Church Street—I there found the prisoner in custody of the two last witnesses—he was drunk and very violent; he made use of very bad lan. Guage—the two constables were bleeding very much from the face, one from the mouth, and the other had his eyes cut and all smothered in blood, and his coat was dirty where he had been thrown down—he had his coat on—he was perfectly dressed, belt and all—I assisted in taking the prisoner to the station—McCardle was perfectly sober, but very much excited through being knocked about—on the way to the station the prisoner was very violent; he made use of bad language; he said he would do six months for McCardle, but he was sorry for what he had done to the other, that there was not a man among us; that he had given McCardle a good hiding, and he would serve me the same only he had not the chance; he said he could do me in two minutes if I let go his arm—I saw Fisher that night between 60 and 100 yards from the station—I never saw the prisoner before, or any of the others.
Cross-examined. After he was charged at the station he said that McCardle had challenged him to fight and got the worst of it—McCardle said "No, I did not."
WILLIAM MEASURE . I assist my father, who keeps the British Lion at West Ham—about 11.15 on this night I was going down Church Street, and saw McCardle and Horswell struggling with a man—I cannot identify the prisoner—there were several persons on the opposite side of the way—I saw a person unknown to me come up and and strike McCardle a blow, which knocked him down on the ground, and whilst on the ground kick him in the lower part of the body and run away—the constables appeared perfectly sober; they had their uniforms on—both their helmets were knocked off.
JAMES NYE (Police Sergeant K 17). I was acting inspector on this night, I saw McCardle, before he went off duty, about 9.45 when he brought in a charge, and I saw him leave the station about 10.30, he was perfectly sober—I was at the station when the prisoner was brought in by the two constables at 11.20—he was drunk and very violent—he was placed in the dock and charged by McCardlfi and Horswell, with assaulting them—McCardle's face was very severely bruised, and covered with blood, Horswell's lip was cut, and he was bleeding from the mouth—the prisoner said pointing to Horswell "I am sorry for what I have done for you, I shall deserve all I get for that, I am not sorry for the other b——, it was a fair spar between us, but he has got the worst of it"—he said that several times—McCardle was perfectly dressed except his helmet, neither he or Horswell had their helmets when they first came in.
Witnesses for the Defence.
JOHN HIPWELL . I live at 5, Plaistow Grove—I worked at the Becton Gasworks, at the time in question, but not at present—on Whit-Monday night, about 11.20 or 11.30, I was near West Ham church, K 77 came behind me, touched me on the shoulder, and said "I want you"—I said "You are not far from me, I am here if you want me"—he then said "You are the wrong party, you are not the young man I thought you were"—he walked beside me for some yards—he said "I had a rare game with one or two of them down at a public-house;" I cant remember the name be mentioned—we went on and met two young men, one of them had a stone bottle, the prisoner was one of them, they were entire stangers to me—the constable said "Hold hard we shall be right here," and he said to the young man who
carried the bottle "How are we going on, all right for a whet?" he said "Yes, you can have a drink, both if you like"—he was about uncorking the. bottle, and the constable said to the prisoner "Let us have a quiet spar for a barney"—the prisoner said "No, I am going home, I shall have nothing at all to do with you, you can have a drink if you like"—the constable insisted upon it two or three times, and the prisoner denied him every time, and he; then took him by the collar and pulled him off the footpath into the road, J and said "If I lick you I shall run you in, and if you lick me you can go scot free, and there is a chance for you s—the prisoner declined it; the; constable struck him across the face with his open hand, they got hold of j each other and the constable's helmet fell off; I picked it up and took it to the station—while they were on the ground, they rolled over each other and struggled like a couple of dogs—we tried to part them, but could not for sometime, we did at last with assistance, and the prisoner got up and went away—the constable followed him, and I lost of them in the crowd—no one kicked the constable while I was there, the prisoner never kicked him—I must have seen it if he was—I went the station with the helmet and began to make a statement to the sergeant, and he said I had better go to the police-court and tell the Magistrate what I had seen, which I did.
Cross-examined. The prisoner appeared sober, he was both sober and civil, and was not interfering with anybody—I could not identify the constable, only by the number of his helmet, he looks exactly like the man—I gave the helmet to a constabale at the station door, he took it out of my hand before I got inside, he snatched it out of my hand on the. steps—I don't know that I saw any blood on the constable's face—I did not see the other constable's helmet off—I saw the helmet fall off K 11 and picked it up.
JOHN GEORGE ANDERSON . I live at West Ham, and work at the leathercloth works—on Whit-Monday, I was with the prisoner near West Ham church, at 10.15, I had a bottle of ale—we met the constable and Hip well—the constable said "How are we going on for a drink"—I said "Yes, you are welcome, you can have a drink"—as I was going to draw the cork, he pulled the prisoner off the path by the collar of his coat and asked him to have a spar for a barney—the prisoner said "No, I don't want no barney, drink if you are going to drink, you go your way and I will go mine"—the constable said "If I lick you I will let you go, but if you lick me I will run you m"—he then struck the prisoner across the face; I could not say whether with his open or shut hand, they closed and fell, they were rolling and scrambling on the ground—I and the last witness tried to separate them, at last they got up and the prisoner went away, and I went on towards the Unicom, and did not see the other bit of row at the corner of the King's Head—I did not see the other constable, only when I heard the bother I saw the prisoner n charge of the the other constable, and he said to the one that had hold of him "Let him alone he is going right with me, and he won't go quietly with you"—the constable was not sober, he appeared to have been drinking, excited.
Cross-examined. I have known the prisoner about six years; he is no particular friend—I had been with him that day; it was Bank Holiday—we had not had wonderful much drink—the prisoner was sober—I was once charged with an assault on a cow-keeper, and fined 17. and costs—I was taken by one of the police of the district and taken to this same station—that was the only time—I did not see McCardle's face bleeding or Horswell's lip cut.
Re-examined. We had been out with our wives that day—they had gone home and I was carrying home the beer.
WALTER FISHER . I live at 26, Doulton Road, West Ham—I was it West Ham Lame on this night, about 11.20—I saw the prisoner in custody of one constable, and another constable behind him, with his helmet off, walking in the road—I saw that constable strike at the prisoner, whether he hit him I can't say—I walked by their side to the station, and the constable had his staff drawn all the time—the prisoner was not violent; he did not strike or kick either of the constables—the constable said to me "You saw him strike me, did you not?" and I said "I did not; I saw you strike at him, and that I shall tell when I get to the station"—they were about half-way to the station when the third constable came up—I did not notice the constables bleeding—I have known the prisoner a good many years—none of us—were intoxicated that night—the prisoner has always been a quiet inoffensive man; he is a boiler maker.
Cross-examined. I have heard that he was charged with an assault on a constable—I don't know that he got a month, I don't know what he got; it was at West Ham—I had been with him part of this day—he was not drunk, he was what I call sober—we had been out together from about 11 a.m.; we were jolly—I can't say how many public-houses we had been into; very likely too many to count.
HENRY ROGERS . I was potman at the King's Head—between 10.30 and 11 o'clock on this night McCardle was there talking to some gentlemen—I was getting out the shutters to shut up—he caught hold of my collar and said "Halloo, Rogers, how are you? What are you going to have to drink—I said "A glass of ale"—he gave roe a glass out of a quart pot, and turned to the gentlemen and said "That is the only man I ever laggedb West Ham," meaning me—he had charged me with cruelly working a how—I saw that he was the worse for drink or I should have noticed his showing me up in the public-house—I refused serving him with any ale—he was the last man that went out of the King's Head that night—on the Wednesday following he came and asked if I knew anything about the affair—I said "No, but I was surprised to see you with those eyes after leaving on Whit Monday night"—he said he got knocked insensible when he got outside.
Cross-examined. I was not before the Magistrate—I was fined 4(k and costs at Stratford for cruelly working the horse, upon McCardle's evidence, but I did not have to pay it—McCardle took me into custody—it was on 23rd March last—I was detained till the fine was paid—I know the prisoner by sight, but never knew anything of him till this case.
GUILTY of the assault upon Horswell — Two Months' Imprisonment.
MR. SAFFORD conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM MUNDAY . I live at Villiers Street, Camden Town—on Saturday, 2nd June, I was going for a row on the Thames between 3 and 4 a.m. with two other lads named Thompson and Sutton—the prisoner was in the boat—he said "I am going to draw the plug"—I said "No, I shall not let you"—he said "I will," and I said "No"—we both got out of the boat—he said "If you hit me I shall run this knife into you"—I said "I do not want to hit yon," and T pushed him—I pushed him again and he ran his
pocket-knife into my side—he was standing on some timber—I was taken to the hospital and remained ten days—we had been friends before this—I saw him take the knife out and open it—this is the knife.
BENJAMIN SUTTON . I was with the last witness in the boat—I saw the prisoner pulling the plug out, and Munday said "You must not do it," and he said he should—they got out of the boat, and the prisoner run the knife into Munday when he had pushed him—Munday said "He has stabbed me," and I rushed and took the knife from the prisoner—I took Munday to the hospital.
WILLIAM LEWIS . I am house-surgeon to the Poplar Hospital—Munday was brought in on June 2nd—he was very pale, and suffering from loss of blood—he had an incised wound on the left side, caused by some sharp instrument—I probed the wound, and it went to the left rib—it was very dangerous—it must have been a violent blow, from the quantity of clothes it had gone through.
GUILTY — One Month's Imprisonment.
Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.
MESSES. CRAUFURD and EYRE LLOYD conducted the Prosecution.
FREDERICK SURRINGE . I am a potman at the Freemason's Tavern, Victoria Dock Road, West Ham—on 17th May the prisoner tendered a counterfeit shilling in payment for half a pint of beer—I told him it was the second I had received—he denied having given me one on the 14th and said he received that one from the pay-box at the docks—I had given him 11d. change—I gave him in charge.
Cross-examined. The prosecutor said he could not swear to the first' 1s.
Prisoner's Defence. I have worked many years at the docks. This man has a spite against me.
NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. LLOYD conducted the Prosecution.
MATILDA MORAN . I am barmaid at the Mitre public-house, Woolwich—on the night of 8th June Davis came in for 2d. worth of whiskey cold—he gave me a florin and I put it in the till, but noticed it was dark coloured—this is it (produced)—I gave him 1s. 10d. change.
Cross-examined by Davis. I first discovered that it was bad when the Policeman asked me, about a quarter of an hour afterwards—I can pledge my oath that you were in the house—I should not have known you if I had met you in the street—I said nothing about the coin looking black on the first—hearing, but I did on the second.
FRANCES KEEBLE . I am barmaid at the Castle, Woolwich, about the minutes' walk from the Mitre—on 8th June, about 9.45 p.m., Salmoj came in and asked for a glass of ale—he tendered a sixpence; I put it in the till; I do not know whether it was good or not—five or six minutes afterwards Davis came in for a glass of ale and tendered a shilling, which put in a till where there was no other coin; I afterwards took it out and Mr. Lennie bent it with his teeth, and I laid it on a shelf; I gave it to my brother—on the next day the witness Neale gave me a bad florin and I gave it to my brother.
Cross-examined by Davis. The policeman fetched me after you were taken into custody—the sergeant said "Do you recognise anybody?" and I point out Salmon first—no other questions were asked, or else I should have said that you were the one who passed a shilling afterwards—I came to the station next day and pointed you out—I was merely asked if I could recognizance you.
GEORGE LENNIE . I live at 3, Thomas Street, Woolwich—I do not folk I any occupation—I was at the Castle and saw Davis tender a shilling—I hail a suspicion of it as it lay on the counter; I bit and bent it, it is bad—I heard the two prisoners and another man say that they had been to the Mitre—one said "How did you get on?"—the other said "All right"—thej saw me watching them and went down High Street into the Carpenters' Arms—I spoke to the policeman; they saw me and took to their heels.
HENRY BAKER . I am a sawyer, of 14, Chesham Place, Woolwich—I saw the prisoners running and two policemen after them—I stopped Salmon—lie put his hand in his pocket, and I heard something drop like coin—I gave him to the policeman, went back to the spot, and picked up this bad florin, which I gave to Neale—the went past Parish Road, Clayton's Wharf, where I saw one of them make a bit of an aim over the wall, as if throwing something.
Cross-examined by Davis. I kept the florin all night, and then gave it to Neale.
WILLIAM HENRY KEEBLE . I keep the Castle, at Woolwich—Frances Keeble is my sister—on 9th June she gave me this bad florin; I took it to the station and gave it to Gladwell—she also gave me a bad shilling, which I gave to the sergeant.
WILLIAM NEWLAND . I am a labourer, of 11, Collingwood Street, Woolwich—on the morning of 9th June I was between Park Road and Clayton Wharf—there is only 8 or 9 yards between the two places—I found five shillings lying separate on the road, and on returning I found a packet containing ten florins, all bad; I threw them into about 14 or 15 feet of mud in the basin.
Cross-examined by Davis. There were 25 pieces altogether—I took them into the barge where I was at work and found that they were bad—the five shillings had been thrown over the wall and had fallen out of the paper—I showed them to my father before I threw them away—I did so that they should not get circulated—I did not know then that anybody was locked up.
EDWARD GLADWELL (Policeman R 281). On 8th June Lennie pointed the prisoners out to me—they immediately ran away—I pursued them—they were stopped in Lower Road—Hillier was with me—I took Salmon and told him it was fur passing bad money at the Castle—he said "You are wrong,
old man, we were running to catch the last train for London"—I found a good shilling on him and a railway ticket.
Cross-examined by Davis. I did not see you stopped—you were in custody when I got there.
THOMAS HILLIER (Policeman R 387). I iras with Glad well and took Davis—I told him he would be charged with passing bad money—he said "You are very much mistaken, I was runuing to catch the last train for London"—I found on him a bad shilling, five good shillings, ten sixpences, three fourpenny pieces, two threepenny pieces, and 1s. ld in copper and 6s. 6d. in postage stamps; also half a return ticket from Woolwich to London.
Davis' Defence. I was trying to catch the train, and the two policemen took me. I am a traveller and take a deal of money in a day, and I sometimes get a bad shilling. If I knew that the shilling was bad I should have kept it separate.
DAVIS— GUILTY — Twelve Months' Imprisonment.
SALMON— GUILTY* Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Recorder.
MR. GILL conducted the Prosecution.
JAMES FOX . I am a labourer, and live at 29, Rope Yard Rails, Woolwich—on Saturday night, 2nd June, between 11 and 12 o'clock, I was with Davis in the Coach and Horses public-house—I did net see the prisoner there—Davis and I walked from there along Union Street with linked arms—the prisoner came up and separated us, knocked me down and took my money from inside my jacket pocket—I felt his hand in my pocket—he stopped and talked with me and robbed me of 65. more from my trowsers pocket—I tried to hold him and called "Police!"—he struck me several times in the face and got away—I called to Davis to stop him, but he was not able—I knew him very well by sight—I spoke to a constable—I am sure he is the man.
Cross-examined by the Prisoner. Your mother came to me while I was on the drink and gave me 5s., and I signed a paper not to appear against you, but the Magistrate sent for me—I was tipsy on this night.
THOMAS VOKES . I am a labourer, and live at 38, Ann Street, Woolwich—on the night of 2nd June I saw the prosecutor and Davis in Union Street having hold of each other's arms—I was walking along behind them—I saw the prisoner get between them and saw them go down, and I saw the Prisoner put his hand round and get the money from his pocket; I heard money rattle—he pushed Fox down on his face; I tried to stop him and he 'truck at me and ran away.
JOHN DAVIS . I am a stevedore—I was with the prosecutor when he Prisoner came and gave us a shove, and Fox was on the ground—he shouted out "He has got my money"—I shouted to the last witness to stop hire—I lifted Fox up and then we both pursued the prisoner—he was joined by a confederate and got away; I am sure he is the man—I had seen him at the Coach and Horses, and then he put his hand in Fox's pocket and I cautioned him; he followed us out when we left.
ELIZABETH RITOHES . I live at 25, Union Street, Woolwich—I saw the prosecutor on the ground, and the prisoner in the act of striking Vokes; Vokes struck back at him, and he staggered against the wall, recovered himself, and ran away—I told the constable who he was and gave his name.
GUILTY of an assault, with intent to rob — Nine Months' Imprisonment.
MR. GOODMAN conducted the Prosecution.
SARAH ANN KEY . I am single, and reside at Braincree, Essex—on the afternoon of Whit Monday, about 2 o'clock, I was on the steamboat pier at Greenwich—the prisoner was near me, I felt his hand in my pocket, and I missed my purse, containing 13s. 5d.—I told my friend Tokeley and pointed out the prisoner, and he went after him—this is my purse; the money is still in it.
GEORGE TOKELEY . I was with Miss Key; she called my attention to the prisoner; I went after him and caught him by the collar and asked if he had got the young lady's purse—he said "No" at first; afterwards he said he had it given to him—I saw him drop it behind him; the inspector picked it up.
GUILTY — Six Months' Imprisonment.
Before Mr. Justice Field.
NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Baron Pollock.
MR. BRINDLEY conducted the Prosecution.
CHARLES WINSLADE (Policeman P 100). On Monday morning, May 21st, at 12.45, I heard yearns, went to a house, and saw the deceased lying in the passage—the prisoner was on the stairs—I said "What is the matter" and helped to put the fire out—I sent for Dr. Smith—I then said to the prisoner "This is some of your work"—she said "No, you mind your own business; she did it herself"—Dr. Smith came and I took the deceased to Guy's Hospital in a cab—she said to the prisoner "You know you did it; you know you put it in my lap"—the prisoner said that the deceased did it
herself—I spoke to the mother in the prisoner's presence; she said "I know nothing about it, I was not in the room; they commenced to row and I came out"—the deceased told the doctor that her sister did it with a lamp.
THOMAS DURHAM (Policeman P 45.) On 21st May, at 1 am., from information I received, I went to 13, Bexley Place, and saw the deceased—the prisoner was on the stairs—the doctor said that the deceased was suffering from severe burns from paraffine, and she must be taken to the hospital immediately—I asked her how it occurred—she said "My sister done it"—I called the prisoner and then said to the deceased "Tell me in your sister's presence how it occurred," and she said "Me and my sister were upstairs in the room quarrelling; she took up the lamp and threw it at me"—I said "You are making a very serious charge against your sister, is that true?"—she said "That is quite true, that is how it occurred"—she was sent to the hospital, and I took the prisoner to the station—she said "I did not do it; she done it herself."
MATTHEW MURPHY . I live at 13, Bexley Place, in the room next to the prisoner—I was at home and heard a disturbance between the sisters about 12 o'clock, and then a fall of glass—I saw a flame through the fan-light over the door, jumped out of bed, went to their room, and found the deceased on the floor in flames—the prisoner said "For God's sake, save my sister"—I carried her down stairs—Doctor Smith came and asked her who did it; the deceased said that her sister had done it—the prisoner was upstairs then, but before the doctor came the prisoner said that the deceased had done it herself.
Cross-examined by the Prisoner. You asked me to go and put the flames out.
DANIEL HUNT (Police Inspector P). On 23rd May I went to Guy's Hospital with Mr. Ellison, the Police Magistrate, and the prisoner, who was taken to her sister's bedside in custody—the deceased made a statement and was cross-examined by the prisoner—what she said was taken down by. the Magistrate's clerk. (Read: Mary Ann Ready on her oath saith, "I live at 13, Bexley Place, Peckham. On Sunday night I was hurt. She would not have done it only she had a drop of drink. She was quarrelling with my mother. I told her to leave off jawing. The glass of the lamp fell off, and it was burning at the time. She hit me on the forehead. I ran downstairs. I felt all my head and neck greased; my dress was burning. I rolled downstairs and my mother gave me a bed to lie on. I seat for the doctor. My sister seemed very sorry. It was my sister did it. Cross-examined. I tried to take the lamp out of your hand when it was alight. You did call for the man from the next room. Re-examined. The glass fell off, and I tried to take the rest of the lamp from her hand. She tried to prevent me and she hit me with it.")
SARAH READY . I am a widow, and live at 13, Bexley Place—the prisoner is my daughter; the deceased was my other daughter—she was twenty-four years old and was single, living with the prisoner in this room—we all three slept in the room and a baby—they came in after 11 o'clock—I have no clock—they had a bit of supper together, and both had a drop, taken—they sang a little song after that, and then my daughter went into bed, and she said to her sister "If you don't come to bed I shall come and out the lamp"—I said "You had better leave her alone" because she had a fit on Saturday night—the deceased said "It is my oil"—the prisoner
said "It is my limp; I gave 2s. for it"—I got out of bed, as I wanted to go downstairs, and I had not gone down more than four stairs when I heard glass break and saw a blaze—I cried out "My room is on fire"—Murphy came and I went back and saw the deceased; her head was on fire—I tool the baby and ran downstairs.
MONTAGUE LUBBOCK . I am house-surgeon at Guy's Hospital—the deceased was admitted there early on the morning of the 31st, suffering from the shock of burns on the head, face, and left side, the left upper and lower extremities, the left side of the chest, and the right shoulder—there was a strong smell of paraffine oil—the oil of a paraffine lamp would be likely to produce those injuries—she died on June 1st from lock-jaw from the effect of the burns.
The Prisoner's Statement before the Magistrate. "My sister jumped out of bed and said that she paid for the oil. I said it was my lamp. She up with her hand and smashed the glass, and I was removing the other part from the mantelpiece to the table, and she was trying to snatch it out of roj hand and it turned over, and then I saw her all ablaze. I called a man in the next room."
NOT GUILTY .
MR. COOPEE conducted the Prosecution.
ELIZABETH JACKSON" . I live at 5, Cottage Square, Lock's Fields—tie deceased, who was my husband, was a soda-water bottler; his age was 43—we occupied the front room, and the prisoner and her husband the adjoining one—their door was outside our door; they both opened on to a narrow passage—the stairs were in front of my door—on Saturday, June 9th, we were in our room; we had just come in, and my husband was not sober—he sat down and took off his coat and boots—the prisoner began talking from her room to my husband, who opened the door and held it with his right hand, standing partly on the landing—I remained in the room, and heard him say "Oh, Lizzie, I am burnt to death"—T saw him one mass of flames, and saw some pieces of glass and drops of paraffine fall on our floor—they frequently had a paraffine lamp in their room—I tried to daft the flames, and my husband ran downstairs—I went down and saw Mr. Hearn standing by the street door—I saw my husband rolled up in coats and taken to Guy's Hospital—I did not see the prisoner, I only heard her voice—through me and my husband the Hearnes had had notice to quit—we made frequent complaints to the landlady, as their quarrelling disturbed us, and she gave them notice to go.
Cross-examined by the Prisoner. My husband did not swear to settle yours before he came out of the room—he did not say that he would have his life that night—he was not in the house ten minutes before he was in flames—my husband did not say "I will have the b——," and burst the door open, nor did the lamp fall from your hand in your fright, on the landing.
WILLIAM BROOM (Police Sergeant B 40). The deceased was brought to the station with only his trowsers on and a rug over him; we took him to the hospital—I then went and knocked at the door of the prisoner's room, and was let in, and saw Hearne and his wife and two children—I told them I should have to take them in custody for the injury done to the man—he said "All right," but she said "I done it, my husband had nothing to do
with it whatever; I threw the lamp, and am very sorry for it"—I took them to the station, the charge was made, and she still adhered to her statement that she had done it—Mr. Wheeler gave me part of a broken lamp, and here are some pieces of glass which I found on the landing—I also found a whole lamp at Hearne's—the prisoner was sober—her husband was a little the worse for drink.
Cross-examined. You told me that Mr. Jackson used disgusting language towards you when he first opened the door—I have examined the door since the remand, and find one panel cracked, which seemed to have been recently done—it appeared to have been forced, but I cannot say whether from the outside or inside, as one panel leaned in and the other out.
MONTAGUE LUBBOCK . I am house-surgeon at Guy's Hospital—the deceased was brought there shortly before midnight, suffering from the effect of burns on his head and face and the upper part of his body—paraffine oil would account for it—he died next morning early from the shock to his constitution.
WILLIAM WHEELER . I am a shoemaker, and live in the same house—my mother is the landlady, and the Hearnes were her tenants—f heard Mr. and Mrs. Jackson's voices, and Mr. and Mrs. Hearne and Mr. Jackson came out on the landing and banged the door, and it was opened, and I heard a smash and screams, and saw the man on the stairs in a blaze—I ran and caught him at his own door, and tried to put it out, but burnt my hands, and, with the assistance of another man, held him on the ground and tore his shirt off, and went and got a rug, and while I was putting it over him the prisoner said "It was not him, it was me threw the lamp at him"—after I came from the station I saw the prisoner again, and she said "I bare done it, I know I done it."
The Prisoner's statement before the Magistrate. "He made violent threats towards me, and used disgusting language, and said he would do for my husband that night. I threw the lamp in self defence when he burst the door open, but not with the intention of doing what has been done."
Prisoners Defence. I beg for mercy, he burst the door open, I had the lamp in my hand and threw it at him, but not with such an intention, I did it through terror. He has always been on at my husband because he is a quiet man; only a fortnight previous when I had my daughter at home he said he would kick the door in, and I fastened it to keep him out. He burst the door open to take my husband's life, and I believe one blow would have killed him. He was a very violent man, and his wife had to walk the streets for two nights, as he ran about with a knife in his hand; my husband locked the door.
GUILTY. Strongly recommended to mercy by the Jury — Six Months' Imprisonment.
Before Robert Malcolm Kerr, Esq.
MR. POLAND conducted the Prosecution.
THOMAS BERRY (Detective Officer E). I watched the prisoners about 8 o'clock, on the 8th June—the elder one gave the little girl something and pointed, and the little one went to 50, Rodney Road, to Elizabeth Powney's—I sent a man in to give information—Mrs. Powney came out and ran after
the prisoner, I followed—Powney said "You gave me a bad sixpence"—I said "Where is the sixpence?"—she said "I have thrown it away"—she had little purse in her hand, and she gave some halfpence to Mrs. Powney—I said "I shall take you into custody"—she said "The lady does not want to charge me"—I took her to the Rodney Road station—I afterwards saw the little girl—I said "What is your name"—she said "I have got no name"—I said "Where do you live"—she said "I have got no home"—I put my hand in the pocket of her waterproof, and found 7 1/2 d. in coppers"—she said "My mother gave them to me"—I took her to the station and searched her and found in one pocket a bad sixpence, and in the other two bad six-pences and two bad shillings folded up with a piece of paper between each—the elder prisoner cried out "Nelly, say you found it"—I said "Found what?"—in the inspector's room she said she lived at 6, Nelson Street—they had only a market basket and two eggs, and about 11b. of bread besides—I afterwards went with Sergeant Reeve's, to No. 1, Aaron's Buildings, in consequence of information received from Mary Searle, who pointed out a room to us which we searched, and found the vitriol, melting pot, and ladle, spoon, copper wire, French chalk, and silver sand produced—they are used in making bad money.
ELIZABETH POWNEY . I am the wife of Wallis Powney, of 50, Kodnej Road, a general dealer—on the night of the 8th June, the elder prisoner came into my shop and bought some bacon; I gave her change for sixpence—then Mr. Harvey came in and from what he said I looked at the sixpence and found it was bad—I ran after her and said "Please this is a bad six-pence, are you not aware of it?"—she said "No, I will give you the half-pence back again," and she gave it to the policeman.
Cross-examined by C. Moran. The policeman came to my shop at the same time as you did—you said you threw the sixpence away, but you put it in your mouth with the bacon.
MARY SEARLE . I live at Hearne Buildings, Elstead Street, Walworth—the two prisoners occupied a back-room in my house from the 26th March, to the time they were taken into custody—the elder prisoner took the rooms in the name of Mrs. Raynor—the younger prisoner and another little girl lived with her—she said she was a washer and ironer.
CATHERINE MORAN— GUILTY*— Judgment Respited.
ELLEN MORAN— NOT GUILTY
NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MESSRS. POLAND and HORACE AVORT conducted the Prosecution; and MR. GILL the Defence.
THOMAS HALLIGAN . I am a knife and scissors grinder—T was discharged from the Wandsworth Infirmary two nights ago—T was with the deceased, Duffey, on June 7th, in East Hill, Wandsworth, near the Royal Oak public I house—our machine was standing on the left side of the road, going down the hill—I was between the handles of the machine and looking down the hill—Duffey was regulating the tools in the box, and he was on the off side of the machine—I heard a noise—I was struck in the back and I remember no more till I found myself in the infirmary with Dnffey, who died on the 16th—he was not ill before the accident.
Cross-examined. I stopped near the public-house to get lodgings—we were on the side that vehicles coming down the hill would naturally come.
HERBERT MORRIS LEIGH . I live at Windsor, and am an assistant to Young and Bainbridge, the brewers—on June 7th I was walking down East Hill, Wandsworth, about 10 p.m.—I saw a two-horse ginger beer van pass me on the brow of the hill, about 200 yards from the Royal Oak, at the rate of 10 or 12 miles an hour—it was on the near side, I was on the opposite side—I saw no skid on—immediately afterwards I heard a sound—I walked down the hill and saw the deceased lying in the road—the machine was smashed up and the debris lying about—Halligan was sitting on the kerb—the van was standing still—one horse was being led on the pavement—the men were taken away—I met a policeman and told him, and the prisoner was taken into custody—it is a very steep hill.
Cross-examined. There were one or two vans there—the prisoner was on his right side—I did not talk to the prisoner—I did not see that he was stunned—it was not a dark night—there was no light then in the public-house there was afterwards.
JAMES HOBBS . I live at 124, High Street, Wandsworth, and am a painter—I saw this collision with a two-horse van and the grinding machine—the driver was pulling in towards the kerb and his near horse went on to the pavement and stumbled, but recovered himself—the off horse fell down and the driver fell of the horse's back—the horses cleared the machine, but the van knocked it all to pieces—there was no skid on the wheel; I saw it hanging on the van—the van was heavily laden with bottles of mineral waters and ginger beer—I saw nothing else passing at the time—I saw the prisoner—his face was covered with blood—I could not say whether he was drunk.
Cross-examined. There was a private lamp but it was not lit—it was not a dark night—I think there was a moon.
WILLIAM COOK . I am a fishmonger, at 4, St. Ann's Hill, Wandsworth—I was in the Two Brewers public-house on the 7th June, which is lower down the hill, and about 30 yards from the Royal Oak—I heard a rattle like an engine, and ran out, but before I had got out the collision had occurred, and the bottles were thrown on the pavement and broken—there was no skid on the van—the prisoner was being picked up—he was ale ding—he was very drunk—I said "Shall I get a little water and wash rou"—ho abused me—I said "I am afraid you have killed those two men behind"—he called me a b——liar and abused me like a drunken man would—I said "I am sorry I spoke"—he was taken into custody—I should say there were two tons on the van.
Cross-examined. It was a rather dark night—I did not try to annoy the prisoner.
EDWARD LAUGHTON (Policeman V 16). I was called to this accident sail found the prisoner standing near the Royal Oak—I asked him if he had charge of the horses—he said "Yes," and if he had done anything wrong he had not done it with a guilty conscience—he appeared to be drunk—I told him I should take him into custody for being drunk and for reckless driving—he did not reply to that—I directed two constables to take him to the station, and I went to the infirmary with the two men—I saw the prisons about 11 o'clock the same night and charged him with being drunk and reckless driving—he said he was not too drunk to take charge of the horses—the road is about 25 feet broad; three vehicles could pass.
Cross-examined. There was blood on the prisoner's face—there was alight in the beer-shop, but the lamp outside was not lit—the night was dark, but not very; I said so before the Magistrate.
THOMAS CRESSWELL . I am a member of the Royal College of Surgeon and medical officer of the Wandsworth Infirmary—the deceased was brought on the night of the 7th in a state of collapse, and suffering extreme pain from some internal injury such as would be produced from an accident, or from external violence—the first day I did not think he would live twenty four hours, but he rallied in a day or two, although he never became in a satisfactory condition, and he died on 16th June from the effects of the accident—I made a post-mortem examination, and found that he had died from internal injuries.
GUILTY — Eighteen Months' Imprisonment.
MR. PURCELL conducted the Prosecution.
ELIZABETH PARSON . I live at 3, Wine Office Court, Fleet Street, and have known the prisoner about 6 years—I know his first wife, who was Ann Mills—I was present at their marriage at St. John's Church, Waterloo Road, on 26th July, 1871, and have seen the wife within the last two or three months—she was at the police-court—they had been parted about three years.
Prisoner. My mind was so bad I didn't know what I was doing.
CLARA HISCOFF . I live at 5, Pleasant Row, Wandsworth—the prisoner married me on 15th October, 1876, at Kingston-on-Thames—he was living with his father then—he courted me for about four months—I was living with him when he was given into custody—a fortnight after he married me he told me he was a married man—I asked him every question, but could get no clue to it till about three weeks or a month ago—I wrote to his aunt and received a letter from his wife; she gave him into custody—I am in the family-way by him.
JOHN SUTTON (Policeman V 134). I took the prisoner into custody in Wandsworth, telling him it was for intermarrying with Clara Hiscoff, his wife being alive—he said "I was not aware that my wife was alive when I married Clara Hiscoff; she knew I was a married man"—he said he did not care—I produce the certificates of the two marriages—the prisoner was at work at a large piggery at Wandsworth.
after I was married—he came home very low-spirited and I said "What is the matter?" and he said his father had given him a severe talking to—I asked him the cause of the talking to, and he told me after a time that he was a married man.
Cross-examined. I told you I had two children; that is quite correct—I was living with titled people, Lady Harrington, of Eichmond Heath, when I married you, and had been there for two years, gaining my living in a respectable manner, and always have done so until I married you—your illtreatment has been dreadful; you swore you would cut me in pieces—since I have been in Wandsworth I have had to leave you five times in nine months because T couldn't put up with your ways—I did not ask you to marry me; I would rather have done anything than married you.
Prisoner's Defence. All I have to say is that she has got a child, which she professes to be mine, and I don't think it is a just thing at all. I work for my own living, and was living with my father, thinking to do him a service, and was getting on very nicely, and I was led astray.
GUILTY — Five Years' Penal Servitude.
MR. COLE conducted the Prosecution.
JOHN CEEASEY (Policeman P 60). On 27th May, just after midnight, I saw the prisoner and two men in East Street, Walworth Road—the prisoner went into the garden of No. 186, and down the area; that is Mr. Trigg's house—the other two walked backwards and forwards, one one way, and one the other—I was concealed nearly opposite—I heard a window lifted, and about 2.50 I saw the prisoner coming from the garden—he had been there about twenty-five minutes—I asked him what he had been doing—he said "I have been asleep; I have just recovered from drunkenness "—the other two ran away—the prisoner asked me what I should charge him with—I said I thought it would be burglary—he said "Well, I must put up with it"—I found at the station this table-knife in his pocket, and a bottle contaning brandy, I think, and two or three matches and a purse.
Cross-examined by the Prisoner. I was about 30 yards from you.
GEORGE HOLLIS (Policeman P 131). I saw Creasey take the prisoner—I found the area window at No. 186 a little way open and called the inmates—I found this coat and vest at the bottom of the kitchen stairs, and two shirts and a jacket, all laid together, ready for removal—the area door had been opened from the inside—I found this piece of candle on the kits hen table.
WILLIAM TRIGG . I live at 86, East Street, Walworth Road, and am a boot-finisher—on 27th May Hollis called me, and I found the area window a little open—this property is mine—one bundle was just outside the kituben door, and the other in the kitchen on the floor—the clothes were on a peg in the passage when I went to bed—I had looked at the area window that night; it was always kept closed—I left my sister up that night—there was a piece of candle there which was not there before; we never use candles; there was also a screw-driver on the table.
AMELIA TRIGGS . I am the sister of the last witness; we live with our father and mother at 186, East Street, Walworth Road—I went to bed about 1.30, and fastened the area door with two bolts: the kitchen window
was closed, but not fastened—these things were then hanging on the rails in the passage.
Prisoner's Defence. I was lying in a van, drunk. I saw a man come out of this house and run across the road; another chap was in the middle of the road, and the policeman jumped up and caught hold of me. I bought the candle and had it in my pocket, as my landlord does not supply them.
GUILTY . He was further charged with having been convicted at Newington, in January, 1872, to which he
PLEADED GUILTY— Twelve Months' Imprisonment.
Before Mr. Recorder.
After being given in charge the Prisoner stated that he wished to
PLEAD GUILTY to unlawfully wounding, and the Jury found that verdict. He received a good character— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
ADJOURNED TO TUESDAY, AUGUST 7TH, 1877.