Judith Murray, William Tinman, Philip Murray, Royal Offences > coining offences, Royal Offences > coining offences, 12th April 1738.

Reference Number: t17380412-11
Offences: Royal Offences > coining offences; Royal Offences > coining offences
Verdicts: Guilty
Punishments: Death > respited for pregnancy; Death

14, 15, 16. Judith Murray, (otherwise Judith the Wife of William Tinman ) William Tinman , and Philip Murray , of St. Leonard Shoreditch , were indicted, for that they not having God before their Eyes, &c and not being Persons employed at the Mint in the Tower, (not any of them) for our Sovereign Lord the King, nor weighing the Duty of their Allegiance, but contriving and intending our Lord the King, and his People, feloniously and traiterously to deceive and defraud, on the 11th of March, 22 Pieces of false, feigned and counterfeit Money, of Pewter, Tin, Lead, and other Metal, in the Likeness of Shillings, falsely, deceitfully and traiterously, did Forge and Coin, to the evil Example of Others, &c. against their Duty and Allegiance, and against the Form of the Statute .

They were a 2d Time indicted, for that they not being Persons employ'd, nor any of them, for the Mint in the Tower, or elsewhere, for our Lord the King, nor being lawfully authorized by the Lord High Treasurer, or Commissioners of the Treasury for the Time being, but not having God

before their Eyes, &c. after the 15th of May 1697, to wit, on the 11th of March , with Force and Arms, one Pair of Molds made of Chalk, on one of which Molds was impress'd the Figure and Resemblance of one of the Sides of a Shilling, without any lawfull Authority or Excuse, knowingly and traiterously had in their Custody and Possession, in the dwelling House of William Saul , against the Duty of their Allegiance, &c.

The Counsel for the King having open'd the Charge, the following Witnesses were call'd.

Alice Donnavin I was born at Chester, but was bred up in Ireland: Judith Murray was born in Ireland. About the latter End of May last, I came from Ireland, with the two Murray's, and we arrived at Park-Gate. At this Place she shew'd me the bad Money, and said she was obliged to put it off for her Livelihood. She asked me if I would keep her Counsel? I promis'd I would; upon which she shewed me about 8l. in these Shillings, which they dispos'd of, upon the Road. She had a good Half Crown, which she gave her Brother Philip, and the Way was, to go to a House and call for something that came to a Groat or Six-pence: Philip threw down the Half Crown, and receiv'd the Change in good Money; then Judith would tell him he need not change his Half Crown, she would lend him a Shilling, so he used to take his Half Crown again, and return these Shillings for that and the Reckoning. Thus they changed the bad Money for good, and she told me, that was the Way in which she had got her Bread. I promis'd to keep her Counsel, if she would let me into the Secret, and inform me how she made them, which she accordingly did as we were upon the Road, on this Side of Park-Gate. When we came to London, we took a Lodging in Drury-Lane , where she conceal'd her making them from me, and I was suffered only to pass them away. Some Time after this, Judith Murray, and I, went to France, (I don't know the Time precisely) and we left Philip Murray in England, while we went there to put off our bad Money. In France we got acquainted with the Prisoner Tinman: He came back with us, and we all three landed at Dover At a Place call'd Hithe, we were detected, and though Judith Murray concealed her Molds, yet we were all taken up; but we were discharged by a Justice of the Town of Hithe, because the Person could not swear positively to us. From this Place we came to London, and took a Lodging in Cable-street; this was about three Months ago.

Councel. Did you lodge at any Time in Holywell-Lane, in Shoreditch.

Donnavin. Yes; the Prisoners were taken there: We had lodg'd there about three Weeks when they were taken; but I never saw any Money made there, 'till the Day they were apprehended; and that Morning Judith put the Chalk, (or something White) into the Molds, then she made an Impression, by putting a Shilling between them, and afterward fix'd them. When the Molds were ready, she took two pewter Spoons which I had bought the Day before, and having broke them to Peices, she fill'd a Tobacco Pipe: Phillip Murray held it in the Fire 'till the Pipe was red-hot; then Judith pour'd the Metal into the Molds, and Tinman clipp'd the edges of the Shilling thus made They had made 8 of these Pieces, and had given me 3 or 4 to put off, before I left the House that Morning to detect them. Tinman clipp'd the edges of some of the Pieces with a pair of Scissars, but not many, for Judith said, he did not do it right, and she could do them better herself. Phillip Murray colour'd over the 4 Shillings they gave me that Morning with Quicksilver, and when I went out to pass them away, Judith desired Phillip Murray to go with me, for fear of any accident happening to me; but I would not accept of his Company, because I intended to detect them. So I went out and got a Constable, and desired him to send for Mr. North. I told the Constable they were then at Work, and I placed him at a House over the way, where he was to stay 'till I went over to see whether they were still at Work, because she always hid her Molds out of the Room, when they had done with them. As I went up Stairs, I met Phillip coming down; and I ask'd him whether his Sister had done Coining. He told me No, and that he was going only for a Pint of Beer. I took the Pot out of his Hand, and said, I would fetch the Beer; so he went up again, and I went over the way and told the Constable, and the Man he had with him, they might now go up. I went with them into the Room, and Judith when the Men came up Stairs, had got the Flasks (or Molds) in her Lap, and would have thrown them out of Window; but I seiz'd them in her Hand, and deliver'd them to Mr. Rogers. There were about 18 s. found in the Room, besides the 4 they had finish'd for me to put off This I believe is some of the Money.

Phillip Murray. I did not Lodge at this Place; Was not I sent for that Morning to Bleed my Sister?

Donnavin. No; he was not sent for that Morning, but when he came he did Bleed her. He had

been for some time from us, with a Friend, but he has put off this Money for us.

Judith Murray. Had not you and I quarrell'd?

Donnavin. We generally quarrell'd, because I did not put off her Money, and frequently had Battles.

Phillip Murray. Did not Mr. Haines go with the Constable, and did not he ask you, What you could charge me with?

Donnavin. Yes, and I said - with colouring the Money. I did not then recollect that he had melted the Metal, - I was in a Surprize.

Phillip Murray. Did not you say you could charge me with nothing but putting off the Money?

Donnavin. I can't say whether I did or not.

Thomas Rogers Donnavin came to me the 11th of March, about 9 in the Morning, and enquired for a Constable to take up some Coiners. She said she was a Party concern'd, and was as bad as They. She told me farther, that there had been a Quarrel among them, and if she did not discover Them, they would impeach Her. Upon this Information, I went to the King John on Horseback, in Holywell lane , and placed my self in the House, so as to see her go in again, and had got Mr. Barlow along with me. Presently Donnavin return'd to the Alehouse for a Pot of Purl, and bid us stay a little longer. She carry'd up the Purl, and came down again to call us; she went in first, we follow'd her closely and found the 3 Prisoners in the Room. I am not positive whether Judith was sitting or standing, but they were all by the Fire, and we lock'd the Door to keep all in, that were in. I asked Donnavin, who she charged with Coining? She charg'd all of them; upon which Judith lifted up her Hands and cry'd - What! have you serv'd me so! And immediately she fell upon her Knees and beg'd for Favour. They all seem'd to be in a great Surprize, and lest any Mischief should happen, I order'd them to turn out their Pockets. While this was doing, Mr. Barlow found the Molds, and opening of them, he said they were hot; there was on one of them a visible Impression of the Head side of a King William's Shilling, and on the other, the Impression was plain, but Blank. After this, Mr. Barlow found 18 Shillings in an old Cap, and I took 3 or 4 of them; here they are, and I have mark'd them. We carry'd the Prisoners before Mr. Justice Wroth, and he committed them.

Judith Murray . Donnavin brought me from Ireland, I was only her hired Servant . I ask her, Whether Phillip Murray was not to Bleed her in the Foot? Because she said, that would make her Fairer, than Bleeding in the Arm would.

Donnavin. I never spake about Bleeding at all.

Councel. Did you find any Money upon any of them? (To Rogers.

Rogers. No; only a good Shilling upon Judith.

Mr. Barlow. When we went into the Room, I think they were all sitting by the Fire; Donnavin told us these were the Coiners, upon which Judith fell down upon her Knees; and while Mr. Rogers was searching their Pockets for Fear of Mischief, I found the Moulds upon a Table by the Fire-side, covered with a Cloth, and they were hot. I found likewise 18 Shillings in the Crown of a Woman's Cap, fifteen of them I mark'd, and delivered to Mr. North. There was two or three Pipes lay upon the Table with the Moulds. Donnavin charged Judith Murray with coining them, Tinman with clipping them, and Philip Murray with silvering them, before Mr. Justice Wroth. I don't remember that she charged Phil. with doing any thing in particular, till we came before the Justice.

John Hain . I went to the Prisoner at the King John Alehouse, and asked Donnavin who she charged? all three for coining, she said, and that the Boy was guilty of passing off bad Money, but yet she should save his Life. Mr. Barlow delivered me four of the Pieces to carry to the Tower; I shewed them to Mr. North, and he told me he would come to us at the Alehouse very speedily; as soon as he came, I went with him to search the Prisoner's Room, and among the Ashes we found this Piece of Metal. Donnavin charg'd Phil Murray with silvering the Shillings over, before the Justice.

Mr. North. I act for the Solicitor of the Mint; on Saturday the 11th of March, Mr. Hain called me to the Alehouse where the Prisoners were detain'd, and from thence I went with him to search their Room; we found in the Ashes some Bowls of Tobacco-pipes, discoloured with the Fire, as if Metal had been melted in them. I imagined the Holes in the Pipes would have been stopped by the running of the Metal when melted into them, but they were not. There were several Pieces of Metal in the Ashes, and in the Window I found this Bottle of Quicksilver.

Mr. Barlow. When we seized the Prisoners, and brought them out of the Room, I locked the Door, and kept the Key in my Pocket till

Mr. North came, then I gave it to Mr. Hain, that Mr. North and he might go and search the Room again.

Mr. North. After I had searched the Room, I went to the Alehouse again and saw these Moulds, they were then perfect, and the Impression of the Head Side of the Shilling, was very plain upon one Part of the Moulds, upon the other it was plain. All the Pieces that were shewn to me exactly tally'd with the Impression; these are the same Moulds (or Flasks) which were then delivered to me, but the Chalk is now fell out and the Impression are destroyed. When they were before the Justice, Donnavin swore that Judith coin'd them, Tinman cut off the Knobs and finish'd the Edges, and Phil. Murray silver'd them with Quicksilver.

Phil. Murray. I was sent for to bleed my Sister; I never had any Conversation with Donnavin, but work'd hard for my Bread.

Tinman. I chanced to be in the Room at this Time, but I never knew any thing of their making or putting off bad Money.

Judith Murray. No one ever knew any thing of the Matter but Donnavin and I. She transported her own Brother, and was whipped at Dublin.

Simon Cummins , Archibald Graham , - Roach, and Daniel Banfield , appeared to Tinman's Character, and took him to be a very honest Man.

- Jackson, - Craddock, - Murray, - Walker, - Harrison, Abraham Flawn , and - Archpool, appeared in Philip Murray's Behalf, and gave him the Character of an industrious Lad.

The Jury found all the Prisoners Guilty ; Death .


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