CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT
SECOND SESSION, HELD DECEMBER 18TH, 1865.
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE,
TAKEN IN SHORT-HAND BY
JAMES DROVER BARNETT
Short-hand Writers to the Court,
THE POINTS OF LAW AND PRACTICE
REVISED AND EDITED BY
EDWARD T. E. BESLEY, ESQ.,
OF THE MIDDLE TEMPLE, BARRISTER-AT-LAW.
BUTTERWORTHS, 7, FLEET STREET,
Law Publishers to the Queen's Most Excellent Majesty.
On the Queen's Commission of
OYER AND TERMINER AND GAOL DELIVERY
The City of London,
AND GAOL DELIVERY FOR THE
COUNTY OF MIDDLESEX, AND THE PARTS OF THE COUNTIES OF ESSEX, KENT, AND SURREY WITHIN THE JURISDICTION
CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT,
Held on Monday, December 18th, 1865, and following days.
BEFORE THE RIGHT HON. BENJAMIN, SAMUEL PHILLIPS, LORD MAYOR of the City of London; The Hon Sir COLIN BLACKBURN , Knt., one of the Justices of Her Majesty's Court of Queen's Bench; WILLIAM TAYLOR COPELAND , Esq.; M.P.;THOMAS QUESTED FINNIS, Esq.; and WARREN STORMES HALE Esq.; Aldermen of the said City; RUSSELL GURNEY , Esq., Q.C., M.P., Recorder of the said City; JAMES ABBIS , Esq.; JAMES CLARKE LAWRENCE , Esq., ROBERT BESLEY , Esq.;SIDNEY HEDLEY WATER LOW Esq., ANDREW LUSK , Esq.; and DAVID STONE , Esq., Aldermen of the said City; THOMAS CHAMBERS , Esq., Q.C., M.P., Common Serjeant of the said City; and ROBERT MALCOLM KERR , Esq., Judge of the Sheriffs' Court; Her Majesty's Justices of Oyer and Terminer and General Gaol Delivery of Newgate, holden for the said City, and Judges of the Central Criminal Court.
CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT.
PHILLIPS, MAYOR. SECOND SESSION.
A star (*) denotes that prisoners have been previously in custody—two stars (**) that they have been more than once in custody-an obelisk (†) that they are known to be the associates of bad characters—the figures after the name in the indictment denote the prisoner's age.
LONDON AND MIDDLESEX CASES.
OLD COURT.—Monday, December 18th, 1865.
Before Mr. Recorder.
69. FREDERICK JONES (30), and SAMUEL MERRICK (28), were indicted for Unlawfully assaulting Robert Hunter, and causing him bodily harm. Second Count, for occasioning bodily harm. Third Count, for a common assault.
MESSRS. SLEIGH and MONTAGUE WILLIAMS conducted the Prosecution, and MR. BUTLER RIGBY the Defence.
WILLIAM DAVIS . I am in the employment of Dr. Hunter, of Upper Seymour-street, as hall-porter—I know the prisoners—on Thursday, 2d November, Jones came there about ten minutes to 1—he was then alone—Merrick came about half an hour afterwards—when Jones came, he asked me if he could see Dr. Hunter—I told him he was engaged; if he would wait, he could see him in his turn—I showed him into the waiting-room, and he was there when Merrick arrived—Dr. Hunter was still engaged, and unable to see them—Jones said he could not wait any longer, and I showed him into Dr. Melville's consulting-room—he had a consulting-room in the same house—Merrick was following him—I said to him, "Can't you wait?" he said, "I am Mr. Jones' brother"—I said, "You had better go in there too, and I will go up and see Dr. Hunter, and tell him"—Jones got very excited—I told Dr. Melville that Mr. Jones was getting very excited; he had better go and speak to him—he went in and told him that he must wait, that Dr. Hunter was engaged—I was standing at the banister, and he rushed out of the room and said, "You are all d—d scamps, "and knocked me down, and ran upstairs—Merrick followed—they both rushed up two stairs at a time, as fast as ever they could go—directly they rushed up stairs, I went out for a policeman—I did not see one, but Dr. Hunter's coachman was at the door, and I asked him to get one—I then ran up stairs to try and give assistance to protect Dr. Hunter from further violence—I went and stood between Jones and Dr. Hunter—Jones took me round the waist and threw me away—I did not see Merrick do anything—he was in custody of a police-constable—the policeman got there almost as soon as I got there.
Cross-examined. Q. You say you went out for a policeman? A. Yes, I did—no one sent me for a policeman—I thought it was requisite, in consequence of their excited manner—I did it upon my own responsibility—I did not see Merrick commit any violence—I was examined at the police-court on the charge of rape—on that occasion, I swore that Mrs. Merrick never came to Dr. Hunter on 14th October—I say so now—Jones was not excited when he first came, he was calm enough—I am quite sure I told him that Dr. Hunter was within—I did not tell him he was out—there are two doctors in the house who see patients, and there is Dr. Day, who does writing, I believe—the others are Dr. Melville and Dr. Munns—he is on a visit to Dr. Hunter—he is there sometimes in the day; he does not reside there—I take care of the house—none of the doctors reside there—the different doctors have their own rooms in the house.
DR. HENRY MELVILLE . I am a graduate of the University of Edinburgh, of the year 1837—in the month of October I knew Mrs. Merrick, a patient—I have a consulting-room in the same hones as Dr. Hunter, and assist him—Mrs. Merrick lived at 52, Upper Baker-street—I visited her in company with Dr. Wills, on the 21st October, and on 23d, 24tb, and 27th—I visited her alone on the 27th—the last time I went there, I saw Jones—I understood him to say he was the brother of Mrs. Merrick.
Q. In consequence of directions you had received from Dr. Hunter, did you tell Jones that you wished Mr. Merrick to call on Dr. Hunter and see him? A. I can't say it was in consequence of directions I had received, but I did request him to do so—I at first addressed him as Mr. Merrick—he said, "I am not Mr. Merrick, I am Mrs. Merrick's brother"—I then said, "Will you be kind enough to ask Mr. Merrick to come down and see us to morrow; the attendance now I think no longer necessary, and we should like to see Mr. Merrick on the subject—on the following Tuesday morning, I received a communication from Dr. Hunter about these people—on Thursday, 2d November, about 2 o'clock, the last witness came to me, and said, "Mr. Jones is in a very excited state, he seems very angry"—I said, "You had hotter show him into my room"—that was the front room on the ground floor—I came down from up stairs to see Jones—I found two other persons in the hall besides Jones—I recognise Merrick as one of them—Jones said he wanted to see Dr. Hunter—I replied, "You can't see him at present, because he is engaged with a patient; you will have to wait"—he was at that time sitting on the chair, and he rose up and said, "I will see Dr. Hunter," and he rushed quickly out of the room—I followed him—he went up stairs—as he went up stairs I heard his voice, but I could not catch exactly what he said—at that time Merrick was in the hall—the servant was in a state of great excitement, and I said to him, "William, you bad better go and get a policeman"—there was some other person in the hall, and I addressed him and asked him to walk into the reception-room—I then went up stairs, because at that time I heard a confusion and noise upstairs—I went directly into Dr. Hunter's room; at least, I attempted to enter it, but I could not get in—as soon as I got to the top of the landing, I saw Dr. Hunter with his head against the wall; Jones on his right hand side, with Dr. Hunter's ear in his mouth; Mrs. Hunter standing between the two; Merrick in front of Dr. Hunter, with his hand extended to his throat; Dr. Hunter's daughter on the other side, and Dr. Munns just at the side of Jones, endeavouring to disengage him—I did not at any time see anything in the hands of either of the parties—I endeavoured and succeeded, I think, moving Merrick—I got him by the arms behind, and drew him back-wards
—believe Dr. Munns was instrumental in removing Jones—he again rushed to endeavour to assault Hunter—Merrick at that time was standing quietly enough on the landing, where there were several others, and the policeman was there by that time—I noticed the state of Dr. Hunter's ear; there was a lacerated wound which was bleeding very profusely—I heard Jones, before he was removed, say why he had come there—I was remon-strating with Merrick and said, "You know you" have laid yourself open to a criminal indictment for this proceeding"—Jones, I think, overheard me, and he said, "You don't suppose I came here not knowing the consequence; I came here to give him a licking"—I think he called the doctor an infernal scoundrel—they were subsequently removed by a police-constable—I have known Dr. Hunter very nearly eleven years.
Cross-examined. Q. Where was he then? A. In New York—he left New York, I think it must have been, at the latter end of 1858, or the beginning of 1859—I was in New York at that time—I was intimate with him—we did not live together then—I was in the habit of seeing him daily—I do not know that he had practised there without being qualified—I never knew that he practised before he obtained his diploma—I never heard of any complaints made against him in consequence of that; I swear that—he did not leave New York suddenly; I swear that—I do not know that, just before the time he left New York, a charge had been made against him—I swear most distinctly I never heard that a charge was brought against him; nothing of the kind—I did not see Merrick strike any blow on this occasion—I saw him with his band on Dr. Hunter's throat—I swear that he had hold of him—I did not see him seize him—when I came to the top of the stairs, he was leaning over Mrs. Hunter, who was between them, with his hand on Dr. Hunter's throat—I was not present at the commencement—to the best of my recollection, what Jones said was, "You don't think that I came here not knowing the consequence of what I was going to do; I came here determined to give him a licking"—if he did not use the word "determined." it was certainly a word expressive of the same meaning—he said that he had grossly insulted his sister; he assigned that as the cause—he was very excited—I have been fourteen months with Dr. Hunter in London—I did not say I was an assistant; there is a partnership I presume existing between him and myself—during the time I have been there, I think I have known most of the patients attending—I do not remember a Mrs. Eversfield being a patient of Dr. Hunter's—I knew a Mr. Rawlings in New York—(Looking at a gentleman in Court) I do not know that gentleman; that is not the gentleman I knew—I think I remember the fact of a Mrs. Brisley being a patient—I never saw her—I do not know that she suddenly discontinued her visits.
MR. SLEIGH. Q. During the whole time you have known Dr. Hunter, did he bear among his friends and acquaintances the character of A well-conducted, moral, truthful person? A. Undoubtedly.
DR. ROBERT HUNTER . I reside at 3, Queen's-gate-terrace, but I have a professional residence in Upper Seymour-street—I am a registered licentiate in medicine and surgery, and a Doctor of Medicine—among many patients there was a person of the name of Mrs. Merrick—I first saw her, I think, on 25th September—she came to my house to consult me—she made seven or eight visits—Dr. Melville is associated with me in practice as a partner—subsequently to these visits of Mrs. Merrick's, she took a severe cold, and had an attack of pleural pneumonia, and was obliged to keep her house—two of the gentlemen associated with me visited her—on Monday, 30th
October, Mr. Merrick called upon me—he stated that Dr. Melville bad left word for him to come down and see me in regard to the payment of fees—I explained to him that he was indebted to the medical men for their visits, that the mouth had expired by four days, and it was impossible for us to go on, unless the regular fees were paid—he disputed the right of the medical men to be paid for their visits—I called his attention to the fee-card, which distinctly states that all out-visits are extra—he then said, "You won't continue attendance, unless I pay this?"—I said, "Certainly not, unless you arrange for them, and pay the monthly fee, inasmuch as the expense we have already been put to is considerably more than the amount received in fees"—he again asked me whether I would not allow the fees to remain unpaid, and continue my attendance—I told him I would mention the matter to Dr. Melville, but, so far as I had any connexion with it, we would not continue the attendance—he left very much dissatisfied—Mrs. Merrick had been supplied with an inhaling machine and medicines, and so forth, which had been rendered necessary by this attack of illness—on Thursday, 2d November, I was in my consulting-room from an early hour, perhaps half-past 10—I think it might have been after 2 o'clock when I heard a loud excited talk in the adjoining room, in which my wife and daughter, and Dr. Munns were sitting, and, thinking that the servants had had some dispute, I went to the door to ascertain what it was—immediately upon opening the door I received a heavy blow over the top of the head with this cane (produced)—these are the pieces—the blow was struck by Jones, with the cane held in this manner, the moment my head appeared at the door—before I was conscious of what was taking place, I must have received two blows, as there were two heavy ridges over the head afterwards; but of course, in the excitement of the moment, it was not possible to say—Merrick, being a smaller man, was in front of Jones—Jones struck over his head—both of them rushed into the room—I succeeded in defending my face—Merrick got round on my left-hand side—Jones was on the right—Merrick got under my guard—I held up my arms to guard my face, and I turned towards him, and struck him down against the table—as I did so, Jones worked in upon me, his cane having broken in his hand, and fastened his teeth in my right ear; he bit the ear almost quite through—it bled very profusely, so as to saturate my coat and shirt, and even the floor—Merrick recovered himself, and seized me by the throat—almost at the same instant as Jones fastened his teeth in my ear, Mrs. Hunter and my daughter rushed from the adjoining room, and seized hold of my arms with a view of protecting me—with their assistance, and that of one of the medical gentlemen and the policeman, I was released from them—they were then given into custody, and taken to the police court—they were committed on that very day for trial at the Middlesex Sessions on the ensuing Monday—on the Saturday night before that Monday, at half-past 10 o'clock, I was taken into custody, on a warrant, on a charge of rape, and locked up—upon an application being made to postpone this trial of assault at the Sessions, I instructed my Counsel to oppose it.
Cross-examined. Q. You say you practice at this house in Seymour-street; in what capacity do you practice? A. As a physician—I hold a British Colonial qualification—I hold no English degree—I first took a degree, to enable me to practise, in March, 1846, I think—that was at the University of New York—I had not been practising previously to that, I swear that: nowhere—I had undergone six years' probation for it—I commenced my studies with my father, as preceptor—he was a Doctor of
Medicine and a licentiate—he resided in Canada—I was for two years a student at the University of Geneva—I then was for two yean at New York—until I took my degree, I never practised, unless it can be considered practice to attend to patients of my father's—no complaints were ever made against me, at New York, of practising without being properly qualified; that I swear—I suppose inclination caused me to leave Canada—there was no cause that I can assign, except a desire to visit England, and to spend a few years pleasantly abroad—no other cause—the first time I left New York was, I think, in May, 1858—I did not leave suddenly; I swear that.
Q. Was not a charge openly and publicly made against you just before the time you left there? A. No charge was ever made against me, on my oath—no charge of having committed a rape; nor since I was born—I was not challenged to come forward and refute the charge; it is untrue from beginning to end—I think it very likely I saw that gentleman (Mr. Rawlins) about fourteen years ago—I hardly know his face again—he never dined with me at my house—I say distinctly and unhesitatingly that I was never charged with a rape, nor anything of the kind; I swear that—among my patients, I think, was a Mrs. Brisley—she never made any complaint against me, never—I do not know of her ever making any complaint whatever; not a word to me—she discontinued her visits at the end of her month, I suppose—I don't think she came more than two or three times altogether—she never alleged any reason for discontinuing her visits; I swear that distinctly—I will swear she did not charge me with having committed any indecency towards her—I had & patient of the name of Mrs. Everafield; she never accused me of any indecent conduct towards her, not a word.
Q. With reference to the complaint at New York, I do not mean a legal charge, but was not your conduct complained of? A. I never heard of it, not on any occasion.
Q. On the day of this assault, you say that Jones bit your ear; will you swear that was so? A. Certainly I will—there was a spatuls in his hands at one time, but how it came there I do not know—I don't think there was any instrument that would cause the wound on my ear—I swear it was caused by a bite from Jones—I was then turning towards Merrick—I had struck Merrick down, and, as I was turning, Jones rushed in and fastened his teeth in my ear—Merrick had put his hand on me before I struck him; be had struck me several blows.
Q. Did Jones tell you, when he first came in, that you had grossly violated his sister? A. He did not say anything of the kind; on his entering afterwards, he said I bad insulted his sister on her second visit—he was as a man would be who had been taken in an assault.
MR. SLEIGH. Q. You say Merrick had struck you several times before you knocked him down? A. Undoubtedly, he struck me several times—there is not the slightest pretence for the insinuations that have been made by the learned Counsel, either as regards America or England.
Q. I put it to you again, as he did, not in the shape of a legal charge, bat any personal complaint made to you by any woman during your whole practice, or during your whole life, of ever having acted indecently towards her? A. Not one single instance of personal complaint even to myself—I never heard of complaints made against me, until this charge of rape was brought—I stood my trial in that dock, and was acquitted.
The Recorder was of opinion that like First Count was not sustained.
GUILTY on the Second Count— Recommended to Mercy by the Jury, in consequence of the excited state they were in.
JONES— Confined Two Months. MARRICK— Fined 5l.
MR. HOUSTON conducted the Prosecution.
MARTIN LUNGREY . I am assistant to Mr. Poole, a watch-maker, in Fen-church-street—on 27th October, between 4 and 5 in the evening, the prisoner came into the shop, produced a brooch, and asked me what we should charge for putting a catch on it—I looked at it, and turned round towards the window, to see what it required, and on turning again to speak to the prisoner, I saw him take his hand out of a case—I could not see what he took—I had no time to tell him what the brooch would cost, for he directly ran out through the doorway—Mr. Bridge followed him—the case was afterwards examined, and one watch was missing.
Prisoner. Q. Did not you state before the Magistrate that you could not say the watch was there when I came into the shop? A. I had not noticed it that morning; I had seen it a day or two before—it has not been found.
JOHN BRIDGE . I am assistant to Mr. Poole—on 27th October I had occasion to leave the shop, leaving the last witness in charge, and went into an adjoining room—while there I heard a noise, as of the opening or shutting of a door—I looked and distinctly saw the prisoner withdraw his hand from the back of the case, and rush to the door—I called out, "Look to the shop," and followed him, and after a run of about five minutes, I overtook him, and gave him in charge—on coming back, I examined the case, and missed a gold hunting watch from it, worth 26l.—I am certain it was there that morning—there were four compartments, with a watch in each, and I must have missed it had it not been there—when I gave the prisoner in charge to the constable, he at first said he knew nothing of the shop, and at the station he said the brooch he had left at the shop belonged to his sister.
Prisoner's Defence. I am innocent; the reason I ran out of the shop was to speak to a friend who I saw passing. I heard a cry of "Stop thief", and saw a man running, and I ran as well.
GUILTY .— Confined Nine Months.
HENRY SMITH . I am a butchers' cutler, of 91, St. John-street, Clerkenwell—on 9th December I was passing through Tylor's-market about half-past 3—I had a parcel under my arm and a child's toy in the other hand—I felt the prisoner with his hand pulling at my watch-guard—I seized hold of his hand with my chain round two of his fingers—he never offered to get away, but still kept pulling at my guard—I asked him what he was doing—he said he either wanted to break it, or to have it—he did not succeed in getting it—there was a constable close by, and I gave him in charge—I thought the man was foolish.
GUILTY .**— Confined Eighteen Months.
MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution, and MR. DALY the Defence.
the wife of Thomas Griffiths, who works at the gas works near the Temple—on the morning of 26th November, between 9 and 10 o'clock, I was looking out of my window, on the second floor, into the corner of Pleydell-street—I saw the prosecutor, the prisoner, and two other men in the court—I can swear positively to the prisoner, I could not swear to the other two—the prisoner was talking to the prosecutor, as if to a friend; then he twitched his chain and pulled it, and then took it right off his neck—the old gentleman resisted feebly—the prisoner put the chain in his coat pocket—I could not see whether there was a watch attached to it—the prisoner then put his hand into the prosecutor's waistcoat pocket, and then into his trousers pocket—the other men stood round him, but did nothing—the prisoner then enticed the prosecutor to have something to drink—I did not see him strike him—I told my husband to go and get a policeman—I kept my eye on the window till they got out of my sight—I then put on my bonnet and shawl, and went to the corner.
Cross-examined. Q. How far is your house from where the men were standing? A. I can't tell the distance; it is two houses from the court—they were standing at the corner of the court—I heard the prisoner say, "Come down, old fellow, and have something to drink, "and then I said to my husband, "I can't stand this, go and get a policeman"—after I had put on my bonnet and shawl, and gone down stairs, I went into Water-lane, between the two dung-holes, and there the prisoner knocked the old man down like a bullock—I told the bye-standers to assist him, and pointed out the prisoner.
THOMAS GRIFFITHS . I am the last witness' husband—on this morning I was sitting at the table having my breakfast—my wife was looking out at the. Window—she called me, and I saw the prisoner take a chain off the prosecutor's neck—lie held it feebly by the left-hand—the prisoner took it off, put it first in his left hand then in his right, and then shoved it into his pocket—I then put on my coat, and went down into Temple-lane, and at the end, by the dung-holes, I saw the prisoner with his hand in the prosecutor's pocket, fumbling about—I went to look for a policeman—I saw two men who said they were detectives, and I heard one of them say to the prisoner, "What have you been doing to the old man?"—the prisoner had dropped a shilling and something at the corner, and was stooping to pick it it up.
Cross-examined. Q. Did you see the prisoner strike the old man? A. No; I was looking after a policeman—the old man was standing against the wall—there was no move in him—I don't know whether he was drunk; he was silly.
WILLIAM FENN (City-policeman, 306). On Sunday morning 26t November, about half-past 9, I was at the corner of Temple-lane—Mrs. Griffiths came to me, and in consequence of what she said, I ran to the bottom of Pleydell-court, and stopped the prisoner there—I asked him what he knocked the old man down for—he said he would gouge my eye out—another officer came up, and we took him to the station—he was very violent at first—while being searched, with his left-hand, he tried to pass this piece of gold-chain over the dock—another officer seized his hand, and gave it to me—I have two pieces of chain here-one piece was picked up off the floor, close by his feet in the dock—I found 8s. 7 1/2 d. in his pocket, a gold watch, key, and a knife, and when I went down the lane, I saw the prosecutor between the two dung-holes in the act of getting up—I ran past him to go after the prisoner—he came to the station, and gave the prisoner in charge.
Cross-examined. Q. I believe, at the station, the prosecutor said be had no watch? A. Yes, at first; he afterwards said he had—he looked stupid, like a man that had been out all the previous night—the prisoner gave his correct address.
WILLIAM LEWIS (City-policeman, 358). I assisted Fenn in taking the prisoner into custody—the prosecutor said at the station that he had lost a watch and chain—in taking the prisoner to the station he said, "I know I have got the chain, but can't we square it?"—I said, "No."
Cross-examined. Q. Are you quite sure he used those words? A. Yes; he did not say, "Can the old man square it."
JOHN ASTELL GODDEN . I am a pilot, and reside at Folkestone—I have no knowledge of the prisoner previous to seeing him at the Court—on the night of 25th November, I went to the theatre—I did not see him that night—I first saw him in the morning—I left the (theatre about 12 or half-past—I am not certain when I missed my watch—this key and ring are mine.
Cross-examined. Q. I believe the prisoner had been with you all night? A. Not likely—no one had been with me—a captain of a ship had been with me, but we had parted some time—I got out of my way being a stranger in London—I strolled about—I was not in any public-house, not often—I went into the refreshment-room to have a chop—I stopped there as long as I could, and then thinking the hotel would be shut, I strolled about till the morning—my friend was not with me at the refreshment-room—I believe I had my watch safe there—I would not be certain—I missed it some time during the night, it is impossible for me to tell when; between 12 and 1, or something there about, I would not be particular—I sometimes keep it in my fob, and sometimes in my waistcoat pocket—I can't tell what caused me to miss it—I was in no company to miss it particularly—my watch has nothing to do with my chain—I believe I came here to identify my chain—I had the watch at the theatre, and after I left the theatre—I should say I met the prisoner in the morning, between 9 and 10—I am perfectly satis-fied it was not between 3 and 4—I was alone from the time I left one refreshment-room till I met him—the other two men were not with me—I must have met them at the same time I met the prisoner—I could not have met them anywhere else; they were entire strangers—the prisoner was not with me two or three hours—I was not too drunk to remember—I was not in the least drunk—the prisoner did not say anything about taking care of my chain, or he would never have snatched it off my neck—I did not want him to take it—I knew nothing of him.
JURY. Q. Do you remember at what time you wound up your watch last? A. At 8 o'clock—I generally wind it up about 8—I recollect being knocked down—I was very much hurt in the knee, and have been under medical treatment since—I have a knee-cap on now, and have to use a lotion—I believe the prisoner is the man that knocked me down—I saw him.
The prisoner received a good character.
GUILTY .— Confined Nine Months.
MR. PATER conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM WOOTTON . I am an articled clerk, and live at 17, Camden-square—about 12 or half-past, on the night of 20th November, I was in St. Martin's-lane, and saw the prisoner attempting to take a watch from the prosecutor—there were some persons standing at the corner, but they did
not seem to take any notice of it—I stepped up and caught him by the collar, and when I had my hand on his collar the watch was in his hand—he was quite sober, but he acted very cleverly, pretending to be drunk—it seemed to come on as soon as the policeman came up.
LOUIS VANDELEUR (interpreted). I am a musician, and live at 6, Church-terrace, Battersea—about half-past 12, on the night of 20th November, I was in St. Martin's-lane, and saw two men sparring together as if disputing, three or four yards from where I was passing—as I was crossing St. Martin's-lane, both the men came on me, and pushed me—I lifted up my cane to defend myself, and the one who was nearest to me seized my arms, at the same time the prisoner pulled at my watch-chain four times very violently—he pulled the watch out of my pocket, and had it in his hand—he could not break the chain; it was too strong, and it saved my watch—I was obliged to let my stick go and an umbrella that I had in the other hand—the other man ran away with it.
Prisoner. Q. I was never in prison before—I have no home—I belong to Hull.
GUILTY .— Confined Nine Months.
The following prisoners PLEADED GUILTY:—
76. GEORGE WHEELER (32) , to embezzling 11l. 1s. 6d. and 21l. 16s. the property of Peter Brasey Cow and another, his masters. The prisoner's defalcations were stated to amount to 300l.— Five Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty; see original trial image.]
77. JOHN POTTER SERGEANT (51), and JOHN SUTTON (29) , to unlawfully procuring to be forged the trade mark of John Broadwood and others, (under 25th and 26th Vic. c. 88, Sec s. 2 and 4).— Confined Two Months. [Pleaded guilty; see original trial image.]
The prisoner received a good character.— Confined Twelve Months. [Pleaded guilty; see original trial image.]
NEW COURT.—Monday, December 18th, 1865.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
The following prisoners PLEADED GUILTY to feloniously uttering counterfeit coin.—
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and COLERIDGE conducted the Prosecution.
HENRY NEWCOMB I am ten years of age, and am nephew of Mr. John Newcomb, who keeps the Rose and Crown—I do not live with him—I was there on 19th November, when the prisoner came in for a pint of beer—she gave me a florin, and I gave her in change a shilling, a sixpence, and four-pence halfpenny in copper.
JOHN NEWCOMB . I am the uncle of the last witness—on 19th November, the prisoner came for a pint of ale, which she took away in a little jug—my nephew gave me a florin—I looked at it after the prisoner had gone, and found it was bad—I afterwards gave it to a constable—the prisoner came again next day for a half-quartern of gin—my wife served her—she gave her a half-crown, which I took from her and bent—the prisoner took it and went out—I followed her and gave her in charge—I asked her for the half-crown,—she said, "No it does not belong to you"—I did not see it again—she took part of the gin.
WILLIAM WRIGHT (Policeman, F 178). I took the prisoner, told her the charge, and asked her for the half-crown in the street—she said that Mr. Newcomb took it from her—he said that he did not, but he saw it in her hand—she was searched, but nothing was found on her.
She was further charged with having been convicted of a like offence in November, 1864; to this she
PLEADED GUILTY.*— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and COLERIDGE conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM SAVAGE . I keep an oil-shop at 78, Castle-street, Kentish-town—on 26th November, about a quarter to 10 o'clock, the prisoner came in for a pot of marmalade—he gave me a florin—I bit it, found it was bad, and returned it to him—my teeth made two impressions on it—he said, "I have just taken it at the railway-station; I have just come up from the country; I will take it back and change it"—he ran out of the shop—I kept the marmalade—I afterwards spoke to my neighbour, Mr. Young, and pointed the prisoner out to him—the prisoner was brought back to the shop between 1 and 2 o'clock, by a constable, who said, "Is this the man that passed the bad two-shilling piece to you?"—I said, "It is"—he asked me if I should know it again—I said, "Yes, because I bit it"—he showed it to me, and I recognised it—this is it—I know it by the two marks of my teeth.
Prisoner. Q. Did not you say before the Magistrate that you would not positively take your oath that this was the same florin? A. I have no doubt it is the same—I did not say that I would not swear to it.
COURT. Q. Did you look at the mark after you had made it? A. No; all I can say is, that the florin has two marks on it which appear to have been made by teeth—I never saw the marks before, but my teeth could not fail to make an impression on a soft coin like that.
MR. CRAUFURD. Q. Are you sure the florin the prisoner offered you was bad? A. Yes, because it was so soft.
SUSAN BANKS . I am barmaid to my uncle, Mr. Suter, who keeps the Prince of Wales, Kentish town, two or three minutes' walk from Mr. Savage's—on 6th November, about twenty minutes to 10 o'clock, the prisoner came
in for 2d worth of brandy—he gave me a florin—I weighed it, found it was light, returned it to him, and told him it was bad—he said, "I have just come from the City, and got change for a sovereign at the railway-station; I will go back and get it changed"—he gave me a good florin—I gave him the change, and he left.
WILLIAM CUSHKIE (City-policeman, 574). On Monday, 6th November, Mr. Young pointed out the prisoner to me in Eastcheap; he was going at a rapid pace towards London-bridge—I tapped him on the shoulder near Talbot-court—I said, "You are wanted"—he said, "What for?" I said, "You will hear presently"—Mr. Young came up and charged him with passing a bad florin in Kentish-town—he made no reply—I asked him the question two or three times, and he said, "Well, I did take a bad two shilling-piece in change of a sovereign at a railway-station"—I said, "Have you got any money on you?" he said, "Yes", and produced his purse—I examined it and found 1l. 2s. 6d. in good money, and the bad florin—I said, "Well, there is a bad florin here"—he said, "Yes, that is the one I took in change at the railway-station—I did not test it; I took it to Seething-lane station—I saw him put his hands to his mouth, and distinctly afterwards, I heard a noise in his throat—I said, "What have you got in your mouth?"—he said, "It is only a crust of bread and cheese"—I said, "I do not believe it, that sounds to me like money"—the inspector directed me to seize him by the throat, which I did, and this shilling (produced) came out of his mouth into my hand—he gave me his card at the station, by which he appeared to be a provision merchant, at 58, in a road in Bayswater—I inquired at 59, and found he was there in charge of an empty house.
WILLIAM YOUNG . I am a cheesemonger, of 66, Carl ton-road, Kentish-town, next door to Mr. Savage, at 68; the numbers run odd and even—Mr. Savage pointed the prisoner out to me, and I followed him—he went into Mr. Suter's, the Prince of Wales—I spoke to Mr. Suter—the prisoner came out, and I followed him to Malden-road—he went to the Chalk-farm station, and took a ticket there—I left him on the platform, and went into the street to look for a policeman, but could not find one; hearing the bells ringing for the train to start, I ran as hard as I could to the Camden-town-station, and caught the train there—I shifted out of different carriages till 1 found the prisoner—he got out at Fenchurch-street, and I followed him into Eastcheap, where I spoke to a policeman—I have heard what the policeman has stated; it is quite correct.
Prisoner's defence. I was on my way to Eastcheap; I was not aware that it was a bad florin, or I should not have offered it; I changed a sovereign in the morning.
GUILTY. —MR. CRAUFURD stated the prisoner had just been convicted at the Surrey Sessions for stealing a cart. THE PRISONER.—I have now a petition to Sir George Grey; the man swore at the Sessions that he bought the cart of me. I shall be able to prove my innocence.— Confined Nine Months.
MR. CRAUFURD conducted the Prosecution.
CATHERINE NEWTON . I am a widow, and keep a general shop, in Gossett-street, Bethnal-green—on the 14th November, about ten minutes to six in the evening, I served the prisoner with loz. of coffee, which came to 1d.; she gave me a half-crown; I gave her two shillings and fivepence, and she left—I afterwards examined the half-crown, which I had kept by itself, and
found it was bad—I marked it on the edge with my teeth—I went to Bethnal-green Station, half an hour afterwards, and found the prisoner in custody—I charged her with uttering the half-crown—she said, "I was not in your shop at all."
Prisoner. I am innocent, and do not know where your shop is.—Witness. I am sure you are the person. I heard a description of you, in consequence of which, I went down.
SARAH FABER . My father keeps a chandler's shop, in Bethnal-green—on Tuesday evening, a little after 6 o'clock, the prisoner came in for a half-quartern loaf, which came to 3 1/4 d.—there were two gas lights in the shop, which is about two minutes' walk from Mrs. Newton's—the prisoner gave me a half-crown—I bit it—it seemed to grit—I told her it was bad—she said that she did not know it, she got it in Hackney-road, in change for a five-shilling piece—I bent it in the detector, and gave it to my mother—the prisoner gave me a good florin, and I gave her the change—my mother gave me back the bad half-crown, and I gave it to the constable.
Prisoner. I did not know it was bad.
CHRISTOPHER KEMP (Policeman, A 700). I was called, and took the prisoner—she said, "I was not aware it was bad; Mrs. Newton gave me the half-crown"—I found on the prisoner 1s. 6d. in silver, and. 3 1/4 d. good money—she had in her basket 1oz. of coffee, and some other articles—she gave a false address.
MR. WEBSTER. These half-crowns are both bad, and from the same mould.
GUILTY .— Confined Eight Months.
MR. CRAUFURD conducted the Prosecution.
GEORGE BUXEY . I keep the "Cat" beer-house, Walworth-road—on 16th October, about 12 o'clock, the prisoner came for a pint of half-and-half, which came to 3d.—he gave me 1s.—I told him it was bad—he ran out—I ran after him, caught him, and gave him in custody, with the shilling—he said, "I took it of a gentleman in the City, for carrying a box"—he gave me 2d.
Prisoner. I did not run away; you told me to go. Witness. I did not.
ROBERT JONES . I keep the "Boar's Head", Cannon-street—on 29th November, about 8 in the evening, the prisoner came, and my barmaid served him with a glass of ale—he put down a florin, which was handed to me—I told him it was bad, and I should give him in custody—he paid with coppers—I gave him in charge—I had had two or three utterings a day for three weeks or a month before, but have not had one since—I had never seen the prisoner before.
MR. WEBSTER. This florin is bad.
Prisoner's Defence. I took the florin for selling 3 small copybooks and 2 quires of paper.
GUILTY .— Confined Six Months.
MR. CRAUFURD conducted the Prosecution, and MR. WILLIAMS the Defence.
WILLIAM CLARKE . I work for Mr. Sidwell, a market-gardener at Stone-wall—on 21st November I went to Covent-garden with a cart of turnips—the prisoner and a woman came up to me there—I sold them a dozen turnips for 2s.—the prisoner gave me a half-sovereign—I gave him the change, 2 half-crowns and 3 shillings—I saw the prisoner give the woman a half-crown—she then said, "I will not have them, they are not so good as I thought they were"—she gave me 2 half-crowns and 3 shillings back, and an old lady, who stood by, said, "One of those is bad"—the prisoner then ran towards Russell-street, and the woman towards the flower-market, leaving the change in my possession—the policeman took the half-crowns from my hand, and one of them was bad—it was not one of those I had given the prisoner—I had no other half-crowns.
Cross-examined. Q. At what time was it? A. Eight o'clock in the morning—I tried the half-crowns, when a gentleman gave them to me, with a shilling, half an hour before—I bit them—I had taken no other money that morning—I tried the 3 shillings a second time when I gave them to the woman—I am sure the prisoner gave the woman a half-crown before she returned the money to me—the market was very dull.
THOMAS SMITH (Policeman, F 160). I was on duty in Russell-street, saw the prisoner running, stopped him—Clarke was following him—I took him back to Clarke's cart, who gave me this half-crown (produced)—the prisoner said that he knew nothing about it—a half-crown, 6 shillings, and a halfpenny were found on him.
MR. WEBSTER. This half-crown is bad.
GUILTY . He then
PLEADED GUILTY to a former conviction of a like offence, in October, 1857, when he was sentenced to four years' penal servitude; it was further stated that a desperate attempt to rescue him was made as he entered Newgate .—Ten Years' Penal Servitude.
MESSRS. CRAUFURD and COLERIDGE conducted the Prosecution.
GEORGE NAYER . I am in the employ of Messrs. Locock, & Co. Cutlers, of Cornhill—on 18th November, about 1 o'clock, the prisoner came for a sixpenny nail-trimmer—she gave me a crown—I bent it in a vice with my thumb—I told her it was bad, and asked her if she had any more like it—she said, "I have no other money; if you doubt it, I will take it to a jeweller's and test it"—I said, "You need not trouble yourself, I will take it to a policeman and test it, "upon which she walked out—I directed our porter to follow her—I had returned it to her—I saw it again at the Mansion-house two or three days afterwards.
JAMES MERIDEN . I am porter to Messrs. Locock—I followed the prisoner—she joined a tall man in Mansion-house place—I cannot say that they spoke, but she walked by his side—he was much taller than she, but he did not stoop his head—they walked to Bucklersbury—I gave her in charge for attempting to pass a bad crown—she said that she was an unfortunate girl—she made a sweep to the right in Pancras-lane, and when she got to a sink, she stooped and put something down the grating—the man was also taken to the station.
WILLIAM WATTS . I am in the employ of the Commissioners of Sewers—on 18th November, I went with Jenkins to take up a grating in Pancras-lane, and found a crown lying under the ventilating shaft, which has a grating at the top.
THOMAS JENKINS (City-policeman, 491). Meriden gave the prisoner into my charge, and I took her and a man to the station—I said to the prisoner "Where is the crown?"—she said nothing—Merdien drew my attention to a grating, but I did not see the prisoner do anything there—as I had charge of the man, I said to him, "I shall take you on suspicion of being concerned with the female"—he said, "I know nothing about it; I only met her casually"—2d. and a purse was found on him—he was remanded for one day, and then discharged—I did not see the crown found, but Watts brought it up, and handed it to me.
NOT GUILTY .
OLD COURT.—Tuesday, December 19th, 1865.
Before Mr. Recorder.
93. RICHARD WALLER (27) , Stealing, on 15th September, a bracelet of Samuel Nathan—two other Counts for stealing a bracelet, a brooch, and a pair of ear-rings on 16th September, and a bracelet and 2 shirt pins on 4th November.
MR. F. H. LEWIS conducted the Prosecution, and MR. SLEIGH the Defence.
SAMUEL LEWIS NATHAN . I carry on business as a wholesale jeweller and watchmaker, 6, John-street, Bedford-row—I have known the prisoner for some years—in April, 1864, he was selling goods for me on commission—he remained with me on those terms, till August, 1865—an arrangement was then made that every month we were to have a settlement of the accounts; that he was to return the goods that were unsold, and the goods that were sold were to be entered accordingly—I could not get any settlement from him of the goods that were unsold; but a fresh arrangement was made—before entering into that new arrangement, he tendered to me a number of deposit notes and other things for the goods which he did not return—he said the goods were in pledge at Mr. Allison's—about 136l.'s worth of goods were unaccounted for, and l,128l.'s worth in respect of which I held the deposit notes—it was at Mr. Lewis's office that the new arrangement was made.
MR. SLEIGH. Q. Was the arrangement, whatever it was, reduced to writing? A. I do not recollect that it was, I never saw it—there was some mention made that an arrangement was to be drawn up, but I believe it never was drawn up—I cannot call to mind that an arrangement was read to me by Messrs. Lewis in the presence of the prisoner—I believe an arrangement was drawn up, which was submitted to me, and was returned to Messrs. Lewis; but it was never signed, and I never saw it afterwards.
MR. LEWIS. Q. What verbal arrangement was come to between you and the prisoner? A. That I was to allow him to have goods to sell for me in my name, to be invoiced on my invoices, and entered in books kept on my premises—I told him that he was to consider himself my servant, to have the stock every morning, and return it again at night—that was the substance of the agreement—books were kept at my office for the purpose, in which the prisoner was in the habit of making entries, night by night—I remember the prisoner speaking to me about a diamond bracelet that had been pledged by him at Crawford's, in Lucas-street—it was towards the end
of October—it was a portion of the goods that he had received before he entered into the new arrangement—he said that if I would redeem that bracelet, he thought he had a good chance of selling it—I did redeem it, and I also handed him a pair of turquoise and diamond ear-rings to sell with it—they represented part of the new stock—he brought the ear-rings, but not the bracelet, and said that he had shown the ear-rings to Mr. Johnson, of Threadneedle-street, that he admired them very much, and would have purchased them as ear-rings, but one of the young men put one of them into his scarf, and it looked so pretty as a pin, that if I would have them converted into pins, he would give me 40l. for them, and 30l. for the bracelet—I said, "Very well, I will accept the offer"—I had the ear-rings converted into pins, and they were given to the prisoner to take to Mr. Johnson's, about 4th November—I cannot call to mind whether the prisoner returned that evening; but in Oxford-street I asked him once or twice whether he had delivered the ear-rings to Mr. Johnson, and he said "Yes"—here is an entry in the day-book of 4th November, 1865, in the prisoner's writings, "Mr. Johnson, Threadneedle-street, 2 brilliant and turquose pins, 40l.; one brilliant enamelled horse-shoe bracelet, 30l."—in the ledger I find Mr. Johnson's name also carried forward, in the prisoner's writing, as a debtor to the amount of 70l.—Mr. Johnson had not previously been any customer of mine—about the 16th November, I saw Mr. Johnson, and, in consequence of what he told me, I saw the prisoner—I had before that consulted my solicitor, and I saw the prisoner in his presence, and in the presence of Mr. Buchanan, the prisoner's solicitor, or his clerk—I asked him, if he had sold that bracelet and pins to Mr. Johnson, of Threadneedle-street; after a little hesitation, he said, "No, Sir, I have not; but I have sold them to somebody else; I have received the money for them, and have appropriated it to my own use, and now you may do what you like—it was not said defiantly, but almost despairingly—I then asked him about the sale of a bracelet to Mr. Moses, in Oxford-street—I found an entry in the prisoner's handwriting on 15th September, 1865, of a carbuncle and brilliant bracelet, value 20l., sold to Mr. Moses, of Oxford-street, and he is also brought forward in the same way, as a debtor, in the ledger—I asked the prisoner if he had sold the bracelet to Mr. Moses—he said "No, Sir"—I then gave him into custody—I found an entry on 16th September, of a turquoise suite and case for twelve guineas, sold to Mr. Bennett, of Blackheath—that was also carried forward in the ledger—I did not ask the prisoner as to that—these (produced) are the ear-rings—I have not been able to hear of the other property—this letter is in the prisoner's writing—I received it after I had instituted proceedings before the Lord Mayor, (read)—"Sir, I once more ask you to have mercy, not for me, but for my poor little children; if you will only withdraw, I will do all in my power to refund, and assist you—do, for heaven's sake, release; I have suffered much, and without benefiting you one farthing; do not refuse my prayer, or my only comfort on earth will not survive the blow."
Cross-examined. Q. You knew him when he was carrying on business on his own account, and bearing an irreproachable character? A. I knew him when he was a shopman at Hastings—I believe he bore an irreproachable character up to the time of his entering into business relations with me—while he was selling goods on commission for me he also carried on business on his own account, at 9, Hatton Garden—I think he had his name on the door—he was trading on his own account—besides the deposit notes that he handed to me he also handed me bills of exchange, accepted by his relations to the amount of somewhere about 500l.—he did not hand me a bill of exchange
of Mr. Benson's in payment of the jewellery he had been selling—he never offered me a bill of Mr. Benson's, or of any other person—he did not tell me he had received one—I did not know that the ear-rings were sold to Mr. Benson—I had not the remotest idea where they were sold, till afterwards—he might have mentioned that he had received a bill of exchange from Mr. Benson, but he never offered it to me—he asked me one day if I would take Mr. Benson's bill in part payment, and I said no, I did not care about it I wanted the money—that was after the new arrangement and after the sale of the pins to Mr. Johnson—it was not in payment of that that he offered me the bill—he never came to my office, told me he got the bill discounted, and handed me the proceeds, 40l.—all the moneys that were handed over to me are entered in the cash-book, in his own handwriting—he paid me 59l. 2s. on the 4th November, but nothing referring to these particular things—it was made up with small items—this includes the whole of the amount he paid me—it amounts to about 190l.—he paid me a sum of 28l. 10s. in a lump—this sum of 59l. 2s. was handed over to me in one sum—this sum did not include the ear-rings or the bracelet—they are for other goods—it was to be paid by the proceeds of the sales, not by a commission—he was to reduce the old debt by the proceeds of the sales—I had redeemed the property which had been previously pledged, and intrusted it to him to sell, and by that means he was to reduce the former debt till it was discharged—he would be paid a salary—there was none agreed on that I remember, or any fixed commission—he was to be my servant to make the entries in the day-book, every day, of goods sold, and to enter the cash received, and to return the goods every night that were not sold—he was not to sell these goods for the best prices he could obtain—they were marked at my selling prices, and he was to sell them at that price, and was to hand over to me the whole of the cash he received—it was not until the old debt should be liquidated that he was to receive a salary, but in the meantime he was carrying on his own business—he filed a petition in bankruptcy and came to announce that fact to Mr. Lewis the very afternoon that I gave him into custody—I happened to be at Mr. Lewis's office when he came to say that he had made himself a bankrupt, and I then put the question to him whether he had sold those goods to Mr. Johnson.
COURT. Q. Before this new arrangement you had given him various goods to sell on commission? A. I had—he had pledged those goods with different parties—the debt I speak of consists of the value of those goods—I redeemed those goods at my own expense—they were to be subsequently sold, and the items as received were to go against that amount—besides that there were other goods which are the subject of this Indictment—they were given to him to sell on my account.
GEORGE HENRY LEWIS . I was acting as solicitor to Mr. Nathan—the arrangement between Mr. Nathan and the prisoner was entered into in my presence, and it was this: the prisoner was then indebted to Mr. Nathan about 13,000l. or 14,000l., and the arrangement was that he was to hand to Mr. Nathan certain deposit notes, with reference to property Mr. Nathan had supplied to him—he also handed to Mr. Nathan certain bills of exchange to the amount of about 500l., and he then asked Mr. Nathan not to take any proceedings against him in respect of those transactions, and that he would act for him as a servant, and sell the goods so in pawn if Mr. Nathan would redeem them, and any further goods from Mr. Nathan's stock—I said to the defendant at the time, "Mr. Waller, understand that Mr. Nathan will have nothing further to do with you, excepting on the express understanding that you act in the character of his servant; and in
the event of your misappropriating any portion of his property, you will be prosecuted, for I explain to you that it will be a stealing"—he said, after the kindness and indulgence he had received from Mr. Nathan, he might be perfectly certain that in no way in the world would he do anything except to try to reduce the large debt that he owed to him—some weeks before he was given into custody, from what Mr. Nathan had communicated to me, I sent for the defendant, and said, "Mr. Waller, Mr. Nathan hat reason to believe that two chains that you represented as being in the possession of Mr. Gill, I think it was, or Mr. Dobree, a pawnbroker in the Hampstead-road, for sale, have not been left there"—he said, "They have been left there, and I am willing to go with Mr. Nathan at once, and prove to him that the goods are there"—I then said, "Mr. Waller, understand distinctly that if any one of the goods you received from Mr. Nathan is misappropriated, you are guilty of stealing it"—he said, "Mr. Lewis, I am perfectly aware of that fact; I should act very ungratefully to Mr. Nathan if I did anything of that kind, and I assure you that the entries in his books with reference to the property sold are true and correct entries"—Mr. Nathan said, "You know, Mr. Waller, that all the goods you sold on my account were to be sold on my invoices"—he said, "Mr. Nathan, they have all been sold on your invoices with one exception, an exception that you know of"—on the day he was given into custody Mr. Nathan made a communication to me—I was returning to my own office with Mr. Nathan, and met the defendant in Hatton-garden—he was crying—he said to me, "Mr. Lewis, I have made myself a bankrupt to-day"—I said, "You must come into my office"-at that moment his solicitor, Mr. Buchanan, or his clerk, passed, and I asked him to come in with me, when the conversation to which Mr. Nathan alluded took place.
Cross-examined. Q. I think you did not give this evidence at the Mansion-house? A. I did not.
RICHARD JOHNSON . I am a jeweller, of Threadneedle-street—the prisoner did not bring me a diamond bracelet in November, or at any other time, or leave it with me—I have heard the diamond bracelet described—I did not give him any order for converting turquoise and diamond ear-rings into pins—the prisoner called upon me in November with a diamond and turquoise pin—it was one of these produced—it was at the beginning of November—he merely showed it me—it was a pin then, not an ear-ring—I said I did not want anything, I did not want to open any further account—I said they were very pretty—I had never seen him before.
WILLIAM HENRY HUGHES . I am in the service of Mr. Benson, a watch-maker, of Ludgate-hill—on 4th November I purchased these two pins, on Mr. Benson's account, of the prisoner for 40l.—this is the invoice (Read: "To Mr. Benson, two bracelet and turquoise pins, 40l., from R. Walker and Co. manufacturing jewellers, 9, Hatton-garden, Holborn. Received, R. Walker, 4/10/65 ") that must be a mistake; it was in November.
Cross-examined. Q. I believe Mr. Benson gave him a bill of exchange for the amount? A. Yes, drawn by himself—he had been a customer of the prisoner's on a previous occasion; not a customer of Mr. Nathan's.
ALFRED WILLIAM GILBERT . I am assistant to Mr. Bennett, of Black-heath—I did not buy any goods of the prisoner to the amount of twelve guineas—I do not know him—I never bought a turquoise bracelet of him.
COURT. Q. Are you the only person there, does Mr. Bennett carry on business himself? A. Yes—he is not here.
MR. SLEIGH to MR. NATHAN. Q. When the prisoner handed to you the deposit notes, upon the arrangement in August, did not he also hand you deposit notes in reference to some property of his own? A. That I cannot tell, because I have not seen the property; the pawnbrokers have refused to produce it—I don't know whether it is so or not—what I redeemed was my own property, which the prisoner had pledged.
MR. SLEIGH submitted that the relation of master and servant did not exist in this case, and therefore, the offence was not embezzlement. And, further, that it did not amount to larceny, as the prisoner was in business on his own account.
THE RECORDER ruled that as the prisoner had received specific directions to take a portion of the goods to a particular person, and he did not do so, it was for the Jury to say whether at the time he received them he had the intention of misappropriating them. The prisoner received a good character from Mr. Moore, jeweller, of Hastings, his former employer.
GUILTY .—Strongly recommended to mercy by the Jury, believing he had no means of obtaining a living, in consequence of the arrangement made with the prosecutor. The prosecutor stated the amount of the prisoner's deficiences at about 1,600l.,— Judgment Respited.
MESSRS. METCALFE and PATTESON conducted the Prosecution.
MARY ANN FIELDER . I am assistant to the postmaster at Shepherd's Bush—on 23d November I made out this order, No. 309, for 2l. 13s.—I afterwards made out the letter of advice; M.P. Hurry is the remitter—it is made payable at the Vere-street post-office—I gave the order to the person applying for it—I posted the letter of advice by the one o'clock post on the 23d; a letter posted before ten in the morning would be forwarded to Vere-street by the ten o'clock post—made up the mail bag, and dispatched it before ten by the mail cart.
REBECCA CLARK . I reside at St. Stephen's Home, Shepherd's Bush—on 23d November I went to the post-office at Shepherd's Bush, for a post-office money order—this is it (produced)—I enclosed that in a letter with an account to Mr. Potter similar to this, in the name of Miss Hurry, who resides in the same establishment—after enclosing it I fastened the letter and put it into the post-office at Shepherd's Bush, about a quarter before ten—the letter was addressed to Mr. Potter, South Molton-street—there was sixpenny-worth of stamps in the letter—when I enclosed the order there was no signature to it; not on the money order.
THOMAS POTTER . I am an engineer of South Molton-street—In November Miss Hurry was endebted to me 2l. 13s.—I never received that post-office order, or any letter containing it or alluding to it, or the bill, or the postage stamps—this signature on the order is not mine, or written by my authority.
RICHARD JAMES WATTS REED . I am clerk in the money-order department in Vere-street—this letter of advice arrived at the post-office in Vere-street on 23d November, authorising me to pay 2l. 13s. to T. Potter—the remitter was M.P. Hurry—that was presented for payment on the 24th, by a person representing himself to be Mr. Thomas Potter the order was receipted when it was brought to me—precisely in the same state in which it is now—the person who presented it gave the name of the remitter—he
gave two Christian names which I had not; they corresponded with the initials.
JOHN THOMPSON . I am a letter-carrier in the service of the General Post-office—I live at 6, Crown-street, Soho—I know the prisoner—he was some short time ago a letter-carrier in the same office with me, at the Chief office, E. C.—he was at one time at the Western office—he called on me on the 24th November about it—besides being a letter-carrier, I am a ladies' shoemaker—I was cutting out a pair of boots, and I said, "I do not know what to do with this, "and he takes from his pocket a book and said, "What am I to do with this?" and gave me this money-order—I said, "Go and get it cashed" he said, "I do not like to, because they know me there, working there"—he said, "I will give you or any one else five shillings to go and get it—I said "If they know you they know me," because we walked together both on one walk, Piccadilly—I did not notice the name at the moment, because I was engaged—ultimately I took the order, looked at it, and said, "This is made payable in the name of Potter; your name is Manning"—the name of Potter was there then, and I saw it was made payable at the Vere-street post-office—I said, "I should not give five shillings to go and get this cashed, you have been dismissed the office, go and get it yourself; I should be proud to show the order, to show I had friends to send me this money after being dismissed"—he said, "If I get the money I will come back and treat you"—I said, "How is it that it is signed in the name of Potter?"—he said, "It is a betting transaction, and the man knows me by that name"—it often struck me there was something wrong—I had to be on duty just before 2, and I mentioned it to the inspector at the office—the prisoner was sent for next day—I was at Mr. Peacock's office "when be came in—he looked at me and said, "If you have turned informer I will do you an injury"—then the constable took me into the next room.
HENRY BINGHAM . On 23d November I went to the prisoner's lodgings, 68, Fetter-lane—I found him there—I told him I wanted to know where he got the order for 2l. 13s. which he had shown to Thompson the previous day—he said he should not tell me then, he should tell me at the proper place—I took him to the Post-office, into a room where the last witness was sitting—he sat down close against him—I saw they were having conversation together, and I went up to him—I heard the words, "I will do you a serious injury," and I immediately removed Thompson to the next room—an order was shown to the prisoner, he said that was the order that he had shown to Thompson the previous day—he was asked where he got it from, he said he picked it up between two and three o'clock on the previous day, as he was crossing Hyde Park—he said it was in a portemonnaie with some stamps in it—he said after he left Thompson he went to a public house called the Hibernian, in Compton-street, Soho—he there saw a respectable man and he gave it to him—he was then asked what time it was that he was at Thompson's house—he said between twelve and one. After being questioned further as to his not finding the order till three o'clock, he said, "I have made a mistake as to time, it must have been about twelve o'clock when I found the order"—he then said that it was at the corner of Duke-street and Oxford-street that he picked it up, and that when he gave the order to the man at the public house it was not signed—he was searched—I did not find any portemonnaie or any stamps—he said he had been out that night and got drunk—he was out till four o'clock the next morning—he could not give any account of the portemonnaie.
Prisoner. Q. Did not I say I had lost it? A. I believe he did say so
after a time—he did not know what he had done with it; he went out and had got drunk—he was severely questioned about the letter, but he could not give any account of it more than he did not know; he supposed he lost it.
Prisoner's Defence. I wish to state that I found a portemonnaie and some stamps and a little silver in it; in the first instance I had some thoughts of making use of it, but thought better of it and gave it to a man at the Hibernian, to take to Vere-street to see if he could get anything for me; that is all I know about it. I do not know the man's name; I only knew him by sight. I never presented it and never endorsed it, and had nothing further to do with it; placed in the position in which I was many would have done as I thought of doing. I had left the Post-office six months and was in a starving condition, and my wife just on the point of being confined.
GUILTY of receiving.— Judgment Respited.
In this case THE RECORDER entertained a doubt whether, if the prisoner's story was true and he really found the order, it would amount to larceny: the question for the Jury, therefore, was, whether they were satisfied that his story was untrue. (See Reg v. Moore, vol. iii. p. 61.)
MR. METCALFE and MR. MOIR conducted the Prosecution.
JOHN GARDNER . I am one of the senior clerks in the General Post-office—the prisoner was employed as clerk at Mr. Hollis's receiving house in Mount-street—in consequence of receiving some information respecting him, on 13th December, about twenty minutes past one o'clock, I enclosed 120 postage-stamps in a letter, addressed, "Miss Eliza Collins, 5, Roupell-street, Lambeth"—I secured the envelope with an adhesive gum seal and handed it to Mr. Clare to post at the Mount-street receiving house—that letter if posted before two, according to my instructions, should have reached the Western District office, in Vere-street, at twenty minutes past two—I then went to the Vere-street office, and was there when the collection was brought in—I examined the letters, but did not find this one—I waited at the Vere-street office until the three o'clock collection arrived—Mr. Clare was with me—I examined that collection also and it was not there—I afterwards went to Mount-street with Mr. Clare, and Rumbold and Bingham, the officers—I there saw the prisoner—I showed him the letter bill (produced), that is the two o'clock dispatch from Mount-street, and asked him if he had made up the two o'clock collection—he said, "Yes"—I said, "Did you have any one to assist you in clearing the letter-box?"—he said, "No"—I said, "Then you made up the collection entirely yourself?"—he said, "Yes"—I told him that a letter containing postage stamps addressed to Miss Eliza Collins, Roupell-street, Lambeth, was missing, and asked him if he knew anything about it; he said he did not—I then asked him where he kept his postage stamps—he partly drew a drawer from out of the desk in the office—I took possession of that drawer, and requested the prisoner to accompany Rumbold, which he did, to a private room, belonging to the letter receiver—I then said to the prisoner, placing my hand on the drawer, "Where did you get all these postage stamps from?—he said, "I received them of Mr. Hollis this morning"—I said, "All of them? now be particular"—he said, "Yes, I received them from Mr. Hollis, except half-a-crown's worth, which I purchased of a person who presented them at the window"—I said, "About what time?"—he said, "About half-past twelve or a quarter to one, as near
as I can guess"—in the drawer were thirty-two pieces of penny postage stamps of the value of one shilling each, and some smaller pieces of sixpence each—I examined those thirty-two pieces, and selected from them seven pieces, value one shilling each, as those I had enclosed in the letter in question—there were 120 in all—in another portion of the drawer I found 2s. 6d. worth of loose stamps—I told the prisoner that all those stamps had come out of the letter addressed to Miss Collins, and asked how he accounted for the possession of them—he said, "Well, sir, I cannot account for them"—I then requested him to accompany Rumbold and Bingham to his lodging, and went myself to the district office in Vere-street—they returned with the prisoner in about half an hour, and Bingham produced ten penny postage stamps—I said to the prisoner, "These postage stamps have been found at your lodging by the police-officer, where did you get them from?"—the prisoner replied, "I bought six of them from the till at dinner time, and left sixpence for them"—I said, "What time was that?"—he said, "About ten minutes to two o'clock"—(this must have been about five o'clock)—I then examined them, and identified six of them as those enclosed in the letter; those made up the number—I told him they had come out of the letter, and asked where he got them from—he said, "I can only account for them by buying them before I left"—he was then given into custody.
WILLIS CLARK . I am an inspector of letter-carriers in the General Post-office—this letter addressed to Miss Collins was given to me by Mr. Gardner—I posted it about twenty minutes before two, at the Mount-street post-office—I knew for what purpose it was going, and particularly noted the time.
HENRY RUMBOLD . I am a police officer, attached to the General Post-office—on 13th December I accompanied Mr. Gardner to Mount-street, and saw the prisoner there in the post-office—after some conversation between the prisoner and Mr. Gardner we all went into a private room—I there searched the prisoner, and found four sovereigns, two half-sovereigns, two florins, sixpence, and threepence in coppers, and some letters addressed to himself at 22, Berners-street, 5l. 4s. 9d. altogether—Bingham and Mr. Clare then went to 22, Berners-street, and I went with them, with the prisoner in my custody—I did not go into the house—the prisoner pointed out the house—he had given me his address—we stopped in a cab a short distance off—we then went back to the office of the Western District.
Prisoner. Q. Did you find any stamps on my person? A. No; nor the envelope addressed to Miss Collins.
HENRY BINGHAM . I am a police constable, attached to the Post-office—I went to Berners-street in the cab with the prisoner—I searched a back room in the house, a sort of office; there was a desk there—I found ten penny postage stamps in a small drawer there, also some letters addressed to himself—I went back to the district office, and placed the stamps on the table before Mr. Gardner.
FREDERICK HEMMINGHAM . I am nephew to Mr. Hollis, who keeps the receiving house in Mount street—the prisoner has been about six weeks in his employment—on 13th December he was employed there in the post-office—the post-office is partitioned off from the shop by a door—a letter posted at twenty minutes to two ought to go out at two o'clock—I believe no one was assisting the prisoner at the two o'clock delivery—I was not in the shop at the time—I saw the prisoner at six or ten minutes after two—I then took his place in the post-office, and he left to go to dinner—I took
charge of the office at that time—I did not see any letter addressed to "Miss Collins—I sold some stamps from the drawer; I did not place any in the drawer.
COURT. Q. How many did you sell from the drawer? A. About six shillings' worth; that was between two and three o'clock, after the prisoner had left—when he came back I left the office and he took my place.
WILLIAM MORRIS . I am assistant to Mr. Hollis and have been so for twenty-one years—I was in the shop the whole of the time between one and two o'clock on the day in question—the prisoner was at his post the whole of that time, shut in the post-office by himself—no one was with him—he was there alone from twenty minutes to two until two, or a few minutes past—nobody went in there at all—he dispatched the letters—the stamps are supplied to the prisoner in the morning—he has to account for so much money or so much in stamps every evening.
Prisoner's Defence. No letter of any description was found in my possession; with regard to the six postage stamps found at my lodging there is a gentleman who will, no doubt, substantiate what I say. I have been in the habit of corresponding with a gentleman at Liverpool, in whose service I was for three years, and I used a great many postage stamps; I took the stamps, but, of course, I paid for them. On my return that afternoon I commenced my duties again, and in case any postage stamps are presented at the window it is my duty to buy them; whether it is my duty or not I have done it, and have paid the money out of the till; that is the only way in which I can account for these coming into my possession; if I had taken the stamps out of the drawer and appropriated them there must have been so much money over. I can account for every penny that I had in my possession; I had received 7l. 5s. 3d. on account of the gentleman at Liverpool, out of which I had expended 2l.15s. 10d., 1l. leaving 4l. 9s. 5d.; only 15s. 4d. of it was my own money, it was what I had to account for to the honorary secretary of a society, held at 22, Berners-street.
Robert Southey, Esq. of Ely-place, solicitor, deposed to the prisoner's good character.— Five Years' Penal Servitude [No verdict located for this case. It has been assumed that the prisoner was found GUILTY , given the punishment he received; see original trial image] .
99. JAMES JOHNSTONE (21), and JAMES KELLY (54) , to feloniously breaking and entering the shop of John Walker, and stealing 2 watches, his property.— [Pleaded guilty; see original trial image.] JOHNSTONE— Confined Eighteen Months. KELLY**— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
MR. PATER conducted the Prosecution.
HENRY SEWELL . I live in Backchurch-lane, St. George's, and am a labourer—on Saturday night, about 11 o'clock, I was at the corner of Backchurch-lane, and met the two prisoners—the elder one stopped me, and asked if I would treat him with a bottle of ginger-beer—I said I would if I could get it—we went to a shop, but it was closed—he then asked if I would give him some potatoes—I said, "Yes, and welcome"—we went to a fish and potato shop; what they had came to 3d. and I paid for it—I then wished them "Good-night," and was going home—the elder prisoner asked me if I would go any further—I said, "No"—he then upset me, pushed me down, and the younger one picked my pockets of two half-crowns and a shilling, which was all I had, except a few shillings in my waistcoat-pocket—they said they were hard up—I was sober—I had just come from my work.
NATHAN NICHOLAS (Policeman, E 36). On this Saturday night, I heard cries, ran up and saw the prosecutor bleeding from the face—he had been cut over the eye—in consequence of what he told me, I went down Connaught-place, and found the prisoners standing in a dark door-way there—I said, "What are you doing there?"—the younger one said, "We have not robbed the man, governor; we have not got his money"—I said, "I did not say you had"—the elder one was eating a potato at the time—I said, "Come back, and we will see"—I had left my brother constable in charge of the prosecutor at the top of the court—I brought the prisoners to him, and he said, "They are the two fellows, the big one knocked me down, and held me, while the little one took my money out of my pocket"—the younger prisoner said, "1 did not rob you,' and the elder one said, "I did not knock you down"—the prosecutor was quite sober.
JOHN LEARY,— GUILTY .— Confined Eighteen Months.
JOHN LEARY,JUN.— GUILTY .— Confined Twelve Months.
101. GEORGE COLE (32) , Feloniously and by force taking away one Mary Ann Humphreys, a child under the age of fourteen, from the care of her parents, with intent to deprive them of her possession. Two other Counts, for taking her away by fraud, and detaining her.
MR. POLAND conducted the Prosecution.
MARY ANN HUMPHREYS . I am nine years old, and live at 18, St. Mary Axe, with my father and mother—I go to school in High-street, Aldgate, at a day school—I go at 9 in the morning, and stay till 12—on a Monday in November, I went to school at 9 o'clock, and went home to dinner—a man spoke to me in the street—this is him, (Pointing to the prisoner)—he said, "If you will come along with me, I will buy you a doll"—I went with him—he took hold of my hand, and took me a long way—I wanted to go home—he said he would take me home—he took me to a coffee-shop—it was late at night—we had been walking about in the streets in the meantime—I slept along with a little girl that night; the landlady's daughter—I don't know where it was—next morning I got up and had my breakfast—the prisoner gave it me—he took me out and about that day, about the streets—the next night, Tuesday, I slept at a public-house along with a little girl—I don't know what time it was when I went to bed—it was late—I had breakfast next morning—I did not have any dinner that day—the next night, Wednesday, I slept at a coffee-shop again, the one I was at on the Monday—I slept with the little girl again—on Friday, I slept at a public-house—I spoke to the prisoner about going home during these days, and he said be would take me home—he did not—he said my mother was
in the workhouse, and my father was dead—he did not do anything to me at any time.
Prisoner. I never saw the girl before she was brought to the Court.
MARIA HUMPHREYS . I am the wife of Edward Humphreys, of 18, St. Mary Axe—the little child just examined is my daughter—she was nine years old on the 2d of June last—she lives at home with me—she was in the habit of going to a day-school in Duke-street, Aldgate—that is hardly ten minutes' walk from our place—on Monday, 20th November, she went to school as usual, about 8 o'clock in the morning—she ought to have come home to dinner about 12, but she did not return at all that day—I heard nothing more of her till the next Sunday—in consequence of some information I went to the London Hospital, and found her there—I do not know the prisoner—it was not by my consent that he kept her away from the Monday till the Saturday.
JOHANNA LEE . I am the wife of Michael Lee, and live at 36, Flower and Dean-street, Spitalfields—it is a common lodging-house, kept by Mr. Mitchell—I have assisted him there for a good many years—I know the prisoner—he came to the lodging-house on Saturday, 25th November, at very nearly 11 o'clock at night—the little girl was with him—he asked me for a double bed, that is a bed for two persons—I said, "You shall not have a double bed—you shall have a bed to yourself, and the little girl can sleep with Mrs. Daley"—I said, "Where is this child's mother?"—he said, "Her mother is my sister, and she is very ill in the workhouse"—I said, "You have nothing to do with this child, I am sure,' and the people there said they were sure the child was too respectable for him to have anything to do with, and they pitched into him, and pulled him about—he got out and got away, and left the child there—after he had gone she became stupefied—we thought it right to send her to the Loudon Hospital—some of the lodgers tried to find her parents—had known the prisoner before, and am quite sure he is the man.
MRS. HUMPHREYS (re-examined). I was never in the workhouse.
THOMAS OSBORN . I live at 9, William-street, Dean-street, Bethnal-green—I was at the lodging-house in Flower and "Dean-street, on this Saturday night, and saw the prisoner come there with this little girl—I heard him ask for a double bed—Mrs. Lee would not let him have it—I was not one of those that pitched into him.
PATRICK DOVE . I am a house-surgeon at the London Hospital—on Sunday morning, 26th November, the child was brought there—she was then in a state of extreme stupidness, approaching stupor—I was unable at that time to tell what caused it—she vomited—I examined the vomit—I was not able to trace that anything wrong had been given to her—I was under the impression that the drowsiness was probably caused from fatigue and want of food—I examined her person, being told that an assault had been committed upon her, but I found no evidence of an assault.
FRANCIS ROBINS (Policeman, H 119). I took the prisoner into custody on Tuesday night, the 28th, about 11, in Spitalfields—I told him he was charged with an indecent assault—he said he knew nothing at all about it, all he knew about it was, taking her to this lodging-house; he had nothing to do with her; he had no connexion with her whatever; and that if he got six months it would serve him right for what he had done.
Prisoner. There was nothing said till we got to the station, and then you told the inspector that I said I deserved six months. Witness. No, you said it on the way to the station—you were given into custody by a man and a woman—Mrs. Laing was the woman.
ELIZABETH LAING . I was at the lodging-house on the night in question—I know the prisoner—he is the man who came there with the little girl—some of the people pitched into him; I did not—I afterwards pointed him out to the constable, and he was taken into custody.
Prisoner's Defence. I am innocent of the crime. On the day the child was lost I was down at Bromley, six or seven miles away from the neighbourhood. I was at work at the docks on the Tuesday and Wednesday, and on the Thursday, Friday, and Saturday, I did nothing. I was not out of my shop; I could have had plenty of witnesses, if I could have gone down to Bromley to the people that I served there, but I don't know their names.
GUILTY on the last two Counts.— Confined Eighteen Months.
NEW COURT.—Tuesday, December 19th 1865.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
102. JOHN DUNCAN (15) , Feloniously forging and uttering an order for the payment of 75l. with intent to defraud; and HENRY GARRETT (21), and JOHN BUCKLEY (21), soldiers, feloniously harbouring the said John Duncan.
THE MESSRS. SLEIGH conducted the Prosecution;MR. DALEY defended Duncan and Garrett.
HUBERT AUGUSTUS HARPOUR . I am a clerk in the London and West-minster Bank, Whitechapel Branch—on 1st October I cashed this cheque (produced) for 75l. over the counter—I gave the cash in gold, I do not know to whom.
JOSEPH CONTE . I am a cork-manufacturer, of 17, James-street, Aldgate—the prisoner was in my service at 7s. a week—I keep an account at the London and Westminster Bank, Eastern Branch-none of these four cheques (produced) is in my writing, nor was either of them signed by my authority or knowledge—I missed five blank cheques from my cheque-book on 25th October—the book was kept in a drawer in the desk—I used to give the prisoner the book to go to the bank, and cheques which I received from my customers—I know his writing—I cannot tell whether the statement (produced) is in his writing.
Cross-examined. Q. Was the drawer locked? A. No—I had no one else in my employ.
CHARLES CONTE . I am a son of the last witness—on the morning that the prisoner last appeared I told him that my father had gone to the bank; he then disappeared, and I did not see him again—this statement is in his writing, and the body of these cheques also—I do not know whose writing the signatures are in; one of them is a very good imitation of my father's writing; the others are not. (A portion of the statement was here read, it was headed, "A true statement of how I got the money and what I did with it, and where I bought the things. John Duncan, 7/11/65." It stated that a young man who had not long enlisted told him to take the blank cheques from his master and to bring him some of Mr. Conte's writing, which he did, and filed them up by the young man's directions for sums which amounted to 200l. or more; that he gave James Maxwell 30l. and a watch and chain, Bombardier
Jennings 2l. 10s. and a watch, Gunner Buckley 9l. 5s., Bombardier Garrett 6l. 10s. and a watch and chain, rings, locket, and scent bottle, also 30l. to buy his discharge, and 19l. 5s. in cash; that he bought for himself two watches, a chain, seals, microscope, and general articles of dress, and expressed his contrition for what he had done. A letter from the prisoner in Newgate to Mr. Conte was also put in, in which lie stated: "Do not take proceedings against me, and I will pay as soon as it lay in my power to pay you all back; I cry most bitterly to see my mother in such a state.")
DUNCAN— GUILTY .—Recommended to mercy by the Jury on account of his youth and the temptation.— Confined Twelve Months.
GARRETT and BUCKLEY— NOT GUILTY .
THE MESSRS. SLEIGH conducted the Prosecution;MR. DALEY defended Duncan and Garrett.
JOHN WOOD MILLER . I am a clerk in the London and Westminster Bank—Mr. Conte keeps an account there—on 27th October this cheque for 65l. was presented, and I paid it to some person whom I do not know—I also paid this cheque for 50l. dated 19th October, in gold—it purports to be signed by Mr. Conte.
THOMAS CHARLES REEVE . I am a clerk in the London and Westminster Bank—this cheque for 20l. dated 26th October, and purporting to be drawn by Mr. Conte, was paid by me over the counter to some person, I do not know who.
CHARLES CONTE . These cheques are, to the best of my belief, filled up in Duncan's writing—on a Wednesday morning in October my father went to the bank before breakfast—Duncan came in while he was away, and I said that my father had gone to the bank in a stew, or something like that—Duncan then went to his breakfast, and I did not see him again till he was in custody.
JOHN RANDALL . I am a detective of the Metropolitan police, but employed by the War-office at Woolwich—on 2d November, from information I received, I went to the Alexandra Theatre at Islington, and saw Duncan join Garrett, who was standing at the entrance—I said to Duncan, "You have been stealing cheques or money from your employers"—he said, "Yes, I have"—I told him I was a police-officer, and should take him in custody—Garrett was close by and could hear the conversation—I said to Duncan, What have you done with the money you got for the cheques you passed at the bank?—he said, "I have bought things with it; I also bought two watches, one I gave to Garrett, and one I have now, "nodding towards Garrett, who said, "Yes, he did give me a watch and guard"—Duncan said, "I gave him 2l. or 3l. several things I bought with the money are at home"—he also said that he gave Garrett two gold rings-Garrett was not in military costume—Duncan also said, "I gave money to two other men at Woolwich at different times"—I said to Garrett, "The case looks very suspicious against you, receiving watches and money from this boy"—he made no reply—I said, "You must consider yourself in custody for receiving from
the boy"—I remember speaking to Garrett about his discharge, I said "You are about purchasing your discharge, or have done so within the last few days—he said, "Yes, my father has bought my discharge with his own money," and that the amount of it was 3ol.—I had a conversation with Garrett's father, and afterwards, when Duncan and Garrett were both together, I said to Garrett, "Your father tells me you gave him the money to buy the discharge"—he said nothing—I then said to Duncan, "I understand from Garrett's father that you must have given Garrett the money to buy his discharge"—he said, "Yes, I did; I gave him 33l. in gold to buy his discharge"—I took them to the station and charged them—I searched Duncan's premises, and found a great number of things which he said were bought with the money of the forgery—on 6th November I saw Buckley at Woolwich barracks—I told him I was a police-officer, and took him for receiving sums of money from a boy named Duncan—he said, "I have not received any money from the boy Duncan"—he said that he knew the boy Duncan out at Gibraltar, but had not seen him lately—on the way to the station, I said, "You are about getting your discharge, I believe, from the service?"—he said, "Yes, my father is going to buy my discharge."
Cross-examined. Q. When was it that Garrett said that his father had paid the money? A. In front of the theatre—in addition to that, he said, "My father went there to the paymaster"—I do not question prisoners; I have always instructions the other way—I was obliged to ask Duncan what he had done with the money—he had robbed his employer, and I wanted to get the property—my object was to collect the evidence, if possible—that is in accordance with the instructions I receive from my superior, but we are not to put more questions than are necessary—I simply put as short questions as I possibly can to collect evidence—it is usual to tell prisoners that what they say will be taken down, and may be used against them, but I do not—I tell them that I am a police-officer, and I think that is sufficient—I sometimes caution persons, but I think it is quite optional whether I do or not—I believe it is done by the Magistrate at the police-court.
JOHN GARRETT . Garrett is my son—I have not been in the service—about a week before he was taken in custody he incidentally mentioned getting his discharge—I said, "Well, how are you to get the money?"—he said that he had been promised it by a friend of his, a young man whom he had become acquainted with lately in a very good situation, who bad very good friends—a few days afterwards, my son came to me at the Agricultural Hall where I was engaged, and handed me 30l. in gold, which he said was to purchase his discharge—I was rather surprised, but not greatly so, as he had given me an intimation of it before—I believe I said, "I hope you have got it in a proper way," and he said, "Yes"—he came to me again the following week—I went with him, and he bought his clothes—he showed me a watch and chain and a gold guard—he had a watch before, but this was a better one—he said that the guard had been exchanged by his friend for his old watch—I said, "Well, you have been very fortunate to meet with so good a friend, but it is not an extraordinary thing, it is a thing which I have heard of before, and which might occur again"—he said that he considered himself fortunate—he directed me to hand the 30l. over to the paymaster, which I did in two or three days.
Cross-examined. Q. Was there any receipt given for it? A. The pay-master sent me a letter in reply, saying that he had received it, and would forward it to the proper quarter—I sent the money in a letter, but I changed it into notes first—the Artillery is rather a superior corps, and young men of
position who enlist generally prefer it, I believe—I had no knowledge or suspicion that the money was stolen-my son was always steady and truthful; he has borne a good character in the service.
JOHN CHRISTIE . I am a sergeant in the Artillery, stationed at Woolwich—Buckley was also in the artillery there—these two letters (produced) are in his writing, and these two in Garrett's—I was present on 2d November when he was brought a prisoner to the office, and the adjutant told him that a boy named Duncan had made over a lot of money belonging to his employer, and asked if he knew him—he said, "Yes, I knew him about ten years ago in Gibraltar; I went to school with him"—he asked if he had written to Duncan—he hesitated at first, but afterwards admitted that he had written him one or two letters—on 4th November, Buckley was again brought to the office, and the adjutant said to him in my presence, "Authority has been received to pay in the money for your discharge, have you got the money? he said, "No, my father is going to send it for me."
Cross-examined. Q. Were you with Garrett at the theatre? A. I brought him from his father's house to Highbury Barn, and met Duncan in the road by the theatre.
MR. SLEIGH. Q. Had you seen them together previously? A. Never till that night—I should not have known Duncan if it had not been for the description of the mother that day—I was ordered by the adjutant to confine Garrett.
JOHN NEWTON . I am a sergeant in the Artillery—I saw Buckley in custody at the Seething-lane station-Sergeant Christie said to Jennings, "Have you written to your sister?" Buckley said, "D—all letter-writing; we have got into it and we must get out of it the best way we can"—they were taking the charge then—I was present when Randall took Duncan and Garrett at the theatre, and heard the whole conversation—I have heard Randall's evidence to-day; it is correct.
FRANCIS WILLIAM FOSTER . I am a corporal in the Royal Artillery—I know Garrett as a bombardier, and saw Duncan in his company in the barrack-room three times, to the best of my belief, between the 5th and 15th October-Duncan slept at the barracks once to my knowledge, during the time I was in charge of the room—It is since October 2d, when I came off recruiting service—I inquired of Garrett who he was—he said that he was either a friend or a relation—on another occasion when I saw him there and inquired who he was, Garrett said that he was a clerk living in London—I do not remember inquiring on a third occasion, or seeing Duncan there after Garrett said that he was a clerk in London—when Duncan slept there, I gave him leave to do so on Garrett's request—on one of the dates I have mentioned, Duncan came and asked whether Garrett was within—I inquired what he wanted of him, he said that he had a present for him, and showed me a double-case silver Geneva watch and guard, which I saw in Garrett's possession a few days afterwards—It is against rules to allow civilians to sleep in barracks, and I was under arrest for allowing it—I was under the impression that he was a relation.
Cross-examined. Q. Did not you say, "Except relations? A. No—I cannot say whether the boy was tipsy, and not in a fit state to go home, on the night that he slept there—I had other military duties to perform, and when I returned next morning, he had gone-Buffin, who was there, was drunk—I do not know whether he brought the boy.
MR. SLEIGH. Q. If you had not believed he was a relation of Garrett's, would you have allowed him to sleep there? A. No.
ELIZABETH DUNCAN . I am the wife of William Duncan, who was in the service, but now has a pension—Duncan is our son—he has nothing from us but his board and lodging—he went to Gibraltar, and there made Garrett's acquaintance—I opened a letter in October which came by post, directed to James Marville, with "J. O." in the corner of it—I read it, and showed it to the boy at night, and he tore it up—I believe it was from Buckley—I only just read it—I cannot tell exactly the contents of it, but I gathered from it that he had been to Greenwich with Buckley—there was nothing about money—I intercepted another letter from Garrett, and the boy burned that—it said that he was to bring him a watch, that be (Garrett) was on full pay, and would pay it at 3s. a week—I said to my boy, "I do not wish you to have anything to do with Garrett; how have you got money to purchase a watch?"—he said, "Garrett was in London, and I brought him the watch, "that is, took it down to him—I cautioned him—I made a communication to Mr. Conte—my husband wrote a letter to Garrett at Woolwich, and I told him what to put in it—this is it (produced)—Garrett returned the letter to me, and told me to send it to the proper owner—I think the children made away with the letter; I cannot find it—this is a copy of it—(Letters read: "Bombardier Garrett—I received your letter this morning, telling my boy to bring you a watch. You must remember we are only poor people, and the boy has no money to buy watches, or yet to spend in going after you, and you writing after him may only prompt him to rob his master. I wish you to have nothing more to do with him; if you do, I will certainly bring you before your commanding officer, and I know Colonel Maberly will see me justified in doing so; you are a young soldier, with good prospects in front of you, and I don't wish to injure you if it can be avoided. W. Duncan."—"Woolwich, 11/10/65. Mrs. Duncan,—I received this morning (Wednesday), a letter from you, accusing me of writing begging letters to your son, requesting him to purchase me a watch. Now, I see how the mistake has been; I shall take it in that light; you must look again at the letters you received from Woolwich, and you will then see that I have only written you one, which, as I got the address from a friend of mine, I accordingly addressed it there, as what I wrote to your son, whom I know no more about than your husband does of me, although the manner in which you inquired after Bombardier Garrett on Sunday, was as much as to say that I was the means of your son remaining from home; certainly, when he said he should like to stop, and he told me he had paid for a telegram to you, I made him as comfortable as our accommodation would permit. I have enclosed your threatening letter, hoping you will change the name, and forward it to the proper quarter. I wrote a letter for my friend one day, as he was on duty, that he had not time to do it; but I signed his name at the bottom of it, therefore, hoping you will correct the error, and inform me of the result, you will greatly oblige H. Garrett, bombardier.")—I went to Woolwich after the receipt of Garrett's letter, and I think the Sunday morning before—I found my boy in Garrett's room—he came out, but said nothing—I brought him up to London—I did not stop to speak to Garrett.
Cross-examined. Q. What is the name of the boy who came to lodge at your place. A. James Maxwell—he went to school with my boy about four years ago, and he stopped with me, and slept with my boy, with my permission—I think the Sunday I went down to the barracks was the Sunday before the letter was written—I never wrote to him till I received the letter, wanting my boy to bring a watch—I remember every word of the letter,
because it was sent back, and I read it over and over, and Garrett's writing is so saucy, I thought it was very impudent—I can write a little, and can read plain writing—when I spoke to my son I thought there was something wrong—he did not say that he had a good master, and that he sometimes got half-a-sovereign at a time from gentlemen—he said that he got a shilling sometimes, and sometimes sixpence, when he went out to the wine-merchants—I was not satisfied—I had been to Mr. Conte before I received the letter—I began to suspect as soon as I saw him with any money—I then went to Mr. Conte, and he told me it was all right, there was nothing wrong.
Duncan's statement was here put in (for which see page 119), also a letter from Buckley, when in the hospital, to Duncan, asking him to bring down "that" to Woolwich on Sunday, place "it" in a handkercheif, bind it up with paper and string, and give it to him over the hospital wall.
Buckley produced a written defence, stating that he had no knowledge of Duncan having stolen the money, until he was charged at Woolwich Barracks; that the first money he received from him was 1 l. which Duncan met him with as he left the hospital, saying that he knew he (Buckley) would be weak, and had saved it up for him as he got it from the wine-merchants; that as he could not get Duncan a pass to come into the hospital to see him he wrote, saying that he would get one handed to him over the hospital wall; that he only saw Duncan once in three or four weeks, through being in hospital, and had no opportunity of knowing that anything wrong was going on; that he had known Duncan ten years, whose mother was like a mother to him at Gibraltar, and knowing that her husband was in a good situation, he did not wonder at the boy having money.
NOT GUILTY .
NOT GUILTY .
The following Prisoners PLEADED GUILTY:—
NORRINGTON, Confined Eighteen Months. WILLIAMS, Ten Years' Penal Servitude. TONKINS, Seven Years' Penal Servitude. [Pleaded guilty; see original trial image.] And
106. WILLIAM UNDERWOOD (17) , to burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Thomas Gillett, and stealing therein 1 dress, 1 sheet, and other articles, his goods.— Confined Nine Months. [Pleaded guilty; see original trial image.]
THIRD COURT.—Tuesday, December 19th, 1865.
MR. HOUSTON conducted the Prosecution, and MR. DALEY the Defence.
PETER SUNDERGEN . I live at 4, George-street, Tower-hill, and am a clerk—between 12 and 1, on the night of 5th December, I was walking along Tower-hill, coming from a friend's—on my way home, I saw the prisoner standing in George-street, and spoke to her—while I was talking to her, she picked my pocket of a silver watch, and ran away—I had had
some glasses, but I was sober enough to know what I was doing—I afterwards saw my watch at the police-station.
JOHN FOX (Policeman, H 144). On Monday night, 5th December, I saw the prisoner and prosecutor in George-street, Tower-hill, in conversation, and then saw the prisoner about forty yards off—I did not see her leave the prosecutor—he made a complaint to me, and I followed the prisoner, but lost sight of her—I took her on the Thursday night following, and charged her with stealing a watch—she owned that she had the watch, and told me where it was pawned—she said she did not pawn it herself, but told me the woman who had pawned it—I afterwards saw it.
MARGARET SHEE . I live in Flower-street, Spitalfields—the prisoner lodges with me—on Tuesday morning, 6th December, about half-past 1, she gave me a watch—she said she met this young man, and he had only halfpence to give her, and that he gave her the watch till he paid her—the following morning she asked me to pawn it, to get her some breakfast—she went with me to the pawnbroker's door, and I went in and pawned it, and handed her the money and the ticket.
(The Pawnbroker did not appear to produce the watch. NOT GUILTY .)
BETTS PLEADED GUILTY . Recommended to mercy by the prosecutors. Judgment Respited.
MR. PATER conducted the Prosecution, and MESSRS. MONTAGUE WILLIAMS and WARNER SLEIGH defended Peterson.
JOHN FREDERICK BEAUMAR . I am an apprentice to Foster, Porter, & Co. 47, Wood-street—I know Betts—he was employed by one of our travellers, Mr. Jones—on Saturday morning, 25th November, about a quarter past 8, I saw Betts in the entering-room—he took some parcels from under-neath the counter, strapped them up, slung them across his shoulders, and walked out-at that time I thought he was in the employment—I do not know what the parcels contained.
EBENEZER MORGAN JONES . I am a traveller in the prosecutors' employ—Betts was employed by me for two months—I discharged him on 18th November—his duty was to carry samples, and to accompany me in business—I did not authorise him to go to the warehouse on 25th, and take away any goods—I know Butler—he was with me for two days—he absconded on Thursday, 26th November.
Butler. Q. Did I not come to my work as usual on the Friday? A. You left me on Thursday, between 3 and 4—I came to business on Friday at 9, waited there, and you did not come—you came there at 9, and then went away, and did not come back—you went and got this money and went away.
GORGE BETTS (the prisoner). I was formerly in Mr. Jones' employ; I was discharged on 18th November.—I had been with him two months—about a week before I left, Butler and I went up into the rug room together; it was on a Saturday, and Butler said, "There is a good chance to thieve something, "and he went down on his knees and took three gentle-man's Cardigan jackets; he brought them down stairs, till Mr. Bailey, his traveller, went out, and he then took them and left them at a place he had been to before, till he had done business, and then called for them—I was with him—on Saturday he gets done at 12, and he fetched the parcel and took it home—he waited till 1 o'clock, and took it to Henry Peterson, who comes out at 1—Peterson took the three jackets to Cockie Robins, who lives in
Golden-lane, and buys stolen property—he sold them to him for 8s.—I was there—on the Monday Butler took three more—he took them to Peterson's house at 5 o'clock—Peterson went to Cockie Robins with them—I did not go—I met Butler at the Britannia, and he brought the money there, 6s.—he told me that Peterson sold the jackets for 6s. and that Cockie Robins would not give any more—he told me that was the money for the jackets—on the Saturday following, Butler took three lady's Cardigan jackets—he came there about a quarter-past 8—I came there about a quarter to 9—he said there were a lot of gloves upstairs loose on the floor, and he made me go up and get them—I brought them down, and gave them to him—he tied both the parcels together—we went home and counted them—there were 8 pairs of kid gloves, and three odd ones, and the three jackets—we went for a walk till it was about ten minutes to 1, and then Butler went and got the things, and gave them to Peterson—he took them to Cockie Robins, in Golden-lane, and sold them for 7s.—I waited outside—Peterson came out without the goods, and told us he had got 7s.—he gave it to Butler—he gave me 3s. 6d. and we gave Peterson 6d. for selling them—on the Monday following, Butler's traveller was ill, and on the Tuesday Mr. Brookman told him he had better go out with Mr. Jones, as his traveller was ill—I went to the warehouse and saw Butler come out with Mr. Jones's samples—Butler said, "I shall give him the slip"—Mr. Jones told him to go and wait at the Mansion-house for him, and he went away—I then met Peterson, and told him that Butler was going to take Mr. Jones's shirts, and he told me to go to Butler's house and see if he had come home—I went and looked in at the window, and saw Butler kneeling down on the floor, counting the shirts—I went in, and he said, "You did frighten me"—I said, "There is Henry Peterson waiting outside for you"—he said, "(Go and tell him to come in"—he came in, and said to Butler, u You promised me a shirt"—Butler said, "You can take it"—and he took the one which the detective found on him—he took the others at 5 o'clock to Cockie Robins', and sold them for 15s.—I waited in Golden-lane—I saw him carry the parcel—he came out, and said, "I have got 15s. for it"—I said, "Give him a shilling"—he said, "I should think you would"—and I gave him a shilling, and Butler gave him a shilling—on the Wednesday following, Butler took one of Mr. Ede's parcels away—he is a traveller in Foster & Porter's employ—it contained 5 bundles of white kid gloves, 6 pairs in each bundle, and 37 scarfs—he took them home to his house, and counted them—I was with him—he said, "I promised Peterson a silk scarf"—and he took one out, and put it in his pocket—about ten minutes to 1, he brought the parcel out, and when Peterson came out, he said to him, "I have got you your silk scarf, "and when he felt in his pocket he could not find it—Peterson took the parcel to Cockie Robins, and he said he would not buy them, because there were two detectives watching round his house—we were all three together—I did not go in—Peterson told Butler that, and said, "What are you going to do"—he said, "You had better take them back to the warehouse"—Peterson said, "Do not do that; there is a lodger coming to our house; I will put them in the box"—Butler took them back to the warehouse—I went there on the Thursday, and Mr. Ede's boy came in and said, "There has been somebody at my samples, "and I went out—the boy came out, and I asked him if there was anything lost—he said, "Yes; there are five silk scarfs gone"—I did not see Butler again till the Friday, when he pursuaded me to go and take Mr. Garbett's samples, and I took them—they consisted of shawls, shirts, hosiery; and kid gloves—they both pur-suaded me to take them on the Friday night, but I said I would not—
Butler then said, "Go on Saturday morning at a quarter-past 8,"and I went and took them, and that gentleman (Mr. Beaumar) saw me take them—I waited about till half-post 9, and then took them to Butler's house—I opened the parcel, and was looking at the stockings, when Butler's sister asked me to give her a pair, and I gave her a pair—about 11, Butler came home, and said, "They suspect you"—I said, "I dare say they do, the gentleman saw me take them out; I wish I had never taken them"—he undid the samples, and said, "We shall get about 61. for these"—we took them out, about ten minutes to 1, and waited down the court till Peterson came out—Peterson said. "Go and take the things, and meet me in White-cross-street, while I go to Cockie Robins' and see—he came back, and said, "Cockie Robins can't buy them"—Butler then said to Peterson, "You go and ask at the other place in Golden-lane"—there is another who buys stolen property, I don't know his name—Peterson went in and asked, and the man said he would buy them——me and Butler waited at the baths, in Golden-lane, and a little girl came to me, and asked me if I belonged to the things—I said, "Yes," and she told me to bring them to the shop—I took the things into the parlour where Peterson was, with the man and his wife and the little child—the man asked me where I had got them, and I told him how I had got them—Peterson said, "I want 8l. for this lot"—he said, "I can't give it; "and so they made a bargain—Peterson said, "I want 9d. a pair for the kid gloves, "and the man said he could only give 4d.—he asked 8s. each for the shawls, and the man gave him 4s. 6d.—he asked half a sovereign for a lot of hosiery, and the man gave him a crown—he asked half a crown each for the shirts, and the man gave him 2s. and 2s. 9d. for some stockings; altogether it came to 3l. 5s. 9d.—Peterson gave me a sovereign, and Butler a sovereign, and kept the rest himself—altogether I have had 1l. 10s. of 1l. 12s. of the money, from first to last—I have seen Peterson and Butler together frequently—on that Saturday night I went to the Britannia Theatre with Butler—I did not see Peterson that night—the man we sold Mr. Garbett's samples to, is called Cockie Ryan—there is another man named Cockie Robins.
Cross-examined. Q. When did you first commence to take goods yourself? A. Not before Butler—I should never have done so if it had not been for him—I took one Cardigan jacket and Mr. Garbett's samples—those are the only things I myself personally took at all—I took the jacket first—I had been there about a month when Butler came—I took the jacket the Saturday before he began to take anything—I sold it to a boy that goes out with a trap, and works at Lees Brothers'—I got four shillings for it, which I kept—Butler knew I had stolen that jacket, because he was with me at the time, and he said he would take one, and he took one up, and threw it down again—he was the first who persuaded me to take anything—it is not the first time I have told the story about Cockie Robins and Cockie Ryan—I told it first at Guildhall—I did not state the whole there that I have to-day, I had not the opportunity; the Magistrate would not listen to me—I made this statement to my mother, not to a police-constable—I told that policeman (Hills) that I had taken Mr. Garbett's samples, when Mr. Jones came to my house on that Monday, and that Butler and Peterson persuaded me, and that Butler took Mr. Jones' shirts—I told Hills where Mr. Garbett's samples were sold—he asked me where the other boys lived; and I told him they lived in Old-street—he asked me where the things were sold, and I told him in Golden-lane, that was all—he did not tell me it would be better for me if I pleaded guilty and gave evidence
—my mother told me on Monday to plead guilty and be a good boy—I took the samples, I dare say, about five weeks after I took the jacket—Betts took all the other things except the Cardigan jacket and Mr. Garbett's samples—I took the Cardigan jacket about five weeks before the 25th—the time that Betts told me that it was a good chance to steal, was after the time when he took the jacket up, and threw it down again.
JOSEPH WILLIAM YORK (City-policeman, 199). From information I received, I went with Hills on 27th November, between 4 and 5, to 14, Memel-street, where Butler lives with his friends—I received this pair of stockings from his sister (produced)—I afterwards went with Hills to 13, Baltic-street, Old-street, and saw Peterson—I asked him if his name was Peterson—he said it was—I told him we were two detective officers, and I should take him into custody on suspicion of being concerned, with a boy then in custody of the name of Betts, and also another boy named Butler, for stealing and receiving goods from Foster, Porter's, of Wood-street—his reply was, "I know nothing about it, and I don't know Butler or Betts"—I then took him to 5, Bridgewater-gardens, where I saw Butler—I told him we were two detective officers, and I should take him into custody for being concerned, with this boy and Betts, in stealing two parcels on Saturday last—the passage was then in darkness, and he said, "I do not know this boy, and I don't know Betts"—Butler's sister brought a light down stairs into the passage, and he said, "Yes, I do know that boy," meaning Peterson, "but I do not know anything about the parcels"—I said, "You do, for you gave your sister a pair of stockings, which I have"—he said, "It was not me; it was Betts"—I said, "Then you do know Betts?"—and he said, "Yes"—I told him he would have to go with me to the station—he said, "I did not sell the things, but I stood at the corner of Golden-lane while Peterson and Betts went into a shop"—I asked him what shop it was—he said he could not tell me the name, but it was between a shoemaker's and a greengrocer's shop—I know it; it is Cockie Ryan's—I then took Butler and Peterson to Moor-lane station-house—they were both searched—Peterson was wearing this shirt (produced)—I asked him where he got it—he said he had bought it on Sunday week, and he gave 7s. 6d. for it—Butler said that he had a sovereign for his share of the sale of the Saturday previous.
Cross-examined. Q. Have you ever stated before to-day that Peterson said, "I don't know either Butler or Betts?" A. Yes—my depositions were read over to me and I signed them—I have been in the force sixteen years—(The depositions being read did not contain those words)—when I told him the charge, he said he knew nothing about it—he did say that he did not know Betts or Butler.
WILLIAM HILLS (City-policeman, 150). I accompanied York to Memel-street on 2d November, and was also with him at 13 Baltic-street—I saw Peterson wearing this shirt—I asked him where he got it—he told me he bought it in Petticoat-lane on Sunday week—I asked him what he gave for it; he said, 3s. 6d.—I was present at the station-house when the inspector asked him where he got the shirt, and he then said he bought it in Petticoat-lane of a man who sold braces, and he gave 6s. 6d. for it.
EBENEZER MORGAN JONES (re-examined). I recognise this shirt—I missed about fifteen or sixteen similar to this on Wednesday, 22d November, of various patterns—they were done up in a parcel—I dare say Foster, Porter's have stockings like this in their stock—I went to the house in Memel-street, I knocked at the door, Betts opened it—I asked him if he knew where the goods were that were taken from the warehouse on Saturday morning—he
told me he knew nothing about it—his mother then came up and wanted to know what was the matter—I told her that her son had taken some goods from our warehouse on Saturday, and she burst out crying—she then asked us to look over the house to see if any of the goods were there, and Mr. Garbett, who was with me, went with Mrs. Betts, while I took the boy into the parlour—I pressed him to tell me, and said it was no use denying that he had taken the things out of the warehouse, as he was seen to do it—he then burst out crying, and told me that he had been persuaded by Butler to go into the warehouse and take the parcels out—I then asked him if he knew who took the shirts on Wednesday, and he told me it was Butler who took them, and that Peterson sold them in Golden-lane for 3l.—he told me he waited outside till they came out, and they had 1l. each, and they went to the Britannia theatre, and spent the money within a few shillings, and the remainder he gave to his mother—that is the substance of what he told me.
Cross-examined. Q. Is that all that passed? A. To the best of my recollection—this is a very ordinary flannel shirt—It is sold at almost all houses of our trade throughout London—it is an uncommon quality; it is a twill, and is worth 8s. being a peculiar shirt, and very low in price—we very seldom have them at that price in stock.
JOHN GARBETT . I am a traveller in the prosecutors' employ—on Saturday, 25th November, I missed a parcel of samples, consisting of hosiery, gloves, shirts, shawls, and some fancy wool goods—I think I missed about a dozen or a 1/2 dozen and a half, woollen shirts—I cannot tell the exact value of them—I had only had them that morning—these goods altogether were worth from 15l. to 20l.—I had stockings similar to this pair in quality and description.
BUTLER— GUILTY .— Judgment Respited.
PETERSON— GUILTY .—He PLEADED GUILTY to a former conviction of felony at Lambeth Police-court in January 1865, when he was sentenced to Six Months Imprisonment. Judgment Respited.
The COURT ordered the police to take Robins and Ryan into custody at once.
MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution.
ISAAC FARLEY (City-policeman, 342). About half-past 3 in the afternoon of 9th November, I was on duty in Fleet-street, and saw the prisoner and another man, go round a phaeton which was standing at a shop close by Chancery-lane, and take this mackintosh (produced) off the back seat of the phaeton, the other man pointed me out to him in the middle of the road, and he threw the mackintosh in front of the horse—I ran after him and caught him.
Prisoner. Q. Where were you standing at the time I took that? A. Right in the middle of the road, as dose to you as I am now.
HENRY GILLINGS . I am a coachman in the employ of Mr. Redfern, of 22, Alexander-square, Brompton—on this afternoon I was sitting in the front seat of my master's phaeton—this cape was behind, and I saw the prisoner take it from the back seat—I halloed at him, and he threw it up to me—it is worth 35s.
Prisoner's Defence. I was walking along Fleet-street, and saw the cape
hanging out over the back of the seat, and I lifted it and threw it up to the coachman.
GUILTY .—He also PLEADED GUILTY* to a former conviction of felony at this Court in October, 1864. Sentence,Confined Twelve Months .—Seven Years' Penal Servitude.
MR. LANGFORD conducted the Prosecution, and MR. MONTAGUE WILLIAM the Defence.
OLIVER ROBOTHAM . I am a clerk, and live at 21, Temple-street, St. George's-road—on the evening of 30th November, about 6 o'clock, I was passing through Lombard-street—there was a crowd there, and the prisoner was standing at my left side—I felt a strain at my left waistcoat pocket, where I bad a silver watch—I cast my eyes down, and saw the prisoner's hand at my pocket—as I seized hold of him he dropped my watch, and it swung out the full length of the chain—I am sure it was the prisoner's hand that held my watch—a policeman was there, and I gave him into custody—the prisoner said I had made a mistake, and that he was a respectable young man.
Cross-examined. Q. Were there a great many people collected together there? A. Not a great many—there was a crowd, but not a very large one—I should say not above fifty people at the outside.
WILLIAM HISCOCKS (City-policeman, 804). On the evening of the 30th November, about 6, I was in Lombard-street—there was a crowd there—I saw the last witness's watch hanging by the chain from his waistcoat—he said, "I shall give this man into custody for attempting to steal my watch"—the prisoner said it would be a great disgrace to his family, and denied it—he said he lived at Bristol, but declined to say in what street.
GUILTY .**—Joseph King, warder of the House of Correction and George Ager, proved several summary convictions against the prisoner.— Confined Two Years.
MR. HOUSTON conducted the Prosecution.
JOHN ELSOM . I live at 17, Abbey-street, Bethnal-green, and am a brewer's drayman—on the night of the 26th November I went to bed, about 11—previously to that I had secured the front door—about a quarter to 2 in the morning I heard a knock—I was sleeping in the back room—I said, "Who's there?"—somebody said, "A policeman; open the door; are you all right?"—I said, "Yes, for anything I am aware of"—I then put my hand against the front parlour-door, and found it was open—I said, "I don't think I am"—I then went to open the door to let the policeman in, and put my hand on the prisoner's head—he was sitting down by the front door, inside—he appeared to be in liquor, but it is not my opinion that he was—I found this work-box and other articles removed—an overcoat
which was on the sideboard the night before I found by the prisoner's side—the policeman found my savings-bank book on the step of the door outside—that was on the sideboard the night before.
JAMES OLLETT (Policeman, H 34). On the morning of 27th November I was passing 17, Abbey-street, Bethnal-green—just before I reached the door I saw somebody's head looking out at the door—as I got up it was drawn in, and the door was shut—I looked down against the door, and found this paper, with the name of Elsom on it—I knocked at the door, and asked if they had lost anything—as Mr. Elsom came to the door, he called out that there was some one in the passage—I saw a light there when I first came up, and it was put out immediately the door was shut—Mr. Elsom had no light—the prisoner was crouched down by the door—Mr. Elsom had hold of him by the collar—there was a work-box a tea-pot and an overcoat on the floor by the prisoner—the coat pockets were full of children's petti-coats, pinafores, and other things—I asked the prisoner how he came there; he made no reply—I found on him a tea-spoon, a sixpence, and twopence—the parlour door had been locked, and the door had been forced out of the box of the lock—there were no marks on the outer door—I tried the prosecutor's key, and could not open the door with it.
JONATHAN WARREN . I am a baker, and live at 17, Abbey-street, Bethnal-green, with the prosecutor—on the night of 20th November, I unlocked the front door to get in, and shut it after me—I am quite sure I secured it.
GUILTY .— Confined Eight Months.
OLD COURT.—Wednesday, December 20th, and Thursday, December
For the case of Nathaniel Holchester and others, tried on these days, see Surrey Cases.
NEW COURT.—Wednesday, December 20th, 1865.
Before Mr. Recorder.
114. HENRY LUCAS (19), JOHN MAHONEY (29), and WILLIAM BYFORD (18) , Burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of John Ford Hallett, and stealing therein 1 watch, 1 cloak, and other articles, his property.
MR. LILLEY conducted the Prosecution, and MR. LEWIS defended Mahoney.
EMMA SARAH HALLETT . I am the wife of John Ford Hallett, landlord of the Hibernian Stores, Old Compton-street, Soho—on 16th November, about 12.30 at night I retired to my room, and missed some shirts, waistcoats, children's clothing, some watches, jewellery, and a large quantity of property, value 80l., among which was a child's cashmere cloak—they were all safe at 9 o'clock—there is a gate at the bottom of the stairs leading to my bed-room,
which is on the 2d floor—the key hangs by the side, and can be reached—there is also a tongue by means of which a bell is set in motion when the gate is opened, but which can be turned on one side, to prevent the bell ringing—this cashmere cloak (produced) is my husband's property.
Cross-examined. Q. Is that the cloak that was found at Mahoney's? A. Yes—this (produced) is a list of the property I lost.
JOHN FORD HALLETT . I am landlord of the Hibernian Stores, Old Compton-street—on 16th November I went to bed about 12.30—I found that my bed-room had been entered and a large quantity of property stolen—they had stripped two of my drawers entirely of shirts, waistcoats, and scarfs—I have seen Byford in my bar, as a customer, more than once or twice.
WILLIAM JEWELL . I am an engine fitter, of 22, Denmark-street—on 16th November, about a quarter to 11, or it might be 11 o'clock at night, I was coming out of Haye's-court, which is near Compton-street, and saw the prisoners Lucas and Byford, and five or six others, four or five doors from the prosecutor's house, running away from it—one of them had a bundle in his arms—they ran round the corner of Church-street—Lucas halloed out, "Look out, there is some one coming, "and the one who had the bundle chucked it against a doorway—I crossed over towards them, and the one who had the bundle let one of the ends slip, and dropped some shirts and waist-coats on the pavement—they were wrapped in a kind of table-cover, black, with red spots—I told Mr. Sharp what I had seen, and he sent me next morning to give information to Sergeant Cole—I was sent for next day to identify Lucas at Bow-street—I picked him out from 30 or 40 others—about a week after wards I identified Byford at Vine-street; I picked him out from others.
Lucas. Q. Could you say where the bundle was stolen from. A. No, or I should have given you in custody directly.
Byford. Q. When you came out of Haye's-court, how far were the five or six men from you. A. About twenty or thirty yards—Haye's-court is at the bottom of Greek-street, but I could see them because they ran round the corner—you cannot see the prosecutor's from Haye's-court: you can see the sixth door, that is a boot shop—I knew you because I had seen you and Lucas standing by the Dials—you had a little black coat, and a foreign hat, like a Muller cut down only it came up very high—that did not make a great alteration in you, because I knew you so well—I crossed over towards you, and Lucas halloed, "Look out, here is some one coming"—it was not you that said "Look out"—I went out to go to Mr. Sharpe the tobacconist's, and I told him what I had seen, just for a lark—I did not tell a policeman, because I did not know that the things were stolen—I went to Mr. Sharpe's again next morning—he told me he had seen a reward bill up, and I went and told Sergeant Cole, whom I met in Berwick-street, what I had seen, and that I could identify three or four of them—I went with him to Mr. Hallett at 11 or 12 o'clock—I had not seen the bills before I saw Cole.
MR. LILLEY. Q. You say that you crossed over when you saw the men with the bundle, how near did you get to them? A. Close to them; I pressed by them—I have seen Lucas and Byford several times before standing about the Dials.
ANN CROPPERJOHN . I have been in Mr. Hallett's service all his life—I have charge of the upper part of the house for the children—on 16th November, at 11 o'clock, I took candles into my mistress's bed-room—all was right and safe then.
MARY RILEY . I was housemaid at the Hibernian Stores at the time of the robbery. I went into my mistress's room at 11.30, and found it quite dark—there is usually a light there—I found the drawers wide open—I have several times passed Byford in the private bar—we have to pass through there to go to the kitchen.
JAMES BRANNON (Police Inspector F.) On 30th November at 12.30 I went with Ackrill and several other officers, to Mahoney's, the Bell public house, Newton-street—we there apprehended five men, four of whom are now awaiting their trial for highway robbery with violence—I took Lucas from information and description which I had received—I called Mahoney from the bar—some conversation ensued down stairs—we then went up to the first floor, and I said "Mahoney, I have received information that you have some stolen property in your possession"—he said, "Me, I have not"—I said, "Have not you got a child's worked frock and other articles that were stolen from the Hibernian Stores, Old Compton-street?"—he said, "No, I have not"—I said, "Be sure"—he said, "I am"—I said, "If you have not bought anything, have you anything left here?"—he said, "No"—I said, "The information I have received is so correct that I shall search your place; I am sure you have"—Sergeant Ackrill then said, "We do not wish to injure you if you will tell us who the thieves are"—a conversation then ensued, which the Magistrate's clerk told me not to mention. Mahoney did not tell me who the thieves were. (THE COURT considered that as Mahoney did not tell who the thieves were, the conversation could be given in evidence as it did not come within the offer.) He said, "I recollect I bought a child's cloak over the bar, of a stranger, for two pots of ale"—I asked him where it was—he said, "Up in the bed-room"—he went down stairs with Sergeant Ackrill and brought up his wife, who told me voluntarily in his presence that she had bought the ticket of this cloak of a woman for two shillings, and had redeemed it—she then went into the kitchen, the first-floor back-room, and got a piece of paper and lit a candle from the gas—the prisoner then went and said to her in an under tone, but quite loud enough for me to hear, "Do not make a fool of yourself; tell them I bought it over the bar for two pots of ale"—I said, "I shall repeat what you have now mentioned to your wife to the Magistrate"—we then went up to the bed-room—his wife went to a chest of drawers, and from the bottom drawer she took out this cloak (produced)—I left Mahoney in charge of another constable, and went with Sergeant Ackrill to the Hibernian Stores, and showed the cloak to Mr. Hallett, who identified it—Lucas was placed among about thirty others in the station yard, and the witness picked him out without the slightest hesitation.
WILLIAM ACKRILL (Police-Sergeant, F 15). I have heard Inspector Brannan's evidence; it is correct—I apprehended Lucas in the bar—it is a licensed house—I told him the charge—he said that he knew nothing about it, he was not one of the men, but he supposed he should have to suffer for it.
Lucas. You did not tell me the charge till I got to the Station; it was about 4 o'clock in the morning. Witness. It was about twenty minutes past 12 when I told you it was for a burglary.
CHARLES COLE (Policeman, C 23). On Saturday evening, 3d December, about 8 o'clock, I met Byford, in Wardour-street—I had seen him about half-past 10, on the night of 16th November, at the corner of Frith-street and Compton-street, opposite the prisoner's house—I said, "Bill, I shall apprehend you on suspicion of being concerned with others in stealing a quantity of property, from the Hibernian Stores, on 16th November—he
said, "Cole, you are not going to buck me for this?"—I said, "Yes, I am"—he said, "I am an unlucky b—"—I said, "I shall put you with a number of others, and if you are identified, you will be charged with the offence"—he said, "No, take me to the party"—I said, "No"—I put him with nine or ten others, at Vine-street Station, and brought Jewell in, who selected him out, saying, "You are the one, but you did not have that coat or that cap, you had a French hat"—he was then charged—he had a French sugar-loaf hat, and a little black coat, with pockets on the side, on the night I saw him.
Byford. Q. When you gave the information, were you looking for me? A. No, for somebody else—I felt sure it was you, but I had reasons for not taking you without taking somebody else—I let you go for twelve days—I did not intend to apprehend you, until I could apprehend another one—I have lost him altogether through apprehending you.
MRS. HALLETT (re-examined). Among other articles I lost, was a black table cover, with red spots—this child's cloak is worth six guineas—it is cashmere, lined with silk—it had only been worn three times.
Lucas's Defence. A public house is a convenient place for anybody to use; I do not see what there is against me, because I am found in the house.
Byford's Defence. Haye'S-Court is 100 or 140 yards from the prosecutor's place; there are eight doors from his place to the corner of Greek-street, and when you stand at the corner of Greek-street, Haye's-court is 130 yards off; do you think it possible that Jewell could discern me out of five or six others? He said at the Court that he could swear to the lot of us; he says that I had a different hat and coat, and you are aware how clothing alters a man; by my having this clothing on now, I may resemble the man he saw, but I can assure you he is mistaken; he never saw me in his life before, nor I him, to my knowledge; I will not say that he did not see this man, but he did not see me. I have passed Cole, and nodded to him, and he has nodded to me, without my having the slightest idea of being captured. I never saw the other prisoner before, and never was in Byford's house in my life. I told Cole I knew the robbery had been done, but I had nothing to do with it, and that I was always taken for things I knew nothing about. I have been bad, but am now trying to lead an honest life. I was at work at Mr. Woodville's, an engraver, in Wardour-street, and was living at a respectable lodging in King-street; but Cole came to the landlady, and told her that she had got a convicted thief in the house; and when I went home she said that she could not keep me there any longer; I begged her to tell me why, and she told me what Cole had said. Cole has a great bitterness against me, and has often said that he would lag me. I left work two months ago, and have never been in a place since; it is a long time since I was convicted. Cole knows that I am innocent of this.
LUCAS— GUILTY .— Confined Eighteen Months.
BYFORD— GUILTY .**— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.
MAHONEY received a good character— NOT GUILTY .
The officer Cole stated that he never knew that Byford was at Mr. Wood-ville's till after he left: that he had done all he could to get him into a reformatory school, and tried to get him to go to America, but he would not.
MR. LANGFORD conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM BINFIELD . I am shepherd to Charles Edward Smith, of Whitton—on the night of 28th October, I saw my master's 195 sheep safe—I went into a turnip-field about 6 next morning, and found one sheep killed—they had cut off the shoulders, the hind legs, and part of the loin, and had taken skin and all—I told my master, and then went to the bailiff—I noticed two foot-marks, where some one had stood to cut the sheep up—it was a very small-heeled boot, with one nail at the end of the tip of the heel—there were foot-marks of a second man, but not close to the first—I saw the prisoner in Whitton that night, at half-past 10 o'clock, with Gold-smith, about half a mile from where the sheep were—I saw Payne compare a pair of boots with the foot-marks at the side of the sheep—he made an impression by the side of the other mark, and they were very much alike—here is a mark on this boot where the tip has been broken off.
JOSEPH TURNER . I am bailiff to Charles Edward Smith, of Whitton—on 29th October, I received information from the shepherd, I went into a field, and saw the trunk of a sheep—the legs and shoulders had been taken away—I tracked the foot-marks out of the field, and saw that there were nails in them, but it was very wet and slippery—I could only see the track in some places.
WILLIAM CROOKENDEN (Policeman, T 128). On 28th October, about twenty minutes to 12 at night, I saw the prisoner about half a mile from the field, I turned my light on him, and he seemed to avoid me—he went in the opposite direction, towards Hounslow.
WILLIAM HOOPER (Policeman, T 158). On the morning of 29th October, about 11 o'clock, I went with Sergeant Payne and saw him make an impression by the side of the footmarks which corresponded with them—it was a clayey soil—he did not put the boot into the original impression at all.
JAMES PAINE (Police-sergeant, T 19). On 29th October I received information, went into the field, and saw that a sheep had been slaughtered in a furrow—it appeared to have had its throat cut, and a person appeared to have strode across it for a long time, as there were two very deep impressions of boots which had been repaired at the bottom, and a portion of the tip was gone—I went to Hounslow, and apprehended the prisoner on another charge—I looked at his boots, and when he was at the Twickenham-station, I told him I should require them, for I believed there would be another charge against him—I went to the field, and saw that they exactly corresponded with the impressions—I measured the mark with a stick, and it was the same length and width—I covered up the footmarks, and told the shepherd to put up hurdles to prevent the sheep going over the ground—I went back to the station, entered the charge, and told the prisoner he was further charged with being concerned with other men not in custody in slaughtering a fat sheep at Whitton, and stealing a portion of it—he said nothing—when he was convicted of the first charge I apprehended him—I told him the charge, and he asked me if anybody was in custody for it—I said, "Not that I am aware of now, but there may be before you get to Twickenham—he said, "You would have done better, if you had gone and looked over the Park instead of looking after me."
Prisoner's Defence. He ought to have let me go with the boots.
GUILTY .**—He also PLEADED GUILTY to a previous conviction at Clerkenwll in July, 1864.— Confined Eighteen Months.
MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution, and MR. METCALFE the Defence.
CHARLES JAMES SALMON . I am accountant to the General Steam Navigation Company, which is incorporated by Act of Parliament—the prisoner was a clerk at the head office, 78, Lombard-street—his duties were to issue tickets to passengers, to receive the money for them, and to enter them in a book, and pay over the amount to the cashier at the end of each day—there are counterfoils to the tickets—a Paris ticket, fore-cabin and third class, is 15s.—the usual practice is to write the name of the passengers on the counterfoil, and place the date on the ticket—a passenger gives up the ticket, and they are returned, that is after a certain time—this (produced) is the deposit book—I find no entry here, on 10th October, of a ticket, price 3l. 15s. or of tickets 6l. 15s. on 11th October or 5l. 5s. on 13th.
Cross-examined. Q. But you have the counterfoils for all these? A. Yes, but none of those tickets are entered in this book—they are properly entered on the counterfoil, but there is no amount specified on the tickets—we know them by their colour—there is sufficient on this counterfoil for me to verify the ticket—we could have checked the prisoner by a comparison of the ticket with the counterfoil—what we complain is that it is not entered in the day-book, nor the money paid in—if the prisoner was away, another person would take money—the prisoner has been in the service nearly five years—he has been promoted—his duties have been very heavy for five or six mouths during the summer—I understand that he has had to pay telegrams, but that would be between him and the cashier—Mr. Roots has mentioned that to me—I have not seen him here—I have not seen him since last Thursday—he was then at the police-court and asked me there—I spoke to the prisoner about it on the same day as I heard of it—he remained in the office ten or twelve days after that—I told him to make up his accounts, but he did not, and I had them made up—we made up the deficiency by going through the books—that was not with the prisoner's assistance—he merely came backwards and forwards every day to tell me of the attempts that were made to make up his deficiencies—I advised him to try to get the money to pay up his deficiencies—I had no power to promise him—I did it out of a kindly feeling to him—I did not understand that, if he made it up the money, nothing would be done to him—Mr. Roots did not see him during those days to my knowledge—Mr. Roots marked the counterfoils of the prisoner's tickets himself—this marked "0" is one of those that are owing—I cannot say who put it there—it was discovered from there not being entered in this book—Mr. Roots is an active man in the Directorship—the prisoner told me the amount was 40l. or 50l. and he was astonished when I told him it was 75l.—I have not a paper made up by him in which he shows an account of money due—he showed one to me, and I showed him that certain additions must be made to it—I cannot say what that amounted to—it was a large amount—it contained the Paris tickets—the prisoner told me he had lent money to some of the clerks in the establishment, and produced some I. O. U.'s—up to the last moment I believed he would be able to raise the money—he made many efforts to raise it, and reported to me daily whether he was successful or otherwise—that went on for eight or nine days—I told the secretary from time to time what was taking place—I saw a paper something like this (produced)—I do not know whether this is it—by the last moment I mean two or three days
before he was taken—he has frequently complained of the extent of his duties—he has not only to issue tickets, but to advise people what to do, and interpret for them also, to speak almost all languages.
MR. COOPER. Q. When you made an investigation, did you look through the numbers consecutively? A. Yes; from 9,406 to 9,443—I found no entry of this number, but I found the counterfoils of them—he was in the same room with me for half the time he has been there—we were friends—I have a great regard for him.
THOMAS JOSEPH BISHOP . I am cashier to the Steam Navigation Company, Lombard-street—the prisoner was in the ledger office—after receiving the cash for the tickets it was his duty to pay it over to me in the afternoon—I have looked through the tickets from 9,406 to 9,443 inclusive, and he has not paid me any sums received for those tickets or accounted for them—he did not pay me 3l. 15s. on the 10th, 6l. 15s. on the 11th, or 5l. 5s. on the 13th for these particular tickets—he left the office on 13th November—he had come regularly for the last week or fortnight.
Cross-examined. Q. Did you hear of this from the secretary? A. Yes; he is not here, or Mr. Roots—I had no conversation with Mr. Roots about it—I did not advise the prisoner to get the money; he was going to get it and I said I hoped he would do so—I do not remember whether he said that he did not know how the errors had occurred; very likely he did—he said that he had been very much overworked, especially during that season when the errors occurred—he had to pay advance notes, and he might have to pay telegrams for the other clerk in the office if he was asked, also for the removal of manure from cattle ships, and of ashes from steam vessels, also returned passage-money and several other disbursements—other people might come and ask him for money when he was very much pressed—I cannot say whether he has had to advance money to the people in the office—I do not know that he had advanced money to the secretary.
The Prisoner. My diary will show it.
MR. METCALFE. Q. How came his diary to be in your possession? A. Because he left it in the office; it is a public diary which he had to keep, he produced it day by day to me and I put my initials to it—I cannot say whether there are advances to the secretary in this very diary, but I should think not; but if the secretary was going out, and had got no change in his pocket, he would send down to me to give him some money, and if I was out, the clerk might give him a couple of pounds to get his dinner—there would be no cheque for that because he would pay that, to me as money—in order to pay any claim on the Company a cheque would be given—we have to get together three directors in order to sign a cheque—the prisoner does not find the money until the Directors can be got to sign a cheque—I have not seen the I. O. U.'s or taken means to verify them; I have nothing to do with them—I understood that the prisoner was going to pay the amount, but I should not have seen it on my own authority—I did not communicate with the secretary or Mr. Roots—I do not know who issued the order to take the prisoner in custody—I have no officer here who can tell you.
MR. COOPER. Q. I suppose he takes receipts or vouchers for the small payments? A. Always—I take the vouchers as so much money—all offices are more busy at some times than others.
COURT. Q. Is all that you enter in this diary, the amount without the particulars? A. Yes, the particulars are in another book, the calf-skin book—that is the daily receipts, they would agree with this—on 10th October here is 33l. 6s.—there were no deductions that day, it was all paid in in gold
—here are several deductions on 11th October, 1l. 2s., 5s., 7s., and 1l. 2s. 6d.—on 13th October here is "Ashes, 3s. and 23l. 5s. 6d. in money"—I can hardly tell whether other persons sell tickets.
COURT (to C. J. SALMON). Q. Do other persons sell tickets? A. Not when the prisoner is present—these counterfoils are in his writing.
THEODORE HALSTED FOULGER (City detective officer). From information I received I went to the prisoner's residence, and told him I arrested him for embezzling several sums of money, the property of the Steam Navigation Company—he told me to let him be till to morrow and he would come down to the office—I told him I could not do that, and took him in custody—he said, "I know I must appear guilty in the eyes of others; I was drawn into it by another, but I never intended to rob the Company of any money at all"—I searched him at the station, and found a quantity of papers, and among them this one (produced)—it appears to be the names of ships and amounts paid.
Cross-examined. Q. Did you find some I. O. U.'s on him? A. Three—I have not seen some others since—I have made inquiries about them—they only amounted to 12l.—I said 15l. in my depositions.
COURT. Q. Who gave you instructions to apprehend him? A. Mr. Pratt, the secretary—I received the instructions from our chief some days before, and apprehended the prisoner on 24th October—I went to his house before but could not find him.
NOT GUILTY .
The prisoner was further charged upon three similar indictments, upon which no evidence was offered.
MR. STRAIGHT conducted the Prosecution.
CHARLES PERRY . I am a clerk out of a situation, and live at 9, Patriot-square, Cambridge-road—last Saturday night or Sunday morning, at a quarter-past twelve, I was in the Mile-end-road, going home towards the City—I met nine or ten young men in a group on the pavement—one of them struck me on the top of my hat—I was then seized from behind by a person who placed his hands on my mouth, nose, and throat—a person in front turned my waistcoat pockets inside out, inserted one hand in my left trousers pocket, and took some papers out—when they let go of me the lot of them scrambled after my money, which was rolling on the pavement—I then saw the prisoner picking up some, and was quite certain of him—they went in the same direction, towards Bow—I kept the prisoner in sight till I met a constable and gave him in custody—I was perfectly sober—I had never seen the prisoner before to my knowledge—he had a cap on, and most of the others had wide-awakes.
Prisoner. Q. What coin did you see me pick up? A. Copper coin—I had a half-crown, six halfpence, and one penny.
THOMAS MORGAN (Policeman, K 359). The prosecutor gave the prisoner into my custody last Saturday night—he said that he had had his pockets picked by eight or nine young men, and the prisoner was one whom he saw pick up part of the money—the prisoner said that he was innocent, he saw a mob and merely went to see what was the matter—the prosecutor appeared sober—I found on the prisoner 1s. 6d. in silver, and 5d. in copper.
Prisoner's Defence. I went to the King Harry with Jones, Bower, and Davis; they were making a noise about a pot of beer; they were outside and we followed them; they were jangling all the way. I do not know whether this gentleman knocked against them or not, but they hit him on the hat and surrounded him, and a lot of money fell on the pavement.
NOT GUILTY .
THIRD COURT.—Wednesday, December 20th, 1865.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. HORRY conducted the Prosecution.
CHARLES ALLEN . I am pay-sergeant in the Third Battalion of the Grenadier Guards—the prisoner is a private in the same battalion—on 22d November, about a quarter-past 3 in the afternoon, I left my room in St. George's barracks—I locked the door, and left everything perfectly safe—I had a box in the room, which was locked, and in that box was my cash-box, which was also locked, and which contained 15l. in money, or thereabouts—there was one 5l. note, No. 79,603, date 30th September, 1865, one sovereign, and 9l. in silver, or thereabouts, and 4s. 2 1/2 d. in copper—I returned to my room about ten minutes past 5 the same afternoon—I found my door had been opened, my box broken open, the cash-box taken out and also broken open—the centre compartment of the cash-box, which contained the money, was taken away—I at once reported the loss to the sergeant-major and the adjutant—we then searched about the barracks, and in so doing we found a key placed between some packing-cases in the passage below my room—that key opened my door easily—it had been taken from the door of the room below mine—I applied to the sergeant who occupied that room to see if his key would unlock my door, and when he went to find it, the key was missing—on further search about the barracks, the centre compartment of my cash-box was found, also placed among some packing-cases—the prisoner lived and slept in a barrack-room, close to my room door—this is the note I lost (produced).
FRANCES SWAN . I live with Sergeant Boyce's wife, on the landing above Sergeant Allen's—on Wednesday afternoon, the day he was out, I was on the landing, and saw the prisoner at Sergeant Aliens door, trying to force it open with his knees—it was about a quarter-past 3—my mistress called me away, and I left him there—there was another soldier with him at the time—I pointed the prisoner out to Mr. Allen the next morning.
Prisoner. Q. Did you speak to me at the time I was at the door? A. No—I don't know whether you saw me—you could have seen me if he had turned round—I was sitting on a box with a child.
THOMAS PAYNE . I keep the Inkermann beer-house, at 7, Church-street, Kensington—on Wednesday, 22d November, I saw the prisoner at my house between 5 and 6, as near as possible—he treated me and others—I think he stood three or four pots of ale to the customers who were in the room, and then he said, would I give him a sovereign for a pound's worth of silver—my wife then suggested that, as he had got a lot of money, he should leave some of it, or he might lose it, and he left four pounds' worth of silver with
me—he pulled out 4l. 5s. 6d. in silver, and he took the 5s. 6d. and 1l. 4l. remarking that he was going on furlough on the Saturday to the Tuesday, and he would call for it on the Saturday—he said he was going then to Charing-cross to meet his young woman.
CHARLES CHAPMAN . I lodge at the Inkermann public-house—on Wednesday, 22d November, between 5 and 6, I saw the prisoner there, and drank with him several times—he asked me if I would fetch him a bottle of pale brandy, and he gave me this 5l. note—I got the brandy at the Civet Cat, and got the note changed there—I gave the brandy and the change to the prisoner.
Prisoner. Q. What time was it when I gave you the note? A. It might be about 6 o'clock.
NATHANIEL DRUSCHVICH (Policeman, A 36). On Saturday, 2d December, I apprehended the prisoner at Chelsea barracks—he was at once identified by Chapman—I told the prisoner the charge—he said, "I know nothing about it"—the moment he came into the room, Chapman said, "There he is"—there were other soldiers there, dressed similar to the prisoner.
Prisoner to CHARLES ALLEN. Q. Was the money that you lost nearly all half-crowns? A. The silver was a mixture, half-crowns, two-shilling-pieces, shillings, sixpences, fourpenny-pieces, and threepenny-pieces.
Prisoner (to THOMAS PAYNE). Q. Did you see any two-shilling-pieces in the money I gave you? A. I should say there were some, but I did not notice it—it was not all shillings—I think there were some sixpences—it was not all half-crowns—I don't think there were any fourpenny-pieces.
Prisoner's Defence. I have witnesses to prove that at the time that Chapman says I gave him the 5l. note, I was at Charing-cross, and the money I gave to Mr. Payne I received from a gentleman whom I am in the habit of going to see at Knightsbridge; he gave me 5l. 5s. 6d.; I was at the Inkermann that same afternoon; I know Mr. Payne very well; as to giving a 5l. note, I never saw it.
The Paymaster stated that the witnesses spoken of by the prisoner declined to attend, though they had had leave to do so.
GUILTY .—The Prisoner received a good character as a soldier.— Confined Eighteen Months.
JOHN LAW . I am a goldbeater, residing at 3 and 4 North-side, Bethnal-green—the prisoner was in my service some years ago, about twenty-five, I suppose—on 28th October the men came to work in the morning—I had seen all the things brought and put in the counting-house over night, and I saw them safe—when the men came to work, their boxes, their tools, and their gold were missing; the gold upon which the men had been working: I believe the value was about 60l.—I have seen a portion of the tools since, the gold I have not—these skins (Produced) are my property—I never dispose of these skins—I received a note from a person named Kinohkoff, in consequence of which I went, on 14th November, to 1, Guildhall-chambers,
Basinghall-street, with police-sergeant 48 K—I waited there till the prisoner came—when I saw him, I said, "Your name is Killbam"—he said "Yes"—I said, "You have robbed me before; where did you get these moulds from?" pointing to these, which were on the desk—he said, "I met two men in the street"—I said, "Was there any one else?" he said, "No, two men in the street"—that was all the information I could get from him—he asked me if I would go out in the street and he would show me the men—I did not go—I sent the policeman, and he brought in two men from a public-house—one of them has since been discharged, the other I let go at the time—I did not know him—the other man was in my service—he left for dishonesty on 15th September—I then gave the prisoner into custody.
JOHN HILL . I live at 4, Penderson's-gardens, Bethnal-green-road, and work at the prosecutor's—on the evening before this property was missed, I saw it safe in the shop—I had seen the whole of it during the day—I know these skins; they are my master's property—I don't know whether he disposes of them—they are sold for the foreign market, after they have been used here, by goldbeaters—they are not the subject of sale here in England.
WILLIAM KINCHKOFF . I am an importer of foreign goods at 1, Guildhall-chambers, Basinghall-street—on 13th November, the prisoner came to my office in the afternoon, and produced this property to me for sale—there were only the skins—he asked 16l. for them, I offered him 12l. the goods being an inferior quality, and that being a fair price for them—I paid him on that day 2l. and said if he came the next day, and I found them correct, I would give him the rest—he gave me a receipt, and gave the name of Henry Killham, either 54 or 45, New Compton-street, Soho—I wrote that down on an invoice, and he then stated if might be 22, as the numbers had been changed—I told him to call the next morning, and upon that he left the property—I then wrote to Mr. Law, hearing that he had been robbed, and gave up the property to him the next day.
Prisoner. Q. Did I not ask you to send your lad down to my place? A. You did.
RICHARD HARRIS (Policeman, K 48). About 9 o'clock on the morning of 14th November I went to Mr. Kinchkoff's, and saw Mr. Law and the prisoner there—Mr. Law accused him of stealing these skins—he said he did not steal them, he got them from two men in the street to sell for them; and that if Mr. Law would go out with him, he would point the two men out—I went out and saw two men in a public-house at the corner of Guildhall-chambers—I knew one of them because I had had something to do with him some time previous—Mr. Law suspected him of stealing his property—I asked them if they would accompany me to 1, Guildhall-chambers—they did so, and Mr. Law gave one, William Thomas, into custody—he was afterwards discharged—when I took the prisoner, he said he did not steal it, he had only had it given him to sell.
The prisoner's statement before the Magistrate:—"The only thing I have to say is, that I am quite innocent of knowing the goods to have been stolen; I offered them to the gentleman, and he agreed to buy the things; and as to the direction, my name is in two directories; you will find it in last year's as No. 22."
GUILTY .— Confined Six Months.
MR. WARNER SLEIGH conducted the Prosecution.
MARTHA DOWDELL . I am the wife of John Dowdell, of 3, Vine-place, Old-street-road—on 20th November, I went to bed about 10 o'clock—I locked up the house, and fastened the windows of the room in which I slept—that is the ground-floor, next to the street—I did not fasten the shutters—I saw this quilt (produced) and a blanket there then—they are my husband's property—there are two blankets and a counterpane here; the sheet is gone—about half-past 11, I heard my son come home—he sleeps in the same room, in a separate bed—he went to sleep, and about three hours afterwards he awoke me—I struck a light, and found that the window was wide open, and the blanket and counterpane were gone—I raised an alarm, went out with a neighbour, and saw three policemen, and afterwards saw the prisoners in custody.
JOHN DOWDELL . I am a son of the last witness—on this night, I went home about half-past 12—I went to sleep, and awoke between 3 and half-past in the morning—I felt the bed-clothing snatched from my bed—I have heard my mother give her evidence; it is quite correct.
COURT. Q. You were lying under these clothes asleep, were you? A. Yes, under the window—the bed is close to the window, any one could put their hands in and take them out, without getting into the room.
JOHN GILROY (Policeman, G 126). About half-past 3 on the morning of 20th November, I was on duty in the Curtain-road—I saw the female prisoner secreting herself behind a packing-case in Mills'-court—she popped round the corner and looked to see if any person was coming, and she then came out into the court and squatted down—she then got up, and came across the road by where I was standing—I asked her what she was doing there—she said she was doing something for herself—I said it would be better for her to go home, and she then passed on—thinking that all was not right, I went across the road, and looked in the packing-case where I had seen her, and found these two blankets and a counterpane, quite warm, in the packing-case—I watched and saw the female prisoner come back in company with Jones; they went to the packing-case, and were in the act of taking the property away when I pounced upon them—I had left it there—Jones shammed drunkenness—I kept them there till I got assistance, and then took them to the station—I found this knife on Jones—the prosecutor's house is not quite a quarter of a mile from there; about three or four minutes' walk.
Walton's Defence. I never saw the young man till I was going home, and 1 met him as a friend; I am an unfortunate girl; I asked him if he was going home with me, and we went down the same court I came up.
Jones's Defence. I had been to a raffle, and on coming up Norfolk-gardens, I met this female, and she asked me if I was going home with her. I was going up the gardens, and the constable took me; he found that knife upon me, which I use for my own work, cane-splitting.
JONES— NOT GUILTY .
WALTON— GUILTY .— Confined Three Months.
MR. PLATT conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM MASON (Policeman, X 259). From information I received, I went on Monday, 11th December, about half-past 9 in the morning, to the prisoner's house on Uxbridge-common—I went into the bed-room, and saw two small mutton-bones, which were cooked, on the table-Henry White was in bed-1 asked him how he could account for the meat that these bones belonged to—he said that he did not know-David was out then—I went and took him afterwards—It is David's house, and the son lives with him—I then went upstairs, searched the bed-room, and found two fore-quarters of mutton and a piece of the neck, in a drawer, and a piece of lights and liver on the table—I sent for another constable to assist me, and left him in charge of Henry White—I took David about half an hour afterwards, up the George-road, a little way off—I took him to his house, and asked him how he came in possession of that meat—he said, "1 know nothing about it"—I found a pocket-knife in David's coat-pocket—It had some fresh blood on it, and some wool—I noticed blood on Henry White's trousers—I found fresh blood at the bottom of the legs, as if something bloody had been pushed against it—on the morning of the 12th, I took both prisoners' boots into the field, where the sheep had been kept—there were foot-prints in the field—I compared the boots with the tracks of two persons, to and fro—there were several nails out, and the place where the nails were out, exactly corresponded with the tracks in the field—on the same morning, I found a hurdle close to the place where the sheep had been stolen; I produce a piece of wool from it—there was an impression on the wool, that had been made by the trousers that Henry was wearing, as if he had sat on it—the prisoner's house is about 300 or 400 yards from where the sheep was stolen—I produce a skin—there is a head and neck that fits in it.
JOHN MAYDON . I had fifteen foreign sheep in a field at Uxbridge, on Sunday, 10th December I sent my boy to see them on the 9th—I had seen them two or three days before-my attention was called to the skin and entrails of a sheep which had been found in a field on the Sunday morning, as I was riding down to look at my cattle-fourteen remained; I missed one—this (produced) is the skin of one of my sheep—It is marked on the head with ochre.
JOHN VAGG . I am a butcher—I examined the neck of mutton, with the head and skin of a sheep, they tally, and are part of the same animal—I have matched part of the ribs with the skin, where a small piece of meat had been left on the skin—there is a vacant place where the neck has been parted—the sheep was not killed as a butcher would kill it—It was killed in an unscientific way—this knife (produced) might have been used to cut across, but it is not long enough to stick him through the neck.
WILLIAM BROWN (Policeman, X 211). On Saturday, 9th December, about quarter past 11, I saw Henry White about fifty yards from the gate of the field where the sheep was found—he appeared to be listening—when he saw me, he walked towards Uxbridge—I had a full view of him, being close by the gas.
Henry White's statement before the Magistrate: "I am not guilty; I know nothing about it."David White says: "I never left the premises of Sargood, where I live, on Saturday night, except for an hour or two in the evening, and I and my son were in bed before 11 o'clock on that night, and did not leave my bedroom until Sunday morning, and my son slept in the same room with me and my wife."
David White produced a written defence, stating that he and his son came
home together at 10 o'clock, and were not out again till 9 in the morning, and that he found the meat in a field, and took it home.
DAVID WHITE— GUILTY .— Confined Twelve Months.
HENRY WHITE— GUILT **.— Confined Eighteen Months.
NEW COURT.—Thursday, December 21st, 1865.
Before Mr. Recorder.
MR. M. WILLIAMS conducted the Prosecution, and MR. LEWIS the Defence.
WILLOUGHBY JAMES OPPETT . I am under-bailiff to the Edmonton County Court—I produce a plaint note—(This was in the cause of Reed v. Judd, for Il. debt, and 1 s. costs, for damages to a donkey-cart caused by the plaintiffs careless driving)—I was present on 7th December when the case was tried, and law the prisoner sworn—the oath was administered by Mr. Geofrey, the acting high-bailiff—the prisoner swore that he was with Judd in the cart at the time of the alleged accident, which he said was on the 13th December, 1864.
Cross-examined. Q. Did the case come on to be heard on 21th November in the first instance? A. Yes—it was partly heard before Mr. French, the Deputy Judge of the Court—Berry was examined on that occasion, and the present prosecutor was the plaintiff—the date of the accident was not mentioned on that occasion by the defendant and his witnesses, that I am aware of, but it was mentioned by the plaintiff to be the 3d—the case was adjourned for further evidence—it came on again on 7th December, before Mr. Gurdon, the Judge of the Court—the clerk keeps minutes, and this is headed "Adjourned cases", and I know it was adjourned because I was in Court and heard it adjourned—the clerk has some minute from which he can answer to the feet of adjournment—he is not here.
Q. Do you mean to represent that Berry swore that he was present at any accident? A. He swore that there was no accident—I was not present all the time of the first examination, but at the second I was present all the time Berry was being examined—he swore that when he was with the cart with Judd, no accident happened to the donkey-cart—he stated that the donkey turned out of the road, and came in contact, with the horse, therefore, of course, there must have been an accident—he swore that there was no accident when he was present in the cart, and that that was on the 13th; but he said that the donkey came round into the road, and came in contact with Judd's hone, and that that happened on the 13th—the examination lasted, I should think, four hours—that is all I recollect which I think material.
MR. WILLIAMS. Q. You say that the clerk of the Court generally makes a note of adjournments? A. He makes a note by which he can tell the Judge why the case was adjourned, but I was present and heard the case adjourned for further evidence.
RICHARD REEVES . On 3d December I went to Ponders-end with a donkey-cart—I was in South-street at 5 o'clock, and my cart was standing with one wheel in the gutter, on the left-hand side of the road—that would be my right side if I was travelling—while I was at the door of a house I heard another cart coming along—I heard a crash, and found a horse and cart
against my donkey-cart—the wheel was behind my wheel—a man, whose name I found was Judd, was in the cart, and some females, but no man but Judd—I know the defendant—he was not in the cart—he was not there at all—I brought an action in the county court against Judd—the second hearing was on 2d December, and on 7th December, the last time the case was tried, I saw the defendant there—I saw him sworn—he declared that he and Judd were present at the affair, and no one else—he was taxed very closely by the Judge, but he could not say where he was in the cart—the Judge said, "I cannot make it out where you sat; did you sit in Judd's lap?—he could give no accoun what part of the cart he sat in—he made out that he saw nothing; that nothing took place—I think he said that the cart he was in did not come within a yard of my cart—at the second hearing he declared that it took place on 13th December—I say that it took place on 3d December, 1864—I was not at Ponders-end at all on the 13th, and did not see Judd, or his horse and cart—there was more said at the last hearing, but it was such a rambling story that I cannot tell you—I know that the accident took place on 3d December, because it is my rule to go there once a month, on Saturday.
MATILDA JACKSON . I live with my parents at Smith-street, Ponders-end—I was in the County Court when this plaint was tried, and when Berry gave his evidence—he swore that it was on 13th December, 1864, that he was in the cart with Mr. Judd, and that the cart was within a yard of the donkey-cart, but did not touch it—I do not remember whether he said that he saw anything.
Cross-examined. Q. You were not even sure that there was not a man in the cart. A. There was a man and two females in the cart when I saw it.
MR. WILLIAMS stated that he could not carry the case further, and the COURT considered that the averments in the indictment were not made out.
NOT GUILTY .
The prisoner having stated in the hearing of the Jury that he was guilty of the attempt, the Jury found a verdict of
GUILTY of the attempt— Confined Twelve Months.
MR. DALEY conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM PRODDEY . I am a commercial traveller, of 24, Somerford-street, Bethnal Green—on 20th November, between three and four in the afternoon, I was in Fenchurch-street, and saw the prisoner on one side of a post and the prosecutor on the others—I heard the old gentleman say, "You have got my watch"—the prisoner said, "Let me go; I have not got it"—I saw the prisoner leave go of the watch, and run away, and the prosecutor put it in his pocket—the prisoner had not got it off the guard.
Prisoner. Q. Were there not about forty people there? A. Fifteen or twenty; a company of soldiers had just gone by—a person apprehended you, and you said that you knew nothing about it—I said, "What a lie; I saw it in your hand.
THOMAS JOHN HOOPER (City-policeman, 502). I have seen the prosecutor in the hospital in the doctor's presence—he is the same person who was examined before the Magistrate, and who gave the prisoner in charge—the prisoner was present when the prosecutor's deposition was taken, and had the opportunity of putting questions.
The Deposition of SAMUEL BAILEY. "I reside at 2, Cornwall-road, Peck-ham, Surrey, and am a builder—I was in Fenchurch-street yesterday about 3 o'clock, waiting for an omnibus—I saw the prisoner first close to me with my watch in his hand—I caught hold of him, charged him, and he dropped it—it hung by my chain from me—I kept hold of him but he escaped—I called out "Police!" and he was brought back."
Prisoner. Q. How far was I from you when you called out "Heigh?" A. Twenty yards—you escaped, but several gentlemen ran to stop you.
Prisoner's Defence. I was in the midst of about forty people, and my button got attached to the gentleman's chain, and withdrew it from his pocket—I apologized to him, but he was not satisfied.
GUILTY .**— Confined Twelve Month.
MR. PLATT conducted the Prosecution.
GUILTY .— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
THIRD COURT.—Thursday, December 21, 1865.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. METCALFE conducted the Prosecution, and MR. KEMP the Defence.
OLIVER WILLIAM SIMMONDS . I am manager to Mr. John Bennett, a watch and clock maker, of 65, Cheapside—the prisoner was in his service as assistant and salesman in the shop—he had to deliver articles to purchasers and receive money—on 9th November he was discharged—he had been home with some jewellery on the Saturday, and from some circumstances that came to our knowledge we wrote to a lady and asked her if she had paid him, and he then immediately came down and paid the money to the cashier, while I was talking to the lady—the articles had been sold on the Saturday, and this occurred on the Thursday—he received the money at the lady's house—his duty was to have paid the money in—he was asked by the assistant, "Did the lady pay you?"and he said, "No"—he had to go again to see her—the money was not paid until the lady came—he was asked about it before she came, but not in my presence—I think it was 2l. 10s.—it was on Saturday, 14th November, and it was paid on Wednesday, 18th—in consequence of a letter which had been received from Mrs. Janvrin, I communicated with Dean, and desired him to write a letter to me to explain—I saw him after that letter—I took an officer, who said, "You are charged with embezzling the sum of 7l. received by you for Mr. Benuett from Captain Taylor's servant"—I do not remember whether he said anything relating to
the articles—the prisoner said, "You cannot do that, I tendered the money to Dean"—I said that it was out of my hands now, that I must give him into custody—he did not offer to pay the money to me—he said he had been down to my house at Norwood in order to pay the money—he said that was after he had offered the money to Dean—I produce a waste book—I find an entry in the prisoner's writing on the 16th June—(read): "65, Cheap-side, London, 16th June, 1865. Captain Taylor, 6, Portsdown-road, Maida-hill. Marble clock 7l. received 16/6/65; John Bennett, per Fras. Caton"—it was about ten days after his discharge that I went down with him about the 7l.—up to the time when I told Dean to write this letter the money had never been paid in by the prisoner.
Cross-examined. Q. How long has the prisoner been in the service? A. About two years—it was his duty to collect money—he ought to have accounted for this on the Saturday—it was taken late on Saturday, and from there he went home till the Monday, which he had no right to do—I never heard before that, when he came on the Tuesday, he told somebody that he had received the money and taken it to his house, and brought it the next day—he did pay the money—I say this 7l. was not tendered to me, if it had been I should not have given him in custody—I don't know that the 7l. was offered to Mr. Dean, and that he sent the prisoner down to my place—the prisoner said something about having paid the money, and that, if it was so, I was to return it to him—Mr. Dean is here—Mr. Bennett superintends the business himself; he never receives money—if he has money from the till, it is always given to him either by myself or Dean—Mr. Bennett was not preparing to put up for the Shrievalty about this time, he knew nothing of it until the very morning of the election; he never made any preparation at all—he has a very large and extensive business, and we are not unfrequently very busy indeed.
MR. METCALFE. Q. Did the prisoner take out any other articles on 16th June? A. I don't know that he did—there is no other entry here—I think he was paid 1l. 17s. 6d. a week wages—he had not a very great deal to do with taking out articles—if the money had been offered to me on the night before, I should have taken it—I consulted Mr. Bennett in the morning, and he said he would not take it this time.
MARY BURR . I am housemaid at Captain Taylor's, 6, Portsdown-road, Maida-hill, and was so on 16th June—I paid this 7l. to the prisoner on that day—Captain Taylor is a friend of the lady who bought the clock—the prisoner signed this receipt in my presence.
GEORGE DEAN . I am a clerk in Mr. Bennett's employ—it was my duty to receive money from the prisoner—when he received this money, on 16th June, for the clock, he ought to have handed it in to me on the same day—I do not know at what hour it was received; but he certainly ought to have paid it in by the next morning—our business closes at 8 o'clock—the clock was to be delivered at 6 that night at Maida-hill—the money should have been paid in on the next morning—it was not—it was not accounted for at all to me—in consequence of what Mr. Simmonds said to me, I sent a letter to the prisoner, and afterwards saw him—he said, it was a bad job, I believe, or, "What does it mean, "I cannot say which it was; something to that effect—he said, "I do not know whether I received the money, or whether I did not; I really cannot remember; but I have some money now to go through the Bankruptcy Court"—with that he took some money out of his pocket, and said, "I can pay it, and if it should be found out afterwards to be paid, will it be refunded to me?"—I said, "If that be the case,
I have no doubt it will"—he then put it in his pocket again—it never left his hands—I do not know how much he took out—it was a roll of money wrapped up together—I went down to the house, in consequence of a letter from his wife or his parents—I had no authority at that time to answer him or to receive the money.
Cross-examined. Q. Did you not tell him that he must go to Mr. Simmonds and offer him the money? A. No—he asked me if Air. Simmonds would mind if he went down to his house—I said, I did not think he would—he went to Mr. Simmonds' house—the prisoner did offer me the money again the morning before he was arrested—I do not remember that he did—he told me he could not see Mr. Simmonds.
CHARLES THOMAS GAYLOR (City-policeman, 498). I apprehended the prisoner on 1st December, at his house in Elmore-road, Islington—I told him he was charged with receiving 7l. of Captain Taylor's servant, and not accounting for it to his master—he said it was an unfortunate affair, that he had been down, the night previous, to see Mr. Simmonds, to pay him the money, and he was not at home—Mr. Simmonds was then present they had some private conversation, which I did not hear—Mr. Simmonds said he had seen Mr. Bennett since that night, and he was determined to prosecute—I found 8s. and 1/2 d. or 1/4 d. on the prisoner—I did not search his house.
NOT GUILTY .
MR. DALEY conducted the Prosecution, and MR. MONTAGUE WILLIAMS
ANN GORDON . I live at 7, Everard-street, St. George's, Whitechapel, and am an unfortunate girl—on Saturday night, 2d December, I met the prisoner in a public house, the Mahogany Bar—I had some words with her—I was afterwards going home, and saw her on before me, with her bonnet and shawl off—I do not know whether she left before me—we had the words between 10 and 11, and I saw her again about 12——she said, "Now, English Annie, are you ready for me?"—I went into my house, and took my clothes off, and came out again—the prisoner lives at No. 11, and I live at No. 7—it was just as I was going into my house that she said, "Now, English Annie, are you ready for me?"—I said, "Now, Martha Smith, what do you want with me?"—she said, "Take that,"and she cut me with a table-knife on the forehead—I put this plaister on, myself—some one went and fetched a constable, and I was taken to the station, and then to the hospital—the prisoner ran away into her house, and looked out at her bed-room window—I was bleeding—I do not know where she got the knife.
Cross-examined. Q. What time did the assault take place. A. I believe it was past 12; the public-houses were being closed—the prisoner was home before me—going from the Mahogany Bar to her own house, she would have to pass my door—I did not go to her house—I was going in at my own door when this happened—I had not gone beyond it—she is an unfortunate girl like myself—I did not go knocking at her door—I had had a glass, but I was sober; I knew what I was about—I cannot say whether she went home with a sailor—I did not see her leave the Mahogany Bar—she was quite close to me when she said, "Are you ready for me now, English Annie"——it was in the middle of the street: I should say there are about three dozen houses on each side in Everard-street—she was not at the top of the street when
she spoke to me—she came out at her own door, and she was coming towards me when she said it—I do not know a man named Philip Baker, a bootmaker, at 12, Everard-street, Commercial-road—I was not screaming, or making use of bad language before the prisoner touched me—I did not go and knock at her door, and she did not come to the window before she stabbed me—I know a Mrs. Dawson, of 14, Everard-street, I believe she works for the prisoner—I cannot say what became of the table-knife—she shut the door, and went up stairs into her bed-room after she had done it—it was a dinner knife—when she said, "Take that;"I saw the knife—I was once charged with committing an assault on a woman.
MR. DALEY. Q. Were there any other persona present at the time you were stabbed? A. No, not until I screamed "Murder."
ADAM CARR (Policeman, H 40.) I heard cries and went up—the prosecutrix was bleeding a great deal from the forehead—she said the prisoner had stabbed her with a table-knife and gave her in custody—the prisoner was then looking out at her window—I saw the prosecutrix knock at her door when I came up, after she was stabbed.
Cross-examined. Q. Is the prosecutrix rather troublesome when she has got a drop of drink? A. When she is drunk she is sometimes—I did not see any knife—I did not see a sailor with the prisoner—she was looking out at the window, and as soon as I knocked at the door she came out—when she was charged she said she did not do it—there were knives in the prisoner's house, but I could not find one with blood on it.
JOHN LAWSON . I am house-surgeon at the London Hospital—the prosecutrix was brought in there with an incised wound about an inch long on her forehead above the right eye—the tissues were divided down to the bone—it was such a wound that a knife would inflict—I dressed it—she was made an out-patient—the wound is healed now—it could not have been inflicted by a fall on the pavement——the prosecutrix had not black eyes.
MR. WILLIAMS to ANN GORDON Q. Did you threaten the prisoner before this that you would have her in prison before long? A. No, not at any time.
Witnesses for the Defence.
PHILIP BAKER .—I am a bootmaker of 12, Everard-street Commercial-road East—I know the prosecutrix—I saw her outside the prisoner's house—kicking and thumping at the door, and she asked the prisoner to come down and fight, using disgusting language—the prisoner did not come down—she was in her own house—I did not see her—the prosecutrix said, "Martha Smith, come down you long cow,"—I did not see the prisoner at that time—I afterwards saw her come to the window—I saw the policeman come up—I am positive the prisoner did not come down into the street from the time I heard the prosecutrix call out till the policeman came up—I saw the prisoner go in-doors, there was nobody with her then—the policeman was coming down the street when I went in-doors—I did not know she was given in charge then—I know the prisoner—she is the quietest person as need be, for a woman of her sort.
Cross-examined by MR. DALEY. Q. What do you mean by disgusting language? A. She called her all the blackguard names she could think of—I call "long cow" disgusting—I was smoking my pipe previous to going to bed—I work for my father—he keeps a shop at 134, Leman-street, and I live in Everard-street—I am married—my wife lives with me—I have never spoken to the prosecutrix or prisoner—I did not see that the prosecutrix
was stabbed when the prisoner came up—I did not see whether she was bleeding from the forehead—her side face was to me—she did not scream—I was three doors from her and cannot tell whether she was bleeding or not.
SARAH ANN DAWSON . I live at 14, Everard-street—I know the prisoner and the prosecutrix—they both live in the same street as I do—the prisoner is quiet and inoffensive—and the prosecutrix, when she gets drunk, is very noisy and will insult anybody—on this Saturday night, about 5 minutes past 12, I was standing by my door and saw the prisoner go in-doors and shut her door—a few minutes afterwards I and my husband went up stairs to bed, and I heard some one screaming and screeching at the top of the street—I looked out at my bed-room window and saw the prosecutrix coming down the street—she seemed as if she was very intoxicated—she came to the prisoner's door and kicked at it and said, "Come out, Martha Smith, if you want anything of me", and called her beastly names—the prisoner then opened her window, looked out, and said, "Annie, go away, I don't want anything of you,"—she then threw herself down on the pavement and then the policeman came up, but the prisoner never came down stairs till the policeman fetched her out—the prosecutrix was always on to the prisoner, always kicking up a disturbance; every night she kicks up a disturbance when she is in drink.
Cross-examined. Q. Did you see any cut on the prosecutrix's forehead? A. No—I can take my solemn oath that the prisoner never came out—there was no blow struck at all—I remember when the policeman came; I saw the cut then—I don't know how it occurred, I suppose she must have been quarrelling before—my husband is a carman—I should say I have known both the prisoner and the prosecutrix these seven years—I was at the police-court, but was not examined.
COURT. Q. Where was the prosecutrix when you first saw her? A. Coming down the street towards the prisoner's door, between her own door and the prisoner's—she looked as if she had been fighting—her face was wet—I suppose it was blood.
GUILTY of unlawfully wounding.— Confined Six Months.
MR. POYNTER conducted the Prosecution
THOMAS BURNS . I am a bricklayer, and live at 1, Stepney Causeway—at half-past one on Sunday morning, 26th November, I was walking up the Whitechapel-road, in the direction of my home, when the prisoner and one or two others came up and knocked me down on my face, and while I was down, one of them picked my left hand trousers pocket—I cannot swear to the amount of money that I had, but they took it all, and a knife and a pocket comb—I have seen my knife and comb since in the hands of the police—the men ran away—I did not see the prisoner taken.
Prisoner. Q. Were there sdef3-129-18651218ome females there? A. I saw one, and she picked up a penny—I had a lot of coppers and some silver.
SAMUEL RIMELL (Policeman, H 159). About half-past one on this morning I heard the prosecutor cry out, "Police,"and saw the prisoner running away from him—I went across the road to stop him, and as soon as he saw me he turned in the opposite direction, and ran away from me—I followed him and caught hold of him; he threw himself down and threw
3 1/2 d., a knife, and a comb on the pavement, and said, "This if all I took from him"—this is the knife and comb (produced)—I held the prisoner down and the prosecutor came up and said he was one of the men who had knocked him down and robbed him—the prisoner said, "If you won't knock me about I will go with you quiet"
Prisoner. Q. Did I not give you the money, and the knife, and the comb? A. No, I picked them up off the pavement.
Prisoner's Defence. At half-past one I was coming up Whitechapel-road from the play with my employer, and saw two females and three or four men; the prosecutor was lying on the ground, and as they picked him up some halfpence fell on the pavement. I picked up 2 1/2 d., a knife, and a comb, and my employer picked up a penny. I was going along when the policeman came up and took me for being concerned in a robbery. I am innocent of it.
MR. LILLET conducted the Prosecution, and MESSRS. RIBTON and STABLING defended Hands.
CHARLES QUANTIOK . I am a seaman—on 11th December I was staying at the Sailors' Home in Whitechapel—on the night of 11th December, about half-past nine, I was in Cannon-street, going home—I was sober—I met the prisoners and was about to pass them, when Manning touched me on the shoulder, and said, "How are you getting on?—I said, "Nicely "—Donovan was then on the other side of me—I went to go on and Manning said, "I see, you don't know a person now"—I did not stop, and he then came up to me, and said, "D—n it, you don't know a person, you don't recollect me the other day, fetching you to the Sailors' Home?"—I turned round and said, "I know nothing about you, my good man; you did not fetch me there"—he then struck me behind the ear as hard as he could—I recollect seeing him about Wells-street, where the Sailors' Home is, before that—Donovan then grabbed me on the side by the coat, tore my coat open, got his hand in my waistcoat pocket, and took out my money—I had hold of his hand and felt the money in his hand—Manning then struck me again with his fist, and I was pretty near stunned—I called "Police"—after Manning struck me the second time, he put his hand in my right waistcoat pocket, in which I had 5d. in copper, which he took out—I then got away from them and crossed the street; I saw them turn a corner and followed them—I then saw two women, Hands was one of them—I went a little further, saw a policeman, and made a complaint to him—he gave not the least attention to me—I left him to go away and the three prisoners then made a chase after me, and the woman came up to me at different times and got me by the coat and tried to get it off—I turned round and saw her face at different times—I went into a public-house and made a complaint to the landlord, and about five minutes afterwards police-constable Barnes called me out—I gave him some information and went with him to another public-house; I believe it was the Crown—I went in—he remained outside—I went into a room, and saw about fifteen or sixteen men and women assembled
together—the three prisoners were amongst them—Barnes then came in, and I pointed the prisoners out to him—I lost 3s. from the pocket in which the silver was and 5d. from the other—I saw the money safe about ten or fifteen minutes before the prisoners came up to me—I had seen both the men before at different times in Wells-street together—I saw Hands four or five times, and as I was going into the first public-house I looked round into her face, and she said, "D—n it, we will murder you"—they were all taken into custody.
Manning. Q. How long have you been home from sea? A. I had been stopping at the Sailors' Home about a fortnight—I saw you in Wells-street almost every day, perhaps a dozen times a day.
Cross-examined by MR. STARLING. Q. Had you ever seen Hands before? A. No—I did not see her that night till after the men had turned the B. corner.
MR. LILLEY. Q. Had you opportunities enough of seeing her to identify her? A. Yes; she is the person who came and endeavoured to pull my coat off—I had never spoken to the men before—I followed the men round the corner directly—I saw the woman following them as they turned from me—I saw the two women standing back from them when they made the attack on me—the other woman took no part in it at all.
THOMAS BARNES (Police-sergeant, H 10). About five or ten minutes past nine, on the night of 11th November, I was in Cable-street, which is not far from Cannon-street—I received some information which induced me to go to the Hoop and Grapes—I there saw the prosecutor, and called him out—to gave me some information, and I went with him to the Crown—I had seen the prisoners go in there—the prosecutor also gave ma a description of them—he went in first, and then I went in and took them in custody—he pointed them out to me—he was sober—I searched the prisoners at the station—on Manning I found 3s. 2d., on Donovan 2s. 6 1/2 d.—Manning said he knew nothing at all about it, they had been at work together—after I told Donovan the charge, he said, "Why he only charged us before with taking 5d., and now it is 3s"—the prosecutor had a scratch on his nose, and on the following morning his jaw was swollen very much and bruised.
Mannings Defence. Me and this man were at work on Monday, 11th December, and as we were coming along, we met this woman and another, and we went to the Crown to have some beer. We afterwards came out, and met this sailor and two tall men, they were all struggling together, and the sailor then crossed the road. He told a policeman that he had been robbed; the policeman said, "Who robbed you?"and he said, "I don't know"—we stood there listening to him, and the man turned round, and said, "Those two men robbed me,"and the policeman would not take us—the prosecutor said then that he had lost 5d.—he then walked up towards the Sailor's Home—this woman ran before us up to him, and then she came back to us, and said, "I have given him a good hitting and shoving for accusing us"—we then went to the Crown for some more beer, and the sailor and another policeman came in, and gave us in charge.
Donovan's Defence. I saw these men struggling—he dropped a halfpenny on the ground, and the two tall men walked away from him—the policeman asked him what he had been robbed of, and he said 5d., and the policeman would not take us in charge—we stood talking to him, and then went into the Crown—the woman came back, and said, "I gave him such a blow on the back of the head, and shoved him into a fried-fish shop"—the sailor came into the Crown and gave us in charge.
The Prisoners called
ISAAC BRANSLEY (Policeman, K 111). On 11th December I was on duty to Cannon-street, and saw the prosecutor—he came up to me and said, "I have lost 5d"—I said, "Who was it?"and he said he did not know—I crossed the road with him, and he saw the two male prisoners, and said, "Those are the men"—I asked him which one it was who robbed him, and he said he did not know—I thought it was a common drunken row—the prosecutor was very excited—I took him to be drunk, and I took no further notice—a mob assembled, and I told' them to go away.
THE COURT considered that there was no evidenced of robbery against
HANDS.— NOT GUILTY .
MR.—conducted the Prosecution, and MR. COOPER the Defence.
ANN HARRINGTON . I live at 4, Nassau-street, and am a prostitute—on the night of 6th December I met the prisoner outside the Blue Anchor, in Ratcliffe-highway—he went home with me—he gave me 4s.—he jumped into bed with his trowsers on—I said, "Take your trowsers off"—he then opened his leather belt, which was round his waist, drew his knife, made use of very nasty expressions, and then made an attempt to cut my throat—I put my hand up to save it, and my finger was cut—I jumped out of bed, opened the door, and called for help—I had my fingers dressed at the hospital—I gave the prisoner in charge—he did not go away—there was a light in the room.
Cross-examined. Q. You had been drinking, had you not? A. No—he took me into the Blue Anchor and gave me a glass of gin—that is all I had, and a drop; of half-and-half—the prisoner was rather intoxicated, but he know what he was about—we had been in bed about ten minutes when he pulled out his knife—he gave me all the money he had—he had neither pipe nor tobacco—I have been a prostitute about eleven years—it was my own house we went to—I have one room to myself.
MARY HOLLIDAY . I am the wife of John Holliday, a sailor, and live next door to the prosecutrix—on this night I was sent for, and went in, and saw the pcosecutrix standing by her bedside, with her finger bleeding—the prisoner was sitting up in the bed—I asked him why he did it—he said he did not do it; she did it herself—she said that she saved her throat from being cut and had her finger cut—I saw a knife in the policeman's hands.
Cross-examined. Q. Do not sailors always have a knife with them? A. Yes, I believe they do—the cut was just at the top of the middle finger.
ADAM CARR (Policeman, H 40) I was called to the prosecutrix's house, and saw her bleeding from the finger—she charged the prisoner with attempting to cut her throat, and cutting her finger—the bed was all covered with blood; and this knife I found between the bed and the palliasse—it is an ordinary sailor's knife.
Cross-examined. Q. Did the prisoner appear the worse for liquor? A. I believe he had been drinking—this is a kind of knife all sailors use.
GUILTY of unlawfully wounding.— Recommended to mercy by the Jury.— Confined Four Months.
MR. COOPER conducted the Prosecution.
JOSEPH DREETON . I am an oil-stone cutter at 6 A, Carlton-square, Mile-end—I know the prisoner—I was present on the 25th December, 1855, at the parish church, Bethnal-green, when she was married to a Mr. Henry Bates—I was one of the attesting witnesses to the marriage—I have not seen him for six years—I saw him after the marriage—I never visited them—they lived together as far as I know.
ANN CROSSLEY . I am the wife of John Crossley, a City-policeman, of 107, Bishopsgate-street Without—the prisoner is my sister—I was present at her marriage with Henry Bates, and was one of the attesting witnesses—I last saw Henry Bates about twelve months ago, I think, in Houndsditch—it is within a year ago—he used to work in a warehouse at a place where they sold second-hand clothes.
Prisoner. Q. Did he not run away from me? A. Yes; he had lived with you about two years, and then deserted you—you kept him for some time by needlework—he went on board ship as a common fireman.
SAMUEL BATES . I am a rag-merchant, at 150, Houndsditch—I know Henry Bates—he is my cousin—he and the prisoner lived together as hussband and wife—it is about six or seven months since I saw him—he came and slept at my house one night—he was then second engineer on board a Spanish steamer.
JAMES SHAW .—I am a vellum-binder, at 94, Aldersgate-street—I was married to the prisoner, Jane Bates, at St. Andrew's Church, Holborn, on 21st December, 1863—she described herself as being a spinster, and gave her husband's name for her father's—she always led me to suppose she was a single woman—she demanded money of me not three weeks since, and the sole object of my coming here is, that if I wish to get married I may, without being annoyed by her—I have no vindictive feeling against her—I lived with her seven mouths after the marriage, I could not live with her longer, as she abused me and got drunk.
Prisoner. Q. Did not I tell you I was a married woman when I knew you first? A. No.
Prisoner to SAMUEL BATES. Q. Did I not come to your house several times and ask you if you had heard of my husband? A. Yes—it was reported that he was dead—you told me you had received a letter from a seaman saying he was dead—that was over two years ago.
ANN CROSSLET (re-examined). A sailor came to my house with a letter specifying that her husband had been dead two years, and the prisoner afterwards came to me crying and in great distress—I sent to make inquiries about the sailor, but he was gone—Shaw is living with another woman now.
GUILTY .— Confined Three Days.
MR. LEIGH conducted the Prosecution.
ROBERT HUTCHINSON . I am a seafaring man, and was lately lodging at the Sailors' Home, in Wells-street—on 27th November, about 11 o'clock, I had been drinking with Margaret Hines in a public-house in Wells-street—I was going a bit of the way home when I met the prisoner—Hines pointed to him and said, "There, Robert, there is the man who has got your coat"—he had my coat on at that time—I said, "Give it up,"and he struck me on the face with his fist, and then drew out something from his left side, and stabbed me on the left side of the head and the ear—I was out—he struck me once with his fist and then with the knife, hard—I have a mark on my head still—I had a doctor for about five days—the prisoner ran away after it happened.
MARGARET HINES . I live at 4, North East-passage, St. George's—I was with the prosecutor on the night this happened—the account he has given is correct—I saw the prisoner pull the knife from his pocket and strike him on the head—the prosecutor only asked him for his coat, and he struck him.
COURT. Q. How did he come to have the prosecutor's coat? A. I had the coat on my arm in a beer shop, and the prisoner came in and took it off my arm and ran out, and when we went out I saw him with the coat.
WILLIAM JENKINS (Policeman, H 220). I was on duty in Cable-street, just at the top of Wells-street, on 27th—I went up and found the prosecutor bleeding very much—two persons were taking a knife from the prisoner, and I took it out of their hands—this is it (produced)—the prisoner attempted to run away, but I stopped him—there was a great deal of blood on the knife when I took it—it is a seaman's sheath knife—I do not know what the prisoner is.
Prisoner's Defence. I went into this public-house and a man there struck me: I pulled my coat off and threw it down, and then two more attacked me; I then picked up, as I thought, my own coat and went out. About 11 I met this man and he said, "You have got my coat on."I said, "I have not,"and he got hold of me and dragged me about and tore my shirt, and I got a good licking, and could not see; I was about half tight. As to having a knife, I don't recollect anything at all about it.
WILLIAM JENKINS (re-examined). I think the prisoner had two black eyes—he was sober as far as I know—he may have got the black eyes from the mob who surrounded him, and tried to take the knife out of his hand.
GUILTY .— Confined Twelve Months.
FOURTH COURT.—Thursday, December 21st, 1865.
MR. DALEY conducted the Prosecution;MESSRS. COOPER and LILLEY defended
Lemore;MR. WILL defended McCormack; and MR. WARNER SLEIGH defended Southwell.
JACOB KNIEL . I live at 42, Museum-street, and am an artist—a little after 12 o'clock on Wednesday morning, 29th November, I was going down Newton-street, close by where I live, and saw the four prisoners coming out of the Bell public-house, and they surrounded me—Southwell stood in front
of me, and took my watch out of my waistcoat pocket while the others held me—he did not get the money—he ran away with my watch—I ran after him down Newton-street into Charles-street—the other prisoners stopped there—I came back—when I got into Holborn again, I looked for a police-man, but could not find one—George came and put his hand into my pocket—there were three there—the one that took the watch was away—George did not get the chain, it was still hanging in my waistcoat—he got some loose money out of my right-hand trousers pocket—I went to look for a policeman, and then went to the station-house and made the charge—I was called out of my place about half-past 12 or 1 o'clock—I went to the station about a quarter to 2 to see if I could identify the prisoners—I went into the yard and directly identified Southwell as the one that took the watch, and also identified the others—they said that the police told me to pick them out; which I deny—the police-constable said, "Which one?"and I went to him and took him out; he was placed among twenty of thirty others—I picked the four out of the lump.
Cross-examined by MR. COOPER. Q. I suppose at the time you were somewhat frightened? A. Certainly—I have not seen any of these men before—the men who stood in a circle were not much bigger men than these—that was the only boy there—I have never said I would not swear to Southwell.
Cross-examined by MR. WILL. Q. Have not you said before that you cannot be sure about the prisoners, except the one that took the watch? A. I said I did not know their names—there were a good many tall men there some policemen in plain clothes—they told me to see if I could pick them out, and put me in the middle.
Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Do you know, the officer Ackerell by name? A. Yes—when I identified these men I do not know whether that officer was in the yard in plain clothes; he might have been—there was nothing particular that I should take notice of—I spoke to Ackerell in the sergeant's room—I looked at the men facing me—they directly caught my sight—they were the very first—there ware some detectives there—Ackerell may have been there, but I cannot remember where he stood—I say that when the watch was taken away from me I ran after Southwell—I ran about 100 yards after South well—Lemore and McCormack did not hold me by the arms and prevent me from running after Southwell—I have been examined before the police Magistrate—my evidence was read over to me—I was asked if it was correct? I put my signature to it—(The depositions being put in, stated: "The prisoner Southwell took my watch from my waistcoat pocket and ran away with it; the prisoners Lemore and McCormack held me, and prevented me from going after the prisoner Southwell—I saw George when the watch was taken; I am almost certain of George being there")—they came out of the Bell public-house—I was outside the Bell public-house when I was robbed—I was not coming out of the public-house, they surrounded me at the door as I was passing—it was done quietly—I was in company with a female—she is not here to-day—I have never seen her since.
MR. DALEY. Q. What became of her? A. I do not know—I had been with her about two minutes—she spoke to me, and walked along my side.
MR. SLEIGH. Q. Had you been out spending the evening that night? A. No—I had nothing to drink that night.
Prisoner George. Q. You say I put my hand in your pocket? A. Yes;
the right—I believe it is you, but I will not swear to you—yon bad a light coat on—I do not recollect anything about your hat.
MR. DALEY. Q. Where were the other men? A. In a circle—I do not know whether there was room enough to put them in a line—nobody came opposite the man—there was a gas light there.
WILLIAM ACKERELL (Police-sergeant, F 15). About half-past 11 o'clock on Tuesday, 28th November, I was on duty in Holborn—I saw the four prisoners together outside the Bell public-house, in Newton-street—I am sure they are the men—they appeared to have seen me, and they went into the Bell about half-past 11—when I got to the station the next morning I heard there had been a robbery—I heard a description at the station—I went in search of the prisoners on the 30th—I went into Newton-street and saw McCormack and Southwell in the bar of the Bell—Brannan was with me—I went into the parlour, and saw Lemore and George in there, and three others that I wanted for another case—I took them out altogether—they wanted to know the charge, and I told them for assaulting and robbing a gentleman a couple of nights ago out in the street—Southwell said, "All rjght, give us fair play"—with assistance I took them to the station—I believe Southwell is his right name—we put them with about thirty in the yard, and the prosecutor was sent for, and he came and picked them out.
Cross-examined by MR. COOPER. Q. Did not you take Lemore for some one else that was found to be in gaol? A. No, I took the four for this case alone.
Cross-examined by MR. WILL. Q. Was there any constable in plain clothes among the thirty? A. There were some outside—there ware thirty there besides constables—there was no constable in plain clothes among the thirty—I got the thirty from a public-house—it was about 2 o'clock.
Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Did not you take Southwell for some one else? A. No—Southwell is the right name, I believe—I took him that night for Walker—I was not in the circle—I was not standing next to Sputhwell, I was outside the circle—I did not stand behind Southwell—I saw him about half-past 11.
Prisoner George. Q. Do you say you saw me in the company of these men about 11 o'clock on the same evening? A. About half-past 11—you were in the tap-room—I think there were about six policemen in uniform—I took in eight when I came for you—I was in the room, but not near them—Brannan was there all the time with the prosecutor.
COURT. Q. How was the boy dressed, as you see him now? A. He had a longer coat on that night—I have seen him with a light coat on—he had a rough overcoat on—it was a dark night—his arm is disabled; he can lift it, but I do not believe he could use it with any strength—I dare say he could take a watch with it—I should not think be could put it in a man's pocket; he might by shoving his body up.
JURY. Q. Is there any use in his fingers? A. Yes, he can use his hand.
MR. DALEY. Q. When you say that night, do you mean that night or the night before? A. The night of the robbery—he had a dirty coat on then—sometimes he has a light coat on.
THOMAS MACK (Policeman, F 98). I was with Ackerell on the night of 28th November—I saw the prisoners standing outside the Bell public-house in Newton-street—there were two or three girls with them—it was about half-past 11 o'clock.
Cross-examined by MR. CQQPER. Q. Do you make mistakes sometimes? A. Not very often.
Prisoner George. Q. What time was it when you saw me? A. Half-past 11—you were with the other three and two or three girls—it was a dark coat and a black cap that you had on.
Cross-examined by MR. SLEIGH. Q. Have you been examined before? A. No.
JAMES BRANNAN (Inspector, F). About a quarter to 12 I went to the Bell public-house with Ackerell—I saw the four prisoners there, two in front of the bar, and two in the parlour—Ackerell said, "We are going to take you into custody for assaulting a gentleman"—they were then sent to the station—I think Southwell said, "Give us fair play"—at the station they were put with twenty-six other men taken from the street and adjoining public-houses, and after putting them all in a circle I asked the whole of the prisoners if they were satisfied as to the number and sizes of the men that I had put with them—they said, "Yes"—before the prosecutor came, McCormack shifted his position from one side to the other—I then called the prosecutor out, and he went into the centre of the circle that was made, and without the slightest hesitation picked the four prisoners out—they were placed in the dock—Southwell said, "I am innocent about this; the men are here who done it"; pointing to Lemore he said, "That is the fellow that took the watch"—Lemore said, "No, I am not, but it was you, so help me good God; it was you, and you know I could lag you often, and you ought not to have turned round on me like that."
Cross-examined by MR. COOPER. Q. Was that all that passed? A. Yes—they were charged.
Cross-examined by MR. WILL. Q. When they were identified were they together? A. They placed themselves where they liked among the thirty—McCormack was not satisfied with his place, so he shifted himself from one side to the other.
MR. LILLEY called:
ELIZA BLACKETT . I am a widow, and live at 7, Waterloo-street, Albion-town—on 28th November I went to see my sister, and on returning home, I met Lemore, whom I had never seen before, and a female whom I knew, by the Eastern Counties Railway, Shoreditch, about half-past 11 o'clock—I continued in their company till a quarter past 12—I walked with them as far as the Primrose public-house, Norton Folgate, and had some ale with them—we stopped till the public-house closed.
Cross-examined by MR. DALEY. Q. What are you? A. A milliner and dressmaker—my husband was a general salesman—I never knew Lemore till last Tuesday three weeks—I met the three parties together in Shore-ditch—the female gave me to understand that it was an uncle who was with him—I do not know what business he is, or where the woman lives—her name is Barrett—I do not know where she gets her living—she had a dress for me to make for her—she brought it on the Saturday, and asked me if I remembered the young men she was in company with and had the ale—I said, "Yes"—she said, "One of them is taken up on suspicion of robbery, and has sent to know if you will come and state the time you had the ale with him"—I said, "Yes"—she said that she was given to understand that the robbery was committed on the Tuesday night I had the ale—I remembered that it was the 28th by the female coming to me—I had occasion to see my sister that very evening, and I know it was the same evening—I am sure it was Tuesday the 28th—it was last Tuesday three weeks—I knew it was the 28th when the young woman told me there was a robbery—I remembered that it was the latter end of the month, the 28th—I can tell you
what I was doing on the 27th—I was making up this widow's bonnet that is on my head—the 27th was Monday—my husband died on 7th August last—I have only known the young woman six weeks—I never asked her address—she brought a dress for me to make it—I was not speaking to the prosecutor yesterday, but on Tuesday I asked him to drink, and he took two glasses of porter in my company, and I had one—I did not ask him not to appear—other persons were present—he asked me what sort of a man Mr. Lemore was—I said that he was rather a pleasant young man, but rather slight in the whiskers—I did not say a word to the prosecutor to try and induce him not to prosecute—he voluntarily gave me this card, and told me to call upon him when I thought proper—I visited the prisoner in Newgate.
MR. LILLEY. Q. For what purpose? A. Only because I should like to see the young man, as it was very hard for him to be there, knowing he was in my company—Mrs. Barrett is here, and the young man has been here until to-day—Mrs. Barrett spoke to me on the following Saturday, and I then recollected perfectly well being in her company with the young man.
MARY BARRETT . I am married, and live at 33, Charles-street, Drury-lane—I sell things in Covent-garden-market—I know Lemore—I was in his company at the end of November with another young man whom he called his uncle—we met Mrs. Blackett in Shoreditch, facing the railway station—it was as near as I can guess from 11 to half-past—we had two pots of ale at the Primrose at the corner of Primrose-street—I continued with them till about a quarter past 12, when the house was shutting up—Lemore came right home with me to Drury-lane, and did not leave me till he wished me good night at the end of the street—it had then gone 1 o'clock—I afterwards spoke to Mrs. Blackett about the matter—I have known him about six months.
Cross-examined. Q. Did you tell her your address? A. No, because I did not think it was needed—I do not live with Lemore—I am a married woman—I was not there when his place was searched—I was at Moore's place—I live with my brother and sister, Mr. and Mrs. Lemore—I was not at the lodging of either of the prisoners, when they were searched—I did not visit either of the prisoners in prison as his wife, nor did I tell any one in the prison that I was his wife—that man (a gaoler) asked me if I was his wife, and I said, "No"—I did not use the word "alibi" in the prison—Lemore said, "You can prove I was not there"—he did not tell me I was in the Primrose drinking—I knew I was there—no one spoke about the Primrose in the presence of that warder—I only know Lemore by that name—I have known him two or three, or it may be four or five years—I never knew him by the name of Sinclair—I do not know Sinclair to be his right name—a young man who was a perfect stranger to me said that a young man was taken, Lemore, who wanted to speak to me—I said that I would go and see him, and when I went Lemore told me—he told me going along Bow-street, that I was in his company on Tuesday—he did not remind me of the date—I can think of what I was doing on 27th November, I was washing—I cannot remember what I was doing on the 23d—I know the 20th was Sunday, and Saturday I was out with my things in Covent-garden-market—I was not in a public-house the week before—I have only been into two public-houses in my life to drink with him, and one was in Drury-lane.
MR. LILLEY. Q. Did you speak to Mrs. Blackett on the Saturday. A. Yes—I then recollected that I had been in the prisoner's company with the
uncle—the uncle has been here every day, but he had to go away at 4 o'clock to-day.
COURT. Q. Were you in the public-house when Ackerell took the prisoners into custody? A. Yes—I saw them taken away and followed them down—the young man told me, because Lemore wanted to see me.
MRS. SOUTHWELL. The prisoner Southwell is my son—we occupy two rooms in High-street, Bloomsbury—my son does not sleep in the room with me—my husband and I sleep in the work-room—he works for his father, and sleeps at home—he was at home on the night of the 28th November—I opened the door to him at half-past 11, or it might not be so much, and he came up stairs, and went to bed—I unlocked the backdoor and let him in—I did not go into his bed-room with him that night—I always sit up to let him in, and lock him in every night—we have a reason for it—because the work is kept there.
Cross-examined. Q. Do you let him in at 11 every night. A. Yes, and sometimes at 10—he never sleeps out all night—he is never out after 11—I have heard that he was taken by Sergeant Ackerell at a public-house—he was not at home that night; he was in prison, and could not be—my husband is a tailor, and my son and two daughters work at the business.
LEMORE, McCORMACK, (†) and SOUTHWELL,**(†) GUILTY .
GEORGE NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Recorder.
MR. LILLEY conducted the Prosecution, and MR. METCALFE the Defence.
FRANCIS BRAND . I live in East-lane, Barking-road, and am foreman at Mr. Reed's rope factory, East-lane—I was on the premises at 5 o'clock on 18th November—a large copper, belonging to my employers, was then safe, with a large fire under it—it will hold about 150 gallons—from information I received I returned at 11 o'clock at night, and the copper was gone—I saw it at the prisoner's house, on Monday, the 20th, chopped up; cut down at the sides—it was worth about 10l.
Cross-examined. Q. 10l. to you? A. 10l. as old copper—it weighs 2 cwt.
GEORGE THOMAS HURST (Policeman, K 18). On 20th November, about 2 o'clock, I was on duty in North-street, Plaistow, in plain clothes—the prisoner's house is in that street—I saw him standing at the door, and, having received information, said to him, "Can I see the copper?"—he said, u I will show it to you"—I accompanied him to a shed on his premises, and saw a copper broken up, some pieces of which I produce—also, this chopper, which is jagged, and has marks of copper on it—I asked him where he got the copper—he said that two men came on Saturday night and brought it with a horse and cart—he produced this book, pointed to this entry, and said, "These are the men that I bought it of "This was a
receipt for 2 l. on account, for a copper)—I said, "You have no board up to show that you are a marine-store dealer" and I drew his attention to the chopper, and the marks on it—he said, "I have been breaking it up, I have been to London, and have got a customer for it"—I told him I should take him in custody for stealing it, and cautioned him—I said, "Where do these men live that you have got in the book, that I may go and see if it is true"—he said, "It is no use for me to deceive you; I put the names down, but I do not know them"—I took him to the Station—I was with Brand when he identified the copper.
Cross-examined. Q. Did not he say,"I put their names in the book, but I do not know that those are their names?" A. Yes—I went to Swans-combe-street and Abbey-street, but could find no such persons—both streets are near each other, and within a quarter of a mile of the prisoner's, and a mile, or a mile and a quarter, from where the copper came from—the copper was in a shed in the garden, some little way from the house—the road runs alongside the garden—the shed door was closed—the door faces the road—there was no truck in the shed—the truck stands in the yard—the shed door is an ordinary size—we had a little difficulty in getting the copper out—the copper had, I believe, been used some considerable time—I am not on duty on that beat—you can see the door of the shed from the road—it opens into a fore court, and there is the road—if the door was opened for him to go in and out, people could see the copper—there was no secrecy, he took me there at once.
MR. LILLEY. Q. Does the shed stand in a yard. A. Yes—the front of the yard is not enclosed—there are no gates—there are low palings shutting in the yard, with apertures through them—anybody could look over them—the shed is two or three yards from the street—there are palings along the front of the garden, about three yards from the shed, and then comes the pavement—the cart stood before the shed, in a little yard—the prisoner is a greengrocer—I do not know that he occasionally deals in copper.
THOMAS CABLE . I am a carman, of Plaistow—on Sunday morning, 19th November, a man named Bowles spoke to me at my stable-yard—the prisoner was not with him—on Monday morning Bowles came again with the prisoner, and asked me to take the copper in my wagon to London—I do not know whether the prisoner heard that, but I think he might—I agreed to take it if they allowed me to take it as I liked, but they asked me to conceal it, and I declined it.
Cross-examined. Q. Was this Bowles? A. Yes—I stated that before the Magistrate—I do not know whether the prisoner heard Bowles say that—he was standing seven or eight yards away.
COURT. Q. Then why did you say, "They asked me?" A. I made a mistake.
The prisoner received a good character.
GUILTY on the Second Count.— Recommended to mercy by the Prosecutor and Jury.— Confined Six Months.
135. THOMAS FITZ HENRY (17), and FREDERICK HEARNE (18) , Feloniously and sacrilegiously breaking and entering the Parish Church of Leytonstone, and stealing therein 1 clock and other articles, the property of Thomas Fowell Buxton and others. Second Count, receiving the same.
MR. HOUSTON conducted the Prosecution, and MR. WILL defended Fitz Henry.
REV. WILLIAM VERNON . I am a clergyman, and incumbent of the parish church, Leytonstone—on the evening of the 3d December I went to the vestry there—I missed a clock, which I had seen safe on the previous Sunday evening—it was the property of the churchwardens, Thomas Fowell Buxton and others—the vestry is part of the church—I ascertained that at the west window of the church the glass was broken, one of the stanchions moved, and a space left large enough for any person to come in—there were footmarks about the ground—I examined the vestry door, which leads into the church; they had got in that way—this is the clock (produced)—two tassels were taken from the reading-desk, and two mats from the vestry—on the previous Sunday I had seen the tassels in their proper place.
Cross-examined. Q. Were those things removed altogether from the church? A. Yes; and the tassels and mat were left at Mr. McGill's door on the Thursday evening afterwards—the vestry door opens into the church-yard and into the church, too, and there is another door from the vestry to the church, that was left open.
WILLIAM FAIRBROTHER . I am assistant to Messrs. Dicker and Scarlet, of 20, Hereford-street, Commercial-road, pawnbroker—on Tuesday morning, 5th December, about half-past 9, the prisoners came in—Hearne was carrying this clock—he said it was his, and he wanted 10s. on it—they were both together—I asked him how he got it—he said he won it at a raffle—I asked him where—he said, "In Anthony-street"—I rather think the other prisoner mentioned the name of the public-house—I said, "Where are the keys?"—he said he did not know it wanted any—I then left them in the shop with the foreman, and went round to Anthony-street to make inquiries—on coming back I met a constable, brought him to the shop, and gave the prisoners into custody.
Cross-examined. Q. Did either of them make any attempt to run away? A. Not out of the shop.
ALBERT GODFREY (Policeman, K 159). I took the prisoners into custody—Fitz Henry attempted to run away—Hearne said he had won the clock at a raffle—I found a knife, a whistle, and a candlestick on Fitz Henry, and on Hearne a clasp knife.
FITZHENRY— NOT GUILTY .
HEARNE— GUILTY on the Second Count.— Confined Twelve Months.
136. THOMAS FITZ HENRY and FREDERICK HEARNE were again indicted for breaking and entering the Church of S t. George's—In the East, and stealing 4 glass globes, 1s. 6d. in money, and other articles, the property of William Henry Foulger.
CHARLES HENRY MCGILL . I am incumbent of Christ Church, St. George's—on Sunday, 3d December, at 1 in the morning, I was called up by a constable—the sexton went into the church then—I went in the morning, and found the cash-box, in which the offertory was, broken open, and a blanket, 2 globes, and 4 chimneys from the gas lights removed—these are the articles (produced)—I found that an opening had been made in the vestry window, and an entry effected there—those articles are the property of the churchwardens, except the blanket, which is mine—the cash-box had been taken out of the drawer in the table, the lock of the drawer forced, and the side of the cash-box broken open—it had contained about 2s. in coppers—they had left a halfpenny in—I had seen the cash-box safe on the Wednesday, and the other articles on the Sunday—I think I saw Fitz Henry, on
the Sunday afternoon after the robbery was committed, looking in at the front door of the church—William Henry Foolger is one of the church wardens.
Cross-examined. Q. You cannot swear to Fitz Henry, I believe? A. No, I should not like to—all the other things were found outside the vestry, except the 2s. worth of coppers—I had been into the church on the Friday, and seen the things safe—the sexton would be there on the Saturday night—if anything had been wrong, it would have been his duty to come and tell me.
ROBERT SMITH (Policeman, K 47). On 3d December, from information I received, I went to Mr. McGiu's residence—I saw the church—the vestry door had been broken open—the 2 globes, the 4 chimneys, and the blanket were lying outside the vestry window, in the churchyard—another constable called the set ton up, and we examined the church—we found a drawer in the vestry had been broken open, and the cash-box was on the table, also broken open—I found marks on the cash-box—on Tuesday, when the prisoners were in custody on the former charge, I saw this knife found on Fitz Henry—is corresponds with the marks on the drawer and the marks on the cash-box, and would be caused by a knife like this—I preserved the footmarks which I found under the window, took Fitz Henry's boots, compared them with three different impressions, and found them to correspond—I charged the prisoners—they both stated they knew nothing whatever about it.
Cross-examined. Q. What day did you take them? A. On the 5th—they were in custody at the time.
The COURT considered that there was no evidence against the prisoners.— NOT GUILTY .
138. RICHARD HAMPTON** (24) , to breaking and entering the shop of George Barrell, and stealing 1 watch and 1 watch-case, his property, after a previous conviction in September, 1864.— Confined Eighteen Months.
MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution, and MR. RIBTON the Defence.
SAMUEL PARTRIDGE . I am a baker, of 36, Bridge-street, Greenwich—on Saturday night, 11th November, the prisoner came to me to pay 4s., and she gave me a half-sovereign, and I gave her change—as I was going down stairs, I met the witness Carter coming up—when I was half-way down, she said, "The woman is robbing of you"—I ran upstairs into the shop, ran behind the counter, and she said, "That woman has robbed you"—the prisoner said, "I have only been round the counter to take a biscuit or two"—I looked round the flour-shelves, and missed 5s. which was there when I
went down—I accused her of robbing me, and she denied it—I gave her in charge on the following Monday—the reason I did not give her in charge before, was that I had not any one to look after my shop.
Cross-examined. Were there any biscuits there? A. There were some in the window.
COURT. Q. Did she pay for the biscuits, or did you ask her? A. No.
MR. RIBTON. Q. Were you on good terms with her; she was a lady customer of yours? A. Yes—if she had asked me for a biscuit, I would have given her one—she had not been buying biscuits—I had these sort of biscuits (produced) in the window—there is a great space, so as to enable anyone to go round the counter; it does not fill half the shop—there is only just room for the door to swing up—I have known the prisoner five or six years, but she has not been a customer all that time—I think she was a customer in 1863—her husband calls himself a builder—I frequently told him that if she would give me the money I would not say anything about it—I went on the Monday morning—she was given into custody on the Monday night—he told me that if I did not see into it, he would take proceedings against me—there was not a word said about money on the Monday morning—I asked him if he would withdraw his promise, and he said unless I proved the case, he would take proceedings against me—I did not give her into custody before 9 o'clock, because I had no one in the house to leave—a policeman was passing; I called him in, about half-past 5 at night—he went to the house, and Mr. Hockley was not at home—I was not waiting to see whether he or his wife would come and bring me the 5s.—if anybody had come and given me the 5s. I should not have prosecuted—I had not anything to drink on that Saturday night—there was 5s. there, half-a-crown, two shillings, and a sixpence—I have not a till—I am quite sure the money was there while the prisoner was in the shop; I received it a minute before I waited on the prisoner—the other persons went out as I served her—I laid it down behind—I am not in the habit of putting it in the till—I know Mrs. Carter as a customer—we were not more friendly than I have been with the prisoner—I cannot deny that I have had a drop with her—some-times I got a pot of half-and-half—sometimes I take it in the room behind the shop, and sometimes in the shop—that night she came in out of Union-street—there is a thoroughfare through the house.
MR. DALY. Q. Does any other customer come in that way? A. Yes—the parlour is on the left, that leads into the shop—when I went round the counter the prisoner had not any biscuits in her hand—the money was on a little shelf behind me—I should have to go round the counter to get the money.
ANN CARTER . I am wife of Charles Carter, of Greenwich—on Saturday night I was going to the prosecutor's shop; I went in the back way—I met Mr. Partridge on the stairs—I said, "I wish to pay my account, Mr. Partridge"—when I got in the parlour, I could see Mrs. Hockley in the shop—I saw her arm brushing the silver off the counter into her hand—it was a little side counter at the back—if I was standing at the counter, the silver would be behind me—she put it in her pocket—Mr. Partridge afterwards came up stairs—I said, "That woman has robbed you, Sir"—he went round the counter, and said, "Yes, you have taken 5s."—she said, "No, I merely went round the counter and took a biscuit or two"—on the Monday night I was fetched to Mr. Hockley's house—the prisoner was there—a policeman said, "You saw this woman take some silver out of Mr. Partridge's house?"—I said, "Yes"—she asked Mr. Partridge on Monday night if he
would forgive her?—he said he must see Mr. Hockley—I did not see the policeman till the Monday night, and then I repeated to him what I had seen.
Cross-examined. Q. Is not this the first time you have said anything about "forgive? A. No, I said before the Magistrates that Mrs. Hookley asked Mr. Partridge to forgive her—I have never had anything to drink with Mr. Partridge except at Christmas time—the back way is a direct road from my home—directly I went into the parlour, I saw this woman taking the silver—there was a gas light in the shop, I cannot say whether there was one in the parlour—I did not notice an easy chair in the parlour—when I settle my account, I go into the parlour—I do not always go in the back way—it is the way for persons to go in—when they go to settle their accounts they go into the room—I cannot say whether it is furnished—I have dealt with Mr. Partridge for two or three years—I was sent for on the Monday night.
MR. DALY. Q. Has there been any impropriety between you and Mr. Partridge? A. No.
CHARLOTTE MITCHELL . I am twelve years of age, and live at 40, Bridge-street, Greenwich—I know Mr. Partridge's shop—I was looking into the window on Saturday night—there was gas in the shop—I saw Mr. Partridge standing inside the counter, and Mrs. Hockley in front—I saw Mr. Partridge leave the shop—Mrs. Hockley then went round the counter and picked up some biscuits, put one into her mouth and brushed something white into her hand—it was at the corner of the shop—the shelf was under the flour-shelves behind—Mr. Partridge came back and said, "I believe you have robbed me"—she said, "No, Sir, I have not robbed you"—she then got her bread and another pennyworth of biscuits—the biscuits were in one corner and Something white was in another.
Cross-examined. Q. You say you saw her brush something down? A. Yes, that was on the same shelf as the biscuits were.
THOMAS WATSON (Policeman, R 124). On Monday, 13th November, in consequence of something I heard, I called at Mr. Partridge's, and went with him to the prisoner's house—he gave her in custody on this charge—she said, "I did not take it."
Cross-examined. Q. Between the first and second hearing did the prosecutor send you to Mr. Hockley? A. No—I did not go to Mr. Hockley and ask him to pay the money—I did go to him—I went round to Mr. Partridge on the Monday-night, as it was to come off on the Tuesday, and said, "Good evening, Mr. Hockley. I hope I shall have the pleasure of seeing you tomorrow morning"—I do not know whether Mr. Partridge went to see him—I asked Mr. Partridge whether he had any objection of seeing Mr. Hockley, and he said he did not want to see him—I did not tell Mr. Hockley Mr. Partridge did not want to see him.
COURT. Q. Was Carter present then? A. Not then—the prisoner was given into custody—Mrs. Hockley asked him three times to make it up—she said, "Forgive, and let us settle it."
WILLIAM FROST (Policeman, R 80). I went to the prisoner's house with the prosecutor on the Monday night—I saw her—she said, "Mr. Partridge, will you wait till my husband comes home?"and he sat down—I did not see the husband.
Cross-examined. Q. Was the other constable with you? A. Not the first time; the second time he was—I was not called before the Magistrates
—I was subpœnaed to come here by Mr. Chapel, from what Mr. Partridge told him that I was the constable that got there first.
COURT. Q. Was Ann Carter there when you got there? A. No.
MR. RIBTON. Q. When did you see Mr. Chapel? A. He came to me last week, or the week before.
The prisoner received a good character.— NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Justice Blackburn.
140. NATHANIEL HOLCHESTER (34), SAMUEL BERRENS (26), JULES BAYER (28), ABRAHAM DAVIS (34), GERSHORE SILBERMAN (23), PHILIP BRAUN (31), were indicted (under 24 & 25 Vic. c. 98, sec. 19) for knowingly, and without lawful excuse, having in their custody and possession 500 pieces of paper, upon each of which were printed parts of five-rouble notes of the Empire of Russia. Other Counts, varying the mode of charging the offence.
BAYER PLEADED GUILTY .— Confined Fifteen Months.
MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON, with MR. TURNER, appeared for Holchester, MESSRS. METCALFE and STRAIGHT for Berrens,MR. COOPER for Davis, and MESSRS. RIBTON and COLLINS for Silberman. Broun was undefended.
JOSEPH LIBAN , (Through an interpreter.) I came to this country on 1st June in the present year—I was accompanied by Bayer—I went to the Terminus hotel, London-bridge—I stopped there seven or eight days—Bayer left one or two days before I saw Berrens—I think the second day after my arrival I saw Braun in front of the hotel at the railway-station—Bayer was with me—when we were together the talk was about the forged bank-notes, and an appointment was made for the next day to meet, and we did meet at a cafe the next day, not far from the hotel—there were present Berrens, Londinski, I, and Bayer—Berrens introduced himself there as the owner of the manufactory of the notes—I asked him to show me the place of manufactory—he said he could not do so, and he asked me to give him some money for the purpose of procuring some new paper; some better ones—then we separated—I said I should consider about it—the conversation was in German—Berrens is a Russian—he does not speak German fluently—next I saw Blum or Braun, in Spencer's hotel—that was perhaps six or eight days after the interview with Berrens; Londinski, Berrens, Bayer, and I were present—after Berrens would not show me the place of manufacture Braun was introduced to me, and represented to me as one who would establish for me such a manufacture—Berrens recommended him to me, saying that he was an excellent engraver, that he had already made some plates of forged notes at Riga—and that also in London he had taken part, in making some plates, and that latterly he had imitated sixpenny-pieces here—Berrens and Braun told me that they had made these things in partnership with a man named Jaffer—I invited him to call on me to show me a sample, and he promised he would call and furnish me with such a sample—he came, not the next day but I think the second or third day afterwards—at that interview only indifferent things were spoken about—about the forged bank notes it was said, that a house
should be taken if the samples should turn out well, and then the manufactory should be established—we all spoke about it—I cannot recollect that anything more was said about the house at that time—the next person I saw was Holchester—I saw him at my lodging, No. 1, Brunswick-terrace—that was perhaps six or ten days after the interview with Braun—he came with Londinski—Holchester told me that he had 20,000 five-rouble notes ready, and offered them to me for sale—he told me he generally sold them at 20 or 25 per cent, but if I took all he produced he should give them to me at 10 per cent—I told him that I had not the intention of buying his papers, as the paper was so very bad, but if he would receive me as co-partner, and introduce me into his manufactory, I was ready to give him some money—he would not consent to that—no more was said about it.
Q. At any time after that did Braun show you a plate? A. He had made the eagle of a Russian 25-rouble note—it was shown to me at Bayer's lodging; 75, Camberwell-road—after that Bayer, Braun, and I went to Pinner.
Q. How came you to go to Pinner? A. We were about to hire a house, as the eagle had been recognised as being considered a good one—Braun suggested Pinner—he brought me a newspaper, the Telegraph, or some other in which places of abode were advertised, and so we immediately went there—we went in a private carriage, a fly I think—it was hired from a place close to my lodging, the second or third house from it—we went to Pinner, and found that the house had been taken that very day—after that a house was taken at 11, Russell-street, Camberwell—Londinski found that house out, and agreed as to the price—I took the house—the second day I went there—Londinski had come to me about it before I took it, and after it was taken—Bayer went into the occupation of it—the first of the prisoners I saw at that house was Barrens—that was on the same day as Bayer went into it—I saw the prisoners there every day—I can't recollect whom I saw—Davis and Silberman I only saw at a later period—I saw Holchester at that house a few days after it was taken; very little time after—we were every day speaking about my wanting to have the factory, and he persisted on it that he would sell me papers—I did not agree to take the papers—I always refused to—at that time, I was in communication with Inspector Thompson—I afterwards went to Paris.
Q. How came you to go to Paris? A. Towards the end of June, Holchester told me that he would perhaps enter with me into this business, as soon as I should be recommended to him by somebody—I asked him from whom he wished to have the recommendation, and he said from De Lipeou in Paris—I went to Paris to De Lipeou for three days for the purpose of being recommended by him, and about two days after my return to London, Holchester and Londinski told, me that De Lipeou had written to them, and that he was ready or willing to take me as a co-partner into this factory, and asked for this 5,000l. sterling—at that time only I ascertained his name; I did not know it before—we then separated again, and these negotiations were repeated daily—once at my place; once at a public house near Holchester's lodging—in the month of July, Holchester showed me some forged notes—I can't say on what day—it was at my lodging—there were 500 forged five-rouble notes—200 of them Bayer bought—I gave the money for them—I saw Holchester on many occasions between that time and the time when he was taken into custody—every time we met he spoke about his factory—he wanted 5,000l., which I would not give him—I first saw Davis, about the
middle of July, at the London-bridge railway—Berrens and Bayer were present—Davis warned me and Berrens not to throw away uselessly the money at Brussels—I had not been to Brussels at that time—I went afterwards with Berrens—I wanted to discover there the factory of Crawcaur—nothing further of importance passed at that interview, only indifferent subjects—it was after I returned that I saw Silberman—I saw him at Davis's—he told me he had served in the insurrection, and showed me a certificate—nothing more passed of importance then; only indifferent subjects were spoken about—we then separated, and I saw him once more at Davis's; and there I asked Davis and Berrens what sort of a man he was; how he came into it—and they told me that he was a very clever man for the uttering of forged bank-notes—they also told me, at the same time, that he had brought some watches from Holland, for forged notes.
Q. Did you see Holchester at any time when he mentioned to you a person of the name of Spretchnecover, or was the name mentioned by any of the prisoners? A. We spoke every day of the name of Spretchnecover, after she had been arrested in Paris—Holchester told me that he had not sold to Spretchnecover, and he had not sold direct to Bluckler—he always told me that he took from 20 to 25 per cent. for small quantities of the forged rouble notes—about the end of July an arrangement was made between me and Inspector Thompson—I can't recollect if it was on the 29th—I can't recollect what happened on that day—I remember a day upon which several of the prisoners came to Russell-street—when they assembled together there, it was always talked about of the factory and of the future arrangements—on 29th August, Holchester brought to Bayer 500 forged five-rouble notes, at 11, Russell-street—I saw Holchester arrive there—he had with him a parcel with 500 bank notes—it was wrapped up in a thin, fine paper—I can't say the colour of the paper; I can't recollect—Bayer was also there, and later Davis, Silberman, and Berrens came—we separated because Holchester was in a hurry to go away—nothing was done—I can't exactly recollect what was said—we spoke every day of the factory, of notes, of our business—Bayer received the packet of notes that Holchester brought—he took it down to the kitchen, to be kept—I then went away—they went away with the understanding that the next day, the 30th, I should go to Ramsgate with Bayer—Holchester was to accompany us—that was the day they were taken into custody—we did not go to Ramsgate—I had no intention of going.
Q. How came you and Holchester, and the others, to be in the house at the time they were arrested? A. I had then to assemble there—I communicated that to Inspector Thompson—I gave a signal to Thompson to come and arrest them—the signal was unbuttoning my coat—I did that at the first-floor window—that was not the room in which the prisoners were; they were on the ground floor—just before I went up stairs, I asked Bayer to show me the bank notes which Holchester brought yesterday—Bayer then fetched them—we looked at them, Holchester, I, and Bayer—Bayer fetched the notes from the kitchen—they were wrapped up in that paper; but I cannot recollect what sort of paper—I saw a carpet bag at that time in the place—I saw Holchester had a bag—Bayer had a bag—while Holchester, I, and Bayer were looking at the notes, Berrens, Davis, and Silberman came in, and at that moment I went up stairs, to give the signal—I cannot recollect what was going on at the time they came in—the notes were there—I can't say if they were just at that time on the table, or if somebody had taken them and put them somewhere else—I had them on the table—I cannot
recollect whether anything was being said when Silberman, Davis, and Berrens came in—I did not remain up stairs while the prisoners were being arrested—I went down stairs into the kitchen—I first went into the room where they were, and looked out, and, when I saw Mr. Thompson coming, I went down stairs—I was not in the same room that the prisoners were after Thompson came in.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. What are you? A. Now, I have no business; I was a contractor of different government business in Austria—I am a Gallician, and a Catholic by religion—I am not a Polish Jew—I never was a Polish Jew—I was a Jew—I changed my religion a year ago—I do not know if I said it was on 27th July—I think I said in July or August—I am certain it was not on 27th July—it was before I came to London—I was in prison in Dresden—I came out of prison, I think, on 22d or 23d April this year—I can't recollect exactly how long I was in prison there, ten or twelve days; it was not a month—I was not apprehended and imprisoned for having been in possession of some forged notes—I had no forged rouble notes in my possession—a certain Mr. Liberonski had some notes, and he referred to me, and said that he had them from me, and that was the cause of my arrest—I don't know what became of that man—I know I was liberated and he remained there—when I came out I got some money from the government—I have said before how much it was—I received money, and I had some money of my own—I decline to state any more particulars about it—I had upon me about 20,000 francs—I had that when I left Dresden—I had nothing like that amount when I was arrested—I was not arrested for forgery in Paris—I was not charged at all in Paris—I did not first become acquainted with Bayer in Paris—I had been with him in Poland during the insurrection—Bayer is a Pole—I was about a month with Bayer in Paris before I came over to England—I engaged Bayer to come over as my secretary—I did not take him over as my secretary—I took him over here because he knew about the forged notes and the factory—Bayer had no money—I furnished him with money—I did not buy a carpet-bag in Paris—I did not pay for one for him or for anybody—I did not know of Bayer's buying one in Paris—I arrived in London on 1st June—I am clear about the date—Bayer came with me on that day—(bag produced)—I saw that at Bayer's—I saw it in the railway and on the boat—he always carried it in his hands—I did not buy this carpet bag in Paris, and pay for it—I saw Holchester about three or four weeks after I came to London—I first saw him at my place—I did not first call on him at his place in Englefield-road, Islington—I did not go to Islington to call on him—later, I did go to Islington, and there he gave me an appointment at a public-house or tavern—I cannot recollect how soon after I had first seen Holohester in London I went to his house; about ten or fourteen days—the first time I went, he was at home, the second time he was out——he was not out the first time I went—it is possible that I left word with the servant, but not probable that he should come and call on me—it is possible that I left word where I lived, but I cannot recollect it.
Braun. Q. You saw me first at London-bridge-house hotel, did not you? A. No, Spencer's hotel—that is not the same—that was the first tine I saw you—it is possible that I came there with Bayer—Londinski came with us as well—I cannot recollect whether it was on a Monday night—I think it was after 12 at noon—it is possible that that was the very same day that Bayer took the lodging in Camberwell-road—I cannot recollect—I asked you your name, and you told me it was Blum—you did not say that you
lived in St. John's Wood—you always refused to give me your address—we had a conversation, the end of which was that you agreed to engrave plates for me of twenty-five rouble notes—you asked me for a new genuine twenty-five rouble note—I wanted to see a proof of your work, but did not say that I should like to see the eagle best—I understood very little of such works at that time—you told me that you had done this before, and it was only wasting time to see a proof, as you had done them in Riga and here—it was agreed that you should make the sample at Bayer's—I wanted to see the proof done in Bayer's and my presence, and you agreed that the sample should be made under our eye—I gave the money to Londinski to buy a genuine twenty-five rouble note—it was bought by Barrens—I do not recollect whether it was brought to Bayer's lodgings—it is possible that I went there to look at it—I do not know whether the good note was put in paper and handed over to you—I know you received it—it is possible that we then went away, and spent the night at the London Pavilion—I do not know whether you wrote to Bayer saying you would come on the next Saturday—I do not recollect Bayer showing me that letter—I cannot recollect whether you went to Bayer's on the next Monday and took some tools—that was Bayer's business—I saw a piece of steel there, which you brought to do this proof on—I do not know it—you showed it to me at my house, or at Bayer's house—I cannot recollect whether you and Bayer came next morning to No. 1, Brunswick-terrace—it is possible—I know the sample was made at Bayer's house, but I do not know if they went there from my house or not—I went over, talking to the landlord till it was done—they told me that it took two hours to draw the eagle and outline it—I I do not know if it was two, I was not present—I went up stairs and saw the proof—I would not be satisfied, or dissatisfied, as I did not understand that sort of thing—I asked Bayer if it was good—you told me that in three or four months you would have finished the whole engraving—you and Bayer came down stairs and found me talking to the landlord—I then went up and saw a proof—if we went up together, I do not know—I sent Londinski to look for a house, and it is very possible that I was in a very bad temper about his not having a house—you did not propose the newspaper, but you brought one to me—I think it was the Telegraph—I cannot read English, therefore I cannot have picked out the house at Pinner—you found it in the paper and read it, and told me there was a house there—I do not recollect your writing it on a card and showing it to the landlady—it is possible—this was at my lodging, 1, Brunswick-terrace—the landlady, I think, sent the servant to the railway-station—I do not know whether she found that there was no line to Pinner, but we took a private carriage, and you and I and Bayer went there in it—when we came to the house, you left Bayer and I in the carriage, and you came back and said, "You cannot get that house"—I think that it was already let—I do not know that you told me they would not let it to foreigners—we then went to the tavern and had dinner—Londinski came back the same night from Pinner—I do not know whether he found a house the next day or the day after—I do not recollect whether he had written down in his pocket-book the name of the landlord and of the agent, "11, Russell-street, "and "Johnson"—I cannot recollect that you took that paper out of the pocket-book, it is possible, or if you asked me to go and see the landlord—it is possible that I sent Londinski for a cab, and that you and I and Londinski went there and saw George Johnson, but I do not know—I cannot recollect whether I saw a
gentleman in the Swiss House at Peckham—when we came-out of the house I gave Londinski a sovereign to pay the deposit—I do not know where Swiss House is—I went and paid 8£. next morning—it is possible that you and I and Londinski went to see the house, 11, Russell-street, we found some workmen papering it, and I went away later to buy some furniture to furnish it, which I paid for, but I do not know where—I do not know whether you were there on Saturday night—the house was furnished for two persons, Bayer and you, not you and I—the tools were then brought over, and put upstairs on the table in a drawer—I think you had the key of the room; it was probably looked, but I do not know—I do not know if the key was given to Bayer or to you—I do not know whether you wrote to Bayer and me on Monday—I cannot recollect at what time you came to see me—I had no other subject to talk with you about but the five rouble-notes—we had a conversation, I do not know whether it was on 14th June, but the end of it was a separation for ever; it was in June—I do not think I saw you again till 17th August, but I cannot reccollect the date or the time of day—I had not written to you, but it is possible that I was waiting for you at 11, Russell-street—I do not recollect that I knew you were coming that night, but if such was the fact it must have been communicated to me by Berrens—I did not tell you that I had told somebody to write to you that I know of, but it is possible because Berrens had told me that you were coming—it is also possible that I was very glad that you came—I do not know whether you came quite alone, or whether the house was surrounded by police or whether six of them had a look at you before you went in—I cannot remember whether you found Bayer and me quite alone in the room when you came in; it is possible—these are minor circumstances, which are difficult to keep in memory—I drink wine and smoke cigars every day, and it is possible that I did the same that day—wine bottles were used as candlesticks on the table—I do not reccollect whether you cams in with a very hard, loud knock, or that there was another bard knock in a few minutes; or whether two prostitutes came in, one of whom sat down in my lap—we probably had a conversation when I came in—I do not know whether the detectives were looking in at the windows while the blind was drawn up for fresh air—it is very possible that I drew the blind; but on the 17th it was not my place at all to have them arrested, and therefore what were the detectives to do there?—the end of the conversation was that you should find the man who was in the possession of the factory of the forged five-rouble notes—I do not reccollect whether we went together to 1, Brunswick-terrace, it is possible—I know of no detectives following us, it is a mistake entirely—I do not know that one of them kept watch in the narrow passage-where the wooden railings are, and let us pass and had a look at us—I do not recollect the same detective at the end of Brunswick-terrace stumbling over the way like a drunken man to have a look at us—I cannot bring to my mind what happened at my lodging; you probably promised me at my door that you would go and do something for me—I did not see anybody standing at the corner to have another look at us—I do not know on what day I saw you again—I have a further recollection as to the later days, the last days I saw you—it is possible that you came to my lodging on Saturday, 19th April, at half-past 4, and that Bayer was there—you told me that you had found the man who was in possession of the factory for the forged notes; but if it was on on the 19th on 20th, I cannot say—you did not tell me he was an Englishman; on the contrary, you always told me that all the forgers were Germans, and most part watch-makers or engravers—you told me I could
come with my friend and see this man—I do not know if it was at that time or not—I did not want those men to come to my house, on the contrary; but I wanted certainly an interview to come together with this man—you told me that you had been present at the trial of Anthony, and that the career of Thompson was finished, because all the criminals now knew him by sight—I do not know whether you said that the police perhaps might watch us—you did not tell me that they were—it is likely that we then had some wine and bitter ale at the next public-house—I do not recollect any conversation there—you wrote in my pocket-book, "Brann, 23, Great Portland-street,"but where you wrote it, I do not recollect—it is possible that we then went to 11, Russell-street, and then to the next public-house—I alone did not have another two bottles of sherry there, but it is possible we took it together—I do not know whether we then went to my prostitute—I decline to say whether I there sent for some champagne, or whether I stopped all night in the house—I do not know whether the detective was outside looking at all these things going on—you possibly promised to come and see me on Tuesday, 21st August, at 12 o'clock—I do not know whether you then left me with my prostitute—it is possible that on Monday, 21st August, you came to my house; it may be that I was not in—I cannot say if it was August 21st—immediately you came in, we went to London-bridge-hotel and had some dinner there, and champagne—we then took a cab together, and went to 15, Essex-street, Strand, assuming that it was 21st August; but I think we were somewhere else on that day—it is possible that at that time I went to get this coffee-house, and that we then took a cab together, and went home to my lodgings at 6 o'clock—I did not see Mulvaney, the same detective, when we got out, nor did I see him pass ten minutes afterwards—I think I had some company on that night—I do not recollect the exact words, but I recollect that you said you had been to my house with the engraver, who had the engraving of the house, to my place at 12 o'clock, but did not find me at home—I cannot say if he mentioned 12 o'clock, or 3 o'clock—you told me that at 5 o'clock this man would be at home at his house, upon which I took a cab or a carriage, and went with you to him—I think that was at 3 or 4 o'clock in the afternoon—on the way we had a dinner, and a bottle of champagne—you then took me to Essex-street, Strand, and left me outside in the street, and you went down Essex-street, and in order to allay suspicion, I went and bought a few cigars, and about twenty minutes afterwards, you came up to me and said that the engraver was not at home, but that he had left behind him a paper, stating that he was compelled or forced to go out with "Swell"—I asked him who "Swell" was, and he said, "Holchester"—I did not wait at the door of 16, Essex-street, Strand—you did not come out and tell me that I had to wait half-an-hour there—I did not read the name on the door, Solicitor Brendon—you did not tell me that you used to have business to go to at this solicitor's—I did not, while you were in there, go to get this coffee-house—I only went once to the coffee-house, and that was in your company—I do not recollect if I was at the coffee-house on that day—it is possible that I spoke to a tall dark man there—on Monday, 21st August, when you parted with me, you did not say you should not come any more to see me—I do not know whether I wrote to you on Tuesday, 22d—it is possible—(looking at a letter torn in pieces)—this is my writing—(It was translated as follows: "2 o'clock afternoon, London, 22d August, '65. Dear Mr. Braun, I hope to see you still to-day, and there-fore I expect an answer where we may see each other—I shall remain at home till seven o'clock, but I can suit you at any hour which may be convenient
to you, quite after your desire. Yours, Liban.")—I wrote that letter to you that you might come and see me—I received an answer on the morning of the second day—I came on Wednesday, 23d, to your house; that was the first time I was there—it was without any other purpose except to have an answer to my letter—I fetched you out of bed—you told me to wait outside—I told you I was going to the Globe, in Leicester-square, and you might come and see me there—You came in half-an-hour—although I did not see the detective Mulvaney, it is possible that he was there at that time—we went to Verey's, in Regent-street, and had breakfast together—it is possible that I pawned some clothes in Regent-street, and that we went back to the Globe and took a seat close to the door, and that a bottle of brandy was put before us—I did not see Mulvaney going up and down the street—I was looking out to see Thompson that day, and I did not see him—I did not see him pass the house—it is true that he did pass, but X did not see him—I don't know that you remarked "What sort of people have passed here this morning I"—I did not ask if you knew some of them—you did not give me this letter then, you gave it me at your own lodging—I told you that I was going to Paris—it is possible that we had an appointment for amusement that night, and that you had to meet me at 8 o'clock—I do not know where—I cannot say that I did not go there at 8—I possibly went to the Pantheou at 11, and that we went up stairs together—the detective who watched us on 13th August was not there—at 12 o'clock we went out—possibly we went to a coffee-house at the corner of Regent-street—I do not know how long I stopped there—I saw you after that—before this I did not know any policeman except Thompson, now, of course, I know them—I never shook hands with them—you did not say, "Do you shake hands with such people?"—I have said I did net' know anything about him, therefore 1 could not have asked you whether you knew him—he did not tell me he came everywhere where I went, and therefore I shook hands with him—on Thursday, 24th August, I went to your house—I did not find you at home, and I went to Miss Vethin's address to find you there—I think I first saw her in the Pavilion, where you took her home, or went home in a cab with her—I probably took her address—I did not go there to see her, to see you—possibly, not finding you at home, I may have left a letter at your house—I do not recollect whether you answered it—I possibly came to your house again on Friday, 25th; I do not know—it is possible that you came down in your working clothes, and that I wanted you to go with me to buy some jewellery for my wife and children—I did not buy any—I think you went with me—I may have taken a cab in Maddox-street or Regent-street, I do not know the names of the streets—I told you that I had some forged five-rouble notes—you went home and dressed yourself—I was possibly waiting with a cab in Regent-street, and that we went to London-bridge-house hotel and had some supper, but I cannot recollect—possibly we went from there to the Hay market—I went into a foreign money exchangers to buy a genuine five-rouble note—possibly we took a cab and went to Brunswick-terrace and stopped there ten minutes, and then went to 11, Russell-street about 1 o'clock—I did not see Mulvaney there, although I know of the presence of the police there—I saw nobody except Thompson—we may have stopped there twenty minutes and then gone to Brunswick-terrace—I do not think we parted on the 25th—I did not see Mulvaney there—we went into the house in Russell-street to have the persons in there arrested—I took you in there to get you arrested there.
Q. Did you not tell me in the cab that you had to send & large number of forged notes to Paris? A. I do not know for what purpose I should
have said so—I did not tell you that they had written to me from Paris that these notes had a fault—you yourself told me that those notes had a fault—they were a little smaller than the genuine ones—for that purpose I bought a genuine five-rouble note, which I took with me to Russell-street, where you compared the genuine note with the forged one—you told me you knew they were faulty—I showed you three new forged rouble notes, and one torn in two pieces—I cannot recollect whether they had pencil marks where the fault was—I think there was something left out of one line—it was at 1, Brunswick-terrace that I showed them to you first—I do not know that we had a conversation about Inspector Thompson and the police in general, I cannot recollect it—I have said so on a former occasion—I took the forged notes from you—no, you had them to compare, to examine—I did not take them away from you at 1, Brunswick-terrace—I do not know where I gave them to you—you had them to examine at 11, Russell-street—we went there—I do not know whether we walked or rode there—I took them up stairs—possibly I gave them to you on that occasion, and there you looked them over—I cannot produce those notes now, I had them then—I think this was done in presence of Bayer—I possibly went out while you and Bayer were up stairs, and possibly I came up stairs and took everything from you and you went away—we did not then go to 1, Brunswick-place and part,—Holchester came, and brought one thousand bank notes, and then a dispute arose—I gave the signal—Thompson did not take good notice of it—he wanted to wait till the others came as well, and then Holchester rolled up his one thousand bank notes, and went away angry—you were up stairs when Holchester was there, and then you went down stairs, and then you were together—we did not go together on the 25th—possibly we did go to 1, Brunswick-terrace, and that I there gave Bayer some money to get some dinner—I cannot recollect whether you came back to see me at half-past six that evening—I think Bayer was there—I did not see Mulvaney—possibly we went out on the balcony—I think you promised to come back on Saturday, 26th, and you did come—possibly I was alone—I asked you to go to Richmond on Saturday, 7th—I did not go, but kept you with me all day—it is possible that we had a conversation that day—I do not know the subject of it—I cannot recollect that you wrote to me about this, and signed your name Blum—I recollect this letter (Read: not dated, post mark 29th August. "DEAR MR. LIBAN,—After taking all possible trouble yesterday, and perceiving that it is impossible for me to assist you, I did not come. The fact is, as the man told me, that Swell on a former occasion took the original steel plates at once away, and had them in his custody. The galvanic steel plates now in use are worn out, and do not produce any longer proper impressions. In order to make new ones, we must have the original plates; Swell has them, consequently the sole master of the whole affair; and as you cannot make use of copies, this man has nothing in hand which he can hand over to you. Whether his statements are all true or not, I do not know, but he assures me of their perfect truth, and adding that not having been known by any of the society, it was his determination not to make acquaintance with any of them, and he therefore regrets having detained me with hopes which he is now unable to realize. You will see by these few lines how much I have penetrated in this man; and apologizing that I could not do anything for you, I hope you will excuse my not personally coming to you, I being too much engaged in my business, and having been always exposed to unpleasantness when I have stopped away. Should I not see you
any more, I wish you a happy voyage, and success in all your undertakings")—I did not tell you to sign your name Blum—I knew your name was Braun—you did not tell me on Sunday that you should not come any more to me—just the contrary—you did not come any more—I did not go every morning to your house—I went there two or three times—possibly I went after the Sunday—I remember the 30th August—it is possible that I came home in a hansom cab—I took my things away between nine and ten that day—I knew they were arrested at six o'clock—I did not stay at my house then—I did not speak to a tall, dark man.
MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Had you known Braun before you were introduced to Holchester? A. Yes—I saw Holchester between two and three weeks after I had become acquainted with Braun—he and I and Holchester were very often in company together. Q. How was Holchester addressed? A. At first he was not at all addressed except as Sir; after I returned from Paris, he told me his name himself—Braun called him Swell—he told me that among the forgers, the workmen, Holchester was called Swell—I did not hear him called that name by any of the others—I never heard the expression except from Braun—I received a verbal answer to the letter that has been read the same as is contained in this—Braun handed it to me with this writing on it—it was on Friday, the 25th, that I saw the 1,000 five-rouble notes—I do not know whether the 500 rouble notes were a portion of that 1,000—this is Braun's writing (Read: "I only received your letter at 12 o'clock, midnight, when I came home, and you therefore will, in the first place, excuse me for not replying sooner, and, in the second place, I was very busy in my business, and in faith I should not like to lose my situation; it is consequently impossible for me to see you before 3 on Saturday afternoon, or any other evening after 8 o'clock. I do not know what I shall do. I cannot lose any time, because if I am away from business, at least ten people cannot go on with their work, and stand entirely still Swell seems to be very envious of me, and I do not think that the matter will end well should I be mixed up with it. I therefore advise you rather to address yourself to Swell alone, as you have already on former occasions negotiated with him in the matter before you negotiated with me. I will not mix myself, under any circumstances, and on any account, with this society.—Yours obediently, BRAUN, In haste.")
MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. Did you on 30th August know where Holchester's wife and children were? A. At Ramsgate—I once visited them there.
WILLIAM EVE . I am hall-porter at the Terminus hotel, London-bridge—I know Liban well by sight—I remember his coming to the hotel on 1st June at 7.30 in the morning—Bayer was with him—Bayer remained six days, I think, and Liban seven days—while they were there several persons came to visit them—they always went up into their bedroom—I can't say that I should know those persons again—they always asked for Mr. Liban—most of them were foreigners.
JOHN JENKINS . I live at 21, Martha Terrace, Beresford-street, Walworth—on 15th June, an application was made to me for the house, No. 1, Russell-street—three persons came about it, Liban was one; they were foreigners; I think I should recognise them again—there was only one that 1 could understand anything from, he translated—I think those two at the further end are the other two (Holchester and Berrens), but whether Berrens came that day or not, I cannot say; I saw him afterwards going in and out there—I cannot say for certain whether I saw Holchester at the house.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. You will not undertake to
swear that Holchester was one of the men you saw on the first occasion? A. I think he is the man, but I would not swear it—I do not know how many times I have seen any of the prisoners at the house in Russell-street; I have seen them merely in passing—I scarcely took any notice of them—on the first occasion I walked a mile or two with them—I showed them over the house, and then went with them to Camberwell, to Mr. Johnson's, where they took the house—perhaps they might have been in my company a couple of hours, or probably longer.
GEORGE JOHNSON . I live at the Swiss-house, Lyndhurst-road, Peckham—my father is owner of the house 11, Camberwell New-road—I recollect Liban calling at my house several times on the subject of taking the house 11, Russell-street—it was ultimately let to them—on 15th June Liban and two more came; I don't know the two by name—I should know them if I was to see them—I think Berrens is one of them, I don't know the other—I can't say that I have ever seen Londinski—a deposit was paid, and I gave up the key.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. Did you see Mr. Jenkins on that day? A. I saw him outside the house.
Cross-examined by MR. METCALFE. Q. Was not Bayer the man? A. No, to the best of my recollection it was Berrens.
Braun. Q. Do you remember when Liban came with a Polish Jew to you? A. Yes, he did come once, and there was one more—I can't say that I ever saw you.
Braun. But I was there, and you were in the same room, and no one else was there—I came with Liban and Londinski, and the very same day Londinski paid the deposit, did he not? Witness. No, Liban paid me the money—it was my father that had the sovereign deposit, not me.
Braun. But I was there then. Witness. I did not notice—8l. was paid in one sum—I gave Liban a receipt for it.
MR. GIFFARD. Q. Do you remember whether you were present on the first occasion when anything was paid? A. I was not; it was on the 15th they came to me—if there was an interview on the 14th, I was not there—this receipt is my father's writing.
WILLIAM RICHARDSON . I live at 73, Devonshire-street, Kennington-cross—I work for Mr. Barwick, a fly proprietor, of Camberwell-gate—I remember in June last taking some foreigners from 1, Brunswick-terrace, Camberwell-road, to Pinner, to a house that was to let, or was let just previous to our arriving there—I think I should know the persons again that went with me—that gentleman at the further end went with me (Holchester)—one had red whiskers and a moustache—I do not recognise another of them—they remained at Pinner perhaps an hour—they went to the Queen's Head there—I believe I afterwards saw one of the men in Newgate—I do not know who was present when I identified him.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. Do you believe this man (Holchester) was one? A. I think so.
Braun. Q. You drove three persons to Pinner, did you not? A. Yes; I thought you were the gentleman with whiskers—I should not like to swear to you—there was one very dark man, with spectacles, and a younger man, with a light moustache—the gentleman at the further end had spectacles (looking at Liban)—that was one of them—I fancy now that is the gentleman—I firmly believe that is the gentleman that wore spectacles—I think I am mistaken in saying it was Holchester.
there was a cottage there to let, called Fir Cottage—I remember three persons coming in a carriage to look at it—I had advertised it in the Daily Telegraph—I believe it was not let when they came to look at it, but I had a party about it—they wanted to take it for six months, and I would not let it on those conditions—one of the persons got out of the carriage and spoke to me—I should not know that person again, or any of them.
BENJAMIN KANE . I am landlord of the Queen's Head, Pinner—I remember three foreigners coming to dine at my house in June last—Liban was one, and Braun another, I do not see the other—I saw all the three—I waited on them myself—I have no recollection of Holchester.
JAMES THOMPSON . I am an inspector of the detective force—on Thursday, the 15th June, I received instructions from Sir Richard Mayne, and subsequently the witness Liban made a communication to me—he was brought to my private house on the 19th June by arrangement—on Thursday, the 29th June, in company with Sergeant Clarke, I went to No. 1, Brunswick-terrace, Camberwell-road, where Liban lodged—I saw the prisoner Berrens go to that house that day; I also saw Bayer, and likewise Liban—Bayer went in first, and Berrens afterwards—Bayer and Liban came out together, and went to a public-house in the Camberwell-road—they returned to the lodging, and after they went in Berrens came to the house, knocked, and was admitted—a week or ten days afterwards, about the 5th or 6th July, I went to the same neighbourhood, and kept watch on the same house, in company with Sergeant Mulvaney—I saw the prisoners Holchester, Bayer, and Barrens go into the house—they remained a short time, it might have been half an hour or an hour—I walked by the house—the window was open, and they were seated by the window, smoking—I saw one or two of them leave, but I cannot say which—Liban was in the room when I looked in—he remained in the house when the others went away—a day or two afterwards I again watched the house, and saw Holchester, Bayer, Berrens, and Braun go there—I also saw a man named Londinski there on two or three occasions—on this occasion they remained about an hour or so, and then went away—I had no opportunity of seeing into the house on that occasion—from that time until the 20th of August I only saw the four prisoners I have mentioned, together with Liban—I did not see the other two prisoners during that period—on the evening of the 24th or 25th of August, I was in the neighbourhood of Russell-street, Camberwell—other officers were there—I know the house No, 11, Russell street—I got an opportunity of looking into that house from the outside, and saw Holchester, Bayer, Berrens, Davis, Silberman, and Braun; they were seated at the parlour window, which was open, and were smoking—I saw each one distinctly as I passed by—they remained there u ntil about half-past 8, and then went away—they were seated round the window, smoking and talking—I heard their voices—I did not see anything beyond that—I did not observe anything beyond glasses and bottles on the table—from that day, the 24th, until the 29th, I took a room opposite 11, Russell-street, in order to have the means of very accurate observation, and was there daily from 9 in the morning till 9 at night—during that time I saw the whole of the prisoners there; sometimes together, at other times singly—about a quarter-past 10 on Friday morning, the 25th, I saw Bayer leave the house, 11, Russell-street—at half-past 10 Holchester came to the house; he had a light coat on his left arm, a small white packet in his left hand, and a courier bag slung across his shoulder—he tried to look in at the window, ran up the steps, and knocked, but there was no answer; he waited about half a minute, came down the steps, again looked in the window, and
went away, apparently in a great hurry—at about a quarter to 11, Bayer returned—shortly before 11, Liban and Braun came to the house together, and I saw Liban, Holchester, and Braun seated at the window smoking, and in conversation—shortly afterwards I heard them speaking very violently, as if there was an altercation going on, and at 12 o'clock Holchester came out, slammed the door, and went away in a great hurry—he had the same coat and parcel on his left arm as he had when he went in—shortly afterwards, Davis and Berrens came to the house, and about 1 o'clock Berrens, Davis, Silberman, and Bayer went away together—I did not follow them, but I directed Mulvaney to do so—on the night of Monday, the 28th, I was in Holborn, opposite the Dancing-rooms, at midnight, and saw Davis, Berrens, and Liban, come out together—on the following day, Tuesday, the 29th, I was again in Russell-street, in the evening—I had an opportunity of looking in at the window—I was in a room immediately facing the house, and could see anything that went on—I saw the whole of the prisoners come there that evening, with the exception of Braun—they remained there until about half-past 9, and then went away in different directions—I did not see anything take place that day—previous to Wednesday, the 30th, Liban made some communication to me as to what was to take place on the 30th, in consequence of which, on the 30th, I, accompanied by other officers, went to Russell-street about 6 in the evening—I first saw Bayer and Holchester come to the house about half-past 5 in a hansom cab, and, a few minutes afterwards, came up a four-wheeled cab, out of which Berrens, Davis, and Silberman got, and went into the house—previous to this, about noon, I had seen Holchester go to the house and go away with Bayer—within about ten minutes afterwards I received an intimation which had been prearranged with Liban, and entered the house, accompanied by other officers—I first went into the parlour, which consists of two rooms, with folding doors, thrown into one—I there found Holchester, Bayer, Berrens, and Silberman seated round a table, drinking wine—I said, addressing the prisoners generally, "I am an inspector of police, and I have received information that there is in this place a large quantity of forged Russian notes"—several of the prisoners said, "We know nothing about it"—I could not individualise those who spoke—I said, "Very well, I shall search the house"—Holchester got up and said, "Look here, Mr. Inspector, I demand to see your warrant"—I said, "I have not got one, but I shall search the house, nevertheless"—I then directed the police who were with me, each to take charge of a prisoner—I then told Mulvaney to look round the room and see if there were any notes about; I did the same—Mulvaney went direct to the fireplace in the back portion of the room; there were several pieces of paper lying loose in the grate—Mulvaney examined them, there was no fire there—I then told Mulvany to come with me, he was still engaged in searching the fireplace, he left off doing so and went up with me, and we proceeded to search the upper part of the house—I there found some engraver's tools, which I produce, in a drawer in a small table in the back room—I then went downstairs in to the kitchen and searched the ground floor, and then I entered the room with Mulvaney in which the prisoners were—I told Mulvaney to search the room thoroughly, and I commenced doing the same—I saw him go to the fireplace, and whilst I was examining a bed he exclaimed, "Here is something, sir,"and he brought out the papers I now produce—he took them from the fireplace in the parlour where the prisoners were; I am told they are Russian notes, but I do not know Russian and cannot say—they were precisely in the same state as they are now when he handed them to me—
when he produced them I said, "Very well,"and continued searching the room—no conversation passed that I noticed—I have omitted to state that when I re-entered the room with Mulvaney, I said, "I wish to see the occupier of the house"—Bayer stood forward, he did not appear to understand me, and I repeated the same to him in French, and he answered, "I occupy the house"—I said, "Very well, come with me a moment,"and I asked him to come out of the room—he came out of the room; Mulvaney also left the room—what Bayer said was not within hearing of the other prisoners—after some communication had taken place between Bayer and myself I went back into the room and closely searched it, and under a small table I found a carpet-bag; it was a small table near the window in the back portion of the room—this is the bag—it is a small six-roomed house—the bag was not under the table at which the prisoners were sitting—I felt the bag and found that it contained something like a book loose—I placed it on the table around which the prisoners were seated, and asked each one if he had the key of it; they each said "No" I took out my keys but none of them would fit the lock—I then cut open the side of the bag with a pen-knife, took out a small packet from the bag, opened it in the presence of the prisoners, and found it to contain the notes I now produce—I placed the parcel of notes on the table and showed it to the prisoners—I said, "You see here is a bundle of what I think are forged Russian notes"—Holchester jumped up and appeared greatly excited, he said, "I do not speak Russian, and never saw a Russian note in my life"—I then ordered each of the prisoners to be searched—I saw Mulvaney take a key from the pocket of Bayer which fitted the lock of the bag—the prisoners were then given in custody to the station, I went with them—I afterwards went to the house of Holchester and searched it—I found there a duplicate relating to a ring pawned by a man named Berrens of Houudsditch.
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. Did you search HolChester's place? A. I did, immediately after he was taken into custody—I knew where he lived—I had seen Liban about ten minutes before I entered the house in Russell-street—I had not any conversation with him—I had conversation with him the evening previous, but not in the course of that day—I am positive about that—it would not have been safe, to have been seen speaking to him the night before—I was watching this house all day on the 30th, from 9 in the morning until they were taken into custody—I was in a house the whole of the time—it was about 6 when I entered the house—I went at once into the room where I heard voices—it was the same room in which the bag was found—the double room; I had five officers with me—I remained down below about five or six minutes—I spoke to the prisoners during a portion of that time, and then I just looked round the room to see if there were any things about—I had been in the room about two or three minutes before I told Mulvaney to search the fireplace—it appeared as if there had been a fire lighted, and it had gone out—there were pieces of wood and coal and paper, and stumps of cigars—there were several pieces of paper there, as if a man was in the habit of receiving letters, and tearing through the envelopes, and throwing in the fireplace—the papers were all over the ashes generally—the front parlour from the window to the folding doors was about from twelve to fifteen feet, I did not measure it, and the back-room about ten feet—it was a small room—I went in by the door at the front room, and I remained near that door the whole of the time—I told Mulvaney to look round the room—I did not say anything about the fireplace, he went
straight there as if attracted by the papers there, and I left him rummaging there when I called him away, and we both went upstairs—upstairs and down I should say—I was about twenty minutes—I searched the rooms thoroughly—when we came back Mulvaney did not go direct to the fireplace again—he began I believe with the mantel-shelf—he went towards the fire-place—the prisoners were in the same position as I left them, seated round a table in the front part of the room—I had seen Liban below stairs, not above, and Mulvaney went to the fireplace almost as soon as he entered the room—I saw him in a stoopiug position, and I saw him rise; he called out and I saw these (produced)—they were folded, not open—not much crumpled—much the same as they are now—Mulvaney may have said that when he found them they were crumpled up as if squeezed up in the hand—I do not know that I have heard him say so—at the Police-court one of the solicitors of the prisoners asked to have them preserved precisely in the same state as they were then—they were just the same as they are now—I have heard that Mr. Lewis made an observation to the effect that they were just as smooth as when they were first made, and I was requested to keep them precisely in the same state—I have had them in the strong room at the office since—they were not smoother then than they are now—much about the same—I have been particularly careful with them—it might have been ten minutes after returning to the room before the carpet bag was found—there were five policemen in the room—the table under which it was found was a small deal table—there was no cloth on it—the prisoners were committed in September—I was examined before the Magistrate, and so was Liban, Mulvaney, and Holmes—I took possession of what I found on Holchester's person, and of one or two letters, I think, relating to the case which I found at his house—it was on Friday, the 25th, that I saw Holchester go into the house in Russell-street with a parcel—he came twice—I was then on the first floor of the house immediately opposite—the window was open, and there was nothing to obstruct my view—this was the only carpet bag I found in the house—I did not search Holchester's house before I arrested him.
Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. I believe you searched Berrens? A. I did—nothing was found on him relating to the case.
Cross-examined by MR. TURNER. Q. And you found nothing on Davis? A. No—nothing relating to the case.
Braun. Q. Did you search my room? A. No, but I directed Sergeant Mulvaney to do so—I know it was searched twice—I saw you go into the house, 11, Russell-street, with Liban, about a quarter to 11, on Friday, the 25th—you remained there until between 12 and 1 o'clock—you were in the house all the time—I saw you from time to time at the window—I did not see you come in at five minutes before 1, and go out at a quarter after 1—I do not think I saw you on Wednesday, the 23d—I did not pass the Globe, in Leicester-square, about half-past 10 that morning when you were standing with Liban—I did not see you come out of the house in Russell-street at 9 o'clock on the evening of the 19th of August—I only saw you at the time I have stated, with one exception—I did not see you go to the house on Thursday, the 17th—I only saw you with Liban on one occasion, and that was at the London Pavilion Music Hall, when you and Liban came out with two females; he went home and you went home with a female—there was a sergeant with me—I cannot say whether he shook hands with you or not—I was watching you—I did not know the female at all—on Thursday, the 24th, I saw you in the Vassal-road, and
you went to 11, Russell-street, between seven and half-past seven in the evening.
Braun. I will show you I was at work that day.
MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Have you counted the number of things in that larger packet? A. Yes—before I took the charge at the station—there are exactly 500—they were tabbed in hundreds, separated, and were quite damp—there was a means of getting to the back part of this room, besides coming through the door at which I entered—the rooms are so constructed, that when the folding doors are closed, they are two separate rooms—there is a door to each room—the door to the back room is close to the door to the front room—the only division between them is the space for the folding-doors—I did not know where Liban was after I had been into the room—I knew he was in the house, but in what part of it I did not know—I left Sergeant Newey, P 12, Taylor, Holmes, and another constable or two in the room—I opened the front door by a latch-key which I had—I did not make much noise, in coming in—I went in alone, and entered the room alone—the folding-doors were wide open—it would not have been possible for anybody to enter the back part of the room without being seen from the front—it is like one room—the doors go from the ceiling to the floor—when closed it forms two rooms, and when open it forms one room, the doors going flat against the wall.
MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. One of the notes, I see, has a piece of paper pasted at the back; was it in that state when Mulvaney found it? A. I believe so—they are exactly as they were found.
COURT. Q. How many constables did you leave in the room? A. Five—as they came to the house they brought with them two uniform men; their names and numbers I cannot mention at this time—Mulvaney was there—when they first went in there were five in all, Thompson, Mulvaney, and three other detectives—as I went in the men in plain clothes followed, and while I was speaking to the prisoners, before I went upstairs, the two men in uniform came into the house, and they were in the room.
JOHN MULVANEY (Detective Police-sergeant). I was employed with Inspector Thompson to watch the proceedings of these men, supposed to be engaged in a Russian forgery—I have from time to time seen them together—on 29th August, I saw Davis, Holchester, Berrens, and Silberman, in the parlour of No. 11, Russell-street, the same parlour in which they were ultimately apprehended—I accompanied Thompson upon that occasion, got into the house, and followed him into the parlour—there were other officers there—there was one man in uniform outside the house, not inside—after the prisoners were taken into custody, another man in uniform came in—when I went into the front parlour, the prisoners were seated round a table drinking wine—the folding doors were wide open, and there was a door into the room on the side—I searched the fire-place in the front and back parlours—I took out the whole of the paper that was in the grate; some I dropped out on the hearth, and some dropped into the grate again: it was all waste paper—there were no notes in the grate at that time—I saw the carpet-bag under the table when I was searching the fire-place—I then went upstairs with Thompson, came down again after a time, and found the officers still in the room—I had locked them in, and had the key in my pocket—nobody could get out except by the window—we went into the room, and I was desired by Thompson to resume the search—I made a further search in the fireplace—I was examining something on the mantel-shelf, and I saw some coloured paper in the grate which was not there when I left the room
—I took it out, opened it, and there were five notes of five roubles each of the Bank of Russia—I am positive those notes were not in the grate when I searched it before—I said, "Here is something,"and handed it to Thompson; that was in the presence of all the prisoners—Holchester was at that time seated on a chair in the front parlour close to the window—he did not make any remark when I produced these notes, or did any of the other prisoners that I heard—I afterwards saw the carpet-bag produced, and heard Thompson ask if anybody had the key of that bag; and the prisoners who spoke English answered "No"—they expressed no surprise at seeing the bag there—they said they knew nothing about it; they had no key—it was then cut open by Thompson, and these notes found in it—he put them on the table, and cut the string, and said, "You see here is a good bundle of notes;"and Holchester said, "I don't know Russian; I never saw a Russian note in my life"—I don't remember whether Thompson said "Russian notes;"he said, "Here is a good bundle of notes."
Cross-examined by MR. SERJEANT ROBINSON. Q. You left three policemen when you went up stairs, and you found three when you came down? A. Yes—it was ten minutes or a quarter of an hour after I had come down stairs that another policeman came in—possibly I was told by Thompson to search the room again, and I went to the mantel-piece—there were several things there; a small box containing tobacco and some letters—I looked into it—I had not looked into it before.
Braun. Q. You searched my room on Wednesday, 13th September? A. Yes; I made three searches there—I found two leters there—I have given them to the prosecution—they were in envelopes—your room was searched on 31st August——I did not find those letters then—there was a mass of letters—I did not examine them then—when I stepped up to you first in Portland-street, I asked you if your name was Braun; I did not say, "Mr. Braun, I have a letter for you"—I saw you on 30th August—you went up to your door, and I came after you—I did not say I had a letter of Liban's for you—I did not say, "Do you know Mr. Liban?"and you did not say, "Yes, I know him"—I said I was a detective officer, and should apprehend you—I asked you your name first, and cautioned you—nothing was said about letters by you—you asked me to go and see Scott, the detective officer, and perhaps he would tell me something about you—I told you that a number of persons had been arrested—I did not describe them or name them—I saw you on Friday, 25th August, with Liban, in New Russell-street—it was about 10 in the morning—I saw you in the street, going up to the house—I did not pass you—I saw Liban knock at the door, and you went in after him—you stopped in the house about an hour and a half—it was about I when you left—I saw Holchester and Bayer go into the house—I did not see you go into 1, Brunswick-terrace, on the 25th, the same day—I did not see you on Wednesday, the 23d, at 8 o'clock, in Hampstead-road, looking into a public-house—I will swear that I was not there at all that night—I did not see you on the morning of that day in the Globe, near Leicester-square; you are mistaking me for some other person—I did not see you on 19th August, at 9 o'clock, near Russell-street—I saw you on Thursday, the 17th, at 11, Russell-street, about 9 o'clock—that was not the first time I saw you—I had seen you before that a good many times.
MR. SERJEANT BALLANTINE. Q. Are you sure there were three detectives in the room when you returned? A. I am sure there was no policeman in uniform there.
to 11, Russell-street, on the day the prisoners were taken—I was in plain clothes—Holchester was given into my special charge—I saw Mulvaney making a search in the fireplace—there was a quantity of loose paper and old waste paper in the back room—the folding-doors were open—after Thompson and Mulvaney went up stairs, Holchester spoke to Silberman in a language which I did not understand—Holchester then got up and went across the room, where was a chamber utensil, which he used—it was under a washhand-stand, at the corner of the fireplace in the back room—while he was there his back was towards me—I saw his right hand come from his right hand trousers pocket—I watched him—he arranged his dress, and then came back to the place where he was first sitting—about six or seven minutes after that Mulvaney and Thompson came down—I saw Mulvaney search the fireplace again—between the time he left the fireplace after the first search, until I saw him search it again, no one had been near it besides Holcbester—when Mulvaney searched the second time, I saw him take out five pieces of paper, which he held up in his hand—I don't think they could have been there when he searched the first time—when he and Thompson went up stairs, I, Sergeant Newey, and a constable Darned Taylor, 105 P, were left in the room with the prisoners.
Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. Q. You are not what is called a detective, are you? A. No—Thompson and Mulvaney had been gone up stairs about three minutes before Holchester went to the chamber utensil—I was then standing at the rear of him, from two to three yards from him, about the centre of the two rooms, nearly under the middle of the archway—I moved after him, and then he came and took his seat—I did not search the place myself when Mulvaney searched it the first time—I was first examined at the police-court on the second remand—I was there each time—I believe I was examined on the second remand—It would be the third meeting.
COURT. Q. Do you say that you saw Holchester throw anything into the fire place? A. I did not—I saw his hand in his trousers pocket.
MR. GIFFARD. Q. Do you say that you saw Holchester throw anything into the fire place? A. I saw him take out the whole of the papers that were there, piece by piece, and examine them
Bank-notes are manufactured, in St. Petersburgh—I am acquainted with the manufacture of Russian bank-notes, and am the person to whom the question of forgery is referred in St. Petersburgh—these five 5-rouble notes are forged notes—a rouble is worth about 30d. English money—these other notes are all forgeries—there is a very large circulation of these rouble notes in Russia—the five which are together are very similar to these in this packet—it is my belief that they are from the same original metal—it might be an electrotype copy—there are inaccuracies in them—I find the same inaccuracies in both.
Cross-examined by MR. ROBINSON. Q. Have you a good one there? A. Yes—I have the management of the technical department of the manufacture—it is part of my business to examine notes.
JURY. Q. Are all the notes the same? A. I did not examine every one; but wherever I have looked, I find they are marked the same, and are bad.
GEORGE SCOTT (City Detective), examined by Braun. I saw you in May, 1864, in St. James-street—I saw you several times there—I knew you had been with Inspector Hamilton, and had given a statement—you told me that a man came to you and asked you to engrave plates for fifty-rouble notes—you did not tell me that you had several appointments with that man, and that you found out he had already fifty-rouble notes—you told me they wanted you to make a fifty-rouble plate—that they wanted a proof—they wanted an eagle done—I don't know what they wanted done—you told me they wanted a fifty-rouble note done—that they had the printers, but they wanted you as an engraver to engrave the plate—I did not tell you to do it from a Russian coin, certainly not—you asked me to supply you with a fifty-rouble note to make a copy for them, and I said, if they gave you an order, they must supply you with an instrument.
Q. Did not I say, perhaps they might return it on my hands? A. You said a very great deal—I do not know precisely the words that you made use of—I know I met you on several occasions—I told you certainly not to go on with it without letting me know you were going on—I did not tell you to do as you thought proper—I do not recollect your writing me a letter about three months after that—I do not think I ever received a letter from you—you might have written me a letter on 26th July—I don't recollect—I saw you on several occasions, but I think not upon receiving a letter—the last time I saw you I said I would not come any more to see you, if there was nothing done—I certainly did not say you were to go on with them and do something.
Prisoner. I understood you so. Witness. You perfectly understood me to say that you were not to do anything without letting me know, and at that time you said they would not come to you any more—you did not expect you should see them again, and upon that we parted—I saw you about a fortnight before you were apprehended in Lombard-street—I asked you if you had seen anything of those persons since, and you said no, you did not expect to see them any more—that was the whole of the conversation—you did not tell me you had seen them several times just before I saw you—I certainly did not tell you to go on with them and do what you thought proper—I told you to let me know when you did anything, if you did do anything, and not to do anything without letting me know, and you perfectly understood that.
The prisoner Braun, in a long address, commented upon the evidence, and
stated in substance that, having been in communication with the police with reference to the application made to him a year ago to engrave a plate of a rouble note, he was under the impression that he still had their permission to proceed in the matter, and that when applied to by Liban for a similar purpose, he appeared to consent to his proposal for the purpose of detecting the parties concerned, and as he continually saw the officers watching his proceedings he considered they were aware of what he was doing, and sanctioned it.
Henry Isaacs, boot and shoe manufacturer, Houndsditch; Nash Josephs, woollen draper, City; David Nicholl, boot and shoe dealer; 113, Houndsditch, and Lewis Levy deposed to Holchester's good character.
Before proceeding to sum up the evidence,MR. JUSTICE BLACKBURN alluded to the recent Act (28 Vic. c. 18), in the following terms;—
"There is one question which, although, perhaps, it will not bear much on this particular case, is realty of great general importance. I allude to the effect of the new Act of Parliament which has been recently passed at the instance of Mr. George Denman, as to the summing up of the evidence by Counsel in criminal cases, because it really seems to me from my brother Ballantine's address, and from what I am given to understand has been the course of proceeding at this Court, that the object of that Act has been quite misunderstood, and if it is continued to be acted upon as it has been, it will be absolutely necessary that it should be repealed, or the course of criminal justice in this country will be seriously injured. Hitherto it has been the supposition that the Prosecuting Counsel was to consider himself in a hind of quasi-judicial position. Of course he has to conduct the case for the prosecution, and to bring forward these parts of the evidence bearing upon the prisoner's guilt, but he does that with a feeling of responsibility that he is not to be a mere Counsel to try to get a verdict, but an assistant to help the Judge, by fairly bringing forward that which is the case of the prosecution, and nothing more. At Nisi Prius, where the causes are between party and party, the position of counsel is different. There he is employed by a particular party to get a particular verdict, and, of course, he must use all fair means, and none other, to get that verdict. In Courts of Criminal Justice, Counsel is in a very different situation; the tendency of which should be to try to avoid technical objections and Nisi Prius tricks, so that the case may be tried upon its merits. The Act was passed, not as my brother Ballantine has said, making it the duty of the Prosecuting Counsel to sum up in all cases, but giving him the right and the power to do so in exceptional cases where it is necessary in order to set right something that has occurred in the course of the case different to what was expected. If that is followed out as was intended by the Legislature, fairly and candidly—namely, the Counsel to state the case before he calls his evidence—then, when the evidence is over, to say simply, 'I say nothing,' or 'I have already told you what would be the effect of the evidence, and there it is, you see the evidence is right; 'or in exceptional cases to say,' Something is proved different to what I expected,' and merely to give such an explanation of it as is required, and to confine himself simply to those exceptional cases, then the administration of Criminal Justice will go on as it has hitherto done in this country, and as I hope it always will, fairly and properly, the Prosecuting Counsel being really apart of the Court, a minister of justice, filling a quasi-judicial position; but if Counsel are to think it a matter of duty in every case to sum up the evidence and to introduce into criminal cases the course pursued at Nisi Prius; if we once get criminal prosecutions conducted, not by a gentleman feeling himself to be a minister of justice, but by a person who is to open his case slightly, then call the evidence and then trust to an eloquent speech at the end, so as to have the last word with the jury, and thus make himself a partisan, it will be utterly impossible to conduct Criminal
Justice as it has hitherto been conducted; it will become the positive duty and necessity of the Judge, instead of trusting the Counsel for the Prosecution, to assist him in considering what are the real points of the case, and in helping the Jury with regard to them, to have his attention distracted by watching and seeing that no unnecessary Nisi Prius advantage is taken by him in order to catch a verdict upon something not substantially on the merits of the case itself. I do not say that anything of the sort has been done in the present case. I quite agree with my brother Ballantine that it is in the discretion of Counsel whether he shall sum up his case or not, but I think that discretion should only be exercised in particular cases. If it is to be done in all cases I think the Act will become, instead of a boon, a great curse, and must be repealed. If it is carried out as it has hitherto been carried out on the Circuits, that is to say, if the summing up of Counsel is a privilege only to be exercised in exceptional cases where it is really wanted, and if the Counsel, exercising their discretion, will use the privilege sparingly, then, no doubt, it will do, as it was intended to do, a great deal of good."
HOLCHESTER, GUILTY .— Twelve Years' Penal Servitude.
BERRENS, GUILTY .— Seven Years' Penal Servitude.
DAVIS, GUILTY .— Five Years' Penal Servitude.
SILVERMAN, [No verdict given in original; assumed guilty given punishment] Confined Fifteen Months.
BRAUN, NOT GUILTY . There were other indictments as to Braun, which, at the request of the prosecution, were postponed until the next Session.
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. STARLING conducted the Prosecution.
WILLIAM PORTER I live at 1, Jackson's-gardens, Carlisle-lane, Lam-beth, and am a bricklayer—on Saturday night, 9th December, about half-past 11, I was going along Carlisle-lane, by a dead wall there, when the prisoner and another man came up from the opposite side of the way, took a circle round, and met me, the man not in custody ran against me with his head, caught me in my belly, and knocked me down on my back, into the mud—he fell on me, with his knees on my belly, and his breast on my face, and both of them rifled my pockets—they broke my watch-guard in three pieces, and I lost a piece of it—I held the prisoner there till a policeman came—the other man got away—I lost 3s. from my right-hand pocket—they were at all my pockets—I was not drunk—I could not breathe well for two or three days after this.
ROBERT LAWSON (Police-sergeant, L 9). About a quarter past 11, on 9th December, I was in the Westminster-road, and heard a cry of "Police"—on crossing the road I saw the prisoner a short distance from the end of Carlisle-lane—some one said, "That is the man you are called for"—the prisoner said, "If I am the man, I will go with the policeman,"and he went with me to where the prosecutor was—he said he had been knocked down and robbed, and that the prisoner was one of the men—the prisoner said, "If I struck him, he struck me first"—the prosecutor gave me a piece of broken chain at the time—he was not quite sober—he could stand and walk well.
JURY. Q. Had the prosecutor hold of the prisoner at the time you took him? A. No.
The prisoner's statement before the Magistrate:—"I was passing Carlisle-lane, the prosecutor ran against me; I asked why he did that, and he charged me with robbing him; I said I had done nothing of the kind; he
held me tightly round the neck, and got from him, and he fell back; I saw the constable, and walked to him. The prosecutor was very drunk."
Prisoner's Defence. I know nothing at all about it. I am as innocent as a child unborn.
GUILTY .— Confined Twelve Months.
MESSRS. O'CONNEL and STRAIGHT conducted the Prosecution, and MR. HOULSTON defended Carroll.
EMILY ROWE . I live with my father, a chandler, at 20, Trafalgar-street, Walworth—on 24th November, about 3.30, Carroll came in for half an ounce of tobacco, which came to three halfpence—he gave my mother a shilling—she gave him change, and put it in the tilt—there was no other shilling there—it was left open—I remained in the shop—he returned almost immediately and asked the time—I told him, and he left—I then took out the shilling, and found it was bad—a policeman came in and I gave it to him—the policeman afterwards showed me the packet of tobacco which I had sold to Carroll.
Cross-examined. Q. How much do you take in a day? A. Sometimes as much as 30s.—I had no shillings in the till—I was only a yard and a half from my mother—I did not like the sound of the shilling when my mother rang it, but I was serving a customer, and did not trouble myself to examine it then.
LOUISA MANTELLOW . I am the wife of Thomas Mantellon, a news-vendor, of West-street, Walworth—on 24th November, about ten minutes to 4 o'clock, Hayes came in for a Standard—I said, "There is one on the rack"—he gave me a shilling—I gave him a three penny-piece, two halfpence, and one penny, from the till, and sixpence from my basket—I wrapped the shilling up with some florins, but no other shillings—I afterwards gave it to Farrant, P 2, who spoke to me, and who had a copy of the Evening Standard with him, which I knew to be the one I had sold Hayes, as it was torn when he took it from the rack.
GEORGE HORN (Policeman, P 32). On 24th November, about 3.30,1 was on my road home, and saw the prisoners together, looking in at a little shop, on the opposite side to Mrs. Rowe's—I watched them—Craggs and Hayes crossed to Mrs. Rowe's, Carroll went in, while Hayes looked in at the window, and Craggs stood leaning against a post, looking at them—Carroll came out almost immediately, and he and Hayes ran across and joined Craggs, who took something from his pocket and handed to Hayes—I then went into Mrs. Rowe's shop, and received this bad shilling (produced)—I then got the assistance of two other constables, and followed the prisoners—Craggs and Carroll stood at the corner of West-street, and Hayes went into Mantellow's shop—he came out and passed them—they followed him and I started another constable after Hayes—the three policemen were in uniform—they did not run—I took Carroll and Craggs and handed one over to another constable—I found on Craggs a bad shilling—he said that he did not know it was bad—he got it in Billingsgate-market in the morning.
Cross-examined. Q. Where were you, when you first saw them? A. Just inside the Trafalgar beer-shop—I did not let them see me.
Craggs. You were in a jerry shop, and could not see us. Witness. I was in a place where I could see you—Hayes had some one to come and look for me, but I was round the corner out of his way.
JAMES MANNS (Policeman, 75 P). I took Carroll, and found on him three packets of tobacco, three good sixpences, and 13 1/2 d. in coppers—I showed one of the packets of tobacco to Miss Rowe, and she identified it.
GEORGE TARRANT (Policman, P 2). On the afternoon of 24th November, I saw Hayes running along Walworth-road—the sergeant told me to take him in custody—I took him, and said I should charge him with passing counterfeit coin—he said, "I have got no money upon me"—I searched him, and found a sixpence, a three penny-piece, one penny, two halfpence, good money; also an Evening Standard, which I showed to Mrs. Mantellow, who recognised it, and gave me this shilling, (produced).
The prisoners' statements before the Magistrate: Carroll says, "I do not know the other two." Craggs says, "I had 1s. on me, but did not know it was bad; it was given to me in Billingsgate, on that morning." Hayes says, "I was out selling fish, and took the shilling, I did not know it was bad."
GUILTY .— Confined Nine Months each.
MESSRS. POLAND and CLARK conducted the Prosecution.
MARY SHELLY . I am the wife of Benjamin Shelly, of 37, St. Andrew's-row, Southwark, news agent—on Monday, 13th November, the prisoner came in, and asked for change for a florin—I tried it, but I said, "This is not a good one, you know,"—he snatched it out of my hand and ran away—on the evening of the 17th, I saw him in the shop again, but did not take notice of him, not thinking of Monday night—I saw my husband serving tobacco, and saw something pass to him—I heard the prisoner through a hole in the window say, "We have done the old b—now"—I spoke to my husband, looked in the till, and found a half-crown, and I think a three—I tried the half-crown, and found it was bad—I went to the door, the prisoner saw me, and ran away—I called "Stop thief and he was brought back—I said, "Why, you were here on Monday night, with a bad florin,"—he said that he was never in the shop before—I gave the half-crown to my husband.
BENJAMIN SHELLY . I am a news agent, and deal in tobacco—on 17th November, the prisoner came in for half an ounce of tobacco, which came to 1 1/2 d.—he gave me a half-crown—I gave him the change, and put it in the till, where there was nothing but a three penny piece—he left, and my wife came out of a back-room, tried the half-crown, and ran after the prisoner—he was brought back, and I gave the half-crown to 60 M.
Prisoner. It is false, I was not in the shop. Witness, I am sure you are the person—it was half-past five in the evening—one gas was lighted—there was not a great deal of light—you were in the shop about four minutes—you did not give the half-crown till the last thing.
Prisoner. I made a mistake, it is Salisbury-street. Witness. I took you in St. Andrew's-road, near the shop, from Shelly, another person—there was no tobacco or money found upon you.
NOT GUILTY .
MESSRS. POLAND and CLARK conducted the Prosecution.
GEORGE THOMAS NOYCE . I keep the Greyhound at Richmond—on 2d. December, about half-past 6 o'clock, two children came into my house—I did not hear what they asked for, but saw a bad half-crown in my barmaid's hand—I went out with the little girl, who is here, and she pointed out the prisoner, and said, "That is the man"—I walked over to him—he endeavoured to escape through a court or alley leading to Richmond-green—he went between a walk and a run—I overtook him, touched him on the shoulder, and said, "You have given the little girl a bad half-crown to pass upon me"—he said, in the constable's presence, "I did"—I gave him in custody with the half-crown.
Prisoner. You said, "Did not you give the half-crown to the little girl?" I said, "Yes, but I did not know it was bad. Witness. No.
FRANCES LARKING . I am ten years old, and am the daughter of Sergeant Larking—on the evening of 2d December, about half-past 6, I was in George-street, Richmond—the prisoner came up and said, "My little girl, will you go across the road and get me a quartern of rum"—I said, "Where to?"—he said, "Go a message for me, and I will give you 1d."—I looked at my little sister, and then he asked me again—he gave my sister a bottle, and gave me a half-crown—I saw him walk up to the top of Brewer's-lane—I went, and there were three ladies in the bar—one of them put the rum in the bottle, took the money from me, and said it was bad—Mr. Noyes went out with me, and I pointed out the prisoner—he ran up Brewer's-lane—I am sure he is the man.
GEORGE HEATH (Policeman, V 113). On Saturday, 2d December, I was on duty in George-street, Richmond, and heard the little girl say, "There is the man"—Mr. Noyce said, "Policeman, follow me"—he tapped the prisoner on the shoulder, and said, "You gave that little girl this bad half-crown to pass on me"—he said, "Yes, but I did not know it was bad"—I took him to the station, and found on him 1s. 2d. in good money—he said that he received 5s. the day before for carrying a bundle, but he did not know who from, or where he carried it—I received this half-crown from the sergeant.
COURT (to GEORGE THOMAS NOYCE.) Q. Did not the prisoner say, "I did not know it was bad?" A. I turned round to give him in charge, and did not hear it.
Prisoner's Defence. I was waiting for a man to deliver some goods, and was afraid he would pass; so I sent the little girl for the rum.
GUILTY .— Confined Nine Months.
MESSRS. CLARK and STRAIGHT conducted the Prosecution.
pennyworth of rum—he gave me 1s.—I told him it was bad—he said that he took it in Billingsgate-market—I kept it—I marked it and gave it to a policeman—the prisoner gave me another—I have seen him about the neighbourhood, and am sure he is the man.
Prisoner. Q. Was there anybody else in the bar? A. No—I bit the shilling, and put it on a shelf—there was no other silver near it—it was taken down when the shelf was dusted.
MR. CLARK. Q. When did you mark it? A. On the Thursday night, when the constable was in the bar—I had seen the prisoner several times before.
Prisoner. I was the last man walked out of the cells, and you said to Mr. Martin, "That is the man." Witness. Nothing of the kind.
THOMAS BENGOUGH . I am barman at the Hen and Chickens, Suffolk-street—on Tuesday, 14th November, about 11.30, the prisoner came in for a glass of sixpenny ale—he put down a florin—I put it to my teeth, and found it was bad—he said, "Give it to me"—I said, "Take it where you got it from"—he said that he had no other money, and left—he took it to a paper-shop, but they could not give him change—he then went on a little further, came out, and offered me three halfpence—I would not have it, but gave him in custody, with the florin.
Prisoner. Q. When you told me it was bad, did not I ask you to come to the station? A. You said you would go with me, and went—when you got there, you were detained.
LAURENCE KEEFE (Policeman, A 474). On 17th December, the prisoner and Bengough came to the station—the prisoner told the sergeant that he offered to pay him, after he left the house, but the boy would not take it—I found on him 6 good shillings, 10 1/2 d. in copper, and this medal.
Prisoner's Defence. If I was guilty, should I ask a boy not sixteen years old to come to the station, and lock me up? I never went into Mr. Masters' house in my life.
GUILTY .— Confined Twelve Months.
Before Mr. Recorder.
MR. WOOD conducted the Prosecution, and MR. RIBTON the Defence.
CHARLES HARRIS . I am a sawyer, of 51, Charlotte-street, Fitzroy-square—on 20th November, about a quarter past 11 o'clock, I was looking out of the window of the top room of the Manor-house, and saw the prisoner standing in Princes-street—the prosecutor came up; and I saw her take something from under her shawl and throw it in his face—I thought it was water, and that it was done in jest—the prosecutor stooped his head, cried out "Oh", and dropped something which he had in his right hand—when I got near him, I saw that vitriol had been thrown in his face—he was taken to a doctor's, and then to the hospital.
THOMAS HARMAN . I live at 16, Mead's-row, Westminster-road, and know the prosecutor—on 20th November, soon after 11 o'clock, I saw him walking along Princes—street-his face was covered with burns, and looked yellow—I
led him to a doctor—I saw him about a quarter of an hour before that, in Stamford-street, walking up and down just outside the cab yard.
GEORGE EDWARD BLOGG PEARCE . I am house-surgeon of Westminster hospital—on 20th December the prosecutor was brought there with his face and one side of his neck considerably burned by sulphuric acid—I examined the vessel which had contained it at the police-court and found some of it in the glass—nearly the whole of his face was burned, but it did not go into his eyes; it caused them to be closed for a time, but there is no injury to his sight—there is no danger to his life, but some of the marks will be permanent.
Cross-examined. Q. Will he recover shortly? A. He is almost well now.
ROBERT WEST . I am a hackney-carriage driver, of 14, Rodney-row, Old Kent-road—on the evening of 19th December I had been sleeping in the stable in the yard—the prisoner's husband took my cab out at about a quarter past ten on the morning of the 20th—I went out at about a quarter-past eleven and met the prisoner—I never spoke to her and she never spoke to me, but she deliberately took a tumbler from under her apron and threw it into my face—I had this hat on at the time (produced)—it produced all these injuries on my face—I had known her about a month previously—I was with her on the Friday previous at the York hotel, Waterloo-road; her husband was there, but he left—she had a pawn ticket of mine at her house—I had pawned something to save them their rent, and she asked me to come in, she was on the bed with her child in her arms, I was swinging on the door, and said, "No"—I came out and she followed me into Stamford-street—she wanted me to give her something to eat, and pay for her room for her for a short time, but I would not do it—I went away and went to the Victoria theatre by myself—I saw her and her husband at a coffee stall that night, we were all joking and laughing—I saw her husband on Sunday and told him what she wanted me to do—we parted, and on Monday morning this accident happened.
Cross-examined. Q. Have you ever been in her room? A. Yes; with her husband, not without—I do not know the people of the house—I mean to say that on this Friday night I did not go into her bedroom; I can swear it—I believe if I had done such a thing this would not have happened—she had a child in her arms—I did not see that woman there on that night (Mary Harding).
Q. Do you mean to say that she did not speak to you on that night, and say, "You have been committing adultery with Moore's wife?" A. I have not seen her—I know that woman (Mrs. Jones)—I did not see her that night—she did not say to me, "You have been committing adultery with Moore's wife;"nor did I reply, "What matter, it is only once?"—she could not, for I did not see her—I did not see that man (Henry Jones) that night.
GUILTY .—Recommended to mercy by the Jury. MR. RIBTON, in mitigation of the sentence, adduced evidence of adultery between the prisoner and prosecutor when the former was intoxicated, and stated that she had charged him with rape before a Magistrate, that she had told her husband next morning what the prisoner had done, upon which he turned her and her baby out of doors
Confined Six Months.
MR. GRANT conducted the Prosecution,MR. STRAIGHT defended Forbes, and MR. WILL defended Webb.
JOHN DOYLE (Policeman, R 172). I was on duty in Rotherhithe in plain clothes, and apprehended a boy in Church-street—he was carrying something—I asked him what he had got—he threw it away and ran—I followed, and caught him—it turned out to he some wheat—I went into Church-passage with him on the way to the station, and was repeatedly struck by the prisoner Webb, who called out to parties there to rescue my prisoner, and pitch into me—two men, not the prisoners, caught hold of me, and Webb struck me a strong box on the forehead—he also struck the other constable, Hughes, who was down at the time—both the prisoners struck him previous to his falling, and after he was down I saw parties kicking him—I cannot say who they were, but I saw Forbes among them—there was a great crowd—I have repeatedly seen Webb before passing backwards and forwards—I know him sufficiently to say that he is the man who struck me—I was about a yard from the lamp—I apprehended him 10 or 20 minutes afterwards, 100 or 150 yards from the spot—the boy got away—I had not told him what I took him in custody for, and yet he said that he had nothing to do with it—Forbes was taken at 10 o'clock that night—the door was open—Hughes rapped, and asked if Forbes was at home—Forbes said "Yes, I am here for you,"and came out with a poker in his hand, and his wife had a poker also—Forbes raised the poker at Hughes, who raised his staff, warded off the blow, and at the same time struck him on the head—here are the two pokers (produced), this is the one he had—he held it in this way (with the knob upwards) Forbes knew my name, as I had had him in custody previously—he said to me, as I took him to the station, "Doyle, I will give you a b—good punching on your b—head; and I cut or "kicked the b—countenance of that b—Hughes."
Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. When you took this boy in custody whereabouts were you? A. In Church-street—it was about 7 in the evening—it was not a very light night—Church-passage is about 180 yards long, and 20 feet wide—it is not arched over—there is a large granary there, and a mill, and a churchyard—there are a good many lamps there—I believe there were more than 100 people—it is a place where a lot of people are always loitering about—I could not take Forbes before, because I could not find out where he lived, though I knew him perfectly well by sight—I had hold of his arm as we went to the station from Church-street, where he lives—Hughes was coming after me—there was not much mob then—when Forbes said, "Doyle, I will give you a b—good thump on the head; and I kicked the b—countenance of that b—Hughes,"he did not say it in confidence, for he spat in my face at the time he said it—I have not stated that before—I did not break open Forbes' door, nor did Hughes—when Forbes came to the door I requested him to lay down the poker—I believe that I have said before that Mrs. Forbes had a poker in her hand—the second poker is part of a pair of tongs, which has been used as a poker Forbes and his wife were not in bed when we went into the room—we did not drag them out of bed—I dragged Forbes down stairs, he had only his shirt on—we wanted him to put on his clothes, but he would not, and we dragged him along the streets in his shirt—he would not even keep on his shirt when he got to the station—after this Hughes and I went into the Ship public-house, looking for parties—we had nothing to drink there—Hughes did not have some brandy when he was in this fainting state—I
have not said that I did not know who the men were who assaulted me—there were a great many who assaulted me—I did not say in the public-house, "I do not know who they are"—I went into no house till I had arrested Webb—there were only two prisoners in Church-passage.
Cross-examined by MR. WILL. Q. Were the men who you say were the prisoners the first men who laid hands on you? A. No; there was a crowd around me before they came out—other people had been knocking me about, trying to get the boy away before I saw the prisoners—at the time the person I say was Webb struck me, the whole crowd were around—Hughes might not have seen that, as he was down almost continually, and the crowd kept him down—I was endeavoring to save myself—I have no personal acquaintance with Webb, I only know him by passing backwards and forwards on my beat for two or three months; I am quite certain his face is familiar to me—I will not swear that I had seen him for a fortnight before—I had no reason for taking notice of him, but I knew his face, and I identify him by his features—I took him in a yard by the side of the Europa, about 130 yards from the Ship—I do not know whether there was an urinal in that yard—he was not alone—I went up to him and told him he was a prisoner, and would have to come to the station with me—I said, "1 suppose you know me?"he said, "Yes, but I am not the person "—I did not tell him what the charge was—three or four of his companions were standing at the end of the broad pavement, about thirty yards off—I did not say at the station to the sergeant that Webb was not the man, but I heard Hughes say, "I am confident I saw him, but I did not see him strike anybody"—I did not hear the sergeant say that he only detained Webb on suspicion, but he may have.
MR. GENT. Q. Did you go into the Ship? A. Yes; I had no drink there, nor had Hughes—we went in to search for Forbes—the two Forbe's were not in bed, they came out on to the landing—Webb did not get away after I took him—I have not the slightest doubt about him; he stood right under the lamp when he struck me.
MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Did you strike the prisoner with the poker, in the room? A. No; I took the poker from him, and held him, but did not strike him.
JOHN TIMOTHY HUGHES (Policeman, R 36). On the night of 15th December, about 7 o'clock, I was with Doyle in Church-passage, Rotherhithe—he had a boy in custody—there was a crowd, and I went to his assistance—I was in plain clothes—seeing something in a bag I said to Doyle, "What has he got?"he said, "Corn,"and before I could do anything somebody took me by the legs behind and threw me on my head—I do not know who that was—when I was on one knee, getting up, Forbes kicked me on the front of my left leg—he is the only person I can speak to as doing anything to me, but several persons kicked at me and injured me—I have bruises all over my legs, which the doctor has seen—there was a lamp about as far from me as I am from the prisoners, quite sufficient to distinguish people well known to me—I knew Forbes well, and knew his name—about 10 o'clock that night I was well enough to go with Doyle to take Forbes—his is an old house, and the door is always open—I went up stairs and knocked at the door of the first floor, where I was told I should find him, and said "Forbes, I want you", and without asking what for he opened the door with a poker in his hand, and struck me in the doorway—I guarded it with a stick; it is a natural movement for persons accustomed to use sticks to turn their hands, and I struck him on the head with my staff—he was taken in custody, and I took the poker from him—
I went about that night, but after I laid down I felt stiff, and went to a doctor next day—I am still under his care, and am unable to perform my duty.
Cross-examined by MR. STRAIGHT. Q. Are there small stones in the passage where you fell on your face? A. No, smooth flags—I came down with considerable violence—there was a large crowd round me; the passage was full—I have not been assaulted for more than twenty years; I have been in the service twenty-nine years—I knocked at Forbes's door; I did not put my foot against it, and push it open—I did not go into the room and find him and his wife in bed—I did not take up the poker—when Forbes came to the door with the poker he was by himself—I saw a woman standing up with something in her hand, but I did not pay any attention to her—Forbes was carried down stairs in his shirt because he would not go down—he refused to put his clothes on, and they were carried also—it was not a cold night—I kept close behind the other constables going to the station to keep the crowd back—before I pushed at Forbes's door I knocked at another door, and somebody answered.
MR. GENT. Q. Did either you or Doyle prevent the man from putting his clothes on? A. No, we delayed for the purpose—Doyle led him to the station, and I was behind—I could not hear all that was said—Doyle was next him.
NATHANIEL KELLY . I am a surgeon, of 27, Paradise-row, Rotherhithe—Hughes came to me suffering from a great many injuries in various parts of his body—there was a swelling on his forehead the size of an orange, which was probably produced by a fell—he had two black eyes and an abrasion of the skin, caused by violence—both his legs were injured—in fact, his injuries were so numerous that I can hardly recollect them—there was a swelling below one knee and a wound on the outer side of it—a kick with a shoe with an iron heel would do that—I cannot say that the knee joint will not be permanently injured—he is not in good health, he is suffering in consequence—there is also a swelling on his other leg, about the size of a walnut, which may end in an exfoliation of bone—that would arise from a kick or a blow.
MR. STRAIGHT contended that as the constables were in plain clothes, the offence of assaulting them knowing them to be in execution of their duty, could not be made out. THE COURT considered that the offence was not assaulting them knowing them to be in execution of their duty, but assaulting them in execution of their duty.
MR. STRAIGHT called
HARRIETT COWLEY . I live in the same house as Forbes, in Church-street, in the next room—on Friday evening, 15th December, Forbes came home from his work at 5 o'clock, and went out again, to the best of my recollection, at twenty minutes to 8, for a quarter of a pound of cheese and tobacco—he was about ten or twenty minutes away—I recollect the time he went out because his wife and I were talking, and he has a clock in his room—I went back to my own room and was eating my supper—a knock came to my door at about a quarter past 10—I got up to open it, saying, ""Who is there?" but it was thrown in my face—a lantern was put in my face, and there were two constables there, Doyle and Hughes—they went away, and in less than two minutes they knocked at Mr. Forbes' door—Mrs. Forbes said, "Who is there?"—one said, "lam a constable—I heard a scuffle—Mrs. Forbes got out of bed and opened the door—Mr. Forbes did not get out, but he was dragged out—I followed the constables into his room, and saw him dragged out of bed by the hair of his head, and Hughes struck him with violence on the head with his club—I saw no poker in Forbes' hand—they did not give him the privilege to get one, but Doyle took the poker and hit
Forbes twice across the back—they dragged him down stairs naked—they did not even give him time to draw his trousers on—I followed them to the station with his trousers on my arm.
Cross-examined by MR. GENT. Q. Are you married? A. Yes; my husband was in bed tipsy—I was not rather drunk—I live in the next room to Forbes, and can hear all that was said—I have a clock—I was half an hour in their room—I go in and out twenty times a day, because they are the only acquaintances I have—I did not go before the magistrate and state this—I was never asked—I followed the two constables into the room—they would not let him put his trousers on—I have known Forbes eight or nine years.
JURY. Q. Had they plain clothes on? A. No; Doyle had a speckled waiscoat and trousers, but I knew them by sight as policemen—they came up stairs ten minutes after I left Forbe's room—it was 10 o'clock—they were going to bed when I left the room.
MARY GUINNESS . I live at 5, Hanover-street, Rotherhithe—last Friday I was going in the direction of the Thames Tunnel, and saw a disturbance just opposite the Spread Eagle—I heard a woman crying "Oh, murder", and "Oh, my husband"—I saw three policeman bringing Forbes down stairs naked into the street—I saw his face—he was bleeding from the forehead—he had nothing on but a shirt, and that was torn in halves—I saw his wife come down stairs, and beg the police to allow him to put his trousers on, but they took him to the station in his shirt—I believe both the constables to have been intoxicated—I saw the one with a black eye run across the road from the door—I followed to the station-house—I was as near to Forbes as I am to you—the constable had a staff in his hand, and he struck him three times going to the station—I heard Forbes say to the policeman in uniform, "You are a good man; I owe my life to you."
Cross-examined. Q. Did you hear the constable request Forbes to put his coat on? A. I heard Forbes' wife ask the constables to allow him to put his trousers on, and they refused—I did not see him tear his shirt—I say that the police were intoxicated, because I saw Hythe reel across from the door—the other policeman said to him, "Bring down the poker,"and in going to get it, he staggered by the door-post.
MR. WILL called PETER TOFFIELD. I am a boiler-maker, in the employ of Haughton, Son, and Kendrick—Webb was in their employ—we were engaged in a job as Rotherhithe, on the 5th December, fifty-six of us, and had been so for a fortnight—we were sent down by Mr. Kendrick to do a particular job—on 15th December, I saw Webb at work at 7 o'clock in the morning—he was at work with us till 6 o'clock, when I left with him and the other four witnesses—we went to the Ship tavern, Rotherhithe, that is about a quarter of an hour's walk, and had some beer in the tap-room—we remained there till twenty minutes to 7, and then we left together, and proceeded on our road home—we were followed by some tall man in black trousers and a black hat, to the Europa public-house, where Reynolds and I went into a urinal—we both came out together, and as we came out, the tall man took Webb by the cuff, and said, "I want you to go with me"—that was Doyle—he said, "What do you want with me?"—Doyle said, "Come, and you will see"—I said. "Jack, what does he want of you?—he said, "I do not know, I have done nothing"—I followed him to the station, and the constable that had charge of him would not tell us the charge, or let one of his mates go in to hear it—I went for Mr. Topper, his landlord, who bailed him out in my presence—our faces were more like sweeps than anything else.
Cross-examined. Q. Do you know Church-passage? A. No—I have worked there about a fortnight—the shop is close to Rotherhithe church-yard—I heard of no disturbance that night, and saw none—no one went out of the public-house; we never left one another's company—I had never been there before—there is some one from the Ship here, who saw us there—I went to the station, considering they had got an innocent man, but they would not admit me—I went to Greenwich to hear the charge, but they would not admit me even there—I was the only one who went; I wanted to give evidence—it was Doyle who would not admit us to the station—I cannot swear to the constable who would not admit me to the police-court—it is a public court, but I am not accustomed to courts—I wanted to go in, and they said that there was no room—I saw Doyle outside on Saturday, but not inside—I went inside the door, but when I went in to give my evidence along with my mate, they would not admit me; they said that the place was full—I went in at the close of the examination, but did not get a chance to hear or see anything.
Q. You said that you were refused admittance; now you say that you went in at the close of the examination, which is true? A. I wanted to go in with my mate, when he was called in, and the sergeant who was minding the door said that it was full, but I got in four or five minutes after he was convicted—I admit that I was in Court—I went in at the close of the hearing—I will not swear that I saw Doyle there, but I saw him outside.
JOHN HADD . I am a boiler-maker in the employ of Horton, Son and Kendrick, and live at 172, Long-lane, Bermondsey—the prisoner is a fellow workman of mine—on Friday, 17th December, I was at work at Rotherhithe dock—there were fifty-six of us—the prisoner Webb was one—he left home with me in the morning, and was at work with me till we left at 6 o'clock in the evening—five others left with me—the prisoner was one of them—we went to the Ship public-house, Rotherhithe, and had some beer—we stayed there till twenty minutes past 7 exactly, the six of us—Webb was one—he went into a urinal and Topfield followed him—Webb was taken about twenty yards from the urinal—I was half-a-dozen yards from him, almost alongside of him—I could not hear what was said by the man who took him—we went to the station, but they would not allow us in—we told them we wanted to go in to hear the charge that was to be laid against our fellow shipmate, but the sergeant on duty prevented us—Doyle is the man who took Webb—he shoved four of us at one time off the steps of the station—we asked him what he was taking Webb for, but he only replied, "Come with me, and you will know all about it"—when we went he would not let us go in.
Cross-examined. Q. Do you know Church-passage? A. Yes—there was no sign of any disturbance there that night—I did not go along it.
COURT. Q. How do you know there was no disturbance? A. There was none when I came along—we went by the Tunnel into the main road—we did not reach Church-passage at all—it is twenty yards from where we branched round—that was about 10 minutes past 6—the Ship public-house is not a great way from Church passage—I heard no disturbance at all—I noticed the clock because it is right facing the door as we came out—I was about twelve yards off when Webb was taken in custody—I only beard what the constable said when we asked him what charge he had against our mate—we could not get away from our work to go to the police-court and state what we knew about our comrade, but one of us went, Topfield.
FORBES— GUILTY **— Confined Twelve Months.
WEBB— NOT GUILTY .
Before Mr. Common Serjeant.
MR. DALY conducted the Prosecution.
JOHN CLAY . I am butler to Mr. Francis Martin, of Tudor-lodge, Wimbledon-common—on 9th October, I saw the place secured, and went to bed at half past ten—I was the last up—when I came down next morning, I found my pantry in confusion—I missed two tea-pots, a coffee-pot, and a large quantity of plate that had been safe the night before in a cupboard in the pantry—some of the plated articles were on a cloth, but not part of those which I missed—the plated articles were placed on a cloth; they were not taken—I missed that cloth—this is it (produced)—the window of the pantry was wide open, and all over treacle; and there was a quantity of treacle under the window, and some broken paper also inside—the glass of the window was broken—it opens like a door inwards towards the French casement window—there were four iron bars outside the window, not very large; they were painted a kind of brown colour—one was pulled right out, and three others bent very much—I should think it would allow one man to get through—I should think I could get through—the glass appeared to me as if it had been cut by a diamond, and removed by the treacle and brown paper—it was cut below the fastening—there was a very large piece of glass taken out—anybody could put their hands through, and open it quite well—I found this painter's putty-knife on the floor of the pantry close to the sink—I also found this file on the sink, and outside the window a piece of strong rope—I also found a piece of white cloth spread on the ground in front of the pantry window, and a green baize cloth was placed on the top of it—there was also a cloth in front of the hall window—I found a jimmy in the boot-house—on the knife-board I also found some bits of candle and some matches—I also missed two white cloths from the pantry besides the other one—I had known the prisoner before—he used to visit the housekeeper at Mr. Martin's—he was there on the 9th—he left about nine o'clock, just before we had prayers—I noticed a kind of slouched cap on a small table in the servants' hall that evening—the prisoner wore a kind of slouch-looking cap, rather dark, a kind of loose coat, and a fancy shirt, a Jersey—I did not notice whether he had any kind of blouse on.
Prisoner. Q. Have you got three pieces of candle there? A. No, only two; the larger piece, and a piece of sperm candle, which I will swear to—the smaller piece is wax, and the other piece is composite—I swear to the towel by there being a hole in the middle, and it being torn at the corner—I missed it on the morning of the robbery—it had been in my possession some weeks before—no one told me there were two holes in the cloth—I saw it when I put it in the cupboard—I saw it safe on the night of the robbery—it was shown to me on Saturday evening, the 14th, by a constable—he told me he had found it at your residence, and asked me if I knew anything about it—I told the constable, Micklejohn, at the time, that there were two holes in it, and that it was the one I had placed in the cupboard—it is a stable towel—I picked it up outside the pantry door—I wanted it to put the plated articles on, to keep the dust off—it was put underneath them, and also thrown over the top—I had no business with it—the housekeeper did not know I had got it—the painters had been at work at the house—one of the painters employed did not tell me that he knew who that knife belonged to—there was no painting going on in the pantry; I will
swear that—it has been painted—I will swear that the cupboard door has been painted lately—there were six or seven painters, I think, employed—at the time I lost the towel, I did not tell the constable of it—I missed it before Micklejohn called my attention to it—I did not give information about it—I told Micklejohn I had lost it—on the Thursday morning he told me that there were two foot-marks in front of the pantry window—you have been visiting at the house some considerable time—in August last, I went to the Isle of Wight—my bed-room door is always locked; I never leave it unlocked—we had no footman then—we have one now—he has not the key of my room, nor have I—I have not the key here—my bed-room was locked when I went to the Isle of Wight—I took the key with me—the housemaid could not get into the room, that I know of—on Thursday, 12th October, the officer, King, showed me a brooch with a likeness in it—he said he had never seen the likeness in the brooch before, or the person it represented—I saw foot-marks at Tudor lodge before I saw Micklejohn with the boot—Tuesday, the 17th, was the first time I saw marks—I did not see them until the police called my attention to them—they were in front of the pantry window, about seven yards away—there is no mould there—it is a kind of gravel; ashes and gravel together—it is a path, not a bed—there were no foot-marks found on that path—on the Thursday night, two days after the robbery, you came to Tudor lodge, with your mother—about half-past 9, when you were going to leave, I heard a policeman say, that by Mr. Martin's orders, you could not leave—I did not hear you ask him the reason why you were detained—I did not hear him say that he did not know—I did not see you give the police the keys of your residence—I believe you did—I have got a brother a painter—I did not tell the police so—I always leave the plate down stairs—Mr. Martin's orders were, that I should take the silver up every night to my bed-room; but I thought it quite secure to place it in the plate-cupboard, and lock it up, except when they have been out of town, when I have taken it up into my bed-room.
Prisoner. Q. At 11 o'clock on Thursday, 12 October, I went into your dining-room, did I not? A. Yes—I did not give you into custody till 5 o'clock the next morning, when the police returned—I do not know how long you had been there.
WILLIAM KING (Policeman, V 56). On Tuesday morning, 10th October, I was on duty in the Wands worth-road—at half-past 4 in the morning the prisoner passed me, coming from the direction of Mr. Martin's house—he had the bundles tied up in white cloth, or white aprons, one under each arm—he said, "We have a wet night, policeman"—I said, "Yes,"and went on—it had been wet up till about 2 in the morning—I noticed how he was dressed, in a white blouse, that came down to his knees, and a brown cap—it was a very bright moonlight morning then—I saw two very rough-looking men following him, about fifteen or twenty yards behind—I did not stop him, he went on—on the evening of 17th I went with Micklejohn to Tudor-lodge—opposite the pantry window I saw a flower-pot standing over a foot-mark which was there—Micklejohn had a boot—he made a fresh impression with it by the side of the other, and they corresponded—I fetched some compasses—the marks corresponded exactly.
Prisoner. Q. Why did not you stop the man, and ask him to let you see
the contents of the bag? A. It is a time in the morning when I might have stopped a dozen—it is quite a common occurrence—it was between the Clapham Union and the Clapham Junction that I passed you—it might be 150 or 200 yards from Clapham Union, and 400 or more from the Junction—I went on duty at 10 o'clock that night, and kept continually going round my beat—I first passed that spot where I met you at about half-past 10—it is in my option to stop people or not—you had a band round the waist of your blouse—I first mentioned the fact of having seen a person on the night of the 10th to my inspector, Mr. Lovelace, and gave a description of the man to him—I told him he wore a moustache, and his whiskers were shaved off—I saw you on Thursday night following, when you came to Tudor-lodge—I did not say to you then that you were the man I saw at Clapham, I said so to my inspector—I did not take you into custody then because I was not authorised to do so—I had nothing to do with making inquiries into the case—I told you that you were detained, and you asked me what for, and my answer was that I was not obliged to tell—you almost passed me on the Tuesday morning—I had not seen the footmarks before the evening of the 17th, when Micklejohn had your boot in his possession—I saw him make an impression close to the one where the flower-pot was—I saw the flower-pot removed from it—I drank what I wanted on the night I was at Tudor-lodge—my inspector knows whether I was drunk or not.
JOHN MICKLEJOHN (Policeman, V 42). On Tuesday, 10th October, I went to Tudor-lodge, and found a small piece of candle in the shrubbery, in front of the house; I found another piece of composite candle—I afterwards saw the prisoner at Tudor-lodge, and he told me he lived in Gillaghan-street, Pimlico; that is correct—I went to his lodgings and searched the room and found these pieces of candle—he was not there—he was at Tudorlodge, and I detained him there while I went to Gillaghan-street—I made inquiries as to where he was on the night of the robbery—I think these pieces of candle correspond with the piece found in the boot room, they are the same sort—I also found this towel at his lodgings, and these two painter's knives; the prisoner's name was on the blade—I believe these knives together make a set of painter's tools—I found a pair of boots at the prisoner's lodgings—I took this one (produced) to Tudor-lodge, and then made an impression on the ground by the side of the footprint which I had preserved on the Tuesday morning after the robbery, and put a flower-pot over it—the clay was damp—I got a pair of compasses, measured the two footprints, and they corresponded exactly—the heel of the boot is worn down here and the mark in the clay was raised—I also found a cap at the prisoner's lodgings—I afterwards took him in custody—he said he knew nothing about it, he was at home that night at eleven o'clock at his lodgings, and he went out by the front gate.
Prisoner. Q. When you discovered a footmark on Tuesday morning, did you call the butler's attention to it? A. I put the flower-pot on the foot print and told him not to allow it to be removed—he was in the garden with me; I think the gardener was there—I saw several footmarks at the lodge gates; one, I think, was made with nails—one of the tracks was of a boot with nails—I did not discover any footmarks just about the gate, inside; I did not pay much attention to them—that was before discovering a footprint opposite the pantry window—you gave me your door key and I went to your residence; I found this towel in a drawer on the Saturday; that drawer was not locked then—it was partly by my orders that you were
detained at Tudor-lodge—I did not offer to pay your landlady your rent, or promise to pay your laundress's bill—I did not offer any inducement to your landlady, directly or indirectly—I never saw Mary Ward before I saw her at Tudor-lodge—I never made an appointment to meet her any where.
Prisoner. Q. I believe Mrs. Rowe, your housekeeper, is in the habit of giving you these cloths? A. Yes, and I returned them to her—the butler has no business with this towel.
MARY HARPER . I am a widow, and live at 18, Gillaghan-street, Pimlico—about three weeks before 9th October the prisoner lodged with me—on Monday night, the 9th, I was up till eleven o'clock, I think—I could not say that the prisoner was there that night, he did not sleep in the house that night; he came home the next morning; it was about eleven when he came home—I saw his bedroom; his bed had not been slept in on the Monday night—he had a shepherd's plaid waistcoat and trousers, and a black coat on, as far as I could tell—when I saw him he asked me if it was too late to send his linen to the wash—this blouse was left in his room to send with his things; he asked me to send it to the wash; I did so, and it was washed—I saw a towel after the 9th in his drawers like this one—it had the name of Mr. Martin on it.
Prisoner. Q. I believe you saw the towel on Monday, October 2d? A. Yes; I saw it on the morning the inspector was there; he found it in the drawer—it was on the Tuesday morning you wished me to send your things to the wash, I think—I really cannot say when it was I saw the towel—it must have been either the Monday or Tuesday when I saw it—I did not see you come in on the Tuesday—the blouse was dirty when I sent it to the wash—I did not notice that there was any alteration in it—there were some other things with it—it might have been in your room a day or two before—I had never seen you wear it in my house; I suppose you wore it at your work—Micklejohn came to my place on Saturday, the 14th, I think—he did not say that if I came up to Wandsworth he would pay me; he said I had occasion to come—I had a summons to go—he said he would intercede for me to be paid my rent—I believe when you took my apartments you told me you were working for Messrs. Banting of St. James's-street.
MARY EMELIA WARD . I am the daughter of the gardener at the entrance-lodge to Tudor-lodge, Wimbledon—I live there with my father—on the evening of 9th October, I let the prisoner out at the front gates, between 9 and 10—I had not been in the habit of letting him out that way—it was an unusual thing—I cannot say that I had ever seen him go out at the front gates before, I do not remember—I had seen him come in that way on Sundays—he was dressed in dark clothes, and wore a loose coat, and a slouched cap, like this one—the last omnibus to London goes past the house at a quarter past 7.
Prisoner. Q. Who first called your attention to its being an unusual circumstance, my going out that way? A. When I went in, I said, "What a funny thing, Mr. Shaw has gone out at these gates"—sometimes I am out—I am usually at home—I did not swear before you came in and out of the front gates frequently—I said that you sometimes came in and out of those front gates on Sundays, with Mrs. Rowe—I cannot say that I have seen you come in and out there on a wet day.
WILLIAM WARD . I am Mr. Martin's gardener—I saw Micklejohn measure some footmarks on some loose ground, about five yards from the pantry window, with a pair of compasses—he produced a boot and gently pressed it into the hole, and then measured it across with the compasses—he just put it into the footmark—I did not see him make any mark—he did; not press it—he put it gently down to the footmark—I did not see him do anything else with the boot—I was not there when he began the operations—one footmark was preserved—I did not see another by the side of it.
COURT. Q. Then what did he measure? A. He measured the boot with the compasses, and measured the footmark with the compasses.
Prisoner. Q. Was it on the Saturday that your attention was first called to it? A. Yes—I had never looked at it before—the flower-pots are in my charge—Micklejohn did not borrow one of me that day—I never lent one—there are hundreds of flower-pots about there—it was not a secret that you were there—you might be there as you liked—you always had done so—there would be nothing extraordinary in one of your footmarks being there.
MR. DALY. Q. At the time you came to this window where the footmarks were, was Micklejohn there? A. He was—he took a boot, and pressed it into an impression on the ground, that was the only impression I saw—the one I saw Micklejohn measure was the one that was covered up by the flower-pot—that was the one I saw him put the boot into.
COURT. Q. Then if Micklejohn swears that he took the flower-pot up from off that impression, and that he made a second impression by the side of the other, and measured both of them with the compasses, is that true or fake? A. I did not see it done—I will not swear that it is false—he might have done it without my seeing him.
COURT to JOHN MICKLEJOHN. Q. Was Ward with you when you did this? A. He was there, but he came up after I had made the impression with the boot, and I put it into the impression I had made when he came up.
MARY PALMER . I was housemaid to Mr. Martin—on Wednesday, before the robbery, I was waiting at table, assisting the butler—I had occasion to go into the butler's pantry, and saw the prisoner in there alone—he was looking at the window—the curtain was thrown half across the window, and the bottom rod was thrown over the roller at the top—I said, "How you startled me"—he said, "You are very soon startled"—the dinner was going in, and I left to attend to it.
Prisoner. Q. I have been in every room in that house, have I not? A. I believe you have, you went wherever you liked.
MR. DALY. Q. Did you ever see him examining any of the other windows? A. No.
The prisoner after commenting upon the evidence against him, called
ELIZABETH ROWE . I am housekeeper at Mr. Martin's—this towel which is produced, marked "Stable", I lent to the prisoner some weeks before the robbery, to wrap some shirts in; and I told Micklejohn about that—this is marked the same as I lent him, and there was no other one out—this is the towel I lent him—the butler Clay has told me a good many falsehoods, but I don't know that he would tell everybody lies—I never took any notice what he did say, he told so many untruths—I don't mean about this matter particularly—I have caught him in a great many falsehoods.
Cross-examined by MR. DALY. Q. Had you given notice to leave on the Monday of the robbery? A. Yes—the prisoner was paying me his addresses.
Q. Are you in the family way by him? (The witness did not answer.) A. I have not told Mickle john that I never gave him any towel at all—I believe I said I had not, till I remembered—I had forgotten it at first, but I afterwards told Micklejohn that if he found an old cloth marked "Stable," that I had lent it to him.
There were two other indictments against the prisoner for larceny.
ADJOURNED TO MONDAY, JANUARY 8, 1866.